Guild Wars 2

I like it, quite challenging and forces me to keep myself on my toes. all the more satisfying when i beat them.

Can we instead just have a bit more stability and stun breaks in our builds? maby a bit more condi cleanse, considering a lot of people are whining about too much the current zerker or condi burst meta. Maby have a bit of both. focus on cripple, immobilze, weakness etc.

lmao, my sides, all of them xD

kdaddy.5431:

i think its because for 1 the community overall are dumb. There is a forum post to nerf engys since 1 player on twitch is better then everyone else.

There was another player say the same for thief since the other guy from the abjured is really good. People are actually posting nerf classes since the best players are crushing people.

Also i think mesmers need to be toned down a bit but i think eles are fine but a million people will come on here and say different from me which is why i think they will wait.

This, if the developers nerfed every kitten thing u people asked for, pvp would be an absolute mess. it’d be an warrior fest all along. warriors running everywhere. no diveristy whatsoever.

seriously they are people asking for mesmers not to friggin shatter when they are dazed or stunned? like come on man.

Or maby you and your friends make your own premade team? Infact you already have this option avaiable. just make your own team. Do not interfere with the ability of other players to play the game. you are not the only one that bought the game.

Chobits.2430:

Only because people running around in celestial and not knowing how to play.

I ran full ascended sentinel armor/weapons with WvW infusions and all ascended cleric trinkets with WvW infusions.
I ran Jalis/Ventari with Hammer and specced properly and played the class how it was supposed to be played, a ranged support role (CC & heals)
I almost never died.

that’s untrue you had people experimenting with zerker armour as well. and the damage was still subpar. the thing is. if the revenant is meant to be played as a support role. then it sure as hell is the first class in a long time in gw2 that is actively tailored to a single role. which to me is doubtfull considering this is a beta. the corruption trait bieng akin to a necromancer and the elite skill of demon stance and the spontaneous destruction trait.

anyways i have a somewhat different experience, I ran a berserker and rampager revenant with a bit of cleric runes here and there and i must say i didn’t do all that bad in roaming. soloing camps and figthing other players is feasible. altough difficult but feasible. my condition damage was pretty kitten awsome.

raiaknl.6348:

He’s probably one of the best engies out there, I’m talking about Five Gauge from The Abjured.
Well, I see him do the follow:
Perma swiftness
Stealth
Pull the target
Push the target
Heavy condition damage
Good ranged damage
Insane healing
Perma regen
Perma vigor
Insane kite mechanic
Engi shield has lower cooldown on block than guardian and warrior, unbelievable.
He trasnform people into MOA, really Anet??
He gets WARRIOR’S rampage on a much LOWER cooldown, the damage? Is almost the same.
It’s tanky as hell
He goes twice in less than 20 secs into the mini-form being invunerable to everything…
He cleanses condies very often.

So, Engineers can do EVERYTHING and they do everything very very well.
In good hands like Chaith, it shows how broken engies are.

Remove the moa, rampage, shield and invulnerable from this class and it may balance things out.
Also engies has zero cooldown on kits, give Eles no cooldown on attunements too.

That’s just stupid. you are litterally going to possibly the best friggin engineer in the entire pvp scene to somehow prove that engineers are OP?. That’s like saying necromancers are OP because Noscoc can kitten kitten up. Come on no. u cannot use the absolute top of a ladder to prove the worth of the average joe. If people wanna determine how smart one is at average, they are not going to base thier data on people like Steven Hawking and Einstein right?

Engineers mostly Always have ’’isane’’ condition damage even pre patch. but in return they cannot take conditions or heavy cc pressure very well. if you want an engineer to not be constantly Reliant on transmute, which means they’d have to sacrifice kits and go to elixir route. they’d throw away quite a lot of thier overal damage. and even if chaith manages to pull this off. this guy is an prolly the best or atleast one of the best engineers in pvp out there.

Most condi engineers hardly ever use stealth. often they have slick shoes utility or an elixer gun for a stunbreak f key skill. And even when they do thier stealth is only for a very short duration.

push the target and pull the target? an engineer on average has 3 cc moves. not much different then other classes.

Insane healing? sure engineers can stack quite a lot of regenration.. but the thing is, it’s regenration, their direct heals ar often not used. it’s either the healing exlixer or healing turret which has a low base heal afterall. the reason thier heals are insane is because they can stay alive with all thier grenades and movement skills.

perma vigor. not really a game changer here. considering they are quite lot of classes with movement reducing skills or straight AOE damage. the engineer isn’t just seen rolling around dodging everyhing.

Good ranged damage. Sure if you go the celestial rifle or straight up power rifle route. but. You act as if this is a bad thing for a class to be good at multiple things. these kinds of builds are called hybrids. most engineers absolutely suck when it comes to raw dps.

engineers bieng tanky as hell is a straight up lie.

Moa often forces people to disengage. it’s very powerfull in teamfights. but higher tiered players do not fall for these kinds of tricks.

Rampage is absolotutely useless on most engineers unless they happen to be a more dps focused type of build.

how does chaith goes twice in the small form when the elixir has like 60 second recharge in less then 20 sec’s. ? Sound like a lie to me

why should an engineer hace cooldowns on kits, when the kit moves themselves have a cooldown. thier swiftness and vigor is what they use to stay alive. to not get cc’ed down or bursted down by all the dps going around. it’s thier main way of moving.

removing invulnreability and the shield is akin to heavily crippling thier survival and thus would mean that thier regen is useless since they get now kittening time to heal up,no just no.

And still you shouldn’t use somebody like chaith as the kitten representative of engineers in the game.

true, i however went a different route and focused more on conditions and i must say that it works if you go a bit more rampagers route. i have full krait runes. And I can actually burst people down with my elite skill when using the demon stance.

