Guild Wars 2

Ok so this has been bothering me for a long time but even more now since i cant even play it in unranked without it getting smashed.

Why are the CD times on some of the warrior skills so high? The banner has a 240 cd time on it and rampage has 180. banner works like 10% of the time for me and beserk mode (f2) is already better then rampage. Yet im only able to use these skills 2 times a game if im lucky.

The next one i tred was ele. I was thinking out the box (maybe) so i tried to run 2 shouts and 2 glyphs. Use the rune of the druid i believe where using a glyph gives 500 healing. A few things happened and the big one being glyphs for the most part are useless. I got interrupted alot trying to use the heal skill and the elite glyph pet dies instantly, literally instantly. My heals were average and without the high heals im dying slowly to condi but the meta has changed so i just should deal with it.

The part that bothers me is the trait system with it, the elite traits for the ele are the sand squall and boon duration for war horn, condi duration while overloading and the frost aura effect for health. These are horrible!

There has to be alot more but i mostly play ele and warrior and im sitting here looking at some of these things like wow. Like for every 5 useful traits or skills there has to be 3-4 useless ones.

Like kick and throw bolas for warrior. People have so much runninkittening passives that when you try to entangle someone with a 1 tangle they just run right threw it like your skill wasnt even there. Or kick with its small range and incredible low damage. Heres the the best part, its cd is i believe is 12 sec which is the same as revenants unrelenting assault. One skill is a teleport, stakcs might and does 5-8k damage in PvP and the other gives a knockdown and 300 damage lol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you guys could share some other ones i would enjoy reading them because i wont play around with all the classes to find all the useless traits and skills.

ADTempys.6382:

Since he is speaking about DPS and quickness I assumed he was speaking of PvE, so I answered PvE wise, absolutly 0 thoughts about other game modes in my reply

ohhh i apologize then, the Op first paragraph talks about how axe/axe has no mobility, blocks and does less damage then GS so i assumed PvP.

Im wondering if you wrote this post because they buffed axe?

If we are being honest axe kind of sucks, sword kind of sucks and hammer definitely sucks.

This goes for alot of classes though. On thief d/d and s/ anything just isnt as good as staff or d/p in 1 vs 1 or team fights. You can say the same things for alot classes.

Warrior is in the same spot weapon choices wise as many classes. Because arms has the increased weapon speed trait line, power having the axe boost. Then you have defense and zerk spec lines being mandatory. Its near impossible to make quality PvP builds anymore that dont look near the same as someone elses.

Grouch posted on the PvP forum that they have limitations on what they can do for PvP.

Well im reading in between lines and i assume he said yeah we all know the problems but we cant fix them. There are a ton of posts on each professions thread to make the PvP scene better but Anet doesnt want to make PvP better. They are trying to balance it for PvE, raids, and to a lesser extent WvW and PvP.

Everything we need to know about balance in GW2 is looking at the skills. Elite banner cd time 240, rampage 180 and headbutt 16sec. Beserk form actually does more damage then rampage now, banner cant revive downed players if they have psn and less then 50% health. You take into account all the condi be thrown around as well as pulsing stability. It makes for 2 of the warriors elite skills useless in PvP.

So dont feel bad if you cant make axe/axe work because i couldnt and Anet wont fix and PvP issues it isnt high on the priority list and not because the PvP team doesnt want to fix it. If there is still a PvP team.

ADTempys.6382:

What people don’t understand is that to put good DPS on GS you root yourself (2 and 5) for qute a bit of time + you need to be able to connect with bladetrail, when axe allows you to freely move way more as your only skill that you have to be carfull of is f1. And at this point axe just needs a rework, we dont need another spam 1 ftw weapon

I disagree with this, Greatsword has always been the 1 vs 1 and team weapon on DPS warrior builds. Pre hot in 1 vs 1 warrior used mace shield with greatsword and there was alot of things you could do with greatsword.

I mean basically the 3 skill on axe is the 4 skill on great sword and the 5 on axe axe is 2 on greatsword.

But the 1 skill on Great sword is better, the 3 skill is better and the 5 skill compared to axe axe 1-2-4 skills. Even the F1 skill in beserk form is better on greatsword.

So you can argue that GS has limitations which is a odd thing to say about the best weapon on warrior by far.

Dahkeus.8243:

kdaddy.5431:

I find that engy does most things better then the original classes.

Engy is better at rampage then warrior

Engy is better at invisibility then thief

Engy is better with tornado a elite skill ele cant use.

You have to feel like Anet is running out of ideas to balance things or they are saving it for the next expansion.

If the engy gets lucky enough to get rampage, sure it’s a little better, but that’s a 50% chance of happening…

Engi is not better than thief. Especially after the sneak gyro nerfs. Also, any engi with sneak gyro won’t be bringing elixir X, so that’s a pretty irrelevant point.

Ohhh no of course i understand but i feel the engy just steals other classes skills. I mean at 1 point the engy elite skill whether it was gyro or elixer was better.

I mean the ability to moa people and potentially go rampage with 25 stacks of might was very frustrating as someone who didnt play engy and played warrior in season 1 & 2. Literally had a shorter cool down and warriors rampage lasted 15 sec and engys was 20.

Then tornado is actually useful on engy since it can do some dps with high boons and the short cool down.

Its basically just me complaining because they took a skill from warrior, ele and thief and made it better on engy no matter which elite skill you picked.

I find that engy does most things better then the original classes.

Engy is better at rampage then warrior

Engy is better at invisibility then thief

Engy is better with tornado a elite skill ele cant use.

You have to feel like Anet is running out of ideas to balance things or they are saving it for the next expansion.

I find the bigger issue to be the HOT spec in this case.

The ele spec line had alot to do with shouts, overloads and a weapon trait which is mostly useless.

Now eles are running into the problem of is it viable?

I dont know, i guess we will see when the Pro League players get back into it but Anet hasnt addressed other viable builds. Ele cant run conjure weapons, they cant run arcane and cantrips dont remove condi fast enough.

This goes for alot of classes but there are limited build options for running into a match as a solo/duo que player and with Anet putting out odd patches. Will fights be quicker? Yes but will they be fun to play? I myself have have had enough of the F2 then F1 warrior with mace applying 4 stacks of confusion 2 stacks of bleed, the necro with the chill and psn and a mesmer apply 4 stacks of torment and then adds another 6 stacks of confusion by pressing 2-3 buttons.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

do you all realize you can click the “yes” button and then immediately click the “no” button and then exit the match ?

yeah but its just the point. The new team name with the team icon is lame as well as the join team party thing. I dont know why GW1 players had a issue with this but many times during the season people would see me in a match and whisper me if we wanted to party.

