Guild Wars 2

Xirin.8593:

Kincaidia.3192:

order camp upgrade (draining the supply)

Unless I’m having a told brain malfunction, don’t supply camps always start with 100 supply after being flipped regardless of how much supply they had beforehand?

That said, I don’t even remember the last time I ordered a camp upgrade, so I have no idea if this affects supply post-flip.

I’m fairly confident that it does. Sorry that my post is gone – moderator thought I was calling someone a troll something…. here was my post so people aren’t lost. It would be a wonderful day if moderators read and comprehended posts before yanking stuff willy nilly.
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Terrahero.9358:
Thief useless in WvW, there’s a laugh.
….
Single-handed supplytrap a whole zerg, draining their supply rapidly before they’ve even left the camp.
…
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I replied:
OMG, yes, this. About a half dozen times now I’ve been guarding a camp I took (denying that supply and killing any small group that tries to take it) – and then a whole zerg comes in. Drop supply trap, order camp upgrade (draining the supply) and then bail.
Congratulations, you just denied a possible total of 200 supply from that zerg.
Anyone else troll-upgrade camps about to be taken?

I want to counter the “Thieves are useless in WvW” sentiment. For the past month I’ve been running a GC d/d+sb thief. Of course, there is being able to take out a guarded yak in 6 seconds, and usually the mobility to GTFO as well.

The amount of siege I’ve stripped from occupied towers is staggering. Cluster bomb and some clever angles / hill placement can remove ridiculous amounts of decently placed siege. I’m sure Elementalists can do a similar job, but thieves are probably equally (and situationally better with the bounce on short bow autoattack). Stripped towers fall much easier than ones with 5 ACs on the walls (for some odd reason).

Camps – with this build, I can have all the NPCs dead before the swords appear on the map.

In a keep defense/attack, a thief can get, unnoticed, to spots directly below or behind the enemy zerg, and timed appropriate can dish out 20k damage per second for 8 to 10 seconds with cluster bomb (and the trait that has a chance to restore initiative on crit). I can often get a zerg to drop most of their healing cooldowns before our zerg even engages, and it makes a world of difference.

In open field zerg clashes, a thief in the back ranks can be kittenedly useful. With the gap closer combo of shadowstep + steal, you can get to their back ranks and poison field + dagger storm and cause mass confusion while downing the people pulling out from the front lines for healing.

Anyway, for a thoughtful thief – like pretty much every character – can be quite useful. In EB, I feel extremely useful when I shut down all supply for one side, take their camps, strip their towers, and keep both towers + keep contested at once, and I can do it all solo.

How many points do you need for it?

What happens when you apply a venom and then either…
1) Use short bow cluster bomb – who gets the venom?

2) Use short bow auto attack – do subsequent hits of the arrow apply the venom to the next-bounced to target?

Oh, so you’re saying that I shouldn’t worry about something that took 2-3 months of work?

That makes me feel so much better.

I have more time in the WvW ability points than I do in getting 3 characters to 80.

I’m glad someone else feels the same as me Jabberwock. I know some people might just yell “YOLO!” and move on, but it’s actually affecting my enjoyment of WvW right now.

It shouldn’t be easy, but it should be either

1) A badge cost – 250 badges to reset
2) A set interval – perhaps the 1st of every month

I consider myself a normal to high WvW participant and I have 55 points. And it’s been what, 2 months? That barely scratches the surface of some of the trees. I too am nervous about spending points – I only actually put them into AC Mastery when I heard they were working on a reset. Now that it’s been reset, I’m not spending them. Especially because Anet has announced that more abilities will be coming.

It’s just not “fun”. It’s stressful. It’s forcing you down a play style path that will take literally 3-6 months to back-peddle from.

SO MAKE A RESET OPTION. Make it painful. Make it cost 25G. 500 Badges. 250,000 Karma. 20 Laurels. I don’t care.

Just don’t stress me out over the decisions, because then I’m just going to avoid it and resent you for causing me stress.

It’s broken currently, in more ways than one. It is instantly repeatable, and on top of that you can (or could until recently) actually trigger it after you’ve taken the tower. It needs to be a 30 minute wait AFTER Siegerazer has been killed, and at that time marker it needs to check to see if the tower is owned or not.

What was the range? 3400 or something?

As the WP timer isn’t visible to the attacks, I think this one is bunk. You have no way of knowing whether or not it was in the window, and some people take 20-30 seconds to port even in the same map (IE my 5 year old laptop), so they still could have activated the WP when it was open, and only showed up half a minute later.

wvw xp bonus, karma bonus, exp bonus, magic find bonus, no repair costs.

Frankly, I think it would be interesting to see it do something like 200% damage to inanimate objects, such as siege or doors.

Oh snap. What race / server was this thief from?

Agreed. I can’t count the times I’ve heard “XXX is outmanned – we’re going for their keep!”

