Guild Wars 2

Abdulaziz.1496:

musu.9205:

Abdulaziz.1496:

Well, that’d be quite OP in pvp.
also, what Mesmers really need is a new MH weapon that doesn’t suck cough scepter.

What I really think is that the specialization for mesmers wil either give them MH pistol “sloves everything IMO” or changes the existing skills for some weapons.

Mesmers are already pretty good at cc and have tons of dazes and almost every weapon have a cc

it’s funny because mes was supposed to be control role , but ele , war , engi
and thief has far more cc than mes could use(all cc mes have are with long cd) . A heavy interrupt CI build requires daze mantra. It’s sad to see after 2 years people still like to spread rumors about mes.

in pve mesmer is better, it takes nothing for a mesmer to remove all 5 stacks of defiance.
3 clones along with mantra and maybe signet if you really want to spec for cc, not to mention the 1 cc you get from weapons “use sword off hand and it’ll have like only 10 secs cd”

Also, please tell me where I went wrong and “spread rumors about mes”

“it takes nothing "just lol , are u talking about thief? can u read the skill cd , and do u even know that diversion requires some placement of illusion to make it work as 3 times of cc . And such thing is just not happening in most pve dungeons and fractal fight . (all your illusions and a skill slot for mantra so mesmers finally have same amount of cc skills as ele but still less than war , engi and thief . )

Daze mantra is great in pve for defiance removal , vulnerability stack and interrupting some mobs skills in certain situation.So yeah if u want to play something heavy cc on mesmer u have to use mantra because your weapon skills aren’t enough.

about offhand sword ,its 12s cd , 10s if traited .But its just slow and in many situation unreliable. Also with it mes still have less cc than war , thief and engi from weapon set .Its just a pure fact . Personally i never saw ppl complain about cc mesmers do in pvp .
Most are about engi and war ,thief comes second.

MH DAGGER OR SPEAR
MORE CC plz

Abdulaziz.1496:

Well, that’d be quite OP in pvp.
also, what Mesmers really need is a new MH weapon that doesn’t suck cough scepter.

What I really think is that the specialization for mesmers wil either give them MH pistol “sloves everything IMO” or changes the existing skills for some weapons.

Mesmers are already pretty good at cc and have tons of dazes and almost every weapon have a cc

it’s funny because mes was supposed to be control role , but ele , war , engi
and thief has far more cc than mes could use(all cc mes have are with long cd) . A heavy interrupt CI build requires daze mantra. It’s sad to see after 2 years people still like to spread rumors about mes.

i guess we will have to unlock revenant in jungle somewhere first .then revenant will get his own personal mission ,some could be in new zone some will be legend collection across old maps .

Be born from his/her mother like others

new armors or at least make us dye outfit like armor pieces instead of only 4

GinghamLion.3614:

Is that not the same shield ability they showed? I see the hand of a clock.

im pretty sure its not the same skill . even not same color

with trailer video from NCsoft , we could check stuff with more details . so in 02:24 you could clearly see an aoe spell from right side. It should be mesmer’s new skill

Logan will whine about he lost his pants in the jungle ,also will be crying"where is my queen?"
Then Rytlock will summon Gwen….

MailMail.6534:

I think builds that trait into Inspiration are tourney viable. It’s one of my favorite lines. I just think people are lazy and without the desire to work on making interesting builds effective.

I DO NOT DOUBT THAT
My point is we could get some weaker verison of condition removal in different traits lines for different builds and weapon sets.
Like what they did to engi AED or ele fire line trait"Burning Fire"(i know those stuff are still not viable for actual pvp build but a good direction I’d say )
Staying with same build is for sure lazy and boring . But you have to change your build almost completely for inspiration trait line or phantasmal disenchanter. It’s not fun neither.
Let’s say in actual pvp you change your build to counter engi or necro then you find out that’s SD engi or power necro you get kittened pretty hard or your build just ruin their condition builds’ fun completely .Do we really think this is a good way ?

