Guild Wars 2

Dondagora.9645:

StickerHappy.8052:

Okay, to be fair, when fighting a mesmer, thieves have halved stealth durations. Class mechanic vs Class Mechanic.

How…?

I am wondering how is stealth related to CD and would that factor when thief is in squad even stealth and interrupt are not class mechanics…seems very specific also. Any initiative costing skill interrupted should lose the initiative and have the 3 sec CD before reusage, I’m already ware of the designed weaknesses of thief CD is not one of them.

Absconditus.6804:

Sagat.3285:

Really? Bad design is call over the place and I’m open-minded but nope you are not convincing me. Missing a skill on thief is very punishing,the first bad design would be to fix thief weapons THEN your GM trait over thief. Thief is becoming more reflexe and timing based than any other classes even more post patch.

You should rephrase a bit; Missing your <skill here> with <profession here> is very punishing. It’s not just thieves. Also, if you miss your CnD, you can swap to Shortbow and shadowstep your way out with Infiltrator’s Arrow. You can use Hide in Shadows to gain Stealth and get out. You can use Blinding Powder, Shadow Refuge, Shadowstep/Shadow Return, Roll for Initiative+Withdraw. There are so many options for retreat on missing a skill like Cloak and Dagger. If you are punished that badly, perhaps you’re just bad (until you get some practice) at playing the Thief profession, sorry but it’s the harsh reality..

It’s also nearly impossible to miss a opener CnD (unless you’re fighting a decent player who has/is playing Thief, but not necessarily when you battle them). Tap CnD and instantly Steal(/Mug) when in range. You’ll shadowstep (and deal damage with Mug if traited, or at least removed the Aegis), and instantly go into stealth as the buffered CnD hits your target, allowing for a instant Backstab as you push through the enemy (don’t have collision on in the Options). Almost nobody is able to react to that, even if they know it’s coming, and you’ve in the matter of the blink of an eye done about 15k damage to pretty much anyone if you’re built glass. Should they by some miracle not be on the floor, you can spam Heartseeker for massive damage on their lowered health.. because you know, it’s a spammable skill that you can repeatedly “exploit” with initiative. The kind of skill you say is weaker because it’s possible to spam. Nope, not really true.

What made you assume I play d/d I don’t ,not sure what game mode you are talking about the longer I disengage the higher the higher the chance of getting out of combat fully healing foe,while SR is on CD or maybe while I am busy on a combo field my foe will run away. Choking Gas change also affect that and not everyone out there is zerker or glass, ty the game for valkyrie usable on power thief.

Back to original topic, submission is bad even condi necro>engi is not that dominant.

Dondagora.9645:

I was talking about this earlier this year, and thought of a few ideas.

Our interrupt [I had thought] takes the initiative the thief spent on the skill. If it apparently doesn’t, well, it should then. This is the replacement for a non-Power Block interrupted cool down on skills. ANet should make sure that if a thief skill is interrupted, it still costs them initiative, which I think may be a bug if it doesn’t.

Now, against thieves I believe our Power Block should not put them on normal CD, given that their mechanic is having a universal CD called initiative. Power Block should therefore drain from their initiative instead to increase their CD. The obvious, yet wrong solution, is to take as much initiative as the skill interrupted cost, thus doubling the amount the thief lost. This is too much, given that skills interrupted are all globally put on a 5 second CD, or 10 seconds with Power Block. Therefore, the extra initiative drained should be universal.

The best number of initiative to remove is 3, I think. Interrupt a Heart Seeker, you make it cost twice as much without any result. You interrupt a 6 initiative skill, you take 9 and make it so they can’t use it again[in most cases] right after the daze, but doesn’t eat their initiative whole. It punishes but doesn’t make them unable to fight on a lucky daze.

Let see how many reasonable players agree with this “proposition” . Let’s allow 1 interrupt to put thief into submission mode used initiative isn’t enough.

Really? Bad design is call over the place and I’m open-minded but nope you are not convincing me. Missing a skill on thief is very punishing,the first bad design would be to fix thief weapons THEN your GM trait over thief. Thief is becoming more reflexe and timing based than any other classes even more post patch.

AI goes from terrible to “Meh I’ll take it” in pve,who saw actual AI in wvw and mesmer doesn’t count they have no choice so the least they could do is make them viable enough in pvp. At least one mode,just one,current pve and zerg are not AI friendly liked or not.

