were you thinking of the item skins? because i don’t think that’s considered a gear grind since your basicly just taking the model of one item and sticking it on another
or did you mean the ascended stuff, because those aren’t actually very much better than the exotic stuff, it’s only few stat points in difference, and the fact that there probably won’t be a higher tier than ascended for a VERY VERY long time
either way, the “gear grind” in gw2 is so minimal and so impractical (like you said, 2-3 weeks per ascended piece which is a really short time in my opinion), it may as well not have existed at all
Usually almost everyone agree that WoW is grindy, having said that, I would like to quote this old post:
[…]how is GW2 different than any MMO? Speaking specifically to progression.
Simply put, I don’t see much of a difference.
I’ll take WoW as an example since many people have played it.
WoW:——————————————-GW2:
BiS gear through raids:————————BiS gear through crafting
Required only in raids————————-Required only in Fractals
New tier every 2-3 months——————-New slot every 2-3 months
So, wheres the difference? Focus on the second line item…required only in raids / required only in fracta.s. True, currently ascended gear is only required in fractals similarly raid BiS gear in WoW is only required in raids(you can do any heroic content or daily quests with minimal gear.)
Wheres the difference? Why has GW2 been put on a pedestal, first by arenanet and now by the community, as a game where gear doesnt matter and isnt required in any part of the game except fractals. WoW, the almighty gear treadmill of them all, is the same way if you look at it like this. So why is GW2, in your eyes, a unique snowflake here?
Edit: Speaking solely interms of character / gear progression. I know this topic can be applied to many other areas of the game.
I couldn’t say it better than the Cesmode you quoted.
Fractals are the raid equivalent in GW2 so they need their own set of gear.
In WoW you farm raid gear between 3 and 4 times per yea.
In GW2 you have just long grind through professions.
Both ways want the player’s time and dedication in long term to get the rewards.Here is nothing new.The two games are MMOs after all.
No thanks.
World PvP is not needed.It will only srew with the events and will lead people to not want to help each other.
That is why we have WvW.That is the only world pvp mode that i want.
Ahh yea and one more question.
Is the arena account bound or character bound.What i mean by this is.
If i buy the arena with character A can character B on the same account become the host?
I have a few question for Custom Arena.I’m deciding to buy one but i’m just curious about some things.
So here is what i know so far:
I buy one for 1600 gems
To play in it i buy tokens(Play time)
If i don’t pay every time i will lose access to the Arena and i won’t be able to play.
Now my question is will the whole arena disappear if i don’t pay for it a long time?(Six months for instance)
Will i lose my 1600gems investment?
Will i have to buy again new Arena for 1600gems?
Right now the JPs on Red,Blue,Green maps are still part of the border lands.So when some player goes to do them he takes space in the whole border land.
Is it hard to put the JPs in a separate instance just like the EB one?That way people who want to jump will have their fun still staying in a PvP mode but without borrowing unnecessary space.
Save The Inquest is a Europe Cross Server guild focusing on the PvE part of the game.We are doing a lot of champion boss farm runs and speed dungeon crawling
The core of the guild is progressing through lvl60+ in Fractals.
We are doing Open World events and guild missions too.Every Wednesday you can have great and fun time with us when we do the GMs.
We are killing world bosses and do JPs.Guild chat is healthy and very active.
Our main priority is the PvE aspect and always will be.The guild has a stable community of 170+ members.We use TS3 as voice chat.
If you have any other questions I would happily answer them
Thank you for your time reading this and i hope to see you SOONish.
Are you interested in group events?
Are you interested in guild progress?
Do you want to have great time and a lot of fun moments? Then our guild missions are exactly for you.Every Wednesday you can have an awesome evening experience with us.
If you are interested in some fast paced and fun Arah runs whisper me in game.We are still Looking for a people who like to clear Arah on a daily bases.
We are looking for more people to join our progress in the higher tiers of Fractals of the Myst(T5/T6/T7).Agony resistance 45+ is a requirement.
