“This is a guy who spent the entire match playing off point and trying to kill players where it makes absolutely no difference whatsoever.”
am I the only one that thinks a PvP mode should involve killing players and should matter more than standing on a point?
I agree with you and question why people even hold points in soloq. Go fight people.
People like you two are what ruin solo queue. Why try to hold points? Because whether you like it or not that is how you win. Seriously you two have just encapsulated why solo q is such horrid experience even outside of the bad matchmaking we have people like you two that apparently would go out of there way to cause loses by just pew pewing all over the map regardless of whether it helps you win or not. GO AWAY. Hotjoins and WvWvW are that way —-————————>
it appears that Spvp is not the location to showcase our pvp skills. for this I am sorry if it has rustled your Jimmies. I will no longer try to fight other players but instead try and decap an empty point for the entire match so we can “win” the pvp match.
I still dont know why you insist on getting 30 in spite when its not needed.
you want burning pick a target that already has burning on it and epidemic
Can the Leader or an Officer of [GF] Good Fight(s) (Not sure if it’s Fight or Fights) please pm? I have something I’d like to discuss…
Did Cookies call you Bad?
what defense? lol
we only have the ablility to tank dmg or lower the dmg done to us with weakness.
we have limited access to blinds, limited access to protection, no access to vigor, No Blocks.
we do have good access to regen but without much healing power it wont really help much.
This build is better.
133% bleed duration + 2039 condi dmg (25 stacks of Corruption) = nice epidemic’sEdit
Actually that calculator doesnt add sigil of bursting correctly. 2150 should be the correct amount of condi dmg with 25 stacks of corruption.Why? Why do you need transfusion? Dhuumfire+epidemic ftw (even if dhuumfire can be easily override with other burns it’s only condi burst option)
PVE dumbfire is just not the smart way to play.
Ill take 133% bleeding duration so I can stack and maintain 20+ bleeds on a target for the whole fight than get 5 or so seconds of burning.
Edit
Condi cap is 100% and only reason we can get 133% MAX is due to Lingering curses.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QwiTyE5vqw Please refer to this in depth guide.
(edited by Brando.1374)
That quote was referring to the hammer/longbow warrior build in PvP.
so why is it in the WvW forums?
This build is better.
133% bleed duration + 2039 condi dmg (25 stacks of Corruption) = nice epidemic’s
Edit
Actually that calculator doesnt add sigil of bursting correctly. 2150 should be the correct amount of condi dmg with 25 stacks of corruption.
(edited by Brando.1374)
This is wvw not spvp. Conditions rarely tick for the full duration unless your party is full of terrible players with horrible builds. Plus people can run huge condition reduction runes food and traits.
This ^^
+stability will negate necro CC (fear) and the 30/20/0/0/20 is not a tanky build, its actually very squishy if you know how to fight them.
so your mad we can counter a hammer train?
blind makes you miss your next attack, does not stack in intensity but in duration. be happy its like that.
if you are blinded auto attack once to clear it and proceed with the train.
its not our fault you dont pay attention to the conditions on you and waste a skill.
Side Thought - Make Terror do damage based on how ugly your character is…
Or, knowing our population, make the damage you take from Terror based on how attractive her character is….
;)
My dmg would be off the charts lol
If the game mode didnt require you to stand on a point you’d have to deal with Prismatic Understanding mesmers and permastealth/disengage thieves like you see in wvw. The only reason these things are worthless in pvp is the cap point – without it you’d face a bucket load of kitten the likes of which you just aren’t prepared for.
Im not saying remove the points, just give them less importance and more importance on fighting players on and especially off points.
Why cant we duel our friends in wvw, it would be soooo fun and wouldn’t change anything. Plus it would be super fun dueling loudmouth friendlies.Yes i know we could all duel in pvp but pvp changes armor and outcome and builds can be different because they dont have access to a rune etc. Plz Anet it would make my day xD
Rent your own Custom Arena, and duel all you want.
did you read the OP?
“Yes i know we could all duel in pvp but pvp changes armor and outcome and builds can be different…”
he doesn’t want to use the Spvp amulet system and I dont blame him.
“This is a guy who spent the entire match playing off point and trying to kill players where it makes absolutely no difference whatsoever.”
am I the only one that thinks a PvP mode should involve killing players and should matter more than standing on a point?
Ill talk a bit about the 2 classes I play
Necro (codi)- aoe dps, aoe condi application/removal, aoe boon removal
I use my necro to disable and dismantle the enemy while the rest or my group finished them. I use Blinds/chills/fears and cripple to disable the enemy. I use corrupt boon or well of corruption to dismantle boon reliant classes.
