Wonder if this means gvg guilds never leaving guild halls. I am not gvg and I personally don’t like the changes. I can’t imagine what the fighters think …..
A message about this issue when you enter a bl similar to your game will restart in x minutes could work. Only need to do it once when you enter a bl….
If they end up on the lowest servers and much isn’t going on, will they become a paying customer?
Do you think they would be more likely to become a customer if they joined a T2 server where they are constantly being spawn camped and ticking for less than 100 ppt?
This idea would let them experience WvW across multiple tiers. They would have a different experience every time they logged in.
I admit I read past multiple worlds figuring they would always end up on the low servers. I guess it depends on how they were spread ensuring they don’t get the same server – maybe even a prompt for high or medium.
Either way, they have to choose a world up front anyway and I don’t see anet spending any time on changing that….
Yea was trying to say maybe that was when RNG was changed, op thought it went away entirely. Thank you for the numbers though, I know it is 100 + some weird thing Snowreap described now. I did not know what the wider range was previously……
Do free players going into wvw affect the server status? Would really suck to send a server to full based on free ‘alt’ accounts that go into wvw and do nothing to help, but are there to hinder…..
The problem is when the state of wvw is discussed there are always a few that will say it Is because server xyz. Then someone responds what server abc did – making it a matchup thread..
And some servers were trapped because they could not rise above their bracket or drop below their bracket during a tournament……
That is wrong. We had tournaments that literally used the exact winner moves up to the next tier and loser moved down a tier, every week of the tournament, precisely like the system your describing.
It was an utter disaster. Just as I detailed in my post above. We very literally have tested this system through the tournaments, and it was a complete failure.
My memory could be failing, but was there not a ceiling and a floor? Silver could never get to t2 (gold) or t6 (bronze).
Each season that I recall had servers that would have dropped through that floor if they could-sor and maguuma come to mind. Some may have risen through that ceiling as well- hod comes to mind.
I will end it that I think comparing to a season / tournament where the stacked can’t rise far enough and the imploded can’t fall far enough is not comparable.
We had tournaments that were straight up set so the winner moves up and the loser moved down, with no floor or ceiling at all. Some servers did drop through the floor.
How is comparing a tournament not comparable? It was an literal trial of what your asking for. And what do you think will happen if they do a trial of this again? Players will stack and play more WvW then normal, exactly like they do in a tournament, in order to hold their position. Because they know it will be a short trial, so they will pile onto the servers just like a tournament.
I do not recall any tournament where a server could climb out of silver to gold or drop down from silver to bronze. I do remember people gaming the results to get an easier matchup or force another server to a tougher match by purposely losing (s2?). Those were for the end of the season points / rewards…
Anyway, we will never agree on this so no use continuing.
We had tournaments that were straight up set so the winner moves up and the loser moved down, with no floor or ceiling at all. Some servers did drop through the floor.
What? We never had any tournaments where there were no floor or ceiling. Gold, Silver, and Bronze are brackets that no server could cross even if their population size dictated the necessity. I think it is highly telling of these brackets that EU has a 9 server rotation that corresponds to their 9 server Gold league while NA had 6 servers locked at the top, which corresponds to NA’s 6 server Gold league.
The Swiss-style matches from Season 3 were to me nothing more than a FASTER METHOD to sort servers by population and coverage than glicko. I thought that was excellent.
Okay, sorry guys. It seems I may have been the one remembering it wrong.
Well, in that case, I change my opinion on the “trial comment”. As I tend to be a proponent of trying something in an event style or trial run, then I guess I would be in favor of 1U1D trial period for a short time to see how it goes in actuality.
No worries from my end…. 1U1D may iN the end work exactly like you think, but one will never know unless it is tried. 2 months of status quo which may or may not bring new people in via HOT just seems too long…….
@johje – thanks for sort of walking it through. I agree at the very top and bottom it will be flip flop every other week for some time, but the in between seems much more interesting with the possibilities…
If Glicko is the only answer, would a reset / start over make some sense?
And some servers were trapped because they could not rise above their bracket or drop below their bracket during a tournament……
That is wrong. We had tournaments that literally used the exact winner moves up to the next tier and loser moved down a tier, every week of the tournament, precisely like the system your describing.
It was an utter disaster. Just as I detailed in my post above. We very literally have tested this system through the tournaments, and it was a complete failure.
My memory could be failing, but was there not a ceiling and a floor? Silver could never get to t2 (gold) or t6 (bronze).
Each season that I recall had servers that would have dropped through that floor if they could-sor and maguuma come to mind. Some may have risen through that ceiling as well- hod comes to mind.
