Guild Wars 2

Ugh both of the ones for my fav class are kinda junk, mesmer and necro. O look more do damage to self to hurt enemies stuff and of course it will get gutted once its live and transform elites hurt anyone who has minions.

What gets me is the fact that BG/JQ seem to be upset that SoR stopped being the third wheel in there two fight. Is it really that bad that you guys have to fight each other and don’t have a small guy to pick on? Also don’t think this is a unique thing. Any server that comes up to tier 1 and gets trounced on for awhile is going to start going to EoTM instead and just leave you two to duke it out.

Good foe them, viable but annoying tactic, I comend thos

Qaelyn.7612:

Sanduskel.1850:

we care about winning. we don’t care about taking objectives.

The cognitive dissonance is strong in this one. LOL.

Samhayn.2385:

Whole lotta telling people they are quitters because they don’t play they way you want them to play going on in this thread.

They’re being called quitters because they are quitters. It’s not about them playing the way someone else wants. It’s about them suddenly deciding they don’t want to play the way they played when they had matchups more favorable to them, and the way they will play again when they have more favorable matchups.

You don’t really think this “we prefer EotM playstyle” bullsquat will last more than 10 seconds after they get paired with weaker servers, do you?

so if SoR decides not to fight a losing battle (honestly look at the history of tier 1 SoR is not a real contender). Again it is about playing the way others want, you may not like it but if people choose to go to EoTM when they have no way of winning a match up (or even place 2nd) and come back when the odds are more even or slightly on there favor what is it to you? They are playing the game the way they want to with in the rules established by Anet.

Whole lotta telling people they are quitters because they don’t play they way you want them to play going on in this thread.

if anyone bothered you could see that the scoring system in wvw has been one of the largest complaints on the forums, if you can’t field 24/7 coverage the game encourages you to move to somewhere that can OR to stop caring about PPT.

Hmmm fighting for points that will never mean anything once your servers off hours play begins so you will never catch up and never have a chance to even close the gap finally wore people out. Now they either moved or play for the fights. Is it really unreasonable for people to play in such a way that they have fun?

This land was made for you and me!

Umm stability? I mean your a guardian and all.

You can buy ranks with laurels and badges, both can be obtained thru pve, just sayin.

FlamingFoxx.1305:

Arkvan.3561:

Woop, new build. Fingers crossed (by the way, it’s 1.53, dunno what time it is over there but hell, dedication to the job Anet. <3)

Ahh -clings to fellow NZ player- <3

But yeah, great dedication Anet.

its about 5pm as of my posting, but I’m sure they will have guys working late tonight just to see what else pops up.

Name.9625:

Darnacus.5961:

What I don’t get it – if PVE-only player are sooo uber in WvW, why are they complaining about going in WvW for LS in the first place ?

BTW, you all paid for the full package, I encourage everyone to play all three modes, it’s fun and way less repetitive

I think there are a lot of PvE:ers that have tried all modes of the game already. And i am quite sure that there are enough of them who just don´t enjoy PvP.
So please everyone stop requesting us to go into PvP, because we could possibly like it, even tho we have already figured out that we don´t.
Why don´t all the WvWers and PvPers come over to the PvE world and play there? It could be fun for you as well…..

uhmm we do all the time, where do you think our gold, equipment, and everything else come from? If we ever want to finish a LS achievement we go to pve, because we have to.

Atherakhia.4086:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

I think the real issue is that currently Warriors are currently rewarded far more than other professions for not specializing. For example, if a Warrior had to run Cleric’s gear to have high sustain, I wouldn’t think anything of it. But they don’t. They just equip Healing Signet and boom, they have high sustain.

I wouldn’t mind if they had to spec heavily into defense to be impossible to burst down, but they really don’t. Almost every weapon set has significant damage mitigation capabilities built in (Axe/Axe is the only one I can think of that doesn’t) and on top of that, they have numerous utilities and even a heal option where they simply do not take damage.

About the only things Warriors actually have to spec into is damage, but since that is the only thing they need to spec for, there’s no reason to not do it.

Biggest thing I would do would be to heavily nerf the base values of the Healing Signet passive and Adrenal Health, but also drastically boost the Healing Power scaling (say, up to 20% from the current 5% on the signet). At bare minimum, this forces the Warrior to actually spec for heavy sustain if they want it. Addressing the other roles that should be specced for is more complex, but sustain, at least, has an easy thing to point to and say “this needs to change”.