Scattered and Incomplete

I want more stability and stunbreaks. this is just one in few. But considering it’s attack speed is quite slow on account of it not bieng a classical direct damage time. I don’t want to get my attacks constantly interuppted.

On top of having little to no stunbreaks and or stability and a relatively slow moveset. I feel that the stances themselves are fundamentally not working properly.

Back to the whole traits and skills not complimenting one another. there is a fundamental problem with the amount of energy each move uses and a lack of recharge. So the lack of stability, and stunbreaks, the high energy consumption, lack of CC and moves that keep the enemies at bay, Make soloing a camp incredibly hard. U are forced to constantly switch your skills incredibly early in battle and burn through your energy, you have hardly any cc or stunbreaks, which makes it incredibly easily to get chained by an incredibly long combo, and just when you have to heal, it turns out you can’t because you already waisted your skills on just trying to deal some damage. Soloing a camp is incredibly hard and strenous to do so. heck a single fight against a veteran npc takes quite some time. just using a few moves restricts u to your elite or you are forced to change. Once again going back to the whole stunbreak upon switching upon stance thing, so again u are missing another chance to use your appearant stunbreak. I suggest traits that recharge energy for example when u take condition damage. maby 3 percent per condition applied to yourself. that way u can actually fight. Also upon changing stance, there should be a trait possible that heals upon change. Considering the certain stance moves aren’t immeadatly available or u need a certain amount of time to ready your attack for example the ventari tablet, would require you to actually summon the tablet first and then get the skills open. if this is to OP. only apply this to the ventari tablet or any other stance that support healing. heck infact give every stance a certain boon or benefit upon switching as compensation for the energy based skills.

I must say that besides all of this I managed to make a revenant that can kinda hold is own against high ranked wvw players and solo camps but it’s incredibly, and I mean incredibly hard to do so. sometimes even stressfull. well i guess it isn’t called a beta for nothing xD.

I think for the rest everything the revenant is definately a good class to play with. Just pay more attention on having skills and traits complement another.

I suggest having a legend that Focuses on DPS and most importantly CC. Like seriously, there was little to no CC to lock the enemies down. It’s definately needed considering the slowish telegraphed attacks of the hammer, in compairsion to guards who have hammer skill numbers 2, 3 and 5 to lock down an opponents respectively even if it’s attacks are telegraphed very slowly, the hammer skill 1 grants aoe damage and grants protection to compensate for it’s relatively slow attack speed, hammer skill 3 immobilizes and hammer skill 5 can keep an enemy confined in a small symbol. As for warrior, do I even need to start with that xD? the mesmer gs skill tree to wich the hammer bears more resemblance too. has an ample amount of cc and crippling inducing attacks such as gs skill 5 and 4 to keep your enemies at bay. So in short if you want to make dps viable. allow more cc. and change the hammer skills to allow more cc for example. give hammer skill 2 a knockdown with an 8 sec CD. Give hammer skill 3 cripple and or immobilized with an 10 as a base. eventual traits that reduced cd by 15 or 20 percent can still be applied and it would still be perfectly reasonable to fight against sec CD. the 5th skill should remain unchanged. there isn’t an excessive amount of cc here. And the still slow telegraphed attacks don’t make the hammer another cc monster like the warrior. it’s still perfectly dodgeable.

Developer if you intended to add more weapons with CC. Then atleast arm the hammer with atleast a couple of movement reducing skills such as chilled, immobilize and cripple.

The second problem is an distinct lack of stunbreaks and stability. U cannot have a revenant with just 2 stunbreaks the 2 of them bieng only activated when you change stances, which are also temporarily due to most of it’s moves bieng energy based. On top of that u cannot immeadatily switch back so you are forced to use the other stance skills to just stay alive. It brings the player in a very unfair situation. Sure there is a trait that gives u 2 seconds of stability, when u roll, but at the same there is a lack of skills and or traits that give u vigor to make it even viable in first place. Maby you the developers intend for the class to move to earn it’s stability, which is fine but then provide the class with traits and skills that support more mobility.for example considering the corruption traitline seems similar to that of a necromancer. create an utility similar to guardians medidation skill that converts conditions into boons. and give vigor a priortity. Make vigor: always recieve. this is what i mean with the revenant bieng akin to a broken puzzle they are certain traits skills and abilities that do not fit well, they do not compliment one and another. Also allow for example an utility in the legendary dwarf stance considering it seems to be closer to a guardian. for example an utility gives us stability without us bieng forced
to run over said road. if we have to move to get stability then make it so that it’s within a certain radius like a concescration. And discourage people from entering our area. apply burn or other powerfull condition. This can also be placed on the stance of the legendary demon. Also back to the roll to get stability subject. increase the duration to 4 or 5 seconds considering you are encouraged to actually run through your stamina for some stability.

Hey A-Net, I’m very happy to have gotten the chance to play with the revenant, I’ve mainly tested the revenant in wvw, for roaming/pvp purposes, And i must say, that’t it’s got quite an interesting way of fighting, feels as if i’m playing with a necromancer, warrior, engineer,elementalist and mesmer at the same time^^.

Well let’s get started. with the good points eh?

First of all the revenant definately brings something new to the table. Rather then it bieng a simple warrior who’s damage comes from direct damage with either your auto attacks. No instead it’s main amount of damage comes from the corruption trait line and legendary demon stance which just as a necro focuses on self harm through the use of conditions,hold them, and then apply bonus condition damage to your enemies or transfer them over. Sure you have the legendary dwarf stance but considering you have one healing skill that grants retalation and heals conditions, an utility that grants stability, one that applies taunt, a direct damage skill and an elite skill that gives more toughness. this dwarf stance is more akin to a guardian then to a warrior. However it sure as hell is a stance for sustaining damage in my opinion. I must say i like the ventari tablet stance one of the most interesting ways of healing damage. It’s like a mobile healing turret allowing you to focus on healing yourself and others. i Always wished for the engineer to have mobile turrets. well it happend. bieng able to switch forms in battle apply different playstyles with attributes from nearly all classes is pretty kitten interesting.

