Guild Wars 2

While I do hope that the time limit will be improved I doubt that it would be changed for WvW.

Evon is a weasel, he’ll first rescue his monetary goods and then secure a passage for himself. We’ll probably see him again, somehow he reminds me of Scarlet in that respect.

You are correct. Makes more sense too!

Neverminder.3296:

Yeah, obviously we need more old men with white beards screaming.

Ah, umm, you don’t really scream a litany. I don’t think you are supposed to. I’d more envision myself like Jules Winnfield in Pulp Fiction, reciting a verse while poking enemies with the pointy end of my sword.

“And I will strike down thee, who dost not listen and giveth me the loot freely! For the path to a legendary is beset on all sides by the inequities of RNG and the tyranny of evil grind!”

Or something like that. Sorry getting carried away a little.

For lest not forget there is a helmet that magically let’s beards disappear.

The more I think about it though, the skill being a meditation, I would have liked to see a variation of the “Smite Condition” icon.

As the mystic forge explodes, all it’s magical content will rain all over tyria. Hero’s of the first hour will be able to pick up a gazillion weapons and armour off the ground in all zones.

The symbol itself looks like a variation of the “Symbol of Wrath”
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Symbol_of_Wrath

I would interpret the upper “light” part as a representation for healing, but it’s not very intuitive.

I make easy now, I make new character, I give him name “The Meta”. I make new trait every week, you can copy. I make only one class though! One class is Meta, you play other you no meta. You may omega.

I no take serious. I can no take serious. You tell player a to do meta, he no meta player, he not knows. He better non-meta. He may be awesome non-meta. He crushed on the floor now, reaching up meta-hand for entire event. No win.

I make even easier solution. I come for beginning of new “raid” events. I make meta achievement (is pun in there? was not wanted). I help everyone by not coming to raid event. Ultimate meta.

Count number of word meta in post. Win.

For Grape Juice!

Extract all information from leaderboards – potential of 26k players (eliminate doubles).

Keep track of achievement points on a daily basis.

Extract all names from posts here on the board. Add them to your friends list if not on leaderboard, keep track of achievement points.

Visit every world, every day at different times, write down manually every account name that is not on your list yet, add to friends list if not on leaderboard, keep track of achievement points.

Do this for the next half year.

It’s possible to come up with a reasonable number (at least for one region), but it’s work.

Or (!) move to Seattle, lurk around the studio, bump into an employee, seduce him/her, buy lot’s of cookies, tickle the secret out of him/her. Might take half a year as well.

Or (!) apply for a job, get the job, find out … don’t tell anyone.

Soooo, since 42 is taken I take 420 000.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Yeah. GW2 was my first, and last, “free to play” game because the cash shop left such a bad taste in my mouth. It’s why I prefer to just pay a sub and have access to everything instead if getting nickel and dimed on things like bag slots and bank tabs.

Honestly, I should’ve followed my intuition when I first started. I remember feeling disappointed when I found out you had to buy bag slots and with the way items pile up I quickly found myself hurting for space. I gave it a shot anyway, because hey! No sub.

I don’t have a particular problem with that. Of course we all play different, but you could basically treat it like a $10 per month sub if you’d like. With the bonus of not paying for updates (so far) and the option to convert your gold.

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

I love what they did with the Marionette: give key-fragments for participating in the event and combine those to keys which open various chests. It’s really fun to open those chests again and again and again, even though it’s mostly greens.

What I’d like to see as a further evolution of this: combine all the 5 keys to open a new chest which has at least a guaranteed rare and a good shot at (some) exotics (+ a really good chance for something non-combaty – like the Mini)

I’d agree here, but I don’t agree with the direction the event went on the flipside. Like … do it again and again and again. In a sense it is the same as “destroy 20 sonic periscopes in 5 maps”, but it is less flexible – I can’t “adventure” and run into it – I have to be there, wait for it, look at the clock, wait for it … to me that is a worse kind of a grind than killing 1000 Aetherblade mobs.

The loot chamber etc was really nice. Although here as well this underlying "do it again because you only have 18 dodads and you need 25 for another key. Argh I think they are still clogging up my inventory.

