Guild Wars 2

Brokensunday.4098:

Ragion.2831:

Muchacho.2390:

Ragion.2831:

- "Your’e all Weaklings now also grants 2 stacks of Stab for each target hit and if im not mistaken that includes clones, minions and pets.

No that is the elite. “You are all weaklings” gives only 1 stack stab like any non instant stunbreak.

Yea 1 stack not 2, still 1 stack per target for 5 stacks. The skill says gain boons for each hit, stability is boon

read the skill it gives might not stab

Damage foes around you inflicting conditions on them and giving you boons per foe struck.

Damage Damage: 259
Endurance regeneration decreased by 50%. 50% of hits are Glancing Blows (50% damage). Stacks duration. Weakness (6s): -50% Endurance Regeneration, 50% Fumble (Unrestricted)
Increased outgoing damage; stacks intensity.4 Might (4s): +120 Power, +120 Condition Damage
Miscellaneous effect.png Number of Targets: 5
Radius.png Radius: 600

According to the video below the skill now also gives stability as well as might. The skill gives boons per target hit, stability and might are boons. We get 4 stacks of might per target for 20 stacks, if stab is also on the skill and is a boon, does that not mean 1 stack of stab per target for 5 stacks? 1 stack of stab per target makes sense for a stun break that is meant to be area effective.

Shouts starts at 1:30

Muchacho.2390:

Ragion.2831:

- "Your’e all Weaklings now also grants 2 stacks of Stab for each target hit and if im not mistaken that includes clones, minions and pets.

No that is the elite. “You are all weaklings” gives only 1 stack stab like any non instant stunbreak.

Yea 1 stack not 2, still 1 stack per target for 5 stacks. The skill says gain boons for each hit, stability is boon

Actually I like the reaper shouts, they appear to have been changed and I can definitely see myself using them:

- "Your’e all Weaklings now also grants 2 stacks of Stab for each target hit and if im not mistaken that includes clones, minions and pets.

“Suffer” is actually pretty good, the annoying thing about plague is that it can be evaded, with Suffer there is a higher chance that you will still transfer since the shout also affects clones, minions and pets. Another thing about suffer is it can trigger plague on crit trait if you get hit with a condi burst from a thief. Since they can go into stealth immediately after, you can just use the shout and trigger plague instead of waiting for a reveal or another target before critting.

Cast time on chillied to the bone needs to be dropped to 1 1/4 secs and CD reduced to 80secs.

“Your soul is mine” should have another effect on it to make it useful in smaller fights, perhaps fear?

Here is my suggestion, renewing wave, staff 4 could be an evasive attack. The animation is already there for it, also it would be great if the health gain is guaranteed instead of being canceled by taking direct damage while using it. The attack doesn’t do damage and the heal has a small radius so you’ll have to risk taking high damage directly to heal allies with it. Not sure if that is a move most will be willing to make if the attack wasnt evasive

I’m a little worried that with the addition of stab to “Chilled to the Bone” and “You’re all weaklings”, they may have done something to the stability on Infusing Terror. That would be monumentally irritating, especially seeing as that is the best source of stability for smaller fights.

I wonder if Roy will see this but about staff, would it be possible to make Renewing Wave (Staff 4) an evasive attack? the animation does sort of look like an evade, also since the attack is a heal, it would be nice for the heal to be guaranteed since it also has a CD

Kaizoku.1298:

You guys do know that when you target a Revenant it shows which legend he channels, right ? You can always be ready for Jade Wind, unlike Basilisk Venom which is a strong skill that gives you a free Back Stab ( potentially dealing 10k+) and can be used while under stealth.

All comes back to stealth now doesnt it? because if your problem with BV is that it exists then i will say that there is stability for a reason. Just blind or pop stab when you see it

Why people are freaking out over Jade winds is really confusing, the skill costs 50 energy with a 3 second stun, energy regen is at 5/second sword 3 costs 15 energy which means if you somehow have 50 energy to spend in an intense fight you will most likely drop to 0 and have to wait 3 seconds (the entire stun duration) to burst with sword 3 or switch to a non burst legend to do damage. On top of all this even if you somehow manage to hit 5 targets and they all dont have stab don’t you think most of them will break out of it? at best maybe one or two will remain stunned long enough for you to take advantage of it.

At the end of the day the skill only works if you plan ahead of time how, when and what to use it with.

BV and JW are fine as they are, if rev had stealth then there would be a problem

Because thief has stealth.

EDIT

With the way Shiro looks, Revenant is actually really balanced:

-Lots of chase and disengage, to leave bad fights and chase port spamming players, instead of being a free kill for zergs like necro is.
-Just enough blocks including projectile blocks to respond to changing fights without being left helpless like necro is to stealth and range.
-Not too weak to condi but not invunerable to it.
Not too many execution attacks like warrior.

