Guild Wars 2

So why is this unique to the Druid/Ranger when the Guardian has been rolled out as a support class / hybrid?

To further clarify is it the expansion pack / HoT raids that brought this requirement on and Druid was set as the default Healer?

I mean I understand the expansion pack and raid content and idea behind agro, some tanking requirements and now healing. But are the raids going to require people to target heal ala other MMO’s primary healer roles? Or, are we talking about we are gearing and dodging and triggering AoE type heals without the single target ability?

The way the game has evolved since launch it does not appear to me that there has been any success in trying to remove Zerk play and/or gearing. Agony has not seemed to help Fractals.

Enter more class complaints and balance issues that other MMO’s encounter due to raids. So called “first” vale guardian kill was made up of zerker stats, 4 engi’s, 3 revenants, 1 druid, 1 chronomancer, 1 warrior…

Beta, yeah. Launch around the corner I don’t see this being cleared up and I’m not even talking about sPvP, Duid, healing, and WvW…

I’ll be honest here, I don’t get why the Druid would take on a group heal role when we have the Guardian which seems more geared towards it by its very design. I’m talking symbols, shield, staff, mace, and heavy armor.

Enter druid, and, well I guess I can see the lore in the fantasy space although they also seem to remind me nothing more than hippies, gypsies, and, well, tree huggers (no disrespect to the environmentalist out there, power to the people!).

I didn’t play GW1 so if this is the reference than the issue is me just being ignorant but from a WvW point of view I’m comparing the Druid, group support, to that of my Guardian. And it seems we have almost merged the two together, intended? I mean both have staff, both heal, both seem to do group oriented support.

Someone throw me a piece of bark or bone so I get this. First couple minutes out in WvW with staff and it just doesn’t feel right – probably by design.

Ranger personal bias aside, there should be no surprise to the reaction by the company. We can kitten and moan about it all we want but we know at the end of the day this wasn’t intended so they acted. Right or wrong, those are the cards dealt to us.

So the question to the community is rather simple. Continue to play or put up and shut up by changing class or games. That is really the only information and action they will see and act on. I mean no rangers in the game someone will at some point in time ask why. Same with the various tournaments. What, no rangers? Again, light bulb will light up and someone will ask why…

This game has been unbalanced, or perceived to be unbalanced (insert class biasness here), for kitten near a year. During this time their focus has been on HoT and with it right around the corner plus a final beta, there is nothing here that leads me to believe they have time or resources to do anything other than knee jerk reaction.

Sadly, the questions everyone should raise is why does this sort of bug still make it out of their shop?

Is it HoT priority?
Is it crappy QA, no QA, 1 pass of QA, Automation, etc?

Just about every patch has had glaring bugs of late whereas before yeah, some but nothing to this degree. I mean really? Login, daily, log out, change character, log back in, complete daily, rinse and repeat. That isn’t an exploit? People abused that, and that is actually a kitten glaring bug. Fixed, sure. Did you both to take away all the phat loot people received?

Point of ramble is this. Cards dealt. Deal with it or throw and fold, move on.

EnderzShadow.2506:

Crapgame.6519:

EnderzShadow.2506:

Crapgame.6519:

Traps are fine the way they are, I run them in WvW and prefer the post 23rd change.

They work solo, they work in small groups, and they work in zergs when timed properly. Borderland maps they excel or areas that confine space. If you are still having issues after the change then maybe it is how you use them – not being a poo head, just saying.

At first I didn’t like them but after about a week or so I adjusted and couldn’t seem them working any differently now. Besides, you had to trait for it prior to the patch anyway so this gives you a trait point back.

We aren’t talking about WvW. And while I’m glad you like them, I don’t think they are ideal. I’d give up weapon swap if I could get a few utilities and the traps counting as weapons.

OP-I fully understand where you are coming from. This last week I played the hell out of a condi trapper build. I solo qued, duo qued and ran full 5 with friends in Rated.

Sometimes it was amazing, sometimes it just sucked. Being a one man condi bomb is amazing. Having one heal and zero utilities makes the trapper soft. The trapper is slow moving and doesn’t have stealth, blocks or immunes.

Having to drop the traps in a big fight is where I am MOST valuable and it is also where I am most vulnerable. It eems like a conflicted proposition.
Necros can do this and still tank the kitten out of people.

The more organized/meta the group we are fighting is, the more weaknesses the trapper showed. I really saw this to be true when I played my EU account, where our EU GW2 brethren love the crap out of the holy cheese that is the META.

After looking at the meta, I really think ranger is missing something that other classes that fill the meta have. We don’t have the tankiness, the stealth, the heals, the immunes, the movement effects and the cd on spike trap is too long.

Can’t use the runes in sPvP so that leaves WvW/PvE.

People like them the way they are now just as much as people hate them. Just adapt or don’t use them. We don’t need them to be kits, weapons, or anything else.

Nobody is talking about runes and no one is talking about WvW.

No, but they are talking about “traps” and the post 23rd patch that changed how they work. They are connected even if you don’t connect the dots because they are used in each of the formats of play to include the use of runes.

Hammerguard.9834:

Crapgame.6519:

Hammerguard.9834:

Honestly, I’m still playing this trapper ranger and I just can’t get over how annoying it is to have to stand inside players bodies to get these stupid things off. I’m so sick of Anet balancing the game without thinking about what’s actually fun. Throwing traps was fun. You threw them into the area you wanted to fight, then jumped in with them for a fun condi arena.