I espically like the cool animations and voices the revenants abilities apply. it gives a very mystic feeling. teleporting around, displacing space, and summoning heroes from the past is pretty kitten awsome, the feel of mysticsim is emphasized alot. very good job on that part.

Well here are the bad parts. Well how must i say it in short? The revenant feels like an incredibly hard puzzle u need to piece together to make it viable. But hey I guess that’s what the beta is for.

Well first things first. I think most people have called this out but the revenant in terms of raw dps is quite subpar. the relatively slow telegraphed attacks and distinct lack of CC make anybody who prefers a dps type of build not very viable.

Counters to blinding dissapiations and general mesmer bursts

Warrior: Resistance, endure pain, berserker stance. shield skill 5(traits that reflect projectiles)

Guardians: classical medi heals, tons of blocks either through aegis or focus skill number 5.

just a few examples. Mesmers aren’t unchecked. Maby u ought to actually counter thier abilities instead. Maby more lockdowns? More CC? Maby disengage from time to time? Maby ask your members to take the mesmer down?

kitten Yeah, I couldn’t be more happier. Condi this, Condi that, Burst this, Burst that.

To answer your question. It’s because people like that are trash. Embrace your class.

MithranArkanere.8957:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

[…]

What we all know is that after most updates there’s always something broken.

And we can just go to the wiki and read the history of all skills to see things like the broken Descent to Madness that deals over 30K damage or the Broken grenadier that could go through hordes of enemies as if they were brittle paper.

Acting all dismissive as if such things didn’t happen is pointless. It serves no purpose, it helps no one, and won’t prevent things from being eventually fixed.

There are broken things, they need to be fixed, and going around telling people there’s nothing broken and ‘l2p’ while wielding something broken is both unethical and hypocritical.

I never denied that there is something broken. Infact even outright stated that some things can objectively be stated to be broken. Aka actuall exploits and stuff like going through walls, reaching places through unconventional means, often through forms of travelling not possible. That is something i can admit.

However the moment you get in certain traits or certain builds are too OP, Or too broken. U get into the subjective matter of reasoning which is fine and all. But do not act as if you can accurately gage what is too strong and what isn’t. U’d have to handpick what is broken and what isn’t. The default doesn’t lie in ah this build is too strong for me, so therefore it’s broken. that cannot possibly be the default without the developers self stating that they intended for certain traits to work differently.

Considering they are tiers of pvp play. What might be broken to you, Might not be broken to me. which with the current patch is almost nobody, aside from a few to this point have bested me in 1v1’s or one point figting. With the difference in player skill. no player can objectively say: ‘’This build is too strong. ’’ it simply makes no sense.

Anyways, I bet that even after some nerfs. People will continue making ’’OP’’ builds. You will keep getting destroyed over and over again. People will keep asking for nerfs. And this will keep going on and on. Who would then be to blame? What if all of your nerf wishes came true.And people still managed to destroy you? Who will you blame?

This kinda culture supports the supression of build creativity. the thing is here. that no buff or nerf will satisfy. there will Always be people who have concerns. Rather i prefer we adapt.

MithranArkanere.8957:

If what you say was true, they would never make skill changes.

The very fact that skill changes are done is proof that there’s broken builds. Particular combinations of skills, gears and traits that work too well together. Players find those loopholes in balance, and exploit them to get unfair advantages with which they earn undeserved victories, until what’s broken is fixed, and then they cry because they have no skill, and they can’t win without those broken builds.

How ironic when the ones who need to “L2P” the most and can’t do a thing without abusing loopholes in the balance are the ones going around saying others should “l2p”.

This is a game, not real life politics. You can’t prevent things from being fixed by lying and saying they are ok when they are not.

If Balthazar was around, he’ll smack them exploiters silly until their ears flop like freaking sparkfly wings.

Ha ha ha, don’t make me laugh. Builds working too well, exploiting loopholes? You talk as if there is some kind of objective standard of creativity. How in the world do you know how traits are meant to be applied? How do you know that the developers intended for traits to only be combined with certain traits? U cannnot be this strong, is absolutely subjective and in no way does it actually prove that builds are broken.

The only thing that can be said to be objectively an exploit is if through unconvential means certain feats can be achieved. For example running through walls, or go outside the map etc.

You are so sure of yourself, How can you tell that buffs or patches are based on the developers intentions rather then to cater to players such as yourself who go on the ‘’Dis Build is OP’’ Bandwagon and are rather making the game easier for people such as yourself?

Don’t act as if you know what is going on here. You know what they say, They’re will Always be somebody better then you=> A Builds OPness is all in the eye of the beholder.

L2P

BTW: I’m not sarcastic at all. I honestly agree. the source of all OP builds lies mostly with the players themselves. nearly all ridiculous bun builds up for example is due a kittenload of stacking.

Actually, i think you got something here. Rather of constantly figthing the nerfs. I think we should encourage it from all our classes and all the traits and builds considered OP. I will promise that even after burn get’s nerfed i will simply keep creating a new powerfull burn guardian and destroy you over and over again, Infact I encourage every kitten ’’OP’’ Class. To keep creating the same build over and over again and keep them viable. Abuse the heck out of it. We should teach people the difference between making a viable build and ’’broken’’ mechanics.

