Guild Wars 2

The tactics minors suck, and it has always been like that.

Things have to settle down, but I’ve already seen some crazy set-ups.

Sebrent.3625:

If you look at the patch notes … several other classes are affected by it as well.

If you look at those same patch notes, you should notice that this also means that Cripple/Chill won’t reduce the distance traversed by those skills.

You lose something and you gain something. What that does to Warrior meta is yet to be seen, but it is supposed to be consistent across the board.

It also brings consistency between such abilities and teleports … as neither now has their range increased/decreased by movespeed bonuses/penalties.

The problem is that 3 classes have consistent gap closers now, whereas the other 5 have none.

You say it brings consistency, I say it brings imbalance between leaps/rushes and teleports. They essentially allow thieves and mesmers to escape any situation where they made too many errors without even having to stealth up… And then they could still stealth if they wanted to.

online.1278:

Cygnus.6903:

Bad idea. The good thing about where building momentum is right now is that you can try a full offense build while retaining a little survivability in the form of extra endurance.

Likewise, if you build more defensively, you can get a little pressure on your opponent with Spiked Armor in Defense.

I thought having spiked armor on strength line can still benefit because that person seem more likely use power boost amulet. Oppositely, having retaliation does not benefit any war : it only benefit warrior who has power boost amulet. Condi warrior who uses like settler won’t get any benefit from it. Rather dodging is more generally benefit to any kind of warrior in purpose of dodge attack or evade.

I think anet just need to reform formula of retaliation to get affected by both condi and direct damage equally for pure condi war as well. I think this is solution then. currently only power based warrior get benefits from retaliation.

Condition warrior seems so incredibly OP right now, so that too does not sound very appealing to me.

How can you complain so much about shouts when you can:

-get all the nessecary traits by spending 1 trait slot, and get a bonus adrenaline boost for free,
-have a new shout that completely refills adrenaline and heals you for more then 300 HP/second, and
-get Quick Breathing/Leg Specialist and Shrug it Off together (more shout, more heal), or slot Burning Arrows for way more damage.

Honestly, Shouts seem better then ever to me.

Bad idea. The good thing about where building momentum is right now is that you can try a full offense build while retaining a little survivability in the form of extra endurance.

Likewise, if you build more defensively, you can get a little pressure on your opponent with Spiked Armor in Defense.

I am testing the new Heightened Focus with maceshgs in wvw, it seems ridiculous thusfar.

With the lack of answers we get on this topic it just became very clear to me.

The spec will have Fast Hands baseline.

That’s pretty sick. First thing to get nerfed I bet.

JVJD.4912:

Cygnus.6903:

If you do a level 3 burst with something like GS, then swap to Axe, get full adrenaline back (new healing surge, shouts, signet of fury), Evis will hit stupidly hard.

But I agree on Zende, will need a lot of adjusting to your playstyle now that you will miss that extra range.

Would’nt the extra 300 ferocity with dual axes cover the loss of 8 sec 12 % damage increase and with burst precision it would always critically hit no matter what and i am talking specifically of Evicerate not about aoe dps, rotation dps etc , how hard it will be to hit a pve target? lmao

I don’t think 300 ferocity ever beats a flat 20% damage increase.

YuiRS.8129:

Warlord.9074:

uh? not more than it does now. It wasn’t buffed. There is no changes to make it hit harder. The dps changes are all based on what comes after a burst skill is used.

Actually no, Berserker’s Power activates before the Burst Skill hits, so the bonus damage still applies. It’s like Merc Hammer.

Is this confirmed?

120 toughness is close to nothing, whether you are zerk or Knights.

If you do a level 3 burst with something like GS, then swap to Axe, get full adrenaline back (new healing surge, shouts, signet of fury), Evis will hit stupidly hard.

But I agree on Zende, will need a lot of adjusting to your playstyle now that you will miss that extra range.

Well, I’ll miss GS/Hammer with 00626. I will lose either Leg Specialist, or a whole lot of Defense goodies like Dogged March, Cleansing Ire and the added power from toughness.

Also, no Burst Mastery+Merciless hammer is a shame, no more Earthshaker into Arcing Slice.

Thankfully, I will be getting a kittenton of damage in return from Strength.

