Guild Wars 2

Shimond.2478:

The engineer as designed is pretty much a short/mid range class in general. It’s not terribly surprising rifle has the same limitations the other weapons do.

Rangers are the long ranged/sniper class in this game.

This is a flawed mentality.

It is as if all of the sudden the greatsword, knife, sword torch, axes, traps, and pets designed for close range combat do not exist.

The whole “rangers get the range” argument falls to the wayside the second you look at the plethora of options the have for close quarters combat

Besides,we already have reasonable similar range on grenades. All most people are suggesting, is that if our only weapon choices are firearms, it strikes them as backwards, in general that the bows out range the guns. Fantasy game or not, the whole bows out range rifles, is hard for the average person to swallow.

That almost seemed like a decent idea, until it became clear you assume everyone uses rifles. I son’t see it looking right with P/S for example.

Actually I was going to do a quick change and play with a similar build that you speak of. I dot distracted and forgot to go back to the BLTC and find the gear to do so.

Yeah I would like a less bulky appearing kit.

I feel like I Egon Spengler with a proton pack on my back every time I use the elixir gun.

And if you do not get the reference, Just ask your parents.

Kimbald.2697:

coglin.1496:

Just checked in game. The combat log calls this ability from the med kit “Impact trigger”

the wiki page for this got actually adjusted: it’s called impact trigger there too now, no longer detonate.

This skill makes no sense at all as a trigger for a med kit, it’s just illogical.

Yes, I know. I updated the wiki as soon as I tested it.

That is one of the reason the wiki’s and Wikipedia is riddled with inaccuracies. Anyone can go in and put in whatever they want. I am sure who ver put the previous information meant to help, but had no concept of actually pulling information out of the combat log.

Magic Night.1308:

coglin.1496:

Unless your using CQB as something other then the standard close quarters battle, they are one in the same.

Do you even know what is close quarter battle? It’s a type of tactical manuvere use by SWATs in raids, consider as close/mid range strategy.

Yes I do know, thanks for asking.
Here is a excerpt from the first line of the “wiki” on it, since you hold the wiki as the all mighty power.

“engage the enemy with personal weapons at very short range, potentially to the point of hand-to-hand combat or fighting with hand weapons such as swords or knives”

In the context of this game and your reference to rangers, it seems that my previous post of close quarters ranger weapons is pretty applicable.

Greatsword
Axes
Sword
Dagger
Torch

So I am unclear as to what your misunderstanding.

It all boils down to either a ranged attack or a melee attack as far as the general game terminology is concerned. Every class has both, even if some are to more limited extent then others. From the list of obvious close quarters as listed above

to the :
Long Bow
Short Bow
Axes

That rangers have a strong sense of both, they are quit diverse, especially with pets that specialize per situation a well.

We have the same maximum range on select attacks as rangers do. A few here are suggesting a similar effect on a rifle or equivalent, without having to use a kit. Which I feel is reasonable for a “wishlist” titled thread.

Unless your using CQB as something other then the standard close quarters battle, it is one in the same with melee range.

Magic Night.1308:

This is where I think it makes engineers OP, they have range that is superior to rangers but have powerful CQB ablities at the same time.

Are you suggesting rangers do not have strong close quarters combat ability?

Greatsword
Axes
Sword
Dagger
Torch

Not to mention the devourers and spiders with a plethora of ranged attacks and control.

I believe, give or take a few small details, this is the general consensus of the entire engineer community, and has been discussed here since BWE1.

CriSPeH.8512:

Actually, the first sniper rifles were used by the aliens that came to earth and evolved a primate into the first human. And that was like 50,000 years ago so…….you guys are both wrong.

But I think they pronounced it Sneeper Rifles!

How many times do I have to tell you, they were not aliens, they were slightly less evolved Asurans.

Geez, they teach this in the basic day 1 coarse at the Asuran Church of the Cube.

Magic Night.1308:

If you guys really want superb range damage why not play a ranger instead?

Well ummm, because it is a “wish list” and sometimes an engineer wish’s they could hit a ranger with his rifle as soon as the ranger is close enough to hit them with his long bow.

A lot of that idea-ology comes from the fact that it seems backwards to the average mind that a bow is easily out ranging a gun. Fantasy game or other wise. Right, wrong, or indifferent, that is just how it strikes the average person, and with good reason.