Most weapon sets for most classes have ways to avoid damage.

What other heal in the game requires heavy investment in healing power before it’s worth slotting? You can’t start a precedent like this unless you’re prepared to follow through with it for every class.

If the only thing Warriors need to spec into is damage, why do no Warriors spec into damage? The meta specs right now are 0/0/30/30/10 (or something close like 0/0/25/30/15) or 0/0/30/10/30. Neither of these are investing in damage. It’s all utility.

Has anyone who has formed an opinion that the class is overpowered actually played the class so they can actually offer an informed and unbiased opinion on the class? Every post in this thread is just people looking to eviscerate the class instead of actually balance it. The class is overpowered, but the ideas people come up with leave me thinking no one has actually played it…

see I do play a warrior, 30/0/20/020, GS/sword shield. When I say that Warrior is to good at to many things this is what I mean. Good survivabilty(not a bunker) good damage, good condition cleanse, almost completely immune to immobilize. Its not that this build is the best at anyone thing its that a build like this is good at almost everything. The best part is if I do come across something that may beat me i don’t need to stick around nd find out.

DarkFrost.2847:

Well, taking a look at the Edge Of The Mists update, there are a few fatal flaws in this whole thing. Flaw number one, it will pull people from all maps including current wvw players into a zone where ppt does not matter. Two, it gets rid of the queue for the higher ranked (stacked) servers so there is no longer any incentive to leave said server. Three, by pulling players and guilds from the normal wvw maps, the entire scoring system is completely meaningless for any server that does not already constantly queue the normal wvw maps, it does this by taking the already fluctuating amount of people in wvw and exacerbates the fluctuation. For say 2-3 weeks, your server’s wvw guilds hang out in EotM, you drop ranks, they get bored, then it’s karma training and you go back up in rank. Those guilds now have to work for their ppt, no more karma training, and it’s back to EotM, rise and repeat.
I could be totally wrong, but I doubt it. Players will flock to “New and shiny” especially a lot of the wvw players that have been begging for new wvw maps. Let me be the first to congratulate you, ANet, for not listening to your player base.

so new map. People on stacked servers flood EoTM and most likely sit in a near empty overflow. Servers actually move around and get matches with different servers. I don’t see bad in this.

NoTrigger.8396:

Danikat.8537:

Most of them just don’t like the idea that other players can kill them. Yes things attack and kill you in PvE too but they’re usually a lot easier to beat and not as persistent.

timidobserver.7925:

g e o.2589:

Why do pve players whine about LW in EoTM – fist of all there are now queues so you can get in anytime you want – no more “I can’t adjust it to my playtime” arguments. There are no server specifications so even low-pop servers gain same amount of people as T1 servers do. You are not restricted to playing alone. The only difference is that there are more hostile creatures – be it Legendary Bosses or players.

The two things that make PVE players complain about PVE:

1. PVE players basically have a sort of combination of fear, anxiety, and anger at competition and the idea of other players being able to kill them.

2. In GW2, the mechanics of NPCs are extremely easy to predict and avoid. This makes it hard for PVE players to go into PvP where they are just taking advantage of some poorly designed NPC that simply requires them to dodge at the right moment every few seconds.

this is what happens when good PvE players go into wvw:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCaEGzBkEuo

seriously, scripted AI is better than 99% of the wvw and pvp players.

so a video of a good player (pve) vs bad players (wvw,pve who knows) means what? If anything this shows that pve players should embrace this LS since they obviously can just come into EoTM and just beat up us wvw players.

losbananas.8674:

Samhayn.2385:

losbananas.8674:

MarzAttakz.9608:

If you can’t beat them, join them, quite simple really! Maybe it’s time you pve’ers actually did something for the server you’re playing on.

Yes, because I’m so thankfull of bonusses that I don’t care about.

Thx thx thx for providing me with something that i neither need or want.
Also, don’t pretend you play WvW to give your server bonusses. You do it because you derive fun from it. So the bonusses are more like an ‘accident de parcours’ then something you strive to achieve.

