Pve Patch i believe no pvp stuff till march 18th
aka the “pls dont leave” patch
GW1 had “Observe”. What it was, was a recording and replaying of game information, displayed in the game client. It recorded the positions of all players, their movements and actions, etc. This data could then be transmitted to players to view in their game clients, allowing dynamic viewing angles as if the player was actually there. It was a fundamental game engine consideration (afaik) from its inception, and used for development/debugging purposes (source: Patrick Wyatt blog http://www.codeofhonor.com/blog/scaling-guild-wars-for-massive-concurrency). GW2 doesn’t have this system at all. Some devs have mentioned this is due to technical limitations with the 3D nature of the game (GW1 was effectively 2D) and physics/gravity/whatever. The GW2 spectator functions by simply adding viewers as inactive participants to the game server as the game is active. This means the game state information must be transferred in real-time to all participants/viewers, and this is where the bottleneck occurs.
There has been no indication anet has the ability/resources/intent to implement a game state recording feature, in the near future or ever.
(edited by milo.6942)
Its just bad design
They should give character size special attributes. If you are bigger, then you get 5% boost in power or something. Maybe if you are smaller you get knocked back further etc.
thanks for suck suggestion bye
thank my boss
The fundamental game mechanics stayed largely the same. Personally I was hyped about the game at first, and slowly lost interest. I think it has to do with combat simplification when compared to GW1. The game has also changed, and introduced grind ascended items, and gone directly against its own principle of “no grind BIS gear”.
More skills means you may have to change your build. Changing your build means possibly changing your gear. Changing your gear after already grinding through one Ascended set? I can already feel the rage echoing from the future.
I think Anet might have screwed themselves here.
good point
It just adds complexity with not much gain.
Balancing MMOs is very hard to do. They have to account for 3 game modes. WvW, PvE, and sPvP. I know I know, split the modes. However, that makes the process of balancing twice as long. Anet is also very much against wack a mole. So they take things slow and test them out. Warriors are probably their favorite example. Everyone demanded warriors be buffed, that they were useless, etc; for 6 months. Six.months. Then around the necro buff hambow comes into play and its now one of the most OP builds.
Yea I remember that. But doesn’t that also speak to the amount of time it takes for changes to happen? You say yourself, 6 months.
Another thing to note is how wildly the meta swings when they do release updates. It seems like large infrequent updates change the meta drastically and then it sits that way for months and months until a new patch drops.
I quit the game because there’s only dps and tank. There’s little room for utility playstyles, no debuff or disabling playstyles that act as enablers for your teammates to win. I think as a consequence balance is on a razor’s edge, with damage in and damage out being the main 2 variables. Who can kill who and how fast before help arrives? If you can’t win run or die, respawn, repeat. Balancing around that doesn’t leave much room for errors.
edit: to say it more simply: It’s not that balancing mmos is hard, it is, but it’s especially hard here because there are basically 2 roles: kill or live, spread out over 8 professions. There isn’t enough diversity built into the game to cushion balancing errors.
They did do changes in those 6 months. Engineers got nerfed, other specs got buffed and nerfed, eles had some major changes, etc.
You state the reason you quit the game, fixing that reason is no simple matter. People need to realize this isn’t just a number issue. This isn’t something they can fix in a couple of months. It is a mechanic issue. The way the skill mechanics are made and set up is whats keep the game down. It’s whats hurting build diversity, it is whats causing the skill floor and skill ceiling to be so low, and it is one of the main reasons why this game will probably never go esports.
I agree this game isn’t suited to esports.
However, it would be greatly improved by intelligent and more frequent balance patches. There probably exist enough core mechanics to sustain proper pvp, but they are underutilized in favor of raw number bumps, always in line with dps in and dps out paradigms. This is probably due to pve and wvw design considerations, as you’ve said. My point was, given the situation, and given the limits, the best course of action would be to balance more frequently and split skills for spvp.
Balancing MMOs is very hard to do. They have to account for 3 game modes. WvW, PvE, and sPvP. I know I know, split the modes. However, that makes the process of balancing twice as long. Anet is also very much against wack a mole. So they take things slow and test them out. Warriors are probably their favorite example. Everyone demanded warriors be buffed, that they were useless, etc; for 6 months. Six.months. Then around the necro buff hambow comes into play and its now one of the most OP builds.
Yea I remember that. But doesn’t that also speak to the amount of time it takes for changes to happen? You say yourself, 6 months.
Another thing to note is how wildly the meta swings when they do release updates. It seems like large infrequent updates change the meta drastically and then it sits that way for months and months until a new patch drops.
