Guild Wars 2

GrayFox.2601:

One of the most common pro-train arguments seems to be that there is nothing else to do in this game and Arenanet just needs to add more content and the trains will go away on their own.

The fact that these players are saying that is proof they simply haven’t explored the game to any great length. The truth is there are plenty of other things to do all across Tyria, but the train offers rewards with no risk of death or even much thought, so there is no incentive to go out and find anything else.

World bosses, temples, hearts, dynamic events and dynamic event chains all give you experience, karma, gold and loot. The latter can be very rewarding in loot, story content and useful and powerful consumables that you can’t find anywhere else. Map completion itself, aside from the rewards from hearts, POIs, WPs and Vistas, gives you a good reward based on the level of the map and, when finished, a title, achievement points and two of an ingredient needed for many legendaries.

Farmers do not do things for the sake of enjoying them. They do them for the fact that it is the fastest and most efficient way to get whatever they happen to need or want at the time. Queensdale train farmers (and without the farmers, the train would be inconsistent) happen to be after karma.

If they made the content that’s already out there (that most of the train knows exists, so don’t give me the they don’t know it’s there excuse) more rewarding for the risk and time involved, then people will spread out.

The train used to go around Orr. Then when Orr got nerfed because no one was visiting the starting zones, they figured out that dungeons were the best place to farm. Then the dungeon nerfs happened because no one was out in the open world. Around this time they buffed the loot that champions dropped because they were more apt to drop greens and blues only and be honest, the original champion loot was not worth the risk it took to take most of them down. So people farmed the world bosses. Then came the one guaranteed rare chest per account nerf. So people went to Queensdale. Nerf Queensdale and the train will just go somewhere else and the problem will not be fixed.

Now, I’m not saying that ANet should sit back and do nothing. But they should address the true problem. The cause of the train.

They should look at WHY the train formed in the first place. Why do people run the train over and over again. And then design/tweak content to make those things be in other maps. And eventually the train will spread out. Covering more of the map than they did before. And that would be ideal wouldn’kitten

Instead of nerfing the Queensdale Train and watching the train just go somewhere else for people to complain about there being farmers there ruining their experience and how it should be stopped. Doesn’t that just seem like a vicious cycle and how they’ll eventually find the train back in Queensdale…

The population levels are not based on currently playing players. It is whomever has that server chosen as their home server. Even if they only played on release day and decided that the game was not for them.

What ANet should do is analyze what percentage of players from each home server are active. Then make the bottom X% free to transfer to and the top X % more expensive to transfer to.

But since most players want onto the servers with high populations, it will likely not be assuccessful in spreading out the population.

The trains are not the problem. They are a symptom. ANet needs to fix the problem and not just treat the symptom.

The problem is a lack of incentive to do other things. The trains are done mostly for karma. The majority of drops from the train aren’t worth much.

Beginning of the month it’s also for champ killer, group event completion, and/or event completion. Same as the end of the month.

I can do the train about two times before I get bored. I get off the train when I get bored. I do not feel forced to do the train nor did I ever feel the need to use it to level up.

However, I’d imagine it’s nice for the days where you want to play but just aren’t feeling the prescence of mind to do more difficult content. And be honest. We all have those days.

frans.8092:

Subdue.5479:

You know, if you don’t like the Queensdale train, there are 4 other starter zones you could level in.

Egocentric thinking.

The storyline for humans takes you through Queensdale, it’s completely out-of-character (there is no in-story reason) to go to any of the other starter area’s before your story takes you to Lion’s Arch.

People should be able to enjoy the story and atmosphere.

Then just think of the zerg train as a battalion of fighters given the task of keeping Queensdale safe. There immersion kept and the zerg train can continue.

But should a player really not want to play in the same zone as the zerg there are other zones out that can be played in.

Rod.6581:

First, let me tell you, in all MMO games i have played there has always been someone who i really had to ask “Did you buy that account? How did you get to level <insert level cap here>?” And some of those games didn’t have shortcuts like train in Queensdale. So, that player being level 80 and failing terribly in CoF may have nothing to do with this train.

Everyone in forum is yelling Down with the Queensdale champ train or Nerf champs or other destructive ideas. That is not the way to fix this issue.

Train in starting zone is a great thing. Make it more fun. Add chain events to tell bits of story. Make all those champs somehow connected. Make the whole process possible w/o using way points. Make it so players visit every corner of the map, with stories that tell them about specific place they are in.

Use the people farming champions in starting zone and turn it into something new players would enjoy, be happy to do again and make friends along the way. Let farmers have their reward AND new players enjoy at the same time.

But make it all doable on Queensdale only, let’s say, from 8 AM to 10 AM. Then, make the similar thing from 10 AM to 12 AM in Wayfarer Foothils. From 12 AM to 2 PM in Metrica Province etc. Then Queensdale again.

Integrate and improve, don’t destroy.

Don’t make it only for a couple hours on rotation. Make it on all zones at all times. That way when players get bored of one zone they can hop to whatever zone they want. Not have to go to X zone at Y time.

Then you don’t have to worry about the lower level new players when the rotation hots zones they aren’t ready for.

There needs to be a reason for people to spread out.

And they’ll just move on to the next best place to zerg!

The problem isn’t the zerg train. The problem is the lack of incentive to do anything else.

If they made the rewards for doing other things greater, the zerg train would spread out. And that’s what should be done.

Reverence.6915:

Seera.5916:

That’s the thing. You limit it to once a week and what do people do if at launch their friends had to end up on another server and can’t afford to switch? Do you doom those friends to only be able to play together once a week? Just because of a few events that scale poorly if there aren’t 80+ people around?

There’s a thing called server transfer. If you can’t guest to be with your friends, transfer servers. It doesn’t cost much. Maybe 2 weeks max of doing dungeons to convert gold to gems.

Seera.5916:

The solution is NOT to mess with guesting. The solution is to make these events scale better for when there aren’t a bunch of people there. Those that guest to do the events hate the fact that they have to go sit in the map for an hour or longer to ensure their spot just as much as the non-guest. But when you only have a few hours to play and want to do the large events and succeed, you have no choice but to go to a server that has the best chances of having the population needed to succeed. Because if you don’t have the minimum population present, no amount of coordinatin will let you win.

Every single server has the population for these events. No matter how small your population is. It doesn’t take that many people (150) to hardcap a map. Your server has to be willing to coordinate on its own rather than piggyback on another server/guild’s coordination.

These events aren’t for everyone. If you’re not willing to be in Teamspeak/Ventrillo/Mumble etc., the way I see it, you shouldn’t be on the instance where the group is trying to complete the boss fight. It’s really easy to get 20 people in an overflow to decapitate 1 wurm or complete 1 marionette path and get the basic rewards. If you want to actually complete it, you’ll need to put effort in.

