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Thief Backstab [ Picture ]

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Hahaha. So if someone can do massive damage in 1 attack then it’s broken right? So warriors are broken with killshot. It has massive damage AND works at HUGE range! nerf warrior kthx http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Kill_Shot

Tooltip ignores weapon damage. Actual damage for level 3 adrenaline is about 1276.

GIANT.

The warrior will kneel and must stay still during the activation of the skill, making the attack rather predictable.

Oh woah, that’s the same as them being COMPLETELY INVISIBLE.

A thief fighting you 1v1 or 1v5 or w/e is 100x easier to see and counter than a warrior doing killshot from the middle of a zerg.

I can actually confirm that, when I first started doing WvW, I was on my necromancer, and we were attacking bay. When we were heading towards the NPC champ room I lost 80%-90% of my health all of a sudden. No enemy was around me, I was confused, and was forced to go into Death Shroud. Then I saw the warriors at the back.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Rubber Daggers?

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

8k Effective power is quite impressive, but if someone farts, you are dead. I recommend you increase the health to at least 15k and your toughness no less than 1250. Then go full damage with the rest. However, if you want full damage, then by all means go with the spec mentioned above.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

thief dmg.. realy..

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

lol so after people gave up on stealth, now they are whining on damage?

8k for a backstab on a heavy armor isn’t a lot for a full berzerker thief. I do 5k damage and I’m not even close to full berzerker.

Youtube whatever class you want showing some berzerker play in WvW, and check their damage…

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

why all the thief hate?

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

@Sorrow, so I can see you enjoy a build that relies more on dodge and disengaging than stealth, and honestly that’s the way to go with S/D builds. Thus, I was right concerning both sets, you either use S/D or D/D at a time. Using both at the same time will greatly limit your capability. It feels like it will hinder you. At least that’s my personal opinion.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Thief Backstab [ Picture ]

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

let me start off by saying to all those people who are linking that youtube video of that backstab. My main is a thief and i watched that video over and over a couple of times, do you realize how MUCH survivability that guy has sacrificed in order to basically be a one trick pony?? ALL THAT GUY CAN DO IS A NICE BACKSTAB. he can probably take about 4 hits in pvp then hes dead, he has absolutely no escape tools…no CC breaks, can remove ONE condition every 30+ seconds oh and sorry he can blind a SINGLE enemy every 30+ seconds…yea real OP guys

Do you realize that IF he purpously halved his dmg with backstab it would STILL be too much? Most classes unless high tier base hp cant take it even at half! If i run full vit gear and trait im at around 22k hp and it still wont help! Dont tell me get toughness cause it wont help much. Iv ran 3900 armor against thieves in real www and still Hs spammed for 4k crits. Thats like 3sec down to half hp if i cant dodge.

And no thieves are not giving up any survivability as long as they can stealth and move away out of action. Do your 20k combo and get out of action to full hp.

Thieves should be bursty and agile but this current state is beyond the definition of burst imo.

Give me 25 stacks of might and 25 stacks of bloodlust on my Necromancer, and I’ll down zergs by myself.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Rubber Daggers?

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Can you use this site to let us know of your full build. Will make it easier for us to help you!

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

why all the thief hate?

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

@Sorrow, there few issues that you might encounter using that build, as you spread yourself a bit thin:
1- You won’t be able to heal effectively in stealth (Missing 30 points in SA), and so you will need to be quick with your skills for not to lose major health chunks once you are exposed.

2- To be able to perform a backstab, you need a D/x with the S/x set. If you engage with D/x, switching back to S/x will get you nowhere, you are exposed to burst damage, and if two people have immobilize they can make your fight pretty tough, and you might end up with not enough initiatives to perform your stealth combo (D/P) or CnD (D/D) once you switch back to that set. So I believe you are way better off with one specific set, unless you need S/x to remove boons, then go for the kill with other set. But to have S/X only for the shadowstep, is kind of futile in my opinion.
3- In zergs, without a Shortbow and healing in stealth, AOE will make it very tough for you to engage in close combat. Even if we suppose you managed to go in, attack few, then back out. The number of people you will tag is nowhere close than shortbow.

In theory, the way you put things up sound good, however, how feasible and effective are they when you try them out all together? Do you actually use this build?