And when you accidentaly activate a bonus, you deserve no thx for that. If you were to WvW strictly to give bonusses then you would get my thx. But let’s face it, that’s not why you WvW, now is it?

so all the content that was pve only and drove us out of the part of the game we have fun with is cool but asking you to come to our playground is some how bad? Just wondering.

So wait, what are you on about.

What i said is that no WvW’er should go and expect gratitude from strictly pve players for the srv bonusses. If they were to do WvW simply because of the bonusses, then they would be worth of our thx. But they don’t. They play WvW because they like it. If I as a strictly pve player were to unluck server bonusses for our WvW players, then would i be right in expecting thx for it? No.

You are perfectly fine in asking me to come play WvW. I’m perfectly in my right to say no. End of story. All this nonsense about how ppl should thank the benevolence of WvW players who play WvW against their will only to give us bonusses is just silly.
Because they play WvW for the WvW and the fun they derive of it, and not to unlock bonusses for the srv.

Also, how would pve content drive you out of pve. That just makes no sense. Also, why would something mystical that apparantely drove you to play the WvW which you really don’t like convince me of also playing WvW. Poor you, those mean dev’s forcing you to play WvW.

I don’t oppose the implementation of any WvW into the LS. I’m happy for you. But don’t expect me to thank you for giving bonusses by accident. And don’t expect me to take part in this LS. I don’t play WvW because I don’t like it. And these hautain arguments of how thankfull pve players should be to the WvW’ers are just nonsense, and make me resent a part of the community that I so far just ignored, since we never crossed paths.

All this chest beating and ‘bow down to us supreme overlords of PvP’ arguments just provoke one thing in me. Loathing and disrespect.

So by all means, enjoy the new WvW content. Just don’t annoy pve’rs with it or expect thanx for doing exactly that which you enjoy.

no, I’m strictly a WvW.player and find it annoying that if I really want to get any of the LS stuff done I absolutely need to pve. Yet I deal with it, I understand that pve is always a big selling point in an mmo and a bite my tongue and go kill a giant mechanical hooker. What gets to me now is people are so mad at the fact the this part of the LS is pvp driven and complain to no end with out stepping back and seeing that very little has been done for wvw and that maybe we need to spread some.of this development out. I for one hope to see more LS in EoTM since it is the best pvp area to do it in.

Chris.3290:

I’m asking because the projected teams have SoR, Mag, and FA all on the same color; all servers that are “about the fights” and don’t care overly much about PPT. If they come out in force, it’s going to be a one-sided bloodbath and will be the most hated patch in the history of MMOs.

this could be fun.

If dagger cleave is fine, if axe it should be a cone that hits upto 3 tatgets

BurrTheKing.8571:

I’m getting tired of this pointless circle-jerk.

Some counters, going with Hambow as it’s the most common, some of these examples can be beaten by other Warrior builds but those would in term lose to builds Hambow may not etc.:

1. PU Mesmer. Having all your AIs scattered about makes them not be taken out by Combustive Shot. With all of the stun breaks, teleports, and blurred frenzy you should never be hit by a full Hammer combo.

2. Melee Ranger. The build I’ve found that works best was Axe/Dagger+Sword/Torch with 0/0/30/30/10. I lost to this a few times and tried it out for myself and even with my terrible mastery of the playstyle (I find it odd to let my skills do most of the moving for me and end up canceling skills by accident) I could beat most meta Warrior builds. It has insane regen, but also tons of protection. In fact the person I got this build off of beat pretty much every 1v1 I saw them get into. Undead runes with Rabid gear makes them capable of large condi spikes and most importantly they almost always have poison applied. Add it Rampage as One and for 20 seconds the Warrior can do very little damage to you and you can force them to use most of their long CD condition skills while it’s up.

3. Standard Condi Necro with Golem. The one big mistake I always see Necros make is that they use all their best skills at the start and while Berseker Stance is up. You have to putt on just enough condis to force the stance, kite while it’s active, then wait until they use their burst and pile everything on. If you see them go for another burst to cleanse use the Goelm’s charge to either force them to use their Stability (Hambow only brings generally, contrary to popular belief) and if you can corrupt it while laying down the Fear you’re a shoe-in. Now, if they have say Signet of Stamina they may win,but that means they went full on into countering you and it makes them weaker to the other 2 builds mentioned.