Or anet could change those condition apply traits(many traits like engi IP which works with any random attack.) then I’m fine with limitation of condition removal. It also could add more teamwork space .But for now ,that’s not the case.

4/5 trait lines don’t have condition removal traits . Only dom line has a trait for torch .
It’s clear to see how you get locked to that trait line.
It’s like anet kept trash everything wars have and you guys just tell wars :you have hambow +healing signet +Ire ,it’s your fault not to play it .

Another honest thought tho if anet removes portal from mesmer we would finally have slot for good condition removal skill when you have nothing to do for your team .

Fay.2357:

This. You can’t have it both ways. You’re not allowed to say ‘oh, they should really nerf condition removal stuff, I think it’s too strong…but they should add more things for the builds that just I use!’ Yeah, that’s not how it works I’m afraid.

Let me be clear , in the end best way to go is nerfing those said traits for all classes .That requires a lot of work to redesign and rebalance game . Anet won’t do this in short time .So giving advice to this is almots pointless . That’s why I think anet could buff few traits or weapon skill for shatter builds before they ever start rework other stuff .
I DO NOT WANT ANET DO BOTH WAYS.

Fay.2357:

If you want condition removal, take it, but don’t sit here and make a whine thread about how condition removal is too powerful but you need more of it just in your builds.

Again:any classes rely on different source to remove condition beside utility .This way has bad and good . Its good for build diversity , bad for balance .

I see your point , but you didn’t get mine .We could get some weaker versions of those said strong condition removal traits for other builds than just encouraging more phant AI playstyle or worse :stealth condition applier.

ALso how could it be a whine thread, i gave idea what i thought could be nice addition for mesmer condition removal.If you think those are not needed or op please just say so .

Ross Biddle.2367:

As a Mesmer your best defense against conditions is to not be there when they’re being applied.

Best for is interrupting everything from necro then kill him as quick as possible .Engi could be harder tho.
Overall tell me how to deal with condition added nothing to topic.

Carighan.6758:

Honestly I don’t want all classes to be able to viably remove conditions in a useful manners. Say, 4 out of 8 should be able to do it. Ideally, the other 4 have viable ways to handle enemy boons in some way or another.

In other words, use it to encourage teamplay a bit more. Make people depend on each other.

I totally agree with this .
And i think this is how gw2 condition removal skills were designed at start . Anet put so many stupid condition apply traits in game .Now we got more passive condition cleanse traits and weapon skills .

Fay.2357:

musu.9205:

Did we just give up to ask for useful condition removal traits ?

Is something wrong with the ones we have? Mender’s purity is an incredibly strong trait, especially if you use it with the mantra. The torch cd trait is also very strong, providing a lot of sustained and burst condition removal. Lastly, shattered conditions is massively strong for removal, though it could stand to have a buffed radius.

Mesmers also have some of the strongest cleansing utilities in the game, both for group play and solo play.

Conditions are not a problem for any mesmer that cares to build against them even slightly. It’s your choice not to do so.

As i said I don’t think anet should buff inspiration trait line to begin with .
just look at ele , almost no d/d ele would carry cleansing utility , many classes rely on different source to remove condition beside utility .This way has bad and good . good for build diversity , bad for balance .
I still think best solution is nerf most condition removal trait and condition apply trait .
But for now some mesmer builds do need more reliable way to clean condition.

shattered conditions: you need DE or scepter for keep illusion up also short CD for shatter skill .And even you do that lets say 4 points in duel line 4 in illusion line 6 in inspiration line .What’s your damage source then , I could only see some 1v1 phant builds to out sustain everyone else or some condi troll builds.
DO we need to BUFF those playstyle ? NO

Did we just give up to ask for useful condition removal traits ?
Frankly , I think gw2 pvp needs rework many condition related traits which randomly work like engi’s IP . Also reduce every class’s passive condition cleanse traits like war’s Ire
.
But I don’t think anet will do that in any short time .
So why mesmers still have to suffer this issue for more than a year (the only useful one we got are Mender’s purity and idisenchanter both are for phant build which doen’t need a buff to begin with ).