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

My intake on WvW

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I agree with you that any class, if built around mobility, can be slippery. The difficulty of applying it ranges though, for instance, mesmers can be just as slippery as a thief. They can easily switch up with their clone and stealth, then make a run for it. Guardians, Elementalists, Engineers, hunters, and warriors can dash forward using different weapon skills while applying different buffs. Necromancers on the other hand aren’t meant to run away, so even if built around mobility, it can be a bit hard to disengage. All in all, thieves definitely not the only slippery class.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Fighting Mesmer Question

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Yesterday I encountered few of them, the times I won was when I pressured them hard. Do not give them the upper hand by fighting their clones, just stealth, and push forward behind the clones. Mesmers usually will immobilize you, and spam their clones to shatter them while hiding behind them, use shadowstep or CnD to break out of it. Wait for a second and you will find the real one appear at the back. That’s when you should throw everything you have at him. He will keep back paddling and dodging, but unless he is a very good player, you’ve already won if you get them into this position. I play D/D power build, I don’t know much about condition builds, nor how to counter them using S/x or P/P.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

My intake on WvW

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Yesterday I spent quite sometime in WvW, using D/D SB (0/30/30/10/0) build, and this is what I think about Thieves:

1- Enemy Thieves: As with every active borderland, there were a lot of roaming thieves. Not a single one lived in a 1vX situation against us, D/P lasted the most, but even those died afterwards without succeeding in downing anyone. I smiled everytime I saw my autoattack chaining, I even got a CnD off of a stealthed thief. When fighting them, just keep in mind that thieves don’t always instantly teleport after stealth, and when they stealth keep autoattacking, if it chains, then you are hitting them. Do not walk straight, do not stick to one direction, always keep turning around randomly. If you do so, most of the times they will fail their backstab and hit you for around 2k frontstab. Once they do, you have 4 seconds to down them.

2- Ally Thieves and zergs: What you can do is this, if your shadowstep skill and Dagger storm are ready, CnD + steal on someone in the enemy zerg, then daggerstorm, and when your health reaches around 20%, shadowstep out towards your allies. Do this when the enemies are running away, or when your allies charging. This will put a lot of pressure against the enemies. Otherwise, use shortbow to try and tag as many players as you can. AOE is your worst enemy, don’t push yourself unless you have a way out.

3- Backstab damage: My damage ranged between 5k and 9k. 5k was a common damage on level 80s where as 7k-9k was common against up-leveled players. Those who do way more damage have sacrificed their survivability and are susceptible to being downed faster.

4- Getting Downed: Did I live through the whole event? No, I died, and so did many other thieves. We aren’t Invincible, everytime we over commit we have a greater chance, than any other class, to die. I’ve seen warriors/Guardians/Elementalists run through my allies and actually live a long long time before they get downed, or run back.

5- Mesmers: Mesmers gave me the hardest time, especially when my shadowstep was on cooldown. They had this combo that immobilized me and threw a lot of clones against me. Guess that’s the shatterer build. If I had my shadowstep, I usually break out of it easily, and sometimes CnDing the clones breaks me free as well. I was roaming with my mesmer friend, we encountered quite a few mesmers, and some even were able to escape a 2v2 situation after we had the upperhand. Even my mesmer friend lived just as long as I did while we were fighting against zergs. So thieves aren’t the only slippery class.

In conclusion, thieves aren’t OP, not even close, especially if you know how to deal with them. Most of them are predictable, and not all of them are pro. To be honest, any class played by a good player will give you a lot of trouble whether it was an ele, guardian, warrior, ranger, or even a necromancer. D/P and S/x have more mobility than other builds, but even they aren’t that big of a threat. Did they run away? Don’t fret, there are tons of other players, including thieves, you can pick on. You never know, you might even encounter that same thief later on and take your revenge.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Dragon Helm - Suggestion

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

The only thing that needs fixing with the helmet is the facial hair, we shouldn’t lose facial hair when we wear the helmet!!!!!!!!

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

how to farm 100k of Zhaitaffy?

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

They might have increased the drop rate on them, yesterday I dropped one off of a risen while participating in Melandru Event. I’m never usually that lucky, so I think if you wait a little longer, the prices will start to drop quite a bit.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

I'm loving the focus trait fix

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

My Reaper’s Touch is doing around 1.5k x 3 + stacks 12 vulnerability + Regeneration on myself all that on 14 seconds cooldown. My spinal shivers does up to around 3.5k if the enemy had 3 boons.

