Guild Wars 2

Liston.9708:

coglin.1867:

Liston.9708:

And some servers were trapped because they could not rise above their bracket or drop below their bracket during a tournament……

That is wrong. We had tournaments that literally used the exact winner moves up to the next tier and loser moved down a tier, every week of the tournament, precisely like the system your describing.

It was an utter disaster. Just as I detailed in my post above. We very literally have tested this system through the tournaments, and it was a complete failure.

My memory could be failing, but was there not a ceiling and a floor? Silver could never get to t2 (gold) or t6 (bronze).

Each season that I recall had servers that would have dropped through that floor if they could-sor and maguuma come to mind. Some may have risen through that ceiling as well- hod comes to mind.

I will end it that I think comparing to a season / tournament where the stacked can’t rise far enough and the imploded can’t fall far enough is not comparable.

We had tournaments that were straight up set so the winner moves up and the loser moved down, with no floor or ceiling at all. Some servers did drop through the floor.

How is comparing a tournament not comparable? It was an literal trial of what your asking for. And what do you think will happen if they do a trial of this again? Players will stack and play more WvW then normal, exactly like they do in a tournament, in order to hold their position. Because they know it will be a short trial, so they will pile onto the servers just like a tournament.

Liston.9708:

And some servers were trapped because they could not rise above their bracket or drop below their bracket during a tournament……

That is wrong. We had tournaments that literally used the exact winner moves up to the next tier and loser moved down a tier, every week of the tournament, precisely like the system your describing.

It was an utter disaster. Just as I detailed in my post above. We very literally have tested this system through the tournaments, and it was a complete failure.

Liston.9708:

What is in place now does not work. I fail to see how a 1 up 1 down trial for 2 months or so labeled as an “event” would do more harm than good. If it works well, it can be made permanent. If it works exactly like some of you think it will, then it goes away……….

How do you fail to see it? That is precisely what happened in the WvW tournaments. Every other week, the server that moved down, dominated with extreme prejudice, while the server that moved up got beat like a yolked oxen.

Adamantium.3682:

I feel like I’ve stepped into some sort of portal to another world. Since when are grenades not good!? Across all game modes the Grenade Kit is the most beneficial and appears in the most good, working, and popular builds.

Yeah, I do not understand the complaint. They did lose their fields and range, but I feel that was clearly done to balance it a little more with other kits, but they are by all means still a very good kit.

Adamantium.3682:

Yeah sure, Mortar is a bit redundant. Both weapons fill different roles but they apply a lot of the same conditions and they just feel similar. I get that, but in no universe does that mean grenades should “just go away”.

I agree. The other thing is, grenades are an option for one of three utility slots, while mortar is limited to the elite slot. As I see it, mortar allows a similar viable option to grenades if a player wants to use all three utility slots for something other then grenades.

It feels to me as if it offers a lot more diversity. Particularly with the elite. Ranged support with some damage with mortar. Supply crate is still very viable and handy. Moaing folks is a blast, and the two forms work well.

Adamantium.3682:

coglin.1867:

Adamantium.3682:

/shrug

If you haven’t been following, the people who post these have been spot on during these elite specs. It’s obviously new Engineer Elite Spec icons. No skin off my back if you choose not to believe it, we’ll all know in a few weeks.

You mean like when they declared they were positive thieves were getting rifles and eles were getting sword?

I don’t know why you feel the need to be combative and snarky about nearly everything you post. There’s a documented history of accurate data mined information on Reddit available for everyone to see, including Thief staff and Ele warhorn long before Anet ever said anything about them. Choose to believe it or not, I only provided a link to it.

Combative? Because I pointed out that facts that countered what you said? Why do you have to make accusatory remarks simply because someone disagrees with you.

There was quit the debate, particularly over thief, when it came to the subject of rifle.

I am a little unclear on your comment about believing it or not. No one debated the drone skins, so I am unclear why you are creating unnecessary conflict there. Do you not agree that it is reasonably possible that the drones are nor directly linked to the ES, and could very possibly be a rework of turrets to give them some mobility? they could very well be fulfilling popular demand for mobile turrets by turning them into the equivalent of that, and we could still be getting something other then AI as our new utility set.

Yeah, it has already been posted in the thread that was 5 bellow this one with a indicating name, at the time you made this thread, and on Dulfy.

Adamantium.3682:

/shrug

If you haven’t been following, the people who post these have been spot on during these elite specs. It’s obviously new Engineer Elite Spec icons. No skin off my back if you choose not to believe it, we’ll all know in a few weeks.

