Guild Wars 2

pvp fails because of crappy design and lackluster content – nothing else

Atherakhia.4086:

Bleeds tick for 150 a stack.

bleeds dont tick for 150 unless you max out on stats and might

@topic

aoe condition cleansing is very strong with class stacking

like shout guard on one node, 1 ele on the other and 1 roamer ele
you literally cant apply condis fast enough when the opponent times it well

other than the aoe component id actually prefer to see more condi cleanses on some classes who dont have as many viable ones yet. Not a fan of the 1 condi every 10 sec traits they`re kinda random so meh.

Havent been to AC3 since patch.
But if this is really happening it should be fixed asap.

/sign
charkjdhnfjaslgntdrsgnsr

Solo Q > rest imo

As it is now i can spec for the map which adds a tactical component to the game. If the map choice was random that would be taken away.

I do see your point that it gets repetetive though.

I can turn it off pretty please?

In fact i liked the game quite a bit better without it.

Manuhell.2759:

Weapon stats and sigils do apply.

^this

swapping in and out of a kit procs weapon swap effects like a normal weapon swap would.

You always gain all bonuses applied by weapons (weather its stats or sigils) even when youre using a kit.

So after trying it for a bit here are my spvp thoughts.

Its not too viable as condi cleanse because of 2 reasons which are

1) the cleanse is tied to the heal – if you need to condi cleanse but are at high hp you waste your heal other option is waiting till the condis ticked you down enough but that cant really be what a condi cleanse should incorporate. On the other side if you need to heal but have no condis up you waste your cleanse which you might need later on.

2) the cleanse is applied after the main portion of the heal (regen yeye) which means that i cant cleanse poison to get a full heal – this is just soooo important.

The Waterfield is well appreciated!!11 srsly but the mechanic feels wonky and the actual healing field appears a bit delayed even when spamming the heal button. Then again that might be intended. As others have already pointed out the actual duration on the waterfield is more like 3 seconds than 5 seconds.

The waterfield does not disappear faster when blowing up the turret.

The waterfield has very high potential but can be shutdown with CC and we dont have reliable stability to ward stuff like that off.

If the healing turret would ever be intended to be put out and remain in place it would either need to
1) Give MASSIVE heal per second (maybe + 1 condi rmv per second) and let the turret hp as it is
2) Increase the Turret HP drastically

as it is it`s impossible to keep the turret alive even with constant tool kit spam vs simple GC autohits (luckily at this point there is no reason to keep the turret out though)

I`m very happy they didnt decide to force us to have the turret out.

Keeping healing turret alive in pvp with its current hp / tough even when entirely traited and constantly spamming tool kit it still dies instantly when 1 guy is so much as looking at it.

As mentioned in the other thread – The water field appears to be shorter than 5 seconds.
The water field does not get cancled by blowing up the turret

I love dat patch – no irony here.

google.3709:

ahhhhh.. waterfield only last 3 seconds, can anyone confirm this ?

^ i can confirm the waterfield is definitely shorter than 5 sec but i cant say the exact amount – testing is awkward with overcharge activating later than the button pressed

Overall very good patch!!!!!11

Healing Turret changes are great!
The incendiairy powder change actually makes non grenade condi builds a lot more viable!
love the cloaking devicve change

and the bloody steal dmg from thieves got nerfed ohhh yesssssss

they even fixed the traitline that reduces tool belt recharge

ALL HAIL ELIXIKITTEN

called ieeeeehhhhht

Seperation of SoloQ and teamQ coming “soon”?

Any Chance Engineers could their RNG elixirs fixed by adding a “if” question and reducing “rng” down to 2. Where the if question is kit equipped yes/no and depending on if you got a kit equipped or not the elixir will proc one or the other effect?

Would be like ELE attunement boons depending on attunement and actually give the engineer some “VERSATILITY” hinthint

Swim.6830:

OP has no argument, just an opinion.

It’s like saying “Shatters need to be adressed a.s.a.p.” with no argument as basis.

