Guild Wars 2

Black Box.9312:

Burtnik.5218:

Shock wave needs to be buffed/reduced cost to 5

Grasp makes little sense right now..a melee pull..lolwut
Grasp should be “step towards the mist to bound and pull the foe with you” 600range, unblockable.

I bieleve thats what originally grasp was from datamined stuff where it had 600 range, 600 pull. I used it mostly as set up to jade winds if i managed to have so much energy to do so or as a tool to disorient ppl. But 15 energy cost..it hurts

Yeah, I thought that it would be a teleport to an enemy up to 600 units away, followed by a teleport back to your original position with the enemy being pulled along the way.

That would make much more sense to me, at least.

while being cool think of that: twice the chance to get stuck in the terrain and fail… XD

is this still discussed? geez

let it go guys. maybe anet’s timeing was a bit off, but the whole business model is incredibily fair and friendly to new people..dunno what is there to hate.

Burtnik.5218:

And also activate with some dialogues in certain situations like dropping to 75%, 50%, 25% and downed instead of being limited to skill usage.

And the grunts..what is their purpose? They are olny irritating, espesially Glint – which doesnt fit a wise dragon by any means. They honestly feel more like a placerholder than anything else really.

well devs always said there should be somekind of interaction with our legends.
One can only hope that this was disabled during beta to do not reveal the surprise?

Kodiak.3281:

I kinda wish #5 would always do the retreat. Then it could be used as a backwards mobility skill.

that’s actually a nice idea!

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

2 more weeks to go!!

I don’t think I can make it! <GASP>!

yeah exactly 2 weeks today…this is getting intense ò_ò

Chaos.5072:

I kinda liked this part of the auto :/ it made it feel different from all the other sword skills out there. Oh well, at least we still have the cool stabby stab animation on the 1st part

yeah but sometimes usability > coolness…a projectile on a melee auto doen’t feel right

FLiP.7680:

Bovan.9481:

Rich Fuel.7253:

i would LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE if we had on the sword 1 the same effect as the ranger has on the sword, wen the 2nd hit on the auto attack they leap abit and its a gap closer i think it could be perfect

Please, for the love of god, no.
I don’t think anyone is even remotely as excited or involved with the class as I am, but I would instantly give up on the entire class if we get some variation of the horrible Ranger sword autoattacks.

I second that.

smells like well played troll XD

Synosius.9876:

BW2 I was successfully using the skill 5 nearly every attempt but in BW3 it rarely pulled the target. Could have just been user error bur maybe others had trouble getting it to work?

It was under whelming for me this last weekend.

i WvW is always a trouble, in PvP except maps like Temple or Spirit it was almost reliable.
Almost.

It needs work anyway

SoulstitchMMO.1396:

Axe 4 would be a great leap finisher.

right! fact is, axe is already an excellent weapon…even more utility seems too much

I second that!

/15hoods

i only see a cost reduction on block’s followup. and maybe make it projectyle and being able to immob foes at some distance. Other stuffs seem pretty fine to me

GLORIOUS

/15moas

rapthorne.7345:

That moment when the entire team wipes and only you are left standing to save the day.

Happens way more on my necro than any other class

This. Every.kitten .Time

Puls.5867:

Ilharn.6813:

Puls.5867:

Roy Cronacher.1576:

Glad to hear you all can’t wait until launch, me too. It’ll be here soon™, exciting times!

Please give the pre-orderererererers get it a few days before launch I love my Revenant and need to kill zhaitan again and catch up with the story and get it to level 80 before HoT story Dx I need my Revvy

14 days left….

Yes and the withdrawal is real

I feel and empty vessel.
And I can’t even channel my emotions right now.

