hotjoin much? Because i dont see that many thiefs or mesmers in 1vs1 tournies. Especially thiefs, i see them in like 50% of matchs on the other team.
Eles, guardians are more common.
Im sorry but if thiefs and mesmers are what is giving you alot of trouble, you are NOT playing at a high level yet.
I wonder if Anet has numbers that showing that pvp population is increasing…
It probably spiked with the introduction of spirit watch.
What anet probably doesnt have numbers for , and is definately happening is the disintegration of organized play and teams.
Which boads poorly for the long term.
Thiefs usually, but the rudest individual player ive met was an engy.
Monitor the speech time, 20 minutes for each player and 20 minutes for Anet (the 2 devs). Notify people by private messages when their speech time is running out rather than aloud as it breaks the pace of discussion though.
This is especially true for J Sharp. If you’re reading this, please keep it concise.
Noted.
And how about discussing the current state of thief stealth. Giving thieves the ability to hop in and out of stealth repeatedly, without penalty, cure conditions, self-heal, etc is simply not fun for anyone other than a thief.
Imagine giving warriors the ability to become immune to everything but AoE damage at will, as often as they like. While immune, they can heal and remove conditions from themselves. How broken is that!
You may point to the meta and show that thieves aren’t as broken as elementalists, but surely you cannot deny that they are completely broken in other parts of the game (WvW, hotjoin, etc.).
If you think thief stealth is fine, then please tell me what other profession can do this:
Even Warcraft knew how to balance stealth:
– any damage brought rogues out of stealth
– vanish was on a long cooldown
– runspeed was reduced while stealthed
– rogues had access to a very small number of abilities while stealthed
– rogues could not cure conditions in stealth or by going into stealth
– rogues could not heal in stealth or by going into stealth
Never have trouble with theifs tbh, i think this might be a learning curve thing. But thiefs who spec for regen/cure in stealth are just too slow to be useful. At least in premade vs premade. thats why you see NO THIEFS do this at high end play.
Unless your a condition class, you probably cant kill a bunker 1on1. AT least not in a reasonable timeframe. Its best to avoid fights with them, go somewhere else, or get a 2on1 if you want to take em out.
Theres a state of the game broadcast coming out on the 14th, i know alot of people are going to tune into it.
I hope its more concrete and less vague than the last one. Because, alot of us are going to use that to judge whether we stay or go.
the bunker is this games healer in way.
Maybe they could make Your MMR insible to anyone but you, unless you link it or something ( like if u want to prove you have a certain rating) .
Honestly i dont think theres a specific best team. Here are some takeaways ive learnt.
Eles are great-because they can be great orb runners without having to change specs.
Guardians are good bc bunker orb runners are good. -Santuary amzing.
Grenade engies are amazing in the teamfight at mid.
Other classes seem to be roughly as strong on this map as they are on others.
It’s insanely overpowered.
No, they are not. However they are a skill curve class. They are usually the first thing that people struggle with beating.
I play an engy, i beat 95% of the thiefs i run into. Good thiefs can get me, but good anything can get me.
If you want advice on beating thiefs, tell us what class you are.
Flamethrower is not fine in SPVP. Its grenades or bust, unless your bunkering, in which case bomb kit.
Talk about each professsion individually! thats a great suggestion.
How do you feel about where the warrior is, the ele is, etc etc.
Build variety! Some classes, like the mesmer are balanced/strong. But have basically only 1 build thats used.
I miss the holy trinity. But that ship has sailed.
AT this point it would be a betrayal of the game vision and the amount of people playing in this game to bring back the holy trinity.
It’s been 7 months already. Where are my viable builds?
Give specific examples of how you are going to change something for a class. If the devs acknowledge that Corrosive Poison Cloud is a useless PoS skill and finally plan on changing it, I want to know what they’re going to do to change it. If the devs understand that the Elemensalist and Mesmer are overpowered in every way, shape and form, I want to know what they plan on changing.
Here is an important topic I’d like them to talk about.
- Every class currently has an ability to stomp opponents, which is nice. Are mechanics such as shroud-stomp or mistform-stomp intended?
There are viable builds. They just haven’t been explored enough. 3 months ago, people were saying rangers were crap. Now, they’re the meta. 3 months ago, people were saying mesmers were the 1v1 king. Now almost anything can 1v1 them.
