Guild Wars 2

Aury.1367:

Big problem I feel when playing Rev, is that chains skills cost energy aswell.
For example Duelists Preparation: 10 Energy on activation, 10 more Energy to use Shackling Wave.
No other class has this, check thief for similar skills (shortbow cluster bomb for example).
Same issue with Staff 2 chain skill. Youre barely able to use both skills.
Please remove the costs for the second skill, the amount of situations where I use it successfully is so kitten low. You have to care about your energy already so much, now keep it up and kite around just for one skill?

Uhm yes and no Look at Flanking Strike/ Larcenous Strike, and Infiltrator Strike/Infiltrators Return both cost Initiative.

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

How can you push more damage than in your previous vid? Most damage I gave from backstab is just shy of 13k.

Run full Signet Thief

Svarty.8019:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

[..]the magical thing called downing the enemy Ghost a thief and seeing there body in the downed state, I know the majority of players have issues with achieveing that last one especially if you believe people when they say 1 Ghost thief can kill 9 players at once.

That seems, to me, like a silly thing to say.

You can’t blame players for being destroyed by the invisible boy who makes it impossible for them to move while pinging them down with abilities which they can’t even research a counter to because nobody can see what they were in the combat log. Neither “combatant”, thief nor victim, is becoming a better player here.

That’s Arenanet’s fault.

Yeah feels bad for 9 players being Burst down 1 by one every 20-25 seconds single target, if only there were skills that did damage in decently large areas without needing a target, or skills that cleanse conditions on players and their nearby allies, or skills/items that Reveal Stealthed players without needing a target……

Yes it’s a stupid gameplay mechanic, yes it shouldn’t exist but saying there is no way to fight against it is a big lie, and 9 players vs 1 that Thief should have been dead, so yes it’s a L2P issue.

Svarty.8019:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

The only time I have problems against Ghost Thieves is when there is more than 2, legitimately my build is pretty crap since. Any competent player can negate the majority of my damage, yet it is easy to kill the non OP Ghost Theif Build.

How would you ever know? Certainly not by looking at the laughably inadequate combat log!

Not really, lots of things tell you when there are multiples, the amount of Condis applied to you, the frequency at which the Burst are applied and the magical thing called downing the enemy Ghost a thief and seeing there body in the downed state, I know the majority of players have issues with achieveing that last one especially if you believe people when they say 1 Ghost thief can kill 9 players at once.

Straegen.2938:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Did I say it was a DH Blow Up build? Nope, I said my Burn Guard build that is bursty, which it is I can stack well over 15-20 stacks of Burn in the initial opening.

Back to my point, most classes cannot do a thing to a Ghost Thief other than run away (and not all can do that). Telling others to L2P when you are running one of the strongest meta builds in the game right now is silly.

Also “bursty” implies power which on a DH Burn build typically means Viper. Viper is also meta on DH right now because DH has… wait for it… high rotational defense (as in block/invuln up time better than any other class in the game).

Sorry but bursty just mean a burst of damage in a short amount of time which is capable of doing with Burns and other Condis, Power damage is not the only thing that can be burst damage.

And again The Ghost Thief bypasses all of The DHs rotational defenses since you know all the main damaging skills used are unblockable, and limited 2 Condi Clear with the build I use, which is the one I linked.

Again this Guardian build is not OP against Ghost thief since you know Ghost Thief is able to bypass almost all defenses of Guardian and has ample Condis Clear while Stealthed.

But I forgot GS has a “self Condi Clear” built in….

Svarty.8019:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

It isn’t OP against Ghost Thieves

Can you imagine what the game would be like if everybody was on ghost thief builds?

You mean a relatively easy time? Majority of the players in this game are very bad and most would probably be even worse on ghost thief since it requires Proper resource management to maintain stealth and ensure it’s burst lands, when the majority of players have to rely on Passives defenses to carry them.

The only time I have problems against Ghost Thieves is when there is more than 2, legitimately my build is pretty crap since. Any competent player can negate the majority of my damage, yet it is easy to kill the non OP Ghost Theif Build.

Straegen.2938:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

High defensive Rotation? Ghost Thief Condi application is all unblockable so bypasses all Guardian defenses

In your build the GS has built in condi clears. Also if the player takes Renewed Focus their rotational defense gets significantly better. If a DH knows a Ghost is around swap out to Light’s Judgement.

As for your specific build, that is a pure burn build not a DH Blow Up build which often runs Viper.

Too bad the combo field whirler isn’t much of a Condi Clear when it doesn’t cleanse the Guardian.

Did I say it was a DH Blow Up build? Nope, I said my Burn Guard build that is bursty, which it is I can stack well over 15-20 stacks of Burn in the initial opening.

And again I have no issues with 1-2 Ghost Thieves on this build I run, but by no means is it OP or vey defensive since majority of traits are damaging traits and all damaging Utilities. The reason I don’t have issues with Ghost Thieves is because I don’t need to have a target, if they attack me I can instantly cleanse the initial Burst and then drop all my AoEs and let them kill themselves while I sit in the middle of my AoEs and if that doesn’t kill them I start kiting

Bhima.9518:

Its time for Anet to look at history and understand the mistakes already made and solved by the 800lb. gorilla, WoW. WoW’s implementation of LFR has been very successful, and there is absolutely no reason why Anet has not yet implemented an LFR system with easier raids that give reduced rewards (ie: less Ascended currency and no path to Legendary Armor through the LFR). That way, casual players are more likely to complete the content, get something for their effort AND see the story. The only argument against this is some weird elitist mental block… which makes no sense since those that complete the real raid will be rewarded more, and have the opportunity for prestigious legendary armor.