Also any idea to change this :

give us some master trait that removes boon from foe and clean your condition when interrupting a foe

or a trait that when using cry of frustration , for each illusion duration of conditions applied to you will be reduced by 1-2s

I always feel d/p thief and shatter mesmer are the highest skill ceiling in gw2 , not sure they are most mechanically intensive tho , one note :d/p thief and shatter mes have to take huge risk to land their spike (Comparing s/f ele u couldn’t have spike and stupid invul in same time ). Also they have to somehow build up their damage for thief it’s stealth , for mesmer it’s illusion.
S/D ele might be second .
Like someone said before ,engi could do many stuff that doesn’t mean u have to do those in every second in order to kill someone .If your still don’t understand this :just take a look at actual tpvp shatter mesmer builds check those used traits .There is nothing like engi IP trait which randomly works

Lifestealer.4910:

Simon.3794:

Lol, shatter mesmer top all classes in terms of mechanically intense.

thieves are easy mode, just because they have tons of auto pilot doesnt mean it’s intense.
engi really isnt that great either.
Only thing that come close to shatter mesmer is scepter zerker ele.

ignorant people should really check mesmer forum for once in their life time.

yes because needing to only press one button to nuke half someones health is mechanically intensive. You guys heard it here first brah.

Let’s be honest here , every single class could nuke shatter mes more than half hp with one button which has less than mind crack cd .Not to mention any other class has much stronger auto damage .

And meanwhile u don’t have to deal with any “energy bar”like mes illusion source beside mes . Your cc , spike damage , damage reduce share same source and additionally with different cd and require a certain target also you have to manage position of your illusions. That’s what is called mechanical.
If you are talking about someone in 1v1 server who does start fight with stealth then mirror images +cc wipe you in second .That takes almost no skill i agree .But we didn’t talk about skill floor anyway .

Sublimatio.6981:

But iWarden is still bugged. phantasmal haste doesn’t work on him + it doesn’t attack summoned creatures, like Risen Hunter eagles or mossman wolves

At least now u can actually reflect with iwarden , we cant expect more otherwise anet will break something else .
The real problem now is iwarden still chases random target.

Sadly before you guys try to find some "exploit "way to use this new “feature”(best in tpvp i can see is forcing a guard leave point for secs)
Block skills will also block your phase retreat
Worst is Swirling Winds ,now it totally kittens all the staff skills beside chaos storm .

Kelthien.8593:

yanniell.1236:

What is yours standard combos?

Not much in the way of combos for my build, unfortunately. Standard Mesmery ones (Chaos Storm+Staff 2 for Chaos Armor, try to aim GS 2 through a field if you can).

As far as attack chains go, if that’s what you’re wondering, it’s tricky.

I almost always start in Staff. Beginning battle with a Chaos Storm is so satisfying, and all those interrupts will usually net me 15-25 stacks of Might right off the bat.

Once in combat, I usually test the water with GS 1, since I’m awful at telling who I have targeted in large battles. If it hits and my target is positioned well- preferably with no stability- I’ll do GS 3 (strip boons in case he/she has protection), MoD (I run Bountiful Interruption, so this gives me Might), MoP (damage), iZerker, Mirror Blade, Mind Wrack. Then I’ll tap MoP 2 more times while auto-attacking before recharging.

It’s a nice chunk of burst very quickly

I’m so sad in most case chaos armor doesn’t worth to do that combo anymore.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

AnonMD.7263:

Warlord.9074:

AnonMD.7263:

If you lost once you lost all your Adrenaline and the fight got reset, how’d you manage to not get rekt while building it up in the first place?

EDIT: And don’t Thieves kinda hardcounter Warriors? Isn’t that like, their job?

No. If you get one pushed your bad. Yah all you have to do now is reset the fight and GG you beat a warrior.

Still doesn’t explain my question.

cooldowns.

If his utilities were used to stay alive and he exhausted them, a reset would render him a sitting duck.

