Best map to get gold and dimishing returns
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: FrostDraco.8306
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: FrostDraco.8306
The new Bitterfrost Frontier map also seems to be good place with tons of events every minute, but as those two have dimishing return maybe that is why people choose Tarir?
Events? People farm Tarir by abusing the taxi system to farm the reward chests under Tarir 10+ times per cycle. In Bitterfrost, you basically do the same thing by collecting the frozen chests, then hop to a new map to do it again. There’s no DR on chests.
Frozen Chests loot sucks, the gold in Bitter Frost is on events.
It doesn’t suck. It’s almost a full bag of loot+berries for one run, which is about 5-10mins, per character.
Lynx and moa are high dps pets for Non-HoT builds.
0% life force at the start of a pvp match is brutal
If death spiral gave an immob or stun, I think it would be a lot better on single target/1v1 situations.
I completely agree, however the quote is being hyperbolic. If I didn’t think the necro class was great, i wouldn’t have multiple necro’s. However its getting annoying with every patch, there seems to be nerfs to the most used skills, and buffs to the least used weapons.
It becomes even more of an issue with how social this game is, especially when its regarding necromancer use in raids/high teir fractals. I have a thick skin, granted, but it’s annoying that I am simply ignored or disregarded as a special snowflake when playing my favorite build (valk shout reaper). Which is only slightly different from the same build I was using pre-HoT.
For me its just going in brawler style and coming out the last person standing. Even in spvp a lot of time I join a team fight late to just slaughter the enemy team with aoe dmg, chill, poison, cripple, and blinds. I’ve had so many spvp games where I have never die even once.
It’s a bit of the same for pve. So tanky, especially with traits like blighters boon.
Then there is my condi necro, which melts things in an aoe, not to mention all while being able to send condi’s back at opportune moments.
U and anet share the same opinion of how the necro is doing.
Guess the necro is fine.
I just wish some 1 from the balance team would streem his gameplay while solo quing.
But probly they r right, and everything is fine .
U sound like 1 mans army can u 1vs 5 also
You don’t know my opinion on the state of necro, so stop pretending like you even have a clue.
15 charrs
/end thread
I havent done any of the hungry cats. So thats not the case for me.
Snow leopard… not lion.
Edited to reflect that.
For me its just going in brawler style and coming out the last person standing. Even in spvp a lot of time I join a team fight late to just slaughter the enemy team with aoe dmg, chill, poison, cripple, and blinds. I’ve had so many spvp games where I have never die even once.
It’s a bit of the same for pve. So tanky, especially with traits like blighters boon.
Then there is my condi necro, which melts things in an aoe, not to mention all while being able to send condi’s back at opportune moments.
So I made a mistake and spent all my money converting my gear to Viper just before the recent nerf. I’m fairly casual now-a-days so it seems daunting and wasteful to switch my gear back to Berserker or Valk. What is the best casual PvE build with Viper gear? I would prefer power because I like that weapon set and playstyle but Viper feels pretty weak with GS.
Edit: Forgot to mention I also farmed Runes of Thorns. I am additionally sad about that. lol
1.) Dont run viper and GS. Its viper and scepter/dagger+warhorn on swap, a staff for utility.
2.) Don’t feel bad at all, just make a new necro.
If you are playing viper just because its ‘meta’ then there is the issue. Why not just play power reaper from the start since you like it more?
Why would you? Most fractal pugs dont care what you are running, even if its not a dps build. So long as you know the mechanics and are pulling your weight, people rarely have anything to say.
For the ones that specify in LFg, don’t join them, there will be other squads who arent so picky. And for the elitist why try to chastize others for their builds choices, I personally just mock them until they ragequit squad and block me. Normally they suck anyway, and I don’t mind never squadding with them again. But again, this occurrence is very rare on my power reaper (full valk).
I don’t know if anyone has noticed this before, I looked up the thing on the forums and there was no results.
There are several snow leopard cubs that you can save in the Bitter Cold area of Bitter frost frontier. If I recall there are 3 on top of the water fall.
When you save all 3, one of them starts to follow you around. And when you talked to it earlier, you will get the message that the cub is fond of you for saving it. Well when you return to your home instance..the cub is there as well and follows you around.
Edit: I came back to my home instance today and found dead birds that I could clean up? Maybe related?
(edited by FrostDraco.8306)
i think for power build self maintaining vuln wont be too bad. because power builds tend to go with Spite trait line. With Reaper trait line synergy can apply vuln on freeze very rapidly. Then u also got vuln spreading in shroud trait in Spite that works pretty well on adds. Reaper 5 + whirl finish stacks freeze and vuln pretty quickly. then u got reaper 3 fear that applies freeze taht applies vuln due to trait synergy.
these are just burts of vulnerability. not consistent. apart from that you have to drop dps traits
What are you talking about dude? Rending shroud? Vuln on every shroud auto attack? How is that not the definition of consistent?
Well you got to much sustain to get same dps as thief and elem would you be willing to lose shroud to compensate?
Apparently you haven’t seen thief sustain, or the fact ele’s can heal themselves consistently.
ele and thief get 1 hit constantly in raids. maybe play one for awhile and see the struggle.
I have 1k+ hours on my necro, and 800 on my thief. I started this game off playing thief when people considered them trash tier and even refused to take them in dungeons. If you are being one shot in raids as a thief. Maybe you should drop some dps and pick up a slightly tankier set. Seriously, 3 dodges, a 2.5sec block, and multiple ways to keep topped off hp, and constant endurance regen. You should barely even get hit if you are playing the thief well.
There is not struggle atm for thieves, they have a defined dps role. And even support (venom share/tank venom share). And there is DEFINATELY no struggle for eles. A class that has protection uptime almost as good as a revs, and multiple skills to block/become invuln. All while having massive support and massive personal dps.
Necro has neither of these. Mediocre dps, terrible support, and mediocre survivability because they are literally little skills to supplement the high hp pool. If you take the traits for protection you are dropping your dps even lower.
(edited by FrostDraco.8306)
Well you got to much sustain to get same dps as thief and elem would you be willing to lose shroud to compensate?
Apparently you haven’t seen thief sustain, or the fact ele’s can heal themselves consistently.
Its a challenge mode. Not the regular fractal. I highly doubt ANYONE has even considered this.