Anet, please. This is a video game.

I don’t get this comment. You don’t have to stand inside the players bodies. They are not like that. Traps are used to herd, guide, kite, the enemy into. Not on top of… You and your team know where they are. They are to prevent, and alert, and reset the fight, “as well as” damage.

They are not grenades, nets, or boomerangs. You place them and then dance. I run 4 and enjoy spike trap the most.

Trapper ranger can’t be played like this, though. Most classes can get you below 50% before they even get within range to trigger a trap, and with the sacrificed defenses to even slot traps you’re forced to get your traps on your opponent to basically burst them down before they can burst you down. Trapper rangers can’t afford waiting around for opponents to walk on their traps.

So now, in a scenario where the trapper is forced to walk over to an enemy player, they also have to spend 1.5 seconds literally dancing around them to finally get traps activated. At this point the trapper just hopes that the enemy player sits in the traps long enough to make all the effort worth it, which in most cases isn’t worth it. Trying to get on a power ranger with a trapper ranger for example is an absolute nightmare.

Maybe. But this is just a subjective argument really and it isn’t my way or the highway. With regards to my play style I just don’t see them to be a burden by not being able to toss them. I run LB, axe, and torch – maybe that is it. Or, maybe it is the server I run on with regards to WvW.

They give me speed, they provide stealth. I have equal range with LB, and have good melee with axe/torch. Conditions are fine and I can reset/move as needed. I will say the pet not going to stealth at the same time you drop a trap gives our direction a way 90% of the time but even that doesn’t really make them bad.

EnderzShadow.2506:

Crapgame.6519:

Traps are fine the way they are, I run them in WvW and prefer the post 23rd change.

They work solo, they work in small groups, and they work in zergs when timed properly. Borderland maps they excel or areas that confine space. If you are still having issues after the change then maybe it is how you use them – not being a poo head, just saying.

At first I didn’t like them but after about a week or so I adjusted and couldn’t seem them working any differently now. Besides, you had to trait for it prior to the patch anyway so this gives you a trait point back.

We aren’t talking about WvW. And while I’m glad you like them, I don’t think they are ideal. I’d give up weapon swap if I could get a few utilities and the traps counting as weapons.

OP-I fully understand where you are coming from. This last week I played the hell out of a condi trapper build. I solo qued, duo qued and ran full 5 with friends in Rated.

Sometimes it was amazing, sometimes it just sucked. Being a one man condi bomb is amazing. Having one heal and zero utilities makes the trapper soft. The trapper is slow moving and doesn’t have stealth, blocks or immunes.

Having to drop the traps in a big fight is where I am MOST valuable and it is also where I am most vulnerable. It eems like a conflicted proposition.
Necros can do this and still tank the kitten out of people.

The more organized/meta the group we are fighting is, the more weaknesses the trapper showed. I really saw this to be true when I played my EU account, where our EU GW2 brethren love the crap out of the holy cheese that is the META.

After looking at the meta, I really think ranger is missing something that other classes that fill the meta have. We don’t have the tankiness, the stealth, the heals, the immunes, the movement effects and the cd on spike trap is too long.

Can’t use the runes in sPvP so that leaves WvW/PvE.

People like them the way they are now just as much as people hate them. Just adapt or don’t use them. We don’t need them to be kits, weapons, or anything else.

Hammerguard.9834:

Honestly, I’m still playing this trapper ranger and I just can’t get over how annoying it is to have to stand inside players bodies to get these stupid things off. I’m so sick of Anet balancing the game without thinking about what’s actually fun. Throwing traps was fun. You threw them into the area you wanted to fight, then jumped in with them for a fun condi arena.

Anet, please. This is a video game.

I don’t get this comment. You don’t have to stand inside the players bodies. They are not like that. Traps are used to herd, guide, kite, the enemy into. Not on top of… You and your team know where they are. They are to prevent, and alert, and reset the fight, “as well as” damage.

They are not grenades, nets, or boomerangs. You place them and then dance. I run 4 and enjoy spike trap the most.

Traps are fine the way they are, I run them in WvW and prefer the post 23rd change.

They work solo, they work in small groups, and they work in zergs when timed properly. Borderland maps they excel or areas that confine space. If you are still having issues after the change then maybe it is how you use them – not being a poo head, just saying.

At first I didn’t like them but after about a week or so I adjusted and couldn’t seem them working any differently now. Besides, you had to trait for it prior to the patch anyway so this gives you a trait point back.

I don’t know, it is hit or miss but I usually see at least one other ranger most games. As someone said, they are typically LB focused but I see others. In fact, when they come across me they usually kitten a brick because I’m running a sustain / double melee build that totally throws them off. So the dialog starts after the came and idle chit chat follows – which is good.

To be honest I mostly play unranked and it is a toss up of who you are going to get. When I queue up with friends that is typically when I bust out the LB because I’m the primary damage dealer on the /assist. So in that case speed kills

I think maybe ranked you would find fewer of other classes because of the meta and/or favorites. But open/unranked, I think rangers are well represented.

Tragic Positive.9356:

One way or another, if my predictions come true and Rangers will end up as nothing else but a thrown-out piece of forgotten scrap that no one likes to wear but ANet likes, I’ll definitely be sending my love letters to developers.