I will end it that I think comparing to a season / tournament where the stacked can’t rise far enough and the imploded can’t fall far enough is not comparable.
We had tournaments that were straight up set so the winner moves up and the loser moved down, with no floor or ceiling at all. Some servers did drop through the floor.
How is comparing a tournament not comparable? It was an literal trial of what your asking for. And what do you think will happen if they do a trial of this again? Players will stack and play more WvW then normal, exactly like they do in a tournament, in order to hold their position. Because they know it will be a short trial, so they will pile onto the servers just like a tournament.
I do not recall any tournament where a server could climb out of silver to gold or drop down from silver to bronze. I do remember people gaming the results to get an easier matchup or force another server to a tougher match by purposely losing (s2?). Those were for the end of the season points / rewards…
Anyway, we will never agree on this so no use continuing.
And some servers were trapped because they could not rise above their bracket or drop below their bracket during a tournament……
That is wrong. We had tournaments that literally used the exact winner moves up to the next tier and loser moved down a tier, every week of the tournament, precisely like the system your describing.
It was an utter disaster. Just as I detailed in my post above. We very literally have tested this system through the tournaments, and it was a complete failure.
My memory could be failing, but was there not a ceiling and a floor? Silver could never get to t2 (gold) or t6 (bronze).
Each season that I recall had servers that would have dropped through that floor if they could-sor and maguuma come to mind. Some may have risen through that ceiling as well- hod comes to mind.
I will end it that I think comparing to a season / tournament where the stacked can’t rise far enough and the imploded can’t fall far enough is not comparable.
And some servers were trapped because they could not rise above their bracket or drop below their bracket to a place where they belonged. The fact some servers were stuck where they did not belong continued to influence the rest of the bracket. The other problem with this comparison is people stacked, and continued to stack, to various servers they predicted would win the bracket. This left quite a difference between bottom gold/top silver and bottom silver/top bronze. Would hod have been stacked if they could have climbed to gold?
Limit of no map chat better include whisper – or everyone will be turning that off after the 18 millionth gold seller whisper that can friend you so they can mail…….
If you arent on the server whos winning and you are thinking of giving up ppt to let them go to tier 1, YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE A BAD TIME.
If you think your current situation is bad imagine if a real tier 1 server drops to your tier, if i was you i would 1vs2 them and push hard because if you let a tier 1 server drops its gg!
What is in place now does not work. I fail to see how a 1 up 1 down trial for 2 months or so labeled as an “event” would do more harm than good. If it works well, it can be made permanent. If it works exactly like some of you think it will, then it goes away…..
If you hadn’t noticed, SOS went high and fa very high yesterday. You don’t think mag/sbi/cd can compete with them? Db has made a bit of a comeback, shouldn’t they get the chance to 1 up until they can go no farther?
Glicko takes way too long to adjust to shifting populations and NA has had huge shifts in the last month…..
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As far as returning players from HOT goes, I see all sorts of neat PVE things….. Wvw – where’s the beef? (Ok ancient reference there) I haven’t seen anything yet that will draw AND keep new bodies in wvw…..
From what I read on dulfy, it just seems like demo/trial stuff to try the game, with tons of limitations that should prevent any wvw griefing or gold spamming. They have done this periodically with free trial weekends, I guess they want to offer this all the time now if this is true. This is normal with many games isnt it? WoW offers trials doesnt it, thats how I learned I hated it after trying it for 5mins. But yea I dont see much of an issue here tbh with all the limitations listed it shouldnt be a problem.
If you’re not in a hurry for moving you honestly should wait until after the HoT release. The top 3 tiers are, IMO, in a terrible state of health and I would think twice before moving a guild there – especially if it is the guilds first move.
T3 once again has the closest match up out of any of the servers and still has a nice buffer between T2 and T4. I’m sure it won’t last forever thanks to the T2 implosion but T3 is very healthy at the moment.
I don’t think it will last as you long as you may think – certainly not long enough to spend gems…. Fa just went very high and SOS high to show what is happening…… HOD is also within RNG range now (<10%)…..
There is 32% chance this week Of the roll. Was 20% chance last week…. There is a matchup wish list thread on this forum that is updated weekly and coveragewars2.com also shows the percentage. These reflect the percentages of a matchup on the upcoming reset not a projection of the future weeks down the road. The forum post is based on when Snowreap ran the magic. Coveragewars2 run the same thing I believe, but is as current as the page refresh.
Snowreap.5174 on these forums can explain how it works…. ( it is somewhere in that thread)
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Now rolling a t1 match versus becoming server #3 in Glicko are 2 different things. I’d rather they got rid of Glicko myself and go 1 up 1 down, but that is a different discussion….
