Short stealth skills with cool downs are fine… the stealth that thieves can get off is over the top… you should not be able to stealth and re-stealth and re-stealth over and over and over on to infinity. It needs to be fixed for the good of the game – by all means buff the class some more, but make it so thieves have to chose when to use their stealth wisely…
Revealed completely turns them into mobile lootbags so I propose that thieves get protection on revealed to balance this.
I laughed. If you’re dying when not in stealth you’re obviously running something that has no vitality or toughness. I run apothecary, and a guildie runs Soldier’s. We don’t die out of stealth, and if we’re stealthing, we’re running from battle. Actually wear something that keeps your toughness and/or vitality up, you’ll die less.
A thief doesn’t invest in toughness or vitality because it does not help, unless of course they want to hit like a dry sponge.
Another thing, revealed nullifies a whole traitline and kills thief survivability so giving them a small cushion like kitten protection on revealed would balance all those hard counters.
Then join the club… this is the same issue that every class faces except with perma-stealth you can go full berserker and still have decent survivability.
The poor old Elementalist in berserker doesn’t have this luxury.
Buff other defensive traits for thieves and mesmers, but the perma-stealth is ridiculous.
No, not at all. Or is there any bug that Necros have that makes it impossible for them to fight 3 out of 8 character classes if they are using some of their most popular builds?
Cool; that means I’m hyper-intelligent and I become even more intelligent when I’m together with others. Also, I look kinda cool and I get to have a tail on top of that! =)
As this (failed) insult wasn’t called for, I’m tempted to say something about the results of loving Grawls and Dredges. But I won’t do that. After all, I’m way too cool and intelligent for such things.
;P
Yeah, the deathshroud lockout of all heals and utilities has been broken for over 6 months… this is our class mechanic and has resulted in so many deaths for me its not even funny anymore.
But you know, Necro is not a priority class in Arena-nets eyes… this is not the first time they’ve hot-fixed other class issues and left us to rot.
Remember downed state health, where we had 1/3 of the health of every other class in downed state – that went on for months also.
It’s not like we don’t want Mesmer issues to be fixed, heck, Mesmer is one of my main classes – i love playing the little dude… but people are so over this favouritism game that A-net plays… it’s really wearing thin.
pets need to hit moving targets: combat in GW2 is not static, everyone is moving (except current PvE, more later). To improve this, pets need to get their attack range increased, get a short ranged leap or attack while moving. Good example, a pet converted into a moa by a mesmer hits nearly everything
Pet stats: In my opinion, pet stats should scale with ranger stats (each pet-type with different scaling factors). for example, every pet has 2 major, 2 minor stats, which he scales good with and the rest stay at base values. This would especially nerf rangers hybrid builds, which are too strong right now (spirit-bunker-ranger) and will allow balancing the ranger, because right now with those builds, you cant balance them correctly, nerfing the condition part will nerf every condition build and nerfing the pets damage will nerf direct damage builds which are weak right now.
Necromancer:
Skill delay while leaving deathshroud needs to go on utility skills. It cant be possible that you cant use your healing skill for 2 seconds after leaving deathschroud.
Allow heals in deathshroud: right now it is not possible to get healed while in deathshroud. Every regeneration on you is negated. It is not a sort of protection, its a lifesponge and doesnt help to survive nor is it usefull in some builds. which leads to the next point
Split deahtshroud into several forms, one for condition damage, one for direct damage and one for defense (vampiric one would be cool too). Which can be selected (like rangers pets). Rght now, deathshroud is a life sponge and not a utility skill, it is full of different kinds of skills, that dont fit together and maximum half of them is usefull in builds.
Agree with you – love the deathshroud split idea – that would be something cool to try out.. a bunker deathshroud so that Necros could actually bunker!
They should change GW2 stealth to be like DAOC stealth in that you can stay stealthed until you need to attack, but once you attack you cannot re-stealth until you are out of combat. Obviously it would need some tweaking…
IMO this would put stealth in a better position for all involved.. if a stealther messes up you should be able to make them pay – it’s really not the case at the moment unless you get super lucky with your AOE spams…
~6000 damage for a move only performed in one specific situation – not something that can be done regularly – it’s a once in a blue moon sort of a move.
I don’t see the issue either… particularly given some of the damage most classes can give out by hitting regular weapon or trait attacks… 16k for Eviscerate springs to mind…. not that I’m suggesting nerfs, just pointing out that this really shouldn’t be an issue.
No Life – Force:
So what happens if you have no life – force? Its is very unlikely that u run around without life force especially if you are in PvE or WvW. Even if u have no LF you can fill that bar extremely fast with skills such as Spectral Walk/Armor or killing ur own minions. If you have 15 in soul reaping you get another Spectral Armor so Life Force actually is no problem.