Vennyhedgie.5369:

I am actually mildly disappointed in the dodge effect. Not that it isn’t great that such a suggestion made it into the game but when it was mentioned I think that the original intention was to have it look like the revenant was phasing through the mists as they do when using Phase smash, Unralenting assault or the shiro escape skill, instead of just a puff of smoke.

this couldn’t happen because you can confuse it with a skill. Dodge has to be clear even with fluff effects. Thieves’ one is the same dodge animation with some blurr ;-)

Shiren.9532:

Roy Cronacher.1576:

It’ll be acquired via a collection.

Will there be an equivalent armout set for all professions? Or at least one for medium and light armour professions?

i guess, in this case

Rym.1469:

Agree on Mace. This weapon still kinda falls behind others. Mostly because it supports playstyle that is very heavily limited on Revenant and got no such buffs like Sword or Hammer.

I disagree on making all fragments/orbs into regular heals. They just need better indicators for allies. Green glow or “+” above them would help everyone with understanding what these do instead of ignoring or even avoiding these, because non-Revenants don’t know what they do.
Fragments need to have longer duration if we’re supposed to be about “sustain”. Making them last 10 or 12-15s and maybe ge affected by Tranquil Benediction trait for better synergy + visual clues described above would fix the problem and let us keep interesting playstyle.

Finally, I like your suggestion on Phase Traversal. I myself suggested bumping the range to 1500 and adding 2s CD, but your suggestion flows better I think.

Yeah your suggestion about Fragments is a valid alternative. Beside the duration they have to be “wider” in the aoe to trigger them…it’s really SO tiny (like medipack if not smaller). Adding this too.

NoTrigger.8396:

Gaaroth.2567:

DnT calculated like always the best PvE DPS which was a Shiro/Mallyx build (shiro for IO, Mallyx for EtD) and was comparable with staff ele and sinister condi.
This was before Glint. Dunno now.

Anyway, top tier. But it’s not sure that such build will be meta ;-)
If you want the graph i need to find it somewhere burried on reddit…lemme search

shiro mallyx is not the best anymore

Can’t run the numbers but yeah sword with glint buffs seems to be superior (as i said the calc was before glint announce). Mallyx build used EtD but the mere 10% stat doesnt hold against fury with double effect and might

Staff as animation would fit more a whirl finisher.
Unyielding anguish might gain a leap finisher, since i feel it’s way undertuned

Thanks for the feedback guys.
About jalis, I thing is in good place generally, especially the Retribution spec. What I dislike, which is different from being OP UP or broken, is that is so much situational, that’s why I havent listed it above.
Honestly I don’t know how i would fix it.

I agree on glint’s heal, forgot to add. Thanks for other suggestions, i’ve added them to the OP as well.

Hello folks!
It’s already a week that I’m preparing a massive balance/review spreadsheet for the revenant class, to be used even on release to track the status of our beloved class.
Since this project is taking so long I’ve decided to write down here my biggest concerns on Rev after the last BWE3, to give Roy the much needed feedback

Basically this is a TL:DR; of just what seems UP, OP or not working ATM.

MOST NOTABLE BUGS

• Skills like hammer’s Coalescence or Ruin(#2), Phase smash (#3), mace’s Searing Fissure (#2), sword’s Grasping Shadow (#5) suffer badly from uneven terrain like stairs.
• phase smash also has wrong range
• Shooting Bastion trait bugs out the Shield’s Crystal Hybernation (#5) if used during trait’s CD (animation up, but no effect whatsoever)
• Mid stomp quickness brokes the animation and sometimes the stomp itself (this is gamewise, but hits us the most, since we can reliably, on purpose experience it)
• sword’s Unrelenting Assault (#3) , Jalis’ Vengeful Hammers (#9) and Reflexive Summon cancel when next to walls
• Staff’s Renewing Wave sometimes do not clense conditions

UNDERTUNED BUILD

CONDITIONS
Main tools for conditions: Mace/Axe and Mallyx.
We are all sad about lost Mallix’s gameplay but, supposedly, we should have now a condi powerhouse. Not true. In fact during BWE3 condi Rev is what i had least success with, while was my most successful build in BWE2.
Torment application that scared Roy is in fact weak and we lost many useful and cover conditions we had with self application in BWE2’s iteration of the legend.
Looking at skill facts it seems you can push torment up to 25+ stacks.
While this is good on paper, in fact is not possible, here’s why.