Save this post for when someone actually goes on about nerfing it? Right now its just QQ.
to the op:
1) your build is not the optimal power reaper build, it would require gear changes and a lot of concious decisions for every encounter and dmg rotation
2) power reaper is not meta by any means but that doesn’t stop you from running it and being decent (only when you optimize it)
3) i only run as power reaper in dungeons and fractals, i am minmaxed and pugs seem to accept me (of course i dont join lfg’s that ask for viper specifically because that would be me being a kitten)
4) dont use brazil builds
5) here (message to minmaxers: valkyrie only in theory is optimal, perfect circumstances are not something that will happen to a reaper because when you choose to play reaper you automatically choose to not have nice things)
>Telling people not to use Brazil builds
>Telling people valk isnt optimal when we can cap 100% without blinking.
Necro’s dont need perfect circumstances. Thats why it’s a selfish class. Instead of bringing party buffs, it brings it’s own. Thats why brazil has 2 versions of the build. one for raiding, and one for pug/solo play. I was using a similar build way before his videos on it were made. And a lot of other power necro’s use similar setups because we cap on crit so easily.
I would love for ANET to make a UW update with content… but unfortunately most of the mayor content creators (Specially WP) hate UW and they never give any recommendations on how to fix it, or they just want to focus on all the other components of the game.
Not acknowledging all the awesome cultures, lore and possible event that can become part of the GW2 universe.
I watch all of WP’s video’s. He has never stated this to my knowledge, and has hoped they would bring it back for some time( Just watch his videos on the new pvp maps, and raid on the capricorn). Don’t go around name dropping unless you can confirm your claims.
I just got picked up by a guild that trains raiders and Raids supposedly every day of the week. They seemed wary when I mentioned I was a Support Power Reaper but then I pointed out there was a build on I Metabattle that calmed them down.
Find a new guild then. Just because it’s on meta battle doesn’t mean its a good build for the comp they are running. Anyone who knows anything about necro knows about blood magic support. I don’t see why mentioning metabattle would have made a difference there if they knew anything about necromancer.
I think you don’t understand Blood Magic.
Vamp traits are currently by far our best sustain option. And that’s just one part of BM, there’s more to it than just Transfusion, you know.
I kind of disagree here. I run a hyper sustain build that doesn’t use bloodmagic at all. It uses BB, and other sustain tools from spite/soul reaping, to give me massive amounts of life force, which means i can pop in and out of shroud consistently when there are 2 or more enemies (i run shouts as well).
It gives me a lot of team fight presence, and most games (unranked), i never die. Not once.
Ignore them. Problem solved.
So Can we discuss about 4 necro 1 druid meta “again” ? I dont understand the logic behind this. I would prolly change 1 necro into a rev or ps war. Druid in pug is also awful because people never stack properly but that’s not my point here.
I just wanna say 4 necro 1 druid meta is terribad -_-. I’m actually amazed by how many people think it’s good. I’m at NA server, is EU meta also the same?
I think you’re confusing ‘meta’ with ‘popular’ and/or with ‘good’. It’s a popular choice because it works regardless of player skill. That doesn’t make it efficient or even good; it just makes it safe.
Which makes it impossible to find a fractal pug recruiting anything but condi necros.
I’m gonna start pugging fractals as a power necro for teh lulz.
Power necro is my main in fractals. Never had an issue with not being allowed into a squad that didnt specify condi necro. Hell some squads just want any necro lol.
It would depend a lot on your class, your current condi’s, and whether or not you’ve been recently downed (skill cd’s).
also threads like dis makes wonder what would happen if dungeons still gave nice gold. I’m refferimg to arah and lupi xD also bloom is just an easier lupi be at least abit glad theres something likenthat in fractals
Strange. I find lupi easier than bloom.
You could have avoided the whole situation.
Ok. Noted. But again, you are preaching to the choir.
Knowing that the oakheart has a KD and choosing to stay and continue to res was your first mistake,
I never said I didn’t know that the oakheart has a knock down. It’s plain obvious that it does. Don’t put words in my mouth.
not identifying that Bloom was within leaping distance to the downed player was your second,
Another assumption. Can you actually go on the information I gave you, not other BS that I never said and is just you trying to take the kitten? And even if he is in leaping distance that doesn’t mean he will in fact leap.
not knowing who the oakheart and bloom had aggro on was your third.
Another assumption. I never said this.
If you had the aggro, you should have kited the mobs away from the downed person and not gone for the res.
Which I didn’t. Or did you miss the part about it being totally unexpected? Did you even read my post? Seems like you are just here to put words in my mouth and tell me things I’ve already figured out, way before you came along.
If someone else had aggro, then you should have told them to get away from the vicinity while you rubbed the down person.
….Do you even play t4? No seriously. Bloom can change aggro at anytime. It’s not purely based on “who is closest”. But if you have actually done t4 swamp and still don’t know this. Stop trying to use it in an argument, because you are clearly speaking from ignorance. I wouldn’t have ressed the person if bloom was in the vicinity. But of course, YOU, are the only person that could possibly think of that.
kitten right off.
Shouldn’t have to mention all this to someone who “pugged their way to 100 and got their legendary fractal backpiece all on their own”.
You didn’t. You came here and responded days after this was even posted. on top of that you have the audacity to accuse me of things that you can’t possibly know. Your post was useless.
I wonder how all those whiners are actually playing fractals. Blindfolded with one hand tied behind their back (or to something else that’s not mouse and keyboard)? Bloomy does not require anything but a minimal amount of attention. His deadly attacks have clear and rather long windup times, so you can usually simply walk out. If dodges are needed, you have plenty due to the wisp regeneration buff. Trash in the onslaught phase dies from a few autoattacks.
So wtf is supposed to be difficult about swampland? Paying a little bit of attention for a few minutes? Very demanding …
I’ll answer that. My necro has 32k hp, and bloomhunger was still able to oneshot me in scale 89. And it does a lot of 24k+ hits. Which I think is complete BS.
My problem isnt his mechanics. Those are easy. My problem is that even with a tanky build his numbers are way too overtuned. But perhaps its my fault for not kicking the garbage condi necro’s that were in squad. Who knows.
>the mechanics are easy
>I die to him with a 32k necro who also has access to shroudpal, the problem is you, not the fight. Get better at the game and learn to use the dodge button at the right time. Bloomhunger got even easier with the removal of lethargic as you have normal endurance regen everywhere now and double that inside the wisp fields. That’s before anything else such as vigor you might get from whatever sources.
Can’t dodge while I’m knocked down. Can’t use shroud if you get one shot. Endurance regen isn’t even a factor for something you couldn’t dodge.
Did you even read my post? 32k hp in ONE hit. That’s a bit much don’t you think?
But ofc all the idiots will say “just learn to dodge”, or “you have shroud”, as if i dont already kittening know that.
And what’s the reason for getting knocked down? Exactly, you didn’t dodge in the first place nor did you consider bringing a stunbreak if this is an issue for you. Do you, by any chance, also bring Rise most of the time?