I tend to agree with the OP for most of it. It’s not builds that are OP, You’d have to account that certain builds are hard counters to other classes. Then u also need to take in account that still quite a lof people have classes that lean towards the zerker/dps meta on account of the ‘’power inflation’‘. I see a kittenload of people complaining about burning with those people have 20+ ticks and more. often a lack of condi removal. They are very few traits in builds that could make a class OP. I never suffered from anything of the recent patch. Mesmer,Warriors, Engineers, thiefs. They all were beatable. If I with necro can fight for several minutes with a ’’condi mesmer’’ with the supposedly underdog necro then honestly i do think people need to rethink thier strategy. to me it seems the meta is hinging to the balanced build site.

I have taken a look at a thread in the mesmer subsection of the forum called: Why are we a self defeating community? And I’ve come across a few posts in which appearantly frequent mesmer users consider the general mesmer public to be more intelligent or atleast capable of more critial thought in compairison to warrior player who in thier eyes they view as a more straightforward player even jokingly I assume comparing them to neanderthals. This has made me think for a bit. I noticed that in the pvp community I often hear warrior players calling ranged classes for constantly running ’’away’’ in a fight. And this is regardless of if they are winning a fight or not. Even if they win for example against me, they sometimes say: Why are you running away? Also I noticed that friends that play a warrior, when switching to an engineer, thief or other class. they still play quite aggressively. as if this warrior mentality isn’t quite out of them This is for within the PVP community.

In the WvW Community warriors, guards tend to take the forefront as either melee class or commanders. I also sometimes noticed that there is like this unspoken rule of you as a warrior bieng a bit fearless. infact i noticed other people in zerg calling out the melee group for running away. aside from their bieng a tactical advantage it’s brought up in such a way that you need to grow a pair of balls. Guardians and Warriors bieng cowards is in my experience more frowned upon then for example engineers and mesmer bieng cowards.

I noticed a similar trend in dungeons. So I was wondering if thier is some kind of relation to players personality and thier main class? Do the classes alter your way of thinking. Or does your way of thinking influence which class you use a main?

At this moment I don’t really have a main class. I play necro, warrior, engineer, ranger, elementalist, mesmer and guardian at a mediocore level. but I notice, I feel a lot more honourable when playing with a guardian, In a pvp environment I feel somewhat a bit more lenient. But if I for example play with a mesmer, I’m quite playfull. I kitten around a bit more. for example.

So I thought it’d be cool to discuss the relation between classes and class affinity in relation to your personality.

dem thighs are too tick,

no but seriously, yeah that is sloppy work. it’s a bit annoying it also happens to norn, espically with the shoulderguard stuff.

this is actually a very good observation u are making. it explains the constant infigthing over classes, when you hear people say mesmers are op cause of ………………….. and the nay sayers say no cause of…………………….. both parties aren’t actually getting father ahead. but now that you mentioned it. this begs the question of where to draw the line. should people be discouraged from makin powerfull builds? where is the line in bieng just very creative/experienced/and in which a certrain trait or build is OP?

Personally i wouldn’t want to touch much on the build aspect too much cause it can discourage people to be creative. Basically you’d be limited by the community, anytime somebody is jealous or finds things unfair your build get nerfed. which is really childish, this is not directed at you OP but more in general what kind of mentality this can condone.

style.6173:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

if you take 24 ticks of burning. not 5, not 10 but 24 friggin ticks of burning, then you’ve got nothing and nobody to blame other then yourself man. how the hell do you even pull this off? u didn’t cleanse anything whatsoever. which means it’s been your choice which is fine and all but don’t complain about burning damage, whoever did that much damage per tick is most likely a condi based build.

Wow. I bet this person actually thinks burning is balanced right now.

listen carefully, if you take 24 friggin ticks of burning, it’s your fault. Said person had little to no condi cleanses most likely or runes or that decreased condi stacking duration. espically since burning is intensity based rather then stacking in duration i for the love of god wonder how he got even more then 10 in the first place? this guy made the concious choice not to have a suffient amount of condi cleanses and is probably a dps type of build, which is fine and all. but don’t whine because you took 24 frigin stacks of burning. Second of all I do think burning and conditions aren’t op. they are just fine they know allow people who like conditions to also use them to burst. I honestly cannot friggin believe how some people can be fine with zerker meta in which throwin 10 k damage with a combo or higher is completely fine. often it’s argued it’’s squishy but start ranting the moment a conditon equivelant of it comes out.

I mean come on. just think about it. this guy has 24 ticks of burning. the fact that this guy on average took 2000 burning damage per tick on average means that his opponent was very likely to be the zerker equivelant of a condi build. it simply means that they too can burst. this guy was at the very least has heavily in condition damage and thus should be awarded appropiately. Conditions and DPS are finnally on equal playing field.

And if you wanna argue that this guy fought more then 1 person, then such thicks should be expected. he’d then be whining about the fact that he recieved in a situations in which the odds are ’’stacked’’(yes pun intended) against him. If 2 or 3 people decided to burst you down, then it’s appropiate for you to take a massive amount of damage.

Taking 24 ticks of burning SMH. U kittening kidding me?

I might have been a bit ranty in my post. If i offended you please don’t take it personally.

Jesus kittening christ, ridiculous nerf requests, man this gotta be a troll post. U got to be trolling man.

if you take 24 ticks of burning. not 5, not 10 but 24 friggin ticks of burning, then you’ve got nothing and nobody to blame other then yourself man. how the hell do you even pull this off? u didn’t cleanse anything whatsoever. which means it’s been your choice which is fine and all but don’t complain about burning damage, whoever did that much damage per tick is most likely a condi based build.

what are people jabbering about mesmer’s instant cast’s, instant this, instant that. Only the mantra’s can be argued to be cast instantly and that is assuming you don’t run out of them and are left wide open for an counter play in which you have to recharge them in battle mind you, wich considering mesmer’s squishyness and overall lack of stability is quite a gamble you are making.

