Guild Wars 2

Tempest is probably getting a different attunement mechanic however. 3 attunements were mined, so I’m guessing Air+Fire, Air+Earth and Air+Water.
Also the datamined fire tornado looks a lot like Air+Fire.

It’s possible that tempest is going to get 3 completely new sets of weaponskills, or just air + weaponswap, who knows?

This would also open many possibilities for future fire, water and earth specs.

Elementalists is already the strongest dps class in the game, the one with the highest mobility and the only one that can spam 37 skills in a row without waiting for any cd.

And you want to equip 55 weaponskills? Lol. never happy.
Most of the classes have 10 weaponskills (including Revenant). And don’t give me “not all of them are useful”, because that can be applied to any set of weaponskills (Revenant has many objectively useless weaponskills and utility skills that you can’t even change, because Revenant is the only class that can’t change utility skills)

I do not. In fact that’s why BV is better than JW. Once you apply the venom to the weapon, the stun comes with no activation time and cannot be avoided easily with aegis/dodge, since it’s on 2 hits.

it’s 1s in 2hits, meaning it can’t be blocked easily. Plus you can shot it from 900 range, or apply while in stealth.
if BV was 2s then every class would be destroyed by thief in pvp.

BV on thief can’t even be compared to CB on Reaper, even if both have no energy. Reaper has no burst nor stealth, and that shout has a 120s cd.

Chilled to the Bone has many side effects that you get with reaper traits, like chill exploding (and spreading) and chill doing damage (over time?), plus probably higher base damage. 8s of chill on Reaper is huge.

You can use it less often, but you still can spam your skills after that with no restrictions.

If IO can be used for 9s every 10 (with legendswap having no cd ooc) then it’s already decent.

just waiting for Roy to confirm this.

Basilisk venom has
1. Two chances to proc on enemies (less chance to be avoided)
2. Is no where near as telegraphed as jade winds
3. Can be proc from a multitude of ranges in a multitude of ways.

Plus JW isn’t used by a profession that can spam a skill 10 times in 2 seconds (exaggerating bu you get what I mean) and has access to stealth for surprise attacks.

A thief with a 2s BV is gamebreaking

Neeja.4579:

You can’t compare them because Revenant is not Thief.
Thief has more burst damage and stealth. 3s of BV from a stealthed thief would wreak every class in the game.

Thief already has too many toys. BV is just the cherry.
Revenant has nothing.

This. +1

Plus BV is applied on 2 hits, so it can bypass block and dodge, and can be 900 range.

Black Box.9312:

The concept clearly is lost on you…

Since you’re not convinced let me do some math.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/%22Retreat!%22
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/%22Save_Yourselves!%22
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Symbol_of_Swiftness

From Retreat + Save Yourselves you get a throughput of 40 seconds of swiftness every 60 seconds (20s every 40s + 10s every 60s, do the math yourself if you’re able).
Only 1 tic of Symbol of Swiftness gives you 4s of Swiftness every 15 seconds, so a throughput of 16 seconds of swiftness every 60 seconds. Again, only 1 tic. If you get 2 (very easy if you aim ahead) it becomes 32 seconds every 60.

So your total throughput is 56 seconds of swiftness every 60 seconds if you get only 1 tic from your symbol, 72 seconds every 60 if you get 2.

In % you go from 93% to 120%, with an average of 105.5% swiftness uptime with no need to stop in the symbol (thug life).
All those swiftness skills do stack in duration, unlike Mesmer’s focus#4.

Not involving boon duration buffs, of course.

I’ve been a Guardian since the first beta of this game, don’t pretend to teach me my class. I’ve never had any problem to achieve perma swiftness if I needed to reach a far zerk group or any point in the map.

Plus if anyone jumps on you, you already have a lot of swiftness, probably aegis, all your virtues and maybe full Save Yourselves boons (actually 17% of the time). Just swap to Hammer/GS and wreack. You can even use staff to get 1k heal and 12 stacks of might, gg.
I don’t see any sacrifice here. Actually those shouts are pretty good, and staff too.

EDIT: did I mention you can also swap GS and do the leap once in a while?
Guardian has great mobility atm.

Ragion.2831:

All comes back to stealth now doesnt it? because if your problem with BV is that it exists then i will say that there is stability for a reason. Just blind or pop stab when you see it

The fact that thiefs can stealth prevents you from popping blocks and stability to avoid petrification.
Again, a Thief with Jade Wind would be devastating, because you can actually avoid Revenant’s, but not Thief’s (yes, because of stealth).

I agree with everything else you said.

