Guild Wars 2

sweet, time to start flipping legendaries.

In WvW i just walk to up doors with my bomb kit and tell everyone else to get back because I got this, what kind of noob bashes a door with a sword or shoots arrows at it when i can just blow it to pieces with a keg of explosives every second.

alcopaul.2156:

what’s wrong with people logging in forums and hating GW2?

on topic: “uk” is substituted with “kitten”

because we care about the game, even though we hate what it has become.

idk about the UK thing, forum censors all sorts of weird things.

Oxstar.7643:

nofo.8469:

Oxstar.7643:

Ricky Rouse.1583:

Oxstar.7643:

Wow this made me rofl
Engineesr are insanely useful and is anything but worthless in a fight, and I have a lot of rearend-kicking behind me in both PvE and PvP to prove it.
I’m sorry, but whoever called Engineer “Worthless” is a blockhead with no intelligence whatsoever. I don’t even know where to being.
Outstanding aoe healing.
Creates free retaliation combo fields.
Aoe slows and bleeds.
15-20 secs of immobilize.
Can aoe might a team.
Smoke screens and aoe confusion.
The list goes on. And anybody who says that dps is the most important factor in endgame is HOPELESSLY stuck in WoW mentality and should uninstall this game.
I don’t care if it takes 5 or 10 mins to down a boss so long as it dies.
And with no heals and just squishy players you will most likely die.

“Outstanding AoE healing”

that was pathetic and got nerfed.

“Creates free retaliation combo fields”

Elemenatlist has more blast finishers.

“AoE slows and bleeds”

like what? Box of Nails? That terrible ability that the Thief gets to use on dodge instead of wasting a second to cast?

“15-20 secs of immobilize”

With what? Net turret’s toolbelt, Net turret, net shot? and why should a class have to hold another class in place for 15-20 seconds just to be able to attack without getting kittensmacked?

“Can AoE might a team”

Elementalist would REALLY like a word with you about AoE Might. Shout warriors too.

“Smoke Screens and AoE confusion”

You mean the nerfed Smoke bomb? You mean Concussion bomb? You mean the skills that actually require you to go into MELEE RANGE (when the bomb kit only really works with a glass cannon build?)

You seem to be stuck on the assumption Engineers want DPS when in fact they just want to do something that another class can do 4x as good. I dont want to do everything but have to do it at 10% the efficiency. Thats just kittening stupid

All of what I said was true prior to the godawful Engineer nerfs. As for the elixir gun, there is STILL no other class that can permanently provide area retaliation on a spot.

Smoke bomb has it’s uses, for example you can combo it with tranqualizer dart to weaken the foe while reducing the hits he gets on you.

The immobilize consists of net shot>net attack>net turret>overcharged net>net turret>net shot and if need be end with an overcharged shot.

As for the box of nails it’s meant mainly as an escape tool and does the job well. I get out alive in PvE and PvP many time by putting them behind me and run.

But yes, engineer is not what it used to be at all. I wouldn’t call it worthless though.

It’s not worthless, but the point of this thread is whether or not refusing to take this class for progression content is warranted or not.

Idk.
Considering how much self might engineers can stack now… I do good dmg in PvE with my flamethrower.

Might or no might, flamethrower does pretty bad DPS.

Engineers have always been able to stack might fairly well.

hrm

ahahaha no.

Oxstar.7643:

Ricky Rouse.1583:

Oxstar.7643:

Wow this made me rofl
Engineesr are insanely useful and is anything but worthless in a fight, and I have a lot of rearend-kicking behind me in both PvE and PvP to prove it.
I’m sorry, but whoever called Engineer “Worthless” is a blockhead with no intelligence whatsoever. I don’t even know where to being.
Outstanding aoe healing.
Creates free retaliation combo fields.
Aoe slows and bleeds.
15-20 secs of immobilize.
Can aoe might a team.
Smoke screens and aoe confusion.
The list goes on. And anybody who says that dps is the most important factor in endgame is HOPELESSLY stuck in WoW mentality and should uninstall this game.
I don’t care if it takes 5 or 10 mins to down a boss so long as it dies.
And with no heals and just squishy players you will most likely die.

“Outstanding AoE healing”

that was pathetic and got nerfed.

“Creates free retaliation combo fields”

Elemenatlist has more blast finishers.

“AoE slows and bleeds”

like what? Box of Nails? That terrible ability that the Thief gets to use on dodge instead of wasting a second to cast?

“15-20 secs of immobilize”

With what? Net turret’s toolbelt, Net turret, net shot? and why should a class have to hold another class in place for 15-20 seconds just to be able to attack without getting kittensmacked?

“Can AoE might a team”

Elementalist would REALLY like a word with you about AoE Might. Shout warriors too.