I haven’t seen many people actually bieng baited by mantra’s espically since the offensive ones are mantra of pain which on it’s own is garbage and mantra of distraction which is often used in a chain combo.

How the hell do shatters punish bait /dodges any more then any other form of attack? shatters are often used for burst damage. be it condition or pure dps.

And no mesmers do not spam evades, rangers have the evades. the only evade u can argue a mesmer have are distortion which has quite a cd. 50 sec roughly and granted u can have certain traits that decrease illulsion attacks. but that is often at the cost of you reaching a certain hp treshold or sword skill number 4.

But if you are talking about for example skills or moves that allow you to actually take either no damage through a block, dodge or some kind of invulnerability. one can argue even warriors and guardians, have quite lot of those as well. how many blocks and blinds doesn’t a guardian have? A warrior has shield block with a 25 to 30 sec cd, gs skill number 3, gs skill number 5 is also often used for disengage, sometimes even hammer f1, then you have endure pain. u talk as if mesmers can Always dodge while you yourself are sitting duck.

If you are talking about a mesmer wich can spam evades, u can count in blink, distortion, sword skill number 4,focus torch skill number 4, staff skill number 2, decoy and i think glamour skill and elite skill(forgot the name) that grants max stealth. then yes a mesmer is can spam evades but that is so unlikely. it’d be an purely highly unbalanced mesmer, with little to no cc whatsoever, or any stunbreak or condi cleanse whatsoever. all it can do is just stealth and use it weaponskills to attack. U’d have to be an idiot to create an mesmer like that.

Mesmer indeed take skills to be made use of as it’s primary way of attacking is true clones. it can hardly attack u directly which means it’s attacks are telegraphed.

the mesmer and it’s stealth can be a tricky part indeed. but what you can do in stealth is either save up your blocks, or invulnerables or your evasive manouvres or, either just disengage and go out of it’s line of sight. most pvp environments aren’t exactly mesmer friendly in that regard but allow classes with less mobility to actual have an viable way to evade mesmer bursts.

Mesmers aren’t out of control man. U can lock them down perfectly with chilled, weakness, crippled and or immobilize. thier damage is meant to be top tier, along with thiefs. As for all those stuns. Maby u’d need stun breaks or stability of the sorts, And not go all zerker ish meta. because at this moment in time, they’re is a portion of players that still focuses dps/condi rather then balance it. but at the same time do not expect to tank a burst of a mesmer who by itself sacrifices it’s own surviviability to deal high damage. it’s not that a mesmer can just tank and deal massive damage.

It’s just like an ranger. Also even if a mesmer has one of the leading posistions in 1v1. Remember that pvp is a team game. And those clones will likely not survive any skirmishes. Or it get’s focused down.

All those mantra’s need to often be prepared before battle. even if they heal per cast. in such fast paced battle. that very opening, the very skills that make a mesmer powerfull, intterupts need to be charged up. u can use that moment to strike.

Mesmer will go down as easily as they can down u.

Well I guess yeah right. Why not?

This is a free society. Same goes for the gaming company. If you don’t agree with something, U either discuss it’s contents first, U tolerare it, or accept it. Mankind hasn’t thrived so well by just putting things back in the closet(yes punt intended) because you don’t like it. that’s chilidish. They are enough traditional families in the game and enough. Man why is it the people who are against gay marriage, or anything that values thier traditional religious, political values, or whatever so, defensive. this right here is absolutely nothing.

i don’t quite agree OP. they are classes that naturally apply way less conditions, and are mostly dependent on burns and bleeding stacks. the thing is if you apply burning again as an duration stacking boon. Burning as whole will get weaker. Making it player based assumes that all players have some kind of condi build that applies burning, then u must also hope that said players had some decent condition damage. I’m all for teamwork, but forcing certain builds to be heavily player dependent is not something i can stand behind at.

Second of all You still have quite a lot of counters to burns, you have resistance, various stances such as endure pain etc, shout heals. Or you can just straight up get focused and cleaved to death. While condition builds are strong on in thier own right. DPS is easily it’s equal overall. most condition based builds can get cc’ed to death. necromancer have a large channeling time, engineers or thiefs are squishy as hell.

Also this is teambased effort so, and considering guardians and ele will rise a lot more in matches. thanx to the burn buff more water and light fields will be dropped to counter the burn conditions.

I tend to agree somewhat with Velimere. I also think that a possible problem with the whole condition raw dps clutter lies in the fact that the meta before was predominanty;y focused on either zerk/dps or condi based damage. So naturally considering people still need to figure out a new meta. It’’s going to happen. I think this is done intentionally to push people away from the zerker meta. to make more amulets viable, and not only zerker, rampager, assasin, and have something else other then sigils of fire, air, geomancy, intelligence,strength, or runes of hoelbrak, fire etc.

Now that dps and conditions got a buff the risk for running conventionall longbow dps rangers, or traditionall medi guard, is simply too high. U have to balance it more. I run a celestial guardian now and an valkyrie amulet guardian pre patch with right hand strength and i suffer little to none from the raw dps or condi increase.

Harper.4173:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

People, actually don’t like the kasmeer and marjory stuff? i honestly don’t care. seems was pretty kitten funny. I must say the relationship between the salad and the beetroot. is way, and way, and way better. like a 10 times better.

Anyways I also notice that a couple of people are feeling victimised, as if they feel it’s shove down thier throat. So far you have 2 lesbian couples and 1 Transgender NPC. In the entire game. U only deal with the lesbians in some Living world story and some dungeons.