Thats nice. Yur using Wikipedia, a compilation of general populations posted assumption of facts.

I am using an encyclopedia, a compilation a proven, actual, and historical facts.

Magic Night.1308:

coglin.1496:

Magic Night.1308:

coglin.1496:

Magic Night.1308:

CriSPeH.8512:

Magic Night.1308:

CriSPeH.8512:

Magic Night.1308:

Vigilence.4902:

A direct high powered damage long range kit, or in other words a sniper rifle kit.

Giving engineers sniper like range attack kit would over power our class, considering rangers should be the master of long range dmg.

I thought we were the jack of all trades type class!?
I also thought tht no single profession would really be the Master of something!?
That sounds more like a class thing.

As you’ve said it already, if we’re a jack of all trades, while no profession are a master of something then engineers would be OP.

Im sure he doesnt mean a sniper kit that trumps a rangers bow. Being OP is a balance issue and everything can be balanced.

Its also a wishlist.

You guys can put it on the wishlist but I don’t find it really RP, snipers are a modern profession when it comes to gunmans. The only superb range damage class in history were long bow archers that can shoot some where close to 500meters, just like why guardians (knights) don’t use bows in the game, in history knights have to get off their horses and take off their armors to use bows. I guess this is up to the devs to decide.

Firearms snipers have existed since the invention of firearms.

Secondly, your full of it, if your trying to tell folks they are wrong by basing historical fact to justify a fantasy games rules.

Where did you heard this from snipers have existed since the invention of firearms? Do you even know who invented the gun?

And I’m not fool of it, seriously calm down about this, like I’ve said you guys can put it on the wishlist but it’s up to the devs to decide.

Umm, I deduced it with basic logic. The second a ranged weapon was invented to do harm from the safety of a distance, the next immediate step is to extend that range as much as possible. But hey what do I know, the last sniper training I has was in the early 90’s.

As far as your question if I know who invented the gun, well no I do not, because no one knows, but I am quit certain you didn’t know that when you typed it either. Although most historians believe it was invented by the Chinese about 1400-1600 years ago.

Any other matters I can help to educate you on?

Seriously calm down man, you didn’t deduce anything with basic logic, nor you’re making any sense about what you’ve just said. BTW I have a own sniper rifle and I know they never existed his old historal times until the American civil war, doubt you even know how to use one.

Of course I know who invented the gun, you said snipers existed since the invention of fire arms, that’s why I ask you that question to prove you don’t know anything about history. It’s ironic I’m the one that is educating you.

Right……..I love the “yeah I knew, I was just testing you” line.

Secondly, Perhaps you may want of learn a little on the facts before you falsely claim someone is wrong.

Accurized firearms, with elongated barrels, and “peep sights” Are believed to have existed a immediately after the “firearm” left China. So yes, quit literally, historians do say that sniper rifles exist as soon as the “Chinese fire stick” left China.

Last I checked, the general consensus is that 600 AD is not what most folks refer to as “Modern” times.

Do you even know what it takes to constitute a rifle as being a “sniper” rifle?
The answer is nothing, nada, zilch. There is no classification of what makes a rifle a sniper rifle. It is not a definitive term.

Your full of smoke if your claiming they never existed before the civil war.

Magic Night.1308:

coglin.1496:

Magic Night.1308:

CriSPeH.8512:

Magic Night.1308:

CriSPeH.8512:

Magic Night.1308:

Vigilence.4902:

A direct high powered damage long range kit, or in other words a sniper rifle kit.

Giving engineers sniper like range attack kit would over power our class, considering rangers should be the master of long range dmg.

I thought we were the jack of all trades type class!?
I also thought tht no single profession would really be the Master of something!?
That sounds more like a class thing.

As you’ve said it already, if we’re a jack of all trades, while no profession are a master of something then engineers would be OP.

Im sure he doesnt mean a sniper kit that trumps a rangers bow. Being OP is a balance issue and everything can be balanced.

Its also a wishlist.

You guys can put it on the wishlist but I don’t find it really RP, snipers are a modern profession when it comes to gunmans. The only superb range damage class in history were long bow archers that can shoot some where close to 500meters, just like why guardians (knights) don’t use bows in the game, in history knights have to get off their horses and take off their armors to use bows. I guess this is up to the devs to decide.

Firearms snipers have existed since the invention of firearms.