“Smoke Screens and AoE confusion”

You mean the nerfed Smoke bomb? You mean Concussion bomb? You mean the skills that actually require you to go into MELEE RANGE (when the bomb kit only really works with a glass cannon build?)

You seem to be stuck on the assumption Engineers want DPS when in fact they just want to do something that another class can do 4x as good. I dont want to do everything but have to do it at 10% the efficiency. Thats just kittening stupid

All of what I said was true prior to the godawful Engineer nerfs. As for the elixir gun, there is STILL no other class that can permanently provide area retaliation on a spot.

Smoke bomb has it’s uses, for example you can combo it with tranqualizer dart to weaken the foe while reducing the hits he gets on you.

The immobilize consists of net shot>net attack>net turret>overcharged net>net turret>net shot and if need be end with an overcharged shot.

As for the box of nails it’s meant mainly as an escape tool and does the job well. I get out alive in PvE and PvP many time by putting them behind me and run.

But yes, engineer is not what it used to be at all. I wouldn’t call it worthless though.

It’s not worthless, but the point of this thread is whether or not refusing to take this class for progression content is warranted or not.

Levetty.1279:

I’d rather take 5 Engineers through fractals then any other group composition + Ranger.

Seems people are a bit upset that grenades were finally toned down.

Run high fractals with 5 engineers then get back to me on that.

But yes, no kitten engineers are angry our only source of remotely competitive dps got beaten to death with the nerf bat.

Casia.4281:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Caldric.1685:

In the mean time I love my 1000+ crit with autoattack Ranger.

Auto-attack rifle engineer has had 1200-1400+ crit at 50-70% crit rate since before launch. And unlike your ranger, due to piercing, a single rifle shot can hit multiple foes. It’s posts like these that make me wonder if the people in this thread ever even tried a non-grenade build.

Have you seen the “rifle is poor damage”posts prior to patch? I was just sitting there scratching my head.
Engi rifle auto attack is like the #2 highest dps ability after grenades in the game..

Would be cool if people auto attacked for the majority of their DPS.

Sadly they do not, and rifle only has one actual DPS skill aside from autoattack.

I highly doubt its the highest DPS either, highest damage maybe but I am 95% sure my thief’s autoattacks do far more DPS than my engineers.

JMadFour.9730:

so…basically, all the Engineer is/was good for is/was switching to the Grenade kit and pressing 1 over and over again?

is that what you are telling me?

Serious question, because I am leveling an Engineer right now. But I guess is 100% of the class is absolutely, 100% useless outside of a single solitary skill in one kit….then whats the point of leveling one, even without the 30% nerf to Grenade 1 damage.

guess I’ll go back to looking for another class to play. One-button spamming is no fun. I understand that some of you enjoyed the “spam 1 grenade repeatedly” gameplay before it was nerfed, but it just sounds ridiculously boring.

It’s not 100% useless outside of grenade kit, but basically if you want(ed) to do decent dps as an engineer grenade kit was mandatory, as was the grenadier trait.

Now this is a problem with the class, and I agree with nerfing grenade kit but to give engineers no other options and nerf their only viable option is all sorts of stupid development.

If you don’t like grenades the engineer class is still ok for things outside of progression content assuming you are fine with sub-par and being mostly there for CC and a few fields. Note engineer is still fine in SPvP due to knockbacks being so valuable for point defense.

Give it a year or two and maybe.

Conncept.7638:

Yeah, so? I’ve seen the same thing happen to Elementalists and Necros. We just don’t complain nearly as much as the Engineer community apparently…

I don’t recall any time where the primary source of damage for eles or necros were nerfed by 30%. It’s not like engineers did top tier damage pre-patch.

I’m glad you are happy with mediocrity though, good for you.

Horheristo.3607:

@ nofo.8469

I was under the impression that 0 sigils worked before, if the ones I mentioned did,
Then my bad, and indeed this nerf is even worse than what I’ve imagined.

Nah you are right about the sigils, the only sigils that engineers used pre patch were things like bloodlust etc. And that likely won’t change much as they still seem to offer some of the best returns, so it isn’t much of a buff.

The point I was trying to make is engineers have never had any trouble stacking vuln.

Horheristo.3607:

The sigil as matter of fact made engis even more useful in PARTIES, by adding a 3rd way of additional vulnerability.
Combined with +5% C.chance, engis can easily spam the condition and hit the 25 cap.

It does not justify the 30% nerf though, could’ve been 15 – 20%. 30% is a big reduction.

.. we could do this before?

To the person claiming they are pro at engi because they can solo and not die, good for you, that isn’t the point of the post at all, the point of the post is viability of engineer in endgame content; which has absolutely nothing to do with your post.

As for engineers being awesome in groups because they offer “outstanding” healing etc etc, having awesome knockbacks and because they stomped you in PvP.