Big Difference between WoW and Gw2 and that being WoW is almost exclusively built around Raids as the main driving force for Story, GW2’s main story is from Living Story seasons. And has a multitude of different end game content between open world, Fractals Raids Living Story etc.

Raids were released solely at the behest of Players that wanted a challenge, Anet agreed and made Raids, now the people that didn’t want Raids to begin with are tying to turn Raids into easy mode content which they were never intended to be or requested to be by the Target audience, it’s not like Casuals don’t have a multitude of other End game content that specifically targets them as the audience, it’s not like the main GW2 story is locked behind Raids.

When making comparison between different things make sure that what you are comparing are remotely similar, which in the WoW raids vs Gw2 raids they are not even close to the same when it comes to the intent behind them.

Not everything in game is meant for everybody hence why each content is directed at different target audiences.

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

mounts? pls explain how the usage of an external tool will lead to this?

ummm i already just did that thank you very much . and if you really want that answer
then go and get wow and play it . and see just how long it takes for your acount there to get hacked with the use of add ons . and see how it works for you . and even tho i do play wow . i do not use any add ons at all . never have and never will . and do not wish to see them in this game . as it will only drive more people away from the game than it has done now . like i already have said . oh and a have a nice day

Sorry it seems i am not as smart and experienced as you. Can you explain in simple words how using dps meters will lead to the game getting mounts?

i did not say that and please do not put words in my mouth too that i did not say . ok ???

you ask nicely so its like this they say ok to dps meters . look back lets say 6 months later and ok that went great and very well . lets say now how they like mounts add to the game . even tho there is already kinda of in a round about way a form of mounts in the game . with the flying carpet . so maybe in a way they put they did put the horse before the cart this time maybe lol

See Bolded Sections, you said allowing Dps meters would cause mounts to be added. So yes you did say that.

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

snip

Snip

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

Snip

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

Straegen.2938:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

If it was truly 1 ghost thief vs 9 of you that’s a serious L2P issue, I know Roaming on my Burn Guard I am able to easily kill a Solo Ghost Thief, when 2 are involved it becomes a hassle.

In fairness you are probably playing one of the most OP builds in the game right now. Not every build has access to Guardian-level condi removal, strong burst, solid condi damage and high defensive rotation in one package.

High defensive Rotation? Ghost Thief Condi application is all unblockable so bypasses all Guardian defenses, And only have two Condi Cleanses from wings of Resolve and Purifying Flames with this build that isn’t even optimized besides providing large Burst damage.

It isn’t OP against Ghost Thieves o any class with Condi clears.

Yes all gear on this alt is Exotic

Astralporing.1957:

zoomborg.9462:

There are games out there that have 2-3 times harder content than GW2 raids. On those forums usually people ask how to progress in the content. Strategies, advice, tips……
Here people asked for things to be catered to them. It’s embarassing really….

Yeah… almost like those games were targeted at different people or something…
Surprising, right?

(When i want to play a hard game, i play a hard game. GW2 i play for completely different reasons however).

Yeah… almost like Raid target different people or something, Suprising, right?

It’s not like Raids are the only content in game, in most Mmos they have content that cater to a variety of player types/target audience, it’s no surprise that Anet did the same with GW2.

phoenixwil.6071:

Yeah I encountered a ghost thief too and it is unbalanced. One ghost thief (yes it was one), killed 9 of us then he revealed himself and started jumping lol. I don’t mean one of us came along one at a time, there were 9 of us bobbing and weaving yet the ghost thief 1v9 us… and he won lol. Say whaaaaaat? The ghost thief appeared again later picking off zerg tail. Zerg was capping a control point and the ghost thief was jumping a tad out of range, taunting us. Pretty sad when a zerg’s only option is to ignore him. FYI, I was a mythril Herald and actually said no way he’s gonna kill me. I got this…wrong! lol Only one reveal but it was useless since it has short range. No, I shouldn’t need the help of a purchasable WVW stealth reveal to be useful. No doubt that biased thieves will respond with, “Maybe don’t get hit. Maybe get gud at running away. Maybe hit skill 1 to land a lucky hit. Maybe just ignore him in a game that is designed for combat. Maybe ask the zerg for help. Maybe wait it out and the thief will maybe hit you. Maybe switch toons and hope for the best. Maybe just hit me ‘cause I’m fragile…even though I just soloed your squad and you can’t hit me back…um, ok, forget I just said that. Maybe give all classes stealth, um, wait, no don’t do that ‘cause then I won’t be able to target you. Where was I? Maybe…” Yeah yeah ’cause all that makes sense…

Great game but unbalanced. Ghost thief trapper wasn’t the craziest I’ve seen. A ghost thief pistol kills you almost instantly. Shoot twice and you should be dead. Shoot > Shoot > Stealth if foe isn’t dead > Shoot. Can’t fight back if you can’t target even though reflects help, not all classes have reflect. There are some videos that show it and it’s been around a while but still used in WVW for instakills. Same goes for the ghost mesmer greatsword that does an instakill. I have 25k health and I was like wtf just killed me and the auto crystal hibernation at low health didn’t activate. I don’t get how Anet doesn’t have a problem nerfing some things but allows stuff like this to continue. What was the response for nerfing the Dragonhunter trapper, we nerfed it because it was very difficult to counter. Hmm, interesting…

If it was truly 1 ghost thief vs 9 of you that’s a serious L2P issue, I know Roaming on my Burn Guard I am able to easily kill a Solo Ghost Thief, when 2 are involved it becomes a hassle.

