Guild Wars 2

oxtred.7658:

I heard condi guardians are the best class now. Necro mobility is really great, but I find running a shout ah nomad guard really powerful for bursting people.

lol. ^ ignore trollish reply.

The guy asking ‘for what?’ is right, more detail is needed. That said, search for ‘GWEN’. It’s the common acronym for current wvw profession meta or check the profession forums for each of the classes represented by one of those letters. There are always WvW role & build discussions.

Bweaty.9187:

Said since beta, only having the CD on entering DS would allow much more fun & skilled play…

Agreed.

I also disagree with those claiming its a bug fix. Patch notes usually identify bug fixes as such. This was a balance patch (i.e. nerf). It is one that makes sense and I’m not really bothered by it, but the fact that they went out of their way to make necro’s just a little bit less capable despite the many, many legitimate problems with the class does bother me a lot.

This was clearly announced in multiple times & places, so I can’t agree with blaming the devs. That said, it was a poor implementation of a reward system.

Neptune.2570:

Mesmer and Thief for most skill intensive.
Ele and Engi for most mechanically intensive.

Given the OP’s definitions, this.

Susanoo.2586:

Seeing as Warrior Adrenaline degens quicker outside of Combat, I think Death shroud should match that speed, It seems a little cheat-y fighting a Necro that has just built up their life force outside of combat by swapping skills.

When LF builds as fast and as easily as adrenaline, we’ll talk.

Sinbold.8723:

In a past update, Anet was nice enough to get rid of the highly annoying camera spin when one was dead. Now with the respawn timer in WvW, that annoying spin is back. Can you PLEASE get rid of it again? Thank you, if so.

Please fix this; it is very disorienting.

edit: to clarify – this is happening in pve dungeons as well as wvw and elsewhere.

choovanski.5462:

i don’t think enough people are considering the impact of a badly implemented alliance feature. if it’s implemented, and either the execution fails or the design of the system is bad then Anet will not be able to patch it fast enough to retain the players. the risk involved in such a massive change is too high, and the consequences of failure are too great.

And what are the consequences of failing to produce balanced matches?

Plexxing.2978:

I used to run foot in the grave, stability never ended knockdowns or fears.

Probably because the game wouldn’t let you activate death shroud to get stability when knocked down or feared. The DS has been weird for some time, and the recent ‘fix’ for interactions in DS moved the problem instead of correcting it.

nirvana.8245:

Sube Dai.8496:

GreyWraith.8394:

John Corpening.9847:

After last week’s positive discussion on siege trolls I wanted to bring up the topic of population imbalance and ideas that you have on it.
…
Thanks,
John

Given the severe imbalance in population & coverage between servers a mega-server style solution is the only thing with a chance of working. My (rough) suggestion:

1. Discard the concept of servers entirely (for WvW).
2. Every week (or whatever period you choose) assign accounts to a temporary battlegroup (or whatever you name it). The assignment only lasts for the period’s duration. Next period everybody gets re-assigned. If the assignments are done right both population and coverage could be roughly balanced between battlegroups.

How to do this and keep communities together? The same way the megaserver system does it now – by grouping friends and guildmates together in the same battlegroups as much as possible. Maybe include a guarantee that you will be assigned to the same battlegroup as your most represented guild – that way WvW guilds could be sure they would play together. Guild population limits would ensure this stays balanced despite the guarantee.

Not a perfect system certainly, but it would produce games worth playing while keeping most people grouped as they prefer most of the time.

P.S. I know you said no coverage issues, but population and coverage are two sides of the same problem. Any solution will have to address both simultaneously or it won’t be a solution.

The system has to stop people from stacking though, or we have the same problems as now.

At some point it has to say “this battlegroup is full, join one of the other two”

So my battlegroup is only a temporary (weekly) assignment. I have no reason to fight for my battlegroups pride this week, because next week I will have another battlegroup. I might as well just go play in EoTM and karma train because I won’t be doing any of the duties you need to do in a competitive WvW.

1. As stated the period is subject to change
2. Just because the next period is ‘another battlegroup’ doesn’t mean you won’t be playing with the same friends & guildmates etc. Pride in overall group performance doesn’t go away.
3. Your current server has (some) different people on it this week than it did last week; people transfer. Do you take less pride in it because the group of people has changed a bit?