I quit the game because there’s only dps and tank. There’s little room for utility playstyles, no debuff or disabling playstyles that act as enablers for your teammates to win. I think as a consequence balance is on a razor’s edge, with damage in and damage out being the main 2 variables. Who can kill who and how fast before help arrives? If you can’t win run or die, respawn, repeat. Balancing around that doesn’t leave much room for errors.
edit: to say it more simply: It’s not that balancing mmos is hard, it is, but it’s especially hard here because there are basically 2 roles: kill or live, spread out over 8 professions. There isn’t enough diversity built into the game to cushion balancing errors.
(edited by milo.6942)
Hotjoin exists with ancient server interface because they want to make this game into an fps
…for how slow it is to balance pvp?
I don’t play anymore, but it seems like everyone has been pretty fed up with warriors for months. Maybe I’m wrong?
I don’t think many people fully understand that this is not a benefit in any way to pvp players, as OP explained. If we are objective and cynical about the situation, the conclusion is: pvp rewards are being reset to allow $$$ → gems → items in pvp.
If we are slightly less cynical we can say this will facilitate pve → pvp player flow, as well as pvp → pve player flow. There is nothing wrong with this in principle.
What about people that are high-ranked dedicated pvp players? Now their hard-earned skins that used to show prestige can be bought with gold… So they have gained, what, exactly, from all this? The ability to visit pve with skins other players have had for a year now?
I can’t for the life of me imagine anet would risk their precious economy. I don’t see it likely that pvp-earned rewards will be made sellable all of a sudden. Their wording lacks any details, and I wouldn’t put it past them to make the skins account bound “well hey, they’re still greatly valuable to your alts…”
Ah, but don’t worry, soon you can add “gold leechers” to your list of complaints.
Well isn’t this a fine kettle of fish. In SPVP Players often abuse the spectate feature to get wins for achievements. If the reward is based on wins people are going to be flipping sides faster then I blink. As well and please correct me if im wrong, they are removing rewards now and " sometime " in the future will put new content in to replace them? I think we have all heard that song and dance before…
I was so pleased when they put the universal level scroll in as I have already made one of each profession /race and can use my pvp glory to level any new char I create just for the armor style they can wear. Now its going to a 3 ring circus of people spectating to switch to the winning side and others hard raging at their team mates for a loss. And lets not forget " sometime in the future" they will give us new rewards for winning.
Really ANET please don’t take away only rewards that have some value until you have come up with something good to replace them.
That brings up a good point I hadn’t thought of
Hotjoin will be brimming with leechers
Either they reward only the winning team as you’ve said the “casual” hotjoin will become musical chairs even more so, or if the difference in gold reward is minimal then there’s absolutely no reason not to leech & idle matches.
I stopped opening chests because I was getting either a full inventory or carpal tunnel
5 main issues with pvp atm as I see it:
1. Lack of game modes. Sure we have different maps but it is the same form of basic game play – conquest. This is the main issue I believe.
2. A total disconnect between the pvp dev. team and the pvp community. I do think the pvp devs actually listen to the community to a degree. However either they A. Completely disagree. Or B. They do not have the resources, time, or do not care to act.
3. The player base. Peruse these forums and mainly all you see are complaints and rants. Some justified but most are not. As a whole it would seem that no matter what the devs do “we” will never be happy.
4. The matchmaking. I can’t fully comment upon this except to say that as the pvp population declines this issue will only get worse.
5. Balance. The amount of time it takes to correct obvious problematic specs is another major issue. See point 2.
The general negativity being expressed, whether rightly or wrongly, will only breed more negativity in the form of results, perceptions, and experiences. Ask yourself this – if you were a new player or new to pvp and you came to this forum would you be encouraged to play?
In the end the pvp devs are not solely to blame for the rapidly declining pvp population. We as a community share much of the blame. But as it stands atm pvp in GW2 has become rather bland due to us only having conquest mode.
Per the OP’s question (and I qualify this because when I play I play at random hours) the pvp community after NA “primetime” is abysmal.
tl/dr – pvp in GW2 is kittened.
good post, rare objectivism in these forums
but think of the poor casuals
what would they play?
little tear
dev1: PvP is in a bad state.
dev2: Yea it is, but that’s because it doesn’t earn any money like pve does.
dev1: What if we allow players to buy in pvp with gold so pvers with fat wallets can look pro?
dev2: That’s pure genius! But doesn’t that lower the integrity of pvp?
dev1: There is no one left to care!
It’s unlikely they will allow elite slot to hold utilities, would make it seems like elite skills really are inferior to utilities then.
