Guild Wars 2

there are of course counters to it !

- stealth yourself
- move from the points , keep moving until stealth runs out
- try to hinder them stealthing, they have to cluster and cannot attack , if you know you just killed 3 of the nmy team follow them and disrupt their stealthatempt ..

points are ticking for your team that time

To snipe ppl from range P/P => SB all day.
Ricochet change was very nice ( and needed ) but you basicly have to go x/30/x/x/30(20) – but well if you are that deep in trickery you should go for SoH anyway.

You can try something like x/10/x/x/20 and go from there ., but unload without 30 in CS hits like a wet noodle…. so imho 30 in CS is mandatory.

In 1v1 and tPvP i play P/P from time to time, depending on teamsetup ( and nmy classes ) and a really think its > SB in some cases .

Also gets you a BP for those safestomps ( most of the time ).

You can’t instagib a guard, cause he will have Aegis up, which will block the first attack anyway.

I doubt you will be able to “istagib” a bunker ele -

you cannot instagib people who don’t run & specc glass themself.

And if they do, they will hit you as hard as you hit them.

It’s just WvW kitten // stat stacking

my full zerker thief with any spec without 30 points in SA get 1-shotted by eviscerates all the time .

Its WvW kitten and that’s the way it is – you hit hard / you die fast !
In sPvP you won’t see these values .

If you don’t like that specc defensive and run with vitality/toughness gear !

Can CustomArena Starter kits be in BlackLion Chests ?

Please post a vid of your OP spec where you kill a heavy armor golem or a boss in the mists , and i show you that 25/30/0/0/15 will get the job done much faster …

Of course you can heal up yourself and hide better, but this is not a thiefs job ( at least in my teams , i am there to deal dmg , perhaps you have a different position ).

1v1 wise a x/x/30/x/x has more staying power, but in most cases just not the power to kill a full bunker ( or sometimes a halfbunker) , unless TG is up or/and surprise opener.

official.4658:

i love this notion that if you arent a 25/30/0/0/15 thief that you do no damage

its prob. the most ignorant thing ive ever heard especially when im going to have the ability to have a thieves guild every fight considering i can drop a ambush immediatly after they pop the first one

I run a 10/30/30/0/0 spec in pvp and i promise u i will burst more than any other thief in the game and the reason is because of the might stacks you get in 25 into shadow arts im able to stack 10 migh stacks from stealth and pop 2-3 sigs for 20-25 might stacks which will do more damage then any other 25/30/0/0/15 back stab EVEN WHEN IM SOLDIERS AMMY considering im always critting from stealth

Depending on Runes+Utils+Sigils you have around 70-90% critchance with your opener when you use traited steal , i would always go 20% dmg on targets below 50% HP !!!

Also, if you do not belive us, feel free to go into the mists and burst against a heavy armor golem with 10/30/30/0/0 and afterwards with 25/30/0/0/15 or 30/30/0/0/10 D/D fullzerker ( something like this ) .

Feel free to post a vid of your dmg-tryouts.

BlueprintLFE.2358:

Thieves have a trait to blind every time they to stealth, which is/can be every 3 seconds. NOT TO MENTION dagger pistol thieves have a no cool down blind ranged shot that also spawns a spamming blind field, called black powder shot, Infiltrators arrow on shortbow, plus blinding powder utility, signet of shadows….

Hope this was a troll post that just got me to respond otherwise….

Yeah, you know how the Thief’s Weapon Cooldowns are called ?
INITIATIVE ..

Vyxion.6358:

If this is true then we got the laziest lamest and least gamechanging changes out of EVERYONE else. Just a bunch of cd changes?? Come on

Yeah, i thought the same – every other prof gets nice new traits , merges of unused traits etc and we get kittene cd reduction on useless traits !

Only nice change, which may lead to players taking new builds is 20% cd reduction on steal through SoH TRait.