Thief - the Ultimate assassin. We are the masters of stealth and single target burst. Target the squishy Burst him down and if possible get the stomp off, if not them back away a bit and bring down their downed hp with SB. we are the Blast finisher kings/queens with SB.
I can permastealth with d/d without CnD…
I’m sorry sir, but could you please enlight me about how can you do that?
Smoke Screen + HS = 15 secs of stealth
Then use blindin powder or health for more stealth
Then use Shadow Refuge
By this time smoke screen should be off cooldown and repeat the above
you are using utilities where D/P does not need to waste its utilizes to achieve perma stealth
dumbfire condi build
30/20/0/0/20 with scepter/dagger + staff Rabid gear
Dont really play power that much so I dont want to give incorrect or non up to date info.
D/P is the most abused Spec a thief has in WvW.
Get below 50% health BP+HS away to heal up and reset the fight.
Takes almost no skill since you can literally pick and choose who you fight and when to fight.
at least with D/D you had to CnD of something to re-stealth. with D/P you can stay in stealth almost 100% of the time without having to be in melee range.
Even though we wont do it for Dec 10. I just wanted to throw out a wacky possible idea for Dhuumfire that we could discuss…
- Life Blast has a 100% chance to cause Burning on hit (2 seconds long). 6 seconds ICD.
Obviously the #s are ballpark and not necessarily final. The % chance, duration, and ICD are all subject to change.
Jon
A lot of these considerations, unfortunately, don’t make a lot of sense.
We should consider the following realities:
- A damaging condition in the Power line both hurts condition builds that want it and limits power builds that don’t want it
- Having it force power players to use LB to get the burn may have some validity in PvP, but drives this trait further into the mud for PvE where LB is inferior DPS to Dagger
Consider the following instead, Jon:
- Move Withering Precision from Curses to Spite Grandmaster
- Move Dhuumfire from Spite to Curses Grandmaster and DON’T change it
- Move Terror up to Grandmaster
- Drop Lingering Curses down to Master
- Move Weakening Shroud up to Master and DON’T change duration
- Move Spectral Attunement down to Adept
Withering Precision: Deal 15% more damage to foes suffering from Weakness.
Siphoned Power: Deal 10% more damage when you have over 90% HP or 90% Death Shroud.This does the following things:
- Conditionmancers are forced to take either Terror or Dhuumfire, but they can’t have both
- Dhuumfire is a cover condition for other conditions and can have longer durations depending on condition duration investment, but fear doing damage is also very powerful. From this position, you could possibly even buff Dhuumfire to bring it into line with Terror since they occupy the same trait spot on a bar.
- Weakening Shroud is kept valuable with its new synergy with the new Withering Precision, which is now in the Power line
- Withering Precision goes to the Spite line and actually provides a dps boost comparable to Close to Death with different conditions, which actually helps PvE necros too
- New Siphoned Power has synergy with Death Shroud because you can activate it when health is over 90% and keep it there safely, and this trait significantly helps power Necros in both PvP and PvE to actually be worth packing over condition variants
Love the Idea of Making a necro choose to get burning or terror!!!!!
a necro should not be able to get both at the same time!
Even though we wont do it for Dec 10. I just wanted to throw out a wacky possible idea for Dhuumfire that we could discuss…
- Life Blast has a 100% chance to cause Burning on hit (2 seconds long). 6 seconds ICD.
Obviously the #s are ballpark and not necessarily final. The % chance, duration, and ICD are all subject to change.
Jon
make it 100% when life blast crits not when it hits.
and keep the 10s CD.
The main issue is because Dhuumfire is a high-damage cover condition on a necro. Condtidion necros without counting Dhuumfire typically apply bleeding, poison, weakness, cripple, chill, and torment in their standard play, and that’s before counting the Fear to lock our target out of most condition cleanses.
Dhuumfire is hated because it is high damage that doesn’t actually matter much to the necro, but prevents cleansing of the far more dangerous bleed stack. The necro spent no time at all in adding Burning and, given its short duration, doesn’t really care if it gets removed.
High damage? I have no idea what you are talking about. There is nothing high about it.
at my condi dmg when I run 30/20/0/0/20 is 1890 with will equal about 801 burning dmg per second!
now combine that with:
10 stacks of bleeds - 1370
poison = 269
fear = 1k+no add that together and you get around 3440 dmg a second for lets say 3 seconds thats 10,320 dmg!!
so please tell me again how that is not High dmg?
You are talking about all of those conditions. I am just refering to the grandmaster trait dhuumfire and itself is not that high that it gets ridiculous. imo Backstab is high, earthshaker is high etc.
BS and Earthshaker can be dodged, blinded, blocked and they need to be in melee range.
