Guild Wars 2

Prince Vingador.8067:

Loop.8106:

I feel like the population has declined to alarming levels in PvP. This results in incredibly un-balanced and un-fun matches.
I was rank 21 on the EU leaderboards when I started playing today. (slightly above 1800 rating). I duod with a player that had ~1770 rating. We get put in games with 1320 mmr players.
I added them to friendslist after seeing them running core guard builds and farming bosses on Forests aswell as feeding into unfavorable matchups. (Thief Rev vs Ele Necro).

I get that it’s hard maintaining a good matchmaking system when the population probably is at an all time low. However I’d prefer waiting 15 minutes a game for this NOT to happen.

There is a lack of interest in pvp from players atm, and its easy to see why.

*Duo que players 2-2-1 vs solo players 1-1-1-1-1
*patches only once every 4 months or so, and only to change a few recharge skills.
*players that duo que , shouldnt be in the same leaderbord as players that solo que.

• big gap in skill play from the players in the same team , its so annoying to see that u are playing with or vs players , that have 0 awereness of pvp
  *still no skill templates to save builds( i change build almost every game)
  imo poor skill balance between classes, some classes are much stronger ( mesmer/ warrior)

So ofc players start to care less and less.
I only played 10 games this season

I would agree with you but I can’t. Reason – balance. Right now if you play rev, ele, necro you can’t carry on your own that much like engi, druid, war or be main playmaker like Mesmer or thief. If I remember correctly u play necro so you know difference when you don’t have support in teamfight and when you have.

If all classes had more or less fair 1v1 solo q only might be a thing. But…anet doesn’t agree with it clearly.

When people starts to enjoy treb montage…you know that pvp is dying…

Simply no…let’s not give new tools to abuse for trolls and unstable people. We know how seasons 1-4 looked like.

1.Most Pro league evacuated cause there is no end game for them and they have no opportunity to play 5 premade.

2.Those from Pro league that stayed are just bored. They que, it’s always a blowout, they win, that’s all.

3. Those who wanted to improve to compete with these guys are now alone with nothing to aspire so they left too.

4. Anet failed with following with hype of season 5. Grouchoru, a lot pvp veterans back to game, everybody wants to improve to get as high as they can…Generally anet has communication problem with it’s pvp community. Even on official gw 2 twitch nobody give a dam about pvp…like come on guys give us an answer to why we should play this game, give us some future perspective? And no – whole sigil talk is good thing but won’t make people hyped for future season x. When new expansion will show up, there won’t be anybody left.

5.Last balance update was a failure in giving something fresh to almost 1 year old meta so games became so booooooring and predicable. Oh yeah there was a rev tablet buff…oh nobody cares.

6. Pvp lost people from pve thanks to ascended vendors change . Legendary back worth completely devaluated over time (is there somebody that doesn’t have it after 6 seasons?!) Like why there is no new legendary for and new ranked achievement’s? PvP guys who wanted to try pve also kinda lost…

Wow what a title! So dramatic…Thanks devs for update.

Simply no…we don’t want necro to have sustain. Their burst is enough deal with.

x chakuza x.3512:

There is one streaming right now.. one of the Top 10 ratings.. if i watch him i cant see a unplayable class

Good to hear! Can you share a link?

Right now or ,,meta" is purely based on ranked solo/duo q and really few pvp streamers so it’s really hard to say how valuable rev is now. Probably nobody serious tested last 3 balance ,,like" updates.

At HoT lunch when esl teams made power/condi rev builds, class was god tier if you had skill. Time passed, a lot nerfs happened but I have no doubt that somebody who keep playing rev from season 1 to 6 has free spot in platinum and up.

If you decide to learn now rev it’s probably most horrible experience ever. If have 0 experience you can’t learn to play it even on unranked. Nobody streams rev so you don’t even know rotations. Personally if I got rev in my team I never swap to ele (I know how strong rev/ele duo is). Revs in gold and below fail at doing anything so I never get value from class swap.

Personally I hate when anet decides to nerf something that is only strong if used with brain and skill. On everything out there besides chrono/necro is easy to just hop in and be effective and keep learning something.