Yeah, our healing is kinda balls, knockbacks yes, most of the tougher mobs are immune and trust me, being able to do solid damage is far more important than knocking trash mobs around like a pingpong ball. Engineer is a solid class in PvP because this is actually more important than DPS for the most part.

Fields and finishers? Other classes can do this better while doing good damage.

This class is fine in PvP, having a few support abilities doesn’t compensate for doing kitten dps because guess what this game is more about DPS than any “WoW mentality” since support means very little in this game, and even if support was godly for whatever reason this class does not have more of it than other classes, we have more control which has limited use in dungeons and does not even remotely offset having garbage dps.

PWNcakesAndROFLs.8263:

I just wish the Engineer community would stop thinking like a meat-head warriors about DpS and how “essential” it is to a team effort. ArenaNet never pigeon-holed Engis to grenade glass-cannon builds, they did it to themselves.

Personally, I used to run grenades for damage, but even then I acknowledged that I wouldn’t be a DpS machine and used them for the utility more than anything.

The Grenade kit is a step in the right direction, it forces Engis to not pigeon-hole themselves and explore more options, options that Engis excel in; which in my opinion is utility. Yes, they could’ve done it differently, as others suggest, such as buffing our other kits, but from a developer standpoint: which is easier to do in a short amount of time? Coding several changes, or changing one?

From my perspective, ArenaNet delivered. And not only that, but they went as far as to say that they will be implementing future changes to further buff Engis (Weapon stats to kits). Think about it this way: The nerf to grenades along with applying sigils to bundles was an intial step to spark the curiosity to explore more utilitarian builds. E.g. Weaker grenades, but 3 chances to proc a sigil… Sure you can add more damage, but hey what’s the point? Since they cannot do much damage, may as well use them for other purposes such as quickness, healing, etc… That is one possibility.

Now when the second step comes (weapon stats to kits), imagine how much more stronger Engis will become! And on top of that build diversification will also be more of a focus, since DpS is not a primary concern. I have full faith after this patch that ArenaNet will not fail to deliver, they are merely implementing the first step.

That is why I ask the Engineer community to not lose faith. Sure right now we’re gimped, but that is merely a shroud upon us to further tinker with our gadgets and hide us from the rest of the classes. When all is done we will be one of the most unique and diverse classes out there.

We are already the most unique and diverse class out there. We’re kinda like a swiss army knife with all the gadgets replaced with tinker toy variants, and the knives replaced with different types of spoons, which is plenty useful and fun but when you are trying to cut through new content it isn’t going to get you far.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3x9AoCnRTYk/TrhZDJzx2bI/AAAAAAAADwY/icifUPllNOw/s640/seuss.JPG

This is an engineer.

Rfreak.6591:

They NEVER ever listen to us, now THIS! I wouldn’t want to quit but if our bugs and problems don’t get addressed in matter of days (and I mean 3 not 20 Jon) we WILL quit, we literally don’t ever get an answer if a mod wants to try and close this topic please tell me where I’m mistaken, since day1 we only got a couple of posts (literally) from Jon and for the rest of the time we were left behind and forgotten only to be SOMEHOW nerfed once a while with totally unjust patches, not dealing with MASSIVE bugs that are our most important concerns.

It’s pretty clear none of Anet’s staff reads our posts, if so we want answers once a while, definite ones and not rushed from some kind of iphone or smtg.

So here’s my idea, let’s stop posting in this section and get wintersday section (which got literally LOTS of answers already) crowded.

Let’s try and merge the remaining topics into this1 maybe?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer/Give-me-a-reason-not-to-quit/first#post1000643

Not just the grenades’ topic, I mean ok this nerf was just bad but who cares? we have nothing to play with now!

Sure they listen to us.

Engineers complained about grenades being mandatory to do DPS.

Grenades got nerfed.

TY Anet <3

zonderbon.5871:

Shoyoko.7309:

amiable.4823:

Rfreak.6591:

I’d actually do this if I didn’t like engineers mechanics and style, but I’d feel guilty and somewhat dirty inside myself for getting rid of over 350 hrs of gameplay even thought now are basically useless no matter how you see it.

i look at it this way, maybe one day they will buff engineers, and when they do I will have a level 80 decked out in full exotics ready tot take advantage of it. But today I saw “LF2M FOTM lvl 18 no engineers” in lions arch… the writing is on the wall.

OMG It the end for us already. Thank you so much Arenanet!

Oh come on you drama queens, maybe they just had enough engineers already.

lmao.

I saw maybe 5 other 80 engineers in my entire time playing this class.

It isn’t exactly the most popular, I wonder why.

blurps.2340:

This guy is either hardcore trolling or hardcore delusional. For his sake I hope it’s the former.

Good troll imo, lots of hits.