My GS/Sword Shield variant is also getting shrekt. 05423, and the new warrior’s sprint will render it useless against other warriors. Not to mention (movement) condi reduction flying around everywhere.

Torqiseknite.1380:

Do you ever make threads for any reason other than to ask for random buffs?

P.S.: Clearly the extra toughness should go to the minor Thick Skin, giving us an additional +150 toughness when over 90% health. This would be an incredibly thoughtful change that would cause the trait to have a meaningful impact on our build choices. /s

Actually, it wouldn’t. Thick skin would not be good unless the added toughness would be somewhere around 500+, and even then, you only mitigate the first blow probably.

Always useless versus condi either way.

You could do that.

I would still never pick it.

This thread seems to be about discussion more then about finding an answer.

Been a while since my last video, but I managed to finish it just before the big patch tomorrow. It’s a roaming montage, containing what will probably be my last combat footage pre-patch.

Hope you guys enjoy, and see you in the new world

Kagamiku.9731:

Cygnus.6903:

Kagamiku.9731:

CI isn’t just good for the cleanse, adrenaline on hit is amazing as well. There is no way you’re making full use of berzerkers power without it.

Also just noticed they nerfed the adrenaline gain upon using a shout. Sneaky, sneaky…

Did they? On the other topic it says you still get 5 adrenaline.

We get 8 adrenaline now, so 5 is a nerf.

Thanks for clarifying. I won’t notice as I hardly ever use shouts pre-patch ^^

BurrTheKing.8571:

Cygnus.6903:

BurrTheKing.8571:

You’ll have to be more careful about condis but with a offhand Warhorn you could maybe do OK with the trait and Brawler’s Recovery. Burning Arrows actually looks really strong as well.

Except Brawlers Recovery is in Discipline.

I’m talking about running Arms – Tactics – Discipline

Oh, you wrote arms defense tactics.. which kind of makes sense on a condi build.

Sebrent.3625:

Cygnus.6903:

Sebrent.3625:

Is there something wrong with that opinion?
Is there something you disagree with there?

Yeah, I’m done.

Why?
Because you’d only be happy with it being baseline?
You wouldn’t be okay with FH disappearing and Warrior rebalanced from there?

Both options would help with build diversity, which is the reason people are claiming they want it baselined.

If you are unwilling to explain in a logical manner, then I can’t help but wonder why you spoke up in the first place. Might as well have just posted “I want it baseline” as that is all you’re conveying.

I’m done when you start snapping at me, even though we agree.

BurrTheKing.8571:

You’ll have to be more careful about condis but with a offhand Warhorn you could maybe do OK with the trait and Brawler’s Recovery. Burning Arrows actually looks really strong as well.

Except Brawlers Recovery is in Discipline.

Everything is subject to change.

So weapon swap.

Kagamiku.9731:

CI isn’t just good for the cleanse, adrenaline on hit is amazing as well. There is no way you’re making full use of berzerkers power without it.

Also just noticed they nerfed the adrenaline gain upon using a shout. Sneaky, sneaky…

Did they? On the other topic it says you still get 5 adrenaline.

Zin.6170:

What is the thought on this GM trait?

This is the one that activates leap finishers twice.

I like the idea of it, but not sold on it just yet. I’m thinking of trying out a sword and board/longbow condi build with it. Putting down a fire field and then using the two leap finishers will give me 20 seconds of fire shield. This seems fairly good.

Thoughts?

I think what you’d be giving up for it would make the build a lot stronger.

I like the way they went with this, but the execution is flawed. The trait is simply too weak.

Sebrent.3625:

Is there something wrong with that opinion?
Is there something you disagree with there?

Yeah, I’m done.

Ozzrel.9825:

Both GS and Condi variants of the Mace build get a little buff, but I really doubt it will be enough.

As for Unsuspecting Foe, I don’t think it will ever see any use in Arms. The spec doesn’t provide anything useful to CC builds, even if they are condi based. Arms doesn’t have anything useful for any build that isn’t using Sword as the main weapon. Maybe they should move Merciless Hammer to Arms to add some variety to that spec, and save hambow at the same time.

Please, don’t. Merciless hammer might be better of in Defense, but I don’t dislike it in Discipline. I’d hate to see my Hammer trait get moved to the condi-thrashcan that is Arms now.