I truly love it

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

DB Dance party screans!

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

*Screens
*Couple
*Picture
*Similar

Sorry, couldn’t hold back :P

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Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

How it probably happens.

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I agree with Lily. Maybe add a new condition that has the same effect as Burning but labeled differently. Decay perhaps?

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Putrid Mark bug

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I will have to test this out when I get back home.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Thief hate in general

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I personally like stealth because it gives me a totally different gameplay than other classes. Coming after playing Necromancer, Warrior, and a Guardian, took me a lot of time to actually get used to playing a thief, but had a lot of fun with it. If they take away stealth, but offered me no other alternative for a unique gameplay, I will stop playing the thief. But even now I play my Necromancer more lol.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Building a better D/D thief.

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

lol. They were standing there doing nothing… They barely even dodged! Not to mention they were all focusing your ally…

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Thief hate in general

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

So many mistakes for someone who actually plays the class:

Mistakes? No, i wouldn’t call it “mistakes”. It’s just a different point of view on the class.

1- CnD is not a cheap skill which you can spam, and you can easily miss it.

The basic cost is 6 ini, 4 ini if you have “infusion of shadows” traited.
4 ini isn’t that much.
Easy to miss? Like every other skill that is used in close combat.

2- Even if you can Spam CnD, it won’t stack, you will just reveal yourself on the second hit.

You can stack it in a different way: CnD -> Blinding Powder -> Hide in Shadows -> Shadow refuge. This gives us (with Meld with shadows) 4 + 4 + 4 + 13 (=25 seconds of non-stop stealth)
There is no reveal between these skills.

3- If you want to play without stealth, you will not benefit from the Shadow Arts tree.

I didn’t say a thief should play without stealth. My point was – a Thief shouldn’t have the ability to perma-stealth. I thought i said that clear.

4- Without stealth, you can’t perform your highest attack, backstab.

I don’t use backstab. I use sneak attack. But anyway – stealth in it’s current form allows you to perform attacks from out of stealth every few seconds. Sure, i profit from it a lot, but i still think it’s too much of an advantage.
In my opinion there should be at least 10 sec reveal time between different stealth skills.
I’m very, very, very curious how all the pro stealth spammers will look like in 1vs1 with such a restriction.

8- Your comparison is totally wrong. If you want to compare virtue and adrenaline with anything a thief has, it would be steal. I’m pretty sure a thief can survive without using Steal.

You’re partially right here. My intention was to show, that Stealth is the main tool of every thief.
But ok, let’s have a more valid comparision – take traps from a ranger and he will still be powerful. Take minions from a necro and he still will be powerful. Take shouts or whatever from a warrior and there will be lots of good builds left. But … take stealth from a thief … and all you will hear will be “nooooo, don’t nerf us”.

9- Thieves are NOT GODMOD when they stealth.

I didn’t say that. I said clearly – all stealth skills are ok like they are.
It’s just perma-stealth that annoys me and so many other players.

1- 4 Initiative is actually expensive as well. Plus I don’t have the trait you listed because I use blind on stealth and cure one condition in stealth instead, which is more effective than returning two initiatives. Maybe because you don’t play D/D, and Backstab, you don’t understand the impact of missing a CnD. Every CnD missed is one less attempt to backstab, and this means your opponent got the upper hand.

2- I know you can stack stealth that way, but guess what, you just blew up all your cooldowns, now you are just a sitting duck for 4 long seconds. I highly doubt anyone does that for only 1 backstab. Moreover Shadows Refuge is risky, leaving it before it expires will cause you revealed (Knock back, pulled by enemy), not to mention it alerts them of your position.

3- Stacking stealth is not perma-stealth, eventually you will leave stealth even if it was for a second to reapply stealth.

4- 10 seconds revealed? Seriously? Do you know what makes thieves do more single damage than warriors? It is the backstab burst damage. Increase revealed to 10 seconds and you will see the overall burst totally killed in PvE. Just because you don’t use backstab doesn’t mean Anet should kill the build… Please play D/D and see how tough it is. 4 seconds revealed is more than enough to kill a thief if they didn’t slip away smartly.