Not everyone likes dungeons or has the desire or ability to play the meta well enough to do speed runs (otherwise dungeons aren’t an efficient gold farm). Not everyone has the money to pay for gems. Not every server isn’t full. Or they might prefer a smaller quieter server to play on for the most part and just guest over to another server with friends for things that require a number of players. Or they might prefer playing WvW on the server they are on. Not wanting to be top tier but still have a good time in WvW. And well your home server has to be the server you want to do WvW in.

My server has a hard enough time getting people to go to the world bosses that aren’t Teq or aren’t the LS bosses at times. So what makes you think we have the people for Teq? People do tend to come out of the woodwork for LS things so those probably do have enough people.

And guesting is not the problem. The problem is the inherent difficulty of the events. Once a server beats it and it gets out everyone wants to go there to see how it’s done. Then people go: might as well just go to this server. I know they can do it.

The problem is how the bosses are designed.

What they could do is put a temp ban on guesting for a week or two. See what happens when players can’t guest to force people to try it on their own server. After that, open guesting back up.

Or heck, give a karma/gold/XP boost if you do a major world boss on your own server (server pride). Or up the RNG chances for better loot out of the dropped chest when you do the event on your own server.

Give people a reason to do it on their own server (or at least several legitimate tries at it).

Don’t punish those who wish to do PvE on servers that are not their own for whatever reason.

Tsyras.5274:

Anet needs to fundamentally change how guesting works (i.e. something along the lines of needing a direct invite from a friend for each time).

AT THE SAME TIME…fix these world bosses to scale down.

And people would create threads on other forums and reddit going: I need a friend on X server. Low and behold, someone chimes in that they’re on that server and are willing to friend them.

Guesting is NOT the problem and should not be changed just for these poorly designed world bosses that require tons of people.

The bosses should be changed and then maybe put a one week temporary ban on guesting to force people who want to do the events to do them on their own servers to see how things have changed.

And you do realize that most of the larger servers where there is constantly tons of overflows happening might be happening because they have a large active population on their own server? And the problem might not go away if the fraction of guesters go away? The guesters didn’t all band together and decide to make Blackgate or Desolation the go to server. They went there because those servers already HAD the population needed to do those events. And for Teq, that’s darn near a full map. I don’t know about the other world bosses.

If they are designed like Teq and the current bosses are: no.

1. They don’t scale down enough when there isn’t a map full of people there. Not saying it should be doable by a party of 5.

2. I don’t know about the current LS bosses, but Teq doesn’t give that great of a reward. To me the rewards given for the world bosses (short of Teq) is appropriate to the risk and difficulty. 1 rare out of the daily bonus chest plus mostly green/blue armor and weapons and rare & ascended crafting materials typically come out of the main reward chest. And the ascended mat is account bound.

3. Require too much coordination for an open world boss.

So, if they can scale it down so that 50 or so people can reliably do it with minimal coordination and it gives an appropriate reward to the new and increased risk involved, then I’m all for it.

Or they could revert Teq back and add in instanced versions of all world bosses. That when you get close to where they spawn there’s a sign that says: “Beware of [Insert World Boss’s name]” Clicking on the sign lets you join an instance that’s cross server. Where you take on current Teq or whatever world boss you’ve chosen whose been ramped up to current Teq levels.

When the instances reach the minimum number required to reliably take them down, a count down timer starts. This lets commanders or whomever is running the show that there are enough people around and to begin organizing. When the timer is down, the boss spawns with the usual timer to complete like they have now. He’s far enough way so that organization can still occur.

Of course the rewards for the instanced versions should be better than the rewards for the open world content and as for daily reward chest, it would only give it for open world or instanced, but not both.

That way there is content for both groups of people.

My guess is Gele is trying to do the LS events or Tequatal. Where going to an overflow is less than desirable due to the possibility of not having enough people.

@OP: So the game is supposed to stick everyone on the same server and cause people horrendous lag just so you can have 100% chance of playing with your friends?

The solution would be to let the event scale better to smaller groups so that people do not feel as pressured into having to guest to other servers to do events. Or make the events instanced that kicks off 5 minutes after enough people show up. And that instance pulls from all servers.

Reverence.6915:

It’s undesirable indeed for high pop servers since it makes it really difficult getting our guildies and friends into the main instance. Hardcap for Bloodtide Coast appears to be around 150 and we usually get 100-120~ into our teamspeak, so the margin of error can be quite high due to the people not in teamspeak, despite spamming the details in mapchat every 10 seconds.

I’ve had 3 failed attempts on wurm so far due to a failure on communication (people not on teamspeak). Few fail attempts were simply down to not-perfect execution, and even then, can be attributed to the people not on teamspeak (not switching targets, staying behind etc.)

I would rather daily guesting be removed altogether and make it a once-a-week option. Especially on NA servers, where all servers have a decent population, but most guest to Jade Quarry, Blackgate, Sanctum of Rall or Tarnished Coast to do PvE content. It would help bump the native populations up again for sure, I think.

I’m pretty sure all servers can muster up a group of 150 for a daily or weekly event for these kind of bosses. And especially if its within your own server, you’ll more likely be able to get participation within your VOIP of choice and thus have a higher chance at victory.

That’s the thing. You limit it to once a week and what do people do if at launch their friends had to end up on another server and can’t afford to switch? Do you doom those friends to only be able to play together once a week? Just because of a few events that scale poorly if there aren’t 80+ people around?

The solution is NOT to mess with guesting. The solution is to make these events scale better for when there aren’t a bunch of people there. Those that guest to do the events hate the fact that they have to go sit in the map for an hour or longer to ensure their spot just as much as the non-guest. But when you only have a few hours to play and want to do the large events and succeed, you have no choice but to go to a server that has the best chances of having the population needed to succeed. Because if you don’t have the minimum population present, no amount of coordinatin will let you win.

Depends. If the events require too many people (probably more than around 50), it’s probably better off just staying in the main world. Would take too long to fill up likely since the instanced content would be able to start any time. And any time takes the pressure off of doing it now.

If the content is scaled to need at least 20 people, probably better off instanced. A small guild group. 4 full “PUG” groups. A small group of friends. A small group of people who have loosely banded together to do various world content that are neither friends nor in the same guild.

Phoenixlin.8624:

Because when you start “go home guests” chanting, they react =) Also, I can identify several different server’s guilds that I saw in WvW mostly.

But not all and you can’t use who reacts in chat as a measure of how many their are. Not a big enough population size to extrapolate.

And did you not read what I said? Sometimes people aren’t in guilds that make a particular server their home world. Or the guild could have two branches. One in one server and one on another server. With guilds not being server specific you can’t use guilds to determine if people are guesting or not. If you’re sure that guild tag you’ve seen is a primarily WvW guild and not a “we do a bunch of everything guild”, then you could be right. But unless you’re sure that it’s a not a “we do everything and we just happen to be into WvW at the moment” guild.