• Echoing Eruption (Mace#3) says it applies 3xtorment 6s: this is cumulative 1 per blast. You reliable can put 1, if lucky 2
• Searing fissure (Mace#2) is nice on paper but too easily avoided in pratical situations. Make it like the new ele’s ring of fire: big chunk of burning on hit, lower from field (2x burning 6s on hit, 1 burning 3s per pulse). Field shape should be a bit wider.
• mace#2+#3 blast might application: Echoing Eruption triple blast is almost impossible to pull of since the “wave lenght” is longer than the fire field (also the most of fields) and the first hit happen after a small leap. IDEA: make the 3blast cuncked in a triangle? This would solve torment application too.
• Unyielding Anguish (Mallyx#9) should be, with Embrance the Darkness(Mallyx#0), the most reliable torment application. Actually you burn out energy quickly and you can’t even reach 10 stack after 100% energy consumption. And this requires people to stay in UA field. With such insane cost torment on UA must be tripled and EtD doubled.

I’m not scared to push torment stacks that high because, well, we apply just torment with some burning and poison. This can be wiped with even weak condi removals (that usual comes with short CD).
Alternatively, as suggested below, tweaking Corruption spec might also be a good idea.

HEALING
Ventari. I so love the concept around Ventari and the tablet gameplay but in reality it still feels clunky. We supposedly should be the best sustained healer in game, while druids should be the best burst healer.
Fact it the druid is a SUSTAINED BURST (celestial form recharges in 3 sec with right circumstances…wut?). We fall terribly back in terms of row numbers.

Sure, we have amazing utilities (Natural Armony, that should be a delayd burst heal, should be at least double tho to be considered bursty) but the main utility Ventari’s Will (tablet movement) is just slow and costy and doesn’t fit well in GW2 fast combat: having heal on the tablet’s path is hard to pull of since people will be moving. Remove haling on path, make a 25-50% healing increase just on destination, with insta-cast and faster movement (even teleportation).

Puryfing essence is still a bit too costy, make it 30 energy.
Energy Expulsion also seems still costy for the overall effect.

Finally coming from engi and medpack drops i use to give, i’m not sold on healing crystals(Staff#, Ventari Elite, Traits..): the effect is not that great to force someone to run to them, and they count in the skill balance (like Energy Expulsion). Might be boring but i’d like them replaces with plain, small heals.
Rym.1469 alternatively proposes for a longer duration (and i’d say wider trigger aoe) in orther to fullfill the “sustain” role of those fragments.

OP STUFFS
Coalescence of Ruin at max range hits like a kitten truck. This is no brainer. But hits -50% at close range. I’d suggest to even the damage to the mid hit so it can be used iven in shorter range situations.

Phase traversal raises a lot of complaints. While it is ok to be no line of sight insta teleport (like other skills in the game) being able to chain them to cover 2400 might be a bit broken. So a fix like Elementalist’s Ride the Lightning might be good: 0CD if you hit the target, 3-4CD if not (no more otherwise we loose the unrelenting killer vibe)

Glint’s heal, while I do not feel it OP i think needs a better tell. The counterplay is there (stop attacking) but the enemy must be aware.

FINAL THOUGHTS
I see the Revenant in a very good place now, with some little adjustments it will become the most balanced profession in the whole game.

EDIT: typos/formatting

DnT calculated like always the best PvE DPS which was a Shiro/Mallyx build (shiro for IO, Mallyx for EtD) and was comparable with staff ele and sinister condi.
This was before Glint. Dunno now.