One last note: what do you consider a strong AOE? I doubt anyone here can make an Ele AOEing for more than 4k without making a glass cannon build, which compared to 9k backstabs, 8k heartseekers and 4k shatters seems perfectly balanced in my opinion…

^dis pretty much depending on the skill i can easily make it hit for more than 4K though but thats not the point.,.

Are we like talking about staff eles? because lol?

Ele dps output is already a joke – and most of the "aoe"s you can simply walk out because they cast forever/have 3 hour animations. Especially if you ever get hit by churning earth EVER you`re just bad mkay.

Also glasscannon ele brings no poison and dies instantly?!

Ele is the same as guardian imo in the regard that their defensive builds outshine their offensive builds by at least 5 stars

Theres a lot of bad bunkers that just die too kitten fast to too few people in soloq imo.

1v2 should take a looooong time if at all. 1v3 shouldnt mean instant death.

So anyone figured out how exactly the priority for conditions cleansed is?

I have mostly single condition cleanses with some minor casttime between each but still find myself stuck in an immobilize because my 3 cleanses just have to remove that 1 stack vulnerability and those 3 stacks bleed and that 1 stack vulnerability again.

Or having 2-3 stacks bleed which almost ran out + a 7 second poison and i really need that poison off for a heal but end up having to wait till the bleeds ran out

waka.9826:

HGH has 0 peels after the build is done using elixir S.

this pretty much – very squishy after elixir S is gone – only high cd access to snares.
Pretty hard to stay alive after elixir S if you`re getting focused by 2 dudes or more. Also our downed still suxx very hard.

Other than that:

Retaliation

and most of all dodgeing! i swear if people start managing to dodge shrapnel and blowtorch reliably the dmg output is pretty much gone
Dodgeing becomes especially easy when youre staying on range. Getting close vs nades is a terrible idea in general.

edit: also be smart about your condi removals use them only after a close hit by blowtorch or a 3hit shrapnel – in these cases you need to be quick to cleanse because the duration is so long and waiting till you drop to low hp and then cleanse is not a good idea

Kline.9561:

RaynStargaze.6510:

You can`t 1V1 a really good Bunker player in a reasonable amount of time even with HgH. Fortunately players are bad and stand in grenade spam, dodge roll spam pointless stuff and then get hit by blowtorch.

I`ve seen Ostricheggs get outlasted and get knocked off node (and decapped) by 1 Ele (Zerrex/xerrex?whatever).

Most people play terrible as always. So the QQ will continue.

I played vs 5 Guards the other day (suffice to say we won that but not because i killed all dem guards so fast..) and the retaliation damage of just 1 nade throw is massive.

yeah standing in that grenade spam those bad players standing in a little circle due to the game mode we call conquest they should L2P honestly

seriously though HGH is pretty op right now i have nothing against the build personally its a fun spec but when teams of bad are getting carried due to them stacking 2-3 of them its just plain absurd, forcing you stack classes that counter them like necro’s, mesmers etc…

Lmao grenade aoe isnt even large enough to cover an entire node on Niflhel – honestly if you cant avoid nades thrown over range (like the top to bottom spam at mine/keep/henge) you really just deserve to die.

Bad people still QQing about bad strats.

Especially if you get farmed by all those fotm engi rerollers that fill the tourneys atm

You can`t 1V1 a really good Bunker player in a reasonable amount of time even with HgH. Fortunately players are bad and stand in grenade spam, dodge roll spam pointless stuff and then get hit by blowtorch.

I`ve seen Ostricheggs get outlasted and get knocked off node (and decapped) by 1 Ele (Zerrex/xerrex?whatever).

Most people play terrible as always. So the QQ will continue.

I played vs 5 Guards the other day (suffice to say we won that but not because i killed all dem guards so fast..) and the retaliation damage of just 1 nade throw is massive.

Just so we get on the same point here..

Ostricheggs who claims HgH is OP so valiantly actually has:

ALMOST 1200!!!! tourney games on ladder! (so 1200 games ever since ladder started counting which is an insane! number)
over 5000!!!! matches played on engineer

honestly WHAT kitten! Ostrich is just that good – the build doesnt really matter in his case.

