Guild Wars 2

It’s not broken. It’s a little something called Supply and Demand. Let me quote myself to educate you on the real problem:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

The real problem is the idea that some players feel Entitled to getting an item they want. And the fallacy here is that they believe there’s a problem, because they can’t get said item.

Not sure why you felt you needed to start another thread on this issue, when it’s already been resolved.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Lets-talk-about-the-new-Gem-conversion-Merged/page/34#post4507962

lordkrall.7241:

Indeed, good to see that it will be changed based on feedback (did anyone actually think otherwise?)

Not so good to see that this will basically mean that people will start raging everytime they don’t like something, since it is shown to work twice in a row now.

While the original change didn’t affect me at all, it’s nice to see that there’ll be options for custom orders.

That said, if raging works to get our way, should we start another thread about Mounts?

As a preemptive strike, I think it’d be a good idea to buy out as much Karka Shells and Passion Flowers as possible from the TP.

It’s fine to be new to the game. But it’s not fine to be dying and helping the other server blob rally. So the way I see it, T1 and T2 should only allow players that are lv80 into WvW, since these are the Elite servers. T3 and under should have no restrictions.

SpecterMAT.7306:

This copy paste Halloween made me quit GW2 for a few months at least.

Ahem

Mark Katzbach.9084:

It’s also worth pointing out that some people use claims of quitting the game as an attention-getting tactic, when in fact they are still quite active.

juno.1840:

By all means continue to defend — there’s good reason to defend the TP and economy.

However making a trolling post doesn’t do your argument justice — it just drives the wedge a little farther between your arguments and the players you’re trying to convince.

The OP is total snark — not even subtle. I’m not sure what I’m more disappointed about… the lack of forum policy enforcement or the players that defend this post as some champion argument against economic ignorance.

At least the players that post the “precursors are too expensive” aren’t doing it to troll — they genuinely believe there’s a problem. This topic is just junk.

Not sure why you have so much hate for cheap Precursors. Look, it’s your choice if you decide to want a highly demanded item like Dusk. I’m not stopping you from wanting it. I’m merely letting people know that there are currently Precursors that you can get pretty darn cheap, and that this is proof that there’s no problem with the Precursor system as a whole.

The real problem is the idea that some players feel Entitled to getting an item they want. And the fallacy here is that they believe there’s a problem, because they can’t get said item.

Rialen.1524:

What do you guys think?

I think you’re making baseless claims due to the fact that you don’t understand how the Gem Exchange works.

Time for me to chime in.

Ahem. You are Entitled to have fun in this game. However, you aren’t Entitled to getting all the best drops because you want them.

I’d like to know the size of your monitor to pull that setting off.

Right now, Rage is selling for less than 70 Gold. That means the Precursor price dropped by ~22% since this thread was started.

phabby.8945:

John I have another question in relation to all this.

You say that RNG and magic find is working as intended, how do you that it is indeed working?

Sure if its working then by your own comments there are some people in the high cluster range , most people in the middle range and only a slight few in the low cluster range. From all the threads out on the lack of drop rates and the amount of players complaining about Hrs/precursor drops, it seams that there are a huge percentage of players in the low cluster then defined by how RNG and magic find should be working.

Now I for one never like to assume anything and forgive me for having no clue on programming or anything techie stuff, I am sure some ppl here will jump in, but if the answer to the question is based on figures from data stuff and not relying on actual game play input could the entire RNG/ magic find base line of programming be corrupt giving incorrect data as a result and be the problem of why everyone is having issues with RNG/ magic find.

cheers Phabby

Note – The players in the low drop cluster have a higher likelihood of posting complaints on the forums due to the negative aspect of being on the wrong side of luck.

I’m at 185% MF, and drop rates are fine. In the attached picture, all the Ecto you see were salvaged from Rare and Exotics (btw – Ecto salvage rates are fine too). I’ve gotten multiple Precursor drops from monsters and from Zommoros.

The solution is to stop getting hacked. If they have access to your e-mail and password, even after you recover and change them, then somethings one on your end.

"E"von Gnashblade says hello.

Ohoni.6057:

Then why is there a cabal of fatcats so intent on quashing any discussion of making Precursors significantly cheaper?

It’s not the fatcats, but rather the people who understand how the economy works who are against your idea.

You want Precursors cheaper so you can afford them easier. Well good news mate! You can buy Venom on the Trading Post for pretty darn cheap compared to Dusk. I mean, that was the whole point of this thread to begin with.