I thought the trading post was supposed to be a clean environment. Not like the auction house where people can take advantage of others. To me this falls in this category.

But it certainly is not on my top list to fix.

Honestly, check out the profession forums. That might help you more. There are usually some synergies between your traits, weapons and weapon-swap. Get some ideas and see how that plays out for you.

Don’t worry about the stats on your gear until your 80. In general yes, rule of thumb is learn when to dodge/interrupt if possible and maximize dps. For party play bring some utilities.

Nike.2631:

(…) I do think we need to eventually see something in-game that makes non-forumite players aware that their game is being talked about in an open fashion and they are invited. (…)

Absolutely. But not personalized. I believe the exposure would not be that great in any case. An actual email similar to the ones we are getting about the living story segments might be better. In-game mail or at the login screen could be possible too, but how many will leave the game at that point to read the forum and/or simply forget after their gaming session.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

(…)

Secondly. We all really need to work on getting some concise posting going on these threads so we get less “walls of text”. (Scribbles that down for a future Mesmer skill) Part of this is backing away from the “micro” side of ideas and staying with the “macro”; don’t get caught up in the details when you post unless you’re asked by the mods for elaboration. Give an outline, not a full thirty-page proposal.

(…)

Which is kinda what was asked in the OP – should there be a message limit … I think there might be a need for that.

Second, after reading the back and forth between a couple of people – anything that does not contribute to the actual topic on hand should be purged on a regular basis. It’s distracting, frustrating and unnecessary.

I look at this like brainstorming. Short, pass the ball on and don’t keep it. It helps if the “official” voices catch the ball also and potentially contribute every so often.

No in-game titles please, even temporary. I also don’t feel there is a need for personal acknowledgment.

Cruy.

15 little kittens.

I guess we make stealth an elite skill like moa and everything is evened out?

Edit: Just teasing a little bit. I’m not sure what to think about it if it’s an intended change.

CC Danicia.1394:

I think I can fix that.

Engineers can fix anything! Even if it’s not broken!

Thanks for sharing

I probably liquified those amounts at that time … but heh, who keeps receipts.

Boots! Have we had boots before? Gloves, head-gear – even shoulders, lot’s of ’em, but now boots!

I think it’s awesome. Doesn’t phase me that it’s far off for me.

They are all redshirts … see a graphic explanation here:

http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/photos/uncategorized/2008/04/10/insp_expendability.jpg

iriyabran.6218:

Play a mesmer

Cue “Just an illusion” … and some inspiration for Anet Dev team for the next mesmer outfit.

I’m not surprised. Playing a blatant obvious P2W game on the phone right now in a “guild” of 100 people. Every time someone spends $100 you get a gift as well (also for 5, 10, 20 and $50) – not a single day goes by without a single one of those, I’d say an average of 6 daily.

Compared to that I think you are getting really good value here.

I think I’ve spent more than the traditional average of ~ $15 a month, but not much more.

CC Danicia.1394:

First thing I did was get the shield and pistol for my Engie. And the staff for my Ele…and so on and so on….

I checked the Engi forum for a screenshot … but alas no find.

This does not promote fair play but rather violence.

Save the Rangers! Say no to sprockets!

I would have been more concerned about the unicorns a while back …
And what is the disco-balls message, dance or die?
Wintersday – candy is bad for you?

I don’t have a character that can work with that theme, but in general I really like them. Especially the revolver.

ooooOOOOOoooo, there is something in the water.

What are we going for here, controversy, sarcasm, suggestion?

Suddenflame.2601:

Other games have loot as well such as Diablo and Diablo 2 which are not MMORPGs, but also have an economy and ability to play with other players. They are not as different as you want to believe they are. MMORPGs are highly similar to MRPGs which are closely related and 90% of those are mostly (SP)RPG. Loot and grindiness is the discussion of this forum (along with other random things apparently). RNG has little to do with other players as Diablo has RNG, Skyrim has RNG, etc.