I don’t know about these suggestions – Anet has shown (and rightly so) amazing reluctance to impact the established style of play. The solution would have to only impact the abuses of stealth, which is limited to long-term duration by either C&D or BP+HS.

My money is that they’ll implement something that doesn’t allow more than 50% in stealth over a long (1m+) duration.

And I would be all for it.

They could announce what the deviation list is, then we can judge for ourselves – but they should wait until 24 hours before to announce it. The suspense until the day before will be fun while still giving enough time to formulate a bit of a plan.

On February 26th patch: ( https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-February-26-2013 )

Cloak and Dagger: The player can no longer use this ability stack stealth by attacking WvW walls.

During that patch, it no longer worked at all. I was sad, but understood that it was never intended to work. Then with the May 14th patch, it started working again, although you would be properly revealed upon attempting to restealth before becoming visible.

I won’t believe that CnD’ing walls for stealth was ever intended until a red-name comes in and states it.

Huh? My thief is named “Tired of OP” on FA, has 540 skill points after spending 50+ on superior ACs, WvW rank 42 or 43, and my max backstab on a player not down-leveled is 14.2k

Let me assure you, I’m a thief. Heck, I even had someone I insta-gibbed start a “nerf thieves” topic a few days ago:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Why-Not-Balance-Thieves-In-WvW-Like-Spvp/first

Let me assure you: I’m a thief.

I’ve currently 5 greens 1 rare, but for me the best bit is the siege + the silver. It seems about 15s average, so when I get 2 levels in a night (with the backlog of chests), I’m getting 4×15s = 60s + 4 pieces of siege. I’m actually gaining gold instead of losing it in wvw. I upgrade things frequently, so that’s where about half my money goes to.

I know people are complaining, but I think this is a no nonsense way of rewarding wvw, and the double-chest thing is a market-friendly way of not crashing the economy.

I say ‘decent’ to ‘good’ remedy IMHO.

“make exit stealth give revield and make smoke field + leap grant blind to the target hit instead of stealth problem solved”

I think that’s an interesting idea, but it only solves one form of stealth abuse. A P/D thief will never come out of stealth. A group with 2 thieves can remain stealthed indefinitely. Heck, a single thief can. I’ve done dolyak escorts solo where the yak was never visible. So I think your idea about fixing P/D is not bad, the over-arching problem is indefinite stealth, regardless of how it was applied or maintained.

As for whether I’m addressing fighting thieves directly or dealing with tower defense and trolling – both. I’m usually on the offending side, but like it or not, it is neither fun to lose a hard-earned objective due to permanently invisible people, nor is it the intention of the WvW creators, who have spent much time crafting a balance between a fun and challenging experience.

They did. And it’s back, although now the Revealed works correctly. Previously, you could recast C&D before stealth wore off and the Revealed wasn’t applied. Now it is working correctly – IE you’re Revealed if you re-C&D before it wears off. But you time it right and you’re only visible for a split second.

I’ve been guilty of abusing stealth. I’ll admit that. I also know that fighting someone who is almost entirely invisible for 5+ minutes (and yes, I’ve done that and longer) is horse crap.

This is coming from a thief, so take that as you will.

I believe that there should be a mechanic to penalize long-duration stealth for thieves.

For example – every second that they are in stealth, they get an additional stack of “Fatigue”. Every second that they are visible, they lose a stack of Fatigue. If they reach 25 stacks of Fatigue, they are revealed with a 5 second Revealed debuff.

In practice, a normally stealthing thief will never reach this limit – Shadow Refuge (3s + 10s) + hide in shadows (4s traited) and a C&D (4s traited) and you’d still be under the limit at 21 stacks of Fatigue.

What this would stop:
Perpetual C&D off of gates/walls.
Permanent D/P invis.

It would also provide a fight time limit for Thieves that are hidden for the majority of the fight – if the thief spends more time invisible than visible, eventually the Fatigue will catch up.

Watch for the poofs of smoke, shadow refuge icons, doors/walls being cloak & daggered, or NPCs acting funny.

That being said….

As a thief myself, I ABSOLUTELY believe that there should be a mechanic to penalize long-duration stealth for thieves.

For example – every second that they are in stealth, they get an additional stack of “Fatigue”. Every second that they are visible, they lose a stack of Fatigue. If they reach 25 stacks of Fatigue, they are revealed with a 5 second Revealed debuff.

In practice, a normally stealthing thief will never reach this limit – Shadow Refuge (3s + 10s) + hide in shadows (4s traited) and a C&D (4s traited) and you’d still be under the limit at 21 stacks of Fatigue.

What this would stop:
Perpetual C&D off of gates/walls.
Permanent D/P invis.

It would also provide a fight time limit for Thieves that are hidden for the majority of the fight – if the thief spends more time invisible than visible, eventually the Fatigue will catch up.