We still have to take 30 in CS to deal enough dmg for our squishiness – they should have made +DMG adjustments through Grandmaster Traits, so we would start to get away from the 30 in CS …. it’s so stupid !

official.4658:

Heres the Back point thief build im working on if anyone is interestd

20/20/0/30/0
2/3
3/10
5/9/10

This is a triple trap build for post patch

the role will be to lay down all 3 traps which you will be able to leave on the point and go mid once someone triggers the shadow trap u will port back with 10 might stacks stleath and fury they will then trigger the other 2 stun and ambush trap which u with then relay down 2 more of the same which is a total of 5 traps procd which will give them 25 vuln. u can then pop thieves guild and you will have 4 thieves out to destroy anyone who decides to fight you

runes will be ogre 6/6
soldier ammy with beserker jewel
s/p(rage/force) sb(fire) as weapon sets
utilities wil be hide in shadows/shadow trap/ambush trap/tripwire or needle trap
and thieves guild for elite

You will dominate anything and everything that comes to fight u 1v1

Cool, you will be able to port-back and hold the point contested unless you die, cause soldiers + not having 30 in CS will lower your Dmg by ~50% ( perhaps even more ).

Once in 3 mins you possibly could kill someone due to ThiefsGuild.

Your support in Mid fights will be meeh , cause you deal really low dmg compared to outher thiefs builds.

I really don’t understand why the kitten they dont implement TeamQueue ?!

It really make me think to quit playing cause in 90% of the cases you soloqueue you lose and play agains a premade .

Is it really so hard to create a seperate team-queue ?

They even have teamnames ingame, and you can sign up as team, so why the heck they dont split ?

Scared of the fact that only 10 teams are left in all EU ?

How about adding some (really) nice ingame items for the top 10 at the end of the month.

And something for soloqueue as well ( perhaps top 100 ) ?

since you already have an account you don’t have to pay to take a look.

I would also say, that much has improved, pvp-wise.

The more players come back the better i will be – but i don’t see a game out there that makes more fun pvp wise ( mmo of course ).

Romek.4201:

lol you cant say cause teldo can beat it its fine^^

teldo is a very skilled player and atm the best 1v1 player out there – he beat just everyone on stream 1v1 and he won this 1v1 tournier
he even win sometimes 1v2 in stream or 1v3 and you cant say cause HE (Teldo) do this ingi is OP cause nearly all ingis i saw till now with this teldo build failed hard.

So plz stay on earth

edit: but the other way most thiefs i saw till now with the jumper build could easly kill ppl just with spam 3

Easy dude, so you watched the 1v1 tourney, right ?
How many thiefs were in there ?
Yeah right !

NGs ( and not only Teldo ) are very strong, of course it takes more “work” – but S/D thief play is also much more then #3 spam – sorry if you really think its enough you should l2p.

Btw, jumper is no noob either – but wouldn’t you agree that a duelseries of two very good player should end other then 100:0 for one of them ?

Zenon.7364:

Lately I saw a L2P episode with Jumper showing how to play his build and basicaly he relies heavily on 3-5 skills. I play an engi atm and HAVE to use between 19-30 skills. Still a thief is certainly not weaker. What does that tell you about thos 3-5 skills? Almost all the utilities and damage is concentrated there which imo is an artificial enhancement of the class that does not fit the design idea.

Lately i saw teldos ( NG ) stream in a 1v1 agains jumper, jumper lost like 20 fights.
It all comes down to your skill.

Sure a S/D thief can be stupid to fight agains, but he is still a theif, and normally has no condiremoval besides s#2 ( takes off 1 condition ).
So as an NG you should not have to much problems ( when both players are on par ).

Of course you have to use more abilies, which perhaps make it a look harder for your, but trust me, you have also a LOT more options.
You , can deal with so much more as an engineer . Thiefs cant.

And of course there is a spot for us thiefs, depending on your Team , and thats very good.

The buff to FS gave us another spot, and you can still play D/P or D/D , but it depends on your teamsetup.

And your idea to make a thief a debuff-only class, WTF ?
Thief is supposed to nuke people fast ( if specced for that ) , and now we can alos spec for buker-punishment -

Who would want to get that taken away to be a debuff class, most likely also from range ?

We are agile melee fighters , with many tricks in our bag, to harass ( interrupt / kill) keyplayers in the other team. This is our spot.

We can also roam very fast to neutralize unguarded offpoints, sure, this could be done by other professions, but if played ( and specced ) right, noone is faster than us.

We really don’t need a “design rework” – we need some traits fixed ( buffed ) so we have other options then 30 in CS , – a few utils should be better ( traps + poison ) , but outside of that we are fine.