That was simple and yet Anet implemented a silly join party for PvP matches.

I just recently got back into fractals after not doing them since they brought everyone back to fractal 30. I was a bit confused and frustrated with the AR stuff but i figured it out and with that said. Ive only gotten 2 rings from fractal 45-63.

I dont know what it is but i cant ever seem to get a decent drop any where in this game. I have more PvP matches then everyone in my guild but 1, more kills in PvE then everyone in my guild besides 2 and i have the 2nd highest fractal level at 63.

Yet i have never gotten a precursor drop and have had maybe 6-7 ascended weapons/armor drops. Yet some guild members have had 4-5 pre’s never done fractals higher then 20 yet was able to get full ascended for 1 character do low levels etc etc etc.

Its completely random as i see it.

suffish.4150:

ESL casting is great right now and there is nothing that I think could be improved upon. Yes, they could mention the timing of skills and such, but they are the things that I quite literally do not care about. What I want from casting is an overview of the match and who is winning/losing the fights and when caps/decaps are happening. But most of all what I want are casters who genuinely enjoy what they are doing and get hyped and start shouting at exciting moments (if you want to know what I mean by that watch the end of game 2 of vermillion vs. Abjured at the season 1 pro league finals). That is what really makes watching the esports events exciting for me.

If the casters were just listing all the skills that are used and how they are timed, the pro league would be boring for me. If I wanted to see exactly how a fight was won/lost I would go back and re-watch that moment in the game, like I often do (people often complain about it being too hard to see what is going on, but I have no problem seeing exactly what each individual player is doing in a huge teamfight if I am watching them). The thing that gets me hyped for esports events like the upcoming world championship (seriously, I am already counting down the days until I get to watch it) is the exciting moments in the games and the casters’ commentary on those moments, not endless listing of skills and dodges/blocks and technical moments in teamfights with no real excitement behind them.

I agree with you on the excitement matter from the castors.

But dont you think for people not knowing all the skills of each class it can become a issue? When you watch sports center and they break down the NBA finals or Super Bowl they can literally pick 3-4 moments and break down what happened.

For instance when the spurs last won in 2014 they kept showing clips of the passing and cutting and you got those cliche comments such as the ball is faster then any defense. So a old team won a championship on being playing with better ball movement and player movement. They beat 2 teams who were more talented and had the better player. How would you break down the new matches?

I received criticism for saying that I (as well as the castors ) that toker had no effect on the games. If we had game break downs from these castors that showed actual crucial moments it would bring layers of understanding to the game to those just curious about the game. Supercutie tried to do that but he picked moments that really didnt matter for the most part but i respect that he had a actual notebook out and brought up actual plays during the match.

I agree with you about the excitement but when you can get intelligent people who know the game like the troy aikmens who now is a broadcastor, phill simms, doug collins, jeff van gundys. These people making comments about the game have huge impacts on things such as rule changes.

For Guild Wars to be a successful Esports game you need both. If we had castors who said things and didnt make it pg like huerix and simply say necro and thief are not good enough to have a impact on these games it would at least put the pressure on Anet to balance PvP.

OriOri.8724:

Are the replays on the GW2 youtube channel or somewhere else? I haven’t been able to find them

they are on the gw2twitch channel

Its HOT, if you go back and watch WTS 1-2 one where the Abjured won and one with ORNG you got the seperation in play calling. 1 person doing the play by play and the other commenting on the portal plays (TCG) and the effect of having a hammer guardian(ORNG).

You cant do that that because its like this alot, ohhh his health is going low they are putting down the dps and hes full health.

The addition of rebound from ele- cele avatar from druid- boost of health to warrior in the last patch on top of the crazy AOE effects of HOT make it really hard to see what is happening.

Literally 1 mesmer each team with 2-3 clones with a ele using overloads and necros who are not even traited for minions who get 2-5 minions from a shout clutters a point. Before HOT you could hear guardian/warrior/ranger shouts and a shout caster could say at that moment whether or not that was a good play. Each shout did something different, guardians had defensive ones with a shout giving protection, aegis and swiftness, condi clear and slightly healing the guardian. Warriors were offensive giving fear, vulnerability, might and fury.

Now every skill gives everything. Cele avatar heals you, allies, healing ally either gives them dmg boost or blinds enemy on next attack. Ele shouts provide protection,vigor, healing, and a aura.

How can you comment on the match when there is a million things happening at once and they will continue to happen during that fight? Just when you think a ele is gonna go down they use rebound, then ranger fully heals them or engy or a mesmer uses the F4 skill then gets a free rez. Do you blame the shout casters for this?

Ross Biddle.2367:

kdaddy.5431:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Bring a blood offering of 6 fatted calves and lay them at the feet of the great warrior god emkelly. Slice your hand and sprinkle the surrounding area in a shower of your own blood. Then and only then will you be granted access to the hall of warriors to learn the true meaning of what it is to PvP on the one class made to rule them all.

This the same emkelly who said vanilla warrior builds can be just as good as the HOT ones?

Then says crazy stuff like warrior can lose in 6 sec to thief when traited right it has at least 10 sec of invulnerability as well as a shield, 2 dodges and a million stun breakers.

Yeah that emkelly…….(stares into the universe and ask why)

Like you never said anything someone could take exception with before.

hahaha of course someone could but your asking this guy to sell the cow. He has 1 magic bean and you want to give it to emkelly. (stares at you like you all sorts of crazy)

Ross Biddle.2367:

Bring a blood offering of 6 fatted calves and lay them at the feet of the great warrior god emkelly. Slice your hand and sprinkle the surrounding area in a shower of your own blood. Then and only then will you be granted access to the hall of warriors to learn the true meaning of what it is to PvP on the one class made to rule them all.

This the same emkelly who said vanilla warrior builds can be just as good as the HOT ones?

Then says crazy stuff like warrior can lose in 6 sec to thief when traited right it has at least 10 sec of invulnerability as well as a shield, 2 dodges and a million stun breakers.

Yeah that emkelly…….(stares into the universe and ask why)

I would suggest using a mace/shield with great sword if your gonna play vanilla warrior.