Roy has really done something interesting with this class, once the damage numbers and condi stacks has been figured out, id say this class should be a model for a few of the others.

Stealth is a really broken mechanic, the way it can be exploited is not right. The circle of nerfs and over buffs will continue unless they find a way to limit it and find a combination of other defenses for thief and mesmer

Silverkey.2078:

Why changing main? I did not choose mesmer for its efficiency but because I like the play style. If they nerf us to the ground, I’ll still play it because I enjoy it. I’ll just end up in lower tier PvP.

I picked evade thief because i liked the playstyle, since Anet is insistent on making necros fight in slow motion and still punishes the class for it, i switched. I also thought it didnt matter till i realized that part of what makes the playstyle fun is being effective with it even if it is difficult.

Just hope what ever nerf is coming to mesmer leaves the core of the playstyle intact instead of destroying it like they did with acrobatic thief, otherwise it wont take you long before you look for a replacement.

if they actually got serious about limiting stealth like making attacks reveal at the start of the cast instead of if it hits then problems like this can be avoided. Also, mesmer really shouldnt have near perm stealth with blocks, invulns, evasive attacks and clones at the same time then still be able to daze and stun every other second.

You know what bothers me the most? Its not that mesmer is unreasonably more powerful after the patch, the class did need some buffs especially against thief what gets to me is that Anet appears to be purposefully shifting the status quo.

If you’ve been around since release you will remember that the top of the chain was Warriors and their out of control passive healing, followed by thief in WvW and PvE Engineer in PvP, now its mesmer, what will be next? to make matters worse Thief was nerfed considerably (or pushed into stealth spamming playstyle for viablity). This begs the question, how safe is our mains?

I primarily mained necro from release till october last year before going for an evade thief, was really excited about it put alot of effort into learning it in PvP then they kill it. Fortunately Revenant is looking like an alternative, but for how long? Say i start working on a high evasive, risk/reward revenant, will it get destroyed 6-7 months from now?

Mesmer is gaining all this popularity, more people no doubt are running it as a main but we all know it is going to get nerfed possibly destroyed and players will come back here and begin the whole “buff please!” and “suggestions” threads again and Anet would have probably given the title of top dog to another class.

If this power shifting keeps on going, and builds keep getting wrecked every other year, i can definitely see myself replacing this game with something else.

Morfedel.4165:

I mean really, he seems a bit too powerful when compared to the other three legends. Or perhaps you could say the other three seem underpowered compared to him.

I dont think Legends should be compared like that. Each legend is only as powerful as the second one you are using. With all of Shiro’s damage and mobility if you arent handling the conditions or running defensive stuff like protection and stability and evades, you will get slaughtered.

It all depends on what your primary is, if you are healer before DPS, then ventari/Shiro and then run more healing traits than damage traits, if full tank, then Jalis/Ventari, if only direct damage, Shiro/Jalis with damage traits, tanky direct damage, same thing but damage reduction traits. The combos, go on and on.

As someone who has played a lot of thief (a few thousand matches) and fought against a lot of them on other classes, the problem with thief (as well as mesmers) is stealth, those two classes have way too much of it. I dont see it as even halfway decent design to allow any class to always be able to vanish into thin air, remain untargetable and reset a fight while simultaneously being able to kill anyone in less than 5 seconds. If there was more counterplay to this like reveal skills with CDs or traits with ICDs that block skills from stealth.

The damage, getting outnumbered, even evades would be perfectly fine If stealth was severely limited, better access to reveal for other non stealth classes and all other classes have a few mobility skills even if not as much as thief or mesmer.

Tim.6450:

Lynnie.7213:

A lot of people were saying its a necro killer because necro couldn’t stand a chance in 1v1 against a Revenant.

Lol, people really said that? A class with slow cast times, low amount of stunbreakers and low amount of condion clears which were replaced with stab and resistance without cover boons would beat a necro?

its because even though Revenant was revealed incomplete, it was a heck of a start. Condis all over the place, high stability up time, the crazy elites, people simply filled in what they expect was missing like the active defenses and dps and came to the conclusion that once the class is complete it will over shadow necro.

Naa..not a problem for me, im focusing on the person attacking not the flashy stuff. I actually zoom out to the max so i can see more of what is happening. I would rather have all the pretty colours on my screen than nothing at all (stealth)

Roy Cronacher.1576:

Thanks for the feedback. This is definitely the type of stuff we are looking for, keep it coming.

Kronos.2560:

A few skills are unable to be used unless in combat. ex
-Vengeful Hammers
-Energy Expulsion (seems to require 51 energy) kind of strange…
-Embrace the Darkness
.. I think i forgot some but those work for now.

