Guild Wars 2

You cant balance around people that don’t know how to play there profession and the game mode. That is majority of soloQ

Engi is well represented in spvp. The same cannot be said about wvw and pve. Wvw zerging is mainly GWEN and roaming you see a lot more thiefs, mes, rangers, and wars atm. The look of animation comes down to personal preference.

That said engi is actually a solid class, if played well they can excel in all aspects of the game. Sounds like its a learn l2p issue and if you don’t like swapping kits warrior is that way >>>.

I have win 8 64bit, never crashes.

Because the combat in this game is great and lots of fun. Roaming solo/havoc squads in wvw is an absolute blast. Its great feeling when you win those 3 to 1 fights.

Learning different classes and coming up with your own builds is also very interesting.

Thief is in a decent spot atm that’s probably why there weren’t to many changes.

Mrbig.8019:

vincecontix.1264:

Ostricheggs.3742:

Honest to god, rifle 4 NEEDS to be changed. Let’s get real folk’s, that’s the main problem with all the engi QQ going on.

It’s too frustrating as a player to be chain CC’d so frequently. Take it as you will but I personally think a lot of the frustration regarding engis recently has been the growing popularity of rifle as a weaponset and particularly the relatively low-skill builds of cele rifle and turrets.

Rifle 4 has the highest CC uptime on a target in the game.

If I may be so bold to offer a suggestion, I would recommend turning rifle 4 into a 2s daze and remove the self CC and well as keep the condi clear. I think this will still allow the fluid combat that gw2 players are used to. It would also prevent both players from being CC’d to incredible degrees which is really fustrating to watch.

I disagree rifle in its current form is fine *the knock back is really the main reason to take rifle over pistol/shield.* Also I still think pistol/shield is superior in most circumstances.

You just proved OE point.

^^^what the Chaith.8256 said.

Warriors are not op its just there defensive are very passive and you cant really burst down a warrior fast . Regardless if they are good or bad its just take a bit of time to kill these guys. This is why warrior are generally never a first target

Ostricheggs.3742:

Honest to god, rifle 4 NEEDS to be changed. Let’s get real folk’s, that’s the main problem with all the engi QQ going on.

It’s too frustrating as a player to be chain CC’d so frequently. Take it as you will but I personally think a lot of the frustration regarding engis recently has been the growing popularity of rifle as a weaponset and particularly the relatively low-skill builds of cele rifle and turrets.

Rifle 4 has the highest CC uptime on a target in the game.

If I may be so bold to offer a suggestion, I would recommend turning rifle 4 into a 2s daze and remove the self CC and well as keep the condi clear. I think this will still allow the fluid combat that gw2 players are used to. It would also prevent both players from being CC’d to incredible degrees which is really fustrating to watch.

I disagree rifle in its current form is fine the knock back is really the main reason to take rifle over pistol/shield. Also I still think pistol/shield is superior in most circumstances.

zapv.8051:

Engineers just need a few more counters, necros are a good start, but I think a few other classes could be made to be a little stronger against them (not as strong as necros are currently which isn’t nearly as strong as engi’s would have you think).

It does have counters sf ele, condition ranger, necro. Also condi warrior, staff ele, dd ele mesmer is 50/50. It has be said alot but engi is more susceptible to focus fire due to lack of condition removal, stability and stun breaks.

I have also noticed that most of the players complaining are complaining about turrets engi and they are generally thief mains. So it happen engi counters thief in spvp only because of conquest mode. In wvw there are like no complaints about engi roaming or zerging.

Very entertaining and looks like a lot of fun.

If you are also in a premade team bring a guard for lot of Stab, bring staff cele ele to take out turrets and wars to cc engi to dealth. I have run that comp b4 its really trolly but doesnt stand up to a really team or even just counter comp. Stabiliy and cc with ruin there day.

Mike.4830:

XSamX.7182:

S: Elementalist
(Nothing influences the game as this really powerful class. 1 v 1 god, no counter, swiftness for the complete group at start, passive heal like a bozz, combofields + blast finisher, AoE Teamfight Damage + Heals, Condi removal and a lot of boons[2 stabilitys aswell], one of the best mobility, even mobility for your team, nothing more to say)

A: Warrior
(Still really powerful. A Hambow has a rezzbanner, to get teammates up really well. Stability, COMPLETE God mode. AoE Stuns, AoE Burning, long immo, still really powerful in 1 v 1 [except vs ele], combo field and finsisher, passive heal like a bozz)

Thief
(Highest Mobility with elementalist, huge spike damage, invis, shadow refuge in teamfights. 1 v 1 strong, extremely powerful in combination with mesmer, combo fiel + finisher, Stuns and good AoE, can remove stability easily [really annoying])