And save hambow? I don’t think that needs any saving. 00666 is gonna be quite strong IMO. The benefits of Shoutbow healing for your group, coupled with adrenaline on shouts to cover up the loss of Burst Mastery, and still get to hammer smash stuff. Might even be able to take Last stand+Defy Pain and use trooper runes for condiclears.

Hell, you could even try 60066 for more damage and weakness application on CC.

Toxsa.2701:

Btw, LB F1, 3, 4 , 5 all can be casted effectively at 1200 ranger, just that you wouldn’t gain might stack if you don’t blast the field near you, that’s why people choose to use it at close range. It is still a range weapon regardless.

Yeah I don’t agree with the ‘effectively’ part. F1 and 3 are best combined in melee to stack might and keep your (melee) opponent under pressure. 4 was not a skill i was referring to. 5 is only going to hit something that’s paying attention to something else, and even then the telegraphing is awful.
Longbow 2 is best used in melee as you can hit all three arrows that way.

Btw, I don’t and didn’t deny that longbow is a ranged weapon. It’s just not used that way.

Sebrent.3625:

Does the logic provided by ArenaNet employees for “why Illusionary Persona was made baseline for Mesmer” apply to Fast Hands? Yes.

That’s the best argument made in this thread for making Fast Hands baseline. The rest are pretty useless.

My only question on this matter is whether or not there were other reasons. I ask this because I do see one other difference:

• Without Fast Hands, Warrior skills and Class Mechanic still work regardless of the situation. *
• Without Illusionary Persona, Mesmer’s Class Mechanic was often useless in large fights as Illusions die to stray AOEs/Cleaves and a Mesmer with 0 Illusions and no Illusionary Persona was a Mesmer without a class mechanic.*

As I’ve stated in another thread on here, I do think Fast Hands should either be made baseline or removed from the game … followed by whatever balancing is required.

Fast Hands is quite powerful which makes balancing the absence of it with the presence of it a bit of an issue. That issue is highlighted by the fact that all of the currently “viable” Warrior builds take Fast Hands.

Now, this could possibly change with the new specialization … but I’m not going to say that the new specializations change this issue … especially with 0 hours playtesting with them.

That’s not really a good argument IMO. So mesmers are bad in large fights, so are thieves. Doesn’t mean you need to make IP baseline.

Warrior skills work without FH, sure. So do mesmer skills without IP. Even in large fights. Only not often.

Does that make the mesmer unplayable in PvP? No.

Now look at fast hands. Remove it from any warrior build, and you make it underpowered.

Am I against making IP baseline? Hell no actually. Do I think mesmers will be incredibly powerful, especially in 1v1 after the patch? I don’t, I know they will be. In fact, even without IP baseline now, they already are. Still, IP baseline is fine by me, as it did hinder build variety a lot.

Btw, I know your opinion on making FH baseline. I just didn’t see a single decent argument against it yet on this forum.

lordhelmos.7623:

Kagamiku.9731:

It’s not about higher damage, it’s about worthless utility skills. Virtually every skill on rifle is either easily dodged or lacks a purpose. I mean, compare rifle butt with point blank shot. Two skills on the same CD that serve the same purpose, except one if vastly better than the other. The rifle skill volley is similar to rapid fire, except it has shorter range and fires much slower. The fact that it deals less damage just adds to the inferiority of it.

Someone gets it. My whole point was to show how similar those two weapons are and THEY SHOULD NOT BE. Rifle needs to be something else. It needs a complete revamp so its not even comparible to the ranger LB at all. It should be completely different.

I do agree with this partially, though one of the rifle’s skills feels very unique and fun to me, and that’s killshot.

The problem is that they made the rest of the weapon so similar to Ranger’s longbow, yet weaker in every way, that you can only conclude that using it does in fact make you a poor man’s ranger.

I think the comparison between longbow ranger and rifle warrior is perfectly fine. People coming in here saying it isn’t yet provide zero reason why should just go back to the ranger forum really.

And comparing Rifle to warrior longbow shows even more that rifle needs help. Longbow is not really used as a ranged weapon when literally 4 out of it’s six skills are best used in melee range. People may not like it, but longbow does have a distinct feel and use in more then 1 gamemodes.

Buffing the longbow to 1200 range while doing nothing for rifle to me shows a complete lack of understanding of what’s going on with warrior right now.