Not sure on how can you have total AI control in this game even ranger is not at that level.

Just 1 class and you complain? Diamond skin can counter a whole set-up,condition necro own boon classes and has higher win rate against other condition builds…

Changing a class mechanic for 1 trait only seems very minor,very very minor.

Because initiative is different than CD , skills are weaker because you can activate them multiple times,swap weapon still got the same initiative, initiative is too fragile but fits the role of thief. They weren’t meant to be is why. Every weapons carries specific downsides and especially post patch, don’t mention p/d it lacks mobility and just like d/d heavily reliant on CnD,missing it hurts.

Not 10 sec CD but not reusable instantly, please don’t tell me you interrupted AA,thief has utilities as well,wasted initiative is enough just like chill imparing thief movement and utilities.

Thief losing initiative and skills usage CD is not enough?

1v1 fair in GW2? ???? Crate is fair no matter what.

Simple.

You can find the easiest and the hardest build to fight because the game is not about 1v1. Zerker Ax/Sh war complains about celestial ele while LB ranger is trolling the ele while the ele runs away from condition necro. If you can’t get that your credibility is even more in question.

KrisHQ.4719:

Sagat.3285:

KrisHQ.4719:

Sagat.3285:

KrisHQ.4719:

@Sagat
I do not quite understand your post. I never said I wanted to nerf the power side of might? And what bleeds deal a lot of dmg as ele?
It seems you’re agreeing with me, that the condition damage is the problem?
Can you elaborate?

Sarcasm……..the last possible thing I did was agreeing with you.

Well. From a sarcastic point of view, your post still does not make any sense.
I can’t really comment on your post, if it is not explained.

Like you said : what bleed deals a lot of damage?even with burn and/or poison? Only zerkers with melee focus and poor boon dealing complain about celestial and your lack of toughness rather than direct damage turn you on conditions?! How is that possible or you wouldn’t like power build nerf? Did you build to counter celestial ele or to play what you like???

Burning and poison deals fair amounts of dmg throughout a fight, bleed does not however. Only if you land Churning Earth, then you can stack roughly 10 stacks.
I still don’t know what you’re suggestion is the cause. But I can assure you that conditions have a huge part in it. Otherwise, Elementalists would also be OP with Valkyrie’s Amulet.

Valkyrie lacks precision,vitality and healing power. Who gets hits with Churning Earth? It’s celestial (all stats matter)not rabid,dire or carrion,poison is only used for reduced healing. Long fights are at a disavantage of zerkers, stay at range and maintain the ele as far from you as possible like with LB ranger or rifle engi you won’t see much pressure. I’ve never heard of condi ele in pvp in wvw they use dire and perplexity runes…

Only zerkers with melee focus and low boon dealing struggle against celestial ele. Might if nerf would be power side and again did you build to counter them or play what you like? Answer…….

Conquest and wvw are fine,remember the game doesn’t support 1v1,have people on squad to cover your weaknesses and cover theirs, we just need more types in pvp the deatmatch is not enough.

KrisHQ.4719:

Sagat.3285:

KrisHQ.4719:

@Sagat
I do not quite understand your post. I never said I wanted to nerf the power side of might? And what bleeds deal a lot of dmg as ele?
It seems you’re agreeing with me, that the condition damage is the problem?
Can you elaborate?

Sarcasm……..the last possible thing I did was agreeing with you.

Well. From a sarcastic point of view, your post still does not make any sense.
I can’t really comment on your post, if it is not explained.

Like you said : what bleed deals a lot of damage?even with burn and/or poison? Only zerkers with melee focus and poor boon dealing complain about celestial and your lack of toughness rather than direct damage turn you on conditions?! How is that possible or you wouldn’t like power build nerf? Did you build to counter celestial ele or to play what you like???

Liked or not it got to be viable enough to be at least considered(at least in one game mode).

KrisHQ.4719:

@Sagat
I do not quite understand your post. I never said I wanted to nerf the power side of might? And what bleeds deal a lot of dmg as ele?
It seems you’re agreeing with me, that the condition damage is the problem?
Can you elaborate?

Sarcasm……..the last possible thing I did was agreeing with you.