B: Guardian
(really good AoE Support, teamfight strong, you can hold 1 v 1 forever or really really long, blocks, boons for the team, a little AoE Damage, the only stability for the group, mobility isn’t that great)

Mesmer (A Tier if you combine him with Thief, teamfight strong, 1 v 1 is risky and not really good but sometimes have a chance. Huge Spike Damage, Stealth, Moa, Mobility is good, really good range)

Engineer
(One of the best elites in the game, AoE Burning and other good conds, has good survive, with 2 Blocks + immunity, good range on grenades, combo fields + finisher, stealth, good 1 v 1)

C: Ranger
(Has some good moments, teamfight strong if you build him like that but then he is really bad in 1 v 1, 1 v 1 ok but then he is bad in teamfights. AoE Rezz that can trigger multiple times, can bunker, mobility is ok, range is ok]

Nekro
(Has really good moments aswell, bunkerkiller, 1 v 1 is ok, can bunker a bit with elite, AoE Conds, can remove stability but not as good as a thief, mobility isn’t that good, teamfights are really good [in combination with Engi really destroyable], ok range)

I’m basing this off the best players ive seen on each class….
Necro is not an ok 1v1, its the best 1v1 in the game
Engi is 2nd best 1v1er in the game

Also engi thrashes ele 1v1, and necro goes about 50-50 with it (best vs best)
I understand on EU, there are no good engis and necros, but i assure you they are 2 of the 3 best classes in the game

Engi Necro Ele – T1
Warrior Thief – T2
Ranger Mesmer Guardian – T3

Are you talking about meta build used in tq or dueling builds?

Necro>engi
Condi ranger, condi wars, ele are 50/50 with engi in 1v1.

Now if we talking about dueling builds its totally different strong coz then you have to take into account pd condi thief and condi pu mesmers.

Ele :A+
War :A
Eng :A
Thief :A
Mesmer :A-
Necro :B+
Guard :A
Ranger :B

azerte.4365:

vincecontix.1264:

azerte.4365:

Thief is fine now when it comes to balance. A slight nerf to SA and a buff to other skills such as traps, venoms, …. would be nice, but other than that we’re good.
The only thing that makes thief ‘UP’ atm is the amount of bugs that plague the profession. They just need to fix those.

Why does SA need a Nerf? Thief healing and condition removal is already sub standard compared to other profs not to mention thief req a lot more active play. Just make other traits better no need for more nerfs.

Allright here’s how I see it, this is my opinion so take it how you want. SA is too forgiving in the sense that it makes you think less about dodging certain skills and your positioning than say a trickery thief.
E.g. say your fighting a bomb kit engineer and he drops his Fire Bomb, if you run SA you can ‘eat’ that full fire bomb cause you’re about to CnD or BP+HS and clear all those seconds of burning and heal back that damage for a certain percent. Where as on say trickery, you need to either A) dodge out the field and disengage or take the damage and hope you can pressure him enough to make up for the damage you just took.

Yes so it a decision one has to make more damage or more survivability its nice to have options. If you are roaming around solo or in a small group in wvw SA is almost mandatory esp with all the aoe condition damage flying everywhere.

I also dont see anything wrong with it in its current form especially when you compare the thiefs healing capability to ele, engi, regen ranger, etc. While it can be harder running with out it, it always nice to have the option.

Actually crating a thief with in the first 3 sec is sometimes a good idea. A lot of the time if I take home point it is very common for a enemy thief try to come push far straight way. So instead of wasting time with him sometimes I will just crate kill thief and cap point immediately. Then I will go support mid while the far pushers has just kitten up his whole team.

I would like to see a list that is a little more specifc like listing weaps, amy and traits.

Simon.3794:

yes. yes lets not fight guys.

ele and engi are both op.

Eh still dont agree that ele are op I do think they are the prob strongest but they are not game break and one classes with always be at the top. Though you could stilll run other classes and have a good comp. Yes eles are strong but they are not so strong that you cant consider other profs for your team.

Also if we are going to compare I think ele is slightly better than engi. It has a bit more sustain, bit more mobility, there current dd ele x/x/x/6/6 with3x cantrips can deal with focus fire a bit better. Though both still great choices for a team.

Same with Hambow kinda similar to ele but less mobility but war is way easier to play. Though nothing compares to the dps output of thiefs and mesmers the ability to burst from stealth is still very strong.

uberkingkong.8041:

You should get another star by your name. Called reward track completions. And if you do PvE completion you should get 2 stars, PvP and PvE.

This is a good idea but they should also make wvw map completion a req so its not to easy.

Teutos.8620:

Is getting the map completion really a problem for you?
I’d have guessed it would be the precursor or the T6 materials for the gifts…

I can’t do it, it is way to mind numbingly boring.

Sf ele also very good against engi

While I dont think turret engi is op most of us can admit that it is simplely to rewarding for the effort involved. I am specifically talking about x/x/6/6/x turret bunker engi. its probably not healthy for the game and it seem to be ruining a lot of people experience in soloq(mostly thiefs).