4. Damage Guardian. I don’t know a ton about this build but I do know that with all of their blind, high damage, and access to invulnerability that they have a strong chance of beating the Warrior, especially if you get the upper hand early. Same thing as Necro, don’t waste your blinds when Zerker Stance is up and use your blocks that will last you for most of the duration and then blind the big telegraphed Hammer attacks and it’s cash money.

5. Blind Thieves. Similar to Guardian, it’s all about saving your blinds for the big telegraphed attacks and suddenly their DPS is kitten poor. Especially potent is using the steal skill in a blind field, it’s probably the most annoying thing ever to a Warrior.

I’m sure there’s a few more I’ve forgotten but I feel that 5 makes my point, play defensive when Zerker Stance is up, then negate all of the Hammer’s big attacks. Also of note, Pin Down actually does have a different animation, there’s circles around the arrow as it flies. Now this is harder to see coming in CQC but don’t you worry because that’s getting nearly a second charge time soon so at that point Warrior will be the undisputed king of obvious and highly telegraphed attacks.

My biggest gripe with this forum is that I hardly ever hear anyone seriously trying to counter the current meta. Most just instantly throw their hands up in the air when something beats their current build and demand it gets nerfed without even attempting to find a solution. It’s getting really annoying because even in real life everyone wants the solution handed to them on a silver platter rather than trying to fix things yourself.

I like how you put necro and kite in there together during the part of the fight that nothing can slow you down. I mean its easy right?

Manuhell.2759:

rpfohr.7048:

High Access to poison and soft CC.
But is not enough, you need some defense to get by their initial immunity.

Thus classes I feel do well against warriors are ranger and engi.

Guess what, they’re just nerfing poison grenade and net turret in the balance patch…

I think you found it. Everything is balanced around warriors. If its strong against them it needs to be nerfed, vigor uptime, posion uptime, condition application (see dhuumfire).

hellsmachine.4085:

OP needs to L2P. Try dodging their obvious attacks.

favorite answer to every thing. So as a necro with my 2 dodges do I dodge the stin, knockback, knockdown or weakness? That’s just from hammer attacks, no utilities or second weapon set added but you get the idea.

truely the only counter to warriors is a PU mesmer with on death condition application from clones, between stealth, vigor (getting nerfed) and constant application of conditions from clones being replaced they cam whittle warriors down. Yet this build is considered “cheesy” and they are looking at nerfing it. Also PU has no way to keep you from leaving so you don’t actually need to die to it.

roamzero.9486:

Only reliable way is to outcheese them, either signet of spite them with a 100% duration condi Necro, or wear them down with a PU Mesmer or blind spamming d/p Thief. (Im mainly talking about WvW where they can get -100% duration on CC conditions)

yeah but those cheese builds are on the chopping block.

Lunacy Solacio.6514:

Becka Williams.4978:

Edge of the Mists can be entered at any time. It’s just the only WvW map that creates overflows when it’s full.

If so that is great, but they have worded it as such that it is implied it will only be accessible while in queue and that has been a big concern for many. Ordinarily I’d say the concern is unfounded. It’s just that the only mention of Edge of the Mists each time is that while in queue, it would be accessible. Of course, assuming does always get one in trouble.

As for the living story content, it can be hoped that they noticed what did not work, and do not repeat the same mistakes. What I and many want, is a better story. For all it’s problems, GW1 did have a pretty good story. I do not expect half that level of work on a regular content update, but I expected more than what has been seen here.

I do understand how much work has been put into the updates, it’s just that in a way, most of their hard work has been wasted, and that is sad.

Having said all that, we wait and see what the updates bring.

massivly has an interview with Devon, it has a screen shot that shoe you can join even if your server has no queue

losbananas.8674:

MarzAttakz.9608:

If you can’t beat them, join them, quite simple really! Maybe it’s time you pve’ers actually did something for the server you’re playing on.

Yes, because I’m so thankfull of bonusses that I don’t care about.

Thx thx thx for providing me with something that i neither need or want.
Also, don’t pretend you play WvW to give your server bonusses. You do it because you derive fun from it. So the bonusses are more like an ‘accident de parcours’ then something you strive to achieve.