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

Unless the Opponent. Is in full zerker Thieves can’t one shot kill, normally they use three attacks for most huge burst, one of the original huge burst combos was Coak and Dagger into Steal into Backstab after popping all signets.

People need to relive players will be against anything that shines the light on their shortcomings especially when it’s at the expense of others and want to be carried without allowing the others to know, it has been that way for along time in Mmos, they want to reap the benefits without actually being held accountable, nothing new and they will always complain to get stuff like DPS meters removed, which the meters that are used are misnomered as DPS meters when they Show much much more and should be considered Combat Efficacy meters since they track Boon uptime and so on.

Match making means absolutely nothing in WvW do to too much hands on glicko manipulation of Devs and always changing the scoring every other month or so. It’s pathetic to be honest.

Tell Anet to fix their mistake of not stopping/limiting class stacking, it’s not the Players job to fix other people’s mistakes, if only there was a poll recently that had an outcome that would have limited class stacking, oh wait there was.

gebrechen.5643:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Evan Lesh.3295:

It’s almost like DH has a low skill floor or something.

Fun thing is that there is 10 times more thieves than DH in wvw and everyone knows why.

Fun thing your number is arbitrary and no proof to back the claim while Guardians are very prevalent in WvW just saying.. claims with zero proof.

Arbitrary is arbitrary is arbitrary

Uzunari.1964:

DesiRe.1348:

The thing is that alot of players like to get carried in different ways, without ever thinking as to how much they contribute to the gain. For example, I did install a DPS meter a few days ago, and have been doing alot of Fractal 40 farm with it.
I was obviously searching for an expert group, since you want to get as much out of the farm as possible. And let me tell you, its unbelievable how many people 1) think they are exp, but are not, 2) dont care about requirements at all or 3) just lie to get what they want. Before the meters you had a group, if it went well – fine. If it didn’t however, you had no reliable way to tell WHICH PART was the reason for it, so you basically had to search for a whole new group. NOW you can see who is responsible, and tell him he doesn’t meet your requirements (in a friendly manner of course). It’s just way easier to cope with the whole thing. It also helps players in realizing on what level they actually play on. And it does keep snitches from lying their way into getting what they want, thats just a fact.

What I don’t understand is, how can you say you are AGAINST dps meters, because you don’t like to be monitored, and one sentence later say “Let Anet do a DPS meter ingame!!” – it’s the exact same thing? You still get monitored, you still (maybe) get called out for your performance. But honestly, how is that a bad thing? Some people want to take things seriously, and do smooth and/or effective runs. People that aren’t playing on top of their game are denying them that. How is it unfair to help these serious players? If you want to take a more relaxed approach to the game, no one is ever gonna blame you for that. Just don’t join exp groups or such then, you don’t really get any disadvantage by these tools.

Oh and PS:
That thing about gaining an advantage as a commander e.g. is a joke right? Yes, it does make things easier, but it only gives you something you could do anyways. Then you could also say it shouldn’t be allowed to play a mouse with side keys. Or to change your skill hotkeys, because Q,E,R,T are way easier to reach than 6 7 8 9 or F1 F2 F3 F4. What kind of argument is that?

Well, you don’t get the point I consider DPS meter an advantage as even in this state it does not provide only the calculated numbers of dmg but other data as well (buff uptimes, downed stats and so no..) To me this seems like advantage to some degree. I am totally okay with it if it comes from official source though, because I won’t just download some kitteny non-official software from whatever the source is right now (Sorry, this is madness and nobody should). But because of the advantage in my eyes I ask for same opportunities for everyone – make dps meter ingame. Is that not obvious solution? If this is not possible (I really see no reason why it shouldn’t be) then simply block the usage for everyone -> easy as that.

By Anets own words:

The best way for a player to determine whether a specific third-party program could have any impact on another player or a PvP opponent is to ask:

“Does this program allow someone to play faster, better, longer, or more accurately than someone who doesn’t use it?”

“Does this program allow someone to ‘play’ when he/she is not at the computer?”

“Does this program allow the user to gain undeserved rewards?”

DPS Meters do not do any of those things, all they do is provide information already provided by the game in a consolidated manner and Anet has laid for the rules for “legal” DPS Meyers to abide by, so far the two main ones follow Anets Rules on the matter.

There is no advantage given by dps meters that allow anyone to play faster, longer, or more accurately, they don’t magically give players rewards and they don’t allow people to play while AFK.

people complaining about DPS meters have yet to provide any real reasons why dps meters should be removed besides their feelings.

DPS meters are a blessing they allow people to be judged based on their actual performance and not arbitrary things like LI quantity or Kill Proof, or because someone feels like a Player isn’t pulling their weight.