So if changes are made to turret engi how should it be done?

Your are sure it was dp and no pd?

sinject.4607:

WhiteRose.6934:

I agree that d/d ele currently is strong but I don’t think it’s the classes fault.

nope

the professions are just as guilty

here’s part of the reason why:

Charts are nice all but the chart should take meta builds then list there capabilities based of that. Listing every possible way to lay fire field and blast them when they are not used it current meta builds is quite misleading.

I was just wondering if spvp players could get a map completion equivalency to help make things a bit fairer and a bit easyer for pvper to get a legendary. Maybe it would require the completion of every reward track and Map completion in wvw(pvpers should not have as much trouble as pver in this regard). Upon completion a player would get some equivalent to one gift of exploration.

What do you guys think?

DrLane.5248:

A clever mesmer thief comp will one shot the guy that invades , then you only have to play with a guardian that can last a 1vs2/2vs3 vs class that doesnt have so much burst (beside caed).

Like Ybob said , you cant force your opponents to play on 3 points if they decided to play 2

Eh I really dont like versing thief memser comps kinda glad NA doesn’t run it often makes things very hard. Bunker guards just hold/stall on point while thief/mesmer float around forcing un even fights and burst players down players in secs bunker or not. It very strong but requires a coordinated team to make it work.

Anti.9156:

TCG:
helseth: mes
tage: guard
Denshee: dd ele
Sizer: S/d thief
Rom: Hambow or survival ranger

Boon:
Kayun: Guard
Choozen: d/p thief
Sensotix: Mesmer
Fake: Hambow
Ventari: dd ele

MiM:
Sam: guard
Levin: d/p thief
Azani: Mesmer
Shaku: dd ele
Tamyr: spirit ranger (sometimes survival)

PBJT
Art tatum: Guard
Xeon: War
GunsnTools: Engi (sometimes Rabid sometimes Celerifle)
Dhuumfirenecro
D/p Thief

HiT:
Danny: Guard
Thai ju: Mesmer
Matze: d/p thief
Angel: Staff Ele
lypion: hambow or eviserate(with warhorn)

i dont know the comps of the other teams
Cm was something like 2 ele 2 war 1 engi before put they had rosterchanges
ESL was with Necro (dhuumfire i think)

i may have something wrong, didnt looked it up

Thank you.

johnpoc.8732:

Rangers are not god mode, close the gap and it’s GG

Far from god mode but they easy mode.

This current lb zerker ranger allows bad player to contribute to much esp if they have a slight numbers advantage.

At this point its easier dealing with multiple bad zerker thief’s than it is bad ranger.

Can anyone list the comp for Eu Tog 6 top teams?

azerte.4365:

Thief is fine now when it comes to balance. A slight nerf to SA and a buff to other skills such as traps, venoms, …. would be nice, but other than that we’re good.
The only thing that makes thief ‘UP’ atm is the amount of bugs that plague the profession. They just need to fix those.

Why does SA need a Nerf? Thief healing and condition removal is already sub standard compared to other profs not to mention thief req a lot more active play. Just make other traits better no need for more nerfs.

Elitist.8701:

The reason EU runs thief/mesmer/guard comps is because they have the ability to properly rotate the guardian to teamfights and have the thief mesmer combo be able to coordinate bursts. NA runs cheesy cele comps because they lack basic abilities such as bursting down targets and winning teamfights, so they just force 2v2s and 3v3s that last forever. EU also tends to have better players individually as well. Basically its a skill issue.

All opinions I have shared in this post are merely observations, I am not biased towards any side. I am on NA as well, so no inherent bias towards EU.

-Teef Teef Teef Teef

I agree with you, now should this have any bearing on balance? Because it would mean celestial tankish/ dps type builds are not as strong as some people claim.

Jim Hunter.6821:

Carighan.6758:

vincecontix.1264:

While I don’t think mesmer are op they do potentially bring a lot of DPs to the table and I am surprised there aren’t more complaints.

What’s a DP? I mean, the non-sexual meaning?

This made me laugh because that is the first thing I thought of when he said DP as well.
Maybe because it’s the mesmer and a phantasm giving it to him at the same time it kind of counts as DP?

I meant dps idk why my phone auto corrected it making the d and p caps.

While I don’t think mesmer are op they do potentially bring a lot of DPs to the table and I am surprised there aren’t more complaints.

Jekkt.6045:

pvp should be balanced at the high – highest level of play. that’s maybe the reason why turrets haven’t been nerfed yet.

having said that… i wouldn’t mind if passives get nerfed regardless of the level of play they are used in.

I am of the same opinion, though a lot posts I see esp lately seem to want things balanced around soloQ. Most of the time people posting lack experience and seem to be the vocal majority on these forums.