As for the NPC. U don’t even need to talk to her. Why do you hear that the more controversial ideals are shoved down your face, but values such as captialism(trading post and alike), Perfectionism(Asura with thier I’m smarter then you stuff), Heck you can even twist the whole benn tenstrikes thing into A net forcing men to be heterosexual as at the end of the game, Heck then don’t forget your trusty sidekick, Lord Faren, this guy is as thirsty for women meat as you can get. just after you beat zhaitan, you hear his parents contemplating about him finding a suitable female mate.

Nothing is bieng forced down your throat. It’s nothing different then people expressing thier opinion. If they kept even more to themselves it’d be essentially arguing for people you don’t agree with to shut the kitten up until they are asked to do so considering thier very low presence in the game at this point in time. It’s just a game. You can ignore the transgender mesmer, u can ignore jory and kasmeer for the most of the game. And same for the salad and beetroot.

The problem with Jory and Kasmeer is the following :

1. It is extremely cheesy – some of the lines are so bad it made me want to quit the story then and there.

2.It is shoved down our throats – I don’t care and I’m pretty sure most players don’t care about their romance. I don’t care they’re lesbians. I care about killing dragons – this is what I came to this game for. I came here for a decent story – not for cheesy love story things.

3.People think we have a problem with them because they’re lesbians. This for me is not true ( and I’m willing to bet that the situation is similar for most players). I have a problem with them because their cheesy romance story is all up in my face in MY personal story that’s supposed to be about fighting dragons.

I couldn’t care less if they were male and female or both male. Stop pushing silly and cheesy romance stories in the middle of the living story.

I don’t want their “opinion” and I don’t care about their choices. If I had a choice I’d not even take them in the instances with me. I just want the story to focus on the fight against Mordremoth and spare me the useless “I love you Jory, I love you Kas” deadweight.

U can argue the same for lord faren and his constant hunt for female flesh, or Logan’s constant jabbering for the queen, or heterosexual sexually tinted jokes made throughout the game,: Tybalt talking about the ’’apples’’ he got from turning into the daughter of minister cadacus beetlestone. Or the the constant women in divinities gawking over logan thackery. Come on man. I haven’t heard you saying that that this is shoved down your throat.

You are overreacting to say the least. thier lovey dovey stuff makes such an small part of the game i honestly cannot fathom how you feel that is shoved down your throat. I mean. compare to the general slight hetero sexually snipbits, jokes here and there. this lesbian relationship is absolutely nothing.

I mean just compare thier dialogue to the living world story, compare it to doing puzzles, fighting dragon champions, traversing maps, time travelling, skirmishes in camp resolve againsts several mordem, mazes, infiltrations. Then add in the fact that kasmeer and marjory were even temporarily seperated cause majory’s sister died. And u still feel it’s shoved in your face?

come on man. this is nothing. go to divinities reach or queensdale right now, And I bet you, you will hear noblewomen cry out Logan thakeray’s name. It’s just one couple going all lovey dovey in mainly the living world vs lord faren, women gawking over logan thackerey, lord faren, logan fawning over queen jennah this, queen jennah, that even the story itself makes a parody over his obession. No infact u the main character even knows of this man. and the collection of heterosexual innuendo jokes made here and there. over the world that is tyria.

One cheesy lesbian duo in living world should not be considered shoving that stuff down your throat.

nothing changed for me lel. but then again i Always have a bit of sustain on my builds most of the time.

i think you are jumping the gun here OP. Let’s give it a few more days. it’s way too soon. at this point in time it’d be a little bit to easy to come with a general opionion on matter such as these. u will get people claiming that either nothing has changed. or even outright forgone the zerker meta and go all the way on the condi bandwagon cause of the burn and bleed damage. At this point in time personal story accounts will prolly be more prevalent.

For example I have a celestial guardian: With scepter/focus and sword/torch, right hand strength, and pure of voice. it’s an all arounder which deals decent damage in nearly every area. I can also take quite a hit. But I have fought zerker thiefs, zerker warrios, elementalists and honestly my defences weren’t blown away as u feared.

Infact till now I’ve seen a very balanced team make up, conditions, rap dps, all arounders’, cc, terrormancers u name it. I’ve seen it all. Zerker rangers still get as easily mowed down by going out of LOS, Or Retaliate, reflect the damage , or mowe it down with conditions as before, cc warriors, no problem blinding them, thiefs, again heavy cc or condi pressure. it still works as before. infact. I’ve seen little to no change in the meta. still the same heartseaker thiefs here and there or the same shatter mesmer. The same Hambow or shoutbow warrior. and they all go down relatively with the same amount of ease from my point of view. And I’m not that good. I’m just rank 65, I got no champion title whatsoever and my win rate is around 50 percent.

U can possibly argue that with the lack of build diveristy thanx to traits line which in some incases take reduce your sustai even less that it might not even be viable anymore.

People, actually don’t like the kasmeer and marjory stuff? i honestly don’t care. seems was pretty kitten funny. I must say the relationship between the salad and the beetroot. is way, and way, and way better. like a 10 times better.

Anyways I also notice that a couple of people are feeling victimised, as if they feel it’s shove down thier throat. So far you have 2 lesbian couples and 1 Transgender NPC. In the entire game. U only deal with the lesbians in some Living world story and some dungeons.

As for the NPC. U don’t even need to talk to her. Why do you hear that the more controversial ideals are shoved down your face, but values such as captialism(trading post and alike), Perfectionism(Asura with thier I’m smarter then you stuff), Heck you can even twist the whole benn tenstrikes thing into A net forcing men to be heterosexual as at the end of the game, Heck then don’t forget your trusty sidekick, Lord Faren, this guy is as thirsty for women meat as you can get. just after you beat zhaitan, you hear his parents contemplating about him finding a suitable female mate.