Economy however is a main issue here as it is made up of Grindiness and RNG aspects. People are wanting less RNG and less Grindiness which by the way are the only two factors keeping the game’s economy from hyper inflation and devaluing of items. Basically by performing both the prices of items would fall (certain items), but the cost of other items (permanent bank access) would rise.

Grindness in this case of the game is only created due to RNG being as it is. People grind to get specific items which than they sell or use. If people kept getting said item repeatedly or were guaranteed said item the value of that item would plummet harder than a boulder in a bottomless ocean.

Exactly. You just have to ask yourself what the defining parameter is for any genre. Many games have many things in common and are still different. Plus the added twist here and there to set yourself apart.

I’m basically with you that there are worse games out there (for grind mainly) and since early on playing this game found the dilemma between “play the way you like” and the resulting change in loot structure.

It is a bit ironic that from a gameplay perspective I welcome other players (joining in on events etc) but from the economical aspect other players are worse here (from how it’s designed) than in any other game I’ve encountered so far.

Just as an example, WoW, about 6 years ago for me, I’ve always had enough gold basically to buy the majority of things available – especially from NPC’s.
The combination of “making gold” though questing and then “rewarding” yourself with a trinket, armour or mount was more satisfying from my perspective than dumping the materials I have onto the trading post to make some gold.

Of course someone else’s mileage varies, in my case the “play the way you want” (or can often) does not include many dungeons and fractals.

But I don’t have an answer. Hey, the loot for Teq and more was just “increased”, or the chance for ascended items I should say – thank you Zommoros, I knew you would read this, appreciate the speedy reply

Suddenflame.2601:

They share many design concepts actually lol. As RPGs share many commonalities design concepts are built around those. MMORPGs are not too different as they have to be designed the same. An MMORPG is only slightly different from a single player RPG.

I can take GW2, FW, PW, WoW, and other MMORPGs. Remove the network capabilities, add NPC henchmen, and adjust the events to make them easier to accompany the henchmen it would become a single player RPG. Main differences between an RPG and an MMORPG are, there is an active persistent economy and other people which content is designed around. Hence content not concept.

Ah, exactly. So since there are the two main differences playing into this, namely the economy and other players – both tied into loot/rng – stick to comparing that.

Because that’s what your thread is about.

Let’s not get into the details of why they are different and why other genres can tell other stories, allow for a more diverse character development/customization etc etc.

Suddenflame.2601:

They are an RPG and GW2 is an MMORPG. They share fundamental roots where as your little example of Sim City is in a completely different genre with no roots at all. There is always room for improvement but to know what to improve on exactly requires a healthy in-depth discussion such as, on the first page about the party and squad loot distribution system.

Yes, I did do that on purpose.
Still you cannot compare that, stick with the same genre. The point is as moot as if I would point out differences from single player RPGs like Skyrim.

They do not share the same design concepts.

Suddenflame.2601:

(…)

Demon Souls, Dark Souls, and soon Dark Souls 2 are not played for loot but rather for the challenges they present. If you went into Demon souls with a Loot mentality you will find the game boring but go into the game with my achievement mentality and the game is exciting. I am not a lazy designers delight but rather there nightmare.(…)

Demon Souls, Dark Souls … Action Role Playing Games.

Heh, I don’t play SimCity for the loot either. Which leads me to the question, why all over sudden compare the situation at hand with a different genre at all?

If you have to compare, then stick with MMORPGs.

Obviously I like this game, otherwise I wouldn’t be here, but there certainly is room for improvement and I am still waiting for the pre-cursor hunt and hopefully that will be the answer.

Otherwise I can assure you, I never had to even gather that many materials for crafting ever, in any online game. Well, maybe I would have had to if I had stayed (thinking AION).

Zommoros, if you read this, won’t you drop me an ascended greatsword.
My friends all wield legendaries, I must make amends.

Mightybird.6034:

(…) Like with the power nodes and the current living story. I’ve solo’d about 10 of them so far, but came upon one (which i had solo’d yesterday) that reset on me 6-8 times in a row. Couldn’t kill one freaking mob for some reason. Just kept resetting with super health regen, like 5 seconds into the fight. Drove me nuts.

