Guild Wars 2

Sprawl.3891:

felivear.1536:

Sprawl.3891:

felivear.1536:

Payneful.7934:

I use a simple 3 button mouse that cost me 15 bucks at wal-mart lol. I haven’t found a need for anything with more buttons.

If you ever try the naga or any mouse similar with 10+ buttons, you will never be able to figure out how you gamed without it. I have done competitive PvP in other games for a long time without the Naga. After I got used to it (which took about a week or 2) I noticed a difference. The time different between hitting in a sequence like 1, 9 is a huge different because the travel distance is less than an inch for your thumb as opposed doing it with your fingers.

Definitely nothing wrong with normal mouse, I did it forever. But a multi-button mouse is such a quality of life improvement that you didn’t even know you needed.

just stop man. i have a naga, they are great, but for GW2 it’s straight up overkill with how few abilities you have in this game.

why would you be doing 1,9 in GW2. theres plenty of places to remap your utilities to your keyboard, you dont even need shift or ctrl modifiers in this game, no need with so few abilities. now rift or wow or other utility heavy games it’s really nice to have. But if you are buying specifically for GW2 i would just buy a more basic 2-3 side button mouse.

lol, are you actually getting upset with my mouse recommendation? Ok, you’re right, I’m wrong. Is that how opinions work?

Either way OP, try what you like. I love mouses with multiple (10+) buttons, but to each their own.

for GW2 it’s straight overkill is what I’m saying, there is zero need for all those mouse buttons in this game unless you are a horrible typer and dont know where keys are on the keyboard.

See my post above, I edited it before you replied to show you how useful it is. I 100% of the time have full 360 degree range of motion no matter what I am doing. If I am casting skills 1-5 i dont have to take any finger off of a direction key to do it. For melee, although it may seem small, it is a small advantage because of rotating to be behind the character at all times. At some point, to cast 1 of your abilities, you have to take a finger off of a directional key. Super duper small amount of time and not a huge deal, but a disadvantage none-the-less.

Btw, this is an odd debate occurring in a peripheral recommendation thread lol.

Sprawl.3891:

felivear.1536:

Payneful.7934:

I use a simple 3 button mouse that cost me 15 bucks at wal-mart lol. I haven’t found a need for anything with more buttons.

If you ever try the naga or any mouse similar with 10+ buttons, you will never be able to figure out how you gamed without it. I have done competitive PvP in other games for a long time without the Naga. After I got used to it (which took about a week or 2) I noticed a difference. The time different between hitting in a sequence like 1, 9 is a huge different because the travel distance is less than an inch for your thumb as opposed doing it with your fingers.

Definitely nothing wrong with normal mouse, I did it forever. But a multi-button mouse is such a quality of life improvement that you didn’t even know you needed.

just stop man. i have a naga, they are great, but for GW2 it’s straight up overkill with how few abilities you have in this game.

why would you be doing 1,9 in GW2. theres plenty of places to remap your utilities to your keyboard, you dont even need shift or ctrl modifiers in this game, no need with so few abilities. now rift or wow or other utility heavy games it’s really nice to have. But if you are buying specifically for GW2 i would just buy a more basic 2-3 side button mouse.

lol, are you actually getting upset with my mouse recommendation? Ok, you’re right, I’m wrong. Is that how opinions work?

Either way OP, try what you like. I love mouses with multiple (10+) buttons, but to each their own.

Edit: Btw, my left hand never has to be taken off of wasd because all of my abilities are mapped to the mouse on my right hand. My score screen, all 10 of my skills, my special ability (steal etc), my dodge roll and my weapon swap. It is extremely useful, even for this game.

Payneful.7934:

I use a simple 3 button mouse that cost me 15 bucks at wal-mart lol. I haven’t found a need for anything with more buttons.

If you ever try the naga or any mouse similar with 10+ buttons, you will never be able to figure out how you gamed without it. I have done competitive PvP in other games for a long time without the Naga. After I got used to it (which took about a week or 2) I noticed a difference. The time different between hitting in a sequence like 1, 9 is a huge different because the travel distance is less than an inch for your thumb as opposed doing it with your fingers.

Definitely nothing wrong with normal mouse, I did it forever. But a multi-button mouse is such a quality of life improvement that you didn’t even know you needed.

Ah, ya, I don’t think I’ve ever tried to sell the unidentified ones. I usually just sell them when I identify them and decide I don’t want them, that ’s probably why I never noticed.

There is a 2 things that I can no longer game without because of how easy they have made life: Razer Nostromo and Razer Naga.