The Model T came in only black. That saying doesn’t apply here. Anet controls the game, and their decisions influence players. Anet doesn’t say “Let’s start a collection achievement, and increase an Exotic item that only drops from one boss to 200+ Gold”. Nope. Anet says “Let’s start a collection achievement, and make certain items highly desirable”. The players come along and go “Hot dang, let’s make a profit off of this item since we know certain players will pay anything for them!”

THAT is how business works.

Most people in these forums understand how the economy works. We know that each decision has consequences. Oversupply an item, and you ruin it’s value. Pretty straight forward. Anet makes intended changes that shift the velocity, but only after considering all the outcomes. You think Elder Wood is worthless now…

Players in this game are a collective economic skritt hive. Equilibrium prices are achieved fairly quickly. A slight change in drop rates, unintended bugs that spawn constant mobs, and even Anet banning farm bots all affect prices. Precursor crafting, without proper gates, would shock the economy. That’s why John has the job he has. He’s the regulator that makes sure the current economy runs well. Whether you like it or not, it’s all working as intended.

Season 2 returns November 4th mate. Sorry to burst your bubble.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/the-return-of-living-world-season-2/

If you farm Dry Top for chests, you might notice that the amount of Dragonites in chest are double that of Emyreals. But alas, it’s RNG when praying for Empyreals to drop more often.

I remember a time when Sam was useless and worth 10 Gold…

Ohoni.6057:

The GW economy is player influenced, to some degree, but players have a fractional influence when compared to ANet’s, it is an ANet driven economy.

You have it backwards. The economy is Player driven and Anet influenced. Anet can create recipes and requirements for new and/or existing mats. The players are the ones who determine if they want it or not, and the players determine the price they’re willing to pay for them.

You keep making the same mistakes in every post. You want Legendaries to be easier to get, mainly because you desire them. You want more Precursors out there. You want more T6 mat drops. That’s not the focus Anet had in mind for them. I don’t blame you for having tunnel vision on these things. Heck, I’m selfish too when wanting stuff that takes a long time to get. Personally, I would love to be able to get any Precursor I want, and any given point. But the smart business side of me understands that while I want everything as handouts, this is bad for the game.

These weapons are BiS with the best looks (outside of Gem Store skins), and were intended to require a LOT of effort to get. The effort to craft or buy them takes time. This turns into long term goals that some players consider end game. If you short cut the process, you short cut long term goals. And that leads to less to do in game. Imagine starting a new character, and killing Zhaitan one hour later. That’s pretty much what you and some others are asking for. You want that instant gratification without considering the consequences of your demands.

With all the World Events and Dry Top chest farming, I’ve discovered that there seems to be a bit too much Dragonites in the game. At this point, my Dragonites outpace my Bloodstone drops. So that begs the question: Should Anet come up with more ways to utilize excess Ascended mats like Dragonites? I would love to be able to trade 3 Dragonite ores for 1 Emryreal fragment. Throw in some coin and Karma costs, and you have another effective sink in the game.

Anyone else have the same problems as I?

Sure Anet has god-like powers over the economy. Look at what they did to some high end items such as the Mini Monkey King and Endless Monkey King tonics. Something that was 1500+ Gold due to drop rates got flipped completely upside down. I’m not taking a slight drop rate increase. I’m talking something ultra rare going to drops for players once every few rare boss kill.

Players determined the prices to be high, and then players determined the prices to be low. Over supply of an item killed the demand. This is what’ll happen if the Entitled players get their way, and have everything they ever desired to drop frequently. More Dusk -> more Twilight -> less awe factor -> lower demand -> player demand for better greatsword Legendaries -> player rage when they don’t get their way. It’s an endless cycle.

Ohoni.6057:

1. People had hoarded tons and tons of silk.
2. When they added ascended crafting, they increased the cost for bolts to 3 bolts, and made it so you needed 100 bolts for a damask, to take out all that silk.

If that was their intent then they have no idea what they’re doing. You don’t put in long term sinks to cover supply hoarding, you put in short term sinks, like introduce one really slick recipe that 90% of players will be using within the first month, and then the other 10% will trickle in later but the mass demand will be gone by then (like Spinal Blade packs or Mawdrey).

Ahem

John Smith.4610:

We design in some volatility and some stability (silk wasn’t an accident ). We use our past experience, mixed with data to make predictions of what will happen given our choices. We then select outcomes that match whatever goals we have and use the data/experience to match those outcomes. We’ve gotten surprisingly good at this, but if we do make a mistake, the robustness of the player market helps smooth any bumps. For example, at one point a long time ago, we had an ecto exploit with snowflakes. This exploit produced a decent amount of ectos and put them into the market, but the market absorbed that and return to normal in a very short period of time.