Sube Dai.8496:

GreyWraith.8394:

John Corpening.9847:

After last week’s positive discussion on siege trolls I wanted to bring up the topic of population imbalance and ideas that you have on it.
…
Thanks,
John

Given the severe imbalance in population & coverage between servers a mega-server style solution is the only thing with a chance of working. My (rough) suggestion:

1. Discard the concept of servers entirely (for WvW).
2. Every week (or whatever period you choose) assign accounts to a temporary battlegroup (or whatever you name it). The assignment only lasts for the period’s duration. Next period everybody gets re-assigned. If the assignments are done right both population and coverage could be roughly balanced between battlegroups.

How to do this and keep communities together? The same way the megaserver system does it now – by grouping friends and guildmates together in the same battlegroups as much as possible. Maybe include a guarantee that you will be assigned to the same battlegroup as your most represented guild – that way WvW guilds could be sure they would play together. Guild population limits would ensure this stays balanced despite the guarantee.

Not a perfect system certainly, but it would produce games worth playing while keeping most people grouped as they prefer most of the time.

P.S. I know you said no coverage issues, but population and coverage are two sides of the same problem. Any solution will have to address both simultaneously or it won’t be a solution.

The system has to stop people from stacking though, or we have the same problems as now.

At some point it has to say “this battlegroup is full, join one of the other two”

You misunderstand. Megaservers don’t ask you which map you want to join – you are assigned. I’m suggesting similar (involuntary) assignments based on friend/guild/activity data like what megaservers currently do, but with WvW data included.

Involuntary assignments may sound terrible but the system can be designed/tweaked to put the vast majority of people on the same side as friends they wish to play with. Practically speaking, that’s probably the best we’re going to get without allowing people to deliberately unbalance matches.

John Corpening.9847:

After last week’s positive discussion on siege trolls I wanted to bring up the topic of population imbalance and ideas that you have on it.
…
Thanks,
John

Given the severe imbalance in population & coverage between servers a mega-server style solution is the only thing with a chance of working. My (rough) suggestion:

1. Discard the concept of servers entirely (for WvW).
2. Every week (or whatever period you choose) assign accounts to a temporary battlegroup (or whatever you name it). The assignment only lasts for the period’s duration. Next period everybody gets re-assigned. If the assignments are done right both population and coverage could be roughly balanced between battlegroups.

How to do this and keep communities together? The same way the megaserver system does it now – by grouping friends and guildmates together in the same battlegroups as much as possible. Maybe include a guarantee that you will be assigned to the same battlegroup as your most represented guild – that way WvW guilds could be sure they would play together. Guild population limits would ensure this stays balanced despite the guarantee.

Not a perfect system certainly, but it would produce games worth playing while keeping most people grouped as they prefer most of the time.

P.S. I know you said no coverage issues, but population and coverage are two sides of the same problem. Any solution will have to address both simultaneously or it won’t be a solution.

Anet should just use the existing block list and make tags of blocked players not show.

Vorlidian.1045:

Edge of the Mists, yep this area is killing off WvW. I know there will be people annoyed as heck reading this….but Anet need to reduce rewards in EoTM by 80%.
WHAAAT nooo way i can already hear it.
What is the purpose of Eotm? Its supposed to function as an overflow, mess about, lounge room area, while waiting to ENTER WvW.
I was in Eotm while qued for EB and busted on an episode while following the zerg around. I could not believe how much i was being rewarded for killling time holy hanna.
MORE badges then WvW, more Kama then WvW, more WXP then WvW, more levels gained, more everything.
No wonder there are sooo many people in here.
And then there are alot of days where i will be roaming the borderlands with a friend and not see more then 2-3 server allies, for hours on end.
What the hell Anet Eotm contributes close to nothing for the WvW’ers, just takes people away from it.
Oh yer iam on Jade Quarry, thats right a TIER 1 server, just in case someone was bout to say move to a more populated server.
Right now everyone brings their low levels here to level up, you can level up 1-80 in couple of days.
Reduce the rewards massively and lets get some life back into WvW.
iam prepared for the salty response.

Oh btw, no thanks for making this seasons achievements so boring and easy, took like 10min when i was qued in Eotm while watching eps.

So… the devs make something popular that you don’t like; your solution is to nerf it into unpopularity. This is not a well considered approach.