More casual people with less AR are welcomed too for the lower tiers
(0-9/10+/20+/30+/40+)
Everyone who is interested can find me in game.
We are still recruiting people who like dungeon crawling.We need a player or two to strengthen our roster:
Mesmers,thieves,guardians and elementalists are especially needed.
Don’t be shy to whisper me in game
Save the Inquest is a European PvE focused guild with casually done WvW and sPvP.It is a Cross Server guild interested mostly into the PvE aspect of the game and everything PvE related
Dungeons
We do on daily basis all paths of Arah.We also have groups doing different tiers in Fractals.Right now our core team is progressing through 60-69 lvls.We are doing CoF,TA,CoE,HotW,SE speed clears.Champion boxes and Gold farm runs happen very often and are a common thing in the guild.
Open world
Our members are doing a lot of Open World events too.We are killing every day World bosses,do Temples,Scarlet invasions.Some members are doing a daily farm runs for T6 materials like Ore and Wood.
Guild missions
They are being done twice a week so all members can finish them.Everyone who isn’t on Underworld is guesting there.Our PvE part of the guild was 1st formed on this server before we grew rapidly and our guild bank is there too. Full time representation of the guild is expected of all members.
World vs World
Our members that like to do it are on server Pinken Square and form there the groups.The guild doesn’t have a specific WvW raiding set up for now but we are working on something.We want to make our WvW more attractive and to be on par with our PvE crews.
Currently we have 170+ members and we are expanding with fast pace.Our players are social and helpful.We participate in almost everything PvE related– from dungeons and DEs to GMs.The guild chat is active and live.
[i] We are community first, guild second.Representing the guild all the time is expected from all our members.
We use TS3 as a voice chat program.
What Coglin & Slurpey said i agree on 100% with it.GW2 is missing the traditional meaning of ‘’End Game’’ in a MMO.
Also your hand is not hold all the time by the company telling you what to do and where to go.Everything is unlocked from the start.Everything can be done.You just have to decide what do you want to do.
1st Guardian with good kiting capabilities and OP walls and bubbles.
2nd Thief for a lot of skiping with invisibility and good reflect spells(Harpy fractal especially)
3rd Mesmer again for a lot of skiping with the portals and reflects.And some more…umm..lets just say more untraditional fights.(Swamp,Ascalon,Harpy,Cliff Side)
Also Thief-Mesmer make a very good combo in the Dredge fractal.So it’s up to you which class you like more.
Playing MMOs from 2004 till today… I don’t get it either.. Being new to the game. I am like, what the hell, where is everyone? Where is all the chat? When do I get to do instances and form a party? I mean, I still don’t understand why this game even has Guilds, if you can call um that. Going back to Aion… There is No Social Aspect to this game it seems. Whats the point of Leveling up if I insta get pvp gear and Level 80 once I click on pvp button? I Don’t understand this game. To me, this game is a RPG with a dead chat box. * btw, NEVER Played WoW.
Of course there is a social aspect.The difference is that in other MMOs exist group quests.If you want to do it you either have to form a group or to be higher level than the quest.
If i don’t count those group quests in other MMOs there is 0 incentive to group with people in Open World.Why?Because alone i get more items,gold experience,materials.Why should i form a group then?
The only other place that grouping is needed are Raids.But even that is becoming less and less needed.
In GW2 it’s up to you what you are doing.
Do you want to group with other people or not.
Do you want to talk to other people or not.
If you want to talk to other people make friends and join a guild.Everytime i level a new alt i meet new people and make more friends.I repeat everything is in the hands of the player.
Anet doesn’t force you to do this or that.You decide what to do.To be social and to talk to people or not.To do events and form groups or not.It’s not Anet’s job to tell the players what to do.
My guild is very active.In non-prime time we have 20 online and in prime time 60 people.We do many PvE things together and very little WvW because we are cross server comunity.
No holy trinity.I don’t miss the tank/heal/dps.And i was dedicated healer before with tank as alt.
Improved mob taging.I always hated in WoW that i have been punished if i was not the one to pull the mob.