MaXi.3642:

Zunhar.4079:

They’re not account bound. But they should be.

looked at it yesterday when i saw this here… and they really are account bound (only the ones from SPVP ofc)
——————————————————————————————————————————————————
still its a lot about money, as said, they cant give us EVERYTHING for free, we are playing buy2play game, we must count that some work will be needed if we dont want to pay more or just pay for gems, get gold and buy three dyes which you want from auction on every your character, problem solved… this is bussiness and you dont need colors to play the game, so its definitely fine and only cosmetic thing for money… or play PvE and get gold from it :P

I am totally confused about what you all are saying. I am rank 30, I’ve only played SPVP. I’ve recieved at least 30 dyes from chests. I’ve sold about half of them directly on the AH and the other half I consumed on the character. None of those dyes I consumed on character A are available on character B. What am I missing?

What I have found is that most often the gear that you want to keep from the chests because it looks good is the very gear you need to salvage to get slivers. May be a conundrum for most.

I think there should be a “skin locker” and once you unlock a skin, regardless of the means in which you obtained it, you should have that skin to use on any gear of like type, in any facet of the game. That is all.

Heck, ANET can even monetize it by added each slot in your skin locker as being unlocked by gems. Each slot is X amount of gems. You then decide, “man this gear looks so epic, I want to use it over and over throughout the game, I’ll drop X amount of money to ‘lock it in’”

In fact, I think it’s good enough of an idea that I’ll add it to OP.

Latorn.4209:

Braxxus.2904:

Latorn.4209:

Why does it work like that? Why are there two separate grinds within one game? Can’t my character be a single character?

TLDR: Because the gaming community and it’s desire for self segregation and 1-upmanship require it to be that way.

Long version:
It used to work this way.
Then MMO’s started to get away from open world PvP and make it a mini-game within the game. Meanwhile the people still forming raids, pushing new content and such would acquire top-end gear. Then they would go play the pvp mini-game, which some players took very seriously and have pretty hefty stat advantages. PvPers got mad and started screaming for gear advantages in the pvp minigame that would render the PvE gear obsolete, OR for equal gear to the PvE’ers.

Well for a while games had the 2nd option, and PvE’ers got mad as all hell that a few BiS items for their raiding happened to be from PvP, where they’d have to deal with the competitive elitism (vs the time-based elitism of raiding, which is very hypocritical yes but that’s another rant).

This further splintered communities into distinct districts, who then had to have completely seperate gear grinds to validate the time spent by either party in their respective parts of the game. Of course PvE’ers constantly get their gear upgraded with new content which eventually would push the statistical difference high enough to compete with PvP gear again and so PvP gear would have to increase as well. More grind.

ANet here has gone with a decent option which is to fully embrace the segregation by saying “Ok, neither part has any effect on the other part. EVER. Enjoy”…
But now the PvPers still aren’t happy (which is ironic since the PvE’ers are usually called out for being carebear and wanting things handed to them…) and want their cake and to eat it too if/when they choose to go into PvE (which translates into WvW mind you).

The other option would be to get rid of the whole PvP minigame design and go back to the original design of early MMO’s where there is only the “world”. All PvP, all PvE happens in the same world. No instanced PvP minigame. No segregation. One grind for all. However this would mean players would need to go back to actually playing the game in it’s entirety. It would also mean people would have to deal with open world PvP WHILE they PvE’d. Or go to a PvE only server where it wouldn’t matter.

But neither party would be happy with that as history has already gone that route and the self segregation would most likely happen all over again.

Short reply to a long post XD

I suppose you’re saying this because of the introduction of ascended gear? I mean previously a PvEr would have no advantage of going into PvP with their gear, even now the system of gear standardization still exists. In a system of purely horizontal progression, I’m wondering why skins can’t be used in PvP… I’m not talking about stats at all XD

Ya, that’s something that I guess he assumes I would have a problem with. Skins are cosmetic and have no bearing on anything except to show what you’ve accomplished. A PVER is no better off if he uses his skin in SPVP while I’m no better off when doing the opposite. It’s just odd to me that the gear is identical in looks, it just has a different name and means to obtain it. If I’ve spent a ridiculous amount of time getting the gear in SPVP, why should I have to spend a similar amount of time to re-obtain it through PvE?

I would love to join. I am rank 30 Ele, Necro, Guard, or Thief.

Felivear, Rotwielder, Augmentus, and Cognito respectively.

Baam.2493:

Braxxus.2904:

Players A and B actually play MORE of the game than player C, who simply plays a minigame.

And no, I’m not hating on people for playing SPvP/TPvP, I do so as well. I actually participate in all 3 “modes” of the game. It’s a bit like the silly arguments that pvpers make in every MMO about “PvE’ers coming into PvP with their shinies and having advantages! SO UNFAIR!” and then stupid stats are invented coughresiliancecough to throw them a compensation bone and a double gear grind starts for the people that actually play the WHOLE GAME and not just a part.