On the new map, I’m seeing plenty of new builds that I never thought would be viable before and are working.I don’t think the issue here is balance. I think the issue is features and how they are implemented and what is needed to ATTRACT players to the game. There is not a high enough player-base, therefore there is no competition, and this fends off people from continuing to play. It’s an endless cycle.
The devs need to find a way of first keeping whatever players they have left, and then focus on attracting new and old players.
My 3 suggestions are:
1.) Implement leaderboards and visible ratings/ranks AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.
2.) Get rid of hotjoins to be replaced by custom arenas. Solo Queu will then be MORE POPULATED which will lead to players being able to find teams.
3.) Use the QP system and create daily, weekly and monthly tournaments for more substantial rewards than the chests/glory.
These points are listed in my thread, however I picked the three that I felt are the most important.Hope this helps.
You do realize balance and bug fixes happened in that time. Three months ago mesmers hit way harder than they do today because shatter hadnt been nerfed yet.
Eles came into the meta pretty quickly after all there abilities got fixed.
Your partially right, there are good builds that arent figured out, but on the whole the meta is pretty stable nad hard to rock. Nothing moves the meta faster than balance/bug fixs.
1). Incentives to get more casuals to try out spvp. (like ability to earn experience or gold. People would come in to do spvp dailies that way. I dont want experience IN hotm , but no reason your overworld character cant progress there).
2) The fact that 8 team tournies basically don’t pop. What are you going to do here. I know your having trouble getting maps to rotate , but something like this is eventually needed so we can have just 1 Q. (unless you introduce solo q).
Hotjoin or tournaments? bc if hotjoin thief is your man. but try lazy thief in tournies and youll end up dead.
Im not sure if such an easy class exists in tournies, 100b warrior is simple to play if you dont mind dying alot (not dying alot is where the skill on it comes in). But u can kill things w it easy.
Grenades. Aoe destroys there clones, and mesmers are terrible at clearing conditions.
The once you learn to dodge/block a shatter youve won.
Beat out one shatter in a mesmers 1vs1 with you, and youve probably won, as llong as your landing a high percentage of gren.s
Seems like it, i havnt gotten a pop in ages. Pity i like the new map, but not all the time.
I honestly wonder if alot of these players are ‘hotjoin’ players. In hotjoin people come and go as they please, a bad habit for people once they start to try and do tournies.
I wonder if ppl know that initiative doenst effect utilties. Only your 2-5 abilities.
People need to consider that the devs aren’t entirely free to say what they would like, there higher ups place limits on what they can discuss. But ask the questions guys. I mean i know you cant bust there nuts about it, but you can ask.
@ the devs, in case they read this thread. Figure out something up and coming that you CAN talk about, and have that ready.
Maybe if this company gave people a format to duel in, this wouldnt happen. heres something you can do to help yourself out, stop using the join now button, and manually join servers that are nearly full, and bam problem solved.
To play a different map.
This is a problem in spvp for all classes. It almost washes out.
AS far as stun breakers go Elixir S is one of the best ones in the game.
Degrees of unstoppable, a mistform or exlir s is truly unstoppable. ( barring stealthing the person about to be stomped).
But anything that grants stability can be boon stripped-hard to time but good teams manage it sometimes.
And smoke fields dont prevent third parties from interupting. But yes, a handy list to have around of peoples clever ways to stomp.
List also thief shadowstep stomps.
Might stacking is definately the way to go with FT. For sure.
But, all the same this toolkit remains subpar in spvp. Grenade kit seems to be, by far the strongest offensive kit.
@Zoose, awesome bro thanks for engaging with us about this.
I’d like to know if theres anything they plan to attract people into doing spvp. I’ve always felt that if people could progress in spvp , as opposed to wvwvw, or pve then many leveling casuals would choose to do so. Even if HOTM itself has no gold/gear/level differences (which i support). It doesnt mean the overworld toon can’t level up because of HOTM. Pvp population needs help, and this would help more casuals spyher through it than anything else i can think of.
Secondly, i want to know about further balance adjustments. I know your ele got toned down a bit, but is still far as i can tell (at least on this new map especially), the strongest class. I feel a really tiny additional adjustment is needed. I also feel engineer/warrior need more love. The recent flamethrower buffs where insuffcient to make it worth taking.
I’ll think of more stuff.
Ride the lighitng isnt a teleport, and makes eles pretty much the best orb runners.
You can use some ranger abilties, some warrior abiltiies to run the orb faster as well.