Not sure if these would count as bugs or maybe its supposed to be like that. Either way would be nice if they get fixed. Hopefully they fix them, kind of annoying to have to sit the and summon hammers after the surprise attack has happened, instead of prepping for it.

The energy mechanic is kind of weird when out of combat right now and that’s something we’ve already addressed internally. In the next iteration you’ll see it’ll have the updated energy bar.

Basically, you can’t use the upkeep skills right now because you don’t have the upkeep to spend to use them because when you are out of combat energy upkeep drops from 5 per second base to 0 when you are resting at 50% energy. In the new version you will always be at 5 per second base, it’ll instead just cap energy at 50% out of combat. Which should solve a lot of the weirdness.

The energy expulsion issue is probably a bug as it should be costing 50 energy.

(I am assuming Shiro is one of the new legends)

Hi Roy, after the recent annihilation of the acrobatic thief which led me to stop playing the class, I am hoping that the fast paced active defense role will be filled by Shiro on the revenant, will that be the case?

I also want to understand something about this test. Without proper defense and damage legends as well as the weapons and 2 missing trait lines why do the beta now? when those legends get introduced all the feedbacks and balance suggestions may become obsolete because all the missing stuff could significantly change the dynamics of the class. A skill that is underpowered now on Jalis for example when used with Mallyx might become viable when used with Shiro.

Its not like its a good idea to make the legends incompatible with each other because there are stats to worry about. If i were to use Mallyx and jalis then i would be using something like rabid but if i were to be using Shiro and Jalis and Shiro had mobility then i would use zerker or Marauder. I wouldnt use something like Mallyx and Shiro unless i intend on might stacking because other wise they would be incompatible. If people planned on making a hybrid like that, they wouldnt be able to give proper feedback on mallyx because Shiro is missing.

My point basically is doing the beta now and making changes based on non bug related feedbacks when there is still 1/4 of the class missing might lead you to make underwhelming or overwhelming changes. It would be great if we had more info about the rest of the legends at the very least the general idea behind them and the skills so people can give better educated feedbacks.

Bhawb.7408:

“Its a beta” – ANet
“OMG WHY ISN’T THIS PROFESSION PERFECT” – testers

And we wonder why they don’t come on the forums.

See here is the thing, typically I would agree but revenant is not just imperfect, it is a complete disaster of a class. I would happily give Anet the benefit of the doubt and say perhaps there is a few things they want to test specifically, perhaps bugs before rolling out the rest of the class, or synergy between the traits already released. The reason i can’t is because of history. They seem to not know how to balance a class that works fundamentally different from what Guild Wars 2 combat is about.

Look at necro, they decided to give this class no mobility but at the same time give us virtually no stability meanwhile every other class can stun chain. Please explain how that makes sense. They finally give us FTG stun break after 2 years but the only way to take advantage of it is to not be squishy outside the only effective defense we have which is shroud. After 3 years we finally get good stability on the reaper but now we are seeing mind boggling nerfs in other areas such as chilling darkness. How could they sit there and justify a 5 sec ICD on a 2 sec chill duration when all the AoE blinds last 5-6 secs.

Personally im not going any where near Revenant with a 10 foot pole if at least one of the next two legends doesnt have any mobility skills. Can’t believe they are making the same mistakes after 3 years. Can only hope this is just a bug/synergy test and they really have learned a few things.

I want to make a suggestion concerning chilling nova trait. It would be great if it also caused a combo field just like Death Nova. I’m sure this isn’t a balance breaking suggestion since the two traits are so similar.

Also want to again say that the “Chilled to the Bone” skill needs a complete revamp. 2 second cast time with a 120 second CD is basically saying you don’t want the skill to be used outside PvE. I would suggest dropping the cast time to 3/4 of a second, fast enough so we can avoid getting blinded during the cast most of the time but slow enough for people to avoid it sometimes. The cooldown should be at about 60 seconds, because it can be negated quite easily. Using Augry of Death to shorten the cooldown to 39 seconds is fair since we would have to give up the close combat control trait Chilling Nova for it.

1: Yes
2: Continuous AoE blind
3: Shorter cool down. Wells in general should get the 20% cooldown reduction baseline and instead of 3 seconds of protection should pulse protection.

I find Well of darkness to be a game changing skill. It allows me to beat elite transformations like Rampage without using an elite skill or waste Sroud. Allows me to fight thief ambushes or counter attack groups without being forced into a speed battle. Really great skill if you want to heal without being interrupted. Before the June 23rd patch i never really used it but now i do i dont see a good reason not to.

The downside to it is, you cant use it too early or too late. Best used when you are about to take a burst rotation or about to start one mid fight

Sigmoid.7082:

Ragion.2831:

I dont know why this just occured to me.. the “Chilled to the bone” skill is really bad, monumentally bad actually. It can miss.