The number of other engineers doing solo qeue and still making top1000 is pretty darn limited (in fact there are 0 others i know of other than Ostrich but you can educate me on that!)

Then again you can make top 1000 with a few lucky wins in a row so maybe its not that representative.

Here are a few easy pro tips how to counter HgH engineer for easy instawins:

- STAY ON RANGE whatever the kitten you do dont get in close – all engi dps comes in close range/nades get harder to dodge point blank and blowtorch is only really worth using when in close
- DODGE SHRAPNEL
- DODGE BLOWTORCH
- KITE ENGI HgH engi is actually really bad at kiting unless the opponent allows himself to be kited – aside from the chill grenade on 16 sek cd and the aoe cripple from pistol on 25 or 20 sek cd (which can both be dodged very easily) – so in a logical row with what i said previously just kite the engi yourself instead and walk out of his nades (yes you dont even need to dodgeroll as long as you dont get too close)

ezezezezez

google.3709:

Also they do not fire as fast, or fire at enemies as a matter of fact… they tend to get distracted and shoot at rocks..

Forget HgH Nades!

Here comes ADHD Turrets!

kitten

characters

so trueeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

borbottone.6241:

I was thinking about the same might build but I have some general question:
1) i have grenth armor set and caduceus manor armor set. So can I change their rune with hoel, str and fire? If not, where you put on these runes?

To apply new runes to a piece of armor just double click the rune and then on the piece of armor (or right click on the armor and then choose the rue you want to apply)

borbottone.6241:

2) I never tried pvp and wvw and I’m doing dungeons and just started with fractals. Do I need more defense with trinkets? I die a lot, maybe because I’m not really good at the moment.

You generally shouldnt die in PvE even with full berserker gear unless you`re running really high level fractals maybe. Dodge moar!

borbottone.6241:

Can someone explain if healing power+backpack regen is useful?

^google: name of the backpack regen trait + gw2 + wiki

Short: no! in fact healing power is almost always bad on almost all classes. (and btw backpack regen is not affected by healing power and is a terrible trait to begin with!)

Archaon.6245:

Never saw a thief (Or another dps spec) doing a 10k+ aoe combo while still having access to pretty much an entire weapon skillbar of healing/survival skills….did you?

I`ve been hit for 20K with my engi running dat condi/power/vit amulett by a simple steal/CnD/Backstab (not aoe but who gives a kitten rly)

The thief hitting me for this amount used lolstep/lolaoestealth/15%dmg signet as utility which seems pretty kittening good to me

Thief is just cheap as kitten!

@topic Ele aoe buffs/heals/mobility/bunker potential/cantrips/ability to reset combat with rtl all add up to it being very good!

However i dont feel that ele is viable as glasscannon! Their dmg output is not consistent enough to make this style of play very viable.

please dont insult my shortbow 1!

it consistently deals way more damage than SD on every hit!

Assassin.7890:

One quick question to ya all:
I have a hard time to hit stuff with blowtorch, how do you handle this skill? Potentially it is awesome, but it misses a lot…
Kind regards

face directly to the target – with camera and character

dont move at all or only move forward while using the skill – for the love of god dont strafe!

^reduces the misses but doesnt remove them entirely

^i dont wvw and i usually speak from a pvp perspective unless stated otherwise

As for the burn – i agree its very good! but

The burn from pistol is not as important if you have FT + rampagers/berserker to proc incendiairy powder. Then again he doesnt have 2/6 Lyssa runes to get the 3rd tick from the powder burn. (edit: not to mention the burns you get from FT)

overall – and i dont think i can express this well enough – i dont like the build because its this weird hybrid thing that doesnt really excel at anything its just all meh and not very well though out imo.

cleansing formula 409 is at least 33% of the reason why HgH is so good – dropping it seems like a really bad idea

overall build just has no condition remove at all soooo….. meh

I also felt that HgH for might stacking + power builds was never worth it because you lose a lot of crit dmg% which is pretty darn good for berserker builds – in fact i can get the same damage with crit dmg% and bersi amulett that i can get with around 15 stacks might + bersi without crit dmg %

Also sigils for might on crit are pretty bad. Back when i tested them they would only give me 1 stack of might with a ridiculous internal CD (even though it says 2 sec cd in the wiki) and the might duration is also really bad on these sigils.