Your methods of counting are not sever specific enough to really be considered accurate measures of number of guests.

The guesting is not the problem. Yes, it stinks to not be able to do an event on your own server. I get the frustration and I wish there was an easy solution that didn’t rely on ANet doing anything. But there isn’t. Because the problem is the events need too many people and don’t scale down so that a small group can do it. And that’s only something that ANet can fix.

The temples scale properly, or at least one of them does. My brother 4 manned Lyssa one day. If the open world raid content (Teq and now the new LS bosses) scaled down properly there would likely not be a problem short of that due to too many active people on certain servers and people playing with friends who happen to be on that server.

Blackgate does flirt with being Full so there could be situations where people have to guest to play with their friends if they are on that sever even if the person has the gems to transfer.

Phoenixlin.8624:

No, it is not our own population. I can count pretty much lots of guests in main maps(when I can enter).

Please inform us how you are able to tell who is a guest and who is not.

I have a friend who is in one the guilds I am whose home server is neither my server nor the main server for the guild. Yet when he guests over, there is no indication by his name or anything that says he is guesting.

So please, how can you count lots of guests?

And people don’t do the events on their own server because they’ve tried enough other open world raid content to know there is a high chance of it failing due to too few people. And when people don’t have hours to play, they go to a serever that is more likely to have enough people to do the event.

Until ANet learns how to scale events down enough for the low active population servers, then this “problem” will continue to exist. Problem in quotes since I don’t view it as a problem. Just a few people who think they have the right to kick another player from the map they are on. Just because they came from another serever. And they don’t.

Zesbeer.8365:

Gele.2048:

well things to come there was dueling now there is no more oh well if anyone knows from the wiki comminity pls tell me

The note was removed because it had no areananet source. If you have a link to a interview or video or blog post or forum post that talks about how they will be adding dueling then they will re add the note.

Here’s your answer.

It was likely removed due to lack of a source. If they allowed things to be left up that didn’t have a source, the Wiki would be a very very unreliable place to see what things are to come. And you wouldn’t want that, would you?

Asking the same question every other second isn’t going to change the answer -shrug-

So then when those people get to 6-10 they will still not be able to do it. You’re just delaying the inevitable.

Did you know that originally there was a thought that guesting might require you to have a friend on the server you were planning to go to?

Did you know that threads popped up with people saying if that is true, just add me, I’m on X server.

If they add a friend requirement, people will just do that. Get someone on the server they want to friend them so that they can go guest on their server to do an event. And it will solve nothing.

At least these LS bosses are spawning at set times and not in a window. And they chose less generally popular maps. Imagine if they chose Queensdale or Frostgorge given their zerg trains. Or Sparkfly Fen where there is already an overflow issue with Teq.

Home server people get priority on the overflow list than guests do so when disconnects happen and when people leave the zone, those who make that server home get first pick at that spot. And home server people can jump via their party members. Guests can’t. And you can jump via party as long as only the soft cap has happened (they initially cut off the zone early). So those of you who are coming in late and are in a guild, leave a spot open or don’t form your party until you are in the zone. That way one of you can ask a guild member if they are in the main server and to invite to party to bring you over. Then you can bring your friends over as long as none are guesting or the hard cap isn’t reached in the mean time.

But someone who is ON the main map should not be kicked to an overflow just because they’re a guest when the map gets full.

Since Overflows aren’t server specific and the bosses spawn at X times, I’m sure there will eventually be guilds that organize the events in overflows. And might intentionally create an overflow. Like is currently done with Teq.

Players will do the easiest and quickest way to make gold.

Before the zerg trains was the world bosses train before they got nerfed. Before the world bosses was the dungeons.

Zerg trains in Queensdale/Frostgorge Sound get nerfed, they’ll just go to the next best thing to get money and loot and karma or whatever it is they need.

The zerg in and of itself is NOT the problem. The problem is a lack of permanent content that’s challenging and fun with an appropriate level of reward for risk and time. They add in a number of those on various maps and the zerg will spread out or at least map hop.

Week.5680:

One of my best memories in an MMO was the crazy messed up implementation of GVG in SWG. SOOO much fun, although really badly put together. I don’t see why anyone would have a problem with this, your PVE guilds obviously wouldn’t partake, and many will make guilds strictly for this purpose. Add a timer to switching guilds when at war with another guild. Both guilds have to accept the war of course. Hardly see how this would become a problem. GVG will have tons of griefing yes, but who cares? Don’t join a “war” guild if you don’t want to participate.

The problem is EXISTING guilds will want to partake in the wars. A 500 member PvE guild is not going to have all 500 members want to take part in the war.

And NONE of us are saying that we don’t want GvG. We just don’t want OPEN WORLD GvG. Several of us have given suggestions on how to implement GvG that is not open world. That would be better implemented and better controlled. And therefore more fun.

Separate arena for it makes it so that guilds don’t have to poll all of their members and send out mass mails to their members to alert them that at X time and Y date they will be entering a war and to unrepresent before then to not participate.

How many mails can you send out before you’re frozen from sending mail?

And ANet has a stance of being anti-grief so they aren’t likely to implement something that’s going to grief people. Especially those not taking part. Because those people would be the true victims. Group is nearby a person doing a skill point and struggling. Instead of stopping to help the person with the skill point, they continue their little GvG battle despite the player saying in map chat that they need help. Because who really truly pays attention to map chat in the middle of a fight? Or would risk typing something out when their opponent probably isn’t?

To me, they’ll never be fun enough for me to enjoy playing it. PvP isn’t my cup of tea. Never has been, never will. I tolerate WvW for map exploration because I can to some degree avoid all PvP.

Unless winning X number of matches gave you a precursor box that you could choose your precursor from, I wouldn’t ever play it. And even then, I’d only tolerate it and feel it’s a grind.

And there are some of us who don’t mind the maps being on the empty side. It lets us fight things and know that it’s OUR skill that let us win. That we weren’t just carried to victory by whomever else was there.

I soloed about 85%-90% of the PvE map. I soloed a vast majority of the mid level zones as well as the high level zones, including Cursed Shore. I only had to get help for 2 skill points and a vista in Cursed Shore. I did buddy up for the various personal story quests that went into Cursed Shore so some of them were done in parties as we worked our way to and through Arah.

And that’s a pretty powerful feeling. That you can solo an area for the most part.

That being said, there could be things done to increase the ventures into the world. GvG is not one of them.

While it might bring the guilds out to play, it will make the more pure PvE’ers run and hide in other games. Because they don’t want to see it, they don’t want to see a group of players within sight of them when they’re struggling with a skill point and could use a hand. They don’t want to have to leave an otherwise perfect guild because they do not wish to PvP at all but the guild does.