Evan Lesh.3295:

It’s almost like DH has a low skill floor or something.

Hmm let’s see people complain that Pvp get more charges, yet it is one of the worst Gamemodes for getting gear and Gold, while all other Gamemodes get all of those a lot easier, like getting well over 50g in one hour of PvE…. just saying Transmutation charges are an optional thing that provide a convenience, they are not necessary for anything in game unlike Gear and Gold……

Had Mesmer last night try to claim I was a bad Thief when not decapping far when it had 1-2 people babysitting the point between a Guardian and a Mesmer, I would Decap when it was an empty point, while that said Mesmer was feeding those two far the whole match and not contributing anywhere else.

The majority of the player base will try to claim others at being at fault even when it is blatantly obvious they have no idea what they are doing. Most players in ranked don’t know what they are doing and follow the Meta like Lemmings and anything else is wrong.

skoobydoo.9246:

sephiroth.4217:

I don’t like thieves because even if we have 3, none of them switch.

Stacked Druids will switch, stacked Eles will switch, stacked Revs will switch, stacked Scrappers will switch but the thieves never switch….

thats actually 100% true.just today i had x2 thieves in my team asked 1 of them to swap they start explaining how good x2 thieves work.ofc we got rekt and lost the game really hard then 1 of them start explaining how he use to be 2k+ player and we have lost because the rest of us suck.

also when i see 2 or more thieves on enemy team i am so happy

It not the job of the players to fix The poor choices of the Devs in balancing and Class stacking, just saying they are allowed to play whatever they feel like.

Maybe you should ask for better class balance or no class stacking.

Artaz.3819:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Artaz.3819:

If it’s a solo ghost thief, that’s not overtly harsh if you have counter cleanse. It’s the pack of semi-coordinated havoc that is what is broken (or the 2-3 that follow invisible with other single/double defensive-like roamers since invisible rez too). The true issue is if the initial attack fails, no harm, no foul to the thief as you can reset over and over. This is absolutely crazy good when people are using siege out in the open (or just for impossible to stop siege disable).

And the ghost thief build is amazingly synergistic with others thanks to venom share being baseline (Spider Venom, Basilisk Venom). Immobilize comes from the double Needle Trap with one utility and another from heal trait. Easy to apply with timing Steal for insta teleport on target (which also adds stacks of additional Poison, Weaken, Confusion (or Daze) and adds more Stealth to the thief too).

That’s why you get lit up with condis all at once as the standard attack is to start casting Needle Trap followed by Steal (1200 range).

That moment when someone doesn’t realize Venoms/Venomshare do absolutely nothing for Ghost Thief, hint Venoms don’t Proc on Needle Traps, Caltrops, Steal or anything else the Ghost Thief uses.

Thankfully, NPC Guards, that crew of dredge/ogres/frogs, that lonely yak with two pitiful guards, fellow visible players that you are running along with (because everyone solo roams, right?), Turrets from Elite (or Thief Guild) and general pets works all too well. It’s pretty hilarious for killing other roamers that are going after a sentry or your own supply camp guards too.

And if you look at every Ghost Thief build they don’t run Venoms, they run Needle Trap, Blinding Powder and Shadowstep/Caltrop Utility, in the majority of all cases, since it is quite hard to maintain perma Stealth without Blinding Powder and they would lose damage if they don’t run the Needle trap, and your scenario you put out was all using Perma stealth Thieves no mention of any of those AI or Npcs. So you are basing your claims on being outnumbered by either players or Npcs and dying, funny how you claim a build to be OP and your claims come from being in an outnumbered situation.

Artaz.3819:

If it’s a solo ghost thief, that’s not overtly harsh if you have counter cleanse. It’s the pack of semi-coordinated havoc that is what is broken (or the 2-3 that follow invisible with other single/double defensive-like roamers since invisible rez too). The true issue is if the initial attack fails, no harm, no foul to the thief as you can reset over and over. This is absolutely crazy good when people are using siege out in the open (or just for impossible to stop siege disable).

And the ghost thief build is amazingly synergistic with others thanks to venom share being baseline (Spider Venom, Basilisk Venom). Immobilize comes from the double Needle Trap with one utility and another from heal trait. Easy to apply with timing Steal for insta teleport on target (which also adds stacks of additional Poison, Weaken, Confusion (or Daze) and adds more Stealth to the thief too).

That’s why you get lit up with condis all at once as the standard attack is to start casting Needle Trap followed by Steal (1200 range).

That moment when someone doesn’t realize Venoms/Venomshare do absolutely nothing for Ghost Thief, hint Venoms don’t Proc on Needle Traps, Caltrops, Steal or anything else the Ghost Thief uses.

Nope Raids don’t need an Easy or Story mode and the Devs seem to agree, and they have actual numbers to back their design philosophy on this. If it was as big of an issue has the extremely small group of people posting on the forums says it is then the Devs would have implemented and easy/story mode already.

And to the people claiming that their are gates and barriers to Raid, all you need are

10 Level 80 players.
Exotics
And time and patience to learn the mechanics, all of which are easily learned in the Raid encounters or even more easily with a few searches on google.