While I still keep falling in love with the game, I’m slowly but definitely becoming too desperate with our class to enjoy such a great game.
Not as a concept. But as a mechanic they always keep ignoring till the very last moment, pretending they don’t.
Everyone else gets the attention. DH traps is just yet another example. Rangers get noticed only if they have some nice stuff (double leap from GS was intended for 3 years. It stopped being intended a few weeks ago when it made some builds viable. No auras were doubled, it only worked on proccing effects from which Water Field is almost the only that could – Explanation behind the fix? It was Bugged. Case closed for lack of evidence.)

From what I have played so far of the DH we have nothing to worry about.

Besides, we don’t even know what the Druid has in store You know what they say, right? Good things come to those who wait

Lazze.9870:

Crapgame.6519:

Anyway – Give the guardians a break – first two beta weekends the LB was bad. Just bad.

And they should obviously make it so the DH is in a good place. But it’s still funny being on the sideline and finally see other players complaining about the same stuff.

Yeah, when I see it from that side, you guys/gals do have a point. I’m a small bit biased cuz I’ve a guardian since head start and can admit it. Then again, once I switched to the ranger I actually enjoy it 10 times better. I think if supporting roles are a bit more defined in the GW2 format of play I’d like it more, but I just find the Ranger fun when I play well.

But yeah, I see the point, and irony

Tragic Positive.9356:

Greetings everybody. As I usually do, I got bored with my previous build thus I decided to get back to my former build I enjoyed the most. The Beast Master.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQRAnY8fnUqAtCi1CCWsActgBMhyX8F4x/bYVj8eZ70A4gJfeA-TJxHwAOLDI4kAob/BAPBAA

I made a few tweaks here and there and ended up with an incredibly interesting idea. An incredibly tough Bunker.

Pros:
- almost immune to condis
- almost immortal pet
- incredibly high Direct damage mitigation
- access to stability for safe stomping
- access to instant 20 might (Drake + SotP combo)
- doesn’t have a counter and counters thieves and mesmers

Cons:
- damage output is low compared to his other BM brethren
- CC and disruption is lower when compared to other builds.

Goal of this build is simple. Grant your team swiftness before the gate opens – rush close and enjoy 1 held point until the end of the game. This build is able to hold it’s ground against 2 people for a considerable amount of time regardless of their profession or build – buying your team more than enough time to help you and kill them or secure every other point.

Pets do not really have much problem dealing damage since their movement is higher than the one of a player and sword + Winter’s bite does the job to slow them down for pet to land the attacks.

For all those Beast Mastery enthusiasts – I hope you’ll have a good time hunting. Cheers!

I run a similar build in sPvP – not mine, forget who posted it but it uses the celestial amulet and axe/dagger with sword torch. It is point holder but personally I find melee builds, especially double melee, very hard to master. I say this with utter respect for those of you who do play them in sPvP and WvW. I consider myself ok, but still see myself learning daily.

May have to give it a whirl since it is close. I run krait/celestial you are running solider / settler. Almost exact same traits plus or minus a few to support TU, lightning reflex, signet of the wild, guard, and entangle.

Gives me something to try – will do and thanks for sharing.

Well, if you played the Guardian during the beta’s you would know that the long bow is sort okittenward right now. I’ve tried it both times so far and while it has some really strong points overall it is weak. 9 out of 10 times I feel like I am playing duck hunter with it by leading the enemy. Not a bad thing I guess but it isn’t any form of sure fire / guarantee that it actually lands On the other hand when LB 5 does land it seemed a bit over powered / over the top and can see it toned down

Depending on the meta of play symbols are not really smooth operators. PvE and Raids I think they will be perfectly fine. I don’t do fractals much but when I did, symbols are fine. Roaming in sPvP or WvW symbols are not very attractive and 99% of the time in large scale WvW they just are ignored or have no used due to the speed…

I see traps falling into this category based on what I played so far. Then again running them in the ruins like I do on my ranger, well, they have potential due to map layout. Traps are fine with the Ranger as they are post 23rd patch. Just a different play style in my opinion and feel they are still super strong with a good build. I’d almost say a crutch but would be interested to see how other trap rangers make use of them.

Anyway – Give the guardians a break – first two beta weekends the LB was bad. Just bad.

BL maps are pretty good for roaming especially around the ruin area. One of my favorite places to roam when the daily involves capturing them.

Obsidian Sanctum used to be a great place before they removed the poi’s for map complete / legendary items.. Mystic forge, traps, varying heights, and jumps made it a great place with high activity.

Arena net does not really know what to do with the format nor will probably until mid to late 2016 when CU is out. Depending how it goes I’d wager most of the true WvW crowd will move to that game. At least for a month or two. If it is anything like retail launch of DaOC then GW2/WvW will be defunct.

Everyone knows, even a.net, that WvW has been left idle since launch. Autopilot for the win…

Quarktastic.1027:

Sonickeyblade.8415:

This is a sad state of affairs.

I remember the Pet Name bug being an issue back when the game first released. I just figured they COULDN’T fix it. Not wouldn’t.

As Ranger is my favorite class/profession, I am disappointed that it’s doing so badly. No communication, not acknowledgement of the problem(s), no attempts to finish it…

It’s like a wildfire that has been burning for 3 years. How is that even possible? And I feel bad. I thought Anet had good communication with its players as I’ve only been back to the game for 2 months after a year+ hiatus. That is not the case however.

Our only hope is that Druid comes with an overhaul for the entire profession… but I don’t see that as likely… and I don’t think anyone does.