You mean like when they declared they were positive thieves were getting rifles and eles were getting sword?

Phineas Poe.3018:

coglin.1867:

Phineas Poe.3018:

From the very first core trait change preview they said that Hair Trigger, Rifled Barrels, and Forceful Explosives would be merged to baseline.

From Dulfy: “Rifled Barrels and Coated Bullets from Firearms have been made baseline” and “Forceful Explosives trait from Explosives has been made baseline.”

That’s from April 24 during the core trait overhaul preview. When our traits were a PowerPoint presentation with no in-game tool tips. Not sure what’s up with Coated Bullets, though. Either they reversed that decision or it’s still bugged.

Yet, that wasn’t added was it.

I asked you to support the claim that they didn’t add it because it was bugged, not offer support to the fact that they didn’t add it. Coated bullets was never added either yet you offer two options. Either it is bugged, which you have no evidence to suggest that as a reasoning for it, forceful explosives, or rifle barrels (which also should have changed elixir gun and pistol range).

It seems to me, you are basing your entire argument on unfounded presumption, which is not the wisest way to go about making an argument if you desire it to be taken seriously.

I seriously can’t be bothered to talk to you anymore.

You insist on arguing with me without actually offering any countering evidence. You just prod at everything everyone else has to say without actually contributing anything to the conversation. Questions people ask you are never answered, and you dodge any real substance to what people have to say by picking the low hanging fruit of every post.

You do this in literally every single thread on this subforum, and I just can’t be bothered to entertain it anymore.

Take care.

That is an odd outlook. I would think asking for facts instead of assumption, or for you to offer proof of your examples and claims, would strike you as a good argument point.

I do notice you have chosen to avoid answering many of the question , yet your rebuttal to those questions is to suggest others didn’t answer something asked, interesting tactic.

So are you going to provide proof to your claim that those listed trait aspects were not added because of a bugs or not?

Phineas Poe.3018:

What I was trying to establish is that while I agree Medical Dispersion Field is not exactly a useful trait, it should be judged when we have seen the entirety of Heart of Thorns content. And if it were to be replaced, I think it should be with something other than Elixir Infused Bombs.

It is reasonable to judge what we have with Medical dispersion Field, particularly given that there is no evidence to that it will change.

As they specifically stated they were changing traits, in preparation to have them updated to where they wanted them, before HoTs release, what evidence are you using to suggest we should assume there will be a trait change beyond the added trait line for the Elite Specialization?

Phineas Poe.3018:

From the very first core trait change preview they said that Hair Trigger, Rifled Barrels, and Forceful Explosives would be merged to baseline.

From Dulfy: “Rifled Barrels and Coated Bullets from Firearms have been made baseline” and “Forceful Explosives trait from Explosives has been made baseline.”

That’s from April 24 during the core trait overhaul preview. When our traits were a PowerPoint presentation with no in-game tool tips. Not sure what’s up with Coated Bullets, though. Either they reversed that decision or it’s still bugged.

Yet, that wasn’t added was it.

I asked you to support the claim that they didn’t add it because it was bugged, not offer support to the fact that they didn’t add it. Coated bullets was never added either yet you offer two options. Either it is bugged, which you have no evidence to suggest that as a reasoning for it, forceful explosives, or rifle barrels (which also should have changed elixir gun and pistol range).

It seems to me, you are basing your entire argument on unfounded presumption, which is not the wisest way to go about making an argument if you desire it to be taken seriously.

Yeah, but I would play with common sense and cleanse it after one or two seconds. it is just common sense. I may even convert it into aegis with Elixir C, that converts all conditions into boons. Assuming I didn’t dodge or block it in the first place.

Angel.6085:

It wasn’t really a hush hush leak, sorry assumed most of you heard about it.

Heres the dulfy for it. http://dulfy.net/2015/08/27/gw2-getting-raids-with-core-game-being-free/

Hadn’t occurred to me to look on dulfy. But yeah, I hadn’t heard anything about it yet. Thanks for the link.

Well it specifically states the limitations.

No access to WvW. I do not see any issues here. It all seems very limiting and able to prevent most, if not all issues. Just enough to give folks who are interested, a taste of the professions and their game play, to see if they like the game. I do not see much of a problem.

It is possible it is simply an intended design to retrofit turrets into a mobile design in the form of mobile drone that function the same or similar to what we have now, only mobile. I see no reason to assume we would get a second set of AI utility skills. There is no evidence that this will be anything related to the Elite Specialization.

zinkz.7045:

coglin.1867:

zinkz.7045:

Or for the actual reality, which is increasing your condi duration of all condies by a massive 40% is broken as kitten, hence is mandatory.