Nothing else is required to Raid absolutely nothing else, not even VoIP

Ash.8127:

try waiting for wasted ini when he got 1 till 2 other pi-thieves taking turns headshotting and AAing you. besides unless u have pulsing stab he will just steal it …

It’s always hilarious when people’s complaints go straight to well if there is more than one and I am outnumbered by them…….

Counters exist, through Stability, Projectile Hate, Dodges, Blocks, and so on, and any class when fighting multiple and you are by yourself will give the majority of players a hard time.

OriOri.8724:

Turk.5460:

I used the word “akin” because you are right, you can’t directly compare stealth to any other sort of defense. And guess what, you’re not supposed to, the mechanics are nowhere near related. However, people keep trying to compare stealth to other game mechanics/abilities, both offensive and defensive, so its only natural to cater to those people and attempt to make vague comparisons to non-comparable skills in a devil’s advocate style.

How about this: You say blocks have counters via unblockable attacks. OK, not everyone has unblockable attacks/abilities. And those that do may not have them slotted or traited as its not optimal for their build/playstyle.

Stealth has counters via reveals. Not everyone has reveal attacks/abilities. And those that do may not have them slotted or traited as its not optimal for their build/playstyle. DH trap absolutely counts, as relying on a thief walking through the trap means….drumroll …stand on your trap – thief not wanting to walk into the trap? OK cool, now your cooldowns are ticking back.

Stealth stacking- when talking about thieves specifically – counters itself by consuming utility cooldowns, endurance, and/or initiative. Think of your preferred non-thief profession – lets say you go into stealth, now you want to attack, but you now only have 1 bar of endurance, 3 skills and a utility on cooldown. Is this an optimal way to engage your target?

Again, as stated above, this is a vague comparison, because you cannot make a direct comparison, but it gets the job done and outlines the risk that people think has magically disappeared.

Every single class has access to unblockable weapon attacks, as well as 4 classes have traits that make attacks unblockable. Even if you want to count DH trap (though really? So now the “counter” to a ghost thief is to stand completely still? What next?), that’s still only 3 classes out of 9 that have access to AoE reveal. 3 out of 9.

And only 4 out of 9 classes have pure Invulnerable, 2 of which can still use all skills while Invulnerable. No hard counters.

Or 2 classes have pseudo Invulnerable that allow them to use all skills. While taking no physical damage. No Hard counter unless running a Condi build.

Or 1 class has a Pseudo Invulnerable that allows them to take no damage, or it heals them, only Counter is to stop doing anything.

While stealth has hardcounters on multiple classes only 3 can innately do it while the Thief is already Stealthed the other 2 have to choose when to preemptively use it, then there is an item that can be used by any and all classes to reveal Stealthed players.

So 5 out of 9 classes have access to reveals 3 out of those 5 can do it in an AoE while the Thief is Stealthed.

And you know something DHs normally just stand in one spot because of traps lulz you act as if they don’t do that already between traps and Purging flames, majority of DH players will stand near or in their traps in a fight, just saying.

The balance in this game is a complete joke especially in WvW, it was proven this last patch when they buffed one of the few Specs that shouldn’t even exist in game, there are a multitude of ways to remove the build/playstyle but nope it gets buffed, if that doesn’t tell you anything then idk what to tell you.

But guys Teef is OP don’t you know? I don’t see why people are mad about To many Teefz on teams, by all posts on Forums Teef is the most OP class evah.

This is representative of the majority of people in WvW, stands in Same spot in red circles, keep AA spamming while afflicted by Confusion, doesn’t attempt to cleanse until majority of health is gone, just tunnel vision on Yak, no reaction to the Condi bomb.

Dem Yakslaps doe….

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KPcucSQHBI4

Another over blown Post, the funny thing is the conditions needing to be met to land 10k+ damage, its not like other classes can’t do similar if not more damage on low CD skills….

First things first Stealth Attacks are not Auto Attacks.
Stealth Attacks either need Initiative expended or long CDs used to gain access to.

Backstab
Requires stealth- to get stealth Thief has to
A. Land a Cloak and Dagger 6 initiative.
B. Use Black Powder 6 initiative, then leap through with either Heartseeker 3 initiative (9 total now used) or expend a Dodge through Heartseeker, effective removing or of the Thieves defenses.
C. Use a relatively long CD Blinding Powder or Shadow Refuge skill to gain Stealth without a combo finisher.
And
D. Trait a highly underwhelming purely defensive traitline Shadow Arts to gain stealth on Steal.

Then on top of that they would have to position behind the opponent and then land the Backstab, and if it misses (which can be a high probability with all the Blocks, Blinds, Invulns, Psuedo Invulns.) it placed Backstab on CD, and if the Backstab is negated close to Stealth Ending then AA is on CD.

This is how the majority of people complaining about Ghost Thieves react to being attacked. Keep AA spamming and don’t try to cleanse on the first sign of Condi Burst….

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KPcucSQHBI4 not my video

Straegen.2938:

Surprised DD with Havoc Mastery and Bounding Dodger isn’t better than Trickery and Lead Attacks especially since DD is two multipliers to one.

It could be due to the possible down time of Bounding dodger procs and the damage from Bounding Dodge not landing due to positioning, and the lower Cd on Steal for more Mugs,

Evan Lesh.3295:

It’s almost like DH has a low skill floor or something.

OriOri.8724:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

apharma.3741:

Snip.