Our elites are summons and transformations so no chance of a misfire unless interrupted, and even then it goes on partial CD but this new elite has a 2 second cast time which is complete BS because during that time anyone can blind us which means the skill will miss and go into full CD. Someone please tell me i am mistaken, please tell me Anet didnt just give us a useless Elite.

I wouldnt say its useless. Can be a game changer if you land it. Other elite skills can also miss or be made useless if you use them at the wrong time so no reason why this shouldn’t be any different.

I dont mean useless in the sense that the skill it self is useless, I mean that it has an extremely high chance of not hitting. If it had entangle’s cast time and CD then that is a different story, but two second cast time? 120 second CD? first of all you would need to use infusing terror to stay stable, a skill that pretty much requires another skill to be successful is already a bad sign. To make matters worse you would need to drop an Aoe blind to prevent being burst down during the cast. Finally if a DP thief (or any class with blind for that matter) is in the area, forget about hitting. That is what i mean by useless.

I dont know why this just occured to me.. the “Chilled to the bone” skill is really bad, monumentally bad actually. It can miss.

Our elites are summons and transformations so no chance of a misfire unless interrupted, and even then it goes on partial CD but this new elite has a 2 second cast time which is complete BS because during that time anyone can blind us which means the skill will miss and go into full CD. Someone please tell me i am mistaken, please tell me Anet didnt just give us a useless Elite.

Eremite i came across that type of ranger about 2 days ago and this ranger was 1 level away from Dragon, needless to say it was no contest till we got to sky hammer where it was just me chasing and the ranger constantly retreating in stealth. The only threatening thing about LB rangers is the stealth, which is not a unique problem. We have no counter play for it, why none of our skills reveal is beyond me then Anet limits our range, our mobility then tells us to go fight classes than can just keep resetting. What i would give for 5 mins with one of these devs. Anyway i digress.

My point is if you are having problems with certain classes or builds then you are most likely making builds that ignore the lack of mobility. I had this same discussion with a skilled necro friend of mine recently. The zerker meta needs to stop, necros wandering around trying to spit out all the damage in Tyria is what is causing a lot of the problems we are seeing. We have established Anet doesnt know how to balance the class to compensate for the lack of mobility so we have to do it ourselves by focusing on the good stuff Anet has recently buffed or thankfully left alone, counter attacks and sustain.

Using little to no defensive traits while having low toughness and not enough cleanses means if your burst is canceled you are screwed, either by your target or by someone else, if your heal is canceled, same thing. Considering most other classes have negates and stuns and can disappear into thin air, being left wide open will happen a lot. So what can you do when that happens? absolutely nothing if any hit can send you halfway to respawn.

I wish they had left the vulnerablity at 10 stacks, all they needed to do to balance it was switch it with the condition from masters of corruption so it lines up with plague sending. I don’t actually know why blindness in the first place, of all the conditions they choose blindness.

This is it folks, i had a feeling this reaper thing was too good to be true, the next thing is an ICD on chilling force and blighters boon. After that, an across the board nerf to Necro’s chill durations.

Chilling darkness is now quite useless on its own meaning there is little to no point taking it over plague sending unless you plan on taking chill nova. Instead of having the ICD at 1 second so it procs a few times when using well of darkness (that has a 50 second CD) or Nightfall (25 seconds) nope, you make sure it only procs once for a pointless duration of 2 seconds. Nicely played Anet, nicely played indeed, I should have known better than to take that reaper reveal seriously.

Eremite as a long time necro, unfortunately i can’t agree with the problems you put up here. Necro has only 3 problems; There isn’t much defense if you run a high offensive build. Unlike most classes who can just bail when they take too much damage, we can’t. The second is dealing with stealth heavy classes and the third is dealing with ambushes.

Kiting builds used to be a problem till they changed the trait system and buffed siphons. Now i run just about all the blind skills we have minus boon conversion so all the builds you mentioned aren’t much an issue unless I have no shroud and i missed all my life force skills or the player is somehow reading my mind.

As for ranger, i find dark path and running behind obstacles helps a lot there. A LB ranger typically has 3 options to mantain distance, point blank, immobilize and cripple, this is where Death Magic and FTG helps a lot. Negate the point blank remove the conditions, tank the rapid fire and pop dark path.

I find the protection after shroud, stability on shroud and cleanse on shroud is a lot more useful to me in a normal match than single target burst. Counter attacking just seems to play out better than always risking taking huge damage from someone else to burst one target when you cant retreat afterwards.

The best reason for the DM line is the cleanse, honestly without Shrouded removal I dont know how I would be able to handle the constant torment from mesmers, really broken burns and movement stopping conditions and still have enough hp to handle more attacks since of course i can’t leave.

Captain Unusual.9163:

Ragion.2831:

Great question, especially since we already have so many other sources of protection compared to stability.