Improved grouping.You decide do you want to play solo or in a group.But for both you have been rewarded.It’s up to you to talk with people and group withy them or not.You are not being forced to group.You have the freedom to choose.
Removed quests.What quests do are to set you a goal that you have to complete.I really like that GW2 is doing a different aproach with questing.
The Overflow system.I really hated in WoW to wiat in queue to enter my home server.I’m glad Anet found a way to remove that.
Patches & instances.I like that patches take maximum 5 minutes to apply and if you are in instance you are not being kicked automatically.You have 3 hours to finish and then the patch will apply.
The maintance.There isn’t any at all.No more 4-5 hours of not being able to play.
Improved loot tables.I don’t miss the ninjas from WoW.Personal loot is great.
TP/AH.I like the cross server AH.There are always things to sell and buy.Which is good forLow population realms.
Cons
Groups.WoW groups have some minor things that i miss.Like 8 marks that you could put on people and 6 marks that you could put on the ground.Also when you are in a raid group you could make Raid Warnings and you could see all your people on the map.
PvP maps.I miss WoW’s 10/15 battle grounds(WSG,AB,EOTS).I really do.
Grind.I don’t like how much grinding has GW2
If you came expecting GW2 to be a WoW clone then you obviously didn’t make your homework.You should have researched more.The game has similarities to WoW and a lot of things are different.
I don’t mind that they are with Roman numerals.I never remember names.So to me doesn’t matter what kind of icon will be.Will it be a number or something else.
I remember the text and the icon but never the name
Agreed. How dare people enjoy wvw in different ways than zerglings!
In fact, I propose that anyone who isn’t within 2000 units of a commander tag is automatically booted from the map!
It still will be a PvP zone.Nothing will change for it.It wil justl be put in a separate instance.
The only thing that will change is that people in it won’t take useless space in the borderlands.
How does there being a JP puzzle in the BLs impact folks to the point that they keep posting for their removal? Why not focus on something else arbitrary like please remove the skritt or centaurs?
If you do not want to do the JP, then do not do them, it is your choice. I have no interest in SM battles. They are laggy and just a blobfest. I suppose I could post asking for SM’s removal, but instead I just do not go fight there and ignore that achievement.
I like jump puzzles and I am happy they are in the game and in WvW. I am sorry you are a bad jumper.
People who do the JP are not helping the server.They just take the spots of those who would do something useful for the server.
I will repeat again.The JP shouldn’t be removed.It must be put in separate instance.Anet already showed that this is possible with the EB JP.
That way the zone will keep it’s PvP mode but people in it won’t take the spots of those who want to contribute more to the server.
I am a so called PVE leech ruining all your fun. If big lags and zerging is it, u can have it…
When the meta is over u won’t see us leeches anymore because that game mode is just lame in general. Anet put in some effort to seduce PVE’rs to try out WvWvW but I doubt that will last in current state.
So as a PVE i agree remove meta APs and rewards from WvWvW and give them to everyone. So i wont have to farm in that legfest.
Or maybe just let guilds invoke those dragon events by spending their merits? This way it would stay in the open world. Canons should be then reserved for the guild members.
Also… It should scale 25 up. 80 is to much… 40 is also to much…
This is actually really good idea.To reserve spots for guild members.I really like it.
Not true at all. Tequatl is murdered everyday in Blackgate.
As I suggested in the past a million times. This content should have been a 40 man instance! And leave an easier version on Sparkfly Fen for the masses.
That way, you won’t have to rely on a timer as a failure condition, witch means that more builds will be supported, and means that People who really want to beat him can more easily work together without “standing stillers”, and the access would be instant instead of waiting in an area for an hour.
My solution is already implementing it self, as the few people-teams who can take him down are escaping in Overflows to avoid the masses…
So much this.When good guilds escape the masses and go in the overflows to kill Tequatl that is not different from a raid instance.