Personally i`d choose battle over sigil of strength any day even with juggernaut. Just make sure not to spam kit swaps like an idiot

I would also pick berserkers amulett and rifle. Pistol isnt all that good aside from the poison and the 2 sigils.

^Precise sights is pretty bad to begin with imo especially if you dont have any fast attacking skills/multihit skills (like FT or nades) (also isnt it still bugged in some way?)

Personally i`d replace precise sights with 10 more points in the critdmg% tree and go for SD. I`d also remove the self CC stun breaker and replace it with utility goggles. (as Sporadicus already pointed out)

crit dmg% is very good in pvp where you dont have ridiculous amounts of it and it also reduces your toolbelt cd for more SD and the utility your toolbelt skills bring to the table with this build aaaaand you also get 10% more dmg with full endurance which is VERY! good

Not only that but you can actually double SD with your turrets which is pretty sweet (not sure if it works with regen mist)

On the bad side you dont have that much condition removal at all and i personally really hate the healing turrets condi removal because it comes DIRECTLY after your heal goes on cooldown – i.e. you cant remove poison safely and then intantly get out a full heal before they can reapply poison which is imho one of the most important things about condi remove to begin with

Edit: And also even worse than HgH which is broken by 1 lucky boon remove, this whole vulnerability stacking thing gets broken by 1 condi remove pretty reliably. And condi remove is way more accessible for everyone than boon stripping.

in PvE

bombs have very good direct damage and scale pretty well with power – therefore bombs + might stacking is pretty good

i personally like the non HgH version with bombs + FT and use FT 1 to attack while kit swapping to retain high might stack without losing any dps at all which is pretty darn sweet (i.e. no “down time” in which you dont dps just to stack might)

Any chance a seperate unranked Tournament que would be easier to implement than straight out different MMR for solo and team?

Solo Queue or groups with rl friends who dont play that often are very much discouraged as it is now.

So i recognized Ostricheggs on the NA servers with a redonculous number of games played(GZ!).

And Teldo on EU (who has a great team to carry him cough cough)
also clik on eu who apparently rolled guard for all dem tourney wins

Who else made top 100?

very nice

characters

Fairtex.7810:

Heres a new video showing a full match at Battle of Kyloh, theres the table at the end for you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmsvtaA4evM&feature=youtu.be

Nice to see you`re playing good people first of all

All the things i said in my previous post about why the build fails still stand though and i dont see my opinion on those changing anytime soon.

Overall in this game you got great teamwork and trebfire helps you out a lot.

I dont really think that you contributed much to this game what a different build/profession couldnt have done better though.

At 6:22 for example the engi and the guard attack in a 2v2 situation and the engi just instagibs you really fast – notice the guard doesnt do anything at all really getting pushed back by your turrets once but that only means that you got killed by 1 engi solo pretty much (the necro joining in as well later on).
Which is pretty much what i said for a non-dps class you die too fast to too many things and dont bring enough utility aside from net turret.

You lose node twice even though youre clearly defending while walking off node to place turrets or something – obviously thats bad and you shouldnt do that.

Later on you get attacked by a guard and a warri you die to them relatively quick even though you use turret knockback – i feel like an aoe slow would have helped you more in that situation.

blurps.2340:

RaynStargaze.6510:

galandor.1059:

What do you think? Personally, I think the odds are around 65 or 70%.

The only time a popular off build for engineer didnt get nerfed right away in the next upcoming patch was when SD first became popular.

SD also hasnt been nerfed since then.

So on the same note i predict that there will be no nerfs to HgH specifically.
Maybe a general Might nerf as Might stacking can be abused on other classes as well

HGH conditions is a much more well rounded build and overall considerably stronger than SD though. In an SD centered build you have no defenses to speak of while getting moderate burst at best in return. There’s a reason hardly anyone is using it these days.

yup thats definitely true

RaynStargaze.6510:

Learn 2 dodge roll treb
make sure you have enough CC / immobi removal

ignore treb —> ez win

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

I think some ppl who answered to this topic don’t know what timed stuns and immobilizes are.

just sayin`

waka.9826:

This is the exact same argument as the “is thief burst op” argument. You can technically tell someone to dodge everything and anything, but is that realistic? Nope.