In the good ol’ days of say Asheron’s Call: Darktide server (only server as far as I’m concerned, full FFA PvP server) there was no seperate “PvP” and “PvE”. Neither gear nor areas. All open world PvP/PvE all the time period. So people that wanted to do both, did both and were rewarded for doing both.

Nowadays though everyone likes their segregation. It’s like reverse civil rights in the MMO universe where people actually plead with the powers that be to be treated as separate and different/discriminated against from each other.

“I’m a PvPer and I deserve to have X because of it!”
“I’m a PvEer and I deserve to have Y because of it!”

Well fine then good sirs, I’m both and deserve to have an advantage over the both of you.

I disagree with your post, and I’m actually a bit offended by it. PvP is for many of us NOT a mini-game. Some of us (such as PZ) will play it anywhere from 6-10 hours EVERY DAY just to be competitive. And the reason we play it to be so competitive is because a few of us feel we can make PvP OUR ACTUAL JOBS when e-sports come out.

If you laugh at that, go look at the top LoL players. Personally, I feel this game will eventually grow to the point where it can support its career-gamers just as much, if not more than LoL.

I think the frustration of a competitive PvPer when he enters the other 2 primary game modes is understandable. After all, his efforts are not rewarded in as broad a manner as those who do WvW or PvE. At the same time, said PvPer is used to being on god-tier, and being a level 1-10 nub after that is frustrating.

I think your last sentence probably sums it up. I play PvP as a solo player but I do it seriously. I spend time on dummies figuring out the smallest discrepancies in sigils, runes, traits. I bought all character slots and have one of each profession. I’ve played them all to attempt to learn their strengths and weaknesses. I do all of this while getting better and better. Once I step out into the actual game (since apparently this is just a mini-game to the other guy), I feel like a peasant. The greatest disconnect imaginable.

Just curious on this:

Player A goes into PvE. Player A plays for 3 months or 400 hours and gets to level 80 (possibly on multiple characters). Player A then acquires tons of cool gear, items and gold. Player A then decides he’ll take a break from PvE and start WvW. Player A now gets to take all of his items, gear, and money into WvW to help him along. He is at almost no statistical disadvantage to anyone who only played WvW the whole time.
Player A then decides to try SPvP. Player A is now a bit uglier than his peers but is on 100% equal footing.

Player B goes into WvW. Player B plays for 3 months or 400 hour and gets to level 80(possibly on multiple characters). Player B acquires tons of cool gear, items and gold. Player B then decides he’ll take a break from WvW and go into PvE. He is level 80 and has good enough gear to jump right in. He is at almost no disadvantage in PvE.
Player B then decides to try SPvP. Player B is now a bit uglier than his peers but is on 100% equal footing.

Player C goes into SPvP. Player C plays for 3 months or 400 hours. Player C acquires some cosmetic gear that he can’t take anywhere. Player C is broke. Player C decides to try WvW. Player C is at a huge disadvantage in gear, skills, traits. His peers may not understand their class as much as player C, but they have an inherent advantage.
Player C then says forget that, he now tries PvE. He is level 2. He must now play the game as if it were his first day launching it.
Player C gets the short end of the stick.

Player D just comes to the game. Talks to his friends: Player A, B, and C. He tries to decide the best way to play the game to experience it all. Player D immediately realizes whichever way he will start, it most assuredly would be insane to go the same route as Player C, because, well…that would be stupid.

This is a QQ thread for all of us Player Cs out there.

BlueprintLFE.2358:

Rieselle.5079:

I would like PvP to give me XP and maybe Karma to use in PvE.

It would be fun to level an alt via PvP.

This would be cool, I have some couple hundred hours logged into certain toons in the mists spvping with them day in and day out, now my guild wants to start a WVW branch that I would like to mess around in… Except all my toons are level 20 and kitten from just pvping… It just doesn’t seem right I know these classes inside and out and log tons of time into them but in WvW the other type of pvp I can’t even participate. …

That is exactly how I feel. I don’t PvE, I don’t expect PvE rewards from SPvP, but to deny me stuff I can use in WvW is crazy. I’ve spent 400+ hours and all of them in S/TPVP. I know my Elementalist, Necro, Guardian, and Thief extremely well. All of that time is a waste in my opinion. I gain nothing for WvW and even when I walk into Lions Arch I look like a total nooby scrub.

Like it or not, we are the kitten child of GW2.

So, I finally hit 30 and all of my characters ( all 8 ) are now in the gear I’ve wanted for a while. They all look great and I’ve spent 400+ hours getting this. So, the question I have is, why can’t I at least use this set in major cities? Why is 100% of the time I’ve spent in this game basically for nothing as soon as I leave the tiny little underpopulated instance called Heart of the Mist?

I don’t understand why I can’t at least display this gear in non-combat cities. I’ve worked very hard for this gear and have nothing to show for it.