^If condition spirit weapon build becomes strong enough….^^^^^^^^

ukuni.8745:

Sagat.3285:

ukuni.8745:

Anton.1769:

<whisper> you can run from that mesmer and he can not chase you

unless he stacks torment which deals more damage when your running away

Start running early.

just like when you see a necro.

on a serious note, mesmers are much more popular the necros for roaming and I’d really rather not be running from fights more then I currently have to when I go roaming.

Necro skill bar is coming,conditions necros are not rare. Ask your self do you build ob what you like or to counter condi mesmer?

KrisHQ.4719:

Sagat.3285:

I just love hearing the nerf might proposition over and over again. It’s one thing to nerf celestial without considering the classes that can’t use it as effective and the specs that can counter it but it’s a whole other thing nerfing might without considering the effect on real condition users mainly build for small scale fights or 1v1.

Very few – if any – condition builds except Warrior and Elementalist relies on might-stacking.
“That’s not true dude, I use my own condi build in WvW that relies on might.”
Yes. It’s a shame that your build will be even less effective, but that balance logic is seriously screwed. Think about it;
“Will Earthshaker be nerfed? WTF. I’m using Hammer in my 6/6/2/0/0 offensive warrior build, and it will be even less useless now. Thanks for kitten arenanet, way to support build diversity”
If ArenaNet had to balance thinking of every single build being affected, they could not touch anything.
The alternative to nerfing Might and trying to avoid hitting other classes would be to nerf the Elementalist’s skills, which would make every build except Might-stackers even worse. Those skills are not the source, since they are not unbalanced WITHOUT Might.
And yes, that IS an alternative and has been proposed in this thread. The problem is that you’re hitting build diversity even more.
Fact is; something has to change, so either you buff other classes to the same lvl (always ends up badly, and is much more time consuming) or you choose to nerf the thing with less impact on alternative builds.
With nerfing Might, you hit both the Ele and Warrior which is good, and apparently also some non-meta PvP/WvW builds.
Last alternative is to reduce the Might duration from runes, so that stacking +15 is not possible alone. That would help in duels and solo encounters but wouldn’t make a difference in a teamfight. Furthermore, you would have to look at all of the other runes, to make sure there aren’t alternatives (like pirate) and also make sure Hoelbrak and Strength does not become useless.

I don’t claim to have the exact answer, since I am unable to test either of these changes. So I can only speculate what their outcomes would be, but based on observations I’d say nerfing Conditon Damage on Might is the solution since Power on Might (and Power on Elementalists) is not a problem.

Inferior burn and some bleeds do SO MUCH DAMAGE,even celestial war do so much conditions even Impale doesn’t land. Zerker in pvp with extra vitality and 0 toughness would change your opinion to nerf power side of might. Mainly offensive power build with melee focus and lack of boon removal have trouble against celestial and so far I haven’t of them being trouble in wvw.

scerevisiae.1972:

I think Lightning Rod is still very weak for a GM trait – it’s essentially equivalent to Halting Strike, an adept mesmer trait.

The other big killer is that Ele has only 1 skill (2 on focus) per weapon that causes disable. This means this GM trait is about as damaging as Arcane wave, but on a longer cooldown, and (but for the weakness, woopedy-doo) is available as a mesmer adept trait.

Infinite weakness is not meant to be is probably why.

I just love hearing the nerf might proposition over and over again. It’s one thing to nerf celestial without considering the classes that can’t use it as effective and the specs that can counter it but it’s a whole other thing nerfing might without considering the effect on real condition users mainly build for small scale fights or 1v1.

ukuni.8745:

Anton.1769:

<whisper> you can run from that mesmer and he can not chase you

unless he stacks torment which deals more damage when your running away

Start running early.

Interrupt on steal with perplexity runes,agony sigils if you worry about bleed.

^lol …2 years…. www problems….please tell me troll….what happened to SA….did they nerf hidden killer and valkyrie…..look is personal…

WvW 2 6 6 0 0,0 6 6 2 0 or even 6 6 2 0 0(not with d/d) beserker gear of course.

Yes because primary condition should come from selected weapon not traits,the scepter #2 has two downsides the visable block icon and foe evading right after block trigger,#3 is too slow and unreliable,last skill of AA chain is slower than the previous ones which are slow also,the scepter is UP without traits currently used for shatter,clone death,bleed on crit(their chains is slower than the scepter AA). Clone factory is a joke with the current velocity and it was intended as condition weapon.