We will never be a 1v1 class , and if we 1v1 we have to play it what people call “unfair” – but belive me , i also think it’s unfair when i fight eg, a BM ranger – just saying.

CollegeDowntime.4187:

On a side note: While it is true that most classes have a skill they can use to guarantee a stomp, the thief only has a 3 second CD while others need to wait much longer and sacrifice a utility. Thief sacrifices nothing.

Theif hast to “sacrifice” his offhand slot and, depending on which weapon combination he runs a LOT of inititive !

Also you can interrupt stealth stomps !
And you can time to interrupt blinded stomps too !!
Many other classes have blind stomps too, ( perhaps you just did not notice )

Also do you know how vulnerable a thief is when stomping / ressing ?

It happend many many times that a thief loses more then half his life while stomping and i don’t think we need to talk about thief down state … you lose agains every class ( unless you trait for downfight // funny thing though ,…. ).

And regarding the topic, if many of you , who claim to have been playing “lots of mmos” complain about Stealth in GW2 i feel something is really wrong.

I mean , in any other mmo you could stealth forever, whereas in GW2 you have to “work” for it, and it comes with drawbacks – because of a) the gamemode and b) you need to spend you offensive-power to use it.

Also everybody who has played a little bit of PvP should know what happens when a thief goes into stealth , you see where he heartseekers – and unless he drops another BD and uses HS you KNOW what is coming.

You can also move, or use ( if you have it ) your AE / blocks / protection – whatever.
There are so many options.

If you decide to sit on the point, and don’t move or dodge preemtivly its a l2p issue.

If you sill need a thief :

Name: Lvis
Account Name: Lvis.3824
Rank: 40

S/D was played by a lot of people back then, but then came the Dancing Dagger + CnD Nerf – which basicly killed it.

perhaps these we not brand new players but rather very good players who log into a twink account for playing soloqueue ?

I mean if you as a team of rank 30-50 players ( although rank does not mean skill ) lose to a team of rank 2 /& 4 players its not only the game that made a mistake ?

Would be nice if we could use it underwater !!!!

dzeRnumbrd.6129:

P/P works well in small groups and zergs for single target damage in WvW.

I run this build and play with 25 stacks of bloodlust for most of the night.

http://bit.ly/10YnDqQ

Basically run around spamming Unloads and dodges until they die.

If you get in trouble either Hide in the Shadows, Blinding Powder, Shadow Step or Shadow Refuge (or a combination of them).

I also use Blinding Powder and Heal in the Shadows aggressively to allow time for ini regen and healing – then use Sneak Attack to re-engage just before the stealth expires.

With your setup you lose 30% dmg to targets below 50%HP which is HUGE !!!!
Sure 2initiative all 10 sec is nice, but losing 30% dmg is just not worth it !

sorrow.2364:

1. If he leaves the node to look for the Shadow Return location, he has done what the
Thief wants: he left the node unguarded.

yes

sorrow.2364:

2. Condition Damage doesn’t really matters. Each CnD cleanse the thief for 2 conditions and each Shadow Return remove one condition. Probably he was running Shadowstep also.

He was running SS, and a CnD does matter very much, cause it costs 6 out of 12 Initiative !
Necro did not dodge any key skills, also died with 100% endurance.

sorrow.2364:

3. Fear is useless. It is a condition (so it can be cleansed with any stealth skill with the trait) and also a stun, so it can be stunbreaked. I think that build has enough tools to counter fear.

Its not, once you are feared you need to use a stunbreak / condiremoval skill to end it.
This can only be done by either using SS, or Sword#2 if he used it bevor to “load” it.

sorrow.2364:

4. I don’t think they are useless in tPvP. Look at the video. It was a typical tPvP situation. Someone holding a node while someone else is trying to cap it. The thief succeded. Now, imagine if that Necro was a Guardian (a more tPvP-like situation). Even worse. FS all the day long. Without counting the amazing mobility this build has.

The thief did not succeed, as the necro did buy a lot of time (altough could have been more).
Another player of the necro’s team came for support, if necro would have feared while downed, he would not have been stomped and the teammate could have ressed him again !

And once again the thief in the vid did not use FS/LS … do you people even watch the buffs / debuffs in the vid ?

Ah and btw, why didn’t u use a single Utility ?