IMO EotM fills a niche that other MMOs satisfy with open world PvE on a PvP server. It’s mostly PvE content but there’s always the risk/excitement of running into enemy players and fighting a bit along the way. Obviously not the original design intent but it works. While at times it can be repetitive, it’s far less so than leveling via hearts/map exploration for the 7th or 8th time.

Same problem here – leveling in EotM, everything going fine till I hit 29, then all my XP gains are 2 digit. It’s like everything is being divided by 10 or something.

I bugged it in game shortly after hitting 29. This has become so common since the feature pack that I heard about it repeatedly in map chat before I even hit 29. It’s affecting a lot of people, why isn’t there a hotfix?

The following had reduced XP @29:
leveling in EOTM, both creature kills and point capture (upleveled, obviously)
open world leveling in Metrica (downleveled)
crafting in Rata-Sum

What gave me normal XP:
I jumped the Divinity’s Reach gate to Fields of Ruin (level 30 zone, so playing at my native level – not upleveled or downleveled) and did open world leveling there. Waypoints, POIs, map exploration, events and creature kills all gave normal XP. Mostly I just killed fireflies and raptors just outside the gates.

NeXeD.3042:

We can cast spells when we are stomping, some of them but ds is a transformation I don’t think it’s a bug, honestly it would be slightly op if we could go in and out of ds while stomping.

Four professions have instant cast stability that can be used during a stomp without interuption:

guardian – stand your ground
warrior – balanced stance
elementalist – armor of earth
mesmer – mantra of concentration

engineer & thief can stealth before stomp
ranger – at least has stability that can be cast before stomp and will last the full stomp duration

Necro is the only class lacking all of these options. Mechanically speaking the OP is right – instant cast DS shouldn’t interupt a stomp. They could always “fix” it by making FitG base 5 seconds instead though. (yes I know that’s unrealisticOP)

I was also sorry to see many of the changes in Metrica. Much of the introductory variety of the game is removed. And the lake! sob

Anymras.5729:

I was getting the ‘miniatures have been hidden due to rising player population’ on a map that then asked me to go to a more populated version.

Something’s screwy with the way it’s working.

I got the same thing. Finally /bug ‘d it in game. I’m assuming this will be fixed since minis are effectively removed from the game right now.

Xillllix.3485:

Mark Katzbach.9084:

Do you have any specific issues to report? It’s difficult to escalate bug reports, without details on the bug(s) you are experiencing and how it’s affecting your gameplay.

Well yesterday we tried to take a keep and every piece of siege we placed down was disabled 99% of the time during which it was destroyed by dps range. There is just nothing we could do beside dps the gate down. Was that the intent of your anti-siege grenade? To have people PvD?

The new siege disabler grenade is seriously overpowered, it shouldn’t be aoe, it should last maximum 5-10 seconds, not 45. But even then, it’s just not interesting for the gameplay.

I was afraid that would happen. I’m not sure what to think about it yet but one thing is certain: sieges will more frequently be actual sieges instead of the previous “drop rams, pop gate” that they were.

Anyone know if the grenade radius is big enough for attackers to disable AC’s in the usual spots?

Mark Katzbach.9084:

Do you have any specific issues to report? It’s difficult to escalate bug reports, without details on the bug(s) you are experiencing and how it’s affecting your gameplay.

Several people in TS last night were complaining about the new ‘standard models’ causing frequent crashes.

Kyotee.7851:

Hello, I’m returning to GW2 after a long break. I actually came back about a week ago. I never played GW2 a lot before quitting, so some what inexperienced at the game – though I am a 15 year MMO vet – I learn classes quickly.

With that said, my preferred play style has always been PvP over PVE. In that role I enjoy a support / dps role (hybrid style). I love buffing my comrades, throwing key CC and peels, and clutch heals. This seems to definitely narrow that down to Elementalist or Guardian.

Just wondering which of the two seem to help a group out more in a hybrid role. Both classes intrigue me. I plan to make both. But just trying to get a feel from experienced players in both PVP/WvW and PVE on the pros or cons of both to decided which of the two will be my first level 80 character.

/bows and thanks

I’ve just returned to the game in the last couple months after a break of a year or so. I did play a lot before my break and I’m struggling with a similar decision. I do primarily WvW. Made the following list* for myself trying to decide. I’m running fairly standard builds on both; guardian = healway + clerics/soldiers + staff & hammer and ele = x/x/x/6/6 + staff.