The change was release 24 days ago so that translates to: 25% of all the servers have beaten an event that happens several times a day more than once a day. I counted 46 servers. So averaged over all the servers the event was beaten 0.87 times a day.
And that is a successful and good change to an event? And the numbers are probably going to get worse.
Or maybe all of you should stop complaining, and realize that tequanti is still easy event, you just need to follow tactics ?
People got so used to facerolling content, that they lost their brains to zombies.
You are wrong.I don’t mind the difficulty.What i don’t like are the slackers,afkers,griefers.
If Tequatl was scaling under 80 people mark my guild could easily bring 40 people and we would search for our own Overflow.
The revamped Tequatl is a boss for instance.Such bosses are not for Open World.There is so much randomness hapening that it’s mind bogling.
anet has forgotten to encourage people to play together.
instead, now we have player scaling + timer countdown to discourage people from playing together.
we get punished for more people joining who don’t know the “right way” of winning.
which also begs another question, why the timer countdown?
it’s basically do the “right way” or fail. That will become a grind because there is only 1 way of winning.
I couldn’t agree more with you.GW2 is not a traditional MMO.Once one friend told me – This game is like a single RPG only that you run with many people around you.
My guild has 40 people that would like to kill him atleast once per day.But when Tequatl doesn’t scale under 80 we are bothering with him anymore.We like to play as guild.We do GMs and WvW but the new boss is being declined to us.Well GW2 is not an MMO in my eyes.It’s a bloody zergfest.
I feel the need to restate my concern about a damage meter, in relation to the arguement: “elitists already exist”. My concern is the ratio of elitist to casuals. Lets say the game community is 90% casual, 10% elitist. Many casuals don’t know what is truely optimal in the game, and since it’s difficult to prove what is optimal definitively, they consign them themselves to the fact that it doesn’t matter in the long run. However, it is in our basic human nature to persue what we believe is the “best”, which is why min/maxers and elitists exist. With a damage meter, we could have a better view of the best dps setup in the game, but this knowledge could promote a desire for casual layman to persue this “best”. This mentality converts what currently would be a casual player, into an elitist, demanding only the best.
I don’t get it. Trying to improve or seek something better doesn’t mean someone’s not casual.
This relies on a faulty assumption that casuals would like to remain ignorant, and elitists are going to use these statistics to min-max everything. But this just represents a false dichotomy. A lot of people wouldn’t say no to something that allows them to get what they want. At the same time, a lot of so-called “elitists” meaning the type that actively excludes and kicks people often don’t care about reasoning and numbers but rather just conforms to the fotm mentality that something is objectively the best without figuring out why… in reality they already made up their minds already.
My point is these so-called min-maxers are also the ones that frequently edit wiki pages so that people such as myself that are too lazy to figure it out on my own can know too. This is just really the same thing. What you view as toxic elitists is not the same as the people that actively explore the mechanics of the game, and it’s honestly quite insulting to them.
My problem isn’t the min/maxer who do legwork or want to improve themselves.
My problem is the players who disallow other players from joining parties.
I want players to be allowed to run what they like without being forced to conform to one specific build.
My concern is with a damage meter, players will find the highest dps build, and it will invalidate any build other then it in the eyes of the masses. All who don’t play that build will not be allowed into most parties; which I might add would halt experimentation.
I want players to be free to play as they choose, not be forced to run fotm. I realize this already happens to some degree, and I don’t want this attitude to permeate the entire player base.
But you wouldn’t want to run with those type of players anyway, would you?
The people who want highest dps pugs will ask you to ping gear or even tell them your build. They don’t need a damage meter.
I wouldn’t run with them, I just don’t want the chances of running into such a group to be any greater then it is now. I prefer them being a minority so most people don’t have to run into them on a regular basis, to not have to spend hours looking for a party, just because they aren’t running certain build.
why would damage meter create more of these players? would a PVT hammer tank warrior suddenly change to a axe/sword berserker warrior when a damage meter is implemented?
I don’t think it will make more of them.They are already in the game.Have people forgotton what was CoF P1 before the gold nurf?The elitists and bads are already in the game.I don’t think they will increase just from one personal dmg meter.