8- Stealth and dodge are the two main defensive mechanisms a thief has, if you want to take either, you need to compensate.

9- There is no such thing as perma stealth, you can see them even if for a split of a second to reapply their stealth, and only D/P got access to such easy stealth.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

There you have your balance dude,

As far as we know, this means nothing!!!
1- You might have had stacks of vulnerability.
2- The thief might have had stacks of might.

With 10 stacks of might I can do 4k damage using the dagger autoattack on my Necromancer.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Thief hate in general

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

It hilarious to see people complain without any facts just stating, “Stealth OP plz nerf.”

There have been millions of reasonable arguments and explanations why “thieves are op” IN SOME SITUATIONS. You need to seperate people who are angry because they can’t handle a thief and people who play a thief and see, that something is wrong with the class.

In the end it all comes to complaining about stealth.
From my point of view there are 2 issues.

I use “hide in shadows” and “blinding power” on my p/p thief. Both skills have a 30sec/32sec cd and i think it’s fair in every 1vs1 when i stealth only 2 times. When i fight mulitple enemys i also use shadow refugee (in most cases to escape).
All these skills are fine and i wouldn’t change anything.
But that’s not all. We all know it.
There is the ability to stack stealth.
There are weapon skills like c&d.
There are combo fields.
There is the ability – the main reason why so many people complain about us/thieves – the ability to perma stealth.

All thieves love to say “l2p”. Well, my friends, now i could reply: first learn to play without stealth, then we can continue this discussion.

You can’t do that, can you?
Which brings us two issue no.2: The profession mechanic.
A guardian can do well without his three virtues.
A ranger still can be very effective without his pet.
A warrior without adrenaline still is very dangerous.
I fought several necromancers who didn’t use Death Shroud even once during the whole fight.
And so on, and so on.
But when you take stealth from thieves there is nothing left. The sad truth is: without stealth thieves are nothing.

So, on the one hand we have god mode when a thief uses stealth ALL the time.
On the other hand we have a dead thief when he doesn’t use any stealth.
I belive, what has to be done is to strike a happy medium.

So many mistakes for someone who actually plays the class:
1- CnD is not a cheap skill which you can spam, and you can easily miss it.
2- Even if you can Spam CnD, it won’t stack, you will just reveal yourself on the second hit.
3- If you want to play without stealth, you will not benefit from the Shadow Arts tree.
4- Without stealth, you can’t perform your highest attack, backstab.
5- Guardians can survive without their virtue because their mechanic isn’t totally based over them. They can heal on each boon apply, apply boons on themselves, and heal on dodge. Virtue skills are more like an “Oh Sh….it!” buttons.
6- Rangers are weak as they are, take away their pet and a BM build, which is their toughest build, will be useless I presume.
7- Warriors already have a high damage coupled with good armor to make them last a bit.
8- Your comparison is totally wrong. If you want to compare virtue and adrenaline with anything a thief has, it would be steal. I’m pretty sure a thief can survive without using Steal.
9- Thieves are NOT GODMOD when they stealth.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Who talked about spamming?
We are saying that Infiltrator’s Strike and Shadow Return are, in fact, stunbreakers on demand. If you need to spam it to break the stuns, you’re probably being focused by 2+ players and you might want to disengage. IS helps you to do so too.

Infiltrator’s Strike/Steal can only be considered as a CC breaker if you were knocked down, you will need the shadow return/actual breakstun to cure any effects. Moreover, if you run out of initiative, the “on demand” part will get moot for Infiltrator’s Strike/shadow return.

I’ve not complained about thieves a single time in this topic.
I’ve just said that saying that thieves are susceptible by CC is an huge lie.
They are by design the profession which is less affected by CC.

I’ve seen you nag how easy playing a thief is, and how stealth is OP, more than once. You are basing your whole argument over a specific build. Of course if you build, whatever class you play, over mobility, you will be less susceptible to CC. In your argument, a thief must carry a sword on main hand, Shadowstep and infiltrator’s signet as utilities, and at least 10 in shadow arts to be even close to what you are suggesting. Guess what? Not everyone runs this build!

Just a dodge is enough to get out of the hot area in which your enemy think you are. Considering the reaction time plus some internet latency, if you are smart enough to get out of that area, you have all the time to do so and you won’t be susceptible by any AoE or CC.