Overall the ele provides great support with more versatility & range while the guardian is tougher and pumps out more & faster group buffs.

Guardian pros:
good healing
best at group buffing
useful but not spectacular cc
lots of stability
better at raw survival in thick zerg battles
staff 1 mindlessly tags everything @ medium range

Guardian cons:
no significant long-range damage
only melee damage is noticeable and its merely tolerable

Ele pros:
good ranged & aoe damage
good group support via heals, buffs and fields, fields, fields (water-heals, fire-might, lightning-cc&swiftness)
better cc

Ele cons:
not as good at raw survival
not as good at stability or other group buffs

*list is specific to the build/weapons/etc cited.

Stogzlol.4795:

unless you plan to play the d/d meta for spvp. I would go guardian. ele isnt rising in the food chain at all and its going to be 6 more months before we see another change.

Also, pve ele is probably still highest pve dps in game but gets cleaved a lot.

Guardian pve provides highest group support.

I would refrain from following advice influenced by post-patch blues and speculation about future-meta.

GoogleBrandon.5073:

Despite me trying to be positive these past days, this slightly depressed me:

Link to video

Stomping in DS has not the effect I would’ve liked to see… Foot in the Grave is not worth it now…

If I’m understanding this video (would it kill you to type a kitten sentence?) it shows entering DS interupts a stomp. Do we know if this is a bug or a new ‘feature’? Did you bother reporting it?

If you enter DS first then immediately stomp FitG stability almost covers the entire stomp; and that’s with no boon duration. Lots of necros have a little boon duration from a few points in Death Magic for staff traits.

Granted, it needs work, but this hardly merits a doomcalling thread.

manveruppd.7601:

Entering Plague Form no longer grants a bonus to your Toughness attribute, whether in pvp or pve.

I know the Power bonus was removed, but, since Lich Form still grants bonus Vitality, I suspect this one is a bug.

Just tested, Plague changes no stats at all except for Health. Mine increased from 23,272 to 41,792. Even though Vitality doesn’t change. Weird.

Lich increased my Health from 23,272 to 32,532 but Vitality and all other stats remained the same.

NeXeD.3042:

I’m still at work will someone please for the love of the flying spaghetti monster tell me that all these stealth nerfs that people are noticing aren’t true…..

Just tested, Plague changes no stats at all except for Health. Mine increased from 23,272 to 41,792. Even though Vitality doesn’t change. Weird.

P.S No, Armor doesn’t change.

SonOfJacob.7396:

Serious question here, because I’d like to understand: if there were a way to implement semi-permanent condi clears for a specific amount of time (ie, a condi clear skill prevents condis from being applied for x number of seconds – I’m thinking like 4 seconds or something), would that at all help or hinder the situation?

I don’t consistently read all forum posts, so I don’t know if anyone’s raised this before.

So if I’m playing my necro condition spec’d can I be immune to direct damage for 4 seconds after you hit me? You’re talking about complete immunity to condition damage; this is not even remotely balanced. Your apparent perspective is very one-sided; I’d suggest you try playing/looking at it from both sides.

You’re also missing the fact that condition clears are not the only counter to condition damage; direct damage works too. Dead enemies don’t apply conditions and direct damage kills faster than conditions.

lordkrall.7241:

So… what in the gem store is necessary in order to play the game?

Real Money Transactions. Because without them Anet would be broke and we literally would not have a game.

Ceallach.8740:

The “SE” is referring to where the map of Dry Top itself …

Yes, I’m aware. Hence the comment about giving directions. It’s a special map with limited access added long after most other zones. A ‘Getting there’ section would be appropriate on the map’s wiki page. I notice the Brisban Wildlands’ page has such a section. Why doesn’t Dry Top’s?

[edited for clarity]

Ignore the confusing Brisban Wildlands (SE) thing. The wiki editors need to learn how to give directions.

Dry Top is entered from the southWEST corner of Brisban Wildlands. The portal is in the Tangle Root area; as mentioned above, it must be opened through a dynamic event.

Purple Miku.7032:

…
You can either make your own parties with the LFG or people that play like you
…
People like me, who have had literally nothing to do on this game other than repeatedly run the exact same paths for well over a year, don’t care about anything other than getting the paths over with
…
For me personally I just don’t join groups with people using terrible setups. I’d rather not waste my own time.