They don’t want to see the smack talk in the chat or the goading if a guild declines a war when they’re in Lion’s Arch.

People trying to take Teq down won’t want it in Sparkfly Fen because you already have to be there an hour early on the servers that reliably do it. GvG will only just make that worse. Not to mention have fun during world bosses where there are people in the opposing guild in melee range of the boss (since they’ll be able to be hit by the opposing guild’s ranged AoE attacks, not to mention the AoE melee attacks).

The only way to actually implement GvG with the least amount of issues is to have it be it’s own separate area. Not out in the open world.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Stand The Wall.6987:

There wouldnt be any pve player ganking.

Guaranteed to be proven wrong in record time. If this was actually to be made a reality, I’d put Gold down on it happening within two days.

It wouldn’t be as wide spread as it would be if not tied to the GvG thing but there might be some people just in a guild without really being in the guild that get hit by this.

At least it having a dedicated arena it would only put those who are interested in actively participating in it into actually participating. It has 0% chance of ever disrupting a DE or being in a Living Story map. It would give ANet better controls for switching Guild representation (you can’t while you’re in the arena). It would give ANet the ability to have different types of GvG: traditional PvP, capture the flag, etc.

Now, would I be opposed to say a Living Story that takes place on a 15-25 level map a GvG event where for 2 weeks guilds can go at it for 2 hour match ups? No. Because it wouldn’t be permanent. Or heck, make it a level 40 map running concurrently with a different Living Story update. Since we all know the mid range maps are the most deserted.

But anything permanent should have it’s own arena for it. Then different match up time lengths could be picked. A guild could have a 1 week match up. Or a 2 hour skirmish.

runeblade.7514:

To fix skipping, I suggest adding more and more low hp mobs with CC skills that makes it hard to skip. Each mob is balanced around the open world PvE mob. The point is to make skipping in the high risk spectrum while killing mobs will be in the low risk spectrum. Groups can skip if they can achieve it. Sometimes, it isn’t worth the trouble to skip all these easy mobs. Why do people skip? So they can shave an extra minute off their run. By skipping, you risk adding 15 minutes instead of saving one minute. It is true today, but the percentage of failing is very low. This time, the percentage is higher.

tl;dr:

• Stacking becomes high risk high efficiency and not-stacking is low risk low/medium efficiency.
• Skipping is high risk high efficiency and not-skipping is low risk high efficiency.

The thing is, if you don’t skip a dungeon takes way more than 15 minutes. Way more than the typical speed run.

If you make it skip and maybe add 15 minutes, you look at 30 minutes or still way more than 30 minutes if you don’t skip. Plus, most people would just equip a stun break or other such CC removal skill or run with a character that has a skill that removes it from allies.

So instead of doing 6 runs in a day for example, a person can now only do 3. They become a lot more picky about who they run with and then more people complain that they can’t get a group to do X dungeon Y path.

Make not skipping more rewarding for the time spent and people might consider not skipping more often than they do.

Zoid.2568:

Seera.5916:

Zoid.2568:

lordkrall.7241:

Zoid.2568:

You should only be able to be in one Guild War at a time. Also. In GW2 guilds are account wide.

So your current guild split into two smaller guilds, declare war on each other and manipulate and get rewards that way.

You shouldn’t be able to call a Guild War on any guild you are a member of, even if you’re not representing.

Here’s what they are saying.

Guild A wants to get the super special rewards that comes from beating a guild that’s larger than they are. They know that no guild is going to want to just let that happen so it’s not a guaranteed win.

So they get together and decide to war amongst themselves. Since you can’t harm anyone that’s in your guild, even if you are in two guilds that are warring against each other, Guild A decides to send 75% of their guild to Guild A Temp. They are kicked out of Guild A once Guild A Temp has been formed. So they are no longer in both Guild A and Guild A Temp. Guild A declares war on Guild A Temp. The members in Guild A Temp are instructed to let members in Guild A beat them so that Guild A wins the war.

Guild A wins the war. Invites are then sent to the members of Guild A Temp. The rejoin and Guild A Temp is deleted.

Then look at guilds that currently have multiple guilds due to having more than 500 members. They can already game the system really easily.

Then they should be permanently banned from the game and learn their lesson. ArenaNet have banned exploiters before and they will do it again. Players will understand that they don’t stand a chance against the law of ArenaNet.

Fair enough, but first they’d have to discover it. And I doubt it would be very easily discovered.

And then you have to separate it from guilds not doing that to just get the rewards, but to have a inter-guild competition. Because I’m sure guilds won’t tell the temp one to just stand there and look pretty. And they’ll probably have the other guild win some to not make it look too one sided.

How do you separate out just purely bad players from people trying to game the system?

Then there’s the map chat. Most players don’t want to see the smack talk. It’s own arena would solve that problem. Plus, it would run smoother and the maps would be able to be better suited for GvG.

And having the arenas means they have different types of GvG. Maybe a capture the flag or cap all the places for X time. Over just who can have the most kills if they had it in the open world.

laokoko.7403:

I don’t know why anyone would want to swap to other stats. Even with the 10% nerf, berserker is still the goto set for pve.

Some people will probably feel that the risk/reward ratio with the loss of DPS has gone below their threshold for running that build.

Berserker gear is glass cannon. This nerf makes their cannon less powerful. But it still leaves them as glass. The more they get hit, the more likely they are to die. Sometimes those few extra seconds can mean the difference between life and death.

Zoid.2568:

lordkrall.7241:

Zoid.2568:

You should only be able to be in one Guild War at a time. Also. In GW2 guilds are account wide.

So your current guild split into two smaller guilds, declare war on each other and manipulate and get rewards that way.

You shouldn’t be able to call a Guild War on any guild you are a member of, even if you’re not representing.

Here’s what they are saying.

Guild A wants to get the super special rewards that comes from beating a guild that’s larger than they are. They know that no guild is going to want to just let that happen so it’s not a guaranteed win.

So they get together and decide to war amongst themselves. Since you can’t harm anyone that’s in your guild, even if you are in two guilds that are warring against each other, Guild A decides to send 75% of their guild to Guild A Temp. They are kicked out of Guild A once Guild A Temp has been formed. So they are no longer in both Guild A and Guild A Temp. Guild A declares war on Guild A Temp. The members in Guild A Temp are instructed to let members in Guild A beat them so that Guild A wins the war.

Guild A wins the war. Invites are then sent to the members of Guild A Temp. The rejoin and Guild A Temp is deleted.

Then look at guilds that currently have multiple guilds due to having more than 500 members. They can already game the system really easily.

If they do allow for gear swapping, it should only be for ascended gear. And maybe exotic. But below that, the gear’s cheap enough.

It would be the best PR move to make given how new ascended armor is. The markets haven’t even stabilized from it yet.