I am aware some mobs are tied to certain locations and will reset if kited out of them. I’m not even talking about that (although that is stupid as well.)
(…)

Let’s concentrate on this part, what mobs were you fighting at this node – we will assume you did not try to kite them away from the node itself.

Guardian.5142:

I’m just gonna go ahead and sound REALLY ignorant… but… what exactly does a dolphin bring to a fight?

I’m not judging now, if you want to.. you know… tame ‘happy tree friend’ familiars that more or less give you warm fuzzies, but… unless you’re strapping a torpedo or something to him, isn’t this like… don’t bring a dolphin to a knife fight kinda logic?

I’m actually only half trolling you here… I do actually kinda want to know what kind of damage to expect when I find myself at the “business end” of a well trained, possibly ill-tempered dolphin…

Could have a sonic daze “attack”, confusion maybe. Fin-slap, head-butt ….

I guess something along this is what is in the back of peoples minds.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Molten-Alliance-Pick-Sickle-and-Logging-Axe/first#post1949758

Very awesome. But all of them would have to be asura.

Asura agglomerate!

All vistas are reachable. The one in Lions Arch on the Island is definitely unique. I don’t want to spoil anything, rest assured there are guides out there if you google them.

Very few are tied to a jumping puzzle, some are more of a pain than others, but even as a not-so-good jumper I managed them all without portal help.

If you look closely, within the personal story your tag shows up on the minimap. You don’t need to see it yourself. Outside you are not commanding the pact troops, ergo the tag is unavailable.

Umm…

brittitude.1983:

This was part of my point. There isn’t a reason to think that this item will cause wealth disparity. There isn’t a reason to think items offered in the future will either. It is rather a baseless speculation.

My point is two-fold.
a) This is not about “money” but the general direction of acquiring in-game materials
b) I wondered about how the materials for living story content will be acquired going forward and I do not agree with this particular solution.

This is also part of my point. No one is complaining about the nodes creating disparity with current players and future players or being able to become rich off these nodes due to limited supply. The watchwork sprocket is a node available through play. I don’t see how it is something only available through the TP.

Also, while everyone disagrees on what it means to win, I think everyone agrees that the pay part is with real-world money, not in game gold. So while it is expensive using the gold to gem conversion, just playing the game gets you gold.

Again, it’s (for me) the same point really, how is it acquired, not the quantity and not the “value”.

I appreciate your arguments and I was responding a little out of frustration with those that think this item is cause for concern and creating a precedence when there are other items that can be considered more pay to win.

However, the arguments that most of them items on my list can be picked up in the game through other means doesn’t contradict my point, since the home node harvesting and purchase from the TP allow the sprockets to be available to players by playing the game.

Let’s let the list aside – why not simply adding a chance for sprockets to drop from any node regardless of which tool is used … if this is really only about giving people an option to acquire the item?

I realize that the thread is not specifically with sprockets, but what else might happen. Your examples made me laugh, but I realize that some people might think this could happen and is why so many people see it as pay to win, and yet, I still don’t, regardless of the definition of winning. There are so many, and much faster and easier ways, of making gold than trying to harvest with a chance at gaining that item and resulting gold.

(…) snip because it’s not about the value

So if lodestones and silver doubloons entered the market through this method, you would be upset? (…) snip for lenght

Yes I would be upset. Realize the difference and the fine line. Technically yes, this game was “p2w” from the start because of the gem to gold conversion. However, the materials in question are not generated from someone who bought them from the store. They came through playing and are then traded. See how beautifully this is constructed, we are entering a half zone … the material is not bought directly, but only through playing with the item from the store you are acquiring it.

Which is of course also part of the next point.

I don’t disagree with your point here. However, as long as they are still available by playing the game, and it isn’t exclusively a gem store item, then I would not see it as a pay to win item. It is the same as buying gems with cash, converting it to gold, and then buying a stock of silk bolts from the TP today. I fail to see the difference.