Edit: forget clone factory it is impossible. DE and vigor on crit takes care of that so scepter is really far from it’s intended use. To anyone posting are you posting about scepter or PU+DE+DD? This about scepter not a build.

Aza.2105:

When there is a nerf thread it always amounts to someone trying to discredit the person/s perspective on the other side of the fence. Its probably best not to do that because each person has some truth to what they are saying, even though it may not be the whole truth.

We should try to keep things simple, maybe by discussing the matter in bullet points. In this case the bullet points could be the strengths and weaknesses of the d/d celestial ele.

I only can say that when you have a build that has high sustain, survivability and damage then this is never a good thing. Since the point of diversity is to sacrifice one area of strength for another. If d/d celestial ele has all three then there is a problem, though the problem may not necessarily be in the area that some people think it is.

It’s because a naked ele has balanced level of all three of those so celestial is more effective on them. Full water magic and arcana(healing+vitality+boon duration) deserves high sustain so that is innocent. First weakness condition,right after they get off water or if they use it carelessly,on condition thief,necro and engi I’m fine against them adding that they are melee also. Second weakness tanks if retaliation is present even more,long fight but if ele stay he will eventually lose. Post patch celestial war will be balanced with torment and adrenaline changes now they will be naturally weak against damage conditions,celestial engi is still weak to condition and cc.

A good celestial(because guard and thief can’t use it) counters an offensive power set up but not longbow ranger that much(they can make you chase them) or just have someone on squad to remove boons if you are in one if not the game is not made for 1v1 you can find your hardest counter out there.

coglin.1867:

Sagat.3285:

I do play condi kit engi and ele actually, my point those two set up can be rewarding but are not all it doesn’t have to be zerker stats. Complicated get’s easy over time that’s not high risk and I go arcana on my ele because I like having all skills as soon as possible. High risk and complicated are not the same lol.

If I’m lost please enlighten me sir share us your high reward/high risk specs that are not zerker related.

Apparently you missed it earlier. I cannot enlighten you on anything, because apparently we disagree. The problem appears to be that you think your opinion of high risk/high reward is cannon. Apparently the concept of subjective opinion is a foreign concept to you my friend.

I asked zerker sir not cannon sir but let’s leave at then sir let’s agree to disagree sir.

Edit: *non-zerker

I do play condi kit engi and ele actually, my point those two set up can be rewarding but are not all it doesn’t have to be zerker stats. Complicated get’s easy over time that’s not high risk and I go arcana on my ele because I like having all skills as soon as possible. High risk and complicated are not the same lol.

If I’m lost please enlighten me sir share us your high reward/high risk specs that are not zerker related.

Klonko.8341:

musu.9205:

nearlight.3064:

Well then, by the logic and opinions of people in this thread, there might as well be no builds that require significant skill to play.

I explained to you why d/p thief require more skill than d/d ,and why shatter/CI mesmer is highest tier of skill play .
what you said is first making wrong opinions about power necro and s/f burst ele . Then throwing more glass cannon builds without any thoughts on them to us to prove you know what are the skillful builds . But sadly you proved that you know nothing about how those builds work.

Are we clear before you are just making up others opinions?

You forgot the only unviable power class -> Ranger. Any person who run a power ranger build need more skill than any of the listed class you mentionned. I don’t talk about the sniper that stay on high ground and #1 all day. I talk about the one that try to decap things or protect a point.

It’s the hardest spec atm because:
1- You have no burst, which means -> you vulnerable to burst and tank usually outheal you. So you basicly you are an attrition zerker class which is REALLY bad.
2- Most unforgiving gameplay from all glass. You more likely to loose any encounter if you miss a defensive skill (such as LB #3-#4).
3- Most timing reliant class. You need those key evades to survive.

Power ranger build are atm are high risk/low reward. It may change next patch!

Are you going to mention the high risk/no reward builds as well like zerker trap thief or zerker signet guard?

+1 ranger is far from being a war.

-1

The block is fine the AA will be decent post patch. I’ m a fan of condition but that one too many compared to the cleansing my thief has and that’s a cc condition on AA my thief only as one break stun. You’re putting oil on the flames.

-2

Edit: not cc on AA but come on mesmer is the last class in need for a new condition yes I am talking about guard until their skill bar is present.