Snip

This just shows how little you know about Chronomancer. Snip

And the tether is 5,000 units long. You can’t break that in a single blink. Even if you took mimic on your bar and double blinked in CS you wouldn’t be able to outrun the tether. But that’s a moot point since you are convinced this is possible without mimic on the bar in the first place.

snip

And you say I don’t know how Chronomancer works, when I don’t even Main the class, you do and think the Tether is 5000 range, newsflash it’s 1200 range, again seeing not knowing mechanics related to your main.

See as I stated before anyone can Spread misinformation it’s quite easy, so let’s see people back there claims on Thief being the unkillable killing machines all being braindead easy. Since those people have been spreading misinformation let’s keep up the trend.

Chorazin.4107:

Hmmm he says, rubbing his chin.

So i can drop my continuum split(CS), blink forward and then illusionary leap to my target. Thus breaking my CS tether and never porting back to my original CS point and never refreshing any of my skills.

You are part of the Anet balance team right?

Exactly, this is how I view all the Complainers saying Thief is OP unkillable killing machine that’s braindead easy, anyone can make outrageous claims right that don’t fit the actual mehanics. That’s how all the complainers are, stating that a Thief can everything and never lose against any class and kill any class, with seeming no costs and ignoring all the facts, that’s why I ask those complainers to post videos to prove their complaints.

And again you and OriOri asked how to Blink Twice Without Mimic and I did tell you how, how effective it is is a completely different matter.

right now the only person that has complained but with a semi valid point has been Xenesis with Ghost Thief and how it should not be a thing, even though it isn’t OP it is one of the most stupidest things Anet has allowed to stay in the game.

You guys seem to forget my stance on the whole matter, Every single class has braindead and Op aspects, the majority of which were introduced with HoT, every single class needs to be nerfed especially the Elite Specs, all passive defenses need to be removed from the game and all classes need to not be able to Attack while in an Invulnerable state. But until they nerf all Classes at the same time it is absolutely pointless to point fingers at any one class since right now every class has braindead OP builds/aspects. there are a few other things that need to be nerfed/changed as well but those are the bigger points.

Chorazin.4107:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Did I say chase potential in any of my posts in regards to Chorizan or OriOri? No I did not they were complaining about No mobility now Continuum Split can be used in conjunction with Blink (guess what you can out run the Tether so it doesn’t port you back all the way to the Continuum Split which still increase the Travel distance on any Skill it resets but hey what do I know) they asked how can you double Blink without Mimic I told them, simple as that.

Wait, where are the mobility riches that were promised to me Blaquefyre? WHERE!!11

Please demonstrate how i can run out of the tether range of my continuum split, sounds almost as plausible as running out of alimony range.

You asked how to double Blink without Mimic I showed you Use CS, to break Tether range all you need to do is Use a second port skill after Blink like idk say About face phase retreat or sword 3 on an Ambient or Enemy you know thinking outside the box. Since you know it doesn’t port you back completely to CS mote if you out Range it

apharma.3741:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

@OriOri and Chorizan
If only there was another skill that allows you to use skills multiple times… if you can’t figure these things out on your own…. need I say?

I hope for your own sake you aren’t meaning continuum shift as it teleports you back to your original location. Given that we were discussing chase potential when you mentioned triple blinking it makes that a moot point and it’s also a moot point using it for escape unless someone is dumb enough to chase you when then mote is up.

Mimic is the only way to use blink multiple times to effectively chase and any mesmer that is using mimic will be either giving up decoy, mantra of distraction or portal for it, all of which are more useful either in combat, for disengage or chasing. Well MoD if you’re playing domination so it stuns instead of dazes but I don’t often see people playing domination now.

At least The Cabbage came up with genuine skills actually used by mesmers and phase retreat is great for running away. Illusionary leap is only slightly faster than running the distance flat but great for Z axis mobility on the few occasions it is useable.

Also can you stop making claims against people that they haven’t actually made? I mean if you genuinely think daredevil is high risk high reward go play sceptre ele, any form of power reaper, core spec or non meta builds. I mean you did say above not everyone follows the meta right? So it shouldn’t be that difficult for you.

Also I like how you ask everyone for proof on thier claims while only a few posts later say you’re not obligated to show how you can triple blink without mimic, the amount of double standards and poor debating from you and Turk is very high.

Did I say chase potential in any of my posts in regards to Chorizan or OriOri? No I did not they were complaining about No mobility now Continuum Split can be used in conjunction with Blink (guess what you can out run the Tether so it doesn’t port you back all the way to the Continuum Split which still increase the Travel distance on any Skill it resets but hey what do I know) they asked how can you double Blink without Mimic I told them, simple as that, and if you read back I was the original person to mention Phase retreat and other options to use as added mobility, built into weapons but hey I guess reading’s hard.

and lastly I am not calling for nerfs or complaining about Mesmer stating it is an Unkillable OP killing machine that’s easy to use, I have nothing to backup there now do I? No I was stating skill uses, pretty simple go ahaead go back and read all my comments, I asked the people complaining about how Thief is an Unkillable OP killing machine that is Braindead easy to play to prove it, since they are let just stating skill uses, they need to provide proof see the difference?

If Thief is as Unkillable OP Braindead Easy and a killing machine and wins every matchup then it shouldn’t be hard for the complainers to prove it by posting a video of them destroying everyone they come across in WvW now would it? Or are the Complainers going to make up some excuse for why they can’t?