So to continue this thought, where is the line then? Based on what? Would “we” complain if the pick would be available in-game for 10 silver? What if the pick only costs 100 gems? What if all the tools would have been like this from the start? Did people already complain until they realized that “heh, that guy has to mine 5mil nodes for this to become cheaper than with in-game tools”?

Yes, and this is the only downside I see to the pick currently.

But why? Is it because of the price point? (see above) Maybe in a year we’ll be able to buy a new tool for 2000 gems that will combine all the benefits of previously released tools?

I’m not sure why you said this. I think we should have more home nodes. I would like to see a pristine spore node actually.

The point here was how we will get them, not that the nodes themselves exist.

At the end of the day I’m not here to convince other players of my point of view. I like to present it and I appreciate reading different opinions. I think I said my part here and I am not trying to spread fear or discredit Anet. I also don’t usually jump into p2w threads, but in this case I believe a very fine line is being crossed and we should ask ourselves how it will change the game, our perception of the game and the genre in general.

brittitude.1983:

(…)

The only precedent, that I see, is allowing more supply on limited items to be available in the TP for current and future players. If this upsets flippers and speculators that like to hoard and depend on demand outpacing supply to make money, then I can only hope that this happens more often in the future. And maybe with past items too. Because yes, I would love it if the molten mining pick was converted to provide a random chance on azurite shards and orbs.

While I agree that pay to win is horrible, I do not think that this is setting or hinting at a precedence for a pay to win model. If this causes you to be worried, what about these items:
1. Magic find booster.
2. Wxp booster.
3. Karma booster.
4. Gathering booster.
5. Experience booster.
6. Black lion salvage kit.
7. Black lion chest keys.
8. Revive orb.

And yes, because there is a gold to gem conversion this should be an acceptable gem store offering.

I’m not a flipper or speculator in general. I’m not getting rich with my candy node nor do I expect to with the sprocket node (soon).

I do understand the difference of how items are acquired and point to another item like the new pick. The nodes btw did not cost me anything, they were acquired through play.

Now you can argue that you still acquire the pick through play if you convert your gold – which is the catch, you have to convert your gold – in a sense it was not “free”, it was paid for.

As to your list.

Magic find booster
Temporary item, also available in game through various means, previously a tradeoff for stats on equipment as well, now improved as constant general stat all over your account via luck and achievements.

Wxp booster
Seems correct, I don’t WvW too much though so I don’t know how often you get that through leveling etc. Stat was also recently changed to account – right?

Karma booster
Again available in-game, food, banners, again temporary item. Also added a constant level to your account via achievements.

Gathering booster
Banners, but agreed not to the same extent. Again this is temporary vs. constant when looking at the pick.

Experience booster
Available in game and constant achievement reward.

Black Lion Salvage Kit
Consumable. Drops relatively often, only increase in quality vs offering a chance of something extra.

Keys
Seriously? I park that under lottery, but ok – p2w then.

Revive Orb
Limited use in PvE, more convenience in my eyes.

Realistically I am not interested in sprockets at all. Currently I only see it as an alternative to level some professions a little bit – but needing 500 will limit that (since I won’t buy them on the TP). Maybe I’ll play with some runes further down the road, the only reason why I “wanted” the node from the meta is a certain sense of completion.

I mean the “Silver Doubloon Pick” or “Wand of Lodestones” might sound nice, but it baffles me how this cannot be perceived as p2w AT LEAST in a sense of an added economical pressure.

How about we drop the supply of any of the items even lower to extra ultra rare and then make them available directly in the cash shop? Bundle of silk, 100 gems, pile of silver doubloons, 500 gems …?

Where “should” be the line?

Will I need 5 different picks at some point depending on which kind of extra drop I might want?

How about we don’t get nodes as meta rewards anymore, but only a token. Ten tokens and you can buy the random node pack from the store – oh, of course those special tokens also drop sometimes from the BL chest.

I’m not even trying to be pessimistic.

All right, time for my 2 cents.

I saw the video and as a pretty much non-WvW, non PvP player I was disappointed. Not about the map, it’s great and we all knew it was coming – I’m somewhat surprised it came so soon. So I am happy for everyone that will have a lot of fun there.