“Given how new ascended armor is [and how expensive exotics are for new players] and the timing of this reworking of crit damage, we have decided to give all players with ascended [and exotic] gear and weapons a free stat swap like what we did when magic find was removed from gear and weapons.”

GotchUrarse.9025:

I don’t completely understand dynamic events, so I’ll be the first to admit to not understanding the ramifications on that point.

To the point of camping banks and/or TP, there are mechanics in GW2 to get around that. Or, and this more likely a rule to be used for technical limitations, major hubs are off-limits to warring. Perhaps it would be only allowable out in the ‘open areas’

As far as everyone being lvl 80 in a GvG, as I understand it, the game scales chars down the area. Why not go with that? Again, I’m ignorant of ramifications.

Dynamic events scale up in difficulty based on the number of people in the immediate area. A group of 40 players (20 vs 20) in an area where a DE is will make that DE scale up even though they aren’t trying to complete it. Making it hard for the small group of players actually doing the event to complete it.

Cities would need to be off limits. Lion’s Arch already has loading issues on the best days. We don’t need it made worse by GvG. Especially during events centered in Lion’s Arch (such as Wintersday, we’re already lagging like crazy in LA, GvG would make it worse)

Those who are not level 80 don’t have all their traits yet and gear doesn’t downscale all the way, meaning they aren’t as optimal. Look at the dungeon forum to see an area where in order to be the best, you have to be level 80.

Vol.7601:

Seera.5916:

I’m personally putting getting my precursor off until the end. I could get it as a drop while obtaining my other materials.

Once I get all of my materials that need for mine that can be got through salvaging or from gold short of the precursor, I will take any exotic sceptors that I get in drops and mystic forge them in an attempt to get Storm. All while earning gold to buy it. If precursor crafting has come out, I’ll probably go that route over buying it or using the mystic forge.

Having exotics drop are rare enough, but expecting specific exotic types are as rare as getting a precursor.

If you do plan on dumping stuff into the forge, remember it’s better to gamble on an expensive precursor, sell it and have funds remaining to buy the one you want + have other gold available

I plan on selling the other drops and expect to buy it than receive it from the mystic forge. And I’d rather try for Storm than the others. I’m in no huge rush to get my legendary. I still have to finish up WvW map completion, get my 500 dungeon tokens, 100 icy runestones, the 77 mystic clovers, and I’m still missing a fair number of T6 mats. Chances are crafting will come out before I get to getting my precursor XD

Romo.3709:

How would that work with players barely starting the game and still adjusting into the battle system. All the opposite guild would have to do is roam around starter areas and wait for easy pray to appear. That wouldn’t be balanced at all. At the same time during World Bosses and Champ Trains it would cause chaos making people practically quit the game or at least the Guild they’re in.
When talking about 20man guild vs 400man guild, and their rewards, you simply stating that the 400+ man guild will never have a better rewards because it’s big. While small guilds will always have a chance at winning. That could be easily exploited with 1-2 man guilds where they kill one or two people and simply switch tags for remainders of the “challenge” so you’ll never find them.
Nice idea, but it won’t work in GW2 with the system we have in place. At least not without frustrations and headaches. Last thing I want in this game is for every jumping puzzle to be like WvW jumping puzzle where you have a group of campers waiting for you at the very end. No thank you.

He’s more talking GvG, if you weren’t in a waring guild you wouldn’t have a risk of dying. Or at least less of a risk. Two opposing guilds going at it on a jumping puzzle could affect visibility for those not in the waring guilds.

And I would have it turned off in dungeons, fractals, and cities (allowing guilds to not have to worry about landing in a dungeon or fractal with an opposing guild if they are having to PUG it, and giving a safe place for people to buy things and craft without having to worry about getting killed.

If they add it, they better add a GvG chat channel so that any and all smack talk can be put there. Any smack talk on other channels would then be reportable. So that players who do not wish to be effected by GvG do not have to be affected. And that way players can smack talk as long as they don’t get too carried away with the insults. And wouldn’t take over map or say chat.

However, you do bring up a good point:

Any guild that wants to participate in this will likely no longer take in new players. Because those new players would likely be easier kills. And would demand that during guild wars all members play level 80 characters since under level 80 isn’t able to be fully traited out and wouldn’t be as good.

However, I’m opposed to this being in open PvE because I don’t trust ANet to implement it well. I want it in it’s own little separate area where they can better implement it. Since if they did it in its own separate area, they can create interesting maps for it that are smaller to reduce the hide and go seek aspect of GvG to a not as annoying level.

I’m personally putting getting my precursor off until the end. I could get it as a drop while obtaining my other materials.

Once I get all of my materials that need for mine that can be got through salvaging or from gold short of the precursor, I will take any exotic sceptors that I get in drops and mystic forge them in an attempt to get Storm. All while earning gold to buy it. If precursor crafting has come out, I’ll probably go that route over buying it or using the mystic forge.

Not in open PvE. The lore doesn’t support GvG anymore since everyone has had to come together to fight Zhaitan.

Make it it’s own arena where they don’t affect dynamic events, can’t affect a map’s performance, won’t cause overflows on maps with world bosses.

That way you can more easily do GvG across servers without having to have one guild guest to the other. Then guild members who do not wish to GvG are not forced to either leave the guild since changing who you represent would be too abused by both sides or not log on should they choose to not participate in the war.

And this would allow guild members of opposing guilds to be able to participate in temple events and world bosses without killing each other accidentally.

That’s the thing. There are too many variables for MMO companies to test to get the balance right before launch.

Their only means of determining if things are balanced are either mainly through players or studying how many people use X gear, Y traits, Z skills and studying combat logs. If too many use the same set or one skill seems to do much higher or much lower than average damage, chances are the game isn’t balanced very well.

It’s easier to nerf the one set down than it is to buff everything up to it so a lot of companies nerf instead of buff if they find something OP.

But they don’t know how much they need to nerf or buff it. So they guess.

Then player feedback comes in and they study percentages of players who have what set up and study the combat logs. And go at it again. Because their last nerf/buff probably wasn’t perfect or might have had an unintended side effect.

Aeonblade.8709:

spoj.9672:

Dean Calaway.9718:

Emanuel.9781:

Dean Calaway.9718:

Wow, so much Bull in one post.

TL;DR

Lol, you couldn’t even come up with a single argument to try to defend yourself…

Your first sentence was a pretty good indication that you dont know what you are talking about and its not worth having an arguement with you.

He’s right, and comments like this just reinforce his point. I understand people probably don’t want to grind for a different set of gear, but this meta is killing this game.

You do realize that unless they change mechanics, the number crunchers will just find out which gear set produces max DPS/second and that will become the new Meta, right? Then it will be [New Meta] only! It will not change the supposed problem. Because isn’t the supposed problem that groups are only wanting those in berserker gear?