Xenesis.6389:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Still not you proving how easy and OP Thief is at being unkillable and killing every one easily like all the complainers keep saying. /popcorn ready

I have to go make a video for an argument I never brought up? ok keep waiting.

Stealth is broken pos mechanic that’s my opinion, not that thieves are op unkillable machines that’s your words. If you’re that desperate for entertainment for your popcorn go look up youtube.

Did I ever say you specifically calling Thief Unkillable, OP killing machines? Nope, I said complainers there are quite a few in this thread saying they are unkillable and win every match up…. go ahead and go read every statement I was quite clear.

I only asked for each complainer to post videos showcasing their complaints and how easy and braindead each is… you complain about the Ghost thief I asked you to show how easy and braindead easy it is to kill people…. shocker.

@OriOri and Chorizan
If only there was another skill that allows you to use skills multiple times… if you can’t figure these things out on your own…. need I say?

Caedmon.6798:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Caedmon.6798:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Headshot isn’t unblockable, Basi Venom is unblockable but has 40 sec CD so is not spammable, boils down to l2p issue, so many counters in game, Projectile hate, Blocks, Stability, Invulns, dodges, get out of range…. the list goes on.

Hes talking about Pulmonary,not the interrupt in itself where pulmonary gets activated after it.Reading is hard eh.

See how OP states spammable 900 range unblockable interrupt, He is most definitely referring to Headshot with it, the Only spammable interrupted Thief has is Headshot which guess what PI doesn’t Proc if you counterplay Headshot. Reading must be very hard eh. Smh people.

Auroraborealis.7310:

Pulmonary Impact is overpowered. Spam-able AND unblock-able interrupt from 900 unit range with decent damage? Yeah no thanks, nerf this cancer!!

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Pulmonary_Impact_

See how he never uses the word Headshot ? Eh ?

See how he refers to PI as a spammable unblockable interrupt from 900 range? eh?

Xenesis.6389:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

I’m not the one saying how OP,easy,unkillable it is so why would I posts videos? So the burden of proof is all on the complainers to showcase how OP, Easy, Unkillable it is while steamrolling like most complainers in this thread have been saying. So chop chop people. Popcorn is ready

Here you go

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Ghost-Thief-Gameplay-Tier-1/first

/munches on popcorn

Still not you proving how easy and OP Thief is at being unkillable and killing every one easily like all the complainers keep saying. /popcorn ready

Xenesis.6389:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Ah that post you linked Xenesis only shows bass not knowing how to use a Condi cleanse or to not stay and fight, again show a video of you playing Thief and show casing how braindead easy and OP it is steam rolling all classes like the complainers say it can, so to the complainers, show yourself steamrolling everyone easily in even fights on Thief.

Lol first you want to discount the multiple video proof of brain dead easy killing with a thief, and then you want me to make a video for you on a class that’s like bottom of the list for my alts. How about I only manage to play this game 2 hours a week on reset these days and not going to waste my time playing on an alt making a video for you. I’ve played every class in the game, not exactly hard to play them if you do some research and learn a class.

Never said they steamrolled all classes, just that stealth mechanic and it’s counters in this game is one of the dumbest ever implemented into a game, them being able to the do the damage that they can while in stealth is ridiculous.

Now how about you make a video for us on hard it is to play a thief since it’s your main.

I’m not the one saying how OP,easy,unkillable it is so why would I posts videos? So the burden of proof is all on the complainers to showcase how OP, Easy, Unkillable it is while steamrolling like most complainers in this thread have been saying. So chop chop people. Popcorn is ready

Ah that post you linked Xenesis only shows bass not knowing how to use a Condi cleanse or to not stay and fight, again show a video of you playing Thief and show casing how braindead easy and OP it is steam rolling all classes like the complainers say it can, so to the complainers, show yourself steamrolling everyone easily in even fights on Thief.

And Chorizan you may not run those but plenty of people do, not everyone blindly follows Meta Battle and they don’t need to use Mimic to double blink or Use other ports/mobility again if you can’t figure out how to maximize the class or build to what you want isn’t my problem and I am not obligated to show you.

Caedmon.6798:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Headshot isn’t unblockable, Basi Venom is unblockable but has 40 sec CD so is not spammable, boils down to l2p issue, so many counters in game, Projectile hate, Blocks, Stability, Invulns, dodges, get out of range…. the list goes on.

Hes talking about Pulmonary,not the interrupt in itself where pulmonary gets activated after it.Reading is hard eh.

See how OP states spammable 900 range unblockable interrupt, He is most definitely referring to Headshot with it, the Only spammable interrupted Thief has is Headshot which guess what PI doesn’t Proc if you counterplay Headshot. Reading must be very hard eh. Smh people.

Auroraborealis.7310:

Pulmonary Impact is overpowered. Spam-able AND unblock-able interrupt from 900 unit range with decent damage? Yeah no thanks, nerf this cancer!!

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Pulmonary_Impact_

Still hearing all this talk of how OP Thief is and how it dominates all other classes in WvW but no one is showing any proof of how braindead easy and OP it is killing all other classes on sight. So come on people prove to us how OP and oppressive Thief is post your gameplay vids.