Edit due to brainstorming: I think there should be a “skin locker” and once you unlock a skin, regardless of the means in which you obtained it, you should have that skin to use on any gear of like type, in any facet of the game. That is all.
Heck, ANET can even monetize it by adding each slot in your skin locker as being unlocked by gems. Each slot is X amount of gems. You then decide, “man this gear looks so epic, I want to use it over and over throughout the game, I’ll drop X amount of money to ‘lock it in’”

So, I have a conundrum. I just hit rank 30 and I have about 60k glory. I would normally think that I should buy 50 or so gold chests, but Jonathan Sharp made a comment during his stream on guru that makes me think I should hold on to it. He said they are looking at letting glory be used for outside of the Mist. Do you think that change is probably so far away that I would be silly to hold on to the glory or do you think I should be banking it?

hmmm…decisions decisions…

pot.6805:

Did the dev ever nerd rage?

haha no, although I did tell him one time after we beat his team that “I am now going to add ‘beat a DEV in GW2’ on my resume right under cat-like reflexes” he then told me to make sure that I add that 7 other people helped me lol

Just wanted to say that tonight Bluxgore (Evan Lesh) played with us for a little over an hour in hotjoins and it was really pretty cool. Fun to see the DEVS in the game and actually playing, killing, and dying with the rest of us.

Hope to do it again some time with him and others.

I have a friend that is a die-hard LoL player. I’m trying to convince him to come here and he is wanting a video of top level play. Do any of you have a link to some of the top teams in a quality match that will show the general “high level” scene?

ELO is not bare bones. This system is bare bones. ELO system would be enough to keep most people playing, not this current glory to get cosmetics. Currently, people complain about the lack of incentive because glory is your only reward. I believe we may be on the same page as much as I can tell that I don’t like you

zone.1073:

Revelstoke.8924:

If your motivations for PvPing are purely cosmetic, then that makes you…a material girl.

That’s right. You’re materialistic. Of course you will burn out and become a quitter. You don’t have any real motivations for PvPing other than beautifying yourself through rank and cosmetic gear.

I’m not going to say I am not materialistic, but as in anything in life I want my time to mean something. I work for hours, I make a paycheck. I go to the gym, I get stronger and more confident. I do yardwork, my lawn looks nice.

As others have said, grinding the same 5 maps for 40 DAYS for NOTHING is pointless. And it was ‘fun’ for a while. I have 3 80’s and have played many builds. After that, its just repetitive. At least in LoL I earned money I could spend on toons I didnt have or unlock abilities I needed.

This is like watching Seinfeld. We’ve all seen em a hundred times and it’s not doing anything for me anymore…

Let me ask you this. What ARE you grinding for? The cosmetics, correct?

Let me tell you what serious PVPers grind for. We grind for qualifying points from paid tournaments, so that our teams can qualify for upcoming monthly tournaments. We strive to win the monthly tournaments to send a message out to the PvP community that our team is the best in our region, and to get the opportunity to participate in the seasonal tournaments. This is our end game.

Do you see the difference here? People who are serious about PvP grind to improve themselves as a team. Think of it like bodybuilding and getting prepped for a competition. That’s what serious PvPers are all about. What you are complaining about, is working at Walmart for 3 years to save up enough money to buy those nice shoes you’ve been wanting. That is the difference between you and us.

And sadly for you, ArenaNet is catering PvP to us, and not people like you. ArenaNet wants to build a competitive PvP community, so all of their efforts are into doing just that.

You know why you are grinding? Because you want status. Some want to look cool, others want to act cool. I’m sure all the people complaining about lack of rewards are silly while you and the other 20 people constantly playing paids are “smashing face because we’re the best!”

Have fun playing your 4 paid tournaments tonight. Should be fun for you to wait 1 hour between queues. Wonder why they aren’t popping? Oh, that’s right, because people with your views are the tiny minuscule minority. But you must be right…because you are earning QP.

Edit: If the game took your stance and didn’t add any more incentives, rewards and fun game modes / maps, then soon you should be able to play all of your paids on a LAN because it shouldn’t be too hard to get the couple of people still playing the game into one room.

Guys, can we please not discuss balance anymore in this thread? Or can we at least not talk about L2P or OP stuff. This thread has been pretty good so far and those types of discussions will turn this into a cesspool.

“When it’s ready! When it’s ready! We release when it’s ready! When it’s ready….”

Then, it releases and it’s not ready.

“We need more time! We need more time! Not enough time! We need more time!”

Song is sung in the same tune, but with drastically different lyrics.

Pyrial.2917:

Brutalistik.6473:

Pyrial.2917:

Brutalistik.6473:

Can’t you guys just wait and see what happens within 2-3 months? You guys want everything so freaking fast ignoring the fact you know good and well haste makes waste.