DenverRalphy.4185:

Anybody that advertises “LFG except for <insert any class here>” isn’t worth grouping with.

The only time it may be a reasonable requirement is because the group is already stacked (read, at least 2) in that class. Otherwise, it’s just players who don’t understand the game very well, in which case you wouldn’t want to be in their group to begin with.

Every class in the game is more than suitable.

I don’t know, if I was trying to progress through a high level fractal why would I risk pugging a class that is sub-par?

The only people that don’t understand the game are the ones that think that having a few support fields and some heals make up for doing 1/4-1/2 the dps of other classes who guess what, likely offer fields and finishers of their own.

If this was CoF or something I wouldn’t care who I invited, but when ANet implemented progression content class balance becomes an important aspect of PvE.

2 of the people that I regularly progress fractals with have geared engineers, want to guess how often they brought them pre-patch?

edit: I understand why ANet nerfed grenades into the ground and I agree 100%, its a horrible kit thats necessary to do any kind of sustained damage as engineer, but to do so without giving the class any alternatives? ahahhaha.

Just roll a better designed class that is less reliant on gimicky things that ANet will polish in a few years.

grumbles.5412:

Engineers can do as much DPS as the rest of em.. it just requires triggering a few toolbelt skills.

ahahahah.

no.

Play an engineer then play a thief/warrior hell even play a mesmer.

Then get back to me on that.

alcedonia.7831:

Saying gw2 won because the competition was terrible is just being grumpy. It’s like saying an actor only won an oscar because movied were terrible that year. The bottom line is that he won an oscar. The bottom line is that gw2 won game of the year. That’s all that matters.

Yep, because there are 10 different companies handing out oscars.

Gamespot is dedicated to promoting gaming excellence.

Should be awarded best RPG of all time.

Up there with BG1-2 and probably beats planescape: torment. Much better story and character customisation, not to mention the combat is much more advanced.

Upgrading server capacity 4 months post release?

This game is so popular!

“YOLO”

more letters

Aim bots? o_O lol

DreamOfACure.4382:

nofo.8469:

Rifle damage including all skills + SD is worse than my mesmers sustained damage. And that’s pretty bad.

No, rifle DPS is not even remotely ok grenade is the only way to go for sustained damage with this class.

lol

You’re never suppose to only use weapon skills for damage on the engineer. The engineer is designed to use kits, turrets, gadgets, traits, etc., to compensate.

Your way of looking at things is the thing that’s bad.

Oh I know that, a few posts in this thread seem to be suggesting otherwise though.

The only rifle skill that does any good damage is the blunderbuss skill, the rest are utility.

But even if I want to DPS on my engineer, I’m better off dancing between bombs and grenades in melee range and ignoring the rifle altogether.

The turrets and gadgets don’t do good DPS either lol, and all classes are designed around traits o_O

Mercucial.6759:

nofo.8469:

Mercucial.6759:

Zid.4196:

offence.4726:

Zid.4196:

Game is improving.

Population still falling, will stabilize somewhat below EVE Online’s.

Nice troll attempt 0/10

Population is still growing , servers are packed most people are upset they cannot join their servers in NA during prime time due to them being full. Big game patch tomorrow everyone is very excited as usual.

Huh? Not a troll at all…

See, EVE hit 450k subscribers whereas SWTOR, WH, and AoC fell to 100k-200k after initial sales in the 1-2m range. I rate GW2 as good enough game to do better than those three, so it will be keeping at least 200k active players. On the other hand it’s very clear it wont be able to keep 500k, in fact the number of active players is already below 500k most likely despite the most recent influx of new players caused by GW2 getting Time game of the year and Xmas.

What I said is a very safe bet and a commendation.

You should let me know the winning lottery numbers, considering you can accurately judge the number of people who will be playing a game that is barely 4 months into it’s life cycle.

I would ignore these forums for the most part, it’s filled with trolls and doomsayers. I have no problem getting a group for dungeons, even without using gw2lfg.com. I’ve also been leveling an alt, around lvl 20 right now and I run into plenty of people in lower level zones.

Also everyone saying “the population has dropped since release”….no kitten. Show me one MMO where the population didn’t drop a couple months after release. The population in Vanilla WoW even dropped for a bit until they started rolling out new content.

Yeah that’s the thing.

GW2 population dropped even further once they started rolling out new content lol.

Based on the numbers you got from…………?

Oh right, nowhere.
Yes the game has issues, but you’re def getting your 60 bucks worth. Lets see, most 60 dollar games you get anywhere from 6-10 hours not counting MP, and lets face it, unless it’s Halo, Call of Duty, Starcraft or something along those lines the MP doesn’t last long anyway. I’ve played about 300 hours of GW2, and many people are close to hitting the 1000 hour mark, and are still having fun.