There is a difference in YB passing one of the other servers and YB getting within RNG roll of a t1 matchup. That chance is about 32% compared to 20% last week. Eventually RNG will put YB in a t1 matchup as the number of rolls increases along with the % chance.
Only once it happens will it be determined if it is a one off, semi frequent RNG roll, or more….
The change I mentioned previously is multi-part. The change that makes all arrow carts use line-of-sight did indeed go out today, but the second part about the arrow cart line-of-sight checks being too forgiving was not part of today’s build. The changes to the way arrow cart line-of-sight is calculated is set for an upcoming patch.
Thanks for the update and help, many of us appreciate the effort.
Id like to ask about the other part of todays update, regarding killing players in spaces they are not allowed to be, does that include spawn sites because that would be doubly great.
And cant wait to get the rest of the ac update, please dont take to long
I thought citadel, but spawn would be good as well. Even better would be under the map…….
Interesting. Gudradain. I’m a bit old school though. I don’t mind ratings but I am about wins and losses. Nothing moves someone more than the simple fact of busting butt to win because there is a reason to win.
There is zero incentive to win in a winner up/loser down system. If you win, you will get promoted and then lose next week. If you lose, you will get demoted and then win next week. If you come in the middle, you will likely come in the middle next week, too.
Where’s the incentive to want to win? The 3 bonus boxes containing crap greens you get for winning? I don’t think so.
Even without incentive,1 up and 1 down should move a server to a point where it is competitive now – not based on what was a month or weeks ago. A “winning server” could go up and then fall back down, but it may also take second or win again to move up yet again. The same for servers bleeding players. If they drop down fast enough to where they can be competitive and have fun, they may not totally implode….
Some places like t1/t2 and t7/t8 (U.S.) may have 2 servers swapping constantly. I don’t think this would be the case with t2/t3 and t6/t7 (and all between). Until it is attempted – maybe a 6-8 week trial “event” we can only speculate……
Yes
Militia is the Pvx pugs who come to help, but do others things than wvw.
Blue is the common commander tag for open groups. Red, yellow, and purple are often some form scout, guild, defender commander – color varies by server.
No clue on spreadsheet unless this is how they track where the forces are spread out for reset.
because of the T1 guilds that stacked on YB and turned T2 into a EotM karma train. There is just no more good fights in T2.
If that had never happened, it is a pretty good bet that matches would have been a complete toss-up, not predetermined, with YB and FA being full and SoS able to get more players.
That’s the rub – who knew at the time SOS was going to open up 10 days later (or so) after being stuck in a 2 server tier for quite a few months. SOS was totally screwed being a semi- empty full by no fault of their own….
Exactly with the bonus that you don’t face the same 2 servers forever… Worst case is t1 ‘loser’ constantly swaps with t2 ‘winner’ and t7 loser constantly swaps with t8 winner (NA). In that scenario, servers 1,2,23, and 24 only have 2 combinations that swap every other week.
Pick a date, use Glicko one last time to set the seeding order, then ash can it to the recesses of our memory. After that, 1 up 1 down to reset the next weeks matches.
Over time, the matches should come to some sort of an equilibrium where decent matches that are not stagnant can occur… If a server gains people, they will rise. If a server loses people, they will fall. Either way, they will get to matches where they can compete and have fun.
Still doesn’t address coverage etc, but it is a start……
I just thinks its slightly odd that those guilds managed to transfer to YB just before the wvw population changes were announced. Knowing full well that the leaders of this “alliance” have often bragged about the close contacts they have with some anet employees i wonder if they got some information about the changes before the rest of us did. Having also been informed that some employees " fully supported" the idea then it would seem a real possibility that this was the case.
The timing was so troll, but actually impeded the move. Pretty sure some got left behind when YB went full and they hadn’t moved yet (with no way to get there either)
A tourney – just to mix things up – when multiple tiers got locked to the same matchup for so long may have helped… Or even a 1 up 1 down month long event……. The other part that hurt several servers SOS-db was the full (but not really) status. SOS full for so long, but clearly outmanned didn’t help for sure. Who knows if this would have ever happened if that change was made before t1 guilds came down……
Well, the OP wrote that he likes occasional roaming and zerging as well.
What always gets me is the number of players who prefer servers that have tags around but never seem willing to tag up themselves. I understand it is really difficult for a lot of new tags to deal with criticism and I hear EOTM is one of the worst places to tag up in, even surpassing EBG. Perhaps Anet will attempt to address that for WvW too. LOL. Sorry for my sarcasm.
I am one who looks for a tag, but won’t tag myself. I will not criticize anyone who does though – good or bad… If they try and are respectful, I won’t give up after 1-2 wipes either….