Secondly, your full of it, if your trying to tell folks they are wrong by basing historical fact to justify a fantasy games rules.

Where did you heard this from snipers have existed since the invention of firearms? Do you even know who invented the gun?

And I’m not fool of it, seriously calm down about this, like I’ve said you guys can put it on the wishlist but it’s up to the devs to decide.

Umm, I deduced it with basic logic. The second a ranged weapon was invented to do harm from the safety of a distance, the next immediate step is to extend that range as much as possible. But hey what do I know, the last sniper training I has was in the early 90’s.

As far as your question if I know who invented the gun, well no I do not, because no one knows, but I am quit certain you didn’t know that when you typed it either. Although most historians believe it was invented by the Chinese about 1400-1600 years ago.

Any other matters I can help to educate you on?

Magic Night.1308:

CriSPeH.8512:

Magic Night.1308:

CriSPeH.8512:

Magic Night.1308:

Vigilence.4902:

A direct high powered damage long range kit, or in other words a sniper rifle kit.

Giving engineers sniper like range attack kit would over power our class, considering rangers should be the master of long range dmg.

I thought we were the jack of all trades type class!?
I also thought tht no single profession would really be the Master of something!?
That sounds more like a class thing.

As you’ve said it already, if we’re a jack of all trades, while no profession are a master of something then engineers would be OP.

Im sure he doesnt mean a sniper kit that trumps a rangers bow. Being OP is a balance issue and everything can be balanced.

Its also a wishlist.

You guys can put it on the wishlist but I don’t find it really RP, snipers are a modern profession when it comes to gunmans. The only superb range damage class in history were long bow archers that can shoot some where close to 500meters, just like why guardians (knights) don’t use bows in the game, in history knights have to get off their horses and take off their armors to use bows. I guess this is up to the devs to decide.

Firearms snipers have existed since the invention of firearms.

Secondly, your full of it, if your trying to tell folks they are wrong by basing historical fact to justify a fantasy games rules.

Just checked in game. The combat log calls this ability from the med kit “Impact trigger”

i go to gwcrtogropher.com and meticulously compare a zones POI on their map to the ones on mine until I find it.

This seems to be the best way to find the one I am missing.

/sarcasm
I won at blackjack one day with a 17!?!?

I lost the next hand with 20!?!?

Really?

I mean seriously…Why do random rewards have to be so….well……..random?

what on gods green earth ikittenazoid?

Magic Night.1308:

Vigilence.4902:

A direct high powered damage long range kit, or in other words a sniper rifle kit.

Giving engineers sniper like range attack kit would over power our class, considering rangers should be the master of long range dmg.

Where does it say this in the wiki? What post did the devs suggest this in?

Weird……I cannot find one fact to support this anywhere on the entire internet. I guess that would make it untrue then…..

I wear prec/cond dmg/toughness armor and pow/vit/cond damage jewelry with prec/pow/cond dmg jewels in the jewelry.

That way I stay at 45ish% crit chance, 1500 condition damage and spread a split on toughness and vitality as a 3rd stat blend.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the shield. It is what I use, because for my play style, I personally love the utility of it.

At my condition damage that is at least 1600 burning damage, AoE, at closer range, every 15 seconds. At least in zones in which I am 80.

Not sure how you see that as weak, but to each there own.

Do you want your survivability in the form of toughness or vitality?

The answer to your question is yes, it does stack.

Eh, I guess I can see that.

CriSPeH.8512:

“I do not see how the wiki is confusing at all. Anywhere in the wiki the words “unarmed kit” are a link to specifically what it is and what kits are specifically “unarmed kits”.”

Well he was obviously a little confused and I’m guessing its because they are called Device kits and Weapon kits on the respected pages.

I appreciate what your saying, but if anyone clicks the link that is in the link he posted, it answers the question in detail with illustrations as well

I do not see how the wiki is confusing at all. Anywhere in the wiki the words “unarmed kit” are a link to specifically what it is and what kits are specifically “unarmed kits”.

That is a very general question. Do you want purely offensive build? a lot of toughness? A lot of Hp?

Help us help you. Give us some direction to guide you in.

Click your own link. In the description “unarmed kit” is in blue because it is a link to exactly what unarmed kits are and gives all the information on it.

I was testing this very thing last night, unless my timing was off, I could not get it to do a blast finisher.

So, I would say no, it does not.