Yeah only glass canons are not low risk high reward..pffbtt...stop drowning in those debates. I’m hoping this is about pve because no build created cannot be countered meaning not 1v1 balance. What is low risk against some is high risk against others that’s what you guys cannot simply understand YOU ARE AVOIDING THE DIVERSITY.

Your beliefs are illusions.

-1.

1v1 balance will never exist and all builds can be countered just got to have someone on the squad that’s brave enough to make up for your weakness.

Depends on skill bar for pvp.

Nah I believed it will be like the ranger and engineer skill bar. Other than anticipated lich nerf sustain and weapon improvement and guard are excited getting spirit weapons and tomes improved not much angry faces will show themselves, minions might get fixed too.

Shatter condition will happen and they buffed scepter not PU trait. Non-popular builds are used as well,I rarely see a mesmer even less a power shatter one.

KrisHQ.4719:

Decrease the amount of Condition Damage received per Might stack from 35 to 15, while maintaining the same Power.

Very poor proposition. Why? Ele is a poor condition class and rely mostly on dps and so far the best class to profit from healing power and boons.

After reading all the post here I’m more on the Arcana side : ele is kind of forced to play with that trait line what some seem to find troublesome is that it is related to boon duration(nothing wrong with runes,sigils or amulet) and affect all elements. Alternative? Why do you have no one on your squad to remove the boons???

+1.

^lol

A few of us use p/d condi despite good results conquest is why we are rare in pvp. The windows for our diversity are closing. They are variations in d/p and s/d builds but conquest and our traits are negatively affecting those as well.

There was a p/p sb thief doing good in www but again conquest in pvp.

mango.9267:

Sagat.3285:

But necro has cc,transfer and higher burst,thief has sustain and control. Both have higher HP and not much boon to steal or corrupt.

Mesmers also have decent CC’s. And thieves have a much lower base hp pool than mesmers do. Thieves also have a ton of boons because of consume plasma, thrill of the crime, and power of inertia.

PU mesmer cc? Dire and carrion thief less hp than PU? Meta condition thief doesn’t use those traits.

Klonko.8341:

Sagat.3285:

Klonko.8341:

I know about 1vs1, and i’m okay because I win most of time. But It’s wrong when you end up fighting a group of people and most of them are P/D. It’s just boring and bad…

So would a group of s/d thieves,group of s/f ele. It’s frustrating having many of the same spec unless your squad has their specific counter. All builds have counters it just some of those counters are not liked by some also stat wise for now.

Edit: I don’t know your spec but p/d can be trolled.

I mean S/D group can be dealt with because they are squishy and evasive. P/D are not squishy and equally as evasive. So every group end up focusing everything except these and they stack up the further the lenght of the fight is long. (because of pugs joining with those builds). At the end you litterally have only enemies P/D left if you won haha.

P/D does not evade they can be trolled and killed low pressure.

mango.9267:

LCV.7245:

Lol, mango clearly doesn’t play Mesmer very well, if at all :P

The bottom line is, torment is easier to fight than another condi application AA such as bleeding from Ranger short bow or bleeding/poison from Necro scepter (both of which have faster AA chains and faster projectiles than Mesmer chains). I mean, seriously compare this to Necro scepter. Necro have infinite projectile speed, the attacks themselves are faster, and there’s two separate conditions in the chain, which makes each of them harder to clear. Additionally, this chain reduces your healing by 33%. And as a cherry on top, Necro has so much condi burst that you can easily bury the bleeding and poison under have a dozen other conditions.

Oh, mango, in case you couldn’t find the Necro forums, I linked them for you. And if you’re going to continue being innept on the forums, you should probably move over to the Warrior forums, where you can’t find a single intelligent idea. I feel like you might fit in there.

Necro forums: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer
Warrior forums: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/warrior

Please stop wasting space in a generally intelligent forum. Thank you.

Hey, nice personal attack. I have 1k+ hours on mesmer, but that’s irrelevant. I see tons of other mesmers (Pyro, Helseth, etc.) are equally concerned about this. Maybe you think they’re also “inept” at the class.

I’m going to read past the ad hominem and address your point directly. The difference between this and, say, a necro’s AA or a pistol thief’s AA, is that your clones will also apply it. Scepter 2 + deceptive evasion allows you to spawn scepter clones very easily, and they’ll apply torment even while you sit in stealth or use other skills. It’s much worse than a mere condi on AA because it’s so much easier to apply.