Cheap AoE aren’t coupled with CC btw.

Yeah, the famous dodge argument, basically you were standing there taking all the damage to the face the first 4 seconds after revealed…
Even if the AOE was coupled with cripple/chill will be a good hindrance to a thief.

Actually, it is you who are denying a Thief feature (provided by design) in order to say how weak thieves are and how easy is to kill them. If there is something here who understand the game, it is probably laughing at you, not me.

I’m not saying thieves are weak, and I’m not saying they are easy to kill. All I’m saying that they aren’t as OP as everyone keeps crying about. The joke’s on you for trying to make them sound so!

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
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Hologram Farming Etiquette and Courtesy

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I usually ask people on map to wait if they see someone running towards the Holo. If someone keeps being a jerk, I will try my best to be ahead of him and one shotting the holos before they make it. Most of the time they either learn to be good or leave the map.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

What kind of reasoning is it?
Of course you’re not attacking if you’re breaking stun.

I said you won’t be attacking IF YOU SPAM IT, and not you won’t be attacking if you used it once. Meaning, the more you use it, the more you use up your initiative, the less you are actually doing any damage, the less you are capable of defeating your opponent. This is totally disregarding the fact that it is preceded by a skill, and the fact that it doesn’t last long before you have to use the main skill again.

Same access. Did you read what I’ve wrote?
Thieves have: Infiltrator’s Strike (Shadow Return), Shadowstep (Shadow Return), Steal and Infiltrator’s Signet. I count more save-your-kitten teleports on thieves then on Mesmers.
But anyway, it’s kinda silly you bring into topic a ridiculously OP profession to say thieves have poor anti-CC management.

Mesmers got Blink, Phase Retreat, Portal Entre. So I guess that counts as “Same Access”? Didn’t know I had to list all the skills for you to acknowledge it…. Moreover, you said tell me another profession, and I told you one. The only silly thing is people complaining against thieves more than they do against Mesmers.

Nope, you can’t. Only AoE CCs affects people in stealth because, while you’re in stealth, you don’t have a target.
People usually don’t use their long-cooldown AoE CCs on stealthed people guessing where they are and, unless the thief is that stupid to stand still after he stealthed, enemy won’t know for sure where you are.

This is way more situational than how simple you made it sound. If the thief is in stealth, he is either on the run, or going for a backstab. Each and every class got access to cheap AOE, whether it was from Utility or weapon skill. Some are even coupled with cripple, Daze, and other. Of course if you waited too long before applying the field you wont know where the thief is, but the doesn’t magically teleports on stealth unless he uses one of his skills/utilities, and guess what? That’s one less escape route after he appears.

I’m not even a pro and I can keep going on and on, so pro’s will just laugh at your over-confident thief.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Please, tell me another profession which has a stunbreaker on no cooldown (Shadow Return).

I will assume you mean shadow return from sword skill, the one from utility shadowstep HAS a cooldown. Other than the fact that this wastes an attack skill for more mobility, it uses initiative which means if you spam it, you are actually not attacking.

Tell me another profession which has the same access to no-casting-time teleports which save your kitten when you are under CC

mesmers: Phase Retreat.

Tell me another profession with the same access to stealth (you cannot be CCed when in stealth unless the CC is AoE and nobody wastes an AoE CC if they aren’t entirely sure they will hit the target)

Mesmers and Engineers have Stealth, and you CAN be CCed while in stealth, thieves only cure one condition every 3 seconds while in stealth, and most probably it will be wasted as soon as they enter stealth, unless you failed to actually attack them.

Seriously guys, you need to play other professions or you need to learn to play your profession. When I’m on my thief, I feel like it’s easy mode against CC

I have 4 80s, and you need to learn to play your other professions.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
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Building a better D/D thief.

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Whenever I come up with a new build, I leave out the hard to get ascended upgrades and buffs. To actually build something that does not need buffs to work.

This is my D/D SB build that i use in PvE and WvW

As you can see, I don’t use expensive upgrades, I don’t use all ascended gear, I don’t use buffs to tweak the end results. Plus, you can get this gear in few days.

Berzerk armor + weapons = CoF
Valkyrie armor = Crafted
Ascended Amulet = Laurel
Rings = Fractal
Accessories + Back = Karma vendor

You are set to go!