Thieves can pretty much hard reset fights by pulling away as soon as adrene is full. once it’s insta-decayed, pop back in while utils are on cooldown and warrior is easy bag.

who has passive play now?

Balance is made around tpvp so far . If you are complaining this i blame anet .

Also run and hit is passive play ?

LordByron.8369:

Elitist.8701:

I hate when ignorant people call thief an easy class, go play the meta DP spec, maybe it was easy back in december but months of power creep have left it worst class in game.

Ranger isnt medium difficulty its easier than warrior ever wkittenter mesmer is onr of the hardest specs in the game.

Elementalist isnt hard to play its faceroll.

Skill floor varies on game mode.
In WWW roaming most beginners rolls thieves and they are effective…
Some of them try an ele and get back to their thief in few minutes

PU mesmer is all but hard to play…. i see that whatever you can counter is not a faceroll and fair
Even shatter is just extreely similar to DD ele….

Ranger atm is just ridiculous.
Pressing 2 every 8 seconds takes no skill.
But hey ……thief can counter it with stealth so its fine.

I wonder why you forgot to talk about engi…. i suppose its a faceroll.

difficulty could depend on different builds .
“but Even shatter is just extreely similar to DD ele.”… i heard a lot of qq about d/d cele ele in pvp is faceroll i never hear anyone qq about shatter mesmer is faceroll in pvp . I might be wrong i guess.
Right now every class got their easy spec to play but in general thief isn’t easy at all (since their easy spec s/d got broken )
By the way usually people who says mesmer and thief are harder is considering skill cap . We could understand that instead of trying hard against each other(well forum works kinda like this way but we can be better human beings i guess)

DeceiverX.8361:

Lol.

I’m gonna say this now.
Ranger CANNOT build the most damage of all of the classes. Especially against thief despite all of the QQ saying they hit just as hard yada yada. Yes, RF has high scaling but the ranger has no boon access under a DPS build and has substantially lower damage modifiers (less than half) of other classes, notably a good burst thief.

The absolute maximum possible damage output on a ranger’s rapid fire is somewhere along the lines of 13-15k if one assumes max stacks in WvW and a 100% crit rate and food. These wild claims of being hit for 20k RF’s could only be the source of a ranger with 25 stacks of might from other people and the target with 25 stacks of vuln.

Thief backstab – not even the combo – can throttle over 20k depending on the foe.
Proof? Here’s mine, to demonstrate how even after the ferocity nerfs these numbers can be achieved because thieves have so many more damage modifiers whereas the power longbow ranger gets a measly traited 20% at absolute best if flanking and at full endurance. See the screenshot below – and that’s on an 80 heavy with no food or stacks.

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

Oh, and such thieves initiate at 2100 range through instant-speed blinking gap closers, which every other class also has access to, many of which also have a multitude of reflect effects, body blocking, inherently high HP/defense, damage immunity, etc. To say RF is overpowered because a full GC ranger gets some predictable and easy to avoid burst damage is just terribly inaccurate, since you can see it coming and can also LoS it through terrain unlike every other melee attack. Are thieves OP? No. Are longbow rangers? No.

Just like I tell people who QQ about thieves being OP, go and play the class/build for yourself, learn it, and then you’ll find out how to beat it. I get a lot of QQ whispers from other thieves I fight when I CnD off of them while they’re stealthed complaining about hacks or lag or some other BS, but ultimately these builds are predictable and in my experience as playing a thief I’ve learned how to beat them fairly easily; they’re easy to counter, and are the source of complaints by players who just simply refuse to learn to get better at counterplaying.

I used RF in heat of the mist on heavy golem and i could do like 10-12k damage with 3-5 stacks of might and ranger rune.
Yeah It’s too hard to learn counterplay just like it’s to hard to roll a ranger and do some test in hotm before claiming something.