Going with the 2 stances and either bulls charge or the stomp with rampage. Hammer imo doesnt really work anymore in pvp. Everyone has huge amounts of stability and/or stun breakers.

I suggest the mace shield for the F1 stun which is 3 sec but they will probably have stability or a stun breaker. Either way it fine because mace also has a block to go with shield. If they dont you obviously go from the stun into hundred blades to try and get the dps or jump in rampage form.

Otherwise practice practice practice, good luck

Im not sure if the community wants stronghold to be a legit map, i personally like conquest with temple and foefire being my favorites.

I do que for stronghold in unranked though and i got my 2nd match in 3-4 and i noticed something. Coordination is huge here and you cant make up/carry anything if your team isnt on the same page.

In conquest getting kills at least gives your team a 15 sec advantage to move to fights/capture points. In the match today they enemy team had 2 go on defense and 3 offense. On my team i went defense and 1 thief went offense and the other 3 went to run supply.

Now the match was extended because im playing the meta ele shout build with d/w. They could not kill me and could not kill the lord till they got 2 champions summoned. The players on my team seemed rather new but the match went 14 min and 25 sec long and we got threw there outer gate around the 12 min mark.

So some things i think could help stronghold because imo its so heavily dependent on protecting/killing the NPC.

1- Get rid of the treb and replace it with something else.

2- When players get kills make it do something on the map.

3- Create a different path to the lord

Im not a huge fan of mobas but the 2 lanes 1 being offense- 1 being defense makes it so huge amounts of stacking can happen near gates which create really long matches where you might not even being focusing a player but your focused on healing NPC or killing a npc.

So some of my thoughts are getting rid of the treb and making a upward lane where the archers go. They when getting to a spot change from regular arrows use fire arrows that help take the door down. This would make it so players now can defend the doorbreakers who are in the front lines or the archers who now become like catas.

The kills on a map should mean something so i was thinking of a kill thresh hold/death thresh hold. Example on 15 kills a champion for your team runs out to help and on 20 deaths a champion comes out to help.

So obviously creating a new path to the lord isnt a necessity but once again, with 1 way in and 1 way out. There is alot of zerging offensively and defensively. Im not sure what the change would be here but its something i think should be looked at. Thank you

Im playing full trap ranger with entangle and in multiple matches across many fights i see this.

I spread the 3 traps across the point. They run from the one spot only to hit another, im using shortbow off point letting the pet fight it on the point. I then run in a circle dropping all the traps again and watching them do it again.

I have no condi clear other then F5 and no stability, no stun breakers and im winning alot of 1 vs 2.

When ranked first ended i was still playing rifle warrior, this ele tried to 1 vs 1 me and he used swirling winds and i used signet of might to hit him with a old school kill shot. He asked how i got threw his swirling winds and i told him the signet. He tried to 1 vs 1 me again and i did it again.

We won and we get into map chat and he starts whispering me and bashing me in map chat about me (using my characters name) is a trash warrior and i was the reason the game was dying with brain dead stupid builds. I actually enjoyed this though, I and some guild mates had a good laugh over this.

Sartharina.3542:

Unranked was great until the season ended and all the actually-competitive players started infesting it again. It seems they feel the same way.

Can we please get Ranked back so the competitive players don’t have to put up with my bullkitten, and I don’t have to put up with theirs?

I have to say i dont know what the change was but im playing full trap ranger, vanilla warrior with axe axe and something happened.

I truly have no clue how MM works.

Topher.5631:

kdaddy.5431:

see and the funny thing about that is thief loses to DH (not usable in Pro leagues other then tage) engy, mesmer, rev and for the most part necro.

For reference thief eats necro / mesmer / rev alive.

But in reference to the skill, the skill needs a larger telegraph and less unique condis inflicted. Daze duration needs to be reduced

Ill just use the ESL level for instance, how many times did toker beat a player 1 vs 1? Well he downed a few players but was never able to finish. Everyone casting/playing basically said that toker is the best thief in the game and he barely got to eat.

Also someone posted a thread about legendary mismatches and caed was in the match. Someone found the caed stream and posted the match on the forum. Caed said when he was about to engage a necro "ok lets see if we can figure this out) or something like that. He killed the necro in 5 sec and said “ok he sucked”.

No offense but i will take the evidence from the ESL/ Pro leagues and the words of imo the best thief in the game.

lucadiro.4519:

XerMeLL.6042:

Warrior’s Skills are so predictable, you can just dodge it.

Yeah, you only have to Dodge shield bash, headbutt, skullgrinder… Easy if you are a daredevil

see and the funny thing about that is thief loses to DH (not usable in Pro leagues other then tage) engy, mesmer, rev and for the most part necro. Then to top it off it would take thief a long time to kill a good warrior with shield, 2X endure the pain even if they did everything right.

You take away 1 stack of bleeding and confusion ok maybe its fixed but its still OP, you take away 2 stacks and now its worse then the other classes.

Reason is every class has so much get out of jail free cards. Take away 2 stacks and a warrior in a 1 vs 1 with a ranger. It couldnt do it with the pet taking condi and cele form to full health. Same thing with the engy and ele and necro.

When HOT skills for warrior is zerker stance, F2 then f1, wait 2 sec then F1 again into headbutt into another skill. The class is now dependent on quick condi damage reapplication. Just like thief has to spam 5-dodge-5-dodge, on staff etc etc on alot of other classes.

This burst quick application meta has huge consequences to classes. For instance if they put even 1/2 timer on Dh putting traps down. The DH trait line is now useless in PvP. That goes for all the classes, it either has to actual balance across all the classes. If Anet picks 3-4 things from 1-2 classes that are OP they will screw the meta like they have been since before HOT.

Its impossible to know what is OP and what isnt in GW HOT. That very mace/shield condi combo was useless in season 1-2. It wasnt until they gave warriors the huge buff to life/sustain in the defense base trait line.

Having been playing vanilla warrior yesterday and today. You realize how spammy HOT is.

Just for quick instance the new zerker trait line gives adrenaline(discipline), boosted damage from going into the zerk mode(power) and then they made the F1 skill spammable.

Every other thread is about how OP a terrible aspect of the new HOT spec lines. Guardians with simple traps that do big damage, engys with incredible tank abilities that forces them into hammer, thieves with pick which spam 3 or 5, etc etc etc.