The pet name issue is something I have never seen in any MMO that has a dedicated pet class. My ranger has been my main since launch, but after playing the whirling god of death that is the reaper, I’m fast becoming a necromancer convert.

Most probably will. It currently has a lot going for it.

And…it has made a few rounds/passes in beta.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Eurantien.4632:

I imagine it would be an unnecessary waste of server space to save 45 pet names for each ranger character. If they say they have sold 5 million copies of the game and we have seen stats before that ranger is one of the most popular classes (as in people have them) then we can almost assume that they would have to save 5 million x 45 names. Granted there are some people who won’t have a ranger or won’t name all their pets, but on the other hand you have people, like myself, who have 4 rangers. Its a waste of space, who cares? It shouldn’t even be mentioned in an article like this.

Just save the names on the client side in a .txt file, then check them for length and language on pet change.

Not that it takes up much space anyway… 5,000,000 (accounts) x 45 (pets) x 15 (characters per name) = 3,375,000,000 bytes, divided by 1024 (Kb)/ 1024 (Mb) /1024 (Gb) = 3.14Gb. I have offered to pay for a USB stick ANet can store these names on previously, that offer still stands

I’m pretty sure you know this but enterprise disk space isn’t that cheap nor is it as simple as tossing Arena Net a USB stick or other form of external storage…

Having played a Guardian for most of my time in GW2, since heard start, I tend to feel it is the bottom dweller and find more enjoyment on the Ranger lately. However, this is really subjective. What I do know is that if you are not playing a Elementalist then it really doesn’t matter because we are al fighting for the bottom tier. ..

One thing that isn’t helping the player base is lack of competition. There really isn’t a game with similar mechanics with regards to WvW. Sure, there are games with so called battle grounds but there is a pretty hefty player base that likes the three way fighting not seen since DaOC. Free to play, one time purchase, can walk away at any time, pretty casual, and reasonable performance make it sort of stand out and sustain a player base. Subbing for WoW or any of the other launches until they fail and become free to play isn’t interesting outside probably SWtOR.

Personal opinion until we get something that catches our attention and plays similarly this is what we got and it is up to each person to decide when it is time to hang up the mouse…

Just depends on where you use the traps. My opinion and I’ve said it before, is that they are OP. But my opinion isn’t something that I’m going to push on anyone else, just how I feel about it based on my play style within WvW.

Borderland maps have so many choke points that traps can turn any fight into your favor even when out numbered. Since most players, on average, heck even 90th percentile, continue to chase and/or push for the kill traps always will get them in the end. Duck around a step, drop a trap, engage, rinse, repeat. Hop off ledge, run around wall, up stairs, drop trap, punt off ledge to their death, rinse repeat. I can’t count how many times, every day, even after facing the same tier group for 5 weeks now, this works.

Honestly speaking, I love it when the master of ruin daily pops up, always means good times to be had. Also traps can and do work within small group play and add value. Flipping NPC’s such as dredge again with control points in the hallways – traps have strong success when facing greater numbers.

So maybe not OP, but they sure in the heck are great fun and work wonders in the BL map area or other choke point areas. And I for one am looking towards the new map in which case they look even more promising.

Probably won’t be as viable come HoT since that is why it is the way it is now, just my opinion. Then again I don’t see the build has anything exceptionally OP. Especially if you have spent any time playing one then switching classes. I know on my Ranger this build doesn’t phase me one way or another. And in PvP I have enough sustain to just outlast them so wear them out.

There are always exceptional players who can play naked and make a build seem OP. I’m not one of those but do see people who are…

You ever consider swapping shield with focus? Mace / Focus seem to flow better. Also you have trooper runes for condi cleansing – ever consider defender runes? Those are typically what I run anyway when in groups and playing the supporting role.

Seems like the shield is more of a modifier than an actual “use/block” weapon. I like it, just doesn’t seem to fit the supporting play style.

Belzebu.3912:

Firstly, I know you are dyslexic, but you could use a dictionary in your browser to indicate the errors, since english isn’t my mother language, I fix small errors with it.

Secondly, if you put your pet on passive it won’t aggro anything, so you can walk among mobs w/o problems, but all in all a permanent stow would be nice for JPs and some dungeon mob skipping situations.

Ignoring the dyslexic comment some people just don’t want the pet. Plain and simple.

Furthermore there is nothing more frustrating than using Trapper runes and having the enemy just follow the pet to know which direction you are heading. No more than me following said person/stealth class with their stupid pets that follow them.

Maybe the Ranger pet is part of the Ranger’s meta, maybe not. Would be nice though to have a trait line to support pets (beast master comes to mind) and those trait lines that take the estimated damage / support from pet and place into that trait line…

I don’t know, seems common sense to me and something I would have done from day one but then again that is just me.

Edit: Yes, one can stow the pet, but why? Or just fix the broken or ill through out trapper runes with pets and stealth. Still, I don’t want a pet and I don’t want to play another class…so check mate.

I run a non standard trapper / condition build when in a group. Same build more or less for solo roaming. Suits my play style whereas I can fire from behind, spread out, drop a trap, stealth behind them, drop a few more traps, then engage. Always throws them off thinking someone is flanking them.

Regardless of build Rangers just need to know when to stay at range and assist to finish and melee when frisky. Had a good fight the other day exiting NPC/Dredge towards Wild Creek and Rogues camp. 2 of us are Rangers and a random Necro held the hallway / corridor for several minutes while the enemy just kept working their way through. Traps helped as did the Necro. Both of us Rangers just moved in and out of range and melee engagement to hold them off. Pug Guardian entered and did his soft CC’s and soon it was the 4 of us vs 15.

Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t. Builds help but just get friendly with your Ranger and it won’t matter what you run or gear. Also I found watching other Rangers what they do and how they play helps ten fold. People are just better.

Whatever you do, have fun

Someone always has to be a troll. But hey, might as well make the day exciting.

What we do know is that it is a specific play style that you either like or don’t. It works for some, me for example, and others not so much. Works with double melee weapons, long bow, and short bow. Works in zergs, works solo, and works on HAVOC. This is my opinion and only for WvW.

It has changed since the 23rd patch but they are not broke by any means. In fact I’m one of the few who say they are a bit on the OP side of things (my opinion) and work better post patch. I like that you set them now rather than lob.

And dancing in the ruins has never been as much fun. They excel on some maps with regards to area of play.

Is what it is. Outside of being slow the big issue I had with it is skill 5.

It reminded me of hunting birds in that you need to lead the target and shoot. It was slow and bulky for lack of a better word. By the end of the night the enemy caught on what it was and timed their dodges better.

It was beta. They have already made changes. I’ll bet an adult beverage or soda if under age that there will be more after then next round. Bound to happen.

The bow is slow, back on par with what Rangers had upon retail launch. CC 5 is too strong but you have to time it right – sort of like hunting a duck – you lead it. Only issue with this is dodge…

Tried Mace/Focus + LB and it was so – so. Traps are nice but again the fast pace of WvW does not seem to fit traps. Then again I play a trapper Ranger so I sort of got used to the play style and they started to perform. Group had to adjust because they didn’t really notice them until I said LOOK, I AM PLACING TRAPS HERE…then they started to work ok.

Problem right now is trying to find a reasonable build that will work with the weapon (Long Bow) and traps. I also tried GS with LB which seemed to work a lot better. Honestly, I’d almost say if I was allowed to use trapper runes the stealth and speed would have been pretty interesting but not on par with how they work on Rangers.

Next iteration will be telling but the changes today mean they are at least watching and/or listening to whatever feedback is provided.

Here is the build I run most of the time when I’m roaming in WvW. If I am with a party roaming I will usually swap to Long Bow. More often than not it is solo play scouting and flipping camps/NPC’s with a bit of hitting things to draw attention away. This is by no means the perfect build and/or set up but it is what works for me. I should also say that I’ll run wolf/spider for pets but I have bird in this case.

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-J;4wEFy-v2oEF-0-3JEFu-e27F-0E;1Z_a;0257146137;4KsG1V;1mAjwmAjw20km0-PgJWL4pz91f3A6f8ABfLuVIF310;4c0-PcW5P;9;9;9;9;7V6s5k

I’m also working on a Celestial ascended armor set now for a double melee build that should also work with this or give me room to play with some of the other builds to fit how I play.

Unless the bow gets buffed on the Dragon Hunter, I don’t think there is much Rangers have to worry about. Also no one was able to play rangers new toys, so who knows.

Having played the DH in WvW I’ll say it was low. Traps seemed to work but again, slow. Best long bow skill was 5. However, it is a lot like shooting a duck or any other moving object. It is so slow that you have to lead the target to get the proper CC.

Longbow 5 is great though and when it hits, is amazing. Didn’t get to try trapper runes. Didn’t really figure out a solid build to make it work. Tried Mace/Focus with Long Bow – support hybrid. Didn’t like it, was too slow. Tried LB with GS. Ok, not too bad but again LB is slow or missed.

Needs some more work but I think we are good.

Sube Dai.8496:

The broken soldier runes mean you arnt providing much support.

That being the case I am playing this a bit more selfishly with tu and entangle. This is closer to the original condi survival build anyway, but has more sustain:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQRAnY8fnEqAtsgVsA+CCUtghMhqT2A4A+aIVnYPxTgGfANA-TZRHABBcEAA4kAEy+DHVGI4HAAA

Traited TU is an amazing heal in a regen build. You’re healing for 1.1k per second and clearing 2 conditions.

This build is a legitimate point holder.

I don’t play ranked but I will say the build does a pretty good job in unranked play. Also if you are in a group with people you know or on vent, it is pretty deadly. I have found that holding a point is pretty easy 1 v 1 and can hold out for a bit if played well in 1 v 2 situations – allowing time for help to come.

I don’t know how it would do in ranked. And I would imagine if a player was good, with good key binds, this would be deadly. That is just coming from an average player. I think melee on the Ranger is difficult, my opinion, but those of you who have it down, well, this is a good build to try.

I like it, thanks for sharing.

Hype = fail.
Copy cat = fail.
Not being unique = fail.

Just three things off the top of my head since I started playing MMO’s dating back to DaOC. Since then I’ve tried just about everything and see a little bit of this and that which they all have in common with the two ton gorilla called WoW.

Because that was so successful, and by many standards still is today, everyone tries to copy it and make a buck. Eve is probably the only other game to have similar longevity to WoW but nowhere near the numbers. Probably due to learning curve and type of game play. But heck, look at SWG, Shadowbane, Rift, Conan, Wildstar, SWtOR, Aion, and many others. Last a few months to a few years if that then boom, they go bust. Warhammer, we can just keep adding game after game with similar results. And guess what, WoW is getting ready for yet another expansion with raised level cap of 110…go figure.