Anything at 1200+ range can easily be avoided, even without using a dodge. rifle, elixir gun and grenades can all have a range of 1200 and more for grenades.

EvilZombie.6801:

What if all kits have passive buff ?

for example:

elixir gun at level 80 gives 50 healing and 50 condition damage
flamethrower 50 power 50 condition damage
bomb kit 50 vit 50 toughness
grenade kit 50 crit damage 50 Precision
med kit +20% resurrection speed +50 healing

Well you can get a trait Juggernaut that gives a passive buff for the flame thrower.
(You gain 200 toughness while wielding a flamethrower. In addition, gain might for 15 seconds every 3 seconds, as long as you remain in this weapon kit.)

Perhaps a trait similar to that for each one might be a interesting idea. Obviously they would have to vary to be more applicable stats that are customized specifically for each trait.

If they fix it, as I understand they plan to, so that weapons stats effect kits, we will have the equivalent of this.

If your referring to super elixir on elixir gun, it only removes 1 condition from everyone. It creates a light field that can remove more with projectile finishers.

That is correct about the mines. Ever since they took the over powered 5x stacking blast finisher off the tool belt skill, everyone seems to believe the mines altogether lost their blast finisher. There have been multiple threads and discussions on it anyway.

Still the BoB needs its blast finisher returned or fixed, what ever the case.

Good point, in that case I absolutely agree, it is broken.

How is this. Engineers do not have weapons swaps, so either adjust and stop complaining or play another class.

We have no need to rebuild the entire class to suit two complainers and hose the rest of us.

I am unclear how they can wear off before you can get to them, because our weapons range are the same as the distance the boots separate us. Am I missing something?

I use a condition damage very successfully, and I can assure you it is not broken. It may be relatively under powered, but it is not broken in the least.

What is broken is a great many abilities and traits, and issues with kits themselves costing a sacrifice of weapons stats.

I find it interesting that you claim it is both broken and “not viable” when so many folks use it so successfully. Bad choice of words perhaps ?

You should really stop trying to tell me what I am saying and just take what I say at face value.

As well, you should grow up and stop berating me because the OP made a difficult post to comprehend.

Also, feel free to send me some money to buy me a game and toss in some gems cash while your at it. Because until you pay for the game for me, you will not tell me how to play, and your certainly not going to tell me what my opinion is allowed to be and what conversations I can participate in.

I disagree with him and will post on it all I like, if that hurts your feelings, well tough crackers pal.

Let me simplify it for you. Some classes have options via weapons swap, some attunements, some because of utility kit options and unique ranged weapon with shield options.

Stop being such a forum Nazi. If you dislike what I had to say, put me on ignore or report it.

Oh I agree to an extent. Due to the fact that pistol main hand has a horrible damage coefficient and is very condition damage focused.

MH pistol is the absolute only option we have with pistol. I do feel shield #4 should be 25s CD as base and #5 should be 30s as base. As of now the #5 skill does not get the 20% reduced CD at all if you throw the shield. As well, we have to spend 20 points to invest in the reinforced shield trait.

I can assure you that rocket boots works. I have done various blast finishers with it all day today.

BoB stopped working as a blast finisher in the lat BWE I think. I have not found an official post on it, so I am unclear if it is bugged as an ability, or if they actually removed it and never adjusted the tool tip. I sincerely hope it is just bugged, because BoB made for a good blast finisher.

Hey, go with what works for you bud. Right now the green gear is chip and you can easily buy various build sets to see what build works for your play style.

As far as your comment
“my playstyle is to simply kill multiple targets with aoe”

Well I could offer the suggestion of going to the mist, there is a crowd of dummies that you can test various builds and see what kills the largest group of them the fastest.

Contrary to your thread title though, I would not call them weak. With grenades, you indeed have a very solid way to do AoE damage

It does tic more and longer. You have to have the right amount of condition duration based upon the duration of the particular ability.

For example, if you have an ability that that cast a 2 second burn you need +50% burn duration to add one more tic. If you have an ability that gives 4s burn, you only need to hit +25% burn duration for an extra tic and the same 50% duration addition would add 2 tics.

In other words the durations addition is directly related to the base duration on the ability itself.

It all scales, and it scales with all of your gear except weapons. So to more directly answer your question, everything in the arsenal scales.

CriSPeH.8512:

And why would you just read the first line of a thread then feel like you have a right to comment?