Also, the highest hit from bloom I remember was a 24k crit on my necro, no idea if getting hit for 32k actually happens, but since I don’t remember all damage values I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt with that one, could be possible on 89 I assume.
I do in fact use rise. Power necro here. Was ressing someone when the champ oakheart knocked me down. Then bloom did his jump attack. Which i couldnt dodge because I was still knocked over.
It’s one of those WTF moments. Everyone is acting like it’s a regular occurence or that it’s clearly a sign that i don’t know what dodge is, as if they are the only ones that can think of that. I just think it’s BS being punished with an instant K.O. on a slightly tanky build for being hit by one attack. But of course on the forums, keyboard warriors will act like you can dodge ‘every’ attack, to make themselves seem better.
Generally I don’t rez someone if there is a mob near me or them but then again I play zerk ele so I don’t have the luxury of 32k health with a second health bar on top. My utilities are taken up with signet of fire, glyph of storms and usually frost bow so it’s not like I have invulnerability rezzing either. Just let them die if they are in a bad spot and come rez them later or just do it without them if the others are competent.
Also 32k health if you’re not counting deathshroud isn’t a slightly tanky build, it’s very tanky. You also said it happened maybe once? OK so it’s one mistake just shrug it off, I’ve gone down to the mobs from the onslaught once or twice when casting meteor, it happens to us all. I don’t see why you’re making a big deal about a single one shot attack you happened to get hit by in an awkward situation.
I like swamp now, feels like a real fractal and not an afk brain off mode. Certainly like how you can’t cheese it either.
Yea, my DS is 28k on its own. I run valk with wurm runes. I took the person advice above you, and ran a second and 3rd stun break. Especially when running with a full necro party.
if you still have problems with swamp….
Get a daredevil/tempest and learn to dodge as it and are the 2 classes that force you to l2dodge the best.
It’s funny because my main before necro was theif.
I wonder how all those whiners are actually playing fractals. Blindfolded with one hand tied behind their back (or to something else that’s not mouse and keyboard)? Bloomy does not require anything but a minimal amount of attention. His deadly attacks have clear and rather long windup times, so you can usually simply walk out. If dodges are needed, you have plenty due to the wisp regeneration buff. Trash in the onslaught phase dies from a few autoattacks.
So wtf is supposed to be difficult about swampland? Paying a little bit of attention for a few minutes? Very demanding …
I’ll answer that. My necro has 32k hp, and bloomhunger was still able to oneshot me in scale 89. And it does a lot of 24k+ hits. Which I think is complete BS.
My problem isnt his mechanics. Those are easy. My problem is that even with a tanky build his numbers are way too overtuned. But perhaps its my fault for not kicking the garbage condi necro’s that were in squad. Who knows.
>the mechanics are easy
>I die to him with a 32k necro who also has access to shroudpal, the problem is you, not the fight. Get better at the game and learn to use the dodge button at the right time. Bloomhunger got even easier with the removal of lethargic as you have normal endurance regen everywhere now and double that inside the wisp fields. That’s before anything else such as vigor you might get from whatever sources.
Can’t dodge while I’m knocked down. Can’t use shroud if you get one shot. Endurance regen isn’t even a factor for something you couldn’t dodge.
Did you even read my post? 32k hp in ONE hit. That’s a bit much don’t you think?
But ofc all the idiots will say “just learn to dodge”, or “you have shroud”, as if i dont already kittening know that.
And what’s the reason for getting knocked down? Exactly, you didn’t dodge in the first place nor did you consider bringing a stunbreak if this is an issue for you. Do you, by any chance, also bring Rise most of the time?
Also, the highest hit from bloom I remember was a 24k crit on my necro, no idea if getting hit for 32k actually happens, but since I don’t remember all damage values I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt with that one, could be possible on 89 I assume.
I do in fact use rise. Power necro here. Was ressing someone when the champ oakheart knocked me down. Then bloom did his jump attack. Which i couldnt dodge because I was still knocked over.
It’s one of those WTF moments. Everyone is acting like it’s a regular occurence or that it’s clearly a sign that i don’t know what dodge is, as if they are the only ones that can think of that. I just think it’s BS being punished with an instant K.O. on a slightly tanky build for being hit by one attack. But of course on the forums, keyboard warriors will act like you can dodge ‘every’ attack, to make themselves seem better.
Try dodging, watching his attacks and not clicking your skills.
If you’ve made it to T4 without these abilities, you’ve been the bane of a lot of pugs. Please don’t be so inconsiderate.
Please don’t speak on something you don’t know? I’m one of the few people that pugs every fractal, and often has smooth runs. In fact i spend most of my time explaining to people that pugging fractals is just fine. But of course, it’s easy to dismiss me as someone who has no experience, or is just bad at the game.
I got my fractal personal level to 100 with no help outside of pugs. Got my legendary back, with no help outside of pugs. I literally pug everything. And very rarely am I the ‘bane’, it’s the opposite. Save me the theatrics.
How condescending can you get?
(edited by FrostDraco.8306)
I wonder how all those whiners are actually playing fractals. Blindfolded with one hand tied behind their back (or to something else that’s not mouse and keyboard)? Bloomy does not require anything but a minimal amount of attention. His deadly attacks have clear and rather long windup times, so you can usually simply walk out. If dodges are needed, you have plenty due to the wisp regeneration buff. Trash in the onslaught phase dies from a few autoattacks.
So wtf is supposed to be difficult about swampland? Paying a little bit of attention for a few minutes? Very demanding …
I’ll answer that. My necro has 32k hp, and bloomhunger was still able to oneshot me in scale 89. And it does a lot of 24k+ hits. Which I think is complete BS.
My problem isnt his mechanics. Those are easy. My problem is that even with a tanky build his numbers are way too overtuned. But perhaps its my fault for not kicking the garbage condi necro’s that were in squad. Who knows.
>the mechanics are easy
>I die to him with a 32k necro who also has access to shroudpal, the problem is you, not the fight. Get better at the game and learn to use the dodge button at the right time. Bloomhunger got even easier with the removal of lethargic as you have normal endurance regen everywhere now and double that inside the wisp fields. That’s before anything else such as vigor you might get from whatever sources.
Can’t dodge while I’m knocked down. Can’t use shroud if you get one shot. Endurance regen isn’t even a factor for something you couldn’t dodge.
Did you even read my post? 32k hp in ONE hit. That’s a bit much don’t you think?
But ofc all the idiots will say “just learn to dodge”, or “you have shroud”, as if i dont already kittening know that.
Honestly most people who aren’t getting kills, dps is not the issue. It’s the mechanics.