Never said I didn’t get my $60 worth, I definitely did.

I have put more hours into the likes of Starcraft, borderlands, CS, LoL, DAoC etc than I have GW2 so it’s not like its the only game on the market that’s worth the money to me. Although I do agree that most games don’t entertain for anything like that long. Saying that though, games like Amnesia or Planescape only entertained me for a few days, they are still the most memorable times I have spent playing games and would give them a monetary value higher than any of the games I have played for 100+ hours.

I was simply pointing out that every MMO gets its population back rather quickly once they establish their domain. And don’t be absurd, I want to see GW2 succeed as badly as everyone else but saying the population hasn’t dropped significantly since the lost shores patch is just being blind.

Mercucial.6759:

Zid.4196:

offence.4726:

Zid.4196:

Game is improving.

Population still falling, will stabilize somewhat below EVE Online’s.

Nice troll attempt 0/10

Population is still growing , servers are packed most people are upset they cannot join their servers in NA during prime time due to them being full. Big game patch tomorrow everyone is very excited as usual.

Huh? Not a troll at all…

See, EVE hit 450k subscribers whereas SWTOR, WH, and AoC fell to 100k-200k after initial sales in the 1-2m range. I rate GW2 as good enough game to do better than those three, so it will be keeping at least 200k active players. On the other hand it’s very clear it wont be able to keep 500k, in fact the number of active players is already below 500k most likely despite the most recent influx of new players caused by GW2 getting Time game of the year and Xmas.

What I said is a very safe bet and a commendation.

You should let me know the winning lottery numbers, considering you can accurately judge the number of people who will be playing a game that is barely 4 months into it’s life cycle.

I would ignore these forums for the most part, it’s filled with trolls and doomsayers. I have no problem getting a group for dungeons, even without using gw2lfg.com. I’ve also been leveling an alt, around lvl 20 right now and I run into plenty of people in lower level zones.

Also everyone saying “the population has dropped since release”….no kitten. Show me one MMO where the population didn’t drop a couple months after release. The population in Vanilla WoW even dropped for a bit until they started rolling out new content.

Yeah that’s the thing.

GW2 population dropped even further once they started rolling out new content lol.

Argotto.7835:

If you still have the game installed by chance, then log on and check for yourself.

However, couple of my cousins and myself play very rarely if at all anymore due to how few people there were anywhere in the world. Sure you can see people in lion’s arch, perhaps looking for the 1 dungeon anyone cares about anymore.. aside from that, I find it VERY surprising anyone here could possibly believe the population hasn’t drastically decreased in the past 2 months.

As I said, take a look for yourself, but compared to 4 weeks from launch, the game is practically dead.

This, check for yourself.

You will find most areas fairly quiet outside of LA and the WvW zones depending on your server.

Rifle damage including all skills + SD is worse than my mesmers sustained damage. And that’s pretty bad.

No, rifle DPS is not even remotely ok grenade is the only way to go for sustained damage with this class.

Vena.8436:

Sirge.8934:

To be fair, dungeons are aggravating. They take hours, somebody usually drops out, and I just get ticked at stupid enemies whose only tricks are an overly bloated hp pool and high attack damage.

What dungeons are you running? No dungeon takes “hours”, heck most dungeons don’t even take half an hour.

CoE in a pug lol.

The laser part alone can take 10 mins+ ahhahaha

Bearhugger.4326:

nofo.8469:

Exactly what was it competing with for MMO of the year? Secret World?

World of Warcraft: Mists of Pandaria (expansions usually count as new games)
TERA
The Secret World
Star Wars: The Old Republic (was released in 2011 but after most GotY awards so technically it’s considered a 2012 game as far as awards go)

I highly doubt this game would come up as MMO of the year if compared to WoW. It’s not a bad game but it has the same sort of content except less polish.

Only benefits I can see for this game is its more solo friendly and no monthly fee.

It’s not particularly bad, its designed for solo play and it is far from revolutionary.

The classes vary a lot in terms of depth of play, but even the more complex classes aren’t overly deep.

Death Reincarnated.3570:

There are many players who are confound to one dungeon (FotM) because of the new content – this was pointed out by ANet to be a “bad decision”.

However, it seems to me that many people are complaining about Ascended gear, YET, most do FotM to get it.

Why do something you hate? No one is forcing you to do it…

This is such an oxymoron.

Because nobody wants to be inferior.

Saying that though, everybody I knew of that played this game that disliked the new direction voted with our wallets. So we aren’t grinding away at fractals like good little hamsters.

Ursan.7846:

nofo.8469:

and player-driven endgame many have dreamed of since Dark Age of Camelot

…lmao.

Exactly what was it competing with for MMO of the year? Secret World?

I think that’s specifically referring to WvW. DAoC also had a similar feature.

I played DAoC for about 5 years.