Arheundel.6451:

Personally I don’t want to see any knee jerk nerfs like the 40s RTL, I don’t want to see them anymore on any profession, I don’t care about the boon stealing, if Anet wants anti-bunker its’s fine for me, I’m not bunker anyway.

First of all a 1200 range teleport is absurd, for 3 ini it should be max 900 range, I believe a spammable stun breaker should already be enough, second they need to increase the ini cost of FS.

I don’t think to be asking too much

You have absolutely no clue about thief, becuase asking for these kind of nerfs would kill this spec !

Please, instead of QQing here reroll S/D high ini thief and play some TOURNEYSs !!
Then you can come back and enlighten us …

Sure an engage / disengage move is absurd … instead thief should waddle up into grp fights and when he arrives he is dead by random AEs !
Or even better, don’t use Sword at all use SB + P/P .

S/D besides D/P is our only viable weaponset , and its nowhere near OP as D/D was in the old days .
Or S/P when haste + PW was not nerfed.

And seriously if you lose to a thief that ONLY spams s#2 , s#3 the problem is NOT S/D , the problem sits behind the keyboard .

Why do you think other people / professions don’t have problems with that ?
At least it requires a lot of skill to use this specc right and be effective with it .

And if you ( or someone else refers to jumperX ), please link tPvP movies, as Hotjoin really is not valid.
There are so many nwebies , you cannot take this as a reference !

Arheundel.6451:

Yeah right…the rest of the eles are so bad that we don’t even know the difference between water and fire attunement, when I see a thief , I smash both hands on the keyboard and press randomly all buttons on the mouse…but when I see the thief is still alive that’s when I come to QQ on the forum -_-

for all you thief’s so OP QQers – perhaps you should accept that most of your problems come from behind the keyboard

http://www.twitch.tv/teldoo/c/2367904

dovrak.4376:

Initiative is a joke. Get initiative regen from traits/utilities and done. Not sure why I’m discussing this, there are lot of broken mechanisms that people just abuse.

Yeah, go for x/x/x/30/30 for max ini regen together with RFI + IS ( blocking 2 of 3 Utilslots ) .
I will laugh at your dmg , compared to other specs or professions.

You either have high initiative regen OR high dmg.

As a thief you need 30Points in CS ( critical Strikes ) to deal dmg !
Try for yourself if you don’t belive me.

The OP has for sure been trolled in Hotjoin by a thief player double or tripple ( maybe even more ) of his skill level.

The vid he posted in addition to the statement below says everything.

This person never played ( or watched ) a tourney at medicore or better level , bc if he would have, he would understand that S#2 is mandatory for survival .

And using Shadowstep to safestop is all right, it’s like other classes Safestomp abilies, perhaps he just does not know about that ….

Same goes for StealthStomping … you either have to use Initiative for that which most of the times is not there right after a kill / or you use a util, like other classes have utils too.

Also perhaps someone should tell him that Stealth != invulnerability .. a guard can still knock you, a ranger still interrupt you … perhaps you will learn when you reach a highter PvP Rank, but honestly i doubt that when all you do is playing HotJoin and complain about thiefs ….

GTOLegend.4175:

Just make lac. strike a 50%Chance to rip 1 boon since it’s such a spammable move and leave the damage alone. Problem solved

It is not spamable !
You ( and all whiners in here ) should perhaps learn how this skill works !
And, yes its not blockable but dodgeable / blindable / kiteable !

Also, if you have been hit for 9k LS, then you were hit by a GC thief, with +might buffs and most likely had some vulnearbility stacks on you.
Also you had less then 50% health and would have died anyway.

If you really think thief’s sword abilities are broken feel free to reroll thief and own others .. you will soon realize thakittens now as easy and OP as you think !
And i would be glad to see more of these QQ-thief’s OP rerollers – it’s so funny to kill them in 3 secs while they don’t understand how eg. BP works

Because then the devs would have to balance thiefs around more then 1 1/2 viable weaponsets , which is, most likely , too much for them

whats the purpose of the vid ?
Hotjoin against terribad enemys, most of them where engaged in fights with other people .

If you really think, that

a) S/D thiefs are OP or
b) you think you are skilled as a thief player

then you should post some duel vids agains good players of other classes, and you will soon see in which state a thief is right now.