Purple Miku.7032:

Everything is viable, but there’s always a best way to go about something. There’s no way around this fact — the faster you complete the objective, the more efficient you are. The outcome of a dungeon is a reward at the end of a path, rather than dispersed throughout it.
…
After the first few times running paths, they will start to feel arduous.
…

The ‘to each their own’ philosophy I agree with. The rest…

In a game played for fun, ‘best’ and ‘most efficient’ aren’t always the same. Your ‘rewards’ are bits in a server somewhere; you can’t take them with you. Fun is dispersed throughout play sessions and the only true reward is the enjoyment you get from playing.

Which takes longer: a year of efficient play or a year of less optimal play?

While this could be a useful QoL improvement, you can also bind the #1 attack to a key pressed by your thumb or little finger. That way you can attack, move and turn all at the same time.

Kiriakulos.1690:

…
sleuth of problems
…

hehehe, I’m going to use that. Totally worth reading the wall-o-text for.
I do agree that DS is poorly designed and needs a major rework also.

a t s e.9614:

BurrTheKing.8571:

Seeing someone complaining about Medi Guard is really baffling to me. Imo it’s the most well designed DPS specs in the game. Play well and you can beat many different builds 1v1. You can even make up for you lack of stability by using well timed blocks/blinds. It’s got more risk/reward than your average Thief build because your utilities that are a big part of your offense are also a big part of your sustain. If you catch the guy out they don’t have something like a auto pop Endure Pain to stay alive.

These are the type of builds you want to encourage! Why you would want something that already sees minimal play nerfed is beyond me. Even the blinds are designed in such a way where getting hit by them feels like you messed up as opposed to Thief or some Ele builds.

Medi guard is super easy to play. Instead of correctly using dodges you just spam defensive cooldowns. It dosent need a nerf but it didint need a buff either. Guardian is the easiest zerker class to play besides from pew pew power ranger that spams 111 from 1500 range with longbow.

Please name these spammable defensive cooldowns that mediguards have.

It is still going to be lacking; Superior sigil of ice has the same %uptime, procs more often, and isn’t limited to a specific weapon.

IMO it would be better to keep the planned changes&ICD but make it work on more than just one weapon.

Favorite
Asura guardian hammer #2 – somersault SMASH (with bonus shiny sfx!)

Honorable mention
Corrupt Boon on a guardian who just popped his Save Yourselves imawin button. Priceless.

Morte.5916:

1. Fix minions not attacking

This one kills me. There are lots of changes I would like to see ranging from minor fixes to major reworks, but this imo should take precedence. It’s a bug fix to a core mechanic and its still happening after 2 years.

spoj.9672:

It should result in slightly more damage on the auto with higher power. But the duration of lich will only be 20 seconds and you can no longer well bomb. So overall its a nerf. It may be a decent buff in some PvE situations though. Depends on numbers. And we wont know for sure until the patch hits.

I view the well bomb as more of a bug fix; the way transforms work it was clearly never intended – just a mechanical design flaw.

Only 20s is technically a nerf but I’ve never used lich for > 20s against other players without being focused and killed so its really only a nerf in PvE.

coglin.1867:

GreyWraith.8394:

DS associated mechanics need a re-design.

Why do they need a redesign? Every hour someone post somewhere on these forums that X mechanic or X skill needs a redesign, and almost none of them, just as you lacked here, offer even a slightly comprehensive reasoning to justify it.

A slightly comprehensive reading of this thread would reveal that I was agreeing with someone who provided a paragraph of reasoning. Granted its short and a broad overview, but hardly without justification.

The trait is decent, but our current might-stacking meta makes it look weak in comparison.

TheLastNobody.8319:

Honestly though, I think what they should really do is reevaluate deathshroud and the life force mechanic entirely.

I agree. Love playing my necro, but DS associated mechanics need a re-design. Unfortunately the devs seem to be limiting themselves to small incremental changes. That’s normally a good thing, but when the overall design of a class is lacking this much an exception needs to be made.

PrinceOfTheImpure.1508:

…
I don’t appreciate the minions and have removed them from my build. I heard they were good for leveling so I kept reserving judgement
….

A minion master doesn’t really shine until you have enough minions
& traits to make it work. The traits ‘Training of the Master’, ‘Flesh of the Master’ and ‘Minion Master’ make the playstyle viable imo.