Precursors are Precursors. They’re all designed with the same drop rates within the RNG system. Anet controls that part. Player demand is not something Anet controls. In Marketing, there are ways to influence customers, but you can’t outright control what they demand, or how much they’re willing to spend.

Thanks to this open market system, players decide on prices of goods. Legendaries would all cost the same to produce if every single component was Account Bound. If this were a single player console game, then the story would be different. However, since we can buy and sell materials on the TP, demand will always increase prices on the stuff everyone wants. Is this fair? Sure it is. If you want something really bad, you need to be willing to pay the price for it, or wait until someone else offers a cheaper rate. But things get complicated when you have a system with pending Buy Orders that then set price floors. To get to cheaper, you now have to wait until 1) a person comes along to sell it cheaper and 2) each Buy Order is filled in sequence.

Your options then turn into the following:

1) Pay full asking price, and save the hassles of waiting for a cheaper price
2) Have patience and wait until you get the item for your lower offer
3) Pick a different Legendary that has a cheaper Precursor

Merchant prices for goods like Salvage kits are the same since the game went live. So are prices for how much Gems costs. $50 still buys me 4,000 Gems. The Gem Exchange rate for Gold → Gems is due to player demand, so if you don’t like the high exchange costs, consider using your credit card instead.

Ohoni.6057:

Nobody is asking for ANet to cater to Dusk users over Rodgort users, all that anyone is asking for is that they make it no harder to get a Dusk together than a Rodgort. Nobody is suggesting in any way making the price of low cost Legendaries any higher than they are, just methods from bringing the top end down.

Sorry I didn’t post for so long. Work got me busy. Anyways, back to the topic.

Rodgort’s and Dusk both have the same drop rates. It’s no harder to get either one of the other. In order to make certain players happy, the only way to do this is to cater to their demands, and make the desirable Precursors easier to get. You can’t do this for obvious reasons.

Precursor rarity in the economy is intentional. Take away the Precursor requirement, and all Legendaries have very similar costs. Some might require more T6 or Lodestones than others, but in general, many of the ingredients are identical. So what’s left is the demand for the Precursor to the particular Legendary people want. Once the demand switches, prices should start slowly falling. If you’re willing to wait for new Legendary weapons to come out before you get a Dusk, you may be able to save a little Gold at that time.

Linen can still be farmed with Karma. Farm Linen, sell Linen, then use profits to buy Silk.

It’s a shame Anet can’t require “reading” as a minimum requirement for the game. There have been a lot of complaints come up that turn out to be user error.

Noah.4756:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

John Smith has commented in ways that suggest it is no accident that Damask is pricier.

I could say the opposite and it would not make it less truthful. John Smith can say a lot of things but if he doesn’t come with a solid argumentation to back that statement I’m gonna go ahead and say that the current Bolt of Damask prices aren’t where they should be.

John doesn’t need to justify Anet’s reasons to you or to any of us. If you want to advocate for change, it’s your job to come up with a valid argument that Damask prices are too high. And saying “because I want them cheaper” is not a valid argument.

As it stands, there’s no problem with prices. It’s driven by player demand, much like Precursors.

HHR LostProphet.4801:

The problem is not that the gem shop gets consistent updates. The problem is that the gem shop gets all the fun stuff.

We get the Living Story, which is even if the story is great only a one-time experience.
We get new maps which suffer from the same problems as the old maps.
We get some new skins, which are heavily grind- or RNG-gated.

The gem store gets skins, skins, skins, useful tools and skins. And everybody just wants these things. No wonder that people get upset with the gem store releases.

If you want these things, feel free to purchase them. The reason why convenience items are microtransactions is to supplement NCSoft/Anet’s income as a business. If you don’t want to pay Gems for these items, you don’t need to. Simply play the game for no monthly subscription fees, as it was intended, as you can still have fun.

Michael Henninger.7451:

I’m going to chime in to say just this:

Don’t use macros.

Thanks Mike. 3 simple words to end an entire debate. Tis the power of a Dev!

Absconditus.6804:

Collections for Black Lion weapons. Yeah, because it’s reasonable to collect 16 skins that you need to gamble on to obtain reasonably, from Black Lion Chests. Again, they want you into the Gem Store. Not all collections added are all bad, but some of these are absolutely making me loathe whoever it is that’s behind them. It’s screaming greed, and it’s making the game look so cheap and tacky, like a full-fledged Free-to-Play title. Only difference is I paid up front for this one.

OR… you can buy them from the TP with Gold. No RNG necessary.

Gizmo.9178:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

All current players should have a lot of lv 20 scrolls in the bank, making any new alt toon easy to level. You’d be at skill slot 7 as soon as you have access to a bank.