Headshot isn’t unblockable, Basi Venom is unblockable but has 40 sec CD so is not spammable, boils down to l2p issue, so many counters in game, Projectile hate, Blocks, Stability, Invulns, dodges, get out of range…. the list goes on.

These are definitely interesting ideas, my take on fixing OH Dagger would be Lower cast time of CnD to 1/4 Sec and increase the Stealth to 5 secs base and increase the Area of the attack(not the range). Dancing dagger would add 3 secs of Weakness on top of the Cripple.

The CnD change would make it more consistent, and more meaning full to setup Stealth Attacks.

The Dancing Dagger change would provide Dancing Dagger to have a more beneficial use which allows Thieves to stick on target since no real Ranged attack options with OH Dagger.

Chorazin.4107:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Just because players are bad doesn’t mean Mesmers don’t have semi highmobility, that isn’t a design flaw that’s just players being bad……

Where is this “semi high mobility” you speak of? That one blink every 30seconds that is quite often used as your stun break? Disengage is != mobility, mesmers do have decent access to disengage if they load up on some stealth options or trait PU. They do not have decent mobility to chase.

For mobility you might outrun a DH or Nero but i think it would be close vs a DH. Simply by virtue of wings, JI, SoB.

All HoT classes could still use some serious nerf bat love compared to their base counterparts. Zerkers, DD’s and condi chronos probably are the stand outs to be toned down.

But it looks like Anet will just be throwing WvW in with the PvE crowd so dont hold your breath on the small scale/solo format ever being remotely balanced. You want better balanced 1v1’s go to PvP where active class balancing is a thing.

It’s been explained how they have semi high mobility not doing it again, if someone hasn’t got it by this time…

And again Mesmers don’t need High mobility and Disengage to sustain/survive….between their Blocks, heals, Invulns but Mesmer does have some semi high mobility on top of their normal defenses. But I forget the people I am speaking with

OriOri.8724:

I agree, all elite specs do need to be nerfed. Does that change the fact that being able to disengage at will and be out of reach for most classes on top of having an overly high amount of dodges and evades when you do stay for a fight is broken?

And I don’t know how you think mesmer can catch up with thief. They can triple blink once every 75 seconds as a chrono, yet a lot of mesmers are just plain bad and can’t pull that off. Aside from that its 1 blink every 30 seconds, plus about-face + phase retreat. But again a lot of mesmers are not very good and can’t figure that combination out. And even if they could its not enough to keep up with a thief that wants to get away.

Just because players are bad doesn’t mean Mesmers don’t have semi highmobility, that isn’t a design flaw that’s just players being bad……

And again a Mesmers don’t need super high mobility since they are capable of other types of sustain/mitigation while dealing significant damage, again something you seem to try to leave out of your comparisons betweenThief and other classes.

OriOri.8724:

reddie.5861:

OriOri.8724:

Snip

Snipples .

Specifically in regards to this line. If a thief’s defense centers around running away and resetting a fight when it goes south that is perfectly fine. What is not fine is when this is his defensive option, and yet when he does choose to engage he still has so many dodges and evades that your frames to attack him are already smaller than against most other classes. On other classes that have high uptimes on blocks or invulns they don’t have the mobility that thief does to run away from a fight if it goes south. Is a thief’s defense in his ability to reset at will or dodge and evade? Because having excessive amounts of both is a problem. If it was one or the other then it would be better. Also, every defense in this game should have a counter. Blocks are countered by unblockable attacks and condis. Resistance is countered by power damage. Invuln are short and most of them also prevent capture point contribution. Etc etc… Yet thief’s ability to disengage is so powerful that very few builds can even hope to catch up to them once the thief decides to run. That is also a problem. Thief being able to run is fine. But it does need to be toned down ever so slightly. It should be possible for more classes to catch up to thief. It shouldn’t be easy for them, they should have to burn some CDs and have built for mobility to do so, but it should be possible for more builds to chase thief at least semi-effectively.

The other classes as you wanted to compare have more passive sustain through passive healing sustain through Boons or traits, high block uptimes, better healing, Invulnerabilities, but yes leave out all of their forms of sustain, the only class that doesn’t have any of those is Reaper, they “give” up mobility for those higher uptime of sustain and passives, while Thief has Evades and Mobility to mitigate damage and Stealth to drop target( doesn’t stop Damage from getting through so not actually a damage mitigation).

But the ridiculous Sustain passive and active has reached stupid levels and needs to be nerfed across the bored and they need to remove all the safe damages every class’ have and make it so players can’t attack/damage while Invulnerable/Evading. And the need to remove all Passive Defenses since they only promote braindead gameplay and reward failing to properly evade/stop attacks or Cc.

And people act like Thief is miles ahead of other classes in mobility which is a farce, Druid, Warrior and Mesmer aren’t far behind Thief in mobility, Thief just has better Verticle Mobility and can burn more resources for mobility, at the huge expense of Damage and versatility, since to have that mobility means burning Initiative and Long CDs and Dodges… which people fail to realize all are costs and unlike every other classes Thieves share Weapon CDs across both Weapons and all skills, not having separate CDs like everyone else.

But meh a lot of people just need to L2P

And if Thief is so easy and OP one of you complainers post Videos of you dominating every player you come across to prove how easy/Op/Braindead Thief is.