Saiyan.1704:

Mr Godlike.6098:

Abelisk.4527:

Mr Godlike.6098:

Where are sigils for ele? Are we still nerfing ele’s anet?

Sugil of Cleansing + Sigil of Purity = Rune of the Monk

Still worse also nobody sane would use monk on tempest…like why when soldier is out there?

The question is, are the sustain option sigils listed here, are on par with the options dps has? I don’t Ele so idk.

Simply put new sigils completely ignore fact that there out there support classes like engi, druid and tempest.

Abelisk.4527:

Mr Godlike.6098:

Where are sigils for ele? Are we still nerfing ele’s anet?

Sugil of Cleansing + Sigil of Purity = Rune of the Monk

Still worse also nobody sane would use monk on tempest…like why when soldier is out there?

Where are sigils for ele? Are we still nerfing ele’s anet?

Saiyan.1704:

Mr Godlike.6098:

Looks like there will be no valuable sigil for ele…even for healbot…it would be nice that any dev could explain what ele’s could use because kinda nothing you proposed is any alternative for renewal, leaching, transference or even blood.

Because you know ele doesn’t have any build diversity…so why are you nerfing one thing that is playable?

There wasn’t a sigil that made the Ele a top tier pick, it was only a supplement to an already good class.

Your Ele is in the same boat as everyone else besides, they said they’ll talk to the balance team about these changes. That means IF they think your Ele needs a buffed in s7, he will.

Good? Healbot that can’t carry on his own? That is only usable in esl comps only because necro/rev sustain doesn’t exists in teamfights? That he’s rotation is to follow necro/rev in ranked and expecting them to do their job because if not then both them and ele (no matter how good he is) leave their team in 3v5 match?

Yes healbot is strong…in ts 5 man premade. In ranked he can only go duo q with necro/rev have really big faith in them.

Proposed changes are nerfs (not big nerf hammer – I am not panicking or something), because removed sigils were only usable ones in matter of ele that doesn’t have any build diversity. It’s not fair move devs.

Looks like there will be no valuable sigil for ele…even for healbot…it would be nice that any dev could explain what ele’s could use because kinda nothing you proposed is any alternative for renewal, leaching, transference or even blood.

Because you know ele doesn’t have any build diversity…so why are you nerfing one thing that is playable?

Crinn.7864:

Mr Godlike.6098:

I also wonder why anybody talks about power mes…

Power Mesmer does have the highest Alpha in the game. It can’t point fight, but the damage is disgustingly good.

Em I know that it’s only my personal experience but seen maybe two during my 300 matches in seasons 5 (EU ranked gold/platinum). They were miserable and really hated by their teams.

Altie.4571:

how can anyone list a p/p CONDI thief, let alone in top 250?

like wut?

It’s troll tread…I also wonder why anybody talks about power mes…

choovanski.5462:

Entenkommando.5208:

Hold on I’m confused…is this a thread about top250 or about silver builds now?

it’s actually just ‘what makes me salty’

Nah about people who never seen how match in legendary/platinum looks like…even on stream…

oh wait maybe they are talking about NA ranked…then we should add turret engi.

Abelisk.4527:

D/D condi thief
P/P condi stealth trap thief
Staff/Staff infidodge thief
Full trap zerk DH
Power Mantra Mesmer
Zerker staff “kamikaze” elementalist

You forget about bearbow pew pew build.

I don’t know …overturned? Most classes after HoT not only can keep doing standard anti-war tactic like juking/kiteing but also have new ways to easy disengage. There are ways to deal with war on any build.

From my perspective:

1. Dev stated already that they are interested in automated tournaments. I really look forward to see what content they will make for 5-man premades.

2. Balance patch was giant led-down. Not only I won’t have many opportunities to play ele (can’t carry on mender d/f if I not in rev/necro duo) and I will have to fight same builds that happened around season 2 all over again..BOOOORING.

3.On the other hand devs are cleary seeking feedback on runes, sigils and amulets so something in meta might happen. I hope devs will make brave crazy ideas happen.

4.It’s obvious that devs by whole ascended buying thing will hurt pvp population but I somehow don’t care. I play gw when is pvp season and only my rating is motivating me to play.