But necro has cc,transfer and higher burst,thief has sustain and control. Both have higher HP and not much boon to steal or corrupt.

Aberrant.6749:

Sagat.3285:

Mbelch.9028:

I’ve only read the first post, but that’s all I need to see right now..

Phant you’re really off base. Why would you ever suggest nerfing a class based on available armor? You need to nerf the armor.

Was D/D overpowered before celestial hit the scene? Honestly ask yourself that. No. It wasn’t.

Celestial is and was the issue. Celestial needs nerfing across the board or removed in PvP. Simple.

Strength runes need the same. So do balth runes.

It is upsetting when people suggest nerfing your class based on one set of armor which makes it overpowered. That’s an obvious miscarriage of balance, and I hope others realize that.

So one last thing, if people are abusing macros to heal more, that’s obviously a bug that needs fixed. Don’t put it in your vendetta for more nerfs.

Seems very poorly thought out in my opinion, to suggest nerfing an entire amulet for one single build on one single profession.

^ that makes more sense than anything I have seen in this thread.

Edit: Ele is a celestial class it make perfect sense celestial works best on them.

It’s too strong on eng as well… basically the classes that can make use of all the stats it’s too strong on. You can go balth with eng and not stack might and it’s still brutal. That means the ammy itself gives too many stats and it’s not related to might stacking.

It’s related to nobody on your squad able to remove the might #not1v1game

Klonko.8341:

I know about 1vs1, and i’m okay because I win most of time. But It’s wrong when you end up fighting a group of people and most of them are P/D. It’s just boring and bad…

So would a group of s/d thieves,group of s/f ele. It’s frustrating having many of the same spec unless your squad has their specific counter. All builds have counters it just some of those counters are not liked by some also stat wise for now.

Edit: I don’t know your spec but p/d can be trolled.

I play it and I like having personal cleasing and healing . Most thieves don’t go in squad and since you could find random builds out there I find it better to prepared to counter or avoid most. The game is not about 1v1 so for a class like thief to roam you play with what you find most helpful in 1v1 stealth.

In a good squad than you will see a different spec. Acro sustain pales to SA and when more pvp modes are available other than conquest you will see to them in pvp as well even with no dire.

PU will not be removed and is very unlikely to change you see condi PU mesmer the devs see PU GM trait in a toughness/boon duration trait line.

PvE is already is already focused on all that damage it would kill the game if PvP and WwW were too.

Maybe will see more support and tank builds since no one wants to play those.

All the change did was creating the shatter condition mesmer and fix a underpowered weapon. Mesmer is still a 1v1 class and pvp is still conquest I can’t understand the fear since any +1k ranged weapon owns PU and condition necro,engi…..and mix of popular and non-popular builds have the same effect. Increased of builds used leads to builds to counter them promoting a well organized team not one full of glassy nukers.

Who knows maybe more will be interested in stats,traits and gear other than damage only. It’s 5v5 you can be as glassy as you want as long as your squad make up for your weakness. Self made duels are against the logic of the game they want to do everything their way (solo way).

Like people kept mentioning over and over scepter was used for clone generation not the conditions themselves even if you trigger the block you can evade right after that and not get the torment stacks if you are in 1v1 situation I refuse to believe Confusion Images fully hit you because there is not much to dodge when fighting condition mesmer. Only good thing about it was you could have an off-hand to help you out but staff was better without that off-hand.

Mbelch.9028:

I’ve only read the first post, but that’s all I need to see right now..

Phant you’re really off base. Why would you ever suggest nerfing a class based on available armor? You need to nerf the armor.

Was D/D overpowered before celestial hit the scene? Honestly ask yourself that. No. It wasn’t.

Celestial is and was the issue. Celestial needs nerfing across the board or removed in PvP. Simple.

Strength runes need the same. So do balth runes.

It is upsetting when people suggest nerfing your class based on one set of armor which makes it overpowered. That’s an obvious miscarriage of balance, and I hope others realize that.

So one last thing, if people are abusing macros to heal more, that’s obviously a bug that needs fixed. Don’t put it in your vendetta for more nerfs.

Seems very poorly thought out in my opinion, to suggest nerfing an entire amulet for one single build on one single profession.

^ that makes more sense than anything I have seen in this thread.

Edit: Ele is a celestial class it make perfect sense celestial works best on them.