You use Jade Winds on 5 targets, then what? Could be useful in a teamfight, but the telegraph is huge. Needs a thief friend to stealth you.
But nothing op here. It’s still inferior to Reaper’s Elite.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Hoelbrak could be pretty nice, same with Strength, Pack would be very nice, Citadel also decent.

They all seem pretty good, but inferior to Rage specifically on Revenant (all of those except Citadel would be better on any other class). Pack is really nice on Revenant, too bad it has no damage modifier and Revenant can’t make great use of the swiftness duration boost. 125 free precision is nice however.
Citadel is basically the same as Rage with a bomb every 15s instead of +5% damage under Fury.

Engi has 15 skills by default excluding kits, plus has A LOT of kits.
With kits Engi can reach 40 skills, excluding the kit invocation skills (45 if you include those). That is actually higher then Elementalist (37-40) and then Revenant with weaponswap (20).

Revenant with weaponswap is similar to Guardian (17 skills), but also has energy to deal with, and can’t chose its skills. Some legend skills are crap but you can’t unequip single skills.

Don’t compare class mechanic. Compare what they can do.
Revenant will be inferior to Guardian and Elementalist, even if one has less skills and the other cone has more.

Most popular builds do not run arcane anymore.

Also ele is the class with the highest dps, the highest condi damage, the highest mobility and the highest number of skills that can be equipped at the same time (37, excluding conjured summoning skills, but only the conjured weapon skills).

And a guy in another thread was asking for weaponswap because Revenant has it.

Sorry to bump, but I noticed that every elite spec is getting 1 extra special weapon skin and 1 extra armor piece skin.

I was talking about Jade Winds used by a thief.
1 seacon od BV is good. 2s would be too much given initiative burst and stealth, plus the fact you can’t see BV coming.

You can even see that Revenant is in Shiro attunement, you can expect JW, even if you don’t see the telegraph.
I should be more worried about the down trait if I were you. 90s icd, but still instant.

That orb was cool on paper, but actually bad because of many unwanted engagements. Maybe if it didnt do any damage…

Do you actually have any better suggestion? Something in between scholar and rage?
I didn’t check every single rune.

Gerrand.3085:

I hope that weapon swap is bound to legend swap

Not this again…
Why should I change weapon and range if I simply go from Shiro to Mallyx to get energy and the other dps upkeep? Or to stunbreak.

If you want that limit just grab a software that makes you weaponswap and legendswap at the same time emulating 2 keys in 1.

I think Replenishing Globe (Swirling Mists) is no longer in the game https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/revenant/Revenant-Changes/first
Even if it was in the stream.

Can’t wait to see the results of your build however.

I’m sure that it’s getting a cd if they see people exploiting it.

this class is eavily under construction. (and by the way you probably need 3 revenants doing nothing except jade winds)

Zodryn.4216:

Kidel.2057:

Revenant replacing Guardian, AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
Mallyx actually worth something in condition management, AHAHAHAHAHAHAH

They already got amazing buffs after the revenant weekend. It seems like they really want all aspects of the class to be viable. Comparatively, we’ve barely heard anything from the devs about thief since last month. Don’t laugh too soon.

Mallyx doesn’t transfer conditions. Just a 2s copy. And you get 2s of resistance even if you copy 2 hours of cripple from allies.
Revenant has nowhere the same survivability Guardian has. No active defense, no protection. Also nowhere close to the same support Guardian provides.
Revenant has less damage and dies easily. Even factoring Shiro.

Necro are kitten because of leech skills, but actually revenant has only 1 good, the healing skill. Everything else only works under special conditions (like attack from side) or giving up 150 ferocity trait (not happening, sorry).

Plus warriors have heavy armor, gs, shouts, signets, 20k hp. Does it mean that guardians and necromancers are useless?
Did you hear some Warrior/Guardian rage because reapers got GS and shouts? Lol.

Being able to emulate a class with another one is one of the main principles of this game.

Rin.1046:

Kidel.2057:

Chilled to the bone! (Reaper) – stun 2 seconds, chill for 12 seconds, resistance 2 seconds
Jade Winds – stun 3 seconds

Jade Winds – Radius: 600, blockable, easy to evade
Basilisk Venom – The venom is still used if an attack is blocked, evaded, obstructed, negated by Blind, or if the target has Invulnerability or Defiance.

Jade Winds – 50 energy cost
Basilisk Venom – 0 initiative cost

Plus Thief can use Basilisk Venom while in stealth and unload all its initiative on the enemy.