Pet related traits still need rework (mostly buff)
RF need A NERF to CD
Shout skills need rework and we need more interesting traits for those skills (could be something like medi guard traits)
Signets might need to nerf a bit like signet of stone shouldn’t let you capture point or it could have a actually cast time .Signet of wild need a bit nerf to damage boost 12-18% should be fine .
Spirit of frost seriously anet should turn it back .
Traps are fine .
Great sword is fine too ,anet could make #4 more push back more reliable though.
Main hand axe is weird now anet could rework #2 skill . It seems they don’t know what they want this weapon do , condition or direct damage .
Offhand axe #4 could apply weakness .

IGN:Nadi Aya
Server: Sea of sorrow
Role: scholar & Tester
playstyle : pve & spvp
Time: hard to tell now

BlackBeard.2873:

musu.9205:

Mesmer: what’s the AA damage ?
why people want every class to be equal in any aspect?
And why anet should make every weapon set with everything ?

Wrong thread?

This is just a request to make other weapon sets besides d/d more viable. Phantaram isn’t asking these weapon sets to be able to do everything, but all of the skills mentioned are sub-par atm, and not really viable. Phanta is asking for buffs so that there are more builds to fulfill specific roles.

Sure, staff shouldn’t be GREAT at 1v1’s, but it needs to be decent because eles can’t swap weapons.

Well i was half joking . Sorry about that .

I agree with Water #1 – Ice Shards Water #2 – Shatterstone Earth #3 – Dust Devil
I think fire scepter is fine but we could make those skills more reliable but less damage or longer CD (we don’t need RF 2.0 yet).

Water #1 – Water Blast : for this one anet could make it work like engi’s bomb so it will acctual heal yourself .
Earth #1 – Stoning : it could be AA chain first hit do low damage with weakness second hit do higher damage on foes with weakness condition.

Personally i just don’t think suggests like reducing cast time and more damage on AA are going to be good ideas in gw2.

I tried some x/4/x/x/6 condi torment shatter builds this week and they are really slow even with ramp stats .Power shatter is just better imho. Also comparing with necro and engi , condi mesmer couldn’t do much for middle point team fight and slow killing killed it as roamer.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

So i guess the issue now is the Range on the Lb (with traits) can hit at 2000yards.

i dont often get enough time at that range to get more than one shot off, unless the target stands still dumfound letting me get max damage hits.
Rf can’t reach 200 yards
nor can all the other skills a Lb uses.

though Balancing is never perfect its a ongoing progression of changes and big changes to a skill can cause balance issues , but under the rules of balance Anet won’t inbalance anything if it ment it would break the game.

currently it all fits into the Balancing rules one vs one other skill ect im sure they will update thing as they go but Currently only the Full zerks are qqing , i realy don’t think anyone that runs some sort of vit or toughness are having any problems with this One Trick pony of a build.

earlier today inWvW somone said is Full zerk mesmer still viable in WvW that made me laugh.

Anet also buffed ranger gs ,it’s crazy easy to swap gs and escape then RF again (not to mention maul easily lands spike damage now )also stealth 3s and signet buff .My personal opinion is that ranger longbow didn’t fit ranger traits and skills well before .Its issue wasn’t lack of the damage .Now anet actually made it work well with other weapon sets and traits etc but also with higher damage .
All we need is nerf to RF CD , the rest will be fine .

Mesmer: what’s the AA damage ?
why people want every class to be equal in any aspect?
And why anet should make every weapon set with everything ?

dancingmonkey.4902:

Rangers got a needed buff to long bow. I like it

What I do not get, is how so many people claim it needs a nerf now, yet offer no reasonable way to compensate the profession.

I played power ranger for wvw roaming before patch and i did like it . And I do know whats needed buff to longbow . Definitely not the damage part .RF need a longer CD , also a little nerf to signet of wild is needed .
I like greatsword buff that’s needed , and longbow needs some interesting traits instead of a plain damage buff .No one likes getting killed or kill someone instantly.Making other classes build around to counter one single button is just insane.

And saying something is wrong doesn’t need to offer something better .This is basic logic.

Zatoichi.1049:

WEXXES.2378:

Zatoichi.1049:

yeah reflect have long cooldowns, but if u manage to reflect a rapid fire only once, im gonna eat at least 50% of my health cuz im full glass cannon too.