Even with an enrage timer you can still kill the boss. 1-2% hp and then going enrage is not a big deal as you can still finish it off. Focus on not wiping first. For training runs, minstrels might be better for your group, as it relives a lot of pressure off your healer, allows you to take more dps in squad, and gives you a cushion for when you kitten up.
Ignore what the people who are saying “its bad” are going on about. As long as you got the kill, it does not matter unless you are doing a speed run.
I wonder how all those whiners are actually playing fractals. Blindfolded with one hand tied behind their back (or to something else that’s not mouse and keyboard)? Bloomy does not require anything but a minimal amount of attention. His deadly attacks have clear and rather long windup times, so you can usually simply walk out. If dodges are needed, you have plenty due to the wisp regeneration buff. Trash in the onslaught phase dies from a few autoattacks.
So wtf is supposed to be difficult about swampland? Paying a little bit of attention for a few minutes? Very demanding …
I’ll answer that. My necro has 32k hp, and bloomhunger was still able to oneshot me in scale 89. And it does a lot of 24k+ hits. Which I think is complete BS.
My problem isnt his mechanics. Those are easy. My problem is that even with a tanky build his numbers are way too overtuned. But perhaps its my fault for not kicking the garbage condi necro’s that were in squad. Who knows.
No one has said this. What a sad strawman. Also if you have 10k AP if never sat foot in a dungeon, you still have 10k AP, which means you have still played more than someone with 2k Ap.
You don’t get 10k in a short period of time. You had to do dailies for one thousand days at least, but the chances of that being your ONLY source of AP, are laughable.
So what you’re saying is that you proved my point, and that ignoring you doesn’t work. And I can’t exactly block you here, now can I?
You really like picking apart every little bit of what I say, and separate parts of sentences in order to make it look like something I said doesn’t make sense.
Anyway, I still want to hear a dev’s opinion on this. I’m a bit bored of hotshot tryhards ‘explaining’ to me why I’m wrong for asking the people who make the game if it would be possible to add a new feature. Maybe I’ll start a new thread and say I want responses from people at ANet or something. Of course, then I’d get told I’m not being fair to real players by excluding them from the conversation or some crap like that.
No one is making you respond. No one is making you visit this thread.
You don’t seem to understand what my argument is, which is probably due to you not actually reading what I have to say.
No one said you were ‘wrong’. What we said was that it’s a useless waste of time and resources to code. But of course you don’t know that, because you haven’t actually read the responses you have gotten.
Code and game options don’t just pop into existence. They require someone to sit down and work on them, which takes time, which takes money. At which point is the time and money it takes to make something not worth making it?
And you have done nothing but prove my point. You are thin skinned, and can’t take any criticism, or even prove a good argument for the things you want. “Because I want it and we should have it”, is not an argument. It’s just you claiming things which people may not agree with you on.
You can yell over and over that hiding certain things won’t stop people, but you still forget that there’s a startling lack of privacy options
Startling? You must be extremely new to MMO’s. Most games don’t allow you to hide ANYTHING. The fact that you gear isn’t displayed (or your stats), in itself is something 99% of other MMO’s don’t allow other players to do.
I don’t care about the ~~~meta-game~~~
Then don’t care about it? No one even brought it up.
(i.e. Lots of Damage Fast all the time)
Chrono tank? Bunker ele? Celestial builds? Those have all been meta, and neither of those are max dps. Just look at druids.
I don’t do raids, I’ve done fractals and dungeons occasionally if I wanted a specific item, but I always explicitly stated in the LFG thing that it was meant to be done at a leisurely pace because I don’t like rushing through content.
Same for a lot of us. I fail to see why you would need to hide anything if you do none of these? Especially because these things were a majority of your complaints. If you don’t do something often, chances are, you aren’t that good. Which is probably why you run into so many issues with other players, especially with the attitude that experience, or credentials, don’t matter.
Certain things, like my mastery level and AP, have no bearing on my experience in the content I play.
Sure they do. For instance a person with 1 AP will NOT have updrafts. A person with less than 160 AP, probably doesn’t have all of the final tier HoT masteries. They are barely an indicator of that, but they are the only ones we get.
I’ve played since the game came out,
So have plenty of others who are still bad at this game.
and have a full understanding of my classes and their roles (when I *do take part in content with other people that aren’t friends).*
You claim this, but yet you seem to have so many issues with people? Something does not add up. And I’m sorry to say this, no player has a ‘full’ understanding. Things change, and people find out new things about the classes everyday.
You don’t care about the meta, so i highly doubt you theorycraft, which is essential to understanding any concept.
I don’t believe my mastery level or AP should define me,
And it doesn’t. Nor has anyone said it does.
so I don’t want them to be visible on my character.
This has nothing to do with what you posted above. If you want that option that’s fine, but trying to scapegoat it on an argument no one has made, is dishonest.
Make your judgements based on my performance, not what you think my performance will be based on an arbitrary number.
Arbitrary to YOU. If you have had HoT since release, and you still have low MP and AP, chances are you either don’t play the game often, and if you do, you don’t actually do anything. Both are indicators of low performance. This is reality. Like it or not.
And of course, before anyone comes to me to say AP isn’t arbitrary, consider this: Someone could have AP over 10,000+ or something, but have never stepped foot in a dungeon.
And the chances of this? Extremely low. But even if that is the case, why not tell people (in the squad) they have never set foot in a dungeon? Why did they wait so long to do a dungeon in the first place? Food for thought.
But you’ll assume they’re super experienced with dungeons because they have a high AP. There’s very little correlation.
No one has said this. What a sad strawman. Also if you have 10k AP if never sat foot in a dungeon, you still have 10k AP, which means you have still played more than someone with 2k Ap.
You don’t get 10k in a short period of time. You had to do dailies for one thousand days at least, but the chances of that being your ONLY source of AP, are laughable.
(edited by FrostDraco.8306)
I’ll still be using my power necro like always.
Fractals were meant to be about playing through Tyrian history.
This is factually wrong. It was confirmed several times that fractals could also be mythic history. Meaning things that never actually happened in the Tyrian timeline. Uncategorized, is not a real place in Tyria, nor has it ever been.
Also I might have to add, have you forgotten that someone is messing with the fractals? That’s what Chaos was all about, and now it’s bleeding over into other fractals. It’s an event.
Yeah I haven’t experienced these friendly people everyone talks about. However, I was in the Black Citadel the other day by the home instance, and a new charr player came up and started talking to me. They were nice, but they were also new. That niceness gets beaten out of you by all the rude people and elitism.
Only if you let it.
People say just to block them, but I don’t think they understand how many people are really, really awful.