Ask these guys to think of at least 1 or 2 definate things that they are working on for Spvp that they can get permission to talk about in somewhat concrete terms. I know that its not up to the devs in the interview to determine what they can say. So before this starts they should ask.
SOTG is important because for alot of players, right now, knowing whats up and coming in the short term is going to be really relevant to whether they stick round or not.
Yo. Since your probably going to ask only 1 question that any particular person lists.
Id like to know if they are going to improve spvp rewards. In particular the ability to earn xp or something like this, that would attract much more casuals to try spvp.
(i dont want levels in hotm itself , but to earn it somehow for your character outside the spvp world).
Also the ability to earn gold in spvp.
Avoid this by manually joining servers.
This game doesnt have a dueling feature so eppoel have to join empty servers to test stuff.
Ive been in pugs that beat premades, some of those rank 5 pve guilds that roll over to pvp and have no idea how to play or spec etc.
But overall, the class balance and voip means a premade will beat pugs.
This seems relevant here as well:
Since this thread is being read ive got some suggestions regarding the solo Q debate.
One of the primary concerns about it , is that it would divide the community. It’s obviously linked to what the OP is talking about here, as funnelling hotjoin players into proper matchs is really important. And for new players like that a solo Q might be very important.
For people to learn the game, and for it to be an esport people have to learn , at least a little, the meta and how the game is really played. Not like what you have with the come and go almost deathmatch experience of hotjoin. That way they will know enough to want to watch what better players are doing.
To wit.
Solo Q , should really be solo or duo. That way its not entirely 1 or 5 only.
And to help out with the ‘wait time’ on real teams quing for ranked matchs, here are some incentives ideas that would be easy on the development time.
1. Unique titles for winning ranked team games. and winning X number of them with certain classes. Somewhat like how we have tourny titles now.
2. A tiny cash prize for ranked team games, like 10 silver a win. That way someone can make gold in spvp. ( why not, this would be trivial compared the money people make in pve, and might drag players into doing team games).
3. As a consideration, consider the 1vs1 tourny implentation with ticket cost and 5 man team requirement? The pops that where happening where still fast. Teams will definately Q.
4. By allowing solo/duo Q, the only groups left out will be groups of 3. As a 4 man group can either, easily grab a fifth from map chat. Or split into two duo teams of 2 till they have more log on.
I myself am not dying for a solo q. But the community is, and these are i think good ways to help it happen that would invovle very little investment of dev time relative to other suggestions.
Ya i didnt use both sigils either. I also dont go up 10 into the precision tree but go into toolkit, this build focuses a bit more on condition than power.
might can go either way. So you could run a bersekers jewel w this. Heck if your smart carry both with you, vs eles and guards condition up. Vs thiefs etc, maybe powers the way to go.
interesting, if you see alot of burst like thiefs, i find putting on a shield useful.
Its funny bc this is the spec , more or less ive been running for weeks.
This actually looks like the spec i run already.
Link doesnt work. Is this an engy build?
From what i gather, warriors are very strong in pve land. So maybe this is why they are reluctant to buff stuff.
Do what you did with eles. distinguish pve/pvp.
I think its needed.
But really it should be solo/duo Q. That way you can Q up with one friend, even if you dont have an entire team.This already exists.
It does not. The game does not have a solo Q friend. It has a join solo button. Which can put you against full or partial premades.
Since this thread is being read ive got some suggestions regarding the solo Q debate.
One of the primary concerns about it , is that it would divide the community. It’s obviously linked to what the OP is talking about here, as funnelling hotjoin players into proper matchs is really important. And for new players like that a solo Q might be very important.
For people to learn the game, and for it to be an esport people have to learn , at least a little, the meta and how the game is really played. Not like what you have with the come and go almost deathmatch experience of hotjoin. That way they will know enough to want to watch what better players are doing.
To wit.
Solo Q , should really be solo or duo. That way its not entirely 1 or 5 only.
And to help out with the ‘wait time’ on real teams quing for ranked matchs, here are some incentives ideas that would be easy on the development time.
1. Unique titles for winning ranked team games. and winning X number of them with certain classes. Somewhat like how we have tourny titles now.
2. A tiny cash prize for ranked team games, like 10 silver a win. That way someone can make gold in spvp. ( why not, this would be trivial compared the money people make in pve, and might drag players into doing team games).