You know, I’m going to post this in another topic as putting it in a QQ topic isn’t the wisest thing….

I’m mostly shocked at the lack of any communication since the initial “Oh, we’re looking into it”. If it’s going to be a couple of days, we’re just going to throw the match instead of putting in extra (painful) time toward a lost cause.

I don’t understand how these guykitten so hard. I’m a valkyrie/berserker thief with 3k power, 110% critical damage and my backstabkitten only for 8k max on level 80 glas cannons.

That was what I said for a while, but if you take the assassin’s signet (180 power) and full power sigil stacks (250) + 5% sigil of force, +10% from scholar runes…..

You know what really sucked? This happened right after FA’s low population time, when we regularly get our whole EB side taken, and then we take it back…

Only now we have zero siege. And their side is still fully sieged, because theirs was placed.

Awesome.

FA was finally neck and neck before the patch.

Maladon.5760:

Haru Kane.4623:

BossFi.6917:

Haru Kane.4623:

http://i.imgur.com/jA1wo5h.jpg I don’t think there is a single class that could survive this

Looking at the skills the thief used you obviously just stood there and did nothing. You deserved it.

I’m a Mesmer too and I don’t die to thief’s.

Well if you knew how to play a thief you would understand that he did the 20k damage (steal, cloak and backstab) within the time it took him to press the steal button. If you want I can show you how quickly it can be done.

You can dodge the backstab if you’re quick enough. On my thief I can shadowstep out of the backstab with reasonably reliability.

Lies! When my timing is perfect (or even just not awful), I hit C&D just before I’m out of stealth, hit steal and immediately backstab – and it takes all of probably 0.2 seconds.

No one is that fast, not even taking into account that given 80ms round trip, most of that time is probably taken up by latency. You’re dead before you know it.

I hate (good) engineers on my thief. Without kiting forever, some can be dang near unkillable.

Side tangent: How many of these arguments would be null and void if anet provided a full combat log instead of the atrocity we have? I’ve had complete battles that show no damage to me, and yet here I am, quite dead indeed.

Hey Fatall, let’s not exaggerate now about WvW.

I find my thief to be ridiculously useful. I can solo a supply camp in the time it takes for the crossed swords to show up. I can scout like a mofo. I can do crazy damage + utility with shortbow blast finishers.

And don’t get me started about shadowstepping to the back of the oncoming zerg, daggerstorming, and then returning. I’m pretty sure that has single-handedly turned large-scale encounters to our favor.

I feel pretty good about the class – just have to be careful and have cat-like reflexes. And die alot. God I die alot.

Haru Kane.4623:

http://i.imgur.com/jA1wo5h.jpg I don’t think there is a single class that could survive this — how can it be allowed? The steal, cloak, and back stab happened while he was in stealth which means the only way I could stop it at all is if I preemptively dodged. Why is this amount of damage acceptable in WvW and not in Spvp? It’s still player versus player, this makes small scale WvW almost unbearable.

Hey, I didn’t expect to get a spotlight Don’t make me regret partying with enemies to talk.

And for the record, I’m playing an all-out glass canon here. 25 stacks of +10 power, scholar runes, all ‘zerker exotics or ascended (missing 2 pieces of ascended jewelry), +power sigil, etc. This isn’t my normal build, but for yak-slaying and speed solo camp taking, it works the best that I’ve found.

The trade off is that I can die by being sneezed on. You got the jump on me seconds before and dropped me to half in 5 seconds. I had to skedaddle, get out of combat, and reengage on my own terms.

And the character name is “Tired of OP”, because I was tired of this happening to my ranger… I won’t go GC for long because it’s…. you know, a bit OP. But FA was not doing well, so I had to put my game face on.

I hope there aren’t hard feelings – I didn’t join your group and say “POWNED MF’ER!”. I hope you found me courteous at least.

Tired of OP
FA roamer
quick edit after actually reading more than the first post

The mesmer was downed after the first burst, so there was no reaction time – after the initial engagement and his damage, I C&D’d him, healed, and then appeared long enough to get steal+C&D+BS combo.

The spec I was running was 25/30/0/0/15. Hidden killer, +10% damage from runes of the scholar, +5% dagger damage.

I hate to ask… but was it upgraded? I haven’t noticed any difference in difficulty.

So they decide to roll a patch out at 10AM EST instead of their normal 8PM EST on the day they’re ending content?

Sweet. Glad to know they’re looking out for me.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/archive/flameandfrost

Evidently they didn’t want to keep a place for people to complain who expected a longer window to finish what took 3 months to get to the end of.

For the record, people saying that they get fast exp in this topic:
Jade Quary [T1]
Maguuma [T3]
Tarnished Coast [T2]

Everyone who is disagreeing with the OP: You do realize that your WXP per hour is entirely a function of the player density specifically at that play time and whether or not your side is winning /losing?