And when you accidentaly activate a bonus, you deserve no thx for that. If you were to WvW strictly to give bonusses then you would get my thx. But let’s face it, that’s not why you WvW, now is it?

so all the content that was pve only and drove us out of the part of the game we have fun with is cool but asking you to come to our playground is some how bad? Just wondering.

Three separate sides all on an over flow and most likely all sides at full capacity and all fighting for the same LS objective. I don’t define that as greifing.

style.6173:

hopefully, players can kill other players while completing this version of LS. It would be a completely new dynamic to the game and I think worth trying.

gosh I hope so, I love attacking people in the middle of a boss fight and then taking the boss for my team.

MastaNeenja.1537:

Tim.6450:

MastaNeenja.1537:

You’re nerfing Vigorous Precision why? I understand that this is also happening to Mesmers as well, so it’s an across the board approach, but again I just don’t follow why this needs to happen. Dodging is a core mechanic of this game, so players are going to dodge. I don’t think taking boon duration to compensate for this makes sense either. We already have a hard nerf to our over all damage in the works, taking away from our damage potential to get boon duration up isn’t going to happen either. Dodging may trivialize some PVE bosses but it’s a matter of life and death in other scenarios especially PVP play. I would think the problem lies within making the PVE bosses more challenging.

While dodging is a core mechanic in the game, it should not be so easy to get 100% vigor uptime with a 5 point minor trait, that is way too good for a 5 point minor trait.

I wonder how players that run condition builds and spend 5 points to get bleeds on crit would feel about that. Singling out dodging, and vigor puts a vice on anyone who runs damage builds. I don’t know why they are coming down on us so hard, they already nerfed our damage 10% now they want us to dodge less? Why so we can sacrifice even more damage to stay alive by piling on armor or switching to defensive traits and builds? I guess you can play how you want unless you like glass. Furthermore that trait directly affects the next minor trait in Honor trait line, which is heals on dodge, and I thought they wanted more viable support not less.

can’t compare the two, on crit bleeds is 66% for a very low duration bleed. This change does effect my mesmer also less dodge=less clones, I would be upset but it was stayed they want to lower vigor across all classes and that’s what’s happening.

Atherakhia.4086:

There are 2 ways to handle incoming damage in this game… you avoid it (dodge, kite, stealth, invuln) or you mitigate it (protection, armor). Which category do you think Endure Pain falls into?

Incoming damage is mitigated by these classes and they’re given very select skills on long cooldowns to handle emergencies.

So you’re right… when you boil an MMO down the successful ones are a game of rock paper scissors. Unlike the one you play in Elementary school though, MMO’s play it with more than one pair of scissors, multiple kinds or rocks, and lots of different kinds of paper.

Classes need to be designed with very clear weaknesses. That doesn’t mean you make it a hopeless case when faced against those weaknesses. Player skill should have some way to overcome it. Thus why classes have stun breaks, or condi cleanse… or why children have scissors with dull points and adults get shears capable of severing fingers.

we do have an issue in this game of some classes not having to deal with the weakness they where supposed to have. Warrior is on that list, so is thief and to a lesser extent PU mesmers.

spoj.9672:

I think people are just unhappy about making an op trait have some skill and thought process implemented. People like easymode passives because they are lazy.

I play a hybrid spec (direct+conditions) not a huge deal for me, yet most of your conditions come from weapon skills and utilities, both of which you get locked out of in DS. Is counter play a bad thing? No but tacking a short burn to a skill you don’t use often in a class mechanic that requires you to build life force, has a cool down itself and has a giant tell for what’s coming next and ALSO leaving a long internal cool down on it does not make sense and is hard to see as anything but a Nerf to a trait that had other parts of our class nerfed with out seeing compensation in other areas.

so I would say either remove the icd and allow it to synergy with life unyielding blast and give Condi a reason to stay in death shroud and adds something to powermancer also.

or

change the trait to be a way to stack torment as a way to keep our enemies in combat with us.

I would prefer it just got changed to an on crit torment. Also move damage on torment to the active side (well moving). Thus we lack mobility yet we punish you for running. I feel this is a better idea, torment is a stacking condition with almost no way to stack it, why not give us a way to do it?