Here is another question, why is spectral wall a line and not a ring? it is supposed to be a combo field, so since when was a combo “field” a straight line in the ground. I never really used it much so it never really occurred to me. Now it has, it is quite irritating to think about.

Why is Line of Warding a line and not a ring?? Why is Temporal Curtain a line and not a ring? Why is Flamewall a line and not a ring? Since when is a fire field a line of fire? That doesn’t make any sense!

You should probably read my second post before commenting, what ever shape its in the point is on necro spectral wall shouldn’t be as restricting, even if it is, there should be a ringed version of it. All the ‘fields’ you mentioned have a ringed counterpart on the same class so why not necro? All the classes that have those fields have more mobility than necro so it doesnt really matter how restricting the skill is for them.

For simplicity sake sure lets call what is virtually a line in the ground a field, still doesnt change my point, considering the mobility issue spec wall should either be changed to an area skill similar to ring of fire or we should get an AoE counter part in addition to it.

Bhawb.7408:

A field can be any shape, it doesn’t have to be a massive circle, and strictly speaking Spectral Wall isn’t a “line” it is a thin rectangle.

And why would you care about losing three stacks of torment with all you gain with Reaper? That’s a completely inane complaint.

You miss my point, i dont care about the loss of torment, The reaper stuff is all well and good. The point here is that little things that could be done to compensate for the lack of one thing or another arent being done or takes them months and years to do. FTG stun break is a good example.

The old FTG had no place as a grandmaster major if all it did was grant stability when we had no mobility to better defend against stun locks and barely any stability to begin with. I would have put it as a grandmaster minor and had a trait that adds 15% more damage while in DS in its place. Now its a stun break and we get more stability as reaper so now it makes more sense to have it as a GM major.

The need to emphasies on burst with the spite line also makes the class vulnerable to groups of players, I opted to better defend against groups by running traits more defensive but now waste too much time trying to deal with mobile classes.

Unlike Dagger auto, axe auto needs a target to be able to hit through stealth, considering the only defence we have against attacks from stealth heavy classes is Death shroud which degrades why doesnt axe 3 at least reveal? The cooldown on it is fair compared to the stealth abilities of certain classes. Its not like we can easily port away and wait for the target in stealth to be revealed without taking any damage.

A ringed spectral wall is simply another one. Something like this will do quite a lot for necro without breaking it:

-Flexibilty when trying to combo. We already have limited movement, standing on a line while trying to blast minions you have little control over the movements of is such an unnecessary limitation. Limiting the direction we can leap to gain chaos armour or spin to apply confusion are also really pointless limitations
-Aoe Defense to at least shake off being overwhelmed for a few seconds since we have limited escape..
-Aoe trapping. It is a fair trade for the limited range and chase with reaper especially. It is also possible for thief and mesmer to port out of it and stability works through it so its not like it is a game breaking change.

Anyway you look at it a ringed spectral wall is simply a decent strategic upgrade.

Bhawb.7408:

It is a line because it is a wall, and there are a number of line fields.

Thats a little absurd, the logic of a field being a line is quite amusing nevertheless other classes have mobility to tolerate that kind of logic not necro. Guardian even has a ringed ward and they have more chase than we do.

With reaper we lose torment but we gain confusion as a combo, how on earth is soul spin supposed to combo properly with a short line in the ground. Tainted shackles is omni directional but the soul spin-spec wall combo isnt? I gotta question that trade off.

Great question, especially since we already have so many other sources of protection compared to stability.

Here is another question, why is spectral wall a line and not a ring? it is supposed to be a combo field, so since when was a combo “field” a straight line in the ground. I never really used it much so it never really occurred to me. Now it has, it is quite irritating to think about.

The stealth issue is something i really don’t understand. Burst, do over 10k, stealth so there is nothing the other non stealth class can react to, come back, do another 10k stealth…i mean it is absurd. That is why of all the defensive mechanics on thief i assumed stealth would be the one that would get limited.

I expected more emphasis to be put on active defense such as blind, ports and evades so its no longer a game of hide and seek but a test of reaction time and decision making. It did not cross my mind that Anet would be so blind enough to encourage unskillful gameplay like stealth spamming so this Acro nerf really came as a shock.

Theres nothing more painful to watch than 2 dp stealth reliant thieves fighting. or one of them fighting a class like necro. Necro is always the one that is forced to waste staff and wells cooldowns while thief is invisible just to avoid or mitigate the high damage attack advantage. Often times youll see a guardian waste shield of wrath to avoid the same thing.

Blinds can be countered by, condition transfer, condi conversion and fast cleanses like smite conditions . Evades can be countered by well timed skills, pressure and conditions but Stealth can only be countered by sheer luck or revealed that either not every class has access to or those who have access to it has to sacrifice something important.