Its the same as with Warrior they have their adrenaline up all the time.
I don’t wholly agree with this statement – we are the first target in WvW… getting focussed tends to suck away any Life force pretty quickly – just tonight i was having this issue… sometimes you have some LF and sometimes not.. it just depends on the situation.
I play zerker Necro, Lifeblast is one of my main tools… i still think Close to Death is a better trait – the new version doesn’t belong at Grand Master level. I might try it out and see what happens.
Condition Necro’s are going to struggle – that is my prediction.
I think we’re already drifting out of the meta and people haven’t realised it yet. I just hope we arrive at one patch day where there are no nerfs – not sure i will stick around long enough to see that, however.
Wells are fine until the person walks out of them (wells)…..
Basically they are solid for PvE and spamming for loot bags, but you won’t get any solid DPS out of them in WvW unless the person is hard cc’ed in place.
What about Necro skill lock when coming out of transforms? That’s a pretty big problem – i have died a number of times because my heal was locked out… i don’t understand why this hasn’t been fixed. Months go by and game breaking bugs still persist.. it’s terrible.
Signet of Vampirisim is still terrible – i don’t understand how this made it to release? All siphoning is terrible and needs to be looked at…
Dhuumfire changes – i think this will hurt condi Necros. It would be nice if they could have some of the previous re-balancing nerfs back – reduced bleeds, terror nerf etc… at least move Dhuuumfire to Master tier.
Wonder what’s next on the nerf block for Necros… A-net trying to hit some sort of record for consecutive nerfs?
This whole post seems underwhelming for many of the classes here.
- Small scale combat (should be more rewarding in terms of WXP)
- Large scale combat (for a change). Can get a bit too zergy at times.
- Class balance – contrary to the complaints on the forums, this is for the most part fairly decent. There are classes that could use some help and some that have a few OP abilities, but on a whole things are pretty good. All classes could do with some more diverse builds…
Dislikes:
- Ascended Gear – unnecessary. The introduction of ascended gear has left a sour taste in my mouth. I should not have to grind, grind, grind PvE just so i can remain competitive in WvW. We were sold a different concept to the one that is currently in play – the 180 degree turnaround has been unfortunate to say the least – if this is not resolved, I’ll find another game to play (Everquest Next most likely).
They had better fix the skill delay when exiting death shroud….
I have died so many times because of this…
I don’t see anyone except hybrid builds using the new Dumbfire… power builds have better options in that trait line and condition builds will probably change trait lines altogether.
I wonder if we’re going to get any of the bleeds back that they nerfed because of Dumbfire… we’ll probably get some more nerfs instead.
The pace of development is no reason to make inept balance decisions.
The predominance of berserker gear in dungeons is symptomatic of the 1.5 year old content with simple mechanics. Players are so familiar with it that almost anyone can, and therefore does, wear zero-defense gear. Now the proposed solution is to change an entire category of gear that’s arbitrarily correlated?
A guy robs a bank because the bank left the vault open. Do you punish the robber’s clothes?
Boom. This exactly.
If my Zerker Necro gets screwed I’m done with this game.
there is 8 ways to counter a thief’s backstab;
1 – Aegis
2 – Fear
3 – Traps/Marks
4 – Evades/stunbreakers
5 – Block
6 – stealth
7 – wildly swinging a GS
8 – count to 3 and dodge it like anyone else
You forgot one – Pull out a boom box, put on that Footloose song, break out into dance and hope he just has to join in on the dancing fun. You can win him over with your sweet dance moves.
I’m hoping we get some more nerfs in the next patch.
I want to get back to underpowered status so i don’t have to read any more OP threads… it’s so kittening old.
Any time someone loses in PvP there is a new OP thread… instead of working on your class and working out how to counter they just throw up the this class is OP thread. Warrior is OP, Thief is OP, Mesmer is OP every class is OP except Ranger.
Deathshroud is invulnerable mode with 50,000 hitpoints.
I died in 2 seconds from conditions.
BAH!
Just give us some more nerfs so we can be done with it.
Either that or ban people that make those threads.
If i could go back to pre-Dhummfire patch, man…. that would be great.
I roam with my berserker build quite well so long as it’s 1 vs 1 – I win considerably more than i lose, but when it’s more than 1 enemy that i need to fight, I’m generally screwed.
I WvW with 8 of them regularly.. i can’t stand the Engineer.
I’ve given up on the idea of ascended armour – it would take me a literal lifetime to gear up my characters – it was implemented in a really poor manner imo.
I’m sure it’s no issue if you only have 1 character.