Anyway, top tier. But it’s not sure that such build will be meta ;-)
If you want the graph i need to find it somewhere burried on reddit…lemme search

continue please! this was good, but please at least introduce what you are about to post…otherwise will just feel akward

So video where a skilled player can kill 4 that don’t know even where they are turned shows Rev is OP? LOL
Have you ever tried to PvP? With semi decent players? All suddenly Rev feels just fine.
Without those invuln and heals we would melt in seconds.
We still melt against condis, even in mallyx, because to keep resistence up you haven’t to use energy for other things.
In PvP know how to mitigate a bloody Unrelenting Assault for more then half.
All skills revenant has are all in other classes. So is clearly a L2P issue, seriously.

If you are looking for something OP to complain check DH Fragments Trap (now fixed tho) or Berserkers Rifle F2 ONESHOTS. Those are broken skill.

Also

Mosharn.8357:

Azure.8670:

style.6173:

@OP:

rev is the new class. If you think it is going to be anything other than overpowered at the beginning, you are not being realistic. This is ANET’s new class. They can’t release it and have it be horrible. Instead, they will release it unbalanced and overpowered and then tone it down later.

I honestly think Reaper and Chrono are more powerful than rev

Pretty much. Reaper can do insane bursts and have almost 100% chill uptime. Chrono can burst or save a whole point with those over the top wells. An evade well that doesn’t put point cap cancel is lolz.

Arantheal.7396:

There is no counterplay to banners, who buff the group just as spirits do & they can even be picked up & replaced.

I don’t see a reason why gyros have to have counterplay in the first place.
I already posted how to rebalance them around their invulnerability & the reason why a vast myority of us requires them to be invulnerable is because they will be useless in 2/3 gamemodes otherwise & massively underperform in the 3rd.

Even if they bring them in line with turrets former, tanky state, they would become merely viable in PvP & still pop everywhere else instantly. There is something people forget about turreteer: Even on their peak, turrets were still garbage in Dungeons/Fractals & WvW.

fact is almost all of them have such an underwhelming effect that even if unkillable, i don’t know if i would take them!
blast gyro? better throw mine
shredder gyro? probably the best out of the pack, but what it that poison field on toolbelt?
condiclense gyro? i clean faster with hgh build
bulk gyro? max health is REALLY low, especially in group situation
healing gyro? doen’t even compare to warrior’s signet
stealth gyro? he doesn’t even stealth himself

and all do not keep up with you and are timed.
SERIOUSLY.

I main engi since 2y now. Hammer is good, traits are decently good. But man gyros need much work.
Making them invunerable is the priority thing to do!

Chaba.5410:

Familiar at all with Signets or Revenant energy-cost skills?

or mantras? (that would be mechanically the best implementation possible)

gannondorf.7628:

Kaligos.7285:

gannondorf.7628:

Kaligos.7285:

Bovan.9481:

Can you name one legendary Largos assassin? Or even a legendary Largos at all?

Well, she is not that legendary but I think Sayeh al’ Rajihd would be cool.

Yeah but she’s alive. ^^

Well, Jalis is also not technically dead, he just turned to stone to fight Primordus.

Yes i have the same reaction some days ago. Why jalis? He must be dead i think coz if not we couldn’t invocate him. And that’s more, legends are hosting you’re body like a possession so i think he must be dead. You only can do that with a dead spirit. But yeah nothing is official on Jalis’ death. A mystery.

actually, you actually channel his essence throught the mists but not he directly.
For example how a Rev vs Rev would work? The same exact legend helping both? Nope.
It’s like fractals. Those are not the real “episode” in history. You just enjoy a “saved copy” over and over again. Same as legends: you just channel the power from a “saved copy” from the mists.
I know is a bit intricate but i hope i was enough clear.

gannondorf.7628:

Gaaroth.2567:

So yeah to me is a safe bet, it might even get some buffs in Mallyx/GLINT/Ventari.

Mallyx i can understand he is in a situation where he haven’t really a role designed. He need some tweks. Ventari is already really good i don’t really understand why you want change him. But man GLINT? Glint is the most op legend the revenant has. She just make 70% of the power of the revenant, she’s freaking huge. So buffing her? Hell no please! She’s already too strong compared to other legends. But buffing and fixing some things in Mallyx and Jalis who are not as good at Shiro, Glint, Ventari and are situational. Yes it can be done.