There is a player base that can support the market for sure but no one really seems to understand just want the player base wants. Even GW2 doesn’t fully understand based on what we’ve seen over the past few years. My gut tells me that if there was something similar on the market we’d see few players here.

2016 will be interesting as there may be two releases that could potentially take away players. We’ll see though. They are already borderline losing the WvW players as is due to population and server ranks combined with no progression or player portal that lists various accomplishments by guild, class, etc.

I actually like the traps as they are today.

Justine.6351:

Crapgame.6519:

Nope. I’ve played DH and have to save while the traps are super cool and pretty animations the bow is slow. It has its moments but so far I’ve personally not found a built and/or weapon set that works well together.

I was going to try trap runes but they don’t let you. I even made a set, placed in my bank, and tried to pull them out – no luck. Can’t even see them. That could be interesting but again, I don’t think Rangers have much to worry about.

Different role / utility I think.

Try making a new guard beta with runes in bank. The account is copied at beta character creation.

Good idea. Tried it but it didn’t work

Nope. I’ve played DH and have to save while the traps are super cool and pretty animations the bow is slow. It has its moments but so far I’ve personally not found a built and/or weapon set that works well together.

I was going to try trap runes but they don’t let you. I even made a set, placed in my bank, and tried to pull them out – no luck. Can’t even see them. That could be interesting but again, I don’t think Rangers have much to worry about.

Different role / utility I think.

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

Crapgame.6519:

Wanted to try trapper runes with DH but alas they are not included I see some potential though after playing in the borderland maps and ruins. However, my trapper Ranger is still more effective.

Will be interesting with next beta rolls out based on feedback. Most of the skirmishes I’ve come out ahead on is more or less the surprise factor. I’m sure by tomorrow that will be gone and these issues will raise its ugly head.

Put 6 trapper runes in your bank on a non-beta character. Create a new dragonhunter. You’ll have access to them.

Wow, didn’t even think of that…thank high heavens they don’t uninstall automatically for not thinking of something like this.

Thanks, will do that now.

How did you get the trapper runes? I was not able to.

Wanted to try trapper runes with DH but alas they are not included I see some potential though after playing in the borderland maps and ruins. However, my trapper Ranger is still more effective.

Will be interesting with next beta rolls out based on feedback. Most of the skirmishes I’ve come out ahead on is more or less the surprise factor. I’m sure by tomorrow that will be gone and these issues will raise its ugly head.

How many traps are there on the Guardian? I have not pre-ordered so no idea.

I’ve been online and seen a few around but figured I’d ask.

Puck.9612:

Crapgame.6519:

I’m in the small camp that believe traps and trapper runes are OP in the small scale WvW meta of play. Doesn’t mean I’m right by any means but they work for me.

They aren’t OP unless your opponent is an idiot. The only time I would argue that they are strong is if you are running with a small group that can draw your opponents attention.

In any other situation running traps leaves you with crappy condi removal, leaves you extremely vulnerable to cc, and the fact that the pet doesn’t stealth when using stealth runes makes the runes mediocre at best.

I agree with Heimskarl, traps should become an elite kit. If they do wise up and make it a kit they should revert healing spring back to normal.

Must be a lot of idiots then. Then again, it is probably the fact they can’t see them so it is only a matter of time before they run over them. I do agree with you in regards to lack of pet stealth when placed. I find myself constantly hiding my pets but it is what it is. Won’t get changed anytime soon with expansion being top priority and it may never otherwise.

Like I said – just my opinion. I really don’t see any loss of condition clearing or breaking of CC. I’ll even go a step further that I can live longer playing the same way with traps than on my guardian. Not as lazy play, that is for sure.

Dardamaniac.1295:

Although i find em really fun i have found some major weakness that make em not viable atm.

Sounds like you are talking about some format of PvP – which one? WvW or sPvP? If this in regards to WvW continue on. If not, stop here. Personally, I feel they are fine and I’ve even stated they are OP with trap runes. Others disagree but we’re still friends.

1. They getting countered by AI. Mesmers, Necros and even other Rangers send their AI on them and they trigger leaving you with a skillslot on a 36sec cd

Ambient creatures, sentries, and other moving non-combative NPC’s trigger them. I’ve had the Champ by Speldan trigger one. I’ve also had one trigger and was able to finish and get a rally. Honestly, this isn’t a big deal and in some cases great because in turn it also triggers their clones and stuff.

2. Range. Good Mesmers that realize that you are a trap Ranger tend to stay away from you. Other classes that have a strong range dmg can beat you easily if the play clever. Being melee and throwing traps feels a little clunky cause of the casting time, even so its nearly imposible to keep a steady flow in your rotations.

I’m glad they do. I stay away from them so this is a win win for both parties. At some point they are going to have to engage. Only time I’ve found this to be an issue is when I have my Short Bow out rather than Long Bow.

Dropping traps isn’t an issue that I’ve found unless a Zerg runs up on me and I’m CC’d. I actually prefer the post patch way of dropping traps. It is just a different play style and encourages some thought process behind placement if you start the engagement. If you are reacting then it is another story but you still have time to disengage and reset if you want or run away.