I feel you either mandatory doesn’t actually mean what you think it means, or are over exaggerating with ridiculous hyperbole.

I see you are off with your typical empty rhetoric.

I am confused. How is my explaining what a word actually means, rhetoric?

zinkz.7045:

coglin.1867:

If it is broken, then please post your damage calculations. Mine show that condition builds do not particularly do more damage then direct damage builds. Less in many cases.

If your going to suggest it is so over powered, can you post the damage break down please?

That you think PvP works simply on the basis of damage calculations is hilarious, but is no surprise, if you want meaningless damage calculations do them yourself, though quite how you would do them is a mystery.

Can you highlight a post where I made such a statement?

You appear confused. You stated builds using a specific damage type (condition damage) has over powered damage outputs.

If two builds have equivalent defensive capability, unless you can offer proof that one of the builds has an advantage in the aspect of damage output over the other one, your simply blowing smoke and kicking opinions around. I find it odd that you find that “hilarious”

I am curious about how damage out put is meaningless in this game. Can you explain that to me? Because your agenda here, appears to be to claim one damage out put as doing more damage then the other. Your very confusing in the contradiction of your statements.

zinkz.7045:

Or for the actual reality, which is increasing your condi duration of all condies by a massive 40% is broken as kitten, hence is mandatory.

I feel you either mandatory doesn’t actually mean what you think it means, or are over exaggerating with ridiculous hyperbole.

If it is broken, then please post your damage calculations. Mine show that condition builds do not particularly do more damage then direct damage builds. Less in many cases.

If your going to suggest it is so over powered, can you post the damage break down please?

zinkz.7045:

Zanther started introducing metabattle as “evidence”, it is just rather amusing that the WvW signet version uses the said food and describes it as “Absolutely mandatory”.

So?

Someone else using some other single individuals skewed opinion as “proof” all of the sudden makes it “proof”? If he jumps off a bridge, do you follow?

style.6173:

coglin.1867:

Main problem I see with this discussion, is that you continuously see poster after poster, claim to tell everyone what is going on with a server they have never been on. It is like primary school here. Everyone claims to “have heard” or “knows someone” but isn’t on a server, yet presumes to post what goes on their and how things work.

A lot of people have more than 1 account these days. Don’t forget that.

Oh I understand that, but there are some that are both making ridiculously inaccurate statements, as well as qualifying them with comments such as “I heard”, and so one in more post than not, on this thread. Some others are so off base, that it is self evident. Some are certainly on the server the speak of. Most here appear not to be though.

zinkz.7045:

Zanther Deathbringer.4762:

Except if condition foods and runes were a problem, their build would be listed up there along with the ones I linked.

They arent.

Well I’m not sure how the backline wells thing is relevant I assume we are talking roaming/small scale not zergs, but perhaps you should look at cele signet build because guess what food it uses – koi cake and master tuning crystal, and guess what it describes the koi cake as “Absolutely mandatory.”.

A single individual posted a build somewhere, and a single individual “claimed” it was mandatory. I do not see how some random person who posted a build, serves as evidence for anything.

Jayne.9251:

Naw Gromit has a point. If you engage in a fight and decide, oh crud, I’m losing, time to press B and exit map — well it’s kind of silly. And lame.

I think most would agree. IF that was his point that they were leaving WvW. Unfortunately that is not what he said. What he said was:

GROMIT.7829:

So this is happening more and more often these days almost 1 in 4 fights results in the enemy logging out at low hp or in downed state. I’m sorry but this is unsportsman like and quite frankly pathetic behavior.

Notice how “logging out” was specified. That was where the discussion became problematic.

zinkz.7045:

coglin.1867:

What are you talking about WvW balance for? It was stated before, during, and after release that professions, builds, and damage types were never intended to be balanced.

No it wasn’t, it was stated WvW was not meant to be balanced in relation to population, not class balance.

Got a link to support that specification you are claiming?

Can we get a link to this leaked story?

zinkz.7045:

coglin.1867:

zinkz.7045:

Wrong, I don’t think it is supposed to be equal, it isn’t equal in PvP, I think that making the rock/paper/scissors far more extreme with food, stones, dire gear, etc, creates moronically bad and boring gameplay.

If you think it is or is supposed to be “rock/paper/scissors” then you are the one who is wrong.

10 pure condition builds attacking a group of 10 anything will do garbage for damage. Too much coordinated AoE cleansing and condition conversion.