We know Beta is just testing grounds and this game was release not too long ago and it haven’t been a year yet. Just calm down for a while instead getting all hype up saying this game already dead, pvp is not competitive etc etc. This isn’t kindergarten guys you know good and well this game is still fresh and it’ll improve later on by taking small steps instead of large steps. If they take large steps then everything will go extremely unbalance than it is now.

Unfortunately games are not given this luxury anymore. Being that we are discussing pvp, we need other players to play against (casually or competitively). The game is hemorrhaging players with (as I see it) no real plan on attracting them back.

Wait and see? That is what beta should have been for. Currently I’m 1 of 2 people still left from a pool of 33 that left WoW and Rift to come over. There is no way for me to help draw them back into this game.

That’s a spoiled brat mentality and you know that. You say it should of been done in beta? Beta is what got the game flowing in the first place because it would suck it the game kept crashing every minute you try to go somewhere. That’s why beta is testing ground just to get the game flowing to get as much bugs out as possible. When the game was release to play for all that’s where the challenge starts and see how far the game can go.

Also for the part where you say players won’t come back. They will come back because one this game has no subscription and they would like to see what have come of the game from when they played it last time. For instance they took a year off so you know a lot has change and they might get hook right back into the game in no time.

Spoiled brat? There’s a ton of facts to support my position. Look at the wasteland that is failed mmorpgs. Do you know why they failed? It wasn’t because of people like me, who stayed with the game. It was because the industry trend is such that people do NOT wait for games to fix themselves. There is an expectation for game performance and that benchmark is increased after every new MMO that comes out.

Players won’t come back, if your supposition was true then the industry wouldn’t be littered with failed mmo’s. Let’s take a look at Rift (being that is the most recent mmo I can compare the game to). The pvp was fun, but mismanaged. Gradually the pvp playerbase left. After the expansion came out, there isn’t many more that came back.
People trying to hang their hat on the subscription free model forget one thing. These people gave the game a shot and would rather stay in a game that they’re already comfortable with after having “tasted” what the new flavor is.

I’m sorry that you feel having an opposing opinion to yours is being bratty, but if I may make a suggestion it would be for you to look into the mirror.

Pyrial is absolutely right. Look, there is no way that people with foresight can enlighten those that live in the moment. Brutalistik, the only thing I can really say is I’ve seen your kind in all MMO forums of failed games. The ones that say wait 3 months and stop being brats. Then that 3 months passes and they say wait 3 months and stop being a brat. Then 3 months later, same thing. Then they start posting on the forums about merging servers because there is nobody to play with.

EoNxBoNx.9213:

1. I would like to see some kind of LFG system for Free tournaments, but for paids, honestly its best if they are organized, (if you want to win).

2. US and EU already can get into the same games sPvP and tPvP.

3. Number 3 yes desperately, there is another thread that was going about these similar issues.

4. I have no idea what you mean on this one. If you mean to make premades fight premades then yeah.

5. See #1

6. Seriously? They didn’t even mean to implement the team color change at that moment. They are not being lazy, they want to make sure everything is ready don’t how many times you want to hear that. Or just ignore it and call them lazy, or say something like they aren’t being transparent.

EDIT: Typo

#2. NA and EU are 2 different regions that are not in the same pool.

choban.9027:

Personal life first man! It’s not like you lost some money or something because of him being AFK. People are AFK all the time when i do PUG tourneys, nothing new there. I guess you’re not playing pug tourneys for a long time….

Getting all philosophical here, but what is money? Money is a payment for your time. Your time while doing X chore is worth Y dollars. So, as a little green man once told me “Time is money, friend”. So, although he’s not losing “money” per se, it equates to him losing the same thing. His loss is no less or greater than if he had not been paid for going to work for 1 hour.

Edit: I also suggest you removing the players name before a mod gets in here. This thread will be locked because it’s against the CoC. You can never publicly “shame” someone on the forums for any reason, because it’s character assassination.

Signet of Forums.4397:

xerxys.2635:

oh, now i get it, it was a mistake to nerf the rangers…..

One thing I have learned in MMOs is that when anything is nerfed, there will always be people who complain about it. I’ve even seen some people explicitly make the ludicrous claim that nothing should ever be nerfed. Now, anyway, class balance really has anything to do with this topic. I’m sure there are plenty of threads about it elsewhere.

I really don’t want to go off-topic here, but ya, I saw many people in the SWTOR forums stating “Bioware says they will never nerf classes for PvP reasons and that’s how it should be. Balance should never be tweaked, only learned to be dealt with.” First, I don’t know if Bioware ever actually vomited out that sentence, but players thinking that was a good idea really amuse me.

JonathanSharp.7094:

felivear.1536:

Just a quick question if you are still monitoring this thread. Do you agree that the scoring system in hot-joins is not conducive to team play and actually causes it to be the main reason you see so many theives and mesmers? Because they are very well suited for that type of play (i.e. Kill, quick hopping between points, cap and leave).