3. The lack of synergize with more traits. We need more traits imo. A single trait giving just some increases doesnt feels right. It either will make em OP or it wont help much. We need some kind of utility on them. Some cond removal, some stun break

Can’t have it all – so every class has to choose. Maybe some have it better, maybe not. Personally I find they work fine but I’m running spike, flame, and vipers nest. Healing spring also. For solo roaming, flipping NPC’s and camps it is enough. Also small fights it works well with my standard setup of SB, axe, torch. If I’m in a party (2 – 5) I just swap out short bow for long bow. Traps haven’t hurt any of my group play and they actually have learned to kite people into it or know where I place healing spring for that quick heal.

4. Pets. They dont seem to synergize well with our pets. The soft cc that they provide may make pets hit more reliably the target but still i believe that more interaction is needed.
Something like giving some boons on pet, something like pet gains Sic em when a foe steps to a trap. Its seems logic that your pet is ambushing with you for a foe to step on the trap and hunt him down..

What do you think?

I don’t know much about pets other than post patch they seem to require a bit more management and selection/choice. There are players who do well at pet management and others like me who don’t like them and want them to be optional or traited out.

I’m in the small camp that believe traps and trapper runes are OP in the small scale WvW meta of play. Doesn’t mean I’m right by any means but they work for me.

Run both. No reason why you can’t. Depending on how you leveled or if you spent any time on the mist map, you might have enough badges for both anyway. If not, hot lap edge of mists and freight train your gear.

I have 3 sets of armor and weapons for my Ranger and 4 for my Guardian Exotic of course with the exception of accessories. Those are easy enough to obtain. Ascended armor is another story but WvW you only need exotic. Anything beyond that and you are gearing for duels (my opinion).

I don’t think it is risky – it is a trade off. One thing I would do for sure is look at the build(s) you run in an editor then change the armor under consideration. I’ve done that looking at my primary build, WvW/Trapper, and it looses a few stats here and there but gains in other areas. Overall not too bad all things considered.

If I wanted to I could gain those few points back by swapping out a few accessories that I already have. Which then makes the set viable and worth my time. That is, outside the stupid name of it (unless there is some GW1 or GW2 connection in the name – I just think it is silly).

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Crapgame.6519:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

If they were OP in any way whatsoever, they would be used extensively in PvP.

WvW. And they are, and have been, since introduced. But you know this already as you list a couple in your build thread. Like I said – OP is subjective. Just my personal opinion that they are.

Are they in the PvP meta? No. Therefore, not OP.
I don’t want to argue for the sake of it, but OP is not subjective at all. Something is either clearly far better than other options or it is not and traps are not, mainly due to trap builds lack of utility because running 3 traps means you have no utility skills or stunbreaks and your pet is gonna die real fast due to Empathic Bond.

No argument – we can’t really. It is my opinion therefore neither is right or wrong. However, I need to clarify something since you asked if they are in the PvP meta. No, they are not. But then again did I say they are or did I preference my statement by “WvW”?

Like I said – clearly they are used and are an option on the table. You list 3 builds last time I checked.

Now, one could argue that it is a glass half full/empty as to why those particular runes are not in sPvP meta of play. But we don’t need to go there.

x indigo x.6981:

There is a little subtle point here that is like to comment on.

Don’t try to make 1 build that does it all in wvw. You will simply end up with a mediocre build if you try to do so.

Make a roaming build and then make a zerging build. Have both builds ( armor, weapons, trinkets, utilities, traits) available in your inventory and ready to be swapped to at any point. If you feel like roaming, equip the roaming build. If you feel like zerging, equip the zerging build.

The way gw2 deals with a builds allows for such setup. There is NO COST to retraiting your specialization and you can carry the extra gear in your bags. That’s the way I’ve been doing it for the past year and it’s been working very well. It allows me to make specialized builds that I’m ready to swap to whenever needed. Burn guard, medi guard, zerg guard, healing guard, .. etc

This is true, and most players regardless of “most” classes will carry lots of different gear and accessories to include food when in WvW. As you said, it is free.

However, the UI and system doesn’t really promote that play with build 1, 2, 3, or armor racks to match. So while yes, it is free it is very cumbersome and/or time consuming. I mean if we get left behind or asked / tasked to do something else and get jump’d we can’t really tell the opponent to say – WAIT! I need a few minutes to re-accessorize

I know you didn’t imply that…just saying though.

Depends on how you are playing. Solo roaming or small HVOC group play, it may work. I’ve personally not tried it but that is when I’ll more often than not run DPS/Zerk buil(s).

Otherwise larger scale WvW zerg type fights it is all about sustaining that initial impact. As someone said above, don’t be that rally target. So much CC, conditions, and red circles of crap on the ground you really need to be able to make it past that initial impact and assist the driver selecting targets.

That is just my personal observation.

CC’ always wins the fight. I don’t know, even on my ranger I always enjoy seeing a burning guardian. If you know what you are looking for it is always a free kill. Not bashing, my main is a Guardian. Just saying burning is by no means OP.

Always useful in WvW. Format is basically run what you brung unless you are in a guild run or specific group that likes certain builds.

At the end of the day any class can, and is, useful. You should really play what you enjoy. Otherwise you are just setting yourself up for failure and will be taking another long break.

nacario.9417:

Good thieves can actually kill the traditional more glassy ranger, but if u are geared/specd more into defense it’s much harder (impossibru?) for the thief.

Pretty much this. Running glass/zerk in WvW if the thief jumps me and I can’t get him/her down within the first couple of seconds I’ll typically lose. I just don’t have the defense with how I’m running or playing.