It make sense to balance things at high level of play, the more people play the better they become. So eventually players that play regularly would reach some level of competency.

Also I do think its nice for casual/less skilled players to have builds that allow them to contribute in a match though I feel that turret engi carries a bit to much.

So how should spvp be balanced? Should anet approach balance under then assumption that a player runs a team oriented build and knows how to play his prof? Should they assume plays know how to focus fire and rotate properly?

The meta between Eu and Na is quite different how should this be considered when it comes to balance?

That is why EU is superior to NA they tend to run more team oriented builds, which with better coordination is stronger than NA celestial tanky meta.

Guard bunker support+thief+mesmer(any other classes) is still incredibly strong. I think NA will eventually switch back. Also the fact that some of the best well know players of Eu play thief and mes prob has some influence on there meta.

I find mesmer to be very strong main issue I have (soloq) is that is still takes quite a bit of time to down warriors they seem to soak up full shatters like no one else.

Sorry I actually feel its necessary to test builds and practice profs in ranked matches at times(not always). It hard to determine a build viability in hotjoin do to players lack of skill.

Prysin.8542:

its simple.

Meta build calculations is as following:
Maximum performance output > minimum performance input

Edit:
To dumb it down – Just find a way to deal damage without actually having to INVEST into dealing damage.

Yes yes thats how it is in all games though it would be nice to some some acutally calculations for: Dp thief, Hambow, DD celestial ele, Condi nade engi, Shatter mesmer, lb zerker ranger, Med guard, and Condi Necro.

Immob is fine even at its current level pining down some classes (in group setting esp wvw) is stilll very hard.

Hi guys lately I have been reading the forums and seeing a lot of statements with out any actually proof. So I was wondering if anyone would be willing/able to do the math of the dps output of current meta builds for each class?

WhiteRose.6934:

lessthanjake.6049:

...

Your point however helps my own point further.

I agree, as I already stated, that skilled _players_ can make engi truly shine due to their knowledge and abilities as a player, however average engi Rose can jump in and do almost as good rolling my face on the keys. I may not know the proper rotations (Spoiler: I don’t) but there’s not much anyone can do under the pressure that engi’s can dish out, whether they know what they’re doing or not. That makes the class have an extremely low skill floor.

There’s a reason so many people are running engi in spvp, and it’s not because it’s complicated. Players always will use what will bring them the easiest victory.

Ehh no they can’t any prof/spec can click skills off cd if they aren’t being focus. If your teams lets zerker staff ele, Necro condi/power, GS/Staff shatter mesmer just free cast as the please of course they can contribute greats to the fight. Same with engi though engi unlike other prof meta builds is more susceptible to focus fire, due to lack of condition removal, stab and stun breaks.

The reason why we see a decent amount of engis is because of turret spec thats what majority of people are running. You dont see to many multi/triple kit specs.

Booms.2594:

dd e/e is pretty op.
to prove it ill have you guys duel my teams ele on any class and any spec you want and if you win ill give you 20g

I accept that challenge your friend better some crazy exception player.

Devs get some ideas from bungie’s Destiny they have no Trinity and there raiding works very well.

Sorry but I like db is actually very useful on hybrid/condi builds.

Xtinct.7031:

Evilek.5690:

Nice BP change ! Thief waste only 11 ini (92% totall initiative) on one stealth

Yea, perhaps 7 might be more appropriate.

bottomline, perma-stealth with d/p was never really resolved.

Actually many ways to stop perma stealth. It can be interrupted with daze, stun, fear(cc). There are lots of channeling skills that track a thief in stealth and continue hitting them( eg..rapid fire/kill shot insta kill thief).

Also there are multiple classes that can use an insta cast unavoidable skill thst apply reveal buff on thief. So there indeed ways to beat stealth enemies.

Bottom line is there are many ways to deal with thiefs. They currently have mediocre combat ability and there lots and of specs that can counter them. Though yes they are still one of best noob stomping classes.

/end thread.

Guys could we no longer feed troll post like this and just let them die. I know its hard not to comment when people make posts out of complete ignorance but it for the best.

NA and EU different meta. More coordinated teams are able to run comps with more DPs specs which allows teams to drop targets a lot faster.

Running full bunker or bunkerish(celestial) is a safer, less rewarding option and is more an NA thing.

Join me iojhttp://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OBhfkJ1J3MY

Sure ele might be the strongest though not by much and its not game breaking. Pretty all classes have specs(in right comp) that can contribute at the level of ele.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

It isnt quite meta yet. The recent buff they got hardly made them overpowered, but it invited a playstyle where camping is heavily rewarded with little risk/effort. So everyone is doing that.

Rarely do you find a ranger that is a decent fighter among them though.

Its the same issue as with turret engi its just to rewarding for the effort.