If the only reason why people use elites is because they cannot put an utility skill in this slot, then it would mean something is really, really bad with elites.
And frankly lot of elites (…most of them, even) are inferior.
Yes it’s common knowledge, but if anet makes it so you really can take another utility in place of elite then it’s like they admit a fault and I don’t see that happening. They’d probably try to fix elites or add new ones instead.
Wow what a bad post. None of this is true.
- Game launched with Guild vs Guild battles and was named “Guild Wars”… despite what gets repeated ad nauseum on these pve forums, GW1 was advertised as a game focused on pvp and that’s why it had the name it did.
- The entire paragraph about “guildsecrets” is totally incorrect and misguided. The GvG ladder is active to this day (with more people than current gw2 spvp maybe even) and as the other poster said all top GvG matches are on public observe for all to see.
First of all, thanks for proving how bad the internet can be by your personal attack. Your a shining example how not to discuss things in a civil and mature way.
But from the Wiki:
‘The name of the series comes from the Guild Wars, a series of conflicts between Tyrian guilds which led to decline of humanity and allowing the charr to invade and eventually retake Ascalon, and other events of the first series of the games.’If you would have been a bit more mature I would even looked up one of the many quotes off Arenanet officials confirming this fact.
It wasn’t a personal attack at all, your post was just brimming with misinformation
I’m aware that GW2 has retconned the GW1 origins (especially, but not limited to, its pvp heritage) but the facts of the original remain. I don’t especially care to debate the source of the Guild Wars name, but I like to at least give the other, more common-sense, explanation (name directly linked to promote gvg). Anyway it remains that the rest of your post, as I’ve already mentioned, is very uninformed.
Simple reply is that this game doesn’t have GvG. It is not a feature in the game and officially it doesn’t exist.
Also, knowing how this thread likely go. The name guildwars has nothing to do with GvG, but with the historical event the guildwars, that happened before the timeline IN GW1.
I know a lot of people want an official GvG, but I’m somewhat doubtfull bout how desirable it is. The reason is what happened with GvG in GW1. At start it was pretty popular. but eventually some guilds got better then others. So everyone wanted to be into these guilds and they only took the best cause they could choose. So those guilds only got better. this limited the amount of guilds big time. The tactics for being succesfull where often guildsecrets and kept within the guild. So the knowledge kept very confined within, this resulted in either more guilds leaving the format. In the end there where bout 10 succesfull GvG guilds left and the rest gave up and moved along.
In the current game we have some very good e-sport competitions, but they are not bound to guilds. This promotes groups forming on occassion and that the tactics to win are more spread around.
By the way, besides your own organized GvG, your guild team can participate in those tournaments as well.
Wow what a bad post. None of this is true.
- Game launched with Guild vs Guild battles and was named “Guild Wars”… despite what gets repeated ad nauseum on these pve forums, GW1 was advertised as a game focused on pvp and that’s why it had the name it did.
- The entire paragraph about “guildsecrets” is totally incorrect and misguided. The GvG ladder is active to this day (with more people than current gw2 spvp maybe even) and as the other poster said all top GvG matches are on public observe for all to see.
The regular skills are already over the top so the elites can’t be too much stronger, especially given the lack of an energy mechanism to balance skills with: it’s all through cooldowns. (which is lame)
It’s unlikely they will allow elite slot to hold utilities, would make it seems like elite skills really are inferior to utilities then.
Besides, why do you want to play a massively multi-player online game solo?
Well that’s his business, and many people do
I apparently left out adding heroes for pve only
you already mentioned it, and it doesn’t change anything
They will never add this. There is already trouble with large events and lag, and recently some summonable AI have been nerfed because of server issues in large fights.
Well good luck with that spvp..
As a general comment about the destruction of LA in GW2 I really don’t have any feelings about it. It feels like a manufactured crisis, and it doesn’t interest me.
Nah ;D , i think for GW1 players, special place was Kamadan aka Spamadan not LA xD
Kama was the “modern” gw1 city where everyone was (is). LA was the “old town” where you’d arrive and hear the music and immediately remember doing the epic villainy of galrath quest for the first time ever being way underleveled and under geared but loving it anyway.
I loved gw1 I only played for 3 years. I loved Lions Arch and Eye of The North sooo much. I loved seeing everything about LA, this variation ( and yes I read the books) has such a gross and flee market feel. I hope that pyscho sylvari blows it all outta the water. And brings back the ruins of LA from the depths. Maybe she saw a murssat/ or kilbron… And it drove her looney. Just as long as that aweful designed city get blown to bits! But that’s me… I’m one lowly player.