They really should split the sPvP forum into a place for hotjoin heros who think they are good players and a place for people who actually play tPvP and who have a bit more understanding of the game …

this is just plain WRONG !

S/P and D/D both were and are >> than any P/P spec.
If you really really think otherwise you have absolutely no clue about thief !

just reroll another profession and fight a (good) mesmer , you will see the world through different eyes … belive me, its worth it !

so, why isn’t he in top 1k then ?

WyldKat.4712:

You’re doing something wrong losing to necro. The only time I’ve lost to one in May involved me getting feared off a very high cliff.

Comments like this have absolutely no sense … you cannot just say “heck, how can you lose agains profession X” ….

It all comes down to specs and playerskill !

Which amuet are you using in your D/P 10/30/30/0/0 setup ?
Try with soldiers(+zerker jewel).

Also you should perhaps switch some utils regarding the class you fight ( also elite ).

D/P can kill many 1v1 speccs, however no bunkers ( who can at all ) but it is hard to kill too !! ( unless you don’t realize when to dodge / rupt and retreat )

Rennoko.5731:

Just to build on this shamefully. Yesterday evening I ran into a P/D thief running full Apothecary gear, who stomped on my face twice in a row (yes I was stupid enough to go back and try again). He proceeded to chain laugh on top of my body and jump around.

How do you know he was full Apothecary geared ?
Did you add & ask him ?

Rennoko.5731:

I never like to admit that my current condition build is completely unviable (situationally), but I think against this combo, even ignoring the fact he COULD reset the fight if he wanted, because he doesn’t need to.

Unlike a D/D or zerker warrior, or some other burst build that will occasionally surprise me to dead; even with proper prep. this one seems to be beyond me… Anyone with advise on how to proceed against the above I would appreciate.

Well, realizing that you cannot win against a build thats a hardcounter for your build unless the person who plays it is much lower skilled or geared ?

It’s the same as if i as a full zerker thief with only Condi removal via Heal or SS, would cry about a conditionmancer …

You have to either realize that there are counterbuilds , or try to play a hybrid build / which will then result in very long fights .

A 0/0/30/20/20 thief has not enough dmg to kill you if you run a build thats high toughness + healing yourself !

WonderfulCT.6278:

I like thief harpoon gun skills underwater. I rarely lose a fight with them even though I rarely fight underwater to begin with.

Try other proffesions underwater skills before asking for buffs. Some of them don’t even do anything, I’m looking at you engineer.

Lol, perhaps you should try other professions underwaters kills before posting something like this.

Thief underwater skills are complete junk , and so are also the utils !

You do lose so much dmg when you specc x/30/30/x/x instead of eg. 25/30/0/0/15 .
If you really main a thief you should know that !

Also, in any game we saw a thief playing in the last big tourney ( and even the one before ) none of the thiefs ran 30 in SA, most of them ran 0 in SA.

Why ?

Because in a teamfight you have a role, and this is in the most games the DPS role.
Sometimes roamer, where a 0/30/0/30/10 S/Dx2 can rock the house.

But x/30/30/x/x is more for if you like to play hotjoins / soloqueue – where you cannot include your team most of the time.

And the Might in stealth is nothing compared to 10% when target has a condition + either 10% with bundle, or perm 5% dagger dmg.

The might you get brings you on par with the 250base attackpower you get from DA.
And you won’t be able to hold the mightstacks that high normally.

Why should a non twink acc player who is rank 10 come in the same bracket as rank 40 players ?

Given the fact that MMR is working correct ?

Makes no sense.

So basicly , if you have a battle of red team with 5 r30 players, and blue with 4 r30 and 1 rank 5 you can be sure that the r5 player is a twink account.
Or MMR is bugged.

in EU there are qtimes of ~ 2 mins max, most of the time instant invite.

Rank doesn’t say anything, when will you ever learn.

I eg play on 2 other accounts for soloq, because i dont want to lose rank on my mainchar, do i play worst because the other 2 accounts are low rank right now?

I doubt it.

They only need to seperate solo from team queue and the game would ROCK !!!

Once again a classic QQ post from someone who doesn’t have a bit of understanding about the classes.
You see what others possibly have and want it for your class, ofcourse without losing anything that makes you own class strong.