And no, comparing WvW to RvR is insulting, the similarities end at sieges.

and player-driven endgame many have dreamed of since Dark Age of Camelot

…lmao.

Exactly what was it competing with for MMO of the year? Secret World?

Mimizu.7340:

the exchange rate is manipulated by “the company”.

they dont want you to use ingame currency to purchase gemshop items,

they want you to purchase gems.

they made this game to make money, not to go bankrupt.

Pretty much this. I remember after the halloweeen event the gem price started to drop dramatically, but when I actually went to try and purchase some with gold it changed to a value that was.. far from the listed value.

Value to items is arbitrary, depends entirely on the person, however I doubt the majority of the people would pay the current price for anything available at the store.

nerva.7940:

actually GW2 pop has been steadily growing. most servers are full.

You can’t be serious.

No, just no.

Yes the majority of the servers are full yet quite a few of them are empty outside of LA.

Tolmos.8395:

nofo.8469:

People acting like this game is all skill based and games with roles are for bad noobs is hilarious.

This game is designed the way it is not for combat complexity, but to discourage group play. Playing solo when your class is tank dps and healer is much easier.

I guess it is a unique system, because there aren’t any other MMO’s that I can think of that actively discourage group play.

Whereas having 10x more dps than tanks or healers, thus leaving thousands of players with long hours of wait time to do dungeons, if they can at all, somehow encourages group play?

If someone doesn’t want to play a class that benefits the group or is in over supply, its their fault they don’t get groups.

And yes, relying on your group members to fulfill other roles does encourage group play.

I have never seen a trinity game that doesn’t balance itself out reasonably well because in most social games (read: MMOs) people don’t enjoy not being useful or wanted.

People acting like this game is all skill based and games with roles are for bad noobs is hilarious.

This game is designed the way it is not for combat complexity, but to discourage group play. Playing solo when your class is tank dps and healer is much easier.

I guess it is a unique system, because there aren’t any other MMO’s that I can think of that actively discourage group play.

phlemhacker.1372:

nofo.8469:

phlemhacker.1372:

The first Guild Wars didn’t specialize in anything and it was fantastically successful. In fact I would say the way the original Guild Wars was rounded out was WHY it was so successful. People could jump into nearly any aspect they wanted to without getting run out for not knowing every nuance of the game (perhaps with the exception of HA in the last few years) and it is reasonable to assume Guild Wars 2 will do well for the same reason.

It specialized in PvP. How many other MMO’s on the market had good GvG PvP?

Well, EVE for one. Guild Wars one did everything pretty well. Except persistence of course.

Completely different kinds of PvP. One focuses on the social aspects, leadership organisation etc.

And the other focuses on tight knit coordination, also completely different settings and gameplay.

Would be akin to comparing DAoC to SB or UO. Yes they are both PvP games but completely different styles.

phlemhacker.1372:

The first Guild Wars didn’t specialize in anything and it was fantastically successful. In fact I would say the way the original Guild Wars was rounded out was WHY it was so successful. People could jump into nearly any aspect they wanted to without getting run out for not knowing every nuance of the game (perhaps with the exception of HA in the last few years) and it is reasonable to assume Guild Wars 2 will do well for the same reason.

It specialized in PvP. How many other MMO’s on the market had good GvG PvP?

IceBlizzard.1054:

nofo.8469:

Syktek.7912:

Riel.2160:

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

Who kittenen cares.

Anet / ncsosft money department should

and that means all of you fanboys too …
you know less money less content even less bug fixes?

No, no they shouldn’t. They already made money off him and if he doesn’t get a refund ,Which most people will not, they made their money off him.

This game will stay healthy for quite some time and probably has already met its marketing needs to the point where they have made money off of it. They will continue to do so regardless of players like this leaving as more will always join.

Just look at EVE Online. The great freak out of September 2011 (Oh the drama was delicious), nearly ten thousand players left or even more. CCP shrugged it off and guess what? Most of them came back and they have many new players now.

That is because EVE is the only modern PvP MMO on the market.

What does guild wars 2 specialize in exactly?

PvE? Eh, heaps of competition, general consensus is other MMO’s do it better.

WvW? Yeah I guess, but ArenaNet has expressed their feel that WvW is nothing more than a side activity and certainly nothing to design a game around.

SPvP? lol please.

Regardless how you feel about the OP’s post, this game is in trouble and yes the population is dropping, some servers are doing fine still don’t get me wrong, but make no mistake, ANet only has a limited time frame to actually excel at something with this game or it won’t go far at all.

In trouble according to who? You? You are injecting your opinion as fact.
Servers are still doing extremely well. Sure there are loads of people who dont log on much anymore but thats expected any mmos population drops dramatically after launch.