And I don’t think you understand just little little people are actually that awful. I personally consider myself somewhat of a jerk, and I rarely have issues with people in game. In fact, it may be due to the fact I also don’t run my mouth 24/7 or complain when something bad happens. Even in fractals, which is rife with people like that for dailies, I rarely have this issue.
I have only one chat tab with map chat in it, and I only check it when I think there might be something important (like about an event or something), and that’s because it’s extremely difficult to avoid seeing awful stuff from awful players.
This is starting to show that the problem is with you more than anything. I have failed to see anything in this game that requires you have map chat muted most of the time. And it’s often you wont even see those people again, or even notice them in game. It’s your right to do so, but I don’t see why even waste the effort. You immediate just discount people as awful, when very little said in this game is that awful.
I check it to see if anyone’s organizing for Teq and I see stuff like “lmao you don’t have a legendary weapon yet are you autistic lol” and really racist/homophobic/transphobic/etc.
Nice way to out yourself as an SJW. Grow up. This game isn’t a safe space.
things and I can block them all I want, but it doesn’t make me unexperience it.
True but it’s no ones responsibility to make you unexperience things. Seek therapy if you are THAT unable to deal with discomfort.
Related, someone harassing me or others for our mastery level or AP can’t be undone just because I blocked them. I still feel crappy. I still lose my motivation to play for that session, etc.
This is a personal issue. Maybe you should be motivated to raise your mastery level if you are tired of it, but I very rarely experience this even in t4 fracs. I run with people with sub Lv50 masteries all the time, and no one says anything about it.
Having the option means they don’t know. They can’t be certain. Since they have no proof, their insult or point is unfounded. Again, it’s like how I appreciate no one knowing how good my gear is, so if I die in a dungeon or event people won’t be like “omg you only have exotic gear? lol noob no wonder you died”. They don’t know, and that’s what I want.
You have some issues, and I suggest you seek therapy. Exotic gear is the minimum standard, for everything in this game. It’s widely agreed upon that unless you are raiding or in fractals ascended is extreme over kill.
Has anyone even said this to you? Because I do about 9 dungeon paths a day and have never heard this, or anything like it. The closest that it’s even gotten is about sub 80 toons, in which there is a viable reason not to run paths with them.
@OP: If this solution is easy to code, then I see no issue with it. But then I ask you the question, what does it change? Nothing.
It will just let us know who the subpar, or scared players are. And I can tell you that in a raid group, if you hid your mastery point’s, and continued to do so after asked to reveal them, I’d kick you. If you were in my fractal squad and you died from AR, and your masteries were hid, I’d kick you. If you died a lot during a dungeon run and weren’t pulling your weight, and refused to communicate with the party, I’d kick you.
Notice most of the things I have said had nothing to do with your actual points, and more with the fact you feel you have to hide them in the first place. If you are pulling your weight, most people won’t have anything to say regardless. It’s selfish.
I honestly think this would be a waste of time, and you should get over yourself.
(edited by FrostDraco.8306)
In WvW it doesn´t matter numbers count.
In PvE ele DPS fire is good.
In PvP you have a one support build. Harder to play then druid but works.Totally fine. About 90% of traits, skills and utilities are unusable now but who cares, no one needs build diversity except about 90% of the player base that will get bored.
A game like GW2 is all about uniquess and diversity. If all are the same, the game is doomed because it´s in the human nature to define yourself…
No, it’s special snowflake nature to define yourself. Most humans practice some form of conformity. In fact its the reason people like kitten, and other dictators are allowed into power. And the reason why traditions and social norms exist.
The elementalist is celestial by nature so they’ll probably bring the celestial amulet back instead of working on improvements, which is more demanding. One thing is certain: they can’t balance skills properly at all and the ele lead doesn’t know how the class functions.
So you are mad because they removed a cheesy jack of all trades bunker build? Then you make the claim ele is celestial by nature.
I can’t even.
Ele has been at the top of the food chain for the longest. The same reason you love the class, is the same reason they have been nerfing it. Food for thought.
Ele is indeed celestial by nature @Xil is correct on that:
The dev himself confirms the idea of ele being a celestial class by design and you don’t need even a dev to prove that…just look at ele weapon sets and look how every each one of them has a mix of direct, condi dmg with healing
Thank you for actual confirmation that a dev said that.
tbh I’m not even sure why you’re here when all you do is say “Ele needs to be bad at everything” and “Ele is fine”. Which are completely contradictory.
This proves you don’t agree with, lest even read my whole post. This is a strawman, and I am seriously not going to waste my time on someone who only reads half of what my actually argument is.
And since when is “Ele is decent at everything”, or “Ele is a good substitute”, saying that ele needs to be bad at everything? It’s almost like you didn’t even bother to read what I wrote, and from what you say, you didn’t bother. If you can’t respond to my actual argument, then I’d ask you not to bother responding at all.
And saying “I would disagree in general” isnt saying I disagree? Highly obnoxious and assumptive of you to think I didnt read it because I refused to waste time on a 5 hr reply that you would dismiss because your ego wouldnt allow a different opinion .
Again, you attack a straw man instead of my actual argument. Saying you disagree in general, says nothing about what you disagree with, which means I can draw nothing from that. In addition, you state I said something that I never did, to also say you disagree with. Don’t get mad because I pointed out that I never said that. Also you are talking to someone that has the opposite of an ego. Having a stance and being willing to argue for it is not ego. You seem to think all opinions are valid. I’m not that kind of person. If you can’t at least give a decent argument for why you think the way you do, why should anyone be inclined to believe you? Or even consider it.
The fact is you act contrarian
Wrong. The fact is I act contrarian to YOU. I agreed with several of the statements of other people in this thread. Spare me your selective memory.
to all the evidence provided to you in this thread
Statements, anecdotes, and conjecture is not evidence. Having a dev say “Hey this is the design behind ele” however is.
and your opinion on ele becomes ever more pointless because you put out blatantly wrong statements like ele has a condi build
It does in fact have a condi build, but I never said anything about how viable that build is.
http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Elementalist_-_D/F_Signet_Condi
http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Elementalist_-_D/D_Conditions
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OH-aB4mwAOkHey everyone, I guess those aren’t condi builds. What a joke.
or that the amount of builds placed on metabattle determines viability.
Which I never said, strawman again. This is getting old.
The fact that you have so much of an ego that you think that me disagreeing with you means I didnt read your post is astounding.
And this proves you either didn’t read, or understand that post either. What I said was that you disagreed with a point that I never made. You are intellectually bankrupt and its quite sad.