XII.9401:

New Healing mechanic:
Introduce gap closing mechanic:
Thieves have shadow step with no cooldown on their sword though they don’t need it with the stealth mechanic and 25% movement speed. The least that can be done is give us a fast gap closer on all melee weapons. The buggy GS 5 won’t do. It is very slow, can be interrupted or dodged. It is also buggy. Give us a ground target AOE gap closer like shadowstep. Introduce pulls such as scorpion wire.

This SS requires them to use Sword in one weaponset + the step has a Cooldown if you want it that way, its 15 sec, or you have to use ShadowReturn which will then cost 5ini in combination.
And sure thiefs don’t need it, they dont need anything because they are so OP with their 12k backstab combo and their Clusterbomb spam.
And the auto condi removal and and an.
They way you describe it, you must have seen a 30×5 thief with 3 weaponsets and 10 utility slots ….

The Sword /x thief, with 25% movement speed, stealth, shadowstep and scorpion wire ( also LOL because of random dodges, blocks , stability and other misses or just not working ) is clearly doing the Dmg that a warrior does ! sure …

XII.9401:

introduce 3rd or ranged weapon set:
Eles have 4 and Engys have up to 4. This won’t be a game breaking mechanic and will increased the skill cap for the class and make it more versatile.

Once again, if you would have at least a bit of understanding how ele works, you would not say something like that.
Ele has to chose one weapon set ( staff not really viable right now ) out of basicly D/D or S/D .
And a 3kit engineer, although it can be very strong, will lose much to achive that ! (eg. wont have a stunbreaker , no stability ) and
dont even try to compare their “skill” to the skill the basic noob GS + A/S warrior shows us everyday in hotjoins….

XII.9401:

Add useful reactive buffs: Stability or protection:
We need protection. Toughness/vitality melts against burst dps/condi as opposed to protection. Eles, guardians and rangers are more tanky than us. Don’t be afraid to balance the scales.

They are more tanky if they go tank, warriors could also go tank, but they will lose their Burst-ability, like these classes do too.
You would have to use a bleeding 2nd set, but you won’t achive their dmg level while beeing tanky.

Therefor you have some CC ability with Hammer which Ranger / ele lacks.

But this is due to the profession philosopy.
Some classes are better for certain aspects , a Ranger / Ele / Guard or basicly no profession could ever reach the dmg capability a full zerker speeced GS + A/x warrior has !

XII.9401:

New Debuffs:
Your criticals immobilize. Snare is useless as it can be dodged out of etc. Chill as well. Weakness on critical.

Something turns out OP? Hey..np..nerf it back. Whats the worst that can happen? Warriors get a spot light like mesmers/guardians/thieves since launch?Eles? etc.

Do we play the same game ?
Warrior in the beginning were real monsters, but somehow all the good warrior players left leaving only QQ and bad players, which clearly have no idea how to play as a warrior.

But yeah dude, give the warrior all the good stuff from 4-5 other professions so even the greatest noob can oneshot anything, and if, for some reason it would not work – just teleport out, go into stealth and switch to your 3rd weapon set giving you stability + protection and heal up to full ….. but even then you would come here and QQ about something else.

As a tip, please reroll the classes you think they are better than yours, and play a bit, you will see that the grass is not alwayas greener on the other side.

McFribble.2349:

(I want to begin by saying I am NOT a massively experienced player, and I am fine to admit that unlike 99% of this board. But I HAVE actually played a Thief to 80, and have participated in PvP as one, which counts for more than most of the people screaming for nerfs)

It is clear that no one is happy about the class. On one end you have a lot of annoyed players who want to pull their hair out trying to fight a Thief due to the nature of the class: being annoying.

Unfortunately, that is all Thieves really strive at, leaving the other end of the spectrum not feeling powerful enough to “finish the job” without the need to run away. Now, I have only really played D/D Berserker Thief (10/30/30/0/0), but I can agree with both sides of the spectrum, which all boils down to one thing: Stealth.

I’ll start with the nerfs:

- Stealth Reveal needs to be upped to 4 seconds again. There is no denying how easy it is for a Thief to pop in and out of stealth, and it is insane to think Thieves should have one fairly easy escape button, let alone 3+ (I didn’t say guarantee, just easy). Some builds can cheese stealth to the point where it is almost impossible for even a group to kill a single thief (granted, the thief won’t be killing anyone either, but this shouldn’t be a problem for ANY group against a single class). By increasing Reveal to 4 seconds again, there is a bigger window for someone to actually pull a few hits against Thieves before he disappears. Again, you SHOULDN’T be walking away with little risk in group fights by yourself.