There are many people who love this game. Just because you didnt doesnt mean the game is in trouble. All these “doomsday” threads just make me laugh

Yes, I’m aware that plenty of people still like this game.

And yes, MMO player base drops after launch but then it comes back when the MMO dominates in a specific area, it could be PvE, PvP, RP w/e its irrelevant. EVE and WoW are prime examples of this, WoW had a large drop shortly after launch as well and look where it is now.

ArenaNet can stop this game from being dead in half a year, but will they? Time will tell.

Every MMO is dying from its inception unless it specialises in something, if you think this game’s population has dropped by normal amounts then you are delirious, developers don’t do large changes in design if everything is going as intended.

From what I have seen so far, ANet has no intention on specializing this MMO in anything and as such, the odds of it dominating any specific type of gameplay before the vast majority leave is quite low.

Syktek.7912:

Riel.2160:

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

Who kittenen cares.

Anet / ncsosft money department should

and that means all of you fanboys too …
you know less money less content even less bug fixes?

No, no they shouldn’t. They already made money off him and if he doesn’t get a refund ,Which most people will not, they made their money off him.

This game will stay healthy for quite some time and probably has already met its marketing needs to the point where they have made money off of it. They will continue to do so regardless of players like this leaving as more will always join.

Just look at EVE Online. The great freak out of September 2011 (Oh the drama was delicious), nearly ten thousand players left or even more. CCP shrugged it off and guess what? Most of them came back and they have many new players now.

That is because EVE is the only modern PvP MMO on the market.

What does guild wars 2 specialize in exactly?

PvE? Eh, heaps of competition, general consensus is other MMO’s do it better.

WvW? Yeah I guess, but ArenaNet has expressed their feel that WvW is nothing more than a side activity and certainly nothing to design a game around.

SPvP? lol please.

Regardless how you feel about the OP’s post, this game is in trouble and yes the population is dropping, some servers are doing fine still don’t get me wrong, but make no mistake, ANet only has a limited time frame to actually excel at something with this game or it won’t go far at all.

oflow.2157:

Console gaming has nothing to do with why people are mad about this game.

I’m a pretty heavy console gamer and I also play almost every MMO that comes out, I dont think either has anything to do with the other.

First of all, most people that are hardcore console gamers dont play PC games.

WoW wasnt popular because it appealed to console gamers, WoW was popular because they took all of the popular elements of the MMOs that came before it and dropped most of the stuff that people hated.

For example, before WoW most MMOs were serious grinds and it took a year plus to reach level cap. In MMOs before WoW most MMOs didnt have mob tagging and you had to compete with farmers and spawn campers to get items or kill mobs. Before WoW there wasnt BoE/BoP gear you could resell your gear which made crafting actually valuable. Before WoW most MMOs werent solo friendly, you had to group with people to succeed. Before WoW games had harsh death penalties, corpse looting. Heck you could de-level in FFXI from dying. WoW got rid of all those things.

WoW also killed MMO etiquette. Pre-WoW you had to obey server etiquette or get blackballed and not be able to advance your character. People used to get kitten off if you talked in the wrong channels. Blizzard basically made an easily accessible MMO for their already established B-Net base, which is BTW one of the most obnoxious communities ever. BNet was already like 4chan before WoW came out.

Blizzard’s negative contribution to MMOs IMHO is how they ruined MMO etiquette. Act like a jerk and ninja? Who cares! You can even get banned make a new account and be back to level cap in a couple months at most and that was in vanilla WoW when they still had harder leveling.

I’d wager that most of the people that play this game arent even old enough to really have played MUDs or EQ1 so I dont really see that as the issue either.

What people are mad about with this game is the game was sold as not having vertical progression/gear treadmill. Most people that have played WoW are tired of running on that treadmill after doing it for 8 years. Its not that they expect an end to it they are tired of running on it and came to this game based on the concept that this game would end that, the trinity and bring back DAoC style world pvp.

Then later they (ANet) went back on their word. And most arent really mad about that but they would like to actually see some of the bugs and balance issues fixed before they start pushing people back onto the treadmill.

I dont really see a huge difference personally between this game and WoW. Frankly speaking WoW has better dungeons and raids than this game.

And the real problem is people were able to ‘beat’ this game too quickly (even ANet admitted that they didnt expect peopel to have full exotics that quickly) which forced them to bring out fractrals faster than they thought they would have to.

Now top this all off with the one time event that screwed over a bunch of people and you see why people are mad.

If they really want to fix the game they should do some serious bug fixing/rebalancing and get the pvp ladder system up and running. Professions like necro & ranger are kinda suffering. Thats a good start. Open up some of the other zones and get people out of L.A. Give people other options to get fractals and fix the ridiculous RNG in the game.

This guy gets it.