Burning is guaranteed damage for a necro, burning cannot be blocked blinded or dodged, you do NOT need to be in melee range for this to proc.Weird that wvw matches you never see an army of necros for that damage. It’s an army of warriors and guardians for the damage. You know why, because direct damage is king, condiotion damage is weak, very weak so it will never be high damage in my book.
do you want to know why warrors and guards are the class to be in wvw:
1. AOE condi clear with shouts/utilites
2. AOE boon application
3. Regen, regen regen
4. warrior only (condition immunity)
5. cleave dmg
so yes in WvW when the Noobs zergs all day power is better.
when it comes to skilled play a good group of condi necros can shut down another group no problem. (we have dont it when we zerg bust and in GvG’s)
Back to the Dumbfire topic
it should just be removed instead of Nerfing our other skills because of how strong burning is.
(edited by Brando.1374)
I remember when we did this to BP.
My question is why do we keep getting nerfs to bleeds/terror when the real problem began with DumbFire?
any word on removing this trait and reverting the nerfs we have had since this trait was introduced?
The main issue is because Dhuumfire is a high-damage cover condition on a necro. Condtidion necros without counting Dhuumfire typically apply bleeding, poison, weakness, cripple, chill, and torment in their standard play, and that’s before counting the Fear to lock our target out of most condition cleanses.
Dhuumfire is hated because it is high damage that doesn’t actually matter much to the necro, but prevents cleansing of the far more dangerous bleed stack. The necro spent no time at all in adding Burning and, given its short duration, doesn’t really care if it gets removed.
High damage? I have no idea what you are talking about. There is nothing high about it.
at my condi dmg when I run 30/20/0/0/20 is 1890 with will equal about 801 burning dmg per second!
now combine that with:
10 stacks of bleeds – 1370
poison = 269
fear = 1k+no add that together and you get around 3440 dmg a second for lets say 3 seconds thats 10,320 dmg!!
so please tell me again how that is not High dmg?
You are talking about all of those conditions. I am just refering to the grandmaster trait dhuumfire and itself is not that high that it gets ridiculous. imo Backstab is high, earthshaker is high etc.
BS and Earthshaker can be dodged, blinded, blocked and they need to be in melee range.
Burning is guaranteed damage for a necro, burning cannot be blocked blinded or dodged, you do NOT need to be in melee range for this to proc.
make capping a point only give points when you cap it. this will give the server an incentive to defend the tower/keep as you dont want the other server to get more points than you. (reward for defending MUST BE GREATER than capping for this to work)(also AC need to be Nerfed to Hell)
killing players should give you the same Points as wxp. the longer the enemy is alive the more points he is worth so no exploiting going on there.
I feel so awful right now running perplex engi
But it’s completely necessary to fight “roam” groups of 5
On another note, why do JQ roamers deem it necessary to /laugh every time they swarm you with 15 people? Is that typical of T1?
JQ roamers feel like beating us 15v1 is an accomplishment. if it was 15v2 they would have lost. so they need something to feel good about themselves.
Terrible idea
why?
I would LOVE WvW is this happened.
Zerg busting guilds (gvg guilds) will be the main source of PPT instead of the mindless zergs.
The main issue is because Dhuumfire is a high-damage cover condition on a necro. Condtidion necros without counting Dhuumfire typically apply bleeding, poison, weakness, cripple, chill, and torment in their standard play, and that’s before counting the Fear to lock our target out of most condition cleanses.
Dhuumfire is hated because it is high damage that doesn’t actually matter much to the necro, but prevents cleansing of the far more dangerous bleed stack. The necro spent no time at all in adding Burning and, given its short duration, doesn’t really care if it gets removed.
High damage? I have no idea what you are talking about. There is nothing high about it.
at my condi dmg when I run 30/20/0/0/20 is 1890 with will equal about 801 burning dmg per second!
now combine that with:
10 stacks of bleeds – 1370
poison = 269
fear = 1k+
no add that together and you get around 3440 dmg a second for lets say 3 seconds thats 10,320 dmg!!
so please tell me again how that is not High dmg?
It’s funny,Dhuumfire isnt even that good.
then they should remove it and give us something else. or revert the nerfs that came after dumbfire.
removing bleeds from necro will not slow us down as much as you think.
Dumbfire needs to be removed or changed to torment instead.Dhuumfire doesn’t even belong in that traitline. IMO Dhuumfire and Terror need both be Grandmaster Curse traits, that way only one or another can be obtained. Then toss Spite a bone with some sort of Vulnerability or Chill focused trait, more appropriate for the Spite line’s design.
I agree. Make Necro’s choose between Terror or burning would be the best thing to every happen to this class.
all the Meta players will QQ and move away from this class while those who really know how to play their necro will have no problems with this.
Bleeds are not what made people complain about necro’s. it was Dumbfire!
they should remove or change burning to torment or another way to apply poison.
removing bleeds from necro will not slow us down as much as you think.