You forgot to mention that CttB has a 120 second cooldown. However, without the snide comments, you do have a point. BV does not cost initiative, and that alone IMO is the only advantage BV has over JW. Is that a big enough advantage? That I am not sure about. Would you want to have a more powerful BV at the cost of some initiative?

Also initiative burst with 2s of stun = insta kill on every class in the game. Nice job balancing.
Thief with stealth, initiative and a 2s stun is really OP. I think that even tank builds would have problems surviving.

You get a lesser stun because you already have too many toys.

you can’t see BV coming. Even without stealth.
Can you imagine Jade winds with stealth? No please.

Thief is thief, Revenant is revenant.
And Jade Wind is already weaker then Reaper’s Elite (you didn’t complain about that huh?).

The reason why Thief doesn’t get something like Jade Winds is stealth. Do you want Jade Winds? Give up stealth.

Also initiative burst with 2s of stun = insta kill on every class in the game. Nice job balancing.

Actually I’d love stealth on Revenant. It would solve the survivability problem.

The main advantage of BV is that you can’t see it coming. Even without stealth.

Can you imagine a thief with something like stealth + jade wind? Or simply jade wind with no telegraph?

Seriously, thief and revenants are different. You won’t ask for Impossible Odds on thief, right?

Or are you asking for a jade wind nerf? Because revenant is already pretty weak.

Einlanzer.1627:

It’s not easy for most classes to get out of the 600 range radius in the 1 second it takes to use it, assuming they are even able to see it coming.

Are you saying that is hard to dodge?

Einlanzer.1627:

My argument is that BV is definitely not balanced correctly in comparison. Thieves are a high risk high reward profession, but for the most part the risk is higher than the reward in the current state of the game, and BV is not worthy of being an elite in its current state.

Thiefs are not assassins. Given that they have initiative and stealth, BV is really good.

If you give jade winds + stealth, than that’s op. But even if you make BV a 2s stun, basically no class can survive a thief.

Black Box.9312:

And yes, since the Symbol of Swiftness change, you have to literally stop and stand in it to gain the full swiftness duration, which defeats the purpose of using it to begin with.

You don’t even need the full duration if you also use shouts.
If you need damage then just swap weapon. You don’t have energy lol.

TheSwede.9512:

I’m fairly certain at least 1 of the Signets with the Glint Legend will be a Movement Signet (Looking at the Wing here). So Couple that with instant legends and Shiro’s mobility, and they won’t be too slow.

Out of Combat, you can still use Hammer and Jalis, since you can switch Legends on the go like any other utility skills. In combat, most mobility seems to lie with Shiro.

I think Revenant will be fine.

I do agree. I’m just waiting for a clarification on Impossible Odds and ooc upkeep+legendswap now.

Zodryn.4216:

Haha…just pray Anet doesn’t realize that 3s stun on 5 targets with no cooldown is insane. It forces the entire enemy team to either blow a defensive cooldown or dodge and can be used multiple times in a row (run with two revenants for max lol, perma team stun). Comparatively, BV is single target 1s stun on a 40s cooldown that’s blockable. Oh no, how will you survive that…/sarcasm

Or to walk out of it?
Jade Winds has a huge green telegraph and a long animation.
Plus you can’t spam it. It’s 50 energy, you can use it twice in a row, then once every 10 seconds. But if you do it you can’t do anything else. Not even use weaponskills except auto attack.

If it becomes op then they can simply add some cooldown, but I don’t think that’s the case.

Overall Revenant is a seriously underpowered class atm. Way inferior to Guardian, but also inferior to Thief.

Mallyx is not bad with staff for condi cleanse atm. Copying conditions that stack in duration is a pain, since you always get 2s of resiastance even if you copy 3 hours of cripple. Of course, you don’t have to spam condi cleanse.

Can we talk about Jade Winds being completely outshadowed by “Chilled to the bone!”?
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/%22Chilled_to_the_bone!%22

“Chilled to the bone!” has more damage (almost double with traits), a lot of sinergy with Reaper traits, almost the same stun, 12 seconds of chill (that Reaper can explode and spread) and 2 seconds of resistance.

Jade Winds sucks compared to this one. “Chilled to the bone!” is going to be a nightmare in pvp.

Einlazer, 1s on a Thief is actually worth, compared to 2s on a Revenant, that is way slower.

Warrior has shouts, signets, greatsword and heavy armor, but 10k more HP, does it mean that Guardian is useless or replaced? Nope.
I’m also hearing no complains by Rangers, even if Guardian is getting longbow and traps.