No, the disappointment stems from something else, which seems to be the current direction. I’m not a big fan of the “open-raid” encounters for different reasons. I am not complaining about them in general, sure they can still be improved but it’s awesome this kind of content exists.

My disappointment stems from the conjunction between these types of content and the living story aspect, combined with the meta achievement.

In order to complete the meta you have to do one game mode (the open raid) more then once, I guess you could say at least 5 times the marionette and 3 times the wurm (or the different escorts towards it).

There is not even a different daily achievement, it’s always “participate” in one of them.
No dismantle energy probes, no defeat energy probe defenders (I guess that would be everything else possible in this case).

Now I’m afraid the same will happen with the next “living story” chapter.

All in the name of “educating” the players.

It’s a great idea to try and expose players to different content and it has been done all along. But for example with the first M&F dungeon – how often did you have to run it? Well once.

“Expose” me to different types of content, try to get me to play around with traits, different weapon sets and armour stats, no problem. But also give me an option to say no thanks, I’d rather do this instead (and still achieve the meta) and not having to look at the clock and be there at the hour for 20-30 minutes.

laokoko.7403:

Oh wait, if Scarlet is “permanent” added to the WvW maps. Does that mean she’ll never die? (sigh)

Outside time and space, this place it is.

It’s like the thread title says, a precedent.

So someone mentioned we can buy armour skins. Yes we can, but they don’t add anything (other than appeal to your taste) compared to other skins available in game.

To me this would be equal as to say the tools are double as effective as regular in-game tools. Imagine armour skins would add another stat that you cannot find in-game otherwise.

I might not care about the monetary value or the item in question or the advantage it gives – but I care about the precedent it sets.

Fast forward two years into the future, the new T8 materials, only available in your home instance through the store bought nodes or the new gathering tools that have a chance to drop them.

Exaggerated? Maybe, but better to make your opinion heard now than when it’s too late.

I guess for 800 gems (or whatever the tool costs) you could get more sprockets right now then you will mine the next 5 years with the pick … but as a matter of principal I agree, not cool.

Getting mining nodes as part of a reward through play is one thing, getting extras like that with a bought item is not right.

Why not double the yield of a node then? 20% chance to convert every normal node into a rich node for yourself with the “MineMorePickMe” pick, now from your convenient convenience store.

Nope, that wouldn’t be right either, which is why those tools are only as good as the best regular in-game tool.

This makes them better.

Looking forward to seeing the result and congratulations Askeptykal!

Yay, I’ll take twenty!

Seriously, are you saying I should buy for 185 and sell for 195?

scratches head

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Just wait for the Cantha update. That will be the best story content since Beta.

I had you all wrong. You are an Optimist!

lol

I would be more for something along this line if it’s in regards to the individual player. Sort of an reverse DR.

But I will have to agree with Smooth Penguin, I will be punished for missing an opportunity and worse … imagine how mad people would get if someone or a smaller group kills the champ “out of rotation” so to speak, or something never heard of, a guest kills the champ on your server.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

I just figured out the story…. Zommorros is controlling Scarlet!!!!!

Ah, so that’s where all my swords really go …

Neural.1824:

That would work, though I was thinking something more event related. Take Origins of Madness for example. Let’s say this was the last in this living story segment. The way it could play out would be that the Marrionette fight would be a lot more difficult, and if not one server ever completed the event by the final date, Lornar’s Pass would be turned into a wasteland, completely void of life except for twisted monstrosities left roaming around the land.
This would give the players a large stake in the course of the game.

Well event related is nice, but I would find it superfluous if for example my server never managed it, but because another server did everything is still ok.

That’s kinda what I meant by not seeing the progress.

Neural.1824:

On a simpler level, it could be game-wide. That’s how it was with the Ellen/Evon event.

Mhhh, so we would not see the progression, it would be tallied in the background and one day we get the result?

Your efforts where in vain as the rest of scarlet’s forces overrun (let’s say) Lions Arch.
cutscene

Victoriffic! Watch the surviving cowards flee.
cutscene

Or it could also be used to display the level of destruction, definitely some option there.