You must be really good, because when I get my attacks reflected I either dodge roll or cancel immediately, taking only 1-2 arrows, then down them after 7 seconds or so, which is basically when rapid fire is off CD again.

I play a ranger too. The issue is not how much damage it dishes out, but how very, very, very easy it is to do it.

The class was never a joke, its just not a lot of people, at least the ones that voice their opinions about it, really knew how to play it well.

perhaps I should have said “up to 50%” because of how fast rapid fire is, when its being reflected, its pretty kitten difficult to instantly tell if its getting reflected, and because Im full glass, (full ascended zerker everything) even 3-4 arrows of it will do up to 8K to me. I can dodge or cancel but im still gonna eat 3-4, maybe more, before most likely

Rangers tell us learn to dodge the RF And now they said : when its being reflected, its pretty kitten difficult to instantly tell if its getting reflected, AND
I can dodge or cancel but im still gonna eat 3-4, maybe more, before most likely

JUST LOL SO HARD
which reflect skill is hard to tell i wonder ?
AND do your rangers know there is another classes playing glass build even with light armor .And they do have to manage their burst unlike your one button RF.

Wyrden.4713:

WEXXES.2378:

It’s starting to become apparent that a lot of people don’t think this through.

@The person who said “Just any block, reflect, or projectile destroyer will PREVENT AT LEAST 80% OF THE BURST IF THE SKILL IS USED THE SECOND YOU SEE RF”

Its true. Unfortunately, the auto attack can do almost half the DPS as rapid fire, which has no cooldown, and rapid fire has a 10s cooldown, which goes down to 8s with the trait. Most blocks, reflects, or projectile destroyers, on average, has a cooldown way longer than that, and using not one, but both dodges just to deal with it isn’t okay, especially since the auto attack, which again, has no cooldown and can be used anytime, also does very high damage.

Also, as soon as you see the skill being used, 5 arrows have already hit you, and most likely you are fighting someone else.

@The person trying to give a definition of rangers. You have it completely backwards.

Rangers are the type of people who excel in close combat and raiding tactics. Read a dictionary. To range is to basically roam, not fire things from long distances.

@The guy who said “use reflect to force swap weapon”.

Yo, you know he can just wait or fighting something else while that’s up? It’s not very hard.

the auto atk dmg w/o cd always was the same, before and after patch…

3 words : read the wind

bri.2359:

Just to add a side note regarding projectile reflection.

In an update awhile back, ANET buffed enemy projectiles so they all have have a rare chance to be invulnerable, meaning they can pass through any type of reflection/block skill.

I have seen this while blocking eggs at the Triple headed Wurm event on my guardian when an egg passed through my Wall of Reflection while the other 2 eggs in the spread were successfully blocked.

They added reflect cap to WOR like what they did to feedback ? Or its just random now ?

Mesmer is fine now in pve and pvp . Not top tier but in pve FGS is gone , so TW has more usage there also iwarden fix helps a lot (its slower tho but better than stand still doing nothing)
6 in dom line is for mantra damage buff 16% damage boost from 4 mantras (usually 8-12% since u have to use signet of illusion and feedback etc) And yes it’s huge for reflect damage.
Btw Dazzling does add a bit more group support. MOD is aoe now which means mesmer could easily do 10 stacks of vule in 5s (last 8s) . Also offhand sword could do daze , it will be 5%-15% group damage boost in short time without considering interruption .
2/4/0/5/3 is still good for some boss fights,

I noticed longer “waiting” duration too , i was thinking it’s a sneaky nerf , but with PH bug … sigh

Lostwingman.5034:

So, with the change to Tornado to be a lightning field, has anyone tested out its synergy with lightning rod?

Yes, it does

But notice that it doesnt work with new elemental summons skills like water knockback and air daze.

Passive AI play means your AI friends do stuff for you without any command , and you can’t Consistently control them. In many pvp games it also means your lovely AI friends have enough damage and abilities to kill your enemies by themselves .