A few weeks ago Devs were talking about putting emphasis on skillful gameplay like steal shortening trap cd and stuff happening when you meet certain conditions, i was silently rejoicing thinking we are going to see dynamic play at its finest, no more passive damage negation like endure pain, signet of stone and excessive access to stealth. Wow was I wrong.

babazhook.6805:

It a case of too many changes at once. One does not make conditions more effective and easier to apply while at the same time weakening a given classes best means of condition removal. What should be done is wait and see the impact of all those conditions and than tweak as required.

It the same with Vigor. You do not remove feline grace and cut vigor return in half and make Vigor reliant on a successful evade and then remove the vitality and boon duration from the same traitline all at the same time.

I think it going to take a long long time to get this all back into some semblance of balance. It is not that the traits added or removed are bad , it just the full impact of how they all woked together as part of the whole was overlooked. Some of this will be player adaptation to be sure , but a whole lort more will be patches and tweaks.

This, so much this, i mean really. If i was part of a team doing balances I sure as hell wont balance blindly, how can a competent thinking design team change so many things at once and pretend to know the full effects of the changes on such a large scale. You make slight adjustments over time so people can adapt easier.

There has always been tremendous backlash when a company does an overhaul on anything people are used to already (e.g Windows 8 ).

It is so difficult to suddenly erase reflex actions you’ve acquired over many months. It would have made more sense to force a choice between effective stealth and effctive evades and then factor in skill. For example:

- Giving us off hand sword and moving flanking strike to a Sword/Sword set, then have the number 5 skill not have stealth on it.
- Having feline grace return flat endurance on a succesful evade with no cooldown
- Endless stamina improving vigor by 100% not 50%
-Better condi cleanse. what in the actual f!k is signet of Agility or Trickster supposed to do with a 1 condi removal Why should i be forced to run rune of lyssa and pick pain response over vigorous recovery? just to be able to handle 3k burn ticks and condi bursts.

I have ZERO interest in spamming stealth, it is not my playstyle. Having my evade playstyle destroyed just because stealth is also a possibilty is ridiculous. Have one be effective at the expense of the other not just nerf blindly.

The elite specilization had better be good or there is a high chance i will drop this game

If an acro thief is evading attacks and people argue dodge spam, the acro thief can argue he/she is knows when you are attacking so therefore evading. You can only prove dodge spam if you stop attacking and the thief continues evading seconds after.

So i ask again, how on earth can people prove evade spam. As someone who has fought many acro thieves, evade spam rarely works because once the opponent has identified you are spamming you will lose.

There was a case where i was surrounded by 2 rangers and another class, I had no choice but to start only evading, manually and with S/D for a few seconds to dodge the multiple rapid fires, point blanks and burst from the other person. The moment they had let up, i was able to cloak and dagger and escape. if i didnt do that it would have been back to respawn for me. Is that spam? no because i knew what i was doing and my evades were timed so why do I have to get punished for that?

This is beyond irritating, all the work ive put into acro thief since picking up the class last october is gone. I dont even have enough evades anymore to take on two people effectively.

As a thief i think Its better it stays this way, counter play to thieves who constantly passively avoid damage

Did they nerf acro thief?

I’m in your situation too but after 3 years just found out on wiki you don’t use just any high level rare or exotic gear but only weapons. Not one of my proudest moments. This whole time I was never going for a legendary so i was just tossing stuff into the forge expecting a wild precursor to appear at some point.

Josh Davis.6015:

Bhawb.7408:

Thanks dude, that’s good to know.

I’m curious, does this mean Spectral Walk (first activation) won’t be able to break stuns that occur mid-air, so things like knockbacks/launches?

If you’re knocked-back in air you won’t be able to use Spectral Walk until you touch the ground. If you get knocked back while jumping, as soon as you hit the ground you can break it, just like other stunbreaks. However, if you already used Spectral Walk and then get cc’d in air, you can return back with Spectral Recall.

That said, as long as you’re on the ground you can stunbreak at any time. Hope I understood your question correctly.

While we are on the the topic of air stuns and stun breaks, maybe we can have a discussion about air immobilize and why that is still a thing

Dadnir.5038:

Blood magic was improved, the siphons now works through shroud and there is quite a number of them on top of all the siphon sigils and runes. Think about how much time you spend in DS, think about the reaper spec and how much healing that line alone has, the attacks are faster which affects the blood magic line, and then there is the chilling nova, chilling force and blighters boon combo.

Sorry to say it but most of us think about the “necromancer” not the “reaper”, because the day of the reapers are still far away in a long long and undetermined futur.

Otherwise, if you allow me to bet, I’d say that soon after this update, minion will be nerfed because a minionmancer with blood magic will have a stupidly high sustain while non minionmaster will struggle.