Saiyan.1704:

…
*Protector’s impact: Create a symbol when you take fall damage
… If some one actually use one of these, please tell me how they help you compared to the others in that tree line.

This also reduces falling damage by 50%; every profession has one of these. I used to play with a guild WvW commander who would have the squad re-trait on the fly when being chased by a superior force. Then we’d run off a fairly high cliff somewhere. Invariably, a fair number of idiots would lemming-leap after us and we’d wipe those that survived the fall.

Gimmicky and tricky to pull off, but hilarious every time.

8/10 that’s a nice fierce/demonic look

here’s mine – not expensive skins, but I like the creeeeeepy factor with the hood & eye

Bhawb.7408:

….Why would a shadow fiend not look like a shadow?
…..
Other than that, gimme skins. For the love of god I will pay so much money if you release skins for minions.

I think the important question is why it’s the shadow of a dust-bunny.

+1 for skins. And Anet can release them as minis to make money from non-necro players.

Bhawb.7408:

… Its a balance thing…

This is true, but in my more cynical moments I’m convinced that transformations are just lazy game design.

urieldhynne.2743:

Don’t make a necro. Its only viable in zergfights, and in organized ones.

PvE: Awful, maybe the hunter is worst.

WvW Roaming: Worst roamer. Roaming is about mobility, necro is the worst in that. You can’t pick fights, if a big group see you, you are dead. And if you are winning they just run away and you cant chase them.

WvW as a pug: You are going to have a bad time in unorganized backline or if you need to cross the entire map to catch the zerg.

Dueling: Is pretty good but easy to hardcounter.

sPvP: is not in a good place right now.

If you need to choose ONE CLASS for all the game content, the most versatile class right now, you can do EVERYTHING with him, is a warrior, make a warrior. You can do everything good with him. Is not the BEST in each mode, but is good and great in all modes.

Meh. It’s viable in many modes. Not optimal, but that’s not what the OP asked. And this game doesn’t have hunters

PvE: open world = fine. dungeons = dps suffers badly due to condition mechanics, more than one condition spec’d party member is definitely not viable.

WvW Roaming: worst runner. The fighting part is viable and we do have chill/cc/etc to help with runners. Personally I’ve never understood why so many roamers work so hard to avoid actually fighting. I’m the kill-you-or-die-trying type.

WvW as a pug: I’ve rarely had trouble catching the random blue dorito. Switch in spectral green-butt-streamer-of-swiftness or signet of runs-faster till you catch the zerg. And I usually survive longer than most PuG zergers as a backline necro.

Dueling: no argument.

sPvP: no clue; not my thing atm.

When I was working on world completion I was very attached to my boon duration build for perma-swiftness (full points in Virtues), but that left me a lot of room to play with traits since running around the world down-leveled isn’t exactly challenging.

I used Retaliatory Subconscious (IV) most of the time for lack of anything better (using shouts for swiftness, so consecration traits not ‘useful’ in this context).

And I really, really liked combining Permeating Wrath (XI) with Supreme Justice (VIII) because setting everything on fire is fun (not terribly effective, but that hardly matters for world completion).

Anyone with an open Grenth?

Nikkinella.8254:

Well if we’re talking purely out of combat running then yeah Guardian would be lower in that case.

Not so. Guardians can easily have perma-swiftness with boon duration runes+trait line (which many wvw support guardians use already for other reasons).

Signet of the Locust + Spectral Walk will average less. Necros can’t get perma-swiftness.

Ronin.4501:

For the most part this matchup has been great this week, but definitely very unimpressed with the [ALS] guild from AR, several of whom seem overly willing to employ the zoom hack on the ACs. Sadly I’ve seen it from them all week long. I guess it’s not only the T1/2 servers that employ the hacks and exploits…

I’m pretty sick of that crap also. Unfortunately I’ve been seeing it from all 3 servers on a continual basis.

Gravy.7589:

ALS get your kitten Ele outta our tower, who either hacked in or got in through that door glitch. Sad sad guild if you gonna play it this way. Have a ton of screen shots of them running around our tower.

I was on TS with him at the time, and he was as baffled as everyone else about how he ended up in there. If someone were glitching [doors] on purpose (and I’m not aware of any AR WvWers who do) they would use a mesmer, obviously.