Engi turrets and necro minions are the things you should target with name of passive AI play.
About mesmer illusions , you really consider that every time those greatsword and staff clones walk towards you and explode is that all illusion suddenly get intelligence ?
Now the truth is there is a button on mesmer skill bar http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mind_Wrack

Also , dolyak Signet, healing signet , signet of Stamina , signet of restoration , ire and strength rune + celestial amulet . those things are far more passive to me than any AI builds.

Rework all those necro skill which instantly work and are 1200 range aoe with little anime, then we could start talking about necro issue in pvp.
About pve ,again it’s dungeon design issue really . It is . Making everyone with lots of damage and might stack is not a way to go .

I don’t think necro has problem in wvw .

PU nerf we should cheer for that finally braindead builds are getting nerfed

clone death ,DD nerf im not so sure if it will hurt other builds .but confirmed anet don’t know CI build .
Mesmer is secret class in gw2 after all.

illusion=clone+Phantasms as mesmer f1-4 skills source
after 2 years ,people in forum still don’t know this and consider themselves expert of active play .
just lol

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

musu.9205:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

musu.9205:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

shimmerless.4560:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

nearlight.3064:

Well yeah that is true. It’s just for mesmers, helseth suggests that they won’t even need PU, since torment spam will let them faceroll through everything. It’s too strong of a condition to just slap on an autoattack.

No it isn’t. Only on Mesmers is that true because the clone system lets them up to quadruple their condition output. If the clones aren’t applying it, then it can be balanced on an auto.

Heck, even if it was on almost any other weapon, it wouldn’t be so bad, but Scepter clone generation is quite fast.

Have you actually played a Mesmer even once? Are you posting from planet Mars?

Yeah, I do play my Mesmer rather frequently and I use Scepter on my shatter build because it generates clones much more rapidly than any other weapon.

scepter has a low AA speed also barely hit things which is why it needs buff to begin with. Low AA speed is same to scepter clone too .
The thing is we dont have chance to test this yet but problem is anet did balance patch slowly(thanks living story group ) and never reacted to balance issue fast(free signet for war has been used in TOL and no words from anet ,no fix in a month)

Low AA speed, but a cycle of the auto is still faster than any clone generation cooldown. The projectiles home, so hitting is not as big an issue as you make it out to be.

Don’t get me wrong, the scepter AA needs a buff, but Torment on Ether Bolt is not what it needs. Ether Blast is fine getting Torment.

I agree with this but if only ether blast gets buffed ,scepter will stay useless .So i think we need something else beside a damage condition on scepter (even i think it wont make pu condi spec op in actual tpvp).But something different from staff , maybe chill/cripple.

Chill is too strong to have on any auto-attack. Honestly, the biggest buff would just be increasing the overall speed of the chain to make the scepter clone’s strength (quantity) stronger. And yeah, Torment on Ether Blast could get a longer duration than 4 seconds. I’d say at least 6 seconds base.

Random 1s chill from chill/cripple/weakness on first attack of AA chain , so that mesmer wont perma chill anyone if you are worrying about this . It’s like staff aa with soft cc condition every 5 second

By the way scholar rune is still best for mesmer i think .
Force sigil is better than fire for reflection damage .For some bosses without projectiles air is better .
Sigil of strength is also a good choice .(It adds less damage than air on sword ,same damage potential on gs )

200 fer +200 pre(even without chose any trait) > 150 power in dom line +that situational 5%damage boost ,consider you usually bring mesmer for reflection .

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fhAQNAs9cnsISpa2qGGoB1aIR1QO5zhoqLJDkokl6A-TFCEAB2t/Qiq/slSQmU+ZwDAoNdAAcCAcTLQAAEgJWiBwEn4En4EnYTciTciTcilCwMlRA-w

And deponds what you get , you could make some change
When you don’t need reflection u could move 2 points from illusion line then one to dom line for 5% boost ,one to 15% damage boost for phant in inspiration line
When you rely on feedback (like fireshaman) then move that 2 points from illusion line to dom line to get 4% per charged mantra

Since when roaming is a official game mode ?