5. It kinda makes me sad that anet is so slow in making new pro-league event. We have so many good players in EU that can’t really shine.

I think people that want defence trait line to be nerfed forget how war was in bad spot after HoT came and in season 1 and 2. Not until Anet buffed war survivability and nerfed damage of quite a lot classes it was possible for warriors to be viable again.

In ques I play mostly druid, sometimes ele and I don’t see nothing too op in war. Druid’s job is to kill gs war (it’s well established counter) or avoid (macebow is bad news for most druids builds). Do I cry that macebow is countering me? Nope, I have my rotations to do. I go hunt some chrono/dh.

People tend to ask for balance classes around 1v1 forgetting that counters exists. That build x will kill you easily – it was made to do that. And that you will kill build x easy You don’t need win every 1v1 on map, go be usefully by killing something that you counter and win.

Poelala.2830:

Thank you for the compliments but I was referring to mainly how mechanically simple DH is and how that will eventually lead to its downfall because players will inevitably get better. I was not referring to its place currently because it’s in a good, yet unstable spot.

Nah new season will start and again we will have tons of posts proving that avoiding traps is to hard…after five seasons in row dealing with the same build.

What mode ?PvP, WvW, PVE or raids?

What would change hard reset? More or less people will stay in their previous divisions if they didn’t improved much.

foste.3098:

1050 power
1050 precision
560 toughness
560 healing p.

I know toughness and healing power were a issue in the past but perhaps they could work fine as lesser stats without being op?
Classes that could make use of it would be ranger, warrior, engineer and perhaps mesmer as others are to squishy and 560 armor and healing is not enough to be able to sustain a 11k hp pool like you could with cleric (900 armor 1200 healing).

This could allow for more of a bruiser archetype instead of a full on healbot like menders and since it gives no vit you would be vulnerable to condition builds.

This amulet is basically what ele needs to have damage and FAIR chance in ranked solo q:

1. Might stacking is needed to dish out damage but it’s ok thing on ele!
2 .It fully uses what tempest has to offer with half of efficiency of cleric so bunkering won’t be possible as in old days.
3. Condi build counters it hard (diamond skin doesn’t make immune like in first seasons.
4. Give us this amulet and we will deal with overpopulation of DH.

Plz devs take look at this amulet proposition and think about it.

Solstace.2514:

Isn’t ele considered a counter to DH? You may have to take that into consideration.

More or less depending on the build and what you understand by counter.

Ele (healbot meta build) has no damage so he might kill really bad thief in 1v1.

Depending on dh build ele can make him useless giving reflects to whole team or make his sad trap burst disappear by pure heal) or just annoying denying any kills from condi.

Funny fact: overpopulation of dh in queues and his return to meta tier was thanks to removal cleric amulet used only by ele^^.

Thief/Mesmer would be the best.

Ele is only needed by necro/rev.

Other options are just ok.

The answer is: nobody knows!

Anet doesn’t make any pro league event’s = no competitive team skrims and seriously test updates…and oh boy that means nobody checked last 3 balance updates.

What we have now is more or less meta based on performance of each classe in ranked and builds that works in solo/duo q for few good pvp streamers. For example berserk gs war and power necro happened thanks to streamers – not because it was effective in full man premade during event with money on the line. We all know how DH performance looks like in ranked but nobody would risk prize money to use dh in team.

And good luck with asking anybody what is optimal/most op premade. If anet ever starts proleague event nobody serious would share such info.

All we can do it’s speculate, that’s all.

Can’t imagine this build beyond gold:

1.Tempest is bad in any dps build – you would gain more taking fire or arcane. Tempest is only good when you have both healing power and toughness.

2.To get some value from sage’s power damage the best way is sigil of intelligence.

3. At least you would get some roaming build, manageable in small fights but any big teamfight will result with whole enemy focusing YOU. Why? Because any decend player out there after 5 seasons will know how easy is to kill ele without obsidian flesh.

4. When making dps build you should think – what I can counter with my build. This build has no chances against warriors (no way to remove resistance); chrono, scrapper and druid will outheal your damage, good thief will always +1 you in the worst scenario ever for you, necro is basily made for killing bunkers so it’s bad matchup too…so your build might win against rev.