- 1 or 2 seconds docked off the stealth from SR. There isn’t any reason for this skill to keep someone hidden for as long as it does. Otherwise, no changes.

- Healing from Stealth needs to be toned down (healing in general needs a nerf across the board). Why Hide in Shadow is the best healing ability a Thief has is still beyond me, and all the other healing abilities seem useless in comparison. Hide in Shadow needs slightly less healing done upon activation (I’d say roughly 10%). If a Thief wan’t fat heals, he needs to trait for them.

Buffs:

- Since the Thief no longer has a “burst” heal, the trait that allows Thieves to heal while in stealth should get buffed to compensate. Increase each tick by 10%

- Weapon SKill 3. Give the Thief the choice between the Dual Weapons Skill, or the Primary Weapon Skill if he would wield only a main-hand weapon. Nothing in dire need of attention, but could open up some new builds.

- Dagger Main Hand: INCREASE Poison time to 3-4 Seconds, keeping the damage the same. This will reduce healing on the target for longer, allowing the less bursty Thieves that we currently have still able to still go toe-to-toe with his target, preventing them from healing through all the damage dealt. Since the Thief won’t be popping back into stealth as often, this will help remedy that lost DPS as a result.

Again, I am an entry level player to GW2, only recently getting into the PvP scene. I do honestly think turning D/D Thieves into a DPS/Heal Denying class can make it viable again outside of UPlevel ganks. I know Thieves are basically useless without Stealth, and they fear being nerfed into oblivion. Just know, as a fellow Thief, my intentions are not to make us an easy kill. But I do have little experience with other builds, so please let me know if these suggestions harm (fairly) other playstyles.

- Revealed is 4 sec in tPvP , it was only changed back to 3 in PvE + WvW .

- HiS is the “best” heal in terms of raw healing because it has double the C/D of the other heals we have access to !
And the other heals are not useless, it comes down to you build, as a S/D player you can take withdraw for even more “mobility” .

I for myself use SoM becuase i play heavy Sigil orientated currently, this Heal gives me much more then HiS. Because i also have access to Stealh using pistol offhand… so you see it all comes down to your specc / playstyle.

- #3 skills, well not sure, but it would be nice to have some more options, because S/P and P/P #3 are really bad !

- inc. poison time on D #1 would be really nice, but i doubt it will happen.
Poison is really strong, however you must also think about the enemy , for him its really a bane to have i perm on him.. i rather would like to see something done with our poison utils.

- D/D is a burst specc, if you want to be a “heal-deny” class you could specc for heavy Shortbow usage + poison dmg.
Somehow, much toughness and condition dmg.
And second weapn set you would use X/P, do deny that heal / Skill usages with headshot.. dunno / check it out.

.. best thief on your server ? Man there must really only be bad thiefs playing on your server ..

You do realise thath you only need to hit BP field ? you can heartseek in and out and still get the “proc”.

Also, what did this vid show us ?
Nothing you weren’t even able to kill an engi in 1v1 … clearly thief needs some more nerfs.

Your max attacks hit for like 5k , thats it ?

Blind op? Only vs other melees that are stupid enough to stay in the field, and even then you will lose a straight up 1v1 vs several other classes if you would just spam BP and hit him while he hits you.

Yeah, 1v1 ladder and you wouldn’t see a single thief in the top 1000 – i swear …

TheGuy.3568:

TL;DR

Thief is OP in WvW but so UP everywhere else that nerfing it makes no sense. Boost other classes capability to deal with thieves mobility and stealth and allow thief meta to stay as is for the time being. If they do nerf then buff other things in the right way to compensate.

Also if you are going to comment (ie attempt to start a war) read the whole thing please. Thank you.

I read all of your post, but won’t quote everything because it will lose readability then.

You really think thief is OP in WvWvW ?
Then you should define your sight of WvWvW – what you mean ?
Zergs running against each other ?
Or 1v1 .

1v1 is no WvWvW in my eyes, and to be honest, a thief will lose nearly any 1v1 against any other profession if the players are on the same skilllevel and specced for dueling.

