Guild Wars 2

I pity all the “Omg Stealth Stomp” whiners…The time will come, when they will realize that Black Powder is roughly 1000 times better for stomping and reviving…

OK i will explain…
Perma-dodging will not work as good as you imagine,but this you will learn the hard way anyway.
Concerning Hidden Assassin,it’s anything but useless.It makes your bleeds more powerful(same as might on dodge).
More health regen than you need?This i cannot comment.I am happy that you are happy with your regen.
Long thing short:might increases condition damage(including the bleeds you applied before hand)

20 Shadow Arts and you don’t go 30 Shadow Arts?
Hidden Assassin and Shadow Rejuvenation are some of the best traits out there.
Instead you traited Pain Response?
I admire that you “discover” your build by your own,but sometimes is just better to check what other people do…
Edit:Also you plan to dodge constantly and you didn’t trait for might on dodge.

This is getting old.Anet are clearly happy from the present state of thief,so you might wanna change the record.Maybe chose some real FOTM,like D/D ele or smtng?

Simple enough.Since this patch it is possible to transmute pvp armors with pve and vice versa.In PvP i am rank 50,but in PvE i am the most miserable bas**rd you can imagine(i think i have 1.4 gold or smtng).So i wanted to transmute my drags at least not to look like beggar.My question is which of the following armor set is most rare and valuable in PvE?
Pirate set
Commando set
Stalwart set
Ascalonian set
Rascal set
Flame Legion set
Conquest set
Noble set
Priory set
Vigil set
Warden set
Whisper set
Prowler set

The problem with the channeling attack has been discussed for months.Sadly in a world,where Stealth is labeled as OP and abusive ability(same as pretty much any thief ability),there is no chance this to be changed…
I asked in this forum once:“If any other class pop ups block or mist or ignore pain or any invulnerability ability,should channeling abilities continue to damage him,because they already started?”
The answer was:“So you want Thief to become even more OP?”

Kurow.6973:

Oh, you mean a survival built thief is not as easy to kill? You mean like the invincible (almost) bunker builds on other classes? Do go on…tell me more.

Well, after all the thief invested only 50 points in healing/toughness/vitality trait lines…
He must die like a…well like a thief.Not like some other classes that if speced like that can drag 4 ppl on top of them and don’t die.

DanH.5879:

it is intended because you would get a really long regeneration time otherwise.
just c&d every 4 seconds and get perma regen …. hm…. Op i think.
and yes, shadow refuge would pop you over 20++ seconds of it because of multiple stealth waves

Hardly OP.If i just C&D every 4 seconds i will achieve literally nothing ,except not dying(probably not even that) .
I can point some other professions ,that have passive/traited regenerations and don’t have to spend resources for it…
Anyway,it is not necessary needed Shadow Protector regen to stack,but it can at least refresh(i mean the new regen to overwrite the older).

It stacks with Hide In Shadows.That’s 100% sure.
It doesn’t stack with itself!!!
?
!

Here i am with the Flame Legion Medium Set.I look like a little devil

Kasama.8941:

So we went from two or three long lasting stealth skills, to well…basically Cloak and Dagger says it all.

@Kasama,you are beginning to net yourself in your own inability to justify your point.

Look at your own video(that you presented for example). Isn’t that Cloak&Dagger?
Right there at #5……PLUS the other Stealths.You are embarrassing yourself.

Doomdesire.9365:

They really need to adjust thieves

Nerfs :

1) Take away 5K HP from the base, to make sure theres a real risk
2)Remove stealth completely, it’s lame
3) 50% damage nerf. The fact that they can do so much damage is lame
4) Add cooldowns. At least 30 seconds for heartseeker, with 10 seconds for auto attack. All this on top of initiative

Buffs)

Everytime a thief uses steal, he will steal all of the enemy player’s money, which will be transferred into his inventory

That was the case of thieves in Ultima Online
They were wearing only simple robe w/o any gear and money,so if caught to not have anything to be looted from their corpse.