Nothing is bieng forced down your throat. It’s nothing different then people expressing thier opinion. If they kept even more to themselves it’d be essentially arguing for people you don’t agree with to shut the kitten up until they are asked to do so considering thier very low presence in the game at this point in time. It’s just a game. You can ignore the transgender mesmer, u can ignore jory and kasmeer for the most of the game. And same for the salad and beetroot.

oh guess i overlooked that ok.

how do you know a net went for the tne transgender route? it could easily be a genderswap.

it’s a kitten move, the major loss lies in the all the skillpoints u have in excess, the skill points u waisted on characters under lv 80. not to mention the silver and gold

Yeah no, this is a bussiness. Thier feelings are second to me, second to MY GAME, AND MY MONEY. The same can be argued for the developers side as well to some extent, the wishes of the consumers will Always be compared to what is financially possible. And sure if they have some leeway they can give back to the community, but yeah how funny this sounds, this gaming industry is serious bussiness xD. Like seriously bieng all mushy, mushy and friendly with developers is bad idea to me. Even if they are also people. It’s still a pretty hard bussiness. lots of money goes into it. developers make hard desicisons from time to time. they knew what they were doing. Sometimes developers need to be made, very, very clear be it positive or negative, how we stand on certain issues. If we like it. we will tell our friends, promote it on social media, do let’s plays and all that crap. but if we hate we should be able to express our hate with the same gokitten kittening passion for kitten’s sake. It’s because they are people. People can be stubborn, and sometimes the nice way doesn’t Always work. Personally I don’t care enough to make a stand about this. but i sure as hell respect those who do. And will strongly disagree with those who oppose giving strong critism’s to developers when the hard times arrive.

Or you can just ignore thier, bashing and do as you please. If a zerg comes in and wipes everyone out, it’’s thier right to do so. If you want to interupt duels then go ahead. kill them. it’s not thier place only. you cap lands. that’s what you do. if they wanna duel. then it’s thier risk they are taking. u are not obliged to wait for thier duels to finish. it’s thier job to maintain that area so that they can duel.

yeah, i was seriously wondering that, why in the world do they constantly wear winterscarves? it’s funny considering those people move around so much ala dbz style, make backlfips, jump several feat in the air, use hand to hand combat here and there. u’d think they’d be hot enough.

Serious answer. it’s got something to do with actual irl ninja’s wearing ninja scarfs from time to time. And then you have several anime exagarating on those scarfs, making them even more humoungous and all. the most recent example bieng the water-dark pokemon, Greninja.

Any company would not always like it when customers who speak thier mind about a product in a negative way be it, justfied or not. A net is an bussiness they expect things like this to happen from time to time. Even if the core of said bussiness is made of up people like us, which every bussiness in reality is. they knew the risks and profits they would come accross. In my eyes feelings of cameradirieship for the customers(if they have any) and money are never to far apart in a bussiness. And ofcourse thier own love for thier jobs would also come into play but that still does not invalidate the driving force behind it all. Which in most cases is still money.. It does not make them worse or better persons by default. It’s just something you have to deal with. It’s a bussiness. And a bussiness is dependent on people actually consumating thier wares. So yeah having consumers that actually tell them what they like and don’t like is something essential for a bussiness work properly. amidst all those ’’whiners’’ you have a group of people that actually make valid points. sometimes you don’t need to write a well thought out essay. something some concerns of the consumers are simply an act of telling company what they prefer. They are rival companies ofcourse so, having nobody to keep you on your toes is not going to work out in the long run, even if you have to cut your way through a lot of childish rants.

i honestly do not see the problem with this. not at all. It’s not as if getting an ascended armour is something you can just get in like a days work. It’s a tiresome job, lots of pve and or wvw to get those things. often your wallet suffers from gaining that stuff as well. infact it was about kitten time they gave ascencende armour a bit of a boost. second of all i honestly do not see the point of making all those calculations when wvw as a whole is determined by a gazzillion factors. like i honestly do not even know where to start? The way builds are now, capable of countering other builds completely even, Asscended armour is in all reality nothing but a buffer that gives you a slight advantage. it doesn’t make you a living god. Also no entire zerg in wvw is going to wear all full ascended armour, that’s statistically impossible,. Then add in the skill levels, numbers, siege, map bonuses, location, strategy, and most importantly the ever changing meta. Have people considered how risky it is to actually go full ascended? Unless you make a timeless build that can last for a long time, that will be able to last for so many nerfs or buffs that will undoubtly come in the next few months to years. Ascended armoury is risky bussiness.

Ascended armour, legendary weapons. the game is tailored so that these kind of equipment are rare, they are weapons and armour that in a sense emphasize ‘’puts you above’’ others. You will have to litterally remove yourself from others, sacrifice so much only to wear a piece of equipment that is more shiny.

And why are people complaining about the new players? Don’t you guys get it? they are new players. They are practically meant to lose. Veterans are supposed to have an advantage over new players, they invested time, gold and sometimes even thier own earned money to get where they are. Do people really think it’s going to matter if vets don’t have any stat advantages over new players? No the vets will still rip them a new ’’kittenhole’’ 9 out of 10 times in a duel or small skirmish. But you know what guys? It’s not going to matter. because wvw is a community. the new player has friends or friendly comrades that will protect them or ress them. teach them the ropes. they will often be enrolled in a guild very quickly.

They are so many still significant factors at this point in time that a 10 percent difference in ascended armour over exoctics is still insignificant and will be nothing more then a buffer for builds most of the time. you also won’t see many full ascended players.

Not that big of a deal the only time gear will really start to matter is when certain builds are close enough that inherent class advantages are overcome and that certain traits and skills are tailored so that a class doesn’t have an inherent advantage over the other. wich based on my experience and opinion starts happening more often then not the moment you come accross silver ranked and upper tiered players. thier builds will still have a certain specialiation aka dps, or support or something else, but thier skill level and traits are tailored so that inherent class weaknesses such as cc or condi’s are kept to a minimum and then, only then you can say gear matters. But let’s say even if ascended gear is a 10 to 15 percent increase in overall base stats. It’s entirely justified.