That is not balance. Anet, please increase condition duration food to 100% please.

If you don’t understand this game is very rock/paper/scissors then that is your failing, go watch Helseth when he talks through one of his PvP games and you’ll see how he describes how which players should rotate where, to create good matchups, or how player X made a stupid decision to 1v1 class X on their class as their class is at a disadvanatge in that 1v1 – ‘rock, paper’scissors’.

As for your 10, like I said before game is balanced for 5v5 tPvP conquest mode, WvW balance is a joke in every aspect, if you try and condi a group of 10 guards/eles/warriors in zerg builds for example sure it is ineffective, because the game is not balanced for that amount of healing / condi cleanse in a large group, likewise in 1v1 other than against a tiny proportion of builds like certain ele builds, a condi build becomes much too effective because cleanses stay the same as PvP, whilst + condi duration can be increased by silly amounts and to a greater extent than it can be reduced and you have stats like dire that were thrown out of PvP because they are broken OP.

I was being sarcastic about the rock/paper/scissors, sorry you missed that.

I am glad you agree that with larger forces, conditions are neutered and underpowered.

What are you talking about WvW balance for? It was stated before, during, and after release that professions, builds, and damage types were never intended to be balanced. So what kind of logic would a person be using, to cry about a damage types balance in order to make a point? Particularly after you agree in larger forces that AoE condition cleanses and conversions makes condition damage under powered.

Main problem I see with this discussion, is that you continuously see poster after poster, claim to tell everyone what is going on with a server they have never been on. It is like primary school here. Everyone claims to “have heard” or “knows someone” but isn’t on a server, yet presumes to post what goes on their and how things work.

Jay.7546:

Win and go up, lose and go down. Sounds simple enough to me. I don’t feel like enrolling at University again to figure out the glicko. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out that YB is stuck in T2 even though they have the numbers and coverage to get a taste of T1. I know it’s not skill that will get them there but at least they can go back to their roots hugging towers and keeps and siege capping everythng they own.

Why is T1 so exclusive? Every tier has had blow outs at some point so why not T1? Is that by design? It definitely seems like there’s some sort of deal or rotation system up there but enough is enough. FA was so strong for months and they should have cracked T1 for at least one week. And now YB is a juggernaut and stuck. Is the T1 lock out really good for the game or fair to those on other servers?

Perhaps you should enroll in University. Higher education would be good for you.

That said, this will be horrible for everybody. I do not feel match ups are stale, I enjoy the consistent rivalry. I suspect others do too. What no one will enjoy, is having one server be extremely under or over powered in a match up every other week.

By the way, what server are you on?

zinkz.7045:

Wrong, I don’t think it is supposed to be equal, it isn’t equal in PvP, I think that making the rock/paper/scissors far more extreme with food, stones, dire gear, etc, creates moronically bad and boring gameplay.

If you think it is or is supposed to be “rock/paper/scissors” then you are the one who is wrong.

10 pure condition builds attacking a group of 10 anything will do garbage for damage. Too much coordinated AoE cleansing and condition conversion.

That is not balance. Anet, please increase condition duration food to 100% please.

Phineas Poe.3018:

Merging traits or making them baseline isn’t the same as outright removing/replacing a trait and later bringing it back.

I guess you decided to stop reading my post and jump straight to knee jerk reactions some time ago, but I specifically ask you about traits that were removed and just reintroduced by being brought back entirely or add to other traits since they were removed?

It occurred to traits in more then one profession.

Phineas Poe.3018:

I know how Forceful Explosives can feel like it had that kind of treatment, but it was supposed to be made baseline on June 23. It was bugged and unintentionally left at 180 radius despite the animations being 240.

I assume if your making that claim, you have a link to evidence? Mind linking it

Are you also suggesting the other traits they removed that they said would be baseline are simply not in because they are bugged as well?

Phineas Poe.3018:

Rifled Barrels, too, was bugged on June 23 and was meant to be made baseline as well and ended up being patch fixed in later. Something being broken and “disappearing” due to a bug is not the same as ArenaNet outright removing something intentionally and bringing it back later.

Interesting claim. Have a link to anything specifically proving it was a bug, and not based on player feedback? Link please.

Phineas Poe.3018:

I cannot think of a single trait they have outright removed from the game in its entirety—both in name and function—that has been brought back at a later point. If there is one, please list it. But ArenaNet historically doesn’t often go back on their decisions, especially when the trait has functionally been replaced.