Ill give 1 more example of how OP the new specs are, I and 1 friend tried going 2 vs 1 on 2 different types of vanilla warriors. I went with mace/shield- axe axe with power-defense-discipline. My team mate went sword-sword longbow with shouts(basiclaly old shoutbow) and we tried to kill the meta ele. We couldnt do it and it took forever just to decap the point. Why are we doing this? Because we have 2 guild members who didnt pay for HOT and were thinking of coming back. When we talk to them in game or face book its impossible to tell them what to expect. The speed of the game flew up X2, the graphics of the different abilities went the same and meta builds are simply far superior to other builds. When you tell that to old players coming back or new players coming in, what should their response be?

So i rambled a bit but to answer the question, is skull grinder OP? Yes and no, its Op because warrior now has great sustain, boon application, condi removal, stun breakers and traits that give increased damaged,stability and spam. To even take away a little of of any of these would bring it in line with necros,thieves, and DH but without other nerfs mesmers,rev,rangers, and ele would have no problems facing warriors.

Highlie.7641:

There is no difference between the player quality in unranked compared to ranked. see what you guy’s are seeing are what the people stuck in “MMR hell” experienced all season.

“Get good and carry” I believe you told them? that goes both way’s i suppose

On another note. noone in the right mind takes unranked seriously. hell even before they removed solo q most people didn’t.

Do yourself’s a favor and roll a build that doesn’t involve arena net carrying you. it will help you in the long run. (and in the next season)

actually i figured it out, i needed to come up with a build that wasnt meta since most people are not running meta. ( i ran into a few meta warriors which crushed me)

But the build has to have huge effects on team fights. So i run full trap ranger in unranked and it worked pretty well.

I find your comment silly because i to want to run non-meta (builds i wouldnt play in rank) and i simply was finding it hard since matches were very lopsided. I was playing axe/axe sword/shield warrior, i was playing dps staff ele, i was playing rifle engy.

I was just not ready for all the terrible builds people were running were no one is running support, bad rotations, etc etc etc. I wouldnt call it MMR, for or less I becoming frustrated.

I wrote this thread because i was unable to get my PvP dailies. I actually yesterday went back to meta ele so i could get the 2g and the potions.

I dont know, unranked has a mixed feel to it. When i am on warrior and i pop my shield and the P/P thief still uses unload. I dont feel like i should be playing. Yet i still lose the match big. It just becomes a bit silly i guess.

I remember someone posting on this forum helseths rage video on why he quit streaming gw2. He would just farm players in unranked because there was no challenge for him.

Now its completely different for me, just needed to write out my frustrations and wondered if others felt the same.

Ill be honest im losing alot, not to mention all the goofy builds and i had a match were we had 3 thieves I on Dh and 1 necro.

Idk, ranked has insanely long que times and unranked seems full of just really bad builds and players. Or am i just the only one?

JTGuevara.9018:

I don’t blame you, I’m done with pvp leagues, maybe pvp for good if this next balance patch doesn’t rein in this powercreep.

This isn’t just meta anymore. This is MUST-HAVE. If you don’t run HoT meta, def, disc, bersk you will not survive. The HoT powercreep is absurd. I mean who even runs arms/tactics anymore?

I ran arms/defense/zerker and i got to legendary pretty easily.

I started the season with 3 wins and 18 losses trying to find a thief build that worked for me. After getting my thief and engy wins for Ap i was around 20 wins and 45 losses.

I played the rest of the season on ele and my warrior and finished with a 152 wins and 285 games. That is 133 losses overall and a 53% for the season. So i would like to point out that with my rifle warrior build i would of held a 60% + win rate playing arms/defense/zerker.

dont want to believe me, you can find on this warrior forum. I sharing my rifle warrior build.

fishball.7204:

“Spent more time queued than playing”

I like this but can we shorten it up a bit?

emkelly.2371:

^this.

Also, skull Grinder Is over powered.

Also, also, You’re the one complaining about build diversity. Warriors are the most diverse class in the game right now. And just because you can’t make anything work for you besides one or two builds doesn’t mean the rest of us have not have great success and fun with many builds.

Also, also, also, I don’t really feel the need to argue this point any more.

I wouldnt want to debate my point either if i said vanilla builds were effective. Playing like a unranked hero during a PvP season is like saying it works in PvE.

If you are talking stances, i have to agree. Since HOT came out every decent build for warrior has included the 2 obvious stances.

Before Hot there was the shoutbow and even some of the best 1 vs 1 builds had 2-3 physical skills such as bulls charge, stomp, and rampage.

But overall i dont know if there is anything to complain about. I got to legendary playing ele and warrior. My warrior build is GS/Rifle and i had a pretty easy time getting to legendary.

If you want to say warrior is forced to play stances then i agree but ele has to play shouts, mesmer has to play condi, engy has to use hammer etc etc etc.

Overall the builds for this game have become 1 sided since they are trying to balance around WvW, PvP, and PvE. So i agree with you but dont agree with you at the same time.

I still dont understand this subject. This once again is a MM issue. The PiP system is a fail for the most part and can create huge mismatches in group play.

But once again this goes back to the actual ability of the players and the rank the PvP season gives them.

I have a screen shot from just now. My guild mates and I do not care for the guild leader board since we got screwed in season 1-2. Season 1 we played alot of matches and won alot but ended up something like 18-8 but i was in legendary rank and we saw a ruby Guild Team get a higher placing then us.

Then in 2nd season the guild decay guild 1 of our teams. They went like 7-1 early in the season and fell out of the top 500. The 4 players i played with in season 2 we went 12-7 and we got 24 on the guild leader board.

So playing at the end of the season is how you get Guild Trophies for the Guild hall which is what we did. Now 2 things to keep in mind, 1- is my guild team mates right for there MM. 2nd is who is on our team.

In the screen shot, we got 2 other players who could hold there own. So we won, next match we que under a different team que name and we lost. The 2 players on that team blamed us for the loss even though both players lost a 1 vs 1 with a thief who i beat for a point on the bunker ele.

So even though i went off course and dragged on a bit, this isnt a premade vs solo issue. Its a players skill issue as well as MM.

OnizukaBR.8537:

Today maitrin is the daily, you could just open “T2 daily Mai trin” i’m sure someone with level 50 or higher will join, so you do it 9 times, then you can see the 51 tab.