I’ve been on when WvW is almost empty and it’s nearly impossible to get much WXP.

If it’s prime time on a T2 server, and we’re winning, HUGE WXP.

If it’s prime time on the same T2 server and we’re getting our butts handed to us, ZERO WxP.

Your WXP rate of experience is unique to you, your server, and your play time. So don’t call the OP “doing it wrong”.

How much time do we have? Mother’s day was completely taken up with family activities, and then yesterday a work event in the evening kept me booked – I’d rather not miss completing because of too small a window….

Well, first you have to use the in game reporting tool to report him as selling gold or being abusive in chat to confuse the Customer support, then send in a screenshot that could easily be doctored and really isn’t “evidence”, and then you wait for them to do nothing.

It really is an incredibly smooth process.

A thief with short bow, or a mesmer pull, or an ele meteor shower, or an engineer… or a necro… Seriously, it’s a minor annoyance at best since unless you’re running a warrior/guardian only party, any single person should be able to get them down.

I think that’s fun What class was up there?

Moderator.1056:

Hi everyone,

If you witness behaviors that could be assimilated as exploits, please report them via the in game report tool, or send a request to our Customer support with all necessary details like screenshots or videos.

We remind you that posting exploits here won’t help us as the moderator team does not investigate those issues.

Thank you.

I use the in game reporting tool. Should I mark them as “gold seller” or “botting”? Because those are my gaddamn options. I’ll believe you care when you actually put a “hacking / exploiting” on the report tool. Until then, you’re just blowing smoke up our assets.

Yes, changing the rules of the game should provide a reset of the points.

With the new AC rules, a ballista which should absolutely trump an arrow cart on single target damage is actually less effective and less dps than an arrow cart does. So the points someone put into a ballista are fairly wasted at this point.

I was shocked that they put that kind of a radical change in without providing a refund. It hurts no one and can only provide a more fair playing field. Or is this another way of Anet screwing you with RNG? They randomly upgrade something to god status and you better hope you either didn’t spend your points or put them in the right place!

Vengeance is only annoying because it robs the attackers of WvW XP.

And as was said earlier, vapor forming back through the portal is just dirty. Zero risk in what should be a risky as balls situation.

I’m playing the build Nettle mentioned because I had heard it was super-bursty. It is. That being said, I spend most of my time
0/30/20/5/15

It gives you great versatility for small 3 vs 5 or 6 in a good guild group – still good damage and a lot of survivability. BOTH specs have great potential, just very different applications.

I was at work and it wasn’t “readily available”. I think the 10 should be a 15 :P

I have having this happen this week – so I dusted off the ol’ berserker set and invested in 6 Runes of the Scholar…

d+d / sb
25/30/0/0/10
25 stacks of +10 power sigil
utility = +25% move, +power, +init regen

o.m.g. I should have done this months ago – before the mug nerf.

I’m getting 12k backstabs on non-upleveled people if they’re glass cannons.
15k on a few poor souls.

And with shadowstep utility + short bow, my escape is usually pretty easy.

Plus, with daggerstorm you can pretty much solo a non-upgraded camp in 45 seconds flat.

I think we need a couple of days more to really get a sense of what the AC change means. Right now, it’s just

HOLY COW THE BALANCE OF POWER CHANGED.

Different is different, but whether it’s a good or bad difference will take time. We definitely need to start using skills to block AC damage. Speaking of which, what player utilities block AC damage?

One thing I do wish was that you wouldn’t get hit if you’re standing under a stone wall. Overhangs should protect

As a thief in full valkerie and the 5% of precision into vitality, I’m right around 19.5k, so yeah, that’s about right.

Anywho, I almost bought mesmer runes yesterday – thinking of trying a stun-lock build based on sword main hand, but I’m just not quite feeling adventurous enough.

Does the +33% from the 6th mesmer rune stack with the +15% from the sigil?

It seems like it should make our 2 second stuns tick for 3 seconds most of the time.

I’ve experienced this too multiple times – although I think I received the damage twice. I actually experienced it myself and then watched a pursuing WvW attacker fall down, then warp back up, and then fall back down again.

Oh, you can steal the might stacks. You just have to have 25/3 = 9 thieves stealing at once. Did they forget to mention that?

Yup, the 3 —> 4 second nerf was aimed at our DPS and not perma-stealth. Unfortunately, for me and lots of other thieves, that extra second

1) Screwed up rotations and flow
2) Less condition removal
3) Significantly less DPS
4) Higher mortality rate when knocked out of Refuge

Very glad it’s back to the way it was. I just have to redo my internal clock. Again.

I had the same thought myself… We should test specific builds and get actual numbers.

Imagine that – not having their tooltips match the actual ability?

nawwwwww…