Saying this game is like any of the oldschool MMO’s is pretty stupid, yes the older MMO’s had a lot of annoying features but they also capitalized on what the genre does best – encourage social play.

This game is less social than most non MMO games that I play and that is pitiful to be honest. People enjoy socialising, even the most jaded bitter nerd likes to be social.

On the DAoC style PvP though, it isn’t going to happen until they put rewards and leaderboards that scale better in small group PvP rather than ZvZ or PvD action, because that’s what’s rewarded at the moment and it shows.

ArenaNet has shown the direction they want to take this game with the november patch, I would be surprised if they viewed WvW as anything other than a distraction or a side activity.

This game is not built around its major selling point, it is not grind free nor is it a PvP game, that is why people are kitten

Lucky Charmz.5089:

So does the rifle really outshine the dual pistols/pistol+shield combos by that much?

Nah. In fact I would say p/p outshines rifle. They both kinda suck at doing damage though.

@OP

Grenades + grenadier are the engineers only good source of sustained DPS.

Bombs are ok, but are best used while dancing between grenades.

Caedmon.6798:

You guys are turning this thread into mindless gibberish . The OP is merely asking if the game is dying or not,In any case..No the game is not dying at all and like someone else says if you want to enjoy the game,Stay the hell away form the forums since alot of people are extremely negative about certain subjects while still..continue to play anyways. Just play the game !

Every game is dying, the question is what rate is it dying at?

Highly debatable with Guildwars 2, hence all the threads.

FaRectification.5678:

nofo.8469:

FaRectification.5678:

nofo.8469:

FaRectification.5678:

Comparing this game to Diablo 3, is like comparing Jesus to Satan, now please be quiet and be more objective. Man, I think I’m done reading these forums.

They both want to come and obliterate the human race?

Listen, the only reason why communities prefer certain games, is because they’re all kittens and they have no sense or reasoning or rational thoughts.

Check this out, they stick to each other and will stand by a game regardless of whether’s it’s bad or not simply because they’re kittens.

GW2 is a much better game than LoL, give it some time. It will build a massive community.

Know why? Because unlike other places, this community is actually a friendly one.

Lol, now I know why people keep posting the word kitten.

The only reason people prefer certain games is because people have different preferences as to what they enjoy.

In what way do you feel as though GW2 is a better game than LoL? One is a competitive PvP game the other is a themepark PvE treadmill.

I will admit the community here is rather friendly.

Why do you feel as though GW2 will build a massive community? ArenaNet hasn’t exactly shown interest in improving the unique aspects of this game or even polishing their current content.

They also hadn’t shown any signs of just how good this game turned out to be while they were giving feedback during development stages back then. I was surprised how talented they turned out to be as well.

Don’t ever judge a book by its cover.

I’m glad you enjoy this game bro, and the game isn’t bad at all.

But in order to have a massive community the game is going to have to exceed spectacularly in something, and as it stands this game is a jack of all trades that does nothing particularly well.

FaRectification.5678:

nofo.8469:

FaRectification.5678:

Comparing this game to Diablo 3, is like comparing Jesus to Satan, now please be quiet and be more objective. Man, I think I’m done reading these forums.

They both want to come and obliterate the human race?

Listen, the only reason why communities prefer certain games, is because they’re all kittens and they have no sense or reasoning or rational thoughts.

Check this out, they stick to each other and will stand by a game regardless of whether’s it’s bad or not simply because they’re kittens.

GW2 is a much better game than LoL, give it some time. It will build a massive community.

Know why? Because unlike other places, this community is actually a friendly one.

Lol, now I know why people keep posting the word kitten.

The only reason people prefer certain games is because people have different preferences as to what they enjoy.

In what way do you feel as though GW2 is a better game than LoL? One is a competitive PvP game the other is a themepark PvE treadmill.

I will admit the community here is rather friendly.

Why do you feel as though GW2 will build a massive community? ArenaNet hasn’t exactly shown interest in improving the unique aspects of this game or even polishing their current content.

FaRectification.5678:

Metalripper.5406:

Rift is a much different game than GW2, It’s not really a good comparison.

Has GW2 lost a chunk of players? Yes, but it’s expected as the game comes out of it’s launch. So much for GW2 being “different”.

GW2 will be okay though, there will be enough casuals and lite gamers to sustain and fill the servers, as well as the super diehard Anet fanboys, but apart from those groups, I really don’t see anyone else calling GW2 “home”.

The problem of the low level zones being completely empty presents it’s own challenges, and I’m sure ANet will figure out how to deal with it.

Just ignore these types of posters, they just exist to stir up trouble. Why don’t you give some basis to back up your claims?

I am a casual, and I’ve never really gotten into anything like this before, but this is really fun so I’d appreciate it if you’d start looking at things in the world more objectively.

Pretty sure you fit into one of the groups he just listed.

Just sayin’