Question, i can just open any fractal that is a daily? Also thanks for the help.

So i recently got a new guild member who came from league. Now he mostly PvP so we took him into the 1 vs 1 room and went threw some things on different classes. He wanted to stay with thief, kind of like master a class before trying a new one.

Either way 2 nights ago he got to level 20 with me in unranked and he went off into ranked. I saw him last night and he said he was 5 wins 2 losses. He said que times could be a problem. He said he had a 10 min que only to face the same people. He also said that 2 people in the match each game would rage and complain about MM and other things etc etc etc.

Now he came from league so he has a different out look on it then i do. He starts talking about how in LOL people say stuff like im in silver division but i play like a platinum. He actually started laughing when other people were saying how bad team mates were since he has only been playing the game for 2-3 weeks since coming back and he considers himself rather new.

Im bringing this up because im frustrated for him and he isnt even frustrated.

1-Hes better then these players. He took the time to come into a 1 vs 1 room and i showed him basic things from other classes. He understands basic ideas on rotations.

2- The que time, im sorry anet your ranked/PiP system sucks. He gets to level 20 and goes into league and he has 10 min que times. Legendary has 15-30 min que times, how can anyone play in ranked?

This is just something i wanted Anet to address. I want to play in ranked, better players, people are trying harder to actually win but no one wants to sit around for 5+ minutes doing nothing. Also the PiP system is horrible, no need to go into further discussion about it. Fix it before the start of season 4.

So im at level 41 fractal. Thanks to a guild team mate i figured out what someone else was trying to say to me on this forum. I have 110 AR but im not allowed to look at higher level fractals.

Ive posted level 41 frac but not to many come along who are helpful. I want to be able to see the level 51-75 fracs so i can level up to them. I basically sit around looking for dailies now because i cant get a group around my frac level and i cant see the levels above me.

I wished there was a better way to get your frac level higher.

Ok so i love the que times being 1 minute or less. Its awesome to play a game. But ive literally had matches in the past 3 days where the other players are horrible.

For instance just the last match i noticed that 2 players on my team had high ranks for PvP. The other team i recognized 1 player from legendary. Now we lost but one of there thieves literally died from a 1 vs 1 with my pet………………………………………

Ive also seen a ton of P/P thieves in unranked so i took my warrior and just went mace/shield and sword shield. 1 thief had 1/2 health and he downed himself.

I dont know if i should be complaining about this because with my luck, Anet trys to fix match making and boom 5 min que in unranked. Ill pass on that but just saying its a bit hard looking for 1 vs 2 just to entertain yourself.

Arcaedus.7290:

kdaddy.5431:

Your next post will be hammer warriors with headbutt and bulls charge is op because my friends dont bring stun breakers or stability to there builds. Im sorry your friends got frustrated and quit playing PvP but i dont want Anet to balance around players who dont know how to play the game.

Countering DH traps takes a little bit more than just bringing stability or dodging reactively. The problem is that if somoene walks onto a point where all the traps are stacked at once, then the sudden damage they take is so ridiculously high that they are very unlikely to survive it. A fix could include a slight nerf to the worst offenders: Test of Faith and Dragon’s Maw.

Just an example of some minor nerfs that I think would make playing against DH more noob-friendly: ToF needs a 1/2s cast time, and Dragon’s Maw should deal less damage up-front and more damage over-time for staying caught in the jaws (compensation would probably include a decreased cd on this trap, or adding a fire-field to it).

It would be a bad idea for ANet to balance around new players, but we should have some pity on them. Sufficient barriers to entry are never a good thing.

Everything you said is correct for “noob friendly” players but what about those like Tage who mastered the class and he had to use guardian/DH with rune of speed in the Pro League? The man wasnt even using the damage traps because he played the 2nd bunker for the team. So at high level play the traps you speak of are not even being used.

Once again i say you cant nerf certain traits/ skills for players walking into the game. Yes we want them to continue playing as a community but not if they want it easy and no not if they want to run any skills they want to be effective. They need to change and run with the meta just like the rest of us.

Like heres my problem with what you are suggesting, the dps DH is not viable at ESL levels, i consider myself slightly above average and Dh did not do well when they were on my team or on the enemy team during the season. My friend was able to use it to get into ruby but when qued with me he got destroyed, not close fights that could of gone either way. Slaughtered to the point of frustration and just logging off.

Which come back full circle, what gets buffed since traps will be nerfed? A class that is barley viable at the average level and destroys people just walking into the game. Base guardian wasnt the best at anything before HOT. I dont want a class to get destroyed like warrior was season 1-2 without saying what can be buffed for the nerfs.

Gatvin.6510:

So here’s my problem with DH. I CAN beat them. Once you figure out the traps its easy. Dodging is great, and the rest is pretty simple, stun then burst, repeat ‘till dead. Many players haven’t figured this out. They just charge in and die. Now my friends aren’t the best PvPers, but my problem is they basically have quit playing because they were tired of DH keeping them from doing anything. Even when they remember not to stand in procession or cross the faith line there’s still the yank, knockback, cage shot, and cage trap to prevent them from being able to do so. Once you’re through all that, you’ve got block skills, then the super-shield to deal with.

DH has a cool skillset, but its way too good at killing newbs. They need to be more intuitive to play against.

Why wouldnt you just go into the guild hall or a 1 vs 1 server and just practice?

We got a new player into the guild and he loved playing P/P thief and i took my warrior into a room and showed him what he hast to look for. Then i brought in my ele and showed him why it wont work in a match with a shout ele.

I have a guild team mate who was crushing sapphires with his DH build and got into ruby with it. We qued together for 18 min (thanks anet) in ranked since he still wanted to get to diamond and he couldnt play anywhere with his DH against high diamond and legendary players.

I really want to know what anet plans to do with a class that brings nothing to high level game play. You want it baby proof for your friends who just want to walk into PvP and do well. They will literally lose to any decent build and quit with the approach they came in with.

Your next post will be hammer warriors with headbutt and bulls charge is op because my friends dont bring stun breakers or stability to there builds. Im sorry your friends got frustrated and quit playing PvP but i dont want Anet to balance around players who dont know how to play the game.

So i just got to legendary and the que times are like this every other que.

I just feel this is a huge issue that Anet needs to address. Some people think its the match making. Others believe its the meta builds being far superior then any other builds. IMO I believe its the horrible PiP system that anet uses forcing players to see the same players in there pip range over and over.