3. As a consideration, consider the 1vs1 tourny implentation with ticket cost and 5 man team requirement? The pops that where happening where still fast. Teams will definately Q.
4. By allowing solo/duo Q, the only groups left out will be groups of 3. As a 4 man group can either, easily grab a fifth from map chat. Or split into two duo teams of 2 till they have more log on.
I myself am not dying for a solo q. But the community is, and these are i think good ways to help it happen that would invovle very little investment of dev time relative to other suggestions.
(edited by daydream.2938)
Ive often though this, testing conditions over time is hard because the dummies die fast…whereas a player would heal, have protection, etc etc. I dont know what the lions arch dummies are like but that sounds like a good idea if its simply infinite life dummies.
Hey. Hoping a dev will read this.
I think buffing the flamethrower was great but its still insufficient. Now, what im talking about is limited to my experience in SPVP. I cant imagine FT gets much wvwvw use, but for all i know its OP in PVE.
So, if thats the case maybe you should split the skills between pvp/pve land.
Here are the major FT issues.
1. alot of people talk about missing with the auto attack, thats because it has a measley 425 range, which makes you have to get really close to opposition to use it. Putting you in alot of danger. Pistol has 900 ranger and rifle (1000-1200 depending on traits). Yes they dont hit as hard, but not much less hard.
So first change, buff the auto attack range to 600, just a bit more and i think we are good here.
2. The #2 flame blast really should be changed into a blast finisher. Compare it to thief shortbow #2 cluster arrow, which is a spammable blast finisher.
3. The #5 blind should have its radius increase to 300 , its often quite hard to get this used effectively. Obviously its meant to protect from melee targets but it would be nice to be able to hit a bulls charging warrior b4 hes right on top of you.
4. The tooltip incendiary ammo should have its cooldown reduced to 45 seconds from 1 minute. I mean it applies burn, and thats something one can already do with the flamethrower.
I think these TINY changes would make the FT viable. In no way would this make the weapon OP in spvp. In fact with these changes it might still be a little weak. I really like the FT, i think alot of engies do and i think this would satisfy alot of the community and in no risk to producing something OP.
I doubt it would impact pve/wvw either.
community thoughts?
(edited by daydream.2938)
I think its needed.
But really it should be solo/duo Q. That way you can Q up with one friend, even if you dont have an entire team.
Honestly a reasonable list.
Smoke vent increase to 240 would be sufficient combo field would be 2 much.
however, i think the flamethrower #2 should be a blast finisher when you blow it up. ( thief #2 shortbow is a non stop blast finisher).
I dont agree with exliri U changes. But i wish our ultimate wasnt a RNG. Id prefer it simply be tornado reliablly.
Im sure there are teams who could use a warrior, try out xephs thread.
Or, if you love the game alot, you could consider rolling another class.
I think alot of people are having trouble fnding teams, they are disbanding left right and center.
Definately a better play because of spvp, nothing forces you to learn specs and the meta more vigoursly, or other classses for that matter.
Got four of these in a row last night, and then one of them turned into a 3on5 because someone quit when they saw it was 4on5.
If that make you feel better, rangers are even worse.
It’s ok we can have meetings where we sit in circles, pat on our back and talk about how anet hates us. Free food on sundays.
no necros allowed
rangers are great in spvp, and remain one of the top 4 classes. (mesmer/ranger) come after guardian/ele, in the power curve in tournies. At least at higher end play. Now of course w the nerf to eles we will see if they can hold onto #1 for long, but they still appear to be the top class.
With the change to Kit refinement, how many of our top and above average builds are still viable? To my knowledge kit refinement was part of almost every viable build this class created over the last few months.
Why?
So how many top level builds are still working?
Power elixir is still very viable , and i run it in spvp tournys. ( have 117 Qp) so im not some never did paid tourny noob.
It never relied on 100 nades, but does require smart game play.
p/p , or p/s if enemy has thief.
30, 0, 0, 30, 10. Obvious traits in first tree for the gren, like burn on crit, extra grens etc.
Then you want alchemy 20% faster exliirs, condi cleanse on exliri, and might on exlir.
Run exlir h, s, and b, gren kit, supply kit.
Thats x6 exlirs (f1,f2,f3). to use as cleanse, exliri b great in a fight, all give you might when you use them also.
reasonble durability, especially compared to 100nades. Decent damage and good 1vs1 ability.
And just grab swiftness on equipping kit on the tool trait line.