I read it, and it is a waste of time reasoning with somebody who will stick to their guns not to mention I would disagree with upwards of 90% of your arguments.
Then why are you still here? And if you actually did read it, why are you saying I said things I never said? Are you done lying?
The ele forms clearly have a different opinion than you
Again, you are talking to me like I care. If you can’t be bothered to argue for your position, then you are free to leave. I’m not holding a gun to your head. But instead you resort to name calling.
and we can back it up with evidence.
Conjecture, anecdotes, and opinions are not evidence. You have lied several times towards me in this thread. Why on earth should i believe your anecdotes?
Again, if ele gets more straight up nerfs maybe you’re right and ele was fine. But if nothing happens or it gets buffs it is more likely that it is weak right now as shown by usage of classes in raids, pvp, and wvw.
I never said ele needs nerfs. I said it needs changes. It’s fine in the way it is, as in it could be worse. It could be necro, forced into one build by other players. It could be guardian, have a ton of bugs. It could be engi, have an overly complicated rotation or okayish dps. But it’s not. If players want ele to fill a niche they are gonna need to give up something. Or leave it the way it is.
You think you are clever
I think you are confusing me with someone who cares enough to be clever. I stated my position. Nothing clever or sneaky about it.
but really youre just a contrarian who thinks he is a special snowflake despite several players disagreeing and you being unable to handle it.
I’m unable to handle it? Sorry but which of us is getting upset enough to want to enact violence? But I’M unable to handle it? I can’t even.
There is a reason somebody keeps saying they want to punch you in the face. You have an attitude that reflects that response.
Or they just really have a messed up temper. It’s not my issue. The fact they feel the need to go that far shows they are not mentally stable. But if they wanna go there, bring it on.
I can respond to whoever I want. If you cant handle it I suggest you go somewhere else.
And so can I. if you can’t handle me saying things about ele you disagree with, I suggest you go elsewhere. I’m here to stay buddy. You can keep your pitiful ad homs and justifications for violence to yourself. Never once have I said I wanted to harm anyone in this thread. But I’M the one who can’t handle it.
kitten please.
@frostdraco
“There is no stun break in curses or death magic, the two trait lines I advised against. Are you even reading my words?”
does plague signet trait not count?
Indeed it does.
I don’t think he’s able to talk about more than one trait line at a time though. It’s his traits or you obviously know nothing, talking about the synergy of two trait line’s traits ( for example: Shrouded Removal, Speed of shadow and Foot in the Grave) seems to just go over his head.
I was talking about curses specifically. That seems to go over YOUR head.
if you were talking about curses than you were wrong. There is a stunbreak in curses.
While plague sending theoretically is indeed a stunbreak, i dont think it is really useful as a stunbreak. Cmon a stunbreak that requires you to crit something, when you have 3 more more conditions on you is a near impossible task while cced (i say near impossible since it is possible to active it with locust swarm etc.).
i understand.
That wasn’t the point though.
I don’t consider a stun break by proxy a stunbreak. Unless it break stuns directly, I do not consider it a stun break. What you are refering to is a condi transfer.
tbh I’m not even sure why you’re here when all you do is say “Ele needs to be bad at everything” and “Ele is fine”. Which are completely contradictory.
This proves you don’t agree with, lest even read my whole post. This is a strawman, and I am seriously not going to waste my time on someone who only reads half of what my actually argument is.
And since when is “Ele is decent at everything”, or “Ele is a good substitute”, saying that ele needs to be bad at everything? It’s almost like you didn’t even bother to read what I wrote, and from what you say, you didn’t bother. If you can’t respond to my actual argument, then I’d ask you not to bother responding at all.
Lingering curse affacts base duration, which means its added after the rest of your condi duration and does not show up in the character window. Just look at it as a 50% bonus, and still shoot for 100% duration on top of that.
As for run of the undead,
2 trapper/4 nightmare runes
2 trapper/4 runes of the tempest
6 Rune of the thorn
6 rune of the krait
6 runes of the berserker (Best in slot)All good options that will give similar dps with full viper armor
Thanks. Any suggestions for more defensive runes? I feel quite vulnerable if I just max out condition duration with full viper armour and weapons. Is more vitality better or reducing incoming condition durations?
If you feel you need more tankiness use Parasitic contagion trait. Minions and plague sending, with dagger 4 make conditions a non issue on condi necro. Even with no vitality you have more hp than other classes in the same stat set.
I agree, multi loot are the most toxic snitch filled place I have ever seen.
One false step and you are dead. The elitism is great to the level they seem to favour botting for this trivial task.But then It was only obvious no good thing could come from people who organize “multiloots”.
It’s funny because my game crashes when i multiloot, I come back, and I’m still in squad. And no comm has ever said anything to me about it.
Seems like you either arent communicating with the comm, or are camping lobby for a long time and getting mad when you get kicked. Either way its a personal issue between you and that commander. Don’t like it? Don’t do it.
But to sit here and call rules elitism? I can’t even.
Lingering curse affacts base duration, which means its added after the rest of your condi duration and does not show up in the character window. Just look at it as a 50% bonus, and still shoot for 100% duration on top of that.
As for run of the undead,
2 trapper/4 nightmare runes
2 trapper/4 runes of the tempest
6 Rune of the thorn
6 rune of the krait
6 runes of the berserker (Best in slot)
All good options that will give similar dps with full viper armor
(edited by FrostDraco.8306)
Easily obtainable is drops, karma armor, and wvw gear. It’s cheaper than crafting due to leather prices.
The way I feel about Elementalist is like this…
The other classes are like the Teachers….
…while Elementalist is like pretty having the most amazing Substitute Teacher ever conceived… willing to help while accepting all the risk and responsibility of the Standing Teacher….However, regardless the skill or ability of a Substitute Teacher… A Substitute Teacher is still in the very end of the day, a Substitute Teacher… One that will be remembered..
In short, I feel that Elementalist is a Secondary Class right now compared to others and the one thing everyone wants is for Elementalist to play like a Primary Class. Problem with that is that somethings gotta give. Either lose the flexibility that substitute teachers have (Subs have the ability to float around and adjust to situations, teachers do not have that right or luxury and have to maintain themselves in their own classrooms) and become teachers, or strengthen the level of flexibility that the Elementalist actually has…
…and that exists in the skill trees and that is what happens.. Non-Celestial Builds mean a focus in one area while giving up a lot. Celestial Builds means having an “Absolute Balance” that actually requires a lot of experience and a strong mind to play. I remember using weapons under celestial builds with specific intent to TIP the balance into one of the areas. Full Set Celestial Armor and Trinkets, but then Berserker, Knights, Cleric, or Rampaging Weapons…. and carrying around excess equipment to adjust to situations…
I still read about Fresh Air Builds and what I have to say is this…
I left this game around 1.5 – 2 years ago. I recently bought HoT, so I am behind…However, the fact that people still talk to me about the main damage build being a Fresh Air build. and that was the final build I used prior to leaving the game makes me believe that a lot has not changed for Elementalist. ;(
I look at this thread and I see almost the exact same pattern from two years ago and wonder why things are so similar… I feel as nothing hasn’t truly changed and the class retains its set of problems.