Also, are you completely set in stone on the no solo queue option? Many people including myself do not have the time or have an odd schedule to form teams and play at set times, we want to be able to queue in tournaments with people who also want the same thing. That would by far be the most popular type of SPVP played if that was added.

Edit: are there any plans to make hot-join keep parties of at least 2 people together? With Christmas rush I plan on seeing a few new friends joining and I would like to stay on the same team in hot-join.

• Scoring: As I said in the interview, we want to make changes to this system once other key features are finished!

• Solo queue: We want to try the system I spoke of, where individuals can join and be grouped together, and then get an aggregate rating. It’s a complicated formula, but once we’re closer to releasing it, we’ll do blog posts to explain how it will work. So we will be addressing the issue you raise.

• For hot joins, we’re going to see what happens after custom arenas go live. We think hot joins will change how people view casual games.

• To the whole newb/noob thing: I did NOT mean this to be derisive. I was simply using it as a term to describe players who are new at the game. I did not mean to deride, explicitly or implicitly, player skill. Sorry that it came off that way to some of you. I simply feel very passionately about making an E sport WHILE ALSO PROTECTING our new players with the fury of a 1,000 burning suns. If we don’t protect and teach our new players, then they can’t get into the game and learn. If we don’t bring in new players, there will be no interest in the higher levels of competitions. I think that in order to have a successful E-sport, you need players who want to watch high level players playing. You also need to bring in new blood into your game to keep the game growing (think of any sport in the world….you have high school -> college – > professional).

So I didn’t mean that to be demeaning at all, sorry if it came off that way. I tried to explain what I meant by newb/casual (new players, or those who just play casually), sorry I didn’t do a better job – I’ll work on that one.

J

Thanks for the reply. I for one don’t understand the fuss about the “noob” comment. Clearly in no way were you meaning it derogatorily. I think maybe people took it that way because the direction of the interview also seemed to be “casuals get features last” type of thing, so maybe they mixed the two? Not sure, but either way, don’t get sucked into “political correctness” because a couple of forum-goers took a benign statement and are treating it like a racial slur.

Lastly, on the point system: maybe I am completely naive here, but is it really that difficult to change(serious question)? It seems that with the Christmas rush looming, this type of change would really help with the Christmas players getting eased into SPVP. Maybe there is a large amount of coding that I am missing here, but it seems like something so simple, that clearly we both agree on, could be added without much detraction from other features?

I look at it like home improvements. If I have a small leak in my bedroom caused by a nail that has come loose on my roof causing the ceiling to drip water on the floor, but I also have my an issue where I am building an addition on my home. The small leak is a nuisance that can be dealt with but will only take 30 minutes to fix, while the addition on my home will be fantastic to complete but will take weeks. Why wait for the addition to be completed to fix the leak?

Again, I don’t want this to come out as “do your job this way” because most of us in the forums make grand assumptions about the ease of creating PvP.

I would like to point you to the thread found 6 posts below yours.

Visiroth.5914:

felivear.1536:

Look at the numerous examples of failed MMOs that went to the free-to-play model with no barrier to return. Can you give me an example of one that is flourishing?

Not sure what you mean by this comment, but there have been multiple PR from Turbine and Sony talking about player increases from their games that switched to F2P. I don’t know about flourishing, but the games haven’t been shut down either.

I mean flourishing. And of course the numbers increased, the reason they went F2P is because the numbers were darn near dead. So, going from 30,000 players to 43,000 players is definitely more players, but still a dead game.

Don’t worry, our current economic climate has made me accustomed to redistribution of wealth.

Pathos.5132:

I was checking out the overworld map for the mists and found a new island in the top right that isn’t currently in the line up. Unlike the surrounding areas it comes into view as you zoom in, and it looks like it may be orrian themed from what I can make out.

I would say this is juicy. Can you put up a screenshot? I’m at work.

Mevious.2847:

This is really confusing if you’re using red or blue dye and you’re on the opposite coloured team.

How so though? The only time this could potentially be confusing is if the enemy is too far away to where the nameplate doesn’t show up above their head, any other time, if they have a red nametag they are the enemy.

I put all my tickets in and have 51 in there. I put all of my PvP kits in there (well over 100) and only have 13 in there…

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

i dont know how to explain it. it looked like you were seeing from the view of the treb.

you cant say its exactly the same because its not. unless im the onlyone it changed

Got a screenshot to show us? I logged on to see the color change but then went to work so I can’t actually see what you mean. Screenshot ftw!

JonathanSharp.7094:

Hey all.