Non of changes will change anything in matter of pvp ele so it’s for sure that if you want play ranked and survive in higher rantings – healbot ekhem tempest d/f mender build is obligatory to play (again!) for 5th season in row. Obligatory not because it’s ,,the meta build". Because it’s only build that let’s you stay alive against class/build x( x – put here just antyhing) Ele will be FORCED to play this build if they want to matter in seasons 6th so questions are:

1. Are there any plans for new amulets that ele could use before new season?

2. Are there any plans of balance changes before new season that could improve ele build diversity.

3. Are there any plans to improve tempest elite specialization to be useful on dps spec or be just be usable on amulet that don’t have both toughness and healing power?

…em what buffs? You still must play healbot at least at gold+ rating.

…still i don’t know who is that guy…

I feel like more random buff here and nerf that then some big thought process…especially in matter in pvp.

Almost completely insignificant patch for pvp ele…Anet strongly supports zero build diversity on ele for another ranked season…literally devs don’t care.

PVP guy here…

…nothing changed…ele stays healbot for season 6th…only Armor of Earth and Mist Form buff means something…

Anet really wants people to stop playing ele in pvp.

It’s complete waste of time to login in and test the changes.

I really I really hope that at last devs do something about or explain horrible, pathetic, depressing, boring and non existing build diversity of ele in pvp.

I feel really paranoid right now because of these rumors…what if those changes are also for pvp ele….we know how in matters of pvp our skill balance team is …at least blind.

Yay 30-40 min ques at higher raitings! New seasons sounds already great!

I am completely pvp player and for me:

1. TEMPEST IS ABSOULTE GARBAGE AS IDEA AND AS DESING: Playing ele is swapping attunements, being good ele is swaping attunements and mixing skills. Tempest as idea for staying in attunement longer to do something is wrong. Making new mechanic that can be stopped by random cc is just stupid. You can’t stop necro from using death shroud, war for going berseker ect ect. Tempest that don’t use overloads doesn’t differ from core ele almost at all (ok one big aoe heal and shouts and perma protection)!

2. Removing cele and cleric, hard tying together healing power on everything valuable on tempest without addressing problems of ele survival on lowest defence stats in game after hot power creep, murdered and buried our build diversity COMPLETELY.

Clueless is to far nice word to address what devs did with pvp ele with HoT and 2016 ,,balance" updates.

Duo should stay – simply because there wouldn’t be sense to play ranked on some classes like rev ,ele or necro.

Edit: if there was at least one good 1v1 build on each class that can carry on it’s own then soloq only might be a good thing. But it’s impossible right now in this meta.

It’s was problem for a moment in EU but rank 55 showed that they won’t give up their top spots for exploiters.

zinkz.7045:

Poelala.2830:

Elementalist probably has the least build diversity of any class in the entire game.

Not really, ele just has the most “special snowflakes” who are so ignorant they think it is only the class in PvP with only one strong build or the only class with weapons that have issues, and as for the “entrie game” it is one of the most pampered classes out there, perma meta in PvE for 4 years (compare that to necros for example), perma meta in WvW (compare that with engy, ranger, thief, etc).

Sorry sir but your are wrong. In case of ele it’s not problem that healbot is only build out there that is ,,strong" and effective at something. It’s not problem here that healbot is meta. It’s problem that healbot is mandatory to stay alive against anything and is mandatory to do anything in conquest as ele. One of causes of this is that tempest elite specialisation is GARBAGE without healing power and toughness.

I know that there are out there classes with same issues like rev but power rev is not freaking boring as hell and your skill maters more on such build then on simple heal spam.

I have more time so I write little more about this build. Idea was like this: cleric was good at keeping ele alive (for some even too good). So there are still amulets that give same or better toughness. What about healing? Do we have things that don’t need healing power to work? Glyph of elemental harmony had nice buff so why not. Overload water is not bad either but I get to that later.

If we think about it on tempest with toughness it’s possible to have some really ridiculs damage reductions with protection boon, weakness, hardy conduit and geomancer defence traits and finally frost aura and rune of scrapper. So it’s possible to tweak my build even further to something like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFAQJAodnUMAFNg9XCWYCcYilNAb4BEAugu31A7htoHsDuBA-TJRIABEXGA89HC4BAAwJAAA

By the way before somebody ask: why glyph of elemental power? Is not for burn but weakness that you can spam on air for additional damage reduction on freaking air! Also this version is more overload friendly.