Kagamiku.9731:

Cygnus.6903:

Seed.5467:

Cygnus.6903:

1. I think the second, so 30% at 3 bars (as opposed to ~33%).

If that is the case then is a straight out 70% damage nerf as currently when traited physical deals 100% damage. Too bad that change will practically render my physical build useless. First the main hand axe nerf, then the adrenalin and now this. Oh well..

2. Nobody knows, and nobody’s answering thusfar. Hopes are up on getting an answer though, as Josh seems to visit us a bit. Hopes are down on it becoming baseline, however. Well hey, at least mesmers got Illusionary Persona as baseline.

Allright, lets hope that we will get some answers at some point.

3. Don’t know about the healing, but you will get the Resistance, and they will nerf the HS passive. At least that’s what they said, but it is subject to change off course…

So, the 6sec resistance should be a compensation for the HS-passive heal nerf ? Still remains to be seen what the active heal and the recharge will be.

In fact, with that last remark in mind , why even ask questions at all?

Because, my main is warrior and i am concerned that with the upcoming changes, i will get force to either go full condition warrior or Shoutbow-warrior in order to compete in the new heavy condition meta.

Regards

Seed

The new Healing Surge will be far superior for both healing and condi mitigation, as you can trait/rune for it to cleanse 2 conditions instead of just ignoring the effects for a little while.

Matter of fact, I think the first thing I will try is 60066.

How do you come up with it cleansing two conditions.

I don’t know, I meant one actually.

Khenzy.9348:

Just listen. From 3:04:43 to 3:05:22.

Says it all really. Literally the exact same reasoning applies to Fast Hands.

Seed.5467:

Cygnus.6903:

1. I think the second, so 30% at 3 bars (as opposed to ~33%).

If that is the case then is a straight out 70% damage nerf as currently when traited physical deals 100% damage. Too bad that change will practically render my physical build useless. First the main hand axe nerf, then the adrenalin and now this. Oh well..

2. Nobody knows, and nobody’s answering thusfar. Hopes are up on getting an answer though, as Josh seems to visit us a bit. Hopes are down on it becoming baseline, however. Well hey, at least mesmers got Illusionary Persona as baseline.

Allright, lets hope that we will get some answers at some point.

3. Don’t know about the healing, but you will get the Resistance, and they will nerf the HS passive. At least that’s what they said, but it is subject to change off course…

So, the 6sec resistance should be a compensation for the HS-passive heal nerf ? Still remains to be seen what the active heal and the recharge will be.

In fact, with that last remark in mind , why even ask questions at all?

Because, my main is warrior and i am concerned that with the upcoming changes, i will get force to either go full condition warrior or Shoutbow-warrior in order to compete in the new heavy condition meta.

Regards

Seed

I was asking that retorically, but I do see your point. don’t get me wrong, I care as well, but after what they pulled with half the stuff they promised, I am simply going to wait for what is going to happen, and until then, I won’t believe anything really.

On the HS thing, yes, the resistance was meant to be enough incentive to use the active. I personally think this is not worth it, because it will only work against condi damage. Whereas it is a celestial meta, and you will stop regening HP. The new Healing Surge will be far superior for both healing and condi mitigation, as you can trait/rune for it to cleanse 2 conditions instead of just ignoring the effects for a little while.

Matter of fact, I think the first thing I will try is 60066.

1. I think the second, so 30% at 3 bars (as opposed to ~33%).

2. Nobody knows, and nobody’s answering thusfar. Hopes are up on getting an answer though, as Josh seems to visit us a bit. Hopes are down on it becoming baseline, however. Well hey, at least mesmers got Illusionary Persona as baseline.

3. Don’t know about the healing, but you will get the Resistance, and they will nerf the HS passive. At least that’s what they said, but it is subject to change off course…

In fact, with that last remark in mind , why even ask questions at all?

skowcia.8257:

Kagamiku.9731:

HS heals for more than that and doesn’t have a cast time.

By how much? To the limit does aoe heal, aoe endurance, aoe condi removal. Its a nobrainer for any half decent shoutbow. Lets also not forget that it can get you full adrenaline for ez combu shot, swap flurry. HS doesnt even come close.

There is this, and also, they are nerfing the Healing Signet passive. At least, that’s what they announced. So I doubt it will even do 350HPS.