What ever the reason is Anet you need to address the fact that its really hard to play ranked games. I had to play unranked for dailys because i cant spend 4hrs playing PvP. I and my guild team mates played 2 games in unranked for guild missions. We wouldnt even be able to attempt a guild mission in rank with these que times.

If you want to have a Pro League/ PvP season you need to have a system where people want to que up in ranked.

Im sorry but you just took out crafting stations out of WvW and im wondering if your gonna do anything for the guilds halls since it seems you anet keep taking stuff away.

Guild halls should have crafting stations and mini games. My guild is a small and we have worked it up to about level 47 and honestly there is no reason to go in there except to upgrade more crap that it needs.

It needs alot more stuff to decorate with, it needs someway to make mini games such as belchers bluff or better yet some of the mini games in the actual HOT meta events. Like a practice arena that you unlock at a certain level.

As someone who mostly PvP and has to farm mats to do anything in this game. Im wondering why nothing has been added to guild halls and why nothing has changed for PvP?

Seriously HOT has felt way more grindy/work since guild halls was suppose to be a fun thing but they are more just empty spaces then anything. Then anet has fallen short on legendarys, PvP is still relatively unbalanced and i have 3 other servers on my team this week for WvW. So all together we are a 4 server team vs a 2 and a 3. I wonder who is winning? I find it amazing that HOT is simply just trying to improve/fix current items and dont have have any ability to add/upgrade anything.

I have to disagree for a few reasons.

1- The skill range in this game is vastly different. I have a friend who is in sapphire right now and he is destroying people in there with thief in 1 vs 1 and even at times winning 1 vs 2. Yet he is super frustrated about losing these games. I brought him into legendary with me and 1 other player who played shout ele who is also in sapphire. We went 1-2 vs the diamonds/legendarys we faced. So now for me to move forward i have to find 4 other players who play at the same time as me/ who i get along with/ and who want to que up together with just to find my correct MMR.

2- Yes ESL level players and above average players will lose sometimes. Yet i would like to point out that when i was getting into legendary. I was stuck in T7 diamond for a good 4-5 days. 1 day i kept seeing tarcis and trackstar on the other team after i would win 1. I didnt win 1 game against them and we lost big everytime. I made a thread about it because when i had a match against zoose. I knew he was the better player and he made the big play at the end to win the game.

3- We had a solo que, the best players in the game then are still the best players in the game now. Seriously why do people think that if there was a solo que that they have a better chance? If you see these guys streaming, for the most part they are solo queing. Heck Helselth in season 1 showed his wins/losses on the top right corner with him solo/duo queing during the season.

Now dont get me wrong, i dont think the MM is all that fair. I find it could be better. I simply believe that having a league system based around PiPs is one of the worst ideas ever. Season 2 was horrible when i saw 2-3 ESL players on my team and then the other team was a bunch of nobodys and the score was 500-0. That was a terrible system. I think they should really look at the % on what team should win.

Nothing worse then players losing PiPs when they had a 25% chance to win a match, yet they dont get to see which team was suppose to win.

dominik.9721:

kdaddy.5431:

Im not sure about you but in regular ranked games, who ever the better player are win not matter the class. At the ESL level from what i saw, all anyone could talk about was the mesmer to thief aspect and imo the necro be lesser then the warrior.

^
TCG and Rank 55 did even confirm it themself that nec and thief does work but is simply inferior to revenant/warrior comps. You have to play much more properly and are still in a slight disadvantage. So to say that thief and necro comp is equal to warrior/rev is just wrong and that PZ would have lost against TCG anyways even with a different composition doesn’t matter at all.

Then people telling how great Toker was on thief and how great Nos was on nec – they indeed were absolutly amazing and from what I’ve seen astral played much more impressive than rank 55 somehow – and that’s the point, they still lost. You simply can do much less mistakes and wrong decisions with a rev/warrior comp not to mention that the classes themself are way easier to play.

And I’m 100% sure neither PZ nor Astral wouldnt have played necro/thief comp if they scrimed EU comps more often before. Necro just sucks in comparison to warrior and a thief simply will create a more complicated game to yourself by making rotations way harder.

+1, Pvtfrosty what this guy said. Dont miss it

Pvt Frosty.6973:

kdaddy.5431:

So you are saying there is no coincidence that the NA teams who played thief and necro lost? PZ best game was when muffins got off of the thief.

Best PZ game was indeed when muffins got off the thief because he is a much better mesmer than he is a thief (in terms of his character and he has been playing it for far longer aswell).

kdaddy.5431:

Also saying they did work is not how you access a situation. Was toker all over the map, yes but he didnt bring anything other then decaps. When he tried to +1 the warrior didnt die and 1 of astral did.

Similarly Toker nearly won the fight against Levin and killed/won against Misha. So I kinda totally disagree that Thief is just straight up a worse version then Rev (especially since it did not even take the rev spot in their comp).

kdaddy.5431:

There was multiple times where nos was alone/or in a 2 vs 2 fight without the engy or ele and he straight lost.

I don’t remember a situation like that, but if it did happen, then it was a rotation issue on AAs part.

kdaddy.5431:

Here is the thing too, acting like astral could of won maybe 1 of the first 2 games is crazy. They were not gonna be able to save lord because they didnt have a mesmer and Rank 55 did. You saw the counter TCG had for rank 55 on legacy. Rank 55 also straight beat Astral on Kylo. If anything Rank 55 should of 3-0 Astral on the forest map.

Sigh. This is getting ridiculous. As soon as r55 lordrush-portaled, they won the game. AA needed to either a) do it first or b) kill Misha or c) actually be prepared for the portal. It took them way too hard by surprise

kdaddy.5431:

Also your comment about mirror classes in the finals, what is that? Did you read my post? Also they blew out PZ 500-100 in games where as rank 55 at times were actually very competitive. Crazy thing the mirror comp was way more competitive, is that just a coincidence?

I’m not even gna bother anymore

A few things here,

1- you are picking and choosing the arguments you want to present. For instance toker nearly killed someone. You wrote that as a actual point. And that he did in fact win a fight. The best thief in the game won a fight, so now he gets a gold star for a 30-60 match up he actually won. In a 12-15 min game he gave them a +3-4 minutes of positive game play as a team. This isnt knocking him as a player but the role he is in and the class he is in which is created by Anet. He playing thief costed his team a chance to win imo.