Dumbfire needs to be removed or changed to torment instead.
for all out 1-2 hit burst D/D thief wins (will die if you look at him funny)
http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/thief/?7.0|8.5g.h2.8.5g.h14.d13.0.d13|5.5c.h4.d13.0.0|1g.7e.1g.7e.1g.7e.1g.7e.1g.7e.1g.7e|2s.d13.2s.d13.3s.d19.2s.d13.3s.d19.2s.d13|p49.u26c.0.0.f4|6f.1|58.5f.5h.5b.0|eI would say close to this, but if you are just setting up for pure burst, I would say pick up Assassins Signet and the Prcision one. Take the 20% more damage while target is under 50% to really push damage after the backstab or to set up for a really nasty Backstab. Ether way D/D 25/30/0/0/15 is the best burst as far as class and set up will go. It requires little to no time to set up and the full bust is less than 2 seconds.
reason I picked random signets is for the trait which gives 5 stacks of might when a sig is activated. essentially you will have 22 stacks of might when you CnD and BS which can be huge.
also I picked 100% crit from stealth because its 100% chance to crit lol and I like to crit
for all out 1-2 hit burst D/D thief wins (will die if you look at him funny)
http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/thief/?7.0|8.5g.h2.8.5g.h14.d13.0.d13|5.5c.h4.d13.0.0|1g.7e.1g.7e.1g.7e.1g.7e.1g.7e.1g.7e|2s.d13.2s.d13.3s.d19.2s.d13.3s.d19.2s.d13|p49.u26c.0.0.f4|6f.1|58.5f.5h.5b.0|e
what do you guys think about this build?
Effective Power 5089.83
Effective Health (EHP) 23505
no he wasnt a D/D thief
he was D/P
here are his stats:20k hp
100% crit dmg
20% precision
3000 power(but can easily get 3400 with might stacking)
over 2000 toughnessive killed all kinds of thieves fine but this one was just ridiculous
I can theory craft a thief with similar stats, just not the 20k HP. 17.5k is the highest I can get it while keeping power (not attack) at 2991 with a crit chance around 20% and 102% crit dmg. with around 1996 toughness ( a bit over 3k armor)
he will need 25 stacks of Bloodlust
full stacks of guard leech and applied fortitude and hold the 3 bloodlust map buffs in order to have those #’s though.
Go to manual to add the power/vit/toughness he should have with the buffs I mentioned above.
go to Ebay.
you can get rid of 25 stacks of bloodlust or guard leach or applied fortitude when the person is downed.
you can not get rid of Bloodlust from the 5 cap points.
You mean a build like this?
"Not running dhuumfire."
Good Vid showing what a necro can really do even without that trait which so many rely on.
0/30/20/20/0 (my daily wvw and GvG build)
The pressure is still there, its just a different playstyle where you are not going to insta down people. it does take a little bit more time to down someone but I never really notice the difference.
for a GvG I normally test out Terror to see it will have any real effect in the match. if it doesnt I go for spectral attunement. the other 2 in curses are chilling darkness and focused rituals.
running in a smaller group I still use the same 0/30/20/20/0 but with different traits and utilities.
isnt that what I had in my original post?
My personal TPvP rules:
Always back cap
Never fight outnumbered
so try not to fight players unless you have even numbers or you outnumber the other players, got it.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNBIhZSwTPRIpoZUb6R3AX4gU4epB-TsAA1CtIQShkDJDSSksIN+Y9xsAA
Updated.
Played 3 matched during my lunch break and so far its fun.
Im tanky as hell lol
get warhorn
Only reason I did go for that is since I dont have consume conditions I use dagger 4 to help with condi removal.
Don’t use death nova then, use trait that makes your minions draw conditions.
ok Ill try that out.
get warhorn
Only reason I did go for that is since I dont have consume conditions I use dagger 4 to help with condi removal.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNAoYWjEat6la+a07JCpHRjaTbSR3AHkC3LNA-TsAA1CtIQShkDJDSSksIN+Y9xsAA
Let me know what you guys think.
First time playing a MM build (Spvp)
Use this build and you should be able to BS for 10k+
stats:
attack = 3.7k
Crit chance = 45-50% or 100% in stealth
crit dmg = 121% for a total of 277% crit dmg
with 20 stacks of might and 25 stacks of Bloodlust your attack will reach around 4.6k
now to add the %dmg
15% from weapons (force and night)
10% from rune 6 (hp above 90%)
30% from traits (Exposed Weakness, Dagger Training, First Strikes, Flanking Strikes)
for a total of 55% more dmg.
(edited by Brando.1374)
I just tried it in a hotjoin and it blows compared to other necro builds.