People told me
“The solution to your problems is just playing another class”
and my reply was
“I don’t want to play another class… I want to log in, and know that my Elementalist is worth something… "Is it so wrong to be loyal to one class regardless what happens to it?
Just like I am loyal to my necro. I agree with you, something has got to give. But when players only complain about the fact ele isn’t a teacher, and just a sub, instead of figuring out what can be done to change that I have an issue.
If they nerfed necro might generation, or condi I would no flinch an inch. Not only because I don’t care for condi, but because I know just how strong it is. I love the class because of how it plays, and it’s niche, not just because it does XYZ good compared to other classes.
It’s like when they nerfed Deathly chill. I could care less, because I knew just how strong it was on all builds.
I play fresh air burst and dunk most people with it.
But it’s a very high skill-capacity build to master. The damage is unparalleled though. I get top damage or kills most games.
Imo it’s just as good as thief at being the roamed (and it kittens on thieves).
Ele is fine. Just learn to adapt and don’t suck.
To be honest it sounds like you’re playing against bad players lol.
If he is playing against the same players and dunking them, wouldn’t that make you the bad one?
Snip
Let me address your “argument”. First of all Ele is “still strong”. Now the classical definition of this is that they have a role in all game modes or at least 2/3. Dps in PvE typically, some sort of role in PvP (I do not claim to speak on specifics), and of course WvW which is typically backline for water fields and meteor finish.
Having a role, does not mean being perfect at all roles. Or top tier. Think about the actual roles in the game, will anyone reject an ele that tries to fill them? In my experience, and from watching the forums, this answer has always been no. Ele may not be optimal, but I have never seen it rejected to fill a role in which is it possible to fill.
Lets look at PvP – Ele has very little active mitigation, low armor, low hp, and high healing power scaling with low base heals.
Stab, constant protection, invulns, projectile reflect, and massive self healing when in water. You could argue that you can’t use some of these things when you are stunned. But when you are not, you have the toons to survive. Ele is a squishy class tho, no argument on that.
This essentially forces ele to need at the very least healing power, vit, and toughness.
I don’t agree with that sentiment. It doesn’t force you to need those things, it forces you to consider your weakness.
Celestial worked so well bc it also gave them damage however imo being forced to build healing power is holding many builds back. That said it is clear that no team picks up ele anymore and would rather go for a more self sustaining class. You can try ele but that doesn’t mean it’ll be any good.
Which teams are you refering to? As for celestial, you basically just said players dont like to play with weaknesses, which is why the celestial build worked well. I can not agree with that playstyle. It’s a crutch.
Chances are, and this is an assumption don’t get your panties in a bunch, you think ele is still good in PvE.
Because it is.
Well you would be wrong on that part. Dagger Warhorn is no longer viable as on a good day with a perfect rotation and permanent alacrity it gets sub 30k dps.
And that’s an issue because? You do realize that warhorn is a support weapon?
You need minimum 30k to be viable if you play a dps class which ele is in PvE.
Well this is just wrong. Firstly who made this rule? I’ve never heard of it. Seems like nit-picking. And dagger/Wh is a support/dps build. Are you comparing full dps builds to a half support build?
You can say “oh wait Ele is supposed to be absurdly strong on big immobile targets while thief should be good vs small mobile targets!”. Fair argument however the data shows us otherwise.
I’ve never made this argument, because I know why ele is used on large hit boxes. Also again, you are compaing a class who’s niche is single target/cleave dps, to ele. What about everything else ele can do, which theif can not?
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/4zoswe/qt_gorseval_speed_kill_420_left/
Enter qT’s speedruns with 10 people. This is gorseval, one of the top two fights ele SHOULD dominate in.
You used the word should, which means you feel that ele should have higher dps than theif, on a single target. I can’t agree with that.
Their dps should be easily over the top of what thief can do due to not only needing to clear orbs but also the fact that gorseval is a big immobile target with the only better target for ele being keep construct. Now that you’ve looked at the topic do you notice anything weird?
People asking for their class to not have a single weakness or shortcoming? Nah, that’s very common in MMO’s.
OH They only took 1 ele, and they didn’t do it for dps reasons. They did it because ele has the only weapon with enough range to stay on stack and kill orbs. And to be perfectly honest a dragonhunter could do that now with the new symbols.
Dragon hunter always had the ability to use symbols, it’s just people chose not to. You just admitted that the problem here was the players.
They replaced every single ele with a daredevil on a fight that is supposed to favor ele.
YOU said it’s supposed to favor ele. You are looking at a speed run, in which people choose particular classes for dps. You still seem to ignore everything else an ele can do outside of dps, that a theif can not, which is plenty.
What do you have to say to this? This is the ideal time for ele to shine and yet they are not in an extremely optimal setting.
Theif does more dps than ele, that’s all they cared about in this run. Ele does more than just dps. Comparing the dps of a class that can only fulfil the role of tank or dps, to a class that can fill any role is dishonest.
Is it still fine? No of course not, that was rhetorical. In PvE once you get to high level play doing many different things at average effectiveness is by far not as good as specializing in one thing.
So you agree that the problem isn’t ele’s damage, but the class in general? You can’t buff damage without removing support or healing capabilities. It’s a very delicate balance. And notice how ele (even with people saying how weak iit is) is still accepted in all of these roles. I have never seen a raid that will reject an ele, for healing, or for dps. Using a speed run, which less than 2% even of the community actually even does, to show case a class needing a buff isn’t a good argument.
Ele was one of the two classes I believe were built for pure power dps, the other being thief and unfortunately when you have classes designed to function like this in PvE consistency is important.
I disagree. Ele and thief can both have condi meta playstyles. Both which are accepted in most if not all game modes. Only kicker is ele has way more support/healing options for the party than thief. Many players would rather take an ele, than a thief in unorganized groups.
Not only is ele no longer consistent but its dps is in the pits compared to thief and it does not offer enough team utility to make up for the lacking of dps.
Which is arguable because everyone still accepts ele in support roles. Also you are comparing a class that ONLY bring dps, to a class that brings party support, dishonest. You can’t seriously expect ele to have thief level dps in it’s current state.