Almost every one plays this game well will tell best 3 classes for all game modes are
war/ele/guard. Only difference are you could add thief to pvp part , necro to wvw part.

“Also mesmer GS is one the 2 reasons why DPS ele is unviable”

no word for this really.

staff ele is healer+ support + extra aoe damage + amount of condition cleanse .

You dont want to play some spec of a class , this has nothing to do with good state of those classes.

You could suggest more build variety ?That’s fine ,but these complaints of yours are totally off the reality

LordByron.8369:

You should specify wich mode are you talking about:

PvE ele is HIGH risk, high reward at moment:
I.E. ANYONE can melee lupi on a warrior, not so many can melee lupi on an ele.
That is because Warrior is extremely forgiving, being able to facetank a couple of strong hits, and healing back without even pressing a button

Ele gets oneshot by so many Attacks in pve that is extremely difficult to play unless the content itself is extremely easy.
Tell me how often do you see a FGS in high level fractals.
The issue is obviously the content, but nerf is Always the lazy way anet chooses.

---

WWW:

Thieves and torpedo warriors are OP and will be almost untouched.
DD celestial ele is trash… You need to be able to engage/disengage and strong defense mechanic at will to be good at roaming.
Ele has none of that. anyone saying the opposite should prove it, and i can prove i can escape them even with a mesmer.

Healing is just half effective due to the increased damage and condition spam comparing to PvP, but this is a concept too hard to grasp for some

In Zerg WWW ele is either a waterbot (low risk/0 reward) or if dps is extremely difficult to play for not even a strong reward. (read unwanted and considered unviable)
But will be nerfed so will be high risk/low reward.

InPvP DD celestial seems strong due to reduced stats, no food exc.
But obviously the need of the few is more important of the needs of the many because of esports TM

We are actually talking about tpvp. And I don’t think it needs to point out.

And may i ask what exactly oneshot eles? do they also oneshot necro or thief(lets not talk mesmer here since sword #2)

“DD celestial ele is trash… You need to be able to engage/disengage and strong defense mechanic at will to be good at roaming.”
D/D ele is exactly the build which has strong defense and could engage/disengage easily. It’s same par with war .only thief is better than them .(Dont say pu mesmer here they cant easily engage).So i dont see any point here.
“Healing is just half effective due to the increased damage and condition spam comparing to PvP, but this is a concept too hard to grasp for some”
yeah , 1.8 healing power for wvw is same level as pvp cleric amulet.

Teutos.8620:

musu.9205:

With MOD buff (hope anet wont change cd plz) ,It might be closer to standard shatter .(i really hope anet could add a trait "remove 1 boon from enemy when you interrupt ")

Do you think so? I was more thinking, that due to the Illusionary Elasticity buff the CI build is loosing more ground to the standard shatter.

totally forgot IE buff , yep thats huge for standard shatter .
But one can only hope!

So healer and support role are something you are unhappy with ?
And you called a weapon set with many useful skills as a waterbot (you cant deny no matter you are using dps or healing build that those skills are always great ,also with might stack. )
Using mesmer for veil +portal and ranger for healing spring , thats what bot means.

Teutos.8620:

musu.9205:

CI is just fine to play ,not powerful as gs/staff shatter but it’s far better than most condi mesmer builds in tpvp.

On top level tpvp CI is fine, not as a condition spec, but as a a gs/staff shatter berserker build (4-4-6-0-0 instead of the normal 4-4-0-0-6 shatter), but it requires the mantra of distraction, which will lead to loosing out on another useful utility skill. Therefore only “fine” and not on par with the standard shatter, but still fun as hell.

Sorry for my wrong words , I did mean shatter spec CI build (gs/staff is what exactly im running now).
With MOD buff (hope anet wont change cd plz) ,It might be closer to standard shatter .(i really hope anet could add a trait "remove 1 boon from enemy when you interrupt ")