PS: You are free to choose whatever food/oil buffs you like, whether you need more offense or a little more defense, and you can either fill the ascended gear with agony or any other stat that you see fit, won’t screw up the overall build.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Did you know that the moment the Thief gets CCed its game over?

This is the biggest lie I’ve ever read in the Thief forum.
Since when CC do something to thieves?

When the other player knows how to play.

Didn’t you hear? Stealth gives unstoppable and invincibility!

Not only that, but all our utilities have a stunbreak in them, and cooldown is 1 second. So we can spam it and never get caught!

And they all apply 5 minutes of stealth. :O

EDIT: AND OMNI-CLEANSE!

Not to mention we lose all the conditions on us as soon as we enter stealth, regain full health, all that while doing 30k backstabs! Don’t forget, backstab is a ranged attack!

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Did you know that the moment the Thief gets CCed its game over?

This is the biggest lie I’ve ever read in the Thief forum.
Since when CC do something to thieves?

When the other player knows how to play.

Didn’t you hear? Stealth gives unstoppable and invincibility!

Not only that, but all our utilities have a stunbreak in them, and cooldown is 1 second. So we can spam it and never get caught!

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Thief hate in general

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Why would I want to reduce “hate” towards thieves? It hilarious to see people complain without any facts just stating, “Stealth OP plz nerf.” I only made and used my thief to annoy people after being killed by them myself .

Now that I don’t use my thief much any more, facing them I just feel sorry. The class is very weak to most tanky builds and good (experienced) players in general.

Currently I don’t really see any build the thief has as too strong however P/D and S/D can do pretty well in duels but in larger encounters is a little less useful.

To be honest the class is more in need of buffs than nerfs and I hope A-Net makes an effort to address this.

Exactly!!! I just can’t believe how many bad players are out there thinking that thieves are OP…

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

in Thief

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Did you know that the moment the Thief gets CCed its game over?

This is the biggest lie I’ve ever read in the Thief forum.
Since when CC do something to thieves?

When the other player knows how to play.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stealth has to reward you the better YOU are

in Thief

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Stop whining like little girls and go roll a thief. This should be our reply from now on.

So many Ignorant fools trying to sound intelligent when they didn’t even try to play a thief.

Just like there are lot of losers nagging when they get killed by thieves, there are a lot of other classes laughing when they see a thief.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Suggestion on Spite V Trait: Spiteful Spirit

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

lol Chesire, guess close to death = Enemy. Near to death = On Self ! hehehe.

@Pierwola, how about if the internal cooldown of Spiteful Spirit was actually different than Unholy Feast? This way everytime you use DS you will get 3 seconds retaliation, but every 10 seconds you can get an Unholy feast. It wont feel like a nerf for retaliation, but will feel like a buff on the trait side

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Thief hate in general

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I just love D/D way too much to use anything else.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stealth has to reward you the better YOU are

in Thief

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

The problem with thieves is that our “in-stealth” abilities are by far stronger than our “out of stealth” abilities..

1- raise our base stealth duration to 4 secs (5 when traited)
2- then add the 3 seconds revealed debuff anytime a thief goes out of stealth (3 seconds also for tPvP) even when the thief do not attack anything

this would prevent us from chain stealth abilities without any attack (aka perma stealth) that is the main reason for all those whining in WvW

3- then if we could have some rework on our “out of stealth” combat it could be nice for seeing more builds that do not rely on stealth exclusively.

At the moment we see just 2 kind of thieves spec around:
d\p hiders and s\d dodgers (there are few exceptions of course), and in WvW d\p hiders is far better than dodgers spec just because of stealth chain.
Remove the stealth chain and you will see far less d\p spec around.

4- also remove from WvW all mobs, with the exception of Champions, kraits, ogres, arpies and thos kind of mobs. But just remove every other mob so that thieves cannot anymore stealth on stupid AI using C&D and they actually need to hit other players properly

Please don’t use the word “our”, any sane thief who cares about his class doesn’t suggest such dumb changes.