Honestly the armor difference is what allows warriors to go more offensive (guardian is pretty balanced due to the way it has to build for damage or defense + low hp) 291 armor gives some wiggle room when specing since the current sweet spot with armor is 2500ish. This allows for the ability to take more offensive stats on your gear allowing to you to do more damage.

but like stated earlier the armor stat that Is lacking on light and medium armor is not being added anywhere else and really should be.

1) like suggested above, make dhummfire (name change needed) a proc on crit torment so we can stack it on people. We have the weakness of having to stay and fight why not let us punish those who try to run.

well you are at it shift the damage on torment away from the passive dot and onto the well moving part.

You can’t still eat retaliation and cc using blurred frenzy so its not invulnerability.

also dhummfire change is ok but 3sec burn on a 10 sec cool down that you can only take advantage of when you use DS is not a 30 point trait and either needs to be buffed or moved. Also wondering with the change to dhuum are we going to see some of the nerfs we have eaten since its introduction will be converted weakening shroud maybe since it is the definition of what our class is supposed to be (attrition and weakening foe so we fan stay in the fight)

I think they need to balance pve mobs around pvp. Make the mobs more intelligent and use different mechanics besides the “one shot”. This way people will use all of there skills. This way people can go between pve, wvw, and pvp and feel like they have a good grasp of what they can do.

Necro changes.

Dhummfire, this needs to be more like. Life blasts now cause burning 2 secs no icd. This makes it more appealing to take life bolts peirce. Life bolt can already easly be dodged and you know when its coming it has the easiest tell in the game (we turn into a shadow).
as is the new one is not worth a 30 point investment.

MM Nerf, I see why MM siphon is getting nerfed but really the only place MM was annoying was spvp. Any other part of the game aoe just kills the pets. Siphons I’m general need a looking at. The damage does not scale well enough to justify losing crit damage and the heal doesn’t scale well enough to lose out on toughness. Between Zealots and life siphon I thought we may get the attrition part of this class but after crafting a full set and testing it I found I was wrong.

Mesmer changes.

I understand nerfing on death/pu builds due to the cheese factor. Its not really the mesmers fault thou. It was one way to fit the meta as it stands. Its currently to passive a play style for a class that shouldn’t be played that way. Honestly its more of a problem that our mindwrack doesn’t hit harder (you want skills that hit hard to have tells this is a big one) and the Nerf to confusion that make people go this route. The harder specs (interupt, shatter, confusion) do not see a greater return for harder play(this can be said about alot of classes look at the rise of Condi bunker)

PvE in the normal wvw maps can be frustrating due to where it spawns. On this map I hope pve acts like a bait. The pve areas will draw people in and almost always guarantee a fight. How is that a bad thing?

I got the recipes for exotic, tried it out. Not worth it since siphons scale so poorly it does not make up for the lose of dps from zerker or lose of toughness from.knights gear.

kyubi.3620:

we aint talking about nerfing phantasm scaling we talking about giving the phantasm stat scaling to pet as well Nerfing never was part of the discution

unfortunately the damage on pets would need to be nerfed before it could scale. So being tanky with a dps pet would not be an option. Also like has been mentioned before phantasms are a weapon attack for mesmers and as such needed to scale.

Fighting for PPT only works if you know your server can field 24/7 coverage or at least coverage during all times your enemy server can field people. If your server can’t do this you will not win and you will get frustrated and either transfer, quit, or play for fights.

EoTM will break up zerging in regular wvw pretty well, server losing bad? Outmanned on all maps? See ya later EoTM here we come.

EoTM seems like its taking on a darkness falls like aspect. Since it has no direct bearing on PPT I can get down with that. Few things more fun then wiping out a group of enemies and stealing the loots!

edit: as an aside, if this hurts wvw population maybe that is a good thing and will show that wvw does need some more attention.

Sandra Martino.3870:

Why would they Samhayn? They can still leap/teleport/stealth/charge away when they realise they are in danger. We would still have no ways to finish the job which i think would be fair in light of the devs vision.

why would they? Honestly it wouldn’t be imbalanced in the current meta but people already hate necro and hate DS. Also I can deal with mobility as a weakness but as of right now we need better staying power so if anything was to change I would rather our life siphons heal us well in DS this would also synergies really well with the heal trinket we got.