That is is quite an assumption…

Each birthday gift has one of these in it. If you had just 1 character from the start of GW2, that means you’ll have two level 20 scrolls already. If you have alts as storage from the beginning, these alts will have the birthday gifts as well.

Now if you keep deleting characters, you’ll never get birthday gifts. So it’s better to just buy character slots, than to delete any toon.

Did you check your Collections tab in the bank? This sounds like user error, rather than a bug or hack.

@OP

You should contact your opponent’s War Council, and ask them to only play during times your server is available. That might be the only way to compromise with your situation.

I’m glad I kept all my Fossils, rather than trade them for bags. Now I’ll be going for the full collection set, just because it’s there. Thanks OCD!

It’s a known issue mate. They’re working on a fix.

All current players should have a lot of lv 20 scrolls in the bank, making any new alt toon easy to level. You’d be at skill slot 7 as soon as you have access to a bank.

Droprate increase, or speculator unloading?

I just received word that CD will be making a late push on YB. This should get their server into T2 by Friday. We’ll see how this goes, as Xushin’s been training his guild in EBG, thus pushing Maguuma’s points up a tiny bit. Maguuma Silver will all depend on how strong CD shows up these next few days.

With an instant level scroll, all new characters start at level 20. There should be no issues because of this.

Has anyone tested the new Superior Trapper rune set yet? With the 3 second Stealth on traps, + SR, + Blinding Power, + Black Power / Heartseeker combo, + Cloak and Dagger, + Hidden Thief trait, + Meld in Shadows trait bonus (+1 extra second Stealth to everything), + Master of Deception trait bonus (20% faster recharge on SR and Blinding Power. Do you guys feel Stealth is more OP now that the rune set let Traps grant an additional Utility skill for Stealth?

It upsets me that I had stuff like 2 Sams and other required rare drops on the lists, and I sold them all a while back. It’s like I lost a good 1k Gold in potential profit.

As for insider information being leaked, it was a bad idea to share which rare items were needed to a select few people. But John did say that they have ways to deal with the people who took advantage of the information.

Indeed! This is a game, not real life. Basic math shouldn’t apply in a fantasy setting. So next time Evon’s name in on the ballot, be sure to vote for him!

Evon is best charr!

Each player has his or her own view on what makes a Legendary epic. Just because a lot of players like Twilight’s animations, thus leading to a higher demand of Dusks, doesn’t mean Anet should cater to them over Rodgort’s wielders.

Right now, prices are still nice for these low-demand Precursors. I would suggest to everyone looking to make a Legendary to consider these as options. If people want to focus on Dusks or Sparks or whatever, feel free to aim high and shoot for the moon. If I come across more, I’ll gladly sell them to the highest buyers.

I agree. I think it’s a mistake for Anet to assume that people know how to add and subtract properly.

Labjax.2465:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I’m certain you’ll be in for a shock once Precursor crafting comes out. If Anet does what I’m sure they’ll do, prices will remain as they are. If, by chance, Anet fails, and makes it too easy to craft, you’ll see a crash in the Precursor market. That’ll send shockwaves throughout the economy.

No, I’m certain I won’t be in for any shock. The whole point of asking for a system to obtain one somewhat consistently is that the cost will be relatively consistent as well and the path will be clear.

At that point, it doesn’t matter if the TP prices remain the same because there will be a reliable alternative.

For some players, that “reliable alternative” won’t be an option. Just look at all the complaints for Mawdrey. The requirements were mild compared to what I anticipate Precursor crafting to be like. The TP may be come a blessing for some at that point.

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Behellagh.1468:

I know it’ll be answered when we get it next week but do we still have the same ability as we do now on the sell screen to choose match low sale price rather than high bid price. The “Sell Instantly” button concerns me because I assume this matches the high bid price and the screen shot doesn’t have any items being sold so I don’t see the mechanism for quick switching other than typing it in.

The reason it bothers me because encouraging to sell to highest bidder leaves money on the table that a player could earn. One of the major complaints that players voice is the lack of money in game yet the way the TP defaults, players may unknowingly be throwing money that they could earn away. And if you are making it more difficult to match the low seller price, this gap could widen even further. That’s good news for player merchants (aka flippers) but I don’t like the notion that less savvy players may be stuck with an Idiot Tax or Not Paying Attention Tax.

Sell on new tp defaults to matching lowest seller so we’re actually reducing this risk and encouraging a more true supply competition.

Instant vs Order is entirely price controlled and the warning message / submit button text changes intelligently depending which listing you match or where your proposed price falls inbetween existing listings.

So what you’re saying is that it now takes more effort to sell to the highest Buy Order?