And you do realize that berserker is the glass cannon build? Hits hard, but can’t take a hit. You do realize that for people to survive in berserker builds they have to be good at paying attention to their surroundings. Granted GW2’s glass cannons aren’t as glassy as other games’ glass cannons are. So there is some skill involved for a player who plays on a berserker build.

They would have to change the mechanics of the game in order to fix the actual problem. Smarter AI, difficulty in killing an enemy not created by increasing its health, those kinds of things. Or a drastic change like moving stats from gear to traits. Then any nerfing and buffing would at least be cheaper for players to work around. And there would probably be a lot more build variety because it’s cheap to try out a new build. Reducing the amount of “elite” players who demand zerker only.

Requiem.8769:

It’s quite simple: I won’t have the armor that I worked for. That will be taken away. As such, the only fair option would be to exchange that armor for another that I choose. It’s still an inconvenience, of course -I will no longer have the stats I considered the best- but at least it will be an inconvenience solely in balance/playstyle preferences, and not an inconvenience of tremendous grinding.

So you’re saying that every time ANet changes things that end up changing the Meta they should offer free gear changes?!

Unless they remove crit chance from armor, they will not be getting rid of the armor you worked on. They’ll just change how it works. And that is something that any player of any MMO should realize. That at anytime, the maker of the game might change it such that there is a new Meta. ANet did not have to offer a free choice on what stats old MF armor got. But they did because they got rid of the stat from armor entirely and they felt that was the best way to handle it from a PR standpoint. Because most MMO’s do not remove stats from armor I would imagine.

However, buffs and nerfs are to be expected in MMO’s and as such, new gear to people should not come free due to buffs and nerfs. Because players should understand that today their gear might be the best, but tomorrow it might not.

Yes, if berserker gear gets nerfed to the point that isn’t the best, I will feel sorry for those people who spent hours and countless gold on making their ascended gear. And I won’t feel sorry for ANet when those players take to making angry posts on the forum. They built the bed they’ll have to lay on given ascended gear.

The best thing ANet can do is come out with a cheaper method of obtaining ascended gear and not nerfing berserker to the point that it’s horrible. So that the new meta can be achieved in a less expensive way, but while they wait their current gear doesn’t handicap them that much.

Also try seeing if someone will help you run it. That way you should get to the end of it quicker and reduce the chances of your internet going out on you.

Saturn.6591:

Duke Nukem.6783:

the idea of charging us to swap servers for a game like this, with so much dynamic content, is a horrible and greedy idea to begin with,

I don’t see your problem. You can guest for free, and that’s all you need to do to do anything PvE-related. On top of that, you can do dungeons cross-server without even needing to guest. The only thing you’d need to actually transfer (and pay) for, is if you want to WvW for another server. Everything else is completely free. So again… what are you even talking about? Greedy, because it’s for free?

His problem is that the OP suggested ANet charge for guesting to solve something that isn’t a problem (guesters filling up the slots, it’s a symptom not a problem and most of us would rather the problem be addressed and not the symptoms).

The thing is, they got rid of magic find as a stat on armor. They had to do something with the armor.

They aren’t getting rid of any of the stats that zerker armor uses. I really don’t see them offering a change.

Nor do I think they should. Anyone who buys or crafts armor in an MMO should realize that the meta could change at any time and make a different build better.

The problem with Teq is NOT the guesting system.

The guesting system is just used as a way to get around the problem of the design of the encounter.

The encounter requires too many people with too much organization for it to happen. What to do is not intuitive if you don’t have people there who know what to do. And you have 15 minutes after he spawns to kill him.

And so on servers with low PvE activity, it is next to impossible to do Teq given the timer. So in order for them to do Teq, they have to guest to a server which does do Teq.

The guesting system should not be changed. The encounter should be tweaked to better scale to the number of people around or have the timer extended to allow for smaller/less organized/less experienced groups to kill him. That way there isn’t as much of a need to guest to other servers.

The guesters making servers go into overflow is not the problem. Heck, I think TTS intentionally forces Sparkfly into an overflow for Teq. So that most people in the map are actually trying for Teq and not doing other things.

Only one build choice is something they need to fix. It in and of itself is not the problem, it’s a symptom of a problem.

If they just buffed condition builds to be equal to pure damage builds, it would be a step in the right direction. To allow players to play how they want without running into issues finding groups for things like speed runs.

They could also change game mechanics to increase the usefulness of other builds.

Nandor The Stampede.1593:

Impossible to deny my logic. Furthermore, when ppl say zerker is the best build in the game… c’mon…. zerker is crap in pvp and wvw.

And you do realize that you’re posting in the dungeon sub-forum and the best gear for dungeons is zerker, right?

Best build varies from area to area. This is the dungeon forum, if area is not specified, you should assume for dungeons.

Creslin.1758:

Seera.5916:

Creslin.1758:

I don’t think the problem is necessarily that zerker heavies do a lot of damage. The problem is that they can consistently do this high damage without risk of death.

In most games, a party of glass cannons simply wouldn’t work. They would get rolled before they could do any significant amount of damage. But certain attributes of the GW2 combat environment make an all glass cannon party not only viable, but optimal.

And I think some of those problems are…

1. Zerker heavies can still be fairly tough because of traits and skills despite the fact that they are doing glass cannon level damage.

2. The AI of many encounters is incredibly predictable and exploitable, and fairly cheesy tactics like stacking allow the zerker heavies to do full damage for most of the fight with little concern for their health.

3. The downed state makes it so it’s pretty easy for the group to get someone up even if they go to 0 hp. In other games, someone going down in a fight is a major problem.

If some of these were changed, I don’t think that zerker heavy would remain as the meta.

For example, if the AI was made more unpredictable, people couldn’t just stack and move to the right places to avoid all damage and zerkers would wind up going down. And if zerker heavies weren’t so survivable, they couldn’t tank the damage that they do wind up taking. And since dead characters do no damage, I don’t think zerkers would constantly be at the top of the meta if they died so much.

The problem is if they change the mechanics of how the game works to such a degree that zerkers aren’t in high demand the number of people who would be up in arms would be extremely high.

The reason: ascended gear.

It’s account bound on acquire. It’s soul bound on use. It isn’t salvageable for even a fraction of the materials used to make it.

It takes months to FARM enough stuff to make a set. Not to mention the time gated bolts of damask. Light armor users will be very much up in arms since that class uses only bolts of damask and no metals or woods to supplement so it has the most needed bolts of damask. Or it takes TONS of gold to buy everything. But even then, the recipes require laurels, which might have been depleted while making the last set.

ANet is probably very wary of any move that would topple Zerker as an in demand build at this point. It would anger way too many people at this point.

You bring up valid points, but I don’t think that players investiture of time is a good reason to completely give up on balancing the game.