Problem is, that many many people just run around in full zerker or some zerker, and these builds will get nuked by a thief.

But thats about it, as soon as a professions does specc + gear for 1v1 against thief, thief has an uphill battle.

And about mobility, it is, aside of stealth, the profession defining “ability” .
And there are professions like Ele / NG / Ranger and even warrior who have nearly ( if not better ) mobility, IF they want to have it.

Thief has to invest in mobility too !!!
We do not get anything for free !

I really don’t understand why you always try to forget about that, we had a discussion about thief condi removal vs warrior condi removal if you remember.
It was the same, thief OP everything “passive” for free and so on … it’s just not the case !

What do you mean by thief meta btw?
You mean playing GC D/D spec and waiting for the right moment to strike, and otherwise sitting there and spamming SB in the groupsfights?

Or do you mean the new S/D Fotm, which doesn’t have a real spot either ?

I also don’t see why you think other classes need more abilities to deal with a thief, what abilities to you need.
An i-win-button ?

Seriously , you stated you were a thief player, you should go and play some tourneys, or 1v1 as a thief, this will
hopefully adjust your sight of the current state….

Nettle.9025:

Honestly I’d suggest getting help from a teammate. This thief, like every other, is susceptible in team fights where they are focused by multiple people or where aoe is flying around everywhere.

This argument is just not valid, a full g/c DD build with the right teammate is much more devastating .
Also a Venomshare, but i come down too much on with whom you play.

S/D opens another niche for thief in tPvp, but i am still not convinced that you will be able to kill a same-skilllevel player with a hybrid specc in 1v1.

S/D default is quite vulnerable to conditions, sure you can IS/SR all the time, but this will only cleanse 1 condition and your dmg is 0.0 while doing so.

Of course you dodge a lot, but there are traits like guards burning on block which you won’t be able to dodge.

And this will give you a hard time, also area targeted , or on crit /bleed/burn skills will hurt you a lot.

You basicly only have your signet of agility, and this will also only cleanse 1 cond, when there is nobody around .

If you run Lyssa you have another 45sec ( the best ) condi cleanse, but its also long recast, and defines your elite + runes.

Have you tried D/P as second weapon set ?

I know and watched jumpers build / stream, and its quite “fun” – but there are times when a well placed HS ( or 2 ) can finish the fight.

Also BP→HS when you need to get away , or just BP for stomping support.
Also HS is very good mobility as you don’t run SB.

The 10 in DA can easily be exchanged, Heal on Steal is okay, but not that much, same goes for the dmg.

You can put them in Trickery for 3 more Ini + either more dmg after steal or 5% dmg from behind/side.

Also sometimes, 10 in SA is not bad either, for eg. condi removal or the blind , other options might also be possible.

Much of “did we become weaker / stronger” comes due to the people you are fighting.

There a times / games i feel like a god, and then, the next game you don’t get anything off.

Really depends on the nmy’s speccs /& professions.

But more and more people go to defensive specs, which means that you as a ( if you do so ) default GC D/D specced thief feel like you “are weaker”.

Its really a shame that one cannot change amulets / skills in tPVP games, would add so much more to the game !!!

TheGuy.3568:

Tl;DR

I doubt you’ll read the entire post since you didn’t read my first post. So I highlighted the most important part. Now please leave. I will also ignore any subsequent post by you since they are not worth the effort and no one was looking to flame here.

I’ve read your post, perhaps you should read it again… you imply, to people who don’t know thief class, a very particulat image.
Which is just not true.

And if you as a warrior want to trait /& specc for condi removal you have also a lot of options.
As eg. Varonth showed you.

Also, i did not judge you and / or your play, so you should not do that either, you don’t know me or my gameplay.

I think i have way more experience on my thief then you, and 20 acrobatics is certainly not needed.
Perhaps you are a WvW fanboy, i was talking about tPvp.

And the “tanky”-setup was an example, regarding the traits + utils we thiefs have for condi removal, paired up
with as much dmg as you could get with the points left.

If you, as you stated know the thief, you should know how much dmg lies between these two specs, and if you
spec 20 in acorbatics it won’t change anything.

Taking condi-removal costs dmg, and not too less.

Travlane.5948:

what is the best way to record WVW action? NO VIRUSES and free download/easy to use

http://obsproject.com/