Rally on spike only, limited to 2 up for 1 downed together these would be awesome!!

People would cry to no end!

Chaith.8256:

Samhayn.2385:

1) Phantasm mesmer gets all its damage from phantasms,

2) phantasm attacks have a lengthy cool down,

3) phantasm mesmers personal damage output is fairly low,

4) in larger fights the phantasm can die to aoe before it even does its damage,

there are reasons they work differently then pets or minions.

1) Turret Engineers gets all its damage from Turrets,

2) Turrets have a lengthy cool down,

3) Turret Engineers personal damage output is fairly low,

4) in larger fights the turrets can die to aoe before it even does its damage,

there are reasons they work differently then pets or minions.

1) Beastmaster Ranger gets all its damage from Ranger Pets,

2) Good Ranger Pet atacks have a lengthy cool down,

3) Beastmaster Ranger’s personal damage output is fairly low,

4) in larger fights the Ranger’s Pet can die to aoe before it even does its damage,

there are reasons they work differently then phantasms or minions.

Do you see the massive double standard of every single one of your arguments? (Besides the target requirement of phantasms.)

sure let them scale with power,crit damage but the base damage would need to be lowered, beastmaster pets can hit hard whether or not you you go full zerk or full tank.

You know when you compare to game modes and say we want different things you should clarify.

1) aoe damage may be a problem and most people will tell you that lowering the damage would not be a problem. The problem aoe in wvw is the five player hit cap. In tpvp (5v5) you can always apply full aoe pressure on a team. In wvw it could be 5v20 allowing the 20 to apply full pressure and the 5 have there damage limited. So the change we would like would not effect tpvp.

2) yes Josh was given the job of talking to the wvw community, look at the post history by anet on the wvw page and tell me this was not needed?

3) the wvw dev team is separate from tpvp. I don’t see how EoTM “took” people away from spvp.

4) as for class balance we hate condi/bunker too. Also with the ability to gain more stats in wvw we get to see op builds at a maxed out potential. Also maining a necro and mesmer l have eatin more nerfs due to spvp then the other way around.

Phantasm mesmer gets all its damage from phantasms, phantasm attacks have a lengthy cool down, like you said the phantasm mesmers personal damage output is fairly low, in larger fights the phantasm can die to aoe before it even does its damage, when the target of the phantasm is killed the phantasm explodes and needs to be resummoned on a new target if it is not on cool down.

there are reasons they work differently then pets or minions.

The make one mistake and you can only make 10 more before your dead was worth the read.

Phi Is Sly.1857:

Not every thing should be balanced on zerg play. The skill is overpowered, just like perma hide builds are. You fight a necro, manage to get them down to the last 5% hp, fending off multiple full stacks of conditions ticking at a much higher rate dps than you can dish out due to the dire set. For them to just enter death shroud and be back at 100% hp.
Cos balance?. If you honestly think my suggestions are going to break your game, it pretty much proves that you rly on this skill! their for proving its op. -.-

+ my changes would give you more hp at the start of a fight, you just end up with less the lower your base hp has been damged at.

you can’t heal well in death shroud his hp didn’t go up at all. As for relying on Death Shroud, yes we do its our class mechanic why would we not that’s like saying mesmer don’t shatter or other classes don’t need there class unique skills.

Paulie.6215:

Agreed. In addition there should be a 1 min cool down once it ends.

But ya something needs to be done.

I was going to reply to the above post but its so stupid its not worth it.

DS can be very powerful if and only if, you built it up before hand, don’t get focused, can build it quickly, don’t get ccd and people don’t dodge or block the over telegraphed attacks that you do well in DS.

Paulie.6215:

Samhayn.2385:

Paulie.6215:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

…so why should one condition class be punished and the others ignored?

Because the necro as a “condition class” can approach 40k ups with one key press.

40k health and can be perma ccd to death.

Spec better? Not sure what else to tell you.

All classes can be “perma ccd to death” necro isn’t special in this regard. 40k hp makes it way easier to survive.

Death shroud should get a 50% reduction in hp or have a 1 min cool down.

Condi spec necros can not take the 30 point need to get 3 secs of stability that is the only access to stability they have. Now powernecro may get it but that was not what you where talking about. Please learn more about a class before you tell people to spec better. Or you know get condition cleanse.