First, I see the fact that berserker gear seems to be the bar-none optimal choice for much of the game’s PvE content as a problem. It completely nullifies a huge amount of variety and forces people down one path. In a game that should be all about variety, different choices, and different builds…that doesn’t seem like a good thing.

Second, I don’t think anyone wants to see ANet nerf berserker gear to the point that it sucks. We just want OTHER builds to be viable/needed for dungeons to make it more interesting.

And third, I think that history has shown that ANet is now averse to nerfing something that people invested a lot of time in to the point where it isn’t viable as compared to the other classes. Case and point, I play and elementalist lol. If ANet is willing to repeatedly nerf the crap out of an entire class…I don’t think that your specific armor type is safe.

Oh, I totally agree. I main an elementalist as well.

And while time invested should not be the sole reason for changing something or not, it would likely need to be a factor in the timing of the changes.

If they release a change that nerfs zerker to not be the best in the game tomorrow, then people will be carrying pitchforks crying foul given the ascended armor.

But if they release that change say 9-12 months from now or longer, the outcry might not be as bad. People will have recouped their money, gotten over any burnout on farming the mats, regained laurels needed for the recipes, etc.

And I would much rather see a buff of the other builds over a nerf on zerker.

Creslin.1758:

I don’t think the problem is necessarily that zerker heavies do a lot of damage. The problem is that they can consistently do this high damage without risk of death.

In most games, a party of glass cannons simply wouldn’t work. They would get rolled before they could do any significant amount of damage. But certain attributes of the GW2 combat environment make an all glass cannon party not only viable, but optimal.

And I think some of those problems are…

1. Zerker heavies can still be fairly tough because of traits and skills despite the fact that they are doing glass cannon level damage.

2. The AI of many encounters is incredibly predictable and exploitable, and fairly cheesy tactics like stacking allow the zerker heavies to do full damage for most of the fight with little concern for their health.

3. The downed state makes it so it’s pretty easy for the group to get someone up even if they go to 0 hp. In other games, someone going down in a fight is a major problem.

If some of these were changed, I don’t think that zerker heavy would remain as the meta.

For example, if the AI was made more unpredictable, people couldn’t just stack and move to the right places to avoid all damage and zerkers would wind up going down. And if zerker heavies weren’t so survivable, they couldn’t tank the damage that they do wind up taking. And since dead characters do no damage, I don’t think zerkers would constantly be at the top of the meta if they died so much.

The problem is if they change the mechanics of how the game works to such a degree that zerkers aren’t in high demand the number of people who would be up in arms would be extremely high.

The reason: ascended gear.

It’s account bound on acquire. It’s soul bound on use. It isn’t salvageable for even a fraction of the materials used to make it.

It takes months to FARM enough stuff to make a set. Not to mention the time gated bolts of damask. Light armor users will be very much up in arms since that class uses only bolts of damask and no metals or woods to supplement so it has the most needed bolts of damask. Or it takes TONS of gold to buy everything. But even then, the recipes require laurels, which might have been depleted while making the last set.

ANet is probably very wary of any move that would topple Zerker as an in demand build at this point. It would anger way too many people at this point.

xsquared.1926:

Seera.5916:

It would be nice if there were more non-zerker builds that could hit in the damage range of zerker builds and hit the range of times speed clears happen in to increase variety of play styles and strategies for speed clearers to not burn them out as quickly.

Only if those gear sets are full on offensive such as rampagers, berserkers and assassins. Gear such as Knights, Valkyrie and Soldiers with partial defensive stats should NEVER have as much DPS as zerkers. If they did, then what would the point of zerks be?

Just as long as there is variety in the builds available, I think it would be an improvement.

I definitely don’t think they should make the more purely defensive or bunker builds on par with the damage builds.

But they could probably change some mechanics around and stats and all that good stuff to get 2 other builds to run at the statistical average speed clear time.

If they could, the price of zerker gear will likely come down. The cost of the other two sets of gear will likely rise, but not to the degree zerker is now (with inflation adjusted for, of course).

Mirsa.1628:

Seera.5916:

Mirsa.1628:

Seera.5916:

So only having one real viable build per class isn’t broken?

So ANet shouldn’t try to increase the variety of viable builds in a way that isn’t nerfing the one build?

Viable != optimal. Just because zerker gear is optimal doesn’t mean it’s the only set viable.

When I say viable, I mean viable for speed runs. Most people in here seemed to get what I meant so I didn’t see the problem or feel the need to edit my post.

For speed runs, you want the best build and gear. Optimal = best. How can there be more than one best? Seems like you need to brush up on your English definitions.

PTV, cleric, and condition damage sets are viable (aka feasible) for all content, just simply not the best.

I would assume that most speed runs have a range of times that are done because nothing goes off at exactly the same time every run through. So there is a range and an average time.

Right now there is only one build set that can hit the current range of times and keep the average. Zerker.

If they changed the mechanics around in such a way that 3 builds have roughly the same range of times and the average times within a few seconds of each other, wouldn’t that be nice? And I’m not saying that the current bottom 2 builds have to be the other builds besides zerker to do speed runs, it could be builds #2 and #3.

Then there would be 3 best builds. If you were comparing 5 items that have different looks but 3 of them have the exact same stats and those stats are the best for whatever it is that the item is used for, wouldn’t those three items be considered the best stat wise? Leaving the true best up to the user on which one they feel is the better looking?

In the case of gear & builds, it would be 3 sets of gear and builds that provide the same average overall DPS (and whatever other mechanic they implement) but work differently in how they create that DPS. So the answer to which is the best question is would be which of the three play styles works best for you.

I’m would also say that zerker needs to be one of the builds since that would open a big can of worms if that isn’t good for speed clearing now that ascended has been released with it being soul bound on use and account bound on acquire. And not salvageable for even a fraction of the materials used.

Don’t assume that every speed run with everyone on meta and on their A game clocks in with the exact same total damage dealt or speed done (comparing runs of the same players in the same dungeon path with the same characters and gear and traits and skills used). Because as soon as there is a range of times or a range of damages dealt, then statistics comes into play and things that seem to be not in the range of reasonable speed clearing might just in fact be in that range. Which could happen if ANet changed mechanics. Right now, a speed clear with too many non-zerkers would be an outlier if done legit.

It would be nice if there were more non-zerker builds that could hit in the damage range of zerker builds and hit the range of times speed clears happen in to increase variety of play styles and strategies for speed clearers to not burn them out as quickly.

Mirsa.1628:

Seera.5916:

So only having one real viable build per class isn’t broken?

So ANet shouldn’t try to increase the variety of viable builds in a way that isn’t nerfing the one build?

Viable != optimal. Just because zerker gear is optimal doesn’t mean it’s the only set viable.

When I say viable, I mean viable for speed runs. Most people in here seemed to get what I meant so I didn’t see the problem or feel the need to edit my post.

timidobserver.7925:

Seera.5916:

If he did it (or someone else does it) for the sole intention of disrupting a farm, then that would be griefing. This one is the hardest to prove unless you get screenshots of the person saying they did it to cause problems.