Interesting. You boasted how you have one of every profession (as if that is some accomplishment in a 3 yr old game) and suddenly you cannot recall a trait this occurred too? hmm, apparently not as knowledgeable as you imply.

Phineas Poe.3018:

But when ArenaNet removed the trait, they made it pretty clear they either weren’t happy with what it did or it didn’t fit with their long-term vision of the Bomb Kit any longer.
.

There were multiple traits thay were removed, that have recently been made baseline or brought back, merged into other traits. Such as the Bomb radius increase. All of this happened through forums discussion. So we know from experience, that discussion and feedback can bring these changes. You do not have to agree, but trying to shout down and berate others for discussing it isn’t isn’t going to assist in your cause.

Phineas Poe.3018:

coglin.1867:

Phineas Poe.3018:

I just think it’s important that people who loved Elixir Infused Bombs be honest with themselves and acknowledge that the trait, however fun to use, was not a very good trait and got replaced by Bunker Down for a reason..

Ah, there is the issue. You are confusing your subjective opinion with that of actual objective fact.

You deem a trait as “not very good” there for everyone who liked it, is wrong by default?

Coglin, when you find a guild that actually has an engineer command their GvG team, you get back to me.

Until then, you’re not really responding to anything I’m saying and just deflecting.

What do we click in the UI to access this GvG game mode again?

Phineas Poe.3018:

I just think it’s important that people who loved Elixir Infused Bombs be honest with themselves and acknowledge that the trait, however fun to use, was not a very good trait and got replaced by Bunker Down for a reason..

Ah, there is the issue. You are confusing your subjective opinion with that of actual objective fact.

You deem a trait as “not very good” there for everyone who liked it, is wrong by default?

Thiefz.3695:

coglin.1867:

Thiefz.3695:

EIB which is passive (ie, I don’t need to attack to trigger it).

That is false. You have to do a physical button press, to deposit a bomb, in order for a heal to be applied. It is an additive effect. That is where the distinction is. Backpack regenerator is passive when in a kit, because no button press or action is needed to receive the healing benefits.

Opposite of aggressive play is passive play. You are talking about a passive trait/proc. I benefit from being aggressive to proc Bunker down or I benefit from sitting in one kit and getting healing regardless of being aggressive. Two different play styles.

Your trying to describe playstyles, which is irrelavent to what I quoted and addressed specifically. You quot literally, and specifically stated that a player “does not need to attack” . That is the inaccuracy of your statement that I was adressing. I was not attempting to debate the symantics of what varies players define as a aggressive or passive play style.

Adamantium.3682:

He’s only giving (accurate) numbers on what Elixir Infused Bombs actually did. Not what you felt like it did, not how much you liked what it did, but what it actually did. It was a mediocre trait. That doesn’t mean you’re a mediocre player or you aren’t good at what you do.

Deeming someone’s build as “a bad build” while incorrectly assuming what traits and gear they are running, while attempting to suggest to know what is or is not meta on a specific server, isn’t moving the conversation forward. Nor did I dispute the numbers of EIB.

Phineas Poe.3018:

coglin.1867:

Why? Because I am a am WvW commander who is on the front lines. I can heal in an AoE while doing damage, AoE blinding, crippling and I’m mobilizing the enemy. I found the AoE heal of 1350 to be significantly superior to a single medpack and minor damage of a single mine with a bugged trigger range.

The fact that you’re talking about the engineer in a space where they’ve never been meta, especially when it came to manning the front lines, I can’t help but wonder if you really understand just how mediocre your build was.

Elixir Infused Bombs healed for 145 base + 15% coefficient according to GW2Wiki. With enough healing power, perhaps in full Cleric, I can imagine the Bomb Kit healing for over 300 (x5) per blast. On paper that sounds awesome, but I think we have to acknowledge that in large-scale operations like WvW with 20-25 people fighting on each side, 300 health return is a drop in the bucket to what damage you face on the front lines—especially if you’re running baseline vitality that Cleric forces you into. It’s important to be mindful that Healway stopped being viable on guardian literally years ago, and that the only classes that really manage to survive on the frontline do so by stacking their vitality and toughness as much as possible and mitigating damage. Endure Pain. Wall of Reflection. Aegis. Protection. Not healing. They do have some healing, but that’s not their primary means of survival, because the second you overextend, that 300-800 health back per shout, heal, or dodge roll isn’t going to save you. It’s Endure Pain, Wall of Reflection, or aegis.