PS: I was myself looking for a versatile class. But jalis and mallyx spot make me sad last BW. You always need to take Shiro or Glint (ventari more in pve for sure) coz they are the best legends so far. And well, having a versatile class who can only use 2 (or 3) legends on five. Well…
I’m waiting for some changes but i’m already levelling a charr mesmer (yes i have finally found a good outfit for a charr mesmer) in case revenant stay on Shiro/glint duality.
Moreover i tend to avoid high popular classes and i’m beginning to think revenant is going to be the most played class for a moment. At top with elementalist or warrior. We’ll se how the future is.

aahhhh my bad! i meant Jalis XD
Jalis should be a tanky legend but it feels to me so much situational. He has the best healing skill aside glint’s one, tho.
Ventari has potential but it is still a bit clunky, especially in the cost management of table movement, it has to be instant or way toned down.
Mallyx is meant to be a condi powerhouse now, but unless you burst all you energy you can really pressure much, and even there, it isn’t that heavy pressure.
My 2 cents.

i always tell this “Doctor who”-ish story. Here’s a TLDR:

• Rytlock trains you in the mists
• Sends you back in time before personal story (possible)
• You have a NDA about his identity until HoT to avoid temporal crashes

Wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff!
(disclaimer: the girl is looking at a recorded video, is not a live conversation)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwdbLu_x0gY

Elan.7523:

Fractal Sword? Nope.

cough dropped yesterday cough

anyway fear not, with hot you will be able to buy it right away. Save those pristines! ^ _ ^

hard call. they are all in decent state, even if i’d like some major tweaks in ventari and jalis

this waiting is unbearable.
2 weeks…i can JUST DO IT

Bovan.9481:

Roy Cronacher.1576:

It’ll be acquired via a collection.

Any chance at all for a little more information? Or can we at least have an estimate of the difficulty of getting the entire set?

Regardless thanks for answering the topic. This is something that’s been on my mind for a while.

smells like lumine from LS2 ;-)

Le-ROOOOOOOOOY Cronacher!
<3 ya pal

Jim.9532:

Burtnik.5218:

I dealed with cc via stab on dodge trait also in herald line. It allowed me to pressure pretty well without being worries about all the junk ppl throwed at me.

Condi depends on class. Engi is easy to beat with hammer projectile block, ranger is in similiar situation except you also kite them. Condi mes – focus clones, watch out for beam and scepter block. Use hammer. If they get you to low hp swap to Glint, get some confusion and use heal. Tada baack to full.

Vs burn guards you dance around them with sword 3, sword block and hammer. If they fail initial burst you have 50% chance to win. Necros and wars are not issue at all.

Point is running double melee is the first mistake you can do. Hammer projectile block paired with Shiro to kite via riposting shadows really do wonders.

Good advise, I went for the stability on dodge roll method with my condi spec. I think it’s better to not be CCd in the first place than get CCd and use a stun-break.

yep, also almost safe stomp: just dodge on top of a downed body and finish him off

Fact is Revenant will be popular but is not OP as other claims. People know other classes perfectly, know what might get against to and how to react.
Even with elite spec, that’s just 1 trait line and some new skill, overall you know what to expect from a class.
Rev is new, and I saw many people fail to avoid super basic stuff like glint’s dragon breath.
No one remembers bolas+bull’s charge+100blades from warriors back at launch? as soon as people learned to block/stun break/dodge it wasn’t much OP, was it?
Rev is in a good spot and looking at 3y of history I prefer to have him start in a bright situation because is more likely to stay competitive with skill balances.
I mean, warriors, guardians, elementalists, all classes in good spot from launch ar still in good spot.
So yeah to me is a safe bet, it might even get some buffs in Mallyx/Glint/Ventari.

Sarif.1827:

EvilSardine.9635:

….