I am well aware that build is countered by condi builds but I wasn’t looking for optimal all around build and conquest is more or less about how you rotate so nobody ask you to fight corruptmancer with this if you move smart. Of course you can try to sustain condis with this…

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFAQJAodnUMAFNg9XCWYCcYilNAb4BEAugErgLwIw9u+XPsA-TJRIABB8AAA4EAA++DyXGAA

…but I don’t feel that it’s worth it. Again when I will have more time I’ll write about build mechanics and rotations.

Sage is kinda waste on ele generally and would worked better with tempest. Healing power works on ele only on tempest and power damage tickle people without cirt. I understand role of arcane precision with this traits but this skill without any other utility then damage it’s isn’t worth it . You should test carrion, deathshot, rabid or wanderer. You don’t gain any valuve from healing power in this build.

Ele’s should get dps build but it’s a long way to make it happen.

Reworks are need to make it possible to survive 1v1 against anything with current amulets with almost no active damage migration and just heals and easy to remove protection. It’s incredible that war can run naked and still he will have better survivability than ele on paladin.

Dps is there but ,,must have focus offhand thing or die" really limits the options out there. There was and effort from devs to improve few things (and efforts to make it worse like ,,mancer traits nerf") but it has no point. We can’t get to this spikes/nukes if we die 1v1 against anything faster then necro by autoattacks!

The fastest way would be new amulet like this: 1050 power, precision and 560 healing, toughness. Tempest thanks to efforts of devs works only with toughness and healing power. It would make possible to make bruiser spec but on same time this amulet would be more or less be broken on scrapper/druid so I doubt it will ever happen.

It’s not right that people are forced to play same thing..boooring as hell thing healboting after 4 seasons in row!. There is nothing mechanically challenging on this build. Your rotation? Run after necro/rev and keep them alive. That’s your rotation! Accept fact that if necro/rev are bad, don’t kill things, move you to impossible to win fights, no matter how long and well you play ele you just leave your team 3v5 and that’s it. That’s how carry works on healbot.

It’s a myth that ele’s play meta because it’s meta. That there are alternatives reserved to skill’ed one’s. Not in EU ranked. Those ,,alternatives" will force your team play 4v5 game in higher ratings no matter what you do. Every class will do your job better than your ,,alternative" by just survival.

But don’t worry those who fear mighty godly ele dps. I am 100% sure that non of dev ever seen or look at ele/tempest balance topic ever. There is a reason why they call healbot ,,supreme".

Anet plz change character shout dialogue from ,,Chilled to the Bone" to just ,,Dodge".

Everything should be fine after that.

I decided to share my little experimental build born when I tried to create as durable tempest as possible. Currently meta shifted to relay on power damage more then on condi so it might shine some day (still it’s not high rating ranked material).

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFAQJAodnUMAdOg9XCWYCcYilNAroHsDuBDPgAwF09u2XPsA-TJRIABgv/QAPAAAOBAEXGAA

If I will have more time I will write more about usage – enjoy.

I personally dislike utility skills in pvp that can do only damage. I think it should stay as it is for sake of pve and wvw.

I would prefer devs to take a look at something completely forgotten – Glyph of Renewal .

If you want to use auramancer on lower tiers you need duo buddy (rev/necro) Basically you should support those builds that need your heals for sustain in teamfights (necro vs anything and rev against condi). The problem is that necro/revs on lower mmr tiers fail usually at doing their job (killing everything) and will rotate you in really not fun places.

It’s small detail and I didn’t have time to watch full thing (only first mid node fight)nobody focused necro like you and whole your team there …he was happily spamming scepter 1 on roof till he charged shroud and cleaved your whole team to death.

Ok from druid perspective going vs vault is just too easy (I use mostly bunker s/d spec). You can dodge whole staff 5+dodge spam with your own dodges and evades and thief has 0 inactive. 0 inactive means dead thief.

This spec rightly inferior to unpredictable d/p.