I killed 4 people a few weeks back, just throwing up clones and stealthing until i had them all down…. 2 were up-levels, but i was still shocked at how well the Mesmer does 1vX
Ironically I play a warrior and was going to ask necromancers on advice on how to counter them… However I play a sword sword / LB condition build which necros are basically immune to. I just hate the hammer playstyle so much. So I guess don’t feel bad, just avoid hammer warriors and go for condi ones instead =) At least necros are the only profession I have any trouble with.
I will say the amount of mobility almost any warrior build has is pretty kitten good (maybe too much). I can basically get out of any situation and I don’t even use a GS
I play a Sword/Shield / Longbow Warrior as well and have no problem with most Necros – some really well played ones give me a run for my money.
Just cc them as much as possible, but make sure you time it right (can be difficult).
I use bulls charge, stomp, shield bash and it seems to do the trick.
Try and get a good stack of conditions going on the Necro before you start to chain stun them – this will generally do the trick. You need to stun before they transfer or consume conditions. I have a fair bit of power/precision in my build so my attacks do decent physical damage as well.
Healing Signet + Mango Pies pretty much rule the universe.
If all else fails, just use Leap and Bulls Rush to run away.
More assumptions and theory-crafting to support whatever argument you’re trying to make… If he has this, if you have this, if he does this… this discussion is pointless. You’re not changing other ppls opinions and they are not changing yours. GG.
But they do not need the vigor to beat a Warrior. I am assuming 100% condition duration increase on the Necromancer for all my posts since that’s what a good Necromancer uses. Most classes do not have condition immunity and only Warriors, Elementalist and Engineers have it. Warriors take 8 seconds of kiting if he used it at the start of combat and then hes a free kill and if he uses it during the middle it won’t remove any conditions so the chill and cripple should make it easy mode. Elementalist takes 30 trait points for a useless trait that 99% of Elementalists don’t use and only useful against condition Necromancers. Engineer takes 30 trait points and it doesn’t remove already applied conditions so all you can do is hope he doesn’t remove all your damaging conditions which is unlikely.
So from the start you are assuming that the Necromancer is a Condition build. That alone is silly as Necromancer isn’t ONLY a condition based class. What about Power Necros? What do they not count for some strange reason?
Power Necromancers have 54k base hp with immunity to Warrior stuns and 5k auto attacks so I don’t know if you want to go that way.
They also have rainbow rockets firing out of their backsides and invincibility and a Battle Cat like He-Man.
You make so many wild assumptions that it’s impossible to take anything you say seriously.
While you’re counting Lich Form and Deathshroud as extra hit points on the Necro, lets take a balanced approach at analysing this and count all the DPS / hit points the Warrior would avoid by using Endure Pain and Bezerker Stance… that would be stupid right?
Let’s also remember that immunities scale in 1vX, whereas extra hit points do not – this is why DS vanishes rapidly under focus fire.
Also, Dark Path is a terrible projectile… it’s like waiting for a flying sloth to grab hold of an enemy, oh wait – there’s a small stick or blade of grass in the way. Dark Path is good for chilling someone who is 6 feet in front of you for extra CC – that’s about it.
I saw a teleporting ranger the other night in PvE and went to report – no selection to report hacking – i don’t understand why i can’t report this. He was just blipping around the map like he was in the Matrix.
I died ONCE in all of my sPvP to a warrior and that was bc I wasn’t paying attention and pooped my stability to soon. Now as I understand it they were nerfed for some some reason.
Thieves changes are just ridiculous and not plausible……..YET again. Have you played a thief? Hell, has anyone that posts about balance changes on these forums played one? I sure as hell don’t think so. LOL. So wrong in so many ways. Play the class for a week before you guys think of trying to balance it. Ty. Your welcome.
So conceptually, the Thief is a problem. Really, it’s a bursty evasive unavoidable highly mobile class with strong support… It’s assasins creed (a single player game where you murder NPCs) in a multiplayer game (where being murdered isnt fun)… so it gets random nerf bat beatings to it’s knee caps…
what it needs, is a role definition that gives it a narrower niche, then we can balance it within that niche. ‘being a kitten that 1 shots kittenes from nowhere and gets away’ isn’t really a niche that works for a pvp game.
being a stealthed controller who threatens to dissable and expose enemies that are out of position, allowing ones teamates to fall upon them… thats a good role definition. It lets stealth be a good weapon because a stealthed thief forces you to play cautiously with your squishier dps peices… even when the thief is just chillin…
but when everybody gets 2+ buttons that teleport them here or there, making it impossible to punish someone for bad positioning, and making it irrelevant wether you know where the thief is or isn’t (it just presses ‘steal’ and it’s where you didn’t want it to be) …
You’re right though… the endless complaining in the PvP forum is just ridiculous.
People just complain every time they die and it goes on and on – a new class gets whined about each patch.. i got hit for xx damage, this player broke wind on my left cheek… this class has xx ability and i don’t…