However, nothing in the OP’s post gives any indication of whether or not he was doing it to spite the farmers or not. His word choice gives high chances that he did do it to spite the farmers, but it’s not 100% that he did it. His wording could simply because he’s angry at yet another group of farmers getting mad at him for playing the game as intended.

The problem isn’t the farm trains. The farm trains are just a symptom of a variety of problems:

1. Not enough real fun, challenging, and appropriately rewarding content is available. Dungeons are really the only thing and they aren’t everyone’s cup of tea and most people like variety.

2. Best gear currently requires a TON of material. Demand is high. Currently supply on the TP is not high and prices have therefore gone up. Makes going out to get the mats yourself cheaper if you know where you can go to get them quickly and for cheap.

3. Said mats for the above requires tons of Bolts of Damask. Which require various threads. Threads come from salvaging only. Or from bags of loot. Which means going out and killing things and hoping you get the right mat out of the salvage.

2 & 3 will likely calm down over the course of the next few months as most people get their gear and more ways to get the gear will hopefully come out that do not involve crafting (or at least not as much)..

1 is something that ANet can fix. They can add in content that’s fun, challenging, and appropriately rewarding.

Hopefully once season 1 of the living story is over, we’ll start to see content come in that fills that spot.

Farm trains are currently, next to dungeons, the quickest way to earn the most money and mats. So until the above three problems are gone, farm trains will likely be very popular. The solving of the problem will likely not get rid of farm trains completely, but should reduce their size considerably most likely.

I am not lawyer here aiming to prove anything or say that he specifically was aiming to spite them. My post is quite short and the point is clear. If, he was doing it to bother, grief, spite, ect them then he is just as bad if not worse than them. However, if he wanted to complete an event, then he has every right to do so.

My post was responding to Alukah who had responded to you. Alukah said the problem was the farmers. I disagreed, said they were a symptom, and said what I thought the problems were that were causing the increase in farming.

I fully agree with you.

GrandmaFunk.3052:

PvE-only would be fine but definitely not in WvW.

Definitely.

Though, it would be nice for the classes without weapon swap abilities to be able to have a weapon swap slot that we can switch to out of combat (instead of opening our inventory to do it).

Kenaron.3654:

Seera.5916:

So only having one real viable build per class isn’t broken?

Well, it’s not quite that bad. Admittedly I do play Ranger a lot and outside of SPvP I’m never certain when there even is a single viable Ranger build. It seems to come and go seasonally. That said, I know Ranger isn’t the worst off and there in lays the problem.

I’m definitely not saying that the game should be made that every build is just as efficient as every other build for a class.

But the mechanics of the game mean that for most all PvE content, one build rules them all. And it’s the same build for all classes: zerker. It would be nice if there was some variety but still being able to maintain the average speed clear run time.

“Well for class A, you have the choice between builds 1, 2 and 3.” Where builds 1, 2, and 3 are builds that speed clearers would take with them if they didn’t already have a lot using that build.

I believe the problem with Ranger is that most players don’t use the meta build and refuse to believe the meta build when they are told it is better than their build. Or at least enough do to create a negative impression among many speed clearing dungeon runners.

Alukah.2063:

timidobserver.7925:

Frostfang.5109:

I’ll answer a couple of u… If I do Teq (wich I do once ina great while for fun).. I DO spend that waiting hour doing other stuff. Then I’m hoping not to get an error and end up on overflow being (most likely) unable to sucess….

The farm. Whenever u enter Frsostgorge there is a HUGE train there farming Champs (wich I hate and never take part of). I have been there a couple of times to get some Dragonites for ascended craftng lately. Same goes for the Epyrial shards wich happened to be located at the Troll…. Many ppl in that farm train are Guests. Talk around listen to chat etc and u’ll find out.

I’m perfectly fine with Guild missions… Its an activity that takes part, not just some abusing crazed mega-zerg hysterical farming 24/7.

Tequatl. Most ppl ther are guests as their own server have too few ppl doing it in order to suceed…

Yesterday I ran onto a big Group pf french ppl farming linen on an event that they used (read “abused” instead). I came there and finished the event and that kittened them off quite badly….

Ppl find all ways of using the game, that are not the ways it was intended. When u act in a normal way, like killing a champ because u happened to pass by, doing an event because u pass by, try to get to a World boss on u’r own server… either u kitten ppl off or end up on an oveflow…

My experience is that these things tend to happen to me more often and in more places lately….

I have to play devil’s advocate and say that I find issue with you going out of your way to interrupt them. I could understand entirely if you genuinely intended to do that event because you wanted to do the event. If that was your intent, then tough to them. However, you are no better than them if you went out of your way just to interrupt or troll them them.

This is really Anet’s fault honestly. They are the ones introducing new gear that requires a level of farming that even WoW would be disgusted with. Clearly Anet supports the needs for MASS farming to improve your gear, therefore it is their fault that people are doing whatever they can to farm it.

He’s not doing anything wrong by going out of his way to complete events because they are meant to be completed, those farming them are exploiting the system.

If he did it (or someone else does it) for the sole intention of disrupting a farm, then that would be griefing. This one is the hardest to prove unless you get screenshots of the person saying they did it to cause problems.

However, nothing in the OP’s post gives any indication of whether or not he was doing it to spite the farmers or not. His word choice gives high chances that he did do it to spite the farmers, but it’s not 100% that he did it. His wording could simply because he’s angry at yet another group of farmers getting mad at him for playing the game as intended.

The problem isn’t the farm trains. The farm trains are just a symptom of a variety of problems:

1. Not enough real fun, challenging, and appropriately rewarding content is available. Dungeons are really the only thing and they aren’t everyone’s cup of tea and most people like variety.

2. Best gear currently requires a TON of material. Demand is high. Currently supply on the TP is not high and prices have therefore gone up. Makes going out to get the mats yourself cheaper if you know where you can go to get them quickly and for cheap.

3. Said mats for the above requires tons of Bolts of Damask. Which require various threads. Threads come from salvaging only. Or from bags of loot. Which means going out and killing things and hoping you get the right mat out of the salvage.

2 & 3 will likely calm down over the course of the next few months as most people get their gear and more ways to get the gear will hopefully come out that do not involve crafting (or at least not as much)..

1 is something that ANet can fix. They can add in content that’s fun, challenging, and appropriately rewarding.

Hopefully once season 1 of the living story is over, we’ll start to see content come in that fills that spot.

Farm trains are currently, next to dungeons, the quickest way to earn the most money and mats. So until the above three problems are gone, farm trains will likely be very popular. The solving of the problem will likely not get rid of farm trains completely, but should reduce their size considerably most likely.