@Kasama,what you see from 2:50 to 3:21 is the old “Hide in Shadows”. Originally it was designed as long Stealth skill and later changed to what is now:Heal+short Stealth.Also there was an elite skill,that was basically ability that allow you to attack for several seconds w/o being revealed.So if you think now Thief is more powerful that was originally intended,you are terribly wrong.You took time and put a lot of effort to write this topic…I suggest invest this time in practice of avoiding particular melee skill with cast time(^%$#cough Compact Disc cough%^$#) and you will laugh at the P/D and S/D thieves in no time.Furthermore you can equip reliable Stunbreaker and you will laugh D/D and S/P burst thieves as well.

Do you guys realize that the topic is called “Thief and its gameplay”,not “Bads and their complaints about thief’s gameplay”

Stealth is Thief’s only damage-defense(beside plain running away),so it stays where it is.
And for those who haven’t learn to deal with it by now:…My condolences!

kKagari.6804:

Hm, sorry I have to disagree with most points except maybe stealth in greater abundance.

I think 4 seconds traited stealth is already WAY TOO LONG.

And here is the opinion of the game developers,concerning Stealth:

“We want every single class to deal situations in an unique manner – we keep “purity” in certain skills/traits i.e. only mesmers and thieves have stealth to deal with some situations. Not everyone have stealth but every class have a defensive mechanism they can use if they don’t stealth.”

In other words,Stealth is equivalent of things that you find in other classes,but you accept as something completely normal.Like almost double base HP of the warrior/necro and the access to various other damage counters like protections/invulnerabilities/e.t.c.

This will only favor the burst builds.To give them a better chance to get away if their burst fail.You put a lot of efforts for a useless purpose.

lordhelmos.7623:

Thoughts on adding an effect to the burning condition that does not allow burning foes to enter stealth while on fire.

I agree if the folowing things cannot happen if the target is on fire,bleeding,or poisoned:
1.Warrior cannot gain adrenaline and lose 8000hp
2.Necro cannot have minions,enter Death Shroud and lose 8000hp
3.Mesmer cannot have clones/illusions
4.Ranger don’t have pet
5.Ele cannot change attunements
6.Guardian loses all his passives
7.Engi cannot plant any turrets/mines/bombs e.t.c

You might wanna post this here:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Bugs-and-Issues-Compilation/page/5#post722339

Professor Sensei.2941:

Seems like they meant for thieves to be able to achieve extended forms of stealth.

Not like that imo.This thing has to go.Majority of the people who QQ for nerf are ignorant enough about the reality of Thief,so giving them another theme to exaggerate is the least we want.

Stiv.1820:

ZLE.8293:

Also Hide in Shadows>Withdraw.

Not always. D/P already has tons of access to stealth. Withdraw is instant and can’t be interrupted. Also a movement and evade ability which you can use more often since it has a short CD. It’s really not bad but I would probably only use it on D/P.

I can see your point there,but for a heavy burst build,HiS is great fight-reset that can heal you+give you the needed advantage to destroy your target.A matter of choice.

DanH.5879:

Dee Jay.2460:

The Cons are:
-Portals combined with Stealth may cause some serious balance issues.
-Thieves don’t care that, they are very unpopular hated amongst the WvW community.
-Other professions like Rangers or Engineers maybe in more dire need of such a buff.

fixed for you

Here we are…

And to the topic.It’s easier just to get rid off the portals,instead of giving them to all.

I definitely think that for such a burst gameplay that you search,D/D is better than D/P.
I also think that Shadowstep is better than Roll for Initiative for such a gameplay(i don’t say to run away,you can always HiS and Shadowstep back and Stick a BS in oponent’s.. …..back).
Also Hide in Shadows>Withdraw.

MightyMe.1356:

How come? No points in Deadly Arts at all? This tree focuses purely on stronger/more durable poisons.