Like you have people either farming like crazy or spending tons of gold to get those pieces. Let them enjoy that stuff rather then go: ‘’the whole only skill matters route’’ this game is not a figthing game, wvw is not solely a figting game, wvw infact heavily depends on certain factors independent of actuall skill level to make the day such as siege, wvw masteries, banners, fortification bonuses, communication programs such as ts3, map bonuses, fortifications, npc’s and much more.

So let them have ascended gear or some kind of foodbuff or any kind of attainable bonus that influence base stats. if you consider the time spent and how those little stat advantages stack up to wvw as a whole. it means nothing.

I fought this kitten dragon 3 kittening times today and none of my kittening attacks connected. I fought him as a staf guardian, when that didn’t work I tried figthing mace focus, and again none of my kitten attacks connected. What the hell is going on here? I never had this problem before. but this all started today when I wanted to go for achievements. if I want to kill the dragon all dps has to rely on my party members. I hope a- net fixes this messy hitbox. annoying as hell espically since this makes getting those achievements incredibly hard. I just made a fool out myself. thinking i’d solo it for another player only to find out my attacks are phazing through him

burst and cc thier butts immeadatly, I stack might and immeadatly pop the fiery greatsword or summon. I also have the glyph that has a 25 percent condition per hit. I just start bursting them down., no need for a prolonged fight, Infact I advise you not t do so. thier bleed ticks are very long and they will force you use your cond cleanses early in battle. Honestly those builds are the very few builds I actually use powerfull elites on such as supply crate etc.

i hated the meta builds too, if you don’t like the meta, fight it. at this moment I’ve been making very unorthodox builds, and most of them are successfull with figthing on pair with the meta. some of them have some similairities of the meta, most of them are heavily modified or not even meta’s at all.

StickerHappy.8052:

This thread is seriously making me question its credibilty posts like this are…

Toxsa.2701:

Go try one in tournament, you hot-join heroes. Just go try it and see how successful and easy you can be.

Also no Ele run zerker in PVP. Nice try bro, way to show how new you are.
Now I can safely reply you: L2P.

Is this seriously a PvP thread? I doubt it. haha.

What this guy is basically saying, something I have been saying as well. The reason some classes seem op compared to others is due to accesibility mainly. the more you associate yourself with higher circles(not pro’s) the less certain class deemed cringeworthy will seem easier and easier to beat.

Not too sound like a kitten, I honestly am not trying to sound like one. I’m no pro, Just rank 60 and 700 games with a i think a 351 L and 349 2 rate.

But the moment you start going to reach the higher levels of pvp: champions ie champion legionairre’s, champion paragons, legendary champions, rank 80 players and or premade teams. You will notice that no class whatsoever has an distinct advantage over one another. Every class and mow each other down easily at that level.

Infact I’m as bold to say that even in unranked play you will notice that the position the ranger held as OP players will already significantly change, to the point that they are beatable.

Infact me bieng above halfway through with reaching my champion paragon and champion legionairre titles start to notice the decrease in difficulty with classes I used to think where OP in practice matches. I absoultely hated mesmers and tought they were just ridiculous classes with little to no recover time and thier ability to disengage out of battle on while I’m still licking my wounds.

The thing is OP, the only inbalance classes have currently is accessability. Surely OP you will understand that it’s much easier to wield a class that specialises in dealing damage from afar then a class that primarily deals damage through melee combat? in this case because both players are new, but because the the ranger in this example has often more chances to deal damage on account a warrior for example having to traverse a certain distance first to deal damage. Also because both players are noobs. The warriors are even more disadvantaged. both players could not know how to dodge or how to counter the plethora of moves or abilities like the average joe , upper tier players and proffesionals. but that doesn’t matter, the ranger could even be such a noob that he doesn’t even have any condi cleanses or proper heals. in the end it’s a basic game of sword vs pistol,. And we all know that the pistol wins pretty much every frocking time.

I was one of those noobs that considered myself a a master of the guardian and engineer. All I did with engineer was run around throwing grenades and running around waiting for my elite skill. After I downed the enemy player I laughed, thinking I was hot kitten. And with guardian all I did was stack all of my traits in ridiculous healing power and made the traditional tanky shout guardian. Well cause those noobs couldn’t kill me after figting for 10 minutes, I tought I could tank everything. I was even so arrogant as to define the entire pvp scene in 4 kittening tiers: noob, mediocore, upper tier and proffesional. I was even more arrogant to consider myself an upper tier player. Well that all changed the moment I started getting into more proffesional circles. My guardian’s defences got poked through as it all that toughness 3000+ and HP 18 K was butter. I litterally couldn’t comprehend how in the world that was even possible. As for engineer when I saw that my turrets were destroyed or worse tanked trough, my grenades skillfully dodged, defended against or tanked through. My CD’s used. My jaw dropped.

long story short. And again no offence, you need more practice, and if you reached your limit, associate with the upper circles of the pvp scene and watch. you will see that each class is equally beatable.

and this is coming from a mediocore player

I have a question here. Excuse the potentially poor English, it isn’t exactly my strong point here. I’m a bit confused, I think I read that the first T.O.L EU match starts at the 6 ot 7th of june, but admittely I cannot remember that too well, I might as well have mixed that date up, So I’m asking you just to be sure, when will the first matches begin? And will al 64 EU teams attend those? Is there some kind of link to a page with all the match up dates or perhaps a match-up bracket? In which I can see the excat dates? I would appreciate it if this question can be answered as quickly as possible. thanx in advance.