1- 5 seconds will not mend the rest of the suggestions.
2- This will not only punish you for failing to land a backstab, but will also end with getting you killed. You used your hide in shadow heal skill? Guess what, you won’t stealth for another 4 seconds. Good luck!
3- Thanks, but I didn’t level a thief to end up having two warriors.
4- There are some people who actually finish their dailies in WvW, so they need the mobs. Not to mention this isn’t a stupid instanced PvP, it needs to feel like it is an open world.

You aren’t “fixing” anything with these changes, only breaking a whole class and making this game even less diverse. The purpose of revealed is actually to put a “cooldown” on backstab to prevent any excessive burst.

The only thing they could do is prevent stealth from stacking when HS over smoke field. This way they won’t stealth for long, and would become too expensive, initiative wise, to spam.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Thief hate in general

in Thief

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Sure not. D/P nerf and larcenous strike nerf are definitely coming.

I use neither >:D

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Suggestion on Spite V Trait: Spiteful Spirit

in Necromancer

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I don’t understand what is all the fuss about, I’m confused, maybe I missed something?

@Pierwola, how exactly is adding an attack to the retaliation “nerf” it? If you haven’t traited the DS it will have a cooldown of 8 seconds if im not mistaken, so you won’t be waiting that much if Spiteful Spirit had an internal cooldown of 10 seconds.

@Chesire, how is Close to Death Increases damage by 20% to enemies below 50% health, a defensive trait?

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

New Necro looking for Advice on a DS Build

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

My Build Thread

Feel free to check it out, and/or comment on it! The only thing I sometimes switch out is my off hand with a warhorn, whenever I feel like I need a fast Life Force refill.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Suggestion on Spite V Trait: Spiteful Spirit

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

By kill his build, he meant he will need to change his build into power.

?

Retaliation is based on power. So he obviously uses Near to Death and Spiteful Spirit in a power build.
Replacing it with Unholy Feast would require an internal cd, so his Retaliation uptime would be reduced.

Don’t know if this qualifies as “build killed” though, considering how much damage Unholy Feast does on it’s own.

I didn’t see him mention his build really, so I would assume he is using a build which doesn’t have any points in Spite. Adding this to spite will “force” him to put points in spite to get this. Which might kill his current build. Anyways, I think this way of thinking is faulty because he won’t benefit from it as much as if he was going full powermancer, which means he should already have points in spite.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Suggestion on Spite V Trait: Spiteful Spirit

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

By kill his build, he meant he will need to change his build into power.

Back to topic, I like this idea, I’m currently actually using this trait and I F1 on/off for Enfeebling blood + retaliation + fury. With this improvement, even if it was a weaker version of the skill, it would be a great asset

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

in Thief

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

To all the people that say stealth is OP, please roll a thief and roam WvW all day, all week, and all year long. You know, after all, roaming in WvW is the one and only feature found in GW2, no need to bother with anything else. Which brings us to our next point, do delete all the other 80s you have since they are useless now, even if you have an 80 mesmer, obviously, in your logic, they are weak and suck at roaming. But this isn’t all, get a real knife and place it next to you, now, everytime you die while roaming, do slice your wrist a little because you just failed at being OP, rinse and repeat…

[/sarcasm] Silly people -_-

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

The thief and its gameplay - Your feedback [Merged]

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Hi,

First of all, my Thief isn’t lvl 80 yet, so I don’t master this class…

But I fight many of them in PvP and WvW.

In PvP, I think it’s a balanced class. Sometimes, they just kill me (Engi) in one burst, sometimes I survive and kick their *. Well, it’s pretty fun, and I often say “gg, wp” when I meet a good thief.
You always have to be careful when you know there is a thief in the other team, but that’s how the thief works… surprise attack -> down ? yes/no -> win/loose.
If you let a thief finish his combo, you’re gonna have a very hard time !

In WvW, I think it’s a class designed for roaming and stealing tower. It’s pretty difficult to play like the others players, you have to be away from the rest of the group….
But honestly I think stealth duration should be reduced in WvW.
I’ve played vs Baruch Bay, and they have some very good “thief guilds” (hi OdS members ). They play stealth and condition damages, and the only way to take them down is to fight at 3 vs 1. (Thief combo : stealth, hit, flee, stealth, hit, stealth)

Unlike PvP, there is just too much space in WvW. When a thief use stealth in PvP, the arena is so small that you almost know where he is or where he will go. In WvW, it’s impossible ^^.
I’ve seen towers been captured with only 2 thiefs, since once they’re inside it, NPC aren’t able to focuse them and die because of the conditions dommages.