So let me get this straight, To the Limit will fill your endurance by 25%, give you adrenaline (a full bar?) and have synergy with Vigorous shouts? A Celestial warrior heals for what, 2k when using a shout? So that’s a 8500 heal every 24 seconds, that’s over 350 HPS. RIP Healing Signet.

Dawdler.8521:

By using a melee weapon on ranger you are essentially becoming a poor mans warrior, so that part balances out at least.

You are kidding I hope.

roamzero.9486:

Gee, a class called Ranger has superior ranged weapon options? Who would have figured..

What an ignorant comment.

Well I wouldn’t say they dislike warriors, but they do have a very different view on what a warrior should be good at then most people here.

Some people keep on hoping that our specialization will fix everything. I am just annoyed about if that is the case, why won’t they just reveal it already.

Honestly though, taking a break from GW2 until the dust settles sounds pretty good to me right now.

Vegito.3048:

To the people feeling like we got left out of good changes, shoutbow and condi warrior will be stronger than ever.

This is exactly the problem.

I think I made a comparison between these two classes and weapons a while back, same conclusions.

Thing is though, it will become worse after the patch the way it looks right nwo.

Even though some are still on the fence about wether or not Fast Hands should be baseline, everybody agrees we need some information on this matter.

The weird thing is that they worded it so incredibly poor, that we can’t be sure either way. Would be nice to get some attention to our forum to clarify this but really, not gonna happen (and I get that).

YuiRS.8129:

Cygnus.6903:

Although it is a good change for non-longbow users, I think it’s stupid. It takes away the skill of using a burst skill to get the cleanse, which is what they meant to do when changing it in the first place. I get why they are swapping it back, anything non-longbow is currently too weak. They just have a strange way of fixing things.

It reminds me of the way they are trying to fix stealthtracking. Rangers rapid firing a thief that enters stealth will still hit all arrows in stealth. So instead of making this impossible or at least make the ranger have a chance of missing, they give the thief -25% damage reduction in stealth. Condi thief says hi.

Stupid.

It’s not really about skill. Having to hit a slow melee ability was just too unreliable by it’s very nature.

How does it not take skill to land a slow melee ability? With the cleanse-on-hit condition to the trait, the trait was purely about skill as long as you didn’t equip a longbow. I was perfectly fine with that. I am not really fine with the abundance of blinds and blocks that fly around (which is why mediguards hardcounter melee warriors IMO). So I guess that problem will get solved.

I also don’t think CI is too unreliable for melee specs right now. At least not when you use either GS or hammer. GS burst is actually very quick cast and hammer allows you to set up your burst (CC, Leg Specialist).

Although I agree, Anet might have just phailed at the wording of this change.

Although it is a good change for non-longbow users, I think it’s stupid. It takes away the skill of using a burst skill to get the cleanse, which is what they meant to do when changing it in the first place. I get why they are swapping it back, anything non-longbow is currently too weak. They just have a strange way of fixing things.

It reminds me of the way they are trying to fix stealthtracking. Rangers rapid firing a thief that enters stealth will still hit all arrows in stealth. So instead of making this impossible or at least make the ranger have a chance of missing, they give the thief -25% damage reduction in stealth. Condi thief says hi.

Stupid.

I get your exictement, but you should check the changes to other classes.

Also, saying we might not need Zerk stance anymore made me giggle (looking at WvW roaming). Condi’s will eat you up worse then before.

Btw, definitely BP over Distracting strikes.

godofcows.2451:

i have forgotten his name but there is a condition s/d – sb thief running around. if i remember his videos right, it revolves around caltrops, crit/hit condi and switch weapon procs.

Tron Jeremy.

His build is stupidly funny. But it’s meant for trolling. You are harder to kill then a P/D thief though. Also, it does not rely on crit condi’s but on swapping for Geomancy.

It might actually become viable with traps on heal and all the new goodies for condi teefs.

I don’t have a pic, but the Predator precursor ‘The Hunter’ is the best rifle skin ingame IMO. Got that back in the old PvP days, so I don’t actually have the precursor (just the skin). Lucky me

LoL!

Personally, I am also very disappointed with the Restorative Strength change.

Asmodeus.8042:

hissy-fit

Best word of the day sir.

Sorry about your banners…