Just wanted to thank Grouch/Frozire and all the players for being involved in this. Sorry if some of the questions felt “soft” to you guys, but we’ll try to do more of these in the future. I thought the players asked great questions and voiced legitimate concerns. I know there are many other concerns out there, and we’ll just have to get to them in due time.

Thanks for listening, and thanks to everyone involved for getting it set up!

J

Just a quick question if you are still monitoring this thread. Do you agree that the scoring system in hot-joins is not conducive to team play and actually causes it to be the main reason you see so many theives and mesmers? Because they are very well suited for that type of play (i.e. Kill, quick hopping between points, cap and leave).

Also, are you completely set in stone on the no solo queue option? Many people including myself do not have the time or have an odd schedule to form teams and play at set times, we want to be able to queue in tournaments with people who also want the same thing. That would by far be the most popular type of SPVP played if that was added.

Edit: are there any plans to make hot-join keep parties of at least 2 people together? With Christmas rush I plan on seeing a few new friends joining and I would like to stay on the same team in hot-join.

Thanks for your time, we do appreciate what you guys do.

I can confirm. No more blue or red dyes in PvP.

Is this really a thing? Did a ninja patch happen while I’ve been ranting on the forums?

I sure hope that I am 100% incorrect, but I believe this single decision may be the one that ultimately cripples TPVP. You are punishing players who enjoy playing games as a single player while being part of a team. I play ridiculous amounts of PvP in games and I’ve almost always done so as a solo queuer (one major exception is in WoW where I arena’d in 2v2 for every season). I’ve had a blast doing so and I’ve done very well for myself in other games. In this game, I am forced to either meet 4-6 people and play on a schedule with them or get rolled. That is a joke.

The fact that the solo-queue option isn’t in this game isn’t even what’s the problem, the fact that it is completely being ignored and brushed aside as “not something were considering at this time” is outrageous. I hate to bring up SWG but gosh darn it feels similar.

You have people begging in unison for a few features. There is almost no resistance from the community on these specific aspects. They are then told, “nope, we got it figured out, sit back and wait while we iron out this wolf finisher animation, I think that’s what is needed right now”

Edit: am I the only one that when discussing things like this start to actually get mad? Like umadbro mad. Watching something so critical be ignored for God knows why is beyond frustrating. I need to take a break from posting, games are about fun and I am finding myself getting angry. breathe….breathe…

I have an SSD and I have had this once during a tournament. Other than that, I’m gravy.

Syeria.4812:

felivear.1536:

Jacobin.8509:

Yes GW2 is slightly easier to return to than other MMOs. The point is that if there is no competitive community with a big player base, you can’t expect an esport to just magically appear once changes are added 2-4 or whatever months from now.

As has been pointed out in this thread and others, rating and MMR won’t work if there is a tiny population. Its still long queues and miss-matches which will not give people who come back a good experience.

Forget this argument: “No sub-fee MMOs are so much different and players come back sooo easy”. I don’t buy it at all. If that were the case, then pay to play MMOs that go free to play should, in theory, get the same return rate or new player rate. Guess what, they don’t.

Look at the numerous examples of failed MMOs that went to the free-to-play model with no barrier to return. Can you give me an example of one that is flourishing?

Jacobin, you are dead on with your assessment and worries. This game is hemorrhaging. In an MMO, the fun of the players requires other players. The major concern for this game should be obtaining and retaining players. All of you other people that are so quick to say “this has no sub fee, they will come back!”….I’m very sad to tell you that one day, you will find out how incorrect that statement is.

That’s not the case at all. Outside of games designed to be free to play (such as GW, SC2, DOTA2, etc) the free to play model doesn’t really end up working how people seem to think it does. In fact, with SWTOR I’m not even sure if free to play users can even enter PvP.

The best parallel for GW2 is the original GW. Outside of that, the parallels are with non-MMO games such as SC2, DOTA 2, and LoL.

GW maybe the only true parallel and I am not qualified to speak to that since I am not sure how the original state of the game was. But, hopefully you can help me there. I did not know many people that played GW1 but I understood it had a healthy community. I want to know, did they game feel this incomplete at launch (serious question). Also, keep in mind that this game had a HUGE hill to climb at the start because it was branded the WoW killer, esport, and the greatest thing since Mario Brothers (which is all the more reason it HAD to ship with features other games currently have) This isn’t like that unknown game where a player tries it and decided “this isn’t for me” then later hears about some major changes and says “i’ll give it another try”. This game was one of the most love and hated games ever before release. Many of the players that loved it so much and touted as the game they will spend the next 5 years playing are very disappointed because some were made to look like a fool. The other half that hated the game and still tried it walked away with a sense of “i told you so”.

I can’t speak for everyone, but I know my friends were pretty much divided in those two camps. All of them are gone, and I honestly don’t know of any of them that will return for any reason.