Troll post is Troll.

account name says it all :-D

Well, you can’t even outrun a warrior, thief, mesmer. At least the revenant will spend an absurd amount of energy in the process. Shiro is MEANT to stick on you. Where’s the balance? He won’t easily get away (unless you have nother target around, but you aren’t exactly getting away from harm this way :-D).
I’m not super fun of a CD, but if we must have it 2s is already more than enough, considering all.

You run a burst build, fragile, with ha heal in shiro that is more a damage boost than a real heal. Glint is what will save you. It’s a unique skill and has a MASSIVE counterplay, you can stop attacking and the rev is screwed. In order to do that i agree it should have a better tell.

There are others reveals in game that are stronger. Engi on is on a targeted area, willingly. This is a not so big area around the rev. I find it balanced.

Now what surprised me is that you wanted to nerf 2 fine skills but then wanted to buff and already very powerful one. If shield#5 allowed to move would be brokenly OP.
Root is the price we pay for a blocking, almost second heal skill.
What could couse some love is shield#4, with a blast finisher for example.

MethaneGas.8357:

EvilSardine.9635:

I was discussing with my friend on how to really bring this skill up a notch and the best we came up with was for Anet to include a stealth at the end of the teleport. It would allow the revenant some much needed survivability.

Don’t forget the superspeed

a blast finisher maybe?

Smoking hell, charr ofc!

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Greatsword!!!!!1!!!!!!!11!!!!One!!!!!!!1!1!1!1!!!!!!!!!

let’s make this real.
I’d be happy with a longbow too

i ran a rabid mallyx/glint bunkerish build.
Mace/axe/shield.
http://dulfy.net/gw2traits#build=AgYBtAK4Bqw~ (i’m at work and other build sites do not work..)

wasn’t bad, even if condi application in mallyx needs some tweaks (it’s too costy to be in a somewhat decent amount)

also the funny things would be thieves having a more reliable and accessible slow that revenant themselves, stealing if from them -.-

why don’t we have more slow on our skills?

Lionwait.4815:

I hope you guys know how radical’s this skill “Phase Traversal” is? I’m dumbfounded how no one is talking about it in the forums. Teleporting up mountains and through houses. No class can out run you nor can they catch you. Its the one and only thing I see that unbalances the Revenant class. It really should have a 5 second timer or a cost of 35 energy or decrees teleporting a person to 900 distance. Am I the only one not making a wish list on the forums but trying to give sound advice in the hope of balance?

Is EXACTLY like all other teleports. You know? Guardians, thieves, mesmers…all can do the same.
Not a Rev problem, but a skill type one. So, that’s why no1 is really complaining.

I second this idea

WUT? Why is only me that has found people that learned to counter UA?
I almost used that as survival more than nuke in PvP since you can half the damage with a single dodge and often it fails near walls or with running targets.
So no, not OP AT ALL.

Rain.9213:

Haha wow. If you think Revenant is completely balanced, you must clearly not be playing it right. Playing Revenant, I can effortlessly mow down practically everything not named Chronomancer.

Sure UA isn’t as strong in a group fight but 1v1, it’s completely over the top.

There are way more ather skills that are over the top in 1v1.
Also on what class/build you fought suche Rev?

Anyway UA got invlun but NO dmg increase. Instead this BWE got a 20% more CD

Toolbox.9375:

I’m coming from Engineer, Elementalist, and a pet-heavy Ranger, so no, I’m fairly used to the Mozart-style keyboard shenanigans. :P It’ll take some time to really commit everything to muscle memory, but all in all, it’s just another song.

yeah, muscle memory is actually easier then engi/ele…you just have to memorize CDs, that will come with practice

Yes because it’s working in a cone in front of you.
Still i’d like to see the buff to us too ;-)

Yeah. i love the hammer so much but if we keep to have those bugs it’s not that usable
I think they made super cool effects but for the sake of usability thay have to use some easy tech behind. let’s hope to see this fixed soon.