Thief and Revenant are nowhere alike.
It’s like complaining about Reaper because it has a better Basilisk Venom. Actually that shout is WAY better than both BV and JW. Does it make thief BV builds less viable? No.
Necro and Reaper are extremely slow classes and have no stealth, burst or surprise effects.

Thiefs and assassins share similar traits, but are 2 very different things.

You should also wait for thief elite spec however.

Revenant replacing Guardian, AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
Mallyx actually worth something in condition management, AHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Isn’t Basilisk Venom 2 stacks? Plus 1s of cast is to apply the venom to the weapon (like a Mantra skill). You can stun instantly 2 times for 30 seconds after that.

Jade Winds is used too if blocked however. That wasn’t meant as an advantage for BV, that still has the upper hand for the lack of cast time (excluding the one needed to coat the weapon, that you can do before starting the fight)

Einlanzer.1627:

Yeah that 1 second of stun behind a second long cast time and 40 second cooldown is so OP.

Isn’t Basilisk Venom 2 stacks? Plus 1s of cast is to apply the venom to the weapon (like a Mantra skill). You can stun instantly 2 times for 30 seconds after that.

Am I wrong?

You’re comparing an instant unavoidable skill to an easy to avoid one with a longer cast time, just because of the aoe effect.
Also I don’t think people will give up 5 seconds of Impossible Odds too often for that.

If we had stealth, on the other hand, it would be OP.

draxynnic.3719:

skowcia.8257:

A link i posted up..Briliant

If not signets then wtf is that? Spectra, survival or physical skills?

Seriously…

I can see how people see signets from that, but if you compare to actual signets, they’re really not. With actual signets, the area inside the circle is monochromatic, resembling a metal which has been inscribed with a design. The glint skill icons have many similarities with signets – a circle and some similarities with the border design – but inside the gold ring, they don’t have the ‘inscribed in metal’ look.

They’re closer to glyphs, but even glyphs have a lot less colour to them. The circle might just prove to have some significance related to the Glint legend that we haven’t figured out yet, or maybe they liked the idea of giving them all a common element.

Signet mechanics also go completely against the revenant mechanic for utility skills. As an elite specialisation there is the possibility to change the way the profession functions, but an overhaul like that – particularly when you can presumably still swap into a more conventional legend – seems highly unlikely.

But signets actually have different styles:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Signet_of_Resolve.png
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Signet_of_Malice.png
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Signet_of_Restoration.png

Signet of Malice is not even made of metal.

Plus Glyphs are a skill type that change their effect based on the caster’s attunement. Since you can only use those skills when “attuned” to Glint, it makes no sense.

Signets instead are interesting. Swap to Glint to get passive effects and some minor effects from activation, then swap to a more active legend.

skowcia.8257:

Cus weaponswap is sooo original right?

It’s a base class mechanic. Do you want it removed from Necromancer as well because it’s not original? After all Necromancers already get a new set of weaponskills with F1.

Seriously, you want a worse machanic for the sake of originality? No, thanks.

skowcia.8257:

cut

Do I need to repeat myself?
Elementalist wannabe with heavy armor and less customization. Plus unwanted behaviour, forcing you to change skills when you swap legend.
Assuming your idea can be somewhat useful, you need some ranged modes on melee weapons. This way you force people to go ranged when they simply want to swap utility skills. It’s exactly like changing weapon based on current legend, and it’s bad (plus it needs more work for no benefits at all).

You’re not getting any better. Go play Elementalis, because they have exactly the machanic you want.

Einlanzer.1627:

Thieves don’t actually have the best offense atm, and they have among the worst attrition. That’s the reason they have stealth.

Did I say dps? Nope, I said burst. I know that Eles are on top atm.

I see no problem in spending cd during exploration. If you want mobility while fighting you have a lot of blinks already and a lot of passive movement speed.

And you don’t have to follow a Warrior. Just stealth and basilisk venom. You’re also talking about the only 1 class that is not wreacked by a thief burst. You should have counters guys.
Thief has some god mode builds atm.

>Jade Winds
>Extremely useful
Pick one.

Sure, take Jade Winds, but give stealth, no cooldowns and blinks. Oh and Basilisk Venom, that is actually better and impossible to avoid.

Also
Chilled to the bone! (Reaper) – stun 2 seconds, chill for 12 seconds, resistance 2 seconds
Jade Winds – stun 3 seconds
Give Necro Chilled to the bone! and nobody blinks an eye, but give Revenant Jade Winds and everyone loses their mind.