Xom.9264:

majos.8503:

Rally it’s one of the best things on this game, not like all MMO’s ok, i did a little mistake so now i’m dead.. here is a second chance

So the player that plays to perfection in the 2 v 1 loses because you get a second chance over and over again if the other player is a bunker rezzing you again and again.

Its a terrible system… but wait we are talking about rally not rezzing. Your team should have to work to bring you back alive or you should have to make a choice self heal or damage the target. Automatic getting back up because your team just continued to attack and killed someone rewards zerging and burst not tactics. Right now it rewards brainless play like so many things.

Hopefully he misunderstood and assumed we meant rezzing. Otherwise, he would literally be the first person I’ve seen to state they like the rallying system.

Jumper.9482:

Not sure if serious. We have 5v5 hotjoin but it is vastly unpopular compared to 8v8.

I believe a major reason is because it’s at the bottom and new players (which I’m assuming the OP is) didn’t even think about it being down there. Maybe 2 tabs would work better.

Also, keep in mind the major reason it is still unpopular is the fact that the scoring system remains unchanged. As long as zerg gameplay is the best way to gain glory while simultaneously being punished for good conquest gameplay, then the more players in a game will be optimal. More people to kill and more people to cap so you can recap, now that’s GLORY! Or, a shame…

OH…oops. Totally sorry, I guess my own biases prevented me from clearly hearing that you are a girl. So often I forget that there are good female gamers as well.

Jacobin.8509:

Yes GW2 is slightly easier to return to than other MMOs. The point is that if there is no competitive community with a big player base, you can’t expect an esport to just magically appear once changes are added 2-4 or whatever months from now.

As has been pointed out in this thread and others, rating and MMR won’t work if there is a tiny population. Its still long queues and miss-matches which will not give people who come back a good experience.

Forget this argument: “No sub-fee MMOs are so much different and players come back sooo easy”. I don’t buy it at all. If that were the case, then pay to play MMOs that go free to play should, in theory, get the same return rate or new player rate. Guess what, they don’t.

Look at the numerous examples of failed MMOs that went to the free-to-play model with no barrier to return. Can you give me an example of one that is flourishing?

Jacobin, you are dead on with your assessment and worries. This game is hemorrhaging. In an MMO, the fun of the players requires other players. The major concern for this game should be obtaining and retaining players. All of you other people that are so quick to say “this has no sub fee, they will come back!”….I’m very sad to tell you that one day, you will find out how incorrect that statement is.

Aragiel.6132:

maybe i did understeand it wrong.. but i think it was said that we can expect only balance changes in December and matchmaking as next thing in new year

That’s exactly what was stated. December is only balance and contains really no game changes. I do understand that 100% of the changes I outlined can’t be implemented in the next 22 days, but to completely avoid issues that made a lot of former new players quit would be shameful.

I just find that things like the scoring system and allowing parties of 2 or 3 people who enter SPVP to stay together would be pretty small changes (time and resource wise) while adding a lot of quality to the new player experience.

Knote.2904:

Adding matchmaking w/o splitting premade vs pug won’t change a thing.

I honestly have no idea what they’re thinking.

They should just be imitating LoL completely. Competitive Solo Queue is a HUUUGE factor.

If you want to premade to stomp pugs, that’s what hotmess is for.

And yes, let Hotjoin for now on be known as “Hotmess”.

Look up hot-mess™ or hotmess™ in the forum search feature. I beat you to it!

Edit:
November 19, 2012 17:49
- The Bad
• Painful partying system with one or 2 friends. Especially those who are just learning the game. It’s either fight against each other in Hot-Mess, or get touched inappropriately in TPvP

tOss.9024:

I don’t necessarily hate it. (Though I too struggle to find how it’s necessary) I think it would be better if you couldn’t rally while someone was finishing you, at least.
I wonder if this was to prevent people from leaving large amount of teams bleeding out?

I’m sure this was the reasoning behind it, but couldn’t they do something to where if after 45 seconds downed you start regenning 5% health or something? Anything but the “Well, that thief I attacked 2 minutes ago just happened to be killed at some other place in the map. I’m up, I feel great, LETS FIGHT!”

Is this part of a plea agreement?

Rallying is the only feature that I genuinely hate in this game. There are other features that I feel could be tweaked or added, but this one blows my mind. I loathe it. If downed state is to stay, that’s fine, but at least make it so healing and teammate rezzing are the only means to get up.

+1 /signed

A few additions that word count prevents me from adding in the OP:

Keep friends together in hot-join.

• I completely understand that you don’t want premades in hot-join, but 2 or 3 friends should always stay together. 2 new players going into a hot-join together and then spending that fight either killing each other or struggling to figure out how to get on the same team is not fun!

Why before Christmas?

• The Christmas season will cause an influx of new blood into SPVP. It would be an absolute waste and shame if some key features that could help to retain them were absent come December 25th.