Honestly… Honestly…. you have no idea what you are talking about…
1- There is no such thing as reduce stealth duration, if you play a D/D thief, you have around 4 seconds to land a backstab off of a CnD (6 initiative), not cheap at all.
2- Condition builds will not one shot you.
3- If any thief attacks you, they will have 4 seconds of revealed where you can actually CC and try to burst them down before they vanish back into stealth.
4- Even if thieves stealth, you can keep the AOE going which still hits them.
5- Their Utility skills aren’t on very short cooldowns, so if they blow them up early, they either have to disengage or they will lose the fight.

So learn more about the class before going on with your suggestions -_-

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stop nerfing us

in Thief

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Yesterday I was killing thieves on my Necromancer faster than they can blink. In one on one fights they might run away, but in big fights, and when they try to stomp anyone, 2 seconds is all the time I need to down them.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Stealth has to reward you the better YOU are

in Thief

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

And how exactly will you land a backstab when you are visible Mr. Make-Us-Visible-To-Promote-Better-Play-Because-I-Find-Playing-This-Class-Too-Easy?

Moreover, you do know that even when you are stealthed, you are vulnerable to attacks, so why the heck even bother going into stealth if they can see you? Untargettable? That doesn’t mean that AOE can’t kill you… Unless you mean we are totally invulnerable, but if that’s the case, then screw BS, ill just do a front stab every 4 seconds, while regenerating, and will use Stealth to absorb whatever burst damage against me. Which is stupid, totally stupid.

Your suggestion is just half-baked and bad.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

no idea what to do against Mesmers anymore

in Necromancer

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I’m a powermancer that run with only 1 well, Well of Suffering, the rest of the utilities are Blood is Power, Spectral Walk/Signet of the Locust, and Consume Conditions as my heal skill. I don’t have that much issues while roaming, maybe because I don’t roam that much unless im heading to a zerg, but so far the classes I’ve met while roaming are guardian (wasn’t a problem), Engineer (popped Lich after they used their elite), Ranger (Ignored their pet, and went directly to them), Elemental (tie, downed each other), thief (they ran away).

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

How to Fight a Thief?

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Go to whatever forum your main class is, and ask them.

Ironic considering the common thief answer on how to fight a thief is that you need to play a thief to understand them., In fairness though mesmer is another such class that is the exact same in that regard.

True, if you play a thief to know how to counter them, you will know their weaknesses and upon that you know which skills to use and when to use them. Alternatively, you can ask someone who plays your class, and already did the homework.

My point is asking a thief, on how to counter them, is a bit vague as they might not know which set of skills/combos are best used during the fight.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Thief is not a Thief.

in Thief

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

And your point is? Thieves should be in the market all day stealing apples? Poor Tybalt, won’t like his apples stolen!

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Dagger Storm (suggestion!)

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Isn’t it what we called “useless skill”? So now, Thiefs don’t have to fight anymore they just need to run everywhere they go?

I don’t know why you find it useless, now if you are running a full glass cannon, this is mainly your problem for not holding out on few hits, but whenever there is more than one target, my Dagger Storm starts doing big numbers, and not only that, I get to tag many people in zergs to get credit once they die. This is all I expect from this Elite.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Dagger Storm (suggestion!)

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Dagger Storm is fine, I know everyone would love their elite to be effective for the full duration, but if we apply this to all the elites, Lich Necromancers will be downing people like flies. Moreover, Dagger Storm has an average cooldown, not that long to be actually way too situational. You can use it and disengage once your health is at risk, then use it again later on.

TL/DR: Dagger Storm is fine and does not needs any buffing.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

Community Thoughts - WoP and WoC

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

Well of Power in short:

U
S
E
L
E
S
S

Edit to add: At least Well of Corruption got some damage in it, even if little.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

no idea what to do against Mesmers anymore

in Necromancer

Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I have issues with mesmers on my necromancer too, the problem is that I have a hard time distinguishing the real one, even when they get downed it is hard to tell, for me at least. I can kill mesmers on my thief because I have a little breathing space to find the real one. So i think if you can distinguish the real from fake quickly, you might have a chance.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…