On an otherhand, more self inflicted condition wouldn’t be an issue IF we had option to be rewarded for them. Baseline nerf on the assumption that you will take a single trait is still an overall nerf for the profession and for diversity. And, since I’m at it, I want to point that support and debuff are 2 things that are vastly different (also, debuffing ourself is vastly different than buffing ourself).

Cmon man, reaper is i would guess 3 maybe 4 months away (most likely this year) Anet is going to consider the reaper line as they make these core spec changes. They wouldn’t rebalance based on the current game then over haul everything in just a few months.

Its a little shortsighted if anyone isn’t already considering what the classes will play like when HoT drops.

When you account for what the reaper shroud is capable of traited, heals like “Your Soul is Mine” might actually be useable, more so now with some of the core changes. If you can achieve a decent amount of cleanses and toss in some of the new healing traits, It is very possible to make Consume Conditions unnecessary, maybe even a bad choice since it has a long cast time.

Honestly i want to get rid of having to use Flesh wurm and consume conditions because that cast time is a problem when facing groups of good players with stun heavy builds

Tim.6450:

Ragion.2831:

Has anyone here even stopped to think about what build they will go with. Has anyone here actually thought about what the new meta will be. Has anyone here even considered how much this change to CC improves condition builds. Of course not because the ones complaining here probably started playing a few months ago or doesnt even main necro.

Yes actally I go spite, blood magic soul reaping power necro. No curses and no transfers so CC is a nerf for me. Also how does an increased cooldown and extra vulnerability on your heal will help a condi necro when you have just cleansed your condi’s so transferring them is not a good option and the corruption trait competes with both terror and path of corruption?

Also I mained necro for at least 1 or 2 years now.

Blood magic was improved, the siphons now works through shroud and there is quite a number of them on top of all the siphon sigils and runes. Think about how much time you spend in DS, think about the reaper spec and how much healing that line alone has, the attacks are faster which affects the blood magic line, and then there is the chilling nova, chilling force and blighters boon combo.

If you are going into blood magic then you are probably focused on healing, so not just from blood magic alone because if there is anything we know about Anet is that they dont allow players to be effective at doing any one thing using one single source.

Spite also has a healing trait and we know how fast a necro can burst with that line, so its not going to be hard to get the trait to proc often.

Imagine you are trying to balance the necro with all this in mind, are you trying to say that increasing the CD on consume conditions makes no sense?

Also one other thing, with these many changes it is possible you might have to rethink your combination. I run Curses Death Magic and Soul reaping, had a lot of success with it, more so than the meta but with all the new stuff, i will be changing it because a lot of the new traits seem to have gotten better at doing what i typically try to do. You might also have to change things up as well.

Has anyone here even stopped to think about what build they will go with. Has anyone here actually thought about what the new meta will be. Has anyone here even considered how much this change to CC improves condition builds. Of course not because the ones complaining here probably started playing a few months ago or doesnt even main necro.

I don’t know what all the complaining is about, We got heal through Shroud as well as a buff to the number of healing traits. So many healing traits can be used simultaneously, passively no less. It is only natural that they would increase the CD on consume conditions.

The funny thing is you can drop the CD on the heal to 20 seconds and Necro has enough cleanses and transfers to more than easily negate the effect of corruptions. I prefer the new consume conditions to the old an i see no reason why it will or should be changed back.

If you dont want to use curses then chances are you are going to be picking up healing traits that work through DS or enough damage reduction traits to not miss the 30 second cooldown on consume conditions.

There are many other reasons why the change to consume conditions is a good thing, opens up a very interesting strategy in particular i will have great fun messing with.

I feel really bad for the devs to have to witness such shortsightedness on the forums.

Can’t believe i made the mistake of expecting some optimism when checking the feedback. This is like the reaper reveal but much worse.

Every single trait that Has changed is actually a buff. For the first time in 3 years i am actually having trouble figuring out what build i will go with. The proc transfer is something i wasnt expecting, yes it could transfer things like cripple, 1 stack of vulns and 1 stack of bleeding but really? thats how you are going to look at it? thats the definition of glass half empty, actually this is pretty much glass virtually empty.

Consider p/d full condi thief, in my experience one of the most irritating thieves to fight and can also be one of the longest duels you’ll find. All of them pretty much start with a huge condi burst, they don’t waste time by applying conditions in small doses, are you saying a plague on crit isn’t game changing in that scenario?

Also you can actually time when you want to proc the signet. If you know that the signet is up you can work it into your attack pattern by delaying your hits when fighting condition builds instead racing to get in every single hit possible. Calm down, wait for condis, then start your burst.

If you re using rending claws, then your build must be broken, with 2 weapon sets, short ghastly claws cd and Shroud personally i don’t even have much of an opportunity to use axe auto.