2- Muffins played thief for years and now that hes playing mesmer we are gonna say hes better at it? Thats fine if you want, hes a thief main and coming from NA (which want to play thief and necro) the 2nd that thief might possibly be usable he took a chance at it. How can you sit here and say hes better at mesmer when mesmer overall is just a better class?

3- Rotation issue you say, thats why Astral lost? You say rotation issue and i say warrior and mesmer are far better/complete classes then thief and necro.

4- The portal play on legacy just adds to my argument which you are missing. Thief role was decap and +1 and toker did his best and it seemed ineffective at times. The mesmer from rank 55/TCG made alot of plays that are stand out. To the point the Helseth is clowning NA for not having any good mesmers. Helseth by the people there commenting wasnt even the best mesmer there and here we have the best thief in the game unable to make 1/2 the plays a mesmer can. I was trying to point out how having the mesmer allowed counter options for defense or offense which TCG could do and AA could not.

5- Please you shouldnt bother because your just being argumentative. Just like your friend Jelzouki you are just picking outs you can actually debate. You have no counter answer for the many things the shout casters and play by play guys were saying. All the NA games you heard things like he cant do anything there hes a thief, Nos cant be left alone because he needs support on necro and so on and so on.

All i said was i felt NA lost because necro/ thief looked a little under powered. You wrote that i should think before asking for better balance.

When other people in this thread agree with me, others posted that the ESL players from EU said themselves that the necro/thief is a lesser team comp.

If you wanted to say that EU is just better, that would actually be a better argument/debate. Instead you and another decided to act like i have no idea what im talking about but im using the actual things said by the people doing the play by play.

Im literally taking what i felt i saw, adding in the words of heirux,storm, jebro, said during the event and adding my own comments. You used that toker nearly won a fight against levin as a reasonable answer to use thief. You literally gave toker a golden ribbon for trying his best………………………..

dominik.9721:

I don’ think we need to argue about this, we all know this proven fact

But The Abjured with OE is 1-0

Ohhh ok, ive been on crystal desert for the most part and it was always greatsword and longbow.

Most days there are just small group fights and there isnt alot of zerg battles so when i tested the other weapons they didnt feel as useful especially in a 5 vs 5 or 8 vs 10 on a small server.

Also the DPS is gone since every class gives off a ton of boons now. Ele gives protection and vigor on shouts necro gets it heading out of shroud etc etc etc. If you are not applying boons or is someone on the team isnt applying boons the team comp wont work.

Its why you see condi all over the game, because it does alot of damage and its much easier to reapply.

Wolfric.9380:

You should not balance on casual players but if you sacrifice build diversity for Balance on ESL level you are going to destroy your large long term player base. As mentioned top level play is only a minority. So in the end for a MMO you need both but diversity > balance. But ruined balance leads to OP builds which destroys diversity ^^.
So you need a good balancing/designer team that is dedicated …

Ive found the balance to be less then less over the years even before HOT. In a AG tourney there was a staff/conjure ele who won a 1 vs 1 vs the OP d/d ele. They nerfed conjure weapons so another build went out the door.

I truly do not know how or why they balance certain things the way they do. All i know is you cant cater to the ineffectiveness of certain players. Example, in the NBA they want to change the free throw rule. 99% of the former players and current players dont want it changed. They will change it for the viewers of the game.

Instead of telling the players to get better at free throws they are trying to make it easier for the bad players. A better example was the 3 point line change in 93-94. They shortened the distance by 2-3 feet. What happened was it was to easy for the pro players. They changed the 3 point line back the next year.

Im not sure about you but in regular ranked games, who ever the better player are win not matter the class. At the ESL level from what i saw, all anyone could talk about was the mesmer to thief aspect and imo the necro be lesser then the warrior. Cant have that in a actual PRO LEAGUE.

Jelzouki.4128:

Another thread where you showcase that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

The only reason Astral stayed as close as they did in points is because of their Thief.

How do you figure? Those decaps were huge plays man except when he couldnt decap like on kylo. He also couldnt bring +1 to win fights such as temple. They actually lost the fight he +1.

Seriously think about it, many people there called toker the best thief in the game. He had little to no effect because TCG didnt run thief and im pretty sure they did ok. Jebro asked Levin if it would of been better had they basically ran a better comp.

I didnt ask that, lastly you never make any points. You state your opinion which never even has a fact in it. You have 2 teams from NA who prefer thief/necro builds and Eu prefer mesmer and warrior.

The 2 NA teams lost 6-1 and should of lost 6-0. Team PZ did better without the thief. Storm said that team PZ would have a much closer game because he wasnt playing thief. He said it it not me, toker the so called best thief in game. Not NA, not EU but in all of the game cant even give enough decaps or +1 enough fights to give Astral a legit win.

Once again this is me making a thread and you not bringing anything to the table other then you think he did a good job, which he did from the perspective he played a under powered thief class.

Why is it that everyone doing the play by play and interviews are making comments about the thief and necro, as the guys being ineffective from the perspective of the whole match. Not 1 play where nos made a good play or toker but the fact that threw a 12-15 minute game they were not as effective as the player they are countering. Other dude tells me to know what im talking about, i am literally using what the people in the room and the results of the match as criteria so what is your counter argument?

Pvt Frosty.6973:

Thats….simply not true.

Team PZ would have been steamrolled even if they played warrior and mes instead of nec/thief, their comp was awkward considering their personal playstyles and TCG was just simply way stronger mentally/individually.

And Astral Authority did NOT loose because of their comp, they lost because of small mistakes in decisionmaking or r55 executing their decisions better towards the end of each game. Toker actually did a LOT of work, and so did Nos.

Also +1ing the warrior as a thief is fine, but not if you +1 your rev (both of the classes with little condi remove), it can work but its extremely risky (AA was just in a situation where they had to try, and quite franky was just really well played by Texbi).

TCG blowing out both teams also has NOTHING to do with classbalance lol they pretty much played a mirror comp in the finals.

So please, think a little more next time before you try to ask for better balance….

So you are saying there is no coincidence that the NA teams who played thief and necro lost? PZ best game was when muffins got off of the thief.

Also saying they did work is not how you access a situation. Was toker all over the map, yes but he didnt bring anything other then decaps. When he tried to +1 the warrior didnt die and 1 of astral did.