Well it’s a matter of personal choice.There are roughly 2 condition types of builds.
1.Build that shares venom.They invest points in DA and also trait XII in Shadow Arts and Equip Thieves Guild.
2.Builds that doesn’t care about poisons and rely entirely on bleeds.They can’t burst,but have much higher survivabilty.They trait XI in Shadow arts and usualy equip Dagger Storm.Some of them invest 5 points in DA,but i prefer 20 in Trickery for shorter Caltrops CD.Also Trickery increases condition damage.

Ye i notice ,but it must have something to do with WvW,cuz in Heart of The Mists C&D(while giving 4 sec Stealth) resets the old Stealth.
Edit:No walls,only Golems,NPC’S,Svanir,Chieftan,Blue Lord e.t.c.
But i will go in empty Legacy of the Foefire and try on the enemy base wall as soon as i can .

Sin.4902:

ZLE.8293:

What you see in that video is not bug,neither exploit.That’s how C&D works.
It’s 100% intended and Thief doesn’t stack Stealth,just chain sustain it.Same can be done
with D/P.

Watch the whole video.

Hmm,i did!Indeed it stacks roughly 1 sec per Stealth(it showed only at the end of the video).That is not the case in Heart of The Mists.I must test it when i get back from work and if i can’t use it in my benefit i will agree with you that it must be fixed :P

What you see in that video is not bug,neither exploit.That’s how C&D works.
It’s 100% intended and Thief doesn’t stack Stealth,just chain sustain it.Same can be done
with D/P.

You can easily go 30 SA and still be a good direct damage build.
S/D is a typical example.Cond damage is more like 30 Shadow Arts,20 Acrobatics,20 Trickery.

Lufian Cweald.3574:

Yeah I know I was just hoping there may be an argument that would point me in the right direction.

There is no wrong direction,that’s the point.So figure it out what you want to do with that thief.Are you gonna go SPvP,or WvW,or dungeons,or all of them?Do you want to be the hit&run burst assassin or the stealthy and annoying bleed menace?Or something between.Share your visions/hopes and we will help you.

Well,you and you only can decide for yourself.Easiest way is to go to Heart of the Mist(the crossed swords on your top left),where you can equip top gear and test what playstyle you will enjoy the most.

I will make a ringtone from this song

OK,to sum it up:

Rayya.2591:

bunch of stuff
Personaly i belive this skill should have an lowered stealth time and thief can receive buffs in other skills /traits

ZLE.8293:

Looks like certain warrior had problems with some P/D bleed thief….

Rayya.2591:

looks like you did your homeworks bad, research better next time, thx
fact is, that i am borred of 40 minutes 1 vs 1 thief vs thief, and no i don’t use P/D , those traits can be used at any build.

Follows with a number of drama performances by the OP,when he acts like a good and experienced thief,who only sees the evil nature of Cloak&Dagger.

And suddenly in a different topic:

Rayya.2591:

I don’t have any problem with backstab thieves or S/D thieves on my warrior, and i dodge fights vs P/D thieves(wich i cannot counter because poor condition remove ability’s)

You could easily spare us your Oscar winning performance and just say:

“Look i am a Warrior and i die from P/D thieves.I don’t wanna change my precious “For Great Justice” for “Shake it Off”,so please ANet,nerf C&D and everyone will be happy.Or at least i will be happy.K.Bye."

OK let me put it this way….
We have build(P/D) that depends entirely on a melee skill(C&D).
And yet this build doesn’t have a single gap closer of any kind.
And yet is labeled as abusive,OP e.t.c.
I can’t find the logic….

Honestly,go warrior as soon as you can.Warrior is equally good in PvP(maybe not as mistake-forgiving in a noob level),he has almost double base HP,does great damage,he is times better in PvE and most of all it isn’t considered Overpowered.

Incurafy.6329:

ZLE.8293:

“Culling” is a side effect from the game engine.Basically it delays the speed with which the server is rendering the objects when they appear near you.In other words it makes objects that should be already visible at your screen,invisible.And naturally Thief benefits from this the most,because he is already invisible at some moments and with culling it’s like perma stealth.
Hope it makes sense.