Engineers have middle-tier health and armor, so you’re already at a disadvantage, and running Cleric in WvW would be placing yourself at significant risk to be blown up, especially if you’re going to do so hinging your entire build around a trait that only scales by 15% of your healing power. Elixir Infused Bombs just gets totally outpaced against quality competition with any remote semblance of organized focus fire. You aren’t keeping anybody alive with your bombs.

coglin.1867:

That still doesn’t explain why you are against the concept of diversity in this matter.

I am not against diversity. I am just against changing things until we have the full picture of what to expect in the expansion with our elite specialization and what expansion content will look like. You are asking for one trait to replace another before we have all the facts, before we even have our elite specialization revealed.

For all we know, a Forge-traited engineer running Medical Dispersion Field may be the best support/bunker class in PvP when Heart of Thorns releases. It may be the very build that allows engineer to be a frontline factor in WvW, which is explicitly your desire.

coglin.1867:

Why would you take Medical Dispersion Field over Bunker down?

If area healing is of greater concern than personal healing, and if Inventions was a wise trait line decision for the given content, I would take Medical Dispersion Field over Bunker Down.

We already have one of the best healing skills in the game, which AoE heals for 6K every 15 seconds when picked up just in a Celestial amulet if you play your cards right with the Inventions traits. I don’t think you’re properly considering the potential for a trait like MDF, and that there may be future content down the road that taps into a lot of things we’re already very good at doing.

What you’re asking for, instead, is bringing back a mediocre trait that has never been meta in anything, especially in WvW, in a state of the game where damage has never been higher. Power creep is all over Heart of Thorns, and you want to bring back a trait that healed for less than a single tick of burning does currently as a Celestial engineer with 25 might.

How many hours do you have in WvW?

How many hours have you spent as a map Pin?

How many hours have you spent as a guild Pin with 40 to 60 guildies coordinated on the same map?

What build am I running that you are declaring as bad that you think I am running?

Based on your statements here, it doesn’t appear to me that you are very aware of what your speaking about when it comes to WvW. Your post displays a large amount of assumptions that are incorrect.

Thiefz.3695:

EIB which is passive (ie, I don’t need to attack to trigger it).

That is false. You have to do a physical button press, to deposit a bomb, in order for a heal to be applied. It is an additive effect. That is where the distinction is. Backpack regenerator is passive when in a kit, because no button press or action is needed to receive the healing benefits.

If you rely on crowd control conditions for your build to work, that is to ur problem. If I invest my traits to negate that, I am making the trade off of offense for defense. If I slot defensive runes to counter that, I am trading offense for defense. I cannot agree with this bad idea to make changes to the game to suit either a bad build, or the inability of you to land your skills.

Xyonon.3987:

Don’t prise something that has become worse … It looks too strange, it’s a mortar, why would you hold a mortar like a mini shotgun?! You definitly need both hands for the recoil … It just looks stupid – bad move anet – sry

No, it should be praised. I love the look. It says I am enough of a bad mamma jamma, that I don’t need two hands.

You know, if you dodge or block an attack, those conditions don’t get applied. If you require landing an attack as your only means of cleansing a condition, that is your fault for running limited condition removal. I see no reason to change how one aspect of damage works for players who do not dodge or who run bad builds.

Yeah it specifically states throwing or drinking an elixir. It doesn’t say elixirs in general. Obviously they worded it very specifically.

if you notice, there is a thread that has been on the front page of this subforum with the name of this trait as the title, and it was explained there and discussed as well.

Prisoner.2419:

Glue Bomb, Big ol’ Bomb, and Magnet Bomb (the Kit Refinement proc) are all missing the +60 radius from Forceful Explosives still.

They never offered that. In the original discussion, they stated all bombs would be 240 baseline. Thus people had a reason for discussing it when it was at 180.

Fuzzion.2504:

This rune needs a solid ICD

I disagree. They are limited by skill cool downs, the fact that you have to actually walk into a trap, and blatant predictability.

Jethro.8725:

You don’t get it. It’s ok. Read other forums about the deals with JQ and BG and keeping T1 locked up. Please.

Nah, he is right, you do not have the slightest idea what your talking about.

No, it is one handed for the charr now. Each race has a different animations I Believe.

That is not actually true in my opinion. The ranged fields are great for WvW. Particularly the ranged water field. I agree the damage nerf was uncalled for, but to claim the fields are only good to shoot at your own feet seems like an absurd statement to me.

Brat.4315:

Yes, this has happened many times from one guy on HoD. You kill him, you take his keeps and he whispers you with harassing words, accuses you of hacks and says ‘enjoy your ban’.