There was multiple times where nos was alone/or in a 2 vs 2 fight without the engy or ele and he straight lost.

Here is the thing too, acting like astral could of won maybe 1 of the first 2 games is crazy. They were not gonna be able to save lord because they didnt have a mesmer and Rank 55 did. You saw the counter TCG had for rank 55 on legacy. Rank 55 also straight beat Astral on Kylo. If anything Rank 55 should of 3-0 Astral on the forest map.

Also your comment about mirror classes in the finals, what is that? Did you read my post? Also they blew out PZ 500-100 in games where as rank 55 at times were actually very competitive. Crazy thing the mirror comp was way more competitive, is that just a coincidence?

As some who has always kind of used rifle and/or hammer. I need to address the fact that most weapons are straight crap. Ive used some screen shots here to show that on maruder amulet, with a shout to give fury and might and the fact im using discpline and the rune of strength. I literally with 10+ might can not do more then 5k damage in a actual match and alot of attacks do less then 1k.

This just doesnt go for axe/ hammer/ rifle for warrior, but all the classes. The Pro League is over and you guys need to make the weapons is this game useful. Im tired of hearing that it needs to be balanced across all 3 phases of the game.

I dont understand how a weapon could be completely useless in PvP and WvW such as axe or hammer but somehow useful in PvE.

I dont know how anyone else feels but i watched the Pro League finals. The Astral and Rank 55 were very good games but i have to say that thief and necro were not very good.

The 2 NA teams tried using necro and thief and PZ simply dropped the ball. But in the Astral case, toker had moments where he did everything right and it didnt matter all he was there for was decaps. There was 3 situations where we was far superior like when he blew up the mesmer (he was rezzed up quickly) and when he engaged levin who was on rev and toker should of had him but simply put the thief class just isnt as good.

Even necro seemed absolutely useless at times. Nos is the past has kept necro viable by simply having the best 1 vs 1 and 2 vs 2 situations but he couldnt do that at all. You heard many times that in the match especially on temple when they had to split apart that the necro needed support help.

I dont know anet plans on how to fix these things but you cant have ESL leagues where you have to use a different class and yet 3 classes seem to be ineffective. Guardian/DH, Necro/reaper, thief/daredevil.

Also i would like to point out 2 things, these were the 4 best teams in the GW2 community and TCG blew out both teams they played. If it can happen to the best players in the game it will happen in ranked games.

2nd is to anet, please balance the game around high level play. The nerf to DH forced the ESL players to not use them which for the most part meant alot of other players in game didnt use them. there also needs to be multiple of builds people can play. It was seriously hard to take it seriously when toker is running from far to mid back to far and the mesmer is just chasing. Maybe there was a build toker could of used to win a 1 vs 1 consistently in that situation. IDK but some of the things in the game just seem ridiculous such as a decap thief that +1 but couldnt +1 a warrior.

Its funny this gets mentioned now but the TOL tournaments were so huge.

I mean even on youtube you had guys breaking down the brackets of who is where and what team could go on.

It was pretty awesome and there was always 2-3 teams that made huge pushes even though everyone knew who the top 4 teams were. So the top 4 teams always made it to the top for but the teams running 5-15 were jumbled up and mixed.

Who knows why they did the Pro Leagues the way they did. I havent checked the AG scene but it just feels like a after thought now.

fishball.7204:

kdaddy.5431:

No definitely not, this is probably just my way of coping with this.

Im trying to look at things from all sides. Ive been in T7 diamond for a good 3-4 days. I its not just zoose. Im getting ESL players on the other team every game i need to get into legendary and this is just my way of telling myself maybe its not my time.

Ive seen these players for years back in solo que and they are a notch above many of us. So i just try to remind myself that its not my fault they are better, its not there fault they always seem to be on the other team. Im also trying not to blame MM even though ive had 4 pips 5-6-7 times and couldnt get the win.

So like Dory said, just keep swimming just keep swimming.

You guys did well considering what you were up against. That symphony guy and tarcis are both amazing players. Even in legend if I vs them it’s a 100% loss lol.

I think you need to start considering blocking/adding these guys to your list so you can q dodge and get into legend tbh.

I feel like they changed the system a bit and even at prestige 16 you can get put against diamonds if the queue is long enough so yeah not very good right now to try get into legend.

No way, i love playing against these guys.

In season 1 i had the same issue, i was 1 pip away from getting into legendary and i had to face team PZ. I quit after that and got into legendary the next day. Then that day i faced 4 out of 5 players from team PZ 5 matches in a row.

I find it alot more fun since the people on my team are actually trying to give it all with classes they know. I would just like to have the Legendary title and rank before consistently seeing them game after game.

But once i do i actually prefer these matches even in a loss.

Israel.7056:

kdaddy.5431:

No definitely not, this is probably just my way of coping with this.

Im trying to look at things from all sides. Ive been in T7 diamond for a good 3-4 days. I its not just zoose. Im getting ESL players on the other team every game i need to get into legendary and this is just my way of telling myself maybe its not my time.

Ive seen these players for years back in solo que and they are a notch above many of us. So i just try to remind myself that its not my fault they are better, its not there fault they always seem to be on the other team. Im also trying not to blame MM even though ive had 4 pips 5-6-7 times and couldnt get the win.

So like Dory said, just keep swimming just keep swimming.

I think that’s a pretty decent attitude to have. Do you feel like you’re getting better by playing in matches like that?

No i believe i have capped in my own abilities. Ive seen these guys for years. Back when we had solo que i would see these guys every game. Like every player who had been ranked #1 in solo que. I was seeing them in the match.

Ive also done the AG scene and the TOL 1-2. Losing to the Abjured and Team Risk (cunning stunts) in those 2. Im pretty sure im better then most but not good enough to compete vs the top 10%.

So like in these 2 screen prints from this season, im just as good if not better as these legendary players.

I was trying to make this thread to show the level difference between just a few players in the game. For instance the screen shots i showed earlier, our other warrior went home. So he had the 1 vs 1 with tarcis, he lost and tarcis had about 75% of his health left and they were running the same build. Now I came with a necro and we rezzed him up. But tarcis and another player was able to drop me, they rezzed me and we killed them both. But we had 3 at home and they only had 2 and literally maybe 1-3 sec longer on no rezzing and they would of gotten the stomps and would of won that fight.

Im getting frustrated but im just trying to remember to keep on swimming.