No it is absolutely not!

A thief has way more burst than you can ever hope to dodge even with vigor up.
(4 Heartseeker/2 CnD base + Steal + stealth utility to reopen with BS + all dem traits that allow faster initiative regen / higher initiative pool – there is no way you are going to avoid all of that unless you kite like a baws to begin with! (i.e. you cant hope to dodge it all without doing anything else to avoid) )

Treb doesnt even fire fast enough to kill people without vigor on side nodes as long as they can dodge.

EDIT: Also you can always see treb fire coming from a mile away and theres even a very early audio cue (which also doesnt always work so thats a huge downside) to avoid it.

With thieves you dont even see them coming.. consider you`re in a team fight and the thief just CnD+Steal+Bs u. There is no cues for steal, it has a 900 range and is instant. And with basi venom youre stunned after that as well.

Plus the thief can approach in stealth so you dont even have a chance to react to begin with.

Very high quality thread – very entertaining

also this

Shar.3402:

Kultas Sunstrider.9218:

/facepalm ?
…

+

Rerroll.9083:

please, go back to pve

Dirame.8521:

Lol sub-par or mediocre? What other class can unload all types of conditions on you before you can even blink?

You clearly didnt read what OP wrote…

Elixir Gun is bad atm. Damage output is subpar + skills are lackluster. Healing is neglectable. I have yet to meet a single person in PvE calling for a condition removal from an engineer. (then again admittedly i dont PvE that much)

Overall Elixir Gun does not shine since the kit refinement nerf – especially in PvE i can see no reason i would want to bring it

If you want to level fast in PvE – Power with bombs is the way to go.

Learn 2 dodge roll treb
make sure you have enough CC / immobi removal

ignore treb —> ez win

galandor.1059:

What do you think? Personally, I think the odds are around 65 or 70%.

The only time a popular off build for engineer didnt get nerfed right away in the next upcoming patch was when SD first became popular.

SD also hasnt been nerfed since then.

So on the same note i predict that there will be no nerfs to HgH specifically.
Maybe a general Might nerf as Might stacking can be abused on other classes as well

sPvP perspective only

“off” condition is decent – everything else does not work in pvp

class overall lacks
1. survivability when playing off builds (as soon as you drop elixir S, you`re going down HARD!) i.e. this means lack of stun breakers + lack of stealth/invul. Engi is reasonably squishy without the massive hp pool of necros or the ridiculous amount of evades which mesmers or rangers (or even thieves) bring to the table
2. lacks condition removal in general outside of elixirs
3. lacks VERSATILITY! lack of weapon swap means we have 1 skill less than other classes with a 4 skill class mechanic even if we pick 1 kit.

For a more detailed look at the last patch i provided this post to the spvp forums:

After my suspension is lifted i can finally go back to voicing my opinion on the most recent patch notes for engineer in the most eloquent way possible.

For this matter i`d like to share this video which explains the issues in depth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxMafF6mj1E

I could write pages of information on what is wrong with this class. But due to the fact that it doesnt have any impact on the ridiculous choices the game designers make i might as well not waste the time.

bhagwad.4281:

TRON.1085:

bhagwad.4281:

Here are a few counters:

1. Single large hits
2. Conditions (condi necros, caltrop thieves etc)
3. Boon stripping (as you mentioned)
4. Minions (you let them do the damage instead)
5. Quick burst (retal gets more powerful as the fight drags on)

Large hit didnt work for me, the mesmer would just not go down
Conditions they just removed
I don’t have any boon stripping on this profession
No minions
Quick burst also not enough to kill them and hurt me more..

These do work. I know because they counter me and I play a retal build. Single large hits work. Conditions work. Minions work. Boon stripping works.