I dont know how path of corruption is suddenly useless when it hasnt changed.

These are just a few of the many things wrong with the complaints. If still having trouble seeing how beneficial the changes are then changing mains might be the best solution.

can someone please explain endless stamina to me. Is that 75% endurance regen (50% base + 25% from trait) or 50% + 50% for 100% endurance regen

Dinks.2478:

It kind of doesn’t make much sense why this would take so long. The items already exist, the skins already exist, PvP tracks already exist. It can probably be set up in like 15 minutes. Everything has to be a big project with Anet. Even the simplest little Quality of Life changes need to be in giant patches for some reason. Maybe I can wrong but I don’t know why they need to make everything so kitten complicated. Even something as simple as revealing the new elite specializations requires months of mystery and breaks.

I agree with you for the most part but as far as the elite specs go it is probably because they are still working on them.

They’ve been planning HoT for a while, most likely since before they removed the skins which leads me to believe that those skins are going to be released with HoT not as pvp gear but PvE which will be pretty irritating especially for the people that grinded for them while it was available.

Those skins should be restrcted to pvp and be part of a reward track for Dragons, because the nerf to pvp xp created a lot more Dragons, and over time the title will not mean anything anymore.

Two things need to happen, reward tracks exclusive to Dragons and one more title that requires 3x (or more) the total xp required to get from rank 1-80 which also gives a legendary weapon of our choosing. The xp Dragons have gained since gaining Dragon of course should reset before this happens.

I think berserker will work but i don’t think berserker and spite trait line should be mixed. Ofcourse there are probably a few who have already decided to do this but it shouldn’t come as a surprise when they suddenly get one shotted by Dragon hunter trueshot with +50% damage.

Sigmoid.7082:

Bhawb.7408:

Yeah, that’s what it was thanks.

I just find it funny that with that and weakness you can be backstabbed for 300 damage with no investment to toughness.

It is pretty funny, but thats the way it should have been in the first place. Better late than never i suppose.

IronPhoenix.2045:

Guys Reaper is made for TEAMFIGHTS dont forget that.

Not quite true, Reaper was made so necro can handle getting ganked better. Vanilla necro is always being tossed around, perma crippled and being forced into speed competitions with our long cast times and no burst skills. This is something that should not have happened in the first place, but again happy someone up there finally played pvp extensively enough to put in detailed fixes.

That 10 second stab on a 16 sec cd and ftg stun break, only 2 and half years late but we did it guys.

Unless my math is wrong, isnt it 66 from trait then 10 from 4 runes and 15 from 6 runes making it 91 not 101? I think you counted stun duration

I’m hoping there will be newer armour on release I can upgrade to since what i’m wearing already exists

I don’t thnk some of you understand what Anet has done with the reaper. As it stands now, with any amulet and rune you can have up to 68% damage reduction (excluding weakness) and keep it that way for quite a long time, almost permanent.

Secondly Necro never had any ranged pressure, LB is too slow, staff shouldn’t even count as a weapon (i personally don’t understand how it made it to zerker meta builds). Anet has finally given us chase that doesnt need a target, and if we arent going to get a decent escape then chase is the next best thing especially since they’ve bumped up healing and chills.

Gs/staff should work because of the way Reaper shroud is, but staff should either be the first or middle of your rotation not the last or you will likely lose time waiting for weapon swap or RS cooldowns to do damage

Staff works for 3 reasons:
- fear which chills and allows you to hit ex scyth, which allows you to do some insane combos that also reduces damage taken
- blast finisher and transfer which again allows for some great combos
-Chillblains which allows you to inflict 3 conditions if you combo, all of which also stacks damage reduction.

Most of these werent possible before reaper.

Lastly, the shouts are pretty incredible, but i’ll just point out 2 that some seem to under estimate “Rise” and “Your soul is mine”. Without giving my build away i’ll just say that on their own yes they don’t seem to out do the current skills but when combo’d with certain gear and traits they should make Zerker builds a lot more dangerous than they are now.

As much as i give Anet $_it for their absurd implementations and fixes that should not have been needed in the first place. The level of thought that went into the Reaper is astounding, and I applaud them, including the animation team.

Zwets.3785:

Even if you improve the pet AI, it will never be perfect, because it will never be as smart as a human.

It doesnt have to be as smart as a human, it should just do what a human says it should do (follow and attack). We aren’t asking for autonomous AI

Bhawb.7408:

We don’t need all that fancy crap, literally just fixing the AI to work as intended is fine. We don’t need commands, that is what Rangers do, we just need them to not have pathing issues.

yea not what i meant. I’m refering to all the times i want golem to attack instead of standing and staring at me and when its not on its own keeping up with me or my target. Tracking is what im talking about.

I found it odd as well but its just different, people will get used to it