Chilled to the bone! (Reaper) – stun 2 seconds, chill for 12 seconds, resistance 2 seconds
Jade Winds – stun 3 seconds
Give Necro Chilled to the bone! and nobody blinks an eye, but give Revenant Jade Winds and everyone loses their mind.

Jade Winds – Radius: 600, blockable, easy to evade
Basilisk Venom – The venom is still used if an attack is blocked, evaded, obstructed, negated by Blind, or if the target has Invulnerability or Defiance.

Jade Winds – 50 energy cost
Basilisk Venom – 0 initiative cost

Plus Thief can use Basilisk Venom while in stealth and unload all its initiative on the enemy.

Do you even Thief guys?

Black Box.9312:

lol, Guardian staff and shouts. If you want to have to stop moving every 15 seconds and/or sacrifice at least half of your damage and sustain, then yeah sure, you can get 100% swiftness uptime.

You don’t need damage while exploring/moving.
And you don’t have to stop at all.

I wish there was a downvote function for this kind of thread.

Einlanzer.1627:

Ragion.2831:

Because thief has stealth.

As I said, that’s not a good enough reason.

Because thief has initiative+stealth and can basically wreack almost any zerker or mob with the highest burst in the game.
Plus the highest mobility and blinks. Plus you don’t waste initiative to use basilisk venom, and it can’t be avoided except with block/evade, while Jade Winds is easy to spot and you just need to move away (or dodge even more easily).

Are you going to be kitten also for Reaper’s elite? Because it’s basically the same as Jade Wind, except it can be traited to do a lot of damage. And it’s also faster if I’m not mistaken. Plus gives chill and resistance.
Jade Wind is actually pretty weak.

skowcia.8257:

My idea was to make an f2 key to alter weapon skills based on a legend.

So basically attunement, except you also swap utilities. You basically wanted Revenant to be an underpowered Elementalist.
0 originality and still the same problems I addressed in my previous post (what if I want to keep the same weaponskills/range with a different legend? What if I simply want to get some energy back or breakstun without having to use a different set of skills/weapon?)

That’s actually even worse then I imagined.

I prefer Revenant’s class mechanic to be independent from weaponswap. If that’s not fine with you, then go play Elementslist, since it’s basically what you want.

TheSwede.9512:

cut

Loving those.

Also the elite is taken from the one that Rythlock uses in the story.

They already had a build ready with weaponswap, and were discussing it internally. The general complains just helped them decide. That’s what Roy said at least.

I’m pretty sure however that the previous activation with legend swap was manually added to makes those sigils usable by Revenants.
Probably they’ll only activate with normal weaponswap in the next iteration.

Not a big deal if they activate with both however. They still have icd.

JoshuaRAWR.4653:

Malyx, not sure on this one to be honest.

Mallyx has some flaws with condition copy imo. The ones that stack in duration completely break you.

However its upkeep does actually more damage then Shiro’s.

skowcia.8257:

I never said i want a weapon swap linked to to legend swap. Not even once, if i did then show me a quote+link to post.

If I’m mistaken then tell me your idea, you simply said that weaponswap is not good, so I assumed you prefer the other most popular option.

skowcia.8257:

Also Mallyx is not 15%, but 10%. Where you get that idea from? WIki? Wiki is wrong and outdated.

I remembered 10% too, but then i checked wiki. However 10% more power, precision and Ferocity is basically 30% more damage, without factoring a 2% bonus from items that give you power/precision from vitality/toughness. 32 seconds of 30% more damage is better then just quickness, also because you can get quickness in other ways, so you can have Mallyx+quickness.
And also 10% more precision means you use more of your ferocity, and without wasting more energy.
EDIT: I also forgot that Mallyx upkeep copies conditions, so yeah, you do way more damage.

And that was just ONE example.

skowcia.8257:

And i am talking about pvp, not pve.

I’m talking about everything, since you can’t have a different class mechanic for pvp only.

Rich Fuel.7253:

the Mist realm is in a different time and space zone, different times like on earth is 24 hours is a day other planets has 28 hours a day

1 hour is 1 hour, regardless of how many there are in 1 day. Flow of time only changes with gravity and speed, so 1 hour for you may be 1 year or 1 second (seen from the outside).
However I get what you mean and I agree: doing 50 meters in the mist doesn’t mean that you also are 50 meters away whan you’re back in the real world. Or spending 1 day in the mist doesn’t mean that once you’re back 1 day has passed.

That’s my argument.

Phys, are you changing the subject? I still want to hear your creative alternative for weaponswap
And I don’t see any problem in changing legend every 10 or more seconds.
Other classes use their mechanic even more often (expecially Warriors since last patch).