Why? Because the Op is making a claim based on pure assumption, and attempting to state it as a fact.

My point is that he is saying we do not have a weapons swap in spite of kits. I am suggesting the opposite. As well, I believe the fact that we can use a ranged pistol and a shield in combination together could possibly play a part in that decision as well.

Not to mention, if you try to read past that, it is worded confusingly and some what difficult to comprehend in detail.

I run a condition build and I do not feel weak at all. Let me explain a little about how it works for me.

I love the P/S myself.

One thing that I had to learn about the shield is to learn the enemies tell to their ranged attacks. Once I did that, I could mitigate the ranged damage completely at times while reflecting it fully back to them, generally with 3/4 of them criting. Nothing is more satisfying then seeing a rifle or bow enemy do a multi-burst attack that reflects back at then for heavy damage.

I found precision helps alot with procs on things that add to cond. damage. I focus on prec/cond dmg/toughness armor and power/vitality/cond dmg jewelry with pow/prec/cond dmg gems in the jewelry. Basically I focus on cond dmg for the pistol and earth sigil. I put 30 into fire arms for the coated bullets and precisions, as well as the 20% decrease on pistol coold downs and 20 in inventions for the added toughness and 20% decrease in shield cool down and the 90 toughness in that same shield trait.

I put 20 more into tools for speedy kits for unlimited swiftness and kit refinement. I use bomb kit, elixir gun and rocket boots. Rocket boots give me two ways to do damage and burning as well as a stun breaker. I use elixir gun for debuffs and two condition removal options and 3 regens avaliable. I use bombs for BoB for damage and control. I often swap to bombs and use #3 then #2 for thr 5 stacks of confusions (got to love watching enemies hurt themselves) and AoE burn. Often I swap just for the fire bomb or smoke bomb for the fire field or smoke field for invisibility or blind.

This gives me invisibility, multiple burns, weakness with elixir gun, 3 AoE regens, a stun breaker, condition removal, the ability to mitigate damage, an escape option, stuns, fire fields, constant swiftness, poisons, and many different ways to play it.

I use this build in PvE, sPvP, and WvW. If I need to help rez in WvW or dungeons, I swap elixit R for rocket boots so I have a stun breaker and an AoE rez assist. I often use elixir gun in those cases as well to keep 100% weakness on enemies. Bosses in particular, as it causes glancing blow consistently, allowing me to limited the enemies damage out put.

As far as the kit refinement question in relation to the med kit, god only knows why it is what it is, I wil never understand that one myself. ……It needs to be a small AoE heal, or a single AoE condition removal, or something relevant to what the med kit does.

Always prepared – I do not have a truly beneficial use for it myself. Perhaps someone else does. Unless there is a group out there some where who has found a good benefit from this, it probably could use a looking into.

Kimbald.2697:

1. First of: if I gain swiftness from the Trait Speedy Kits, I only move faster when I run forward.
Never when I strafe, or god forbid that I would, backpaddle.
Is this a bug, or is this simply how swiftness works? The Wiki doesn’t help me on this one.

No bug.
Think about it. If you can move backwards as fast as your enemy moves forwards, then I could simply backpedal and take on 29 mobs at once with the rifle or coated bullets on the pistol.

Can’t you pick it up on one character and mail it to the other one? or does a character need to be logged on to send mail to it?

Yup, I like tool kit. I love pistol #3, swap to bomb kit for bomb #3 then swap to tool kit for #3. You can literally keep a minimum of 2 and up to 5 stacks of AoE confusion up at all times. Nothing is better then watching enemies do 1000+ damage every time they you.

I love the AoE bleed/cripple that cam be kept up 100% of the time with kit refinement. And a quick swap for a 3rd block after I burn the 2 on my shield. And anyone worth their salt will easily learn every enemies ranged attacks and be able to block them all or dodge. With 3 blocks and a minimum of 2 dodged at your finger tips, you can mitigate a ton of damage.

Splarv.6180:

The second weapon slot of engineer was removed to enforce use weapon kits.

I got this far then had to stop. You have proof of this? Your making assumptions, then basing an entire concept on said assumptions.

We are the only class that has a ranged weapon that can be used in combination with a shield.

I see no logic in assuming they are trying to force anyone to use kits. As I see it, they simply thought it more balanced to not allow weapon swapping after seeing how many option we had if or when we used kits.