My perception is that people vastly underestimate what a thief can do.
Or vastly over estimate it, which led to months of nerfs, and the crippling of every weapon set that isn’t staff in pve, and dagger/pistol in pvp.
I’ve spent sparse amounts of time on thief and what I can tell you is that it is infinitely more survivable and easy to play than Ele as it takes 7% less damage base, has three dodges now, and isn’t limited by cooldowns(making it much more consistent at dps without alacrity).
But it is limited by initiative. But you forget the main meat of a thief rotation is auto attacks, which you can not compare to on an ele. Not to forget thief dps isn’t aoe, in which ele’s is. Thief may take 7% less damage, but ele can heal the group and pump out perma protection. I’d call that even.
Saying that “oh all they do is dps” is interesting bc that is almost all of what ele does too.
Well it isn’t, and you even admit that below. The boons that an ele can provide are invaluable compared to thief dps. Replacing a thief with an ele in a 5 man, can prove useful, however its different in a 10 man where you have more room to replace an ele. If you complain about ele being replacable, I’d like you to look at necro, and thief, and engi, which are no only replaceable, but can be outright rejected for the only roles they can fill.
I never agreed to having tempest be a support spec and honestly I don’t care about the supportive features getting nerfed,
But ignoring the fact it is there, and the fact most, if not ll of the meta builds include it is dishonest.
- interestingly enough thief venom heal will heal the thief for an absurd 8k+ and the team for 5k on 5 targets which would almost be better than old wash the pain away if it was on even 10 sec less cooldown.*
The keyword is IF. And looking at the build date, it hasnt been meta for some time, there’s a reason for that. And even on the meta venom share build, the damage is mediocre.
However a damage class having to compete over damage and not suitability is absurd. There is a trend with ele and engi in that more effort = less reward and anet rarely if ever looks to improve that situation. Even more so when they buff up classes whose optimal rotation is 111111 and occasionally 2 and maybe 1 other skill.
I don’t think about can argue over this. But ele is not nearly as hard to play as engi when it comes to getting even decent damage. Not even close. And ele healing is extremely simple. Same with support ele. Engi is only able to fill the dps role most of the time in groups, and even doing that it has trouble due to the long convoluted rotation. I get the point you are trying to make, but I don’t think the two are equal in terms of difficulty.
As for WvW – some guilds still take ele, but I know T1 and a lot of them have been experimenting with lower cooldown water fields as ele’s is now on terribly long ones. There is so much AoE that meteor is less needed as well.
I can’t really speak on this. When i do wvw, I only roam or havoc, and have never been in a wvw guild.
Now answer me this. Why should a class not do anything well if they do a little bit of everything?
The problem is ele does do everything decently. Ele doesnt do as much dps as a theif, but ele still does good dps. And ele may not heal as well as a druid, but ele still pump out good heals.
You are comparing a jack of all trades to classes that excel in a particular niche, then asking for ele to do that, AND keep its other efficiencies. Until they rework ele and change the class (which at then its a different class than the only you play), then I feel its in a decent spot compared to the rest of the classes.
- By your logic guardian does a little of everything. Team heals, team boons, damage, and yet it has solid damage builds.*
And then look at all the problems guardian has that you are ignoring. So many problem people are outright denying guardians in higher tier fractal, and can be denied in raids.
Revenant can do pretty much everything too, and they’ve been in a good spot for a while.
Rev also received several nerfs, and has very restrictive builds. Even one stance in which people refuse to play.
Due to the design nature of the game every class can do a little bit of everything. The difference with ele is that you have to use your traits to trait for what you want to specialize in instead of simply taking the damage traits and being self sufficient.
Which is an issue. I doo agree on that, but even with this ele is STILL pumping out competitive dps. How is that fair to other classes?
Also you seem to ignore that Ele is surprisingly difficult to play.
I don’t ignore that, I just disagree. I play an ele, and I have never had a moment where I had no idea what skill to use to prevent myself from getting wrecked. I have had them planty on engi, their, and mesmer. Ele is very simple to play,.
Compare the 8 dps steps on a meta ele build (http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Tempest_-_Fresh_Air_DPS_) to an engi’s 31-32, which changes depending on your alacrity uptime, and quickness, in which one wrong choice can drop your dps SIGNIFICANTLY.
People may not think so but playing ele is a lot about aftercast cancelling and that is what separates the great players from the bad ones.
I have never seen anyone on this forum ever say this. Ever.
As it stands Anet offers two classes that are sufficiently difficult to be considered high-skill. Engineer and Ele.
Engineer and Mesmer*. Fixed that for ya.
Both of which can do lots of things well and both of which are being phased out of various metas bc they don’t specialize in anything enough to be worth taking.
LOL, did you forget necro can be outright denied in open world content if they are not condi?
Making a character weak at everything bc they can do everything works for a competitive moba with very simple controls and balancing.
You think moba’s are simple? Have you ever played dota 2? Come back after a few normal games and show me how even the low levels pub stomped you from lv1 onwards, and how many times you got one shotted by even tank characters because you don’t know the mechanics. You are trying to make ele seem like a difficult class to play, to which I think is laughable.
It does not work in an MMO where min maxing is very very prevalent and classes often can fill the same roles.
Min maxing isn’t prevalent in this game at all. I can show you real min maxing games. Games that will eat you out of a car and home with how much even the smallest stats cost, and how much they make a difference. If you think this game has prevalent min maxing, then i can not take you seriously.
Edit: also you would be completely wrong about saying “Ele has been top tier forever” (paraphrasing). Ele was pretty bad early on, so bad people literally just told you to reroll thief bc you could do more and it was simpler to play. I don’t find it right to ask ele players to put in 2-3x the work of other classes and get 1/2 the reward. The same goes with Engi players.
Ele’s put in half the work and get the same reward. Ele was bad early on because no one understood how the class worked. This isn’t a problem with the class, this is a problem with the players being ignorant. As players learned how to play ele has been in the meta for the longest. And reroll a thief? Do I need to show you countless theads where people are telling each other to stop playing a thief after Anet gutted acrobatics (an almost mandatory line), and nerfed multiple weapon sets, and still do so till this day?
Meta battle builds-
Engi builds:
1 raid, 3 fractal, 6 pvp
Ele builds:
5 raid, 3 fractal, 4 pvp
Rev builds:
2 raid, 1 fractal, 3 pvp
Guard builds:
2 raid, 2 fractal, 6 pvp
Remember you said ele isn’t doing good in pve? Why is it that ele has a decent amount of builds for every game mode? Compared to all classes? Your claims just do not match what we are seeing in game.
(edited by FrostDraco.8306)
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