However, when I’m on my trapper/condi build – they die or leave. Not impossible for them to win because it is a game and people are just better. But more often than with my other build I’ll win these encounters.

Just send them a bag/packet of salt or their bag back and play on.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

If they were OP in any way whatsoever, they would be used extensively in PvP.

WvW. And they are, and have been, since introduced. But you know this already as you list a couple in your build thread. Like I said – OP is subjective. Just my personal opinion that they are.

Compared to what exactly? Ambient creatures?

No to both. Well, they do wreck ambient creatures which P.E.T.A. doesn’t approve of nor condone. But solo or small parties they are, in my opinion, over powered and offer a lot of mobility and engagement opportunities. You don’t have to agree by any means but having run full zerker in WvW and then trapper with runes my personal survivability has increased ten fold.

Then factor in some of my own personal challenging fights with other classes, Mesmer and Elementals come to mind, the make a difference. Three traps or four with healing spring. Or go healing spring with two other traps and sun spirit.

I don’t know, to me they seem a bit OP. Don’t judge me!

Edit: I also ran trapper runes pre-patch when you could toss them anywhere. While I didn’t like the change at first I think they are 10x better now. It actually makes you think a bit more when you fight or before you engage. Lots of strategic places to drop them and reset the fight only to have them run over them…provided you remember where you placed them or their timers didn’t kick in

YMMV (your mileage may vary) IAHTRTBI (I always hold the right to be incorrect)…

Jedi.7543:

Thank you.. and may I just say, “wow…….”

So, out of (15) Minor and (45) Major assignable traits… there is only (1) that pertains to traps?

They are still over powered. Just think, you now have more trait points to use elsewhere. Seriously, it is fine. Seriously, they are still over powered. At least in WvW.

leman.7682:

Puck.9612:

This arrogant ”PvP is superior” attitude is getting old. I’ve found great fighters in WvW and pvp, I’ve also found terrible players in both. Neither mode makes you a superior fighter.

Arrogant? I’m just being realistic.
Some facts from the EU high-end sPvP/MMR (mostly soloQ):

• standardisation – it is definitely a thing. Some of the rune sets/sigils are unavailable in PvP. Buffs/food definitely throw the metagame more into imbalance.
• areas in PvP are smaller and force a requirement of better positioning/LoS and basically a faster gameplay (beautifuly shown by the OP with his slow reaction time).
• I’d say there are some good WvW players, even some amazing ones (like Sindrener who started in WvW, but transferred to PvP and is seeing a great success; disclaimer: when he first came to PvP, he was slightly above average IIRC).
• It’s difficult to generalize, but fact is WvW environment does not perpetuate a long-term skill increase directly because of the extremely uneven playing field and relatively low skill-ceiling (the most hardcore/fast/skilled players play PvP) which then skew the perception of WvW players (Dunning–Kruger effect).

Bonus:
My experience on necro a year ago (after Dhuumfire nerfs and before recent buffs, which I consider to be the worst time for necros since the release) was that I was able to kill fully stacked/buffed roamers in T1 matchups on EU without distibuting my points, eating any food and without using my utilities and heal. Obviously, I have never played WvW religously (because of the very reasons I outlined in this post and because it is just too easy for me), but my experience has always been just straight up faceroll against anything and everything). Moreover, my buddy who’s one of the top PvP thieves on EU was dueling a ‘pro’ WvW roamer thief and was able to kill him using only sword or only shortbow. The skill gap is that huge.

I was not attacking anyone, but since you were quite aggressive with your reply, I felt obliged to give a more thorough answer. I’d say backed on my experience that skill-level distribution is just skewed to the left in case of WvW players (attachment) because of the reasons I gave.

I will wait for your reply and some counter arguments backed by experience.

I don’t have a dog in this fight but this is such a old argument / debate and it gets tiring to read over and over again. Too much personal opinion and biasness. We need more cow bell.

WvW != sPvP just like sPvP != WvW. Different formats of play but it doesn’t mean one is better than the other or player A is better than player B.

/sigh

Condition builds are viable with trap runes and rabid gear. I fine axe, torch, and either bow work fine. SB if you are also applying bleeds. Long bow if you find you need the range. This is, from my perspective anyway, for solo roaming in WvW or with a small group picking off stragglers, flipping camps, and camping NPC’s such as frogs, dredge, or ogres.

I believe this is my current build or close to it, won’t be online for a few:

Skirmish 3,3,2 (Trappers Expertise, Hidden Barbs, Light on your feet)
Wilderness 2,2,1 (Oakheart Salve, Refined Toxins, Empathic Bond)
Nature Magic 2,1,2 (Instinctive Reaction, Evasive Purity, Protective Ward)

LB is sigil of air and incapacitation
SB is sigil of doom and earth
AXE is sigil of agony
Torch is sigil of geomancy
Healing spring, spike, flame, frost traps with entangle.

Pets are wolf/spider. Armor is Rabid. Accessories are all ascended celestial stats. Back is exotic crafted. The one that freaks out my bear pet and always asks me what did the bear do to me to become my back pack…

My berserker set and build flips everything quicker. Fights sort of go like melee kills me, range I’ll hold my own. If they are good, I don’t stand a chance (just me, I’m so so). For me it just comes down to comfort and how I feel I have more survivability and/or ways to reset / escape running traps. Fights do last longer solo which is a bust compared to LB/berserker. When I roam with people, elementalist or necro it puts more pressure and the traps become good cc. Just my take on it based on what I play.