Most recent was a few days ago to which he got players from his server to report 1 person for hacking. And Anet’s response was ’ 25 reports of hacking in a short amount of time’ therefore this person (who it is their 1st offense) got a ban of 168 hours. He then sent in tickets to Anet and they will not lift his ban. So a few people sent in tickets to report the HoD player for harassment and false accusations and were told they no longer handle this type of complaint to use the ingame report system. The ingame report system as everyone knows has few options and no where to explain what has happened. I think anet needs to look into this guy’s chat logs but they won’t as they ’ no longer’ handle this type of ticket thru mail. Ridiculous.

Have any proof of this or evidence of any kind?

I was asking the poster I quoted specifically, but I appreciate your input. Personally I would take EIB trait back any day for group support over MDF.

Conncept.7638:

coglin.1867:

Conncept.7638:

coglin.1867:

Conncept.7638:

GrandHaven.1052:

You see the thread above this one? Same topic…
Condition engineer is dead unless you focus burning heavy ft build, which isn’t great either.

Bombs aren’t strictly a condition spec, they have one of the highest power scaling auto-attacks in the game and only two attacks that apply a damaging condition.

That said, they’re still terrible, power or condi the grenade and flamethrower kits do everything better.

You appear to be confusing your subjective opinion, with objective fact. Personally I do not feel the functionality of FY compares, and I feel that BK is superior to FT. Because of the size of the fire fields, the pulsing of the smoke field, and a few other aspects. I will take BK over FT when pinned up and leading a force in WvW.

In how many threads are you going to parrot that exact phrase that you clearly don’t know the meaning of? Get it from your word of the month calendar or something? By the way, don’t know if you are the one that did the reporting in our last conversation but I already contacted support and got the infraction reversed from our previous conversation and my posts restored.

And no, again, I’m not the one confusing anything at all. It is a fact that the bomb kit is not a condition only weapon, it has a massively power scaling spammable AoE with higher uptime and potential DPS output than either of its condition damage sources, and the ability to stack might.

It is also not an opinion that the FT can stack might better. The FT and BK fire fields have the exact same uptime, and the FTs blast finisher has 1/5th the uptime. It stacks might better, deny fact all you like, it won’t change it. Another fact, grenades proc crit and non-critical effects at three times the frequency and speed, and the flamethrower does so even faster. The smoke bomb is literally the only advantage the BK has in any situation where you aren’t dealing with a group of completely inert opponents.

You appear to misunderstand my meaning. I do not debate what kit can stack what might or any other statistic that is a fact. I was a dressing the declaration that they are terrible for a either power or condition.

I feel they are very good for either style of build for various utility and area coverage. I mentioned multiple reasons for my opinion. I never suggested there was anything wrong with GK or FT.

Well then what on earth are you going off about subjective/objective word of the month nonsense for? I stated they are not strictly condition, strictly, meaning restricted, as in they neither are nor are not strictly limited to power or condition builds.

Because you declaratively stated it was a terrible kit for either. As I explained in the post you just quoted. I feel that is subjective opinion, and not objectively a fact.

Sorry, as I thought I was fairly specific with that. I didn’t mean to confuse you .

Phineas Poe.3018:

coglin.1867:

Yeah, this is the skill that seems to be unanimously seen as the trait that should be changed to bring EIB back to replace.

Why would anyone ever take Elixir Infused Bombs over Bunker Down?

If they would replace it, they should offer something new, not bring back an old trait that has already been replaced with something better.

Why? Because I am a am WvW commander who is on the front lines. I can heal in an AoE while doing damage, AoE blinding, crippling and I’m mobilizing the enemy. I found the AoE heal of 1350 to be significantly superior to a single medpack and minor damage of a single mine with a bugged trigger range.

As well, to get the heal you have to be specifically moving forward. You cannot be staffing or backpeddling. Which are both common tactical movements often made. I those cases the medpack itself often becomes totally useless.

That still doesn’t explain why you are against the concept of diversity in this matter.

Why would you take Medical Dispersion Field over Bunker down?

I am not concerned with what your definition of passive is. I am concerned with the actual definition of passive. As well, I am not concerned with what a trait could be. I am concerned with what a trait is. Isn’t it reasonable to discuss things based on facts, actual meaning, and how things are, and not a level of what is and alternate meanings outside of the realm of actuality?

My point is, clearly there are a fair amount of players and posters that like EIB and felt that the trait had value. So my question would be, why are you so strongly against others getting what they want to benefit the kit for their uses?