If your build has none of these, then I just think that you found a counter for it.

^this

/thread

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Thanatos.2431:

Hows that invisible cooldown on kit refinement treated ya? I think your the last engi to still have it…..

It’s not perfect, but it opens up some interesting play possibilities, especially while stunned. I don’t have a stunbreaker in this build, but I can still swap kits while stunned, which allows me to pop a clutch magnetic aura while being pelted with projectiles, or a magnet bomb to interrupt a melee spike.

^oh rly? so you just sit there and never use medkit or bombkit until you get stunned?

pro strat!

@ OP
I cant watch the kylho video (german music gema right protection bullkitten) and you cut out the ending credits on the niflhel video. So for all i care you`re playing rank 20s and dont want to show how bad you actually are

I can play without traits at all and still win against baddies. Owning noobs with crappy builds doesnt make the builds or the player good

EDIT: In fact in the Niflhel video you lose node vs a SINGLE MESMER. A Bunker build (and if i recall correctly you called your build a turret bunker somewhere) that is not able to hold node vs 2 (GC) opponents at the same time for quite a while is not worth it in the slightest.

sooooo you got a terrible pvp game for which you paid 50 bucks or whatever

and now you want people to pay for the terrible game which they already paid for?

Honestly only reason i`m still here is because there have been no decent new games for over a year – only copy paste shooters with a nice colouring (hi there bioshock 3)

Unless they improve the pvp aspect alot until then, i`m out as soon as they ask me for more moneyz

yayaya same for me – hard to get a full group these days

i`ll hit you up for a 1v1 at some point this weekend until then

dzindzinier.6138:

blahhh

I think i beat you up in tourneys a few times the last couple of days if your ingame nick is the same as your forum nick.

Nice fail build.

herr derr i`m a beautiful and unique snowflake herr derr

On a sidenote i agree that condition without HgH is viable simply because it doesnt sacrifice as much utility.
For power builds the only thing still working is SD and SD has always been bad.
Flamethrower damage is too low to compete with other professions.

magic fly.2041:

It was the first time after the patch that I played him, and i tried out a turret build. It is actually kind of fun to use turrets now that they have been buffed

The patch made me stick with my engineer and actually use him in spvp/tpvp to great effectiveness.

tl;dr – i agree with the poster above me – magic fly has no idea what hes talking about and most likely lives under a rock

Turrets are /fail
Ill exclude net turret here because net turret has always been good in off builds

Just so people know what turrets actually do:
Rifle – 500dmg per shot (+ bleed if overcharged)
Flame – 150dmg per shot + 2s burn
Thumper – 700dmg in an aoe the size of traited bombs
Rocket – 800/900dmg per shot 4s burn (knockdown if overcharged) but has a very long cast animation which can EASILY be walked out (in general Rocket turret will NEVER hit anything unless your opponent is terribad – same thing with thumper actually)

1500 damage if the turret explodes in a VERY small aoe
<b>
Turrets can never crit
Turrets always attack the closest enemy – you can`t target stuff
Turrets dont scale with playerstats (<- this is the MAIN issue more than anything else)
You can spend 30 points in a terrible toughness tree so your turrets deal 15% more damage
Turrets bring no utility to the table with the exception of flame turret which has a built in smoke bomb (but simply picking BOMB KIT instead of flame turret is waaaaay more effective – lower cooldown better skillset in general etc etc) (and net turret – but net turret has always been good not just post patch – it brings good CC, too bad engineer has no decent damage output to back up all the CC he has)</b>

Also Turrets have very bad tool belt skills in general. Surprise shot being the only one that sees some use just to proc static discharge

overall this really

blurps.2340:

It’s basically HGH conditions or gtfo now.

EDIT: I`m going to add dps values just for giggles first number is non overcharged dps 2nd is overcharged dps

Rifle T: 250/500 + 4sbleed every second
Flame T (assuming a burn damage of 500): 400/none
Thumper T: 233/ 1-time 1000dmg
Rocket (assuming a burn dmg of 500): 750/850 <— this actually sounds good in theory doesnt it? too bad rocket turret never hits anything