Just thought I might add that this ONLY occurs in WvW and some highly populated world events (but it gives you no advantage in PvE).

Additionally, it’s not like perma-stealth, people exagerate just how much culling actually affects Thief/Mesmer stealth. It’s a couple of extra seconds at the most 9 times out of 10.

Indeed nice addition.You can’t fool the mobs,and in SPvP(the equivalent of battlegrounds) it’s not a problem.

@Peccavi,just to respond to your initial post: not having perma Stealth is not a problem.
Instead of toggled Perma Stealth who will only allow you to strike first initially ,in this game you have limited Stealth,which you can perform many many times.Conisider it like many mini-Vanishes.This results as a play style which you will find both very different from what you have played until now,but also very very satisfying as well.

“Culling” is a side effect from the game engine.Basically it delays the speed with which the server is rendering the objects when they appear near you.In other words it makes objects that should be already visible at your screen,invisible.And naturally Thief benefits from this the most,because he is already invisible at some moments and with culling it’s like perma stealth.
Hope it makes sense.

It sounds very roleplaying and i could see some very PvP oriented players could imagine themselves as a Deadly Assassinations Squad.Sadly in TPvP would fail so hard,since they will not be able to hold points.

I am out of my field,concerning dungeons.I can only help you kill people and stomp their faces.

Alias J.2610:

Hmm, so the right stats to focus on would be Condition Damage, Toughness, and Vitality, since Power and Precision wouldn’t help with the damage I deal in Bleeds/Poisons huh.

Indeed.Except in SPvP you don’t have amulet,that gives exactly those 3 stats.The next best thing is Carrion Amulet:condition damage,vit and power.

The rules are simple.Condition damage ignores toughness and protection at the cost of not being affected by crit and power.Seems fair.Then again it took Blizzard few years to allow bleeds to crit,so who knows

No, i mean Hidden Assassin.The 25 point minor trait in Shadow Arts that gives might when you Stealth.

Bingo!Also Hidden Assassin trait!

No!
Neither of those :Executioner,First Strikes,Exposed Weakness,Flaking Strikes e.t.c(in fact any trait,that states that increases damage)affect condition damage.
The only traits that affect it are the traits that give might.

I give you 2/10
Anyways,if you by any chance are serious,please post your build and we can discuss without guessing what you do and where you fail.

Kurow.6973:

An easy example: friend of mine was complaining about P/D thieves in WvW about a week and a half ago. Then I showed him how to counter it. Now he laughs every time he encounters a P/D thief as it’s become effortless for him to make the pests run for their lives unless they wish to stay and die.

And let me guess what super well kept secret and difficult technique you told him?:
1.Cripple the ^%$#&&^.
2.If they Stealth, after like 2-3 sec DODGE.
3.When they dodge/run towards you DODGE.

Albane.8367:

Thieves are stupidly overpowered right now because of Cloak and Dagger and culling. It is why 99% of the thief builds you see have an offhand dagger.

You are aware that thief can only use 2 kind of weapons in his offhand,right?Pistol and dagger.Mathematically this makes 50% chance a thief to have dagger in his offhand.if it’s more,so be it.If we look warrior,how many of them have greatsword equiped in some way?I would guess 100%.Is that making it OP too?

Stiv.1820:

The mobs are on both sides, you stated you are d/d so you can C&D mobs as well to get rid of them or drag the fight away.

He can,but he didn’t trait for regen and condition clear.He wanna big numbers.And that’s why all this whining is about!

I have a clue.I didn’t say i never been.I just don’t go anymore to this gear-grind fiesta and mindless zerg.The guy will C&D on a random mobs and bla bla bla.So in that case if you feel like complaining,you must formulate smtng like this:“Pls remove the critters e.t.c”,but stop BS-ing Cloak&Dagger

I don’t show my face out of Heart of The Mists,so it doesn’t matter where i am.I have 2gold or something,i don’t go to WvW ever.I have never been to any dungeon.All i do is Structured PvP.Tell me you server and i will transfer right away to you,it doesn’t bother me at all