It’s actually quite a nice city, but it’s not the Lion’s Arch I know. A lot of the environment designs are really top notch, but it’s like they’re from a different game universe.
Of course it would be a good idea, and of course it would promote teamplay and give players a sense of supporting each other, so naturally it isn’t coming to gw2.
The reason why it is called sPvP is because it is structured, and not the only form of PvP in our game.
PvP = WvW + sPvP in the world of Guild Wars 2.
Allie maybe it is a slow day for you, but you are only feeding trolls by posting in this thread
It’s a user error. They rushed and didn’t read what they were doing. Do you want a confirmation box for the confirmation box?
Or just a background color like red that screams read me
Available soon from gemstore: early access pass to canthan lands
guild wars 2 doing P2W (sprocket mining pick)
I’m pretty surprised there’s been no backpedaling from anet on this issue. I suppose they’re hard-up for money then. Their gemstore monetization / living story scheme is starting to implode now. Should have stuck to expansion model.
my joke is not weird rude
a blonde girl walk into bar and she say hey bar man give me drink he say no you are blonde the end
I think the bigger problem is that your armor looks like it’s made of cheap plastic.
They nerfing instanced content to get people into open world champ trains or ls.
They should nerf every other class. But they don’t want to split skills. So if they nerf everything then the pve crowd will be super kittened. But they could split pvp skills. But they don’t… for reasons.
I thought eotn was quite fun, but I didn’t much like the dungeons
-Guild wars? Really? Siriusly? Why the name is guild wars? There is nothing like a “guild war” here
Read the lore, then answer yourself.
lore was added to give backstory to gvg
Here’s a little secret, but all the lore was made up to provide backstory for the game. This may shock you, but none of it is real. It never actually happened. It’s all a story.
yes… what’s your point
-Guild wars? Really? Siriusly? Why the name is guild wars? There is nothing like a “guild war” here
Read the lore, then answer yourself.
lore was added to give backstory to gvg
NO and don’t mention anything about gw1 ever again where devs can hear you.
GW2 main problem: the endless list of differences from gw1.
Strongly agree with OP. Vayne is in here again talking about how it’s the player’s responsibility to “be social” but he completely ignores basic human nature. An mmo game especially should provide some kind of backdrop or reason for you to contact specific people and to form communities based on mutual needs “I scratch your back you scratch mine”. There needs to be some reason for people to seek out other people. Once that’s done you can begin to have more meaningful interaction that goes beyond what you need in game and you can make friends. But if any schmuck can fill your party slot and even a monkey could do it then there’s no reason for you to begin to care about who is in your party because you can just get the next guy to fill the slot too.
To me, this has been the biggest downfall of eliminating the trinity. Not the gameplay consequences (though they are also noteworthy) but the near complete elimination of individual distinction and proficiency, and the boring interchangeability that replaced it.
This game seems to strongly want to become some kind of mmorpg-fps hybrid. FPS games don’t have roles, but the individual’s skill and proficiency can be quickly seen and praised. Here, everyone just rolls into one huge ball of mediocrity.
So what about all the people who want to play the game and aren’t naturally social. The old way force them to be social even if they’re antisocial and they end up destroying everyone else’s fun. That’s bad design.
Here you can find social people if you want to be social, but no one is forced to. What you’re saying is games should basically tell you who to be. I don’t agree with this.
Forcing people who don’t want to socialize to socialize will lead to some people being forced into something they don’t want to do, and some people refusing to do it and having to miss out on vast swathes of content.
I’d consider that far worse design.
Each class should have a selection of weapons that are more balanced for solo play. 90% of the game is open world communal events. If you want to do dungeons or pvp then it should have been clear from the “mmo” game description that you will be playing alongside other players. This is exactly what op was talking about: This is an mmo where everyone plays by themselves. And it is supremely shallow because of it.
I found myself playing far more by myself in other MMOs with the trinity. I was healing so I was looking at little green bars and not really playng with people at all. If I did well no one cared. If I did badly it was the end of the world.
Yeah it was very social. I’m so glad I don’t have to put up with that crap here.
I think your anecdote is irrelevant, if you didn’t enjoy healing then you shouldn’t have played a healer. Now of course people won’t rage at you for doing a “bad job”, support is mostly inconsequential.
Except people pressure you, if they know you have a healer to play one. It happens all the time. And if no one wants to heal there is no dungeon.
Great stuff. I wish I could do it all again.
It’s all this touchy feely candyland “no pressure” stuff that makes this game so bland. It finds the rock bottom players that don’t want to talk to anyone in an mmo and makes a game for them. Have fun man