Conncept.7638:

coglin.1867:

Conncept.7638:

GrandHaven.1052:

You see the thread above this one? Same topic…
Condition engineer is dead unless you focus burning heavy ft build, which isn’t great either.

Bombs aren’t strictly a condition spec, they have one of the highest power scaling auto-attacks in the game and only two attacks that apply a damaging condition.

That said, they’re still terrible, power or condi the grenade and flamethrower kits do everything better.

You appear to be confusing your subjective opinion, with objective fact. Personally I do not feel the functionality of FY compares, and I feel that BK is superior to FT. Because of the size of the fire fields, the pulsing of the smoke field, and a few other aspects. I will take BK over FT when pinned up and leading a force in WvW.

In how many threads are you going to parrot that exact phrase that you clearly don’t know the meaning of? Get it from your word of the month calendar or something? By the way, don’t know if you are the one that did the reporting in our last conversation but I already contacted support and got the infraction reversed from our previous conversation and my posts restored.

And no, again, I’m not the one confusing anything at all. It is a fact that the bomb kit is not a condition only weapon, it has a massively power scaling spammable AoE with higher uptime and potential DPS output than either of its condition damage sources, and the ability to stack might.

It is also not an opinion that the FT can stack might better. The FT and BK fire fields have the exact same uptime, and the FTs blast finisher has 1/5th the uptime. It stacks might better, deny fact all you like, it won’t change it. Another fact, grenades proc crit and non-critical effects at three times the frequency and speed, and the flamethrower does so even faster. The smoke bomb is literally the only advantage the BK has in any situation where you aren’t dealing with a group of completely inert opponents.

You appear to misunderstand my meaning. I do not debate what kit can stack what might or any other statistic that is a fact. I was a dressing the declaration that they are terrible for a either power or condition.

I feel they are very good for either style of build for various utility and area coverage. I mentioned multiple reasons for my opinion. I never suggested there was anything wrong with GK or FT.

lorddarkflare.9186:

coglin.1867:

Phineas Poe.3018:

You just listed most of the reasons why Elixir Infused Bombs was a bad trait.

It may not be the best trait for PvP, but it is a solid trait elsewhere in the game. I understand this discussion is in the context of PvP. But how often do you use Medical Dispersion Field in PvP? Unless you find that to be a valuable grandmaster trait, why are you so against EIB? I suggest exchanging MDF for EIB. I enjoy the bomb kit, so I just assume have EIB for when I am in bomb kit. I do not camp in the kit, but find thay trait valuable when I do use the kit.

Now you lost me when you suggest it is passive. Because that is not what passive means. You very literally need an action to get the benefit. It is simply additive the actions. Just like any trait that adds additional damage, conditions, cc, or any defensive function to a skill.

I disagree with this statement greatly, but as this is a PvP thread, perhaps the discussion should be had elsewhere.

That would be true if it were relavent to the rest of my post. Just because one poster does not personally feel it is optimal, does not justify suggesting it should not exist for other who like the trait. Particularly when it is suggested as a replacement for a trait that appears to be generally unpopular and unused.

Conncept.7638:

GrandHaven.1052:

You see the thread above this one? Same topic…
Condition engineer is dead unless you focus burning heavy ft build, which isn’t great either.

Bombs aren’t strictly a condition spec, they have one of the highest power scaling auto-attacks in the game and only two attacks that apply a damaging condition.

That said, they’re still terrible, power or condi the grenade and flamethrower kits do everything better.

You appear to be confusing your subjective opinion, with objective fact. Personally I do not feel the functionality of FY compares, and I feel that BK is superior to FT. Because of the size of the fire fields, the pulsing of the smoke field, and a few other aspects. I will take BK over FT when pinned up and leading a force in WvW.

kaco.9856:

No loot dropped when they do this and no kill. Always been like this.

This is a factually false statement.

Phineas Poe.3018:

You just listed most of the reasons why Elixir Infused Bombs was a bad trait.

It may not be the best trait for PvP, but it is a solid trait elsewhere in the game. I understand this discussion is in the context of PvP. But how often do you use Medical Dispersion Field in PvP? Unless you find that to be a valuable grandmaster trait, why are you so against EIB? I suggest exchanging MDF for EIB. I enjoy the bomb kit, so I just assume have EIB for when I am in bomb kit. I do not camp in the kit, but find thay trait valuable when I do use the kit.

Now you lost me when you suggest it is passive. Because that is not what passive means. You very literally need an action to get the benefit. It is simply additive the actions. Just like any trait that adds additional damage, conditions, cc, or any defensive function to a skill.