Even now a party leader can ask you to link gear and if he doesn’t like it he can kick you.
If you want a high dmg dealer go for Thief or Ele they both are better from the warrior.
Here is why – GuanglaiKangui explains it perfectly
Remember when I told everyone to get over HB’s one big number, and everyone told me to stop making straw man arguments?
Well, the straw man is right here and he’s posting right now.
I finally got around to modeling thief, which gives me a full DPS tier list, and it looks like this:
Max buffed, from best to worst:
Mesmer (Sw/Sw with 3 phantasms) = ~15k
Thief (D/D backstab) = ~13.5k
Elementalist (fire staff or LH) = ~13k
Guardian (GS+Sword) = ~11k
Necromancer (D/F+WH with all minions) = ~11k
Warrior (Axe+GS) = ~10k
Ranger (Sword and Feline pet) = ~9.5k
Engineer (Grenades) = ~9k
Off the top of my head, anyway. As you can see, ,the difference between the top three and the rest is fairly severe (Ele sits at 13k, while Guardian and Necro are around 11k) but the rest are pretty close together. You can also tell that the top three have “special conditions” on achieving max DPS, as does Necromancer, so Guardian is actually the highest unconditional DPS you will get.
I very much understand where the OP is coming from. The internal metrics won’t lie.
I’m sure the Tequal event metrics will show that it was being killed every spawn on every server, to once or 2 or 3 times a day on one or two servers. This is a step backwards instead of forwards. Because instead of generating new content to attract more players Anet has alienated a large portion of players. Sure some people in Tequal guilds will do it, but that’s far less than the people that were doing it before. Anet wants people to play, if less people play because of a change it’s a step backwards. To be honest it’s a failure.
Solution? Tequal hard mode instance, but because it seems too typical MMO like, Anet will not do this. The real solution is to have left Tequal as is and create a new land where there is an event like Tequal v2. You might sell recycling old content as new content, but it isn’t. You don’t take away from the current state, you add more content.
You add and add and add. No map space? Go underground, go in the air, go into the sea.
I couldn’t even participate in Teq on Gate of Madness… it was more than a ghost town because I was the only one there 2 out of 3 times. I took a few screenshots, but now I can’t find them (I’ll probably add them later). Anyway, I agree 100% with your post.
So much this.Tower Guard nailed it perfectly.
I don’t see PvPers,WvWers,Casual PvErs or even guilds like mine to go kill it.Whenbig percentage of the player base is not doing something that it’s fail experiment.
If only a small number of the playerbase is doing it then the event has made a niche.
Why WoW raid is better from the Tequatl?Because more people are doing it.I can bet that WoW raiders are more than the people who are actually doing the Tequatl.
Why?Because raids are not random and are structured better.There isn’t random chaos going everywhere.
I never played WoW, so forgive me for asking: If only large, organised guilds kill Tequatl in overflows with any regularity, isn’t that exactly the same as instanced raiding?
It’s almost the same.Here some things that raid requires:
Instanace – Overflow
Number of people – 10/20/25/40/80
Raid leader – Commander
People who know the fight and are not screwing,akitteng or what ever they are doing.
What is the similarity of the Tequatle with a raid boss?Well almost everything except that it is minimum for 80 people so everyone with older computer can’t do it.
That is why Blizzard moved from 40 man raids to 25.With more people it’s always more laggy.
The other similarity is that you go to an overflow where you play with people that pull their weight and don’t slack.They are organized and know perfectly what to do.
Now the Tequatl fight would be better if it was not for 80 people minimum.My guild can easily get 40 people.Our GMs are with done by so many.But we are not doing Tequatl because it is not scaling under 80.
I talked with my guildies and we all think that if we could do it with 40 people we would go and actually kill him.But when we don’t have 80 people,well we won’t bother doing it.
+1
To a damage taking dummy that displays DPS
-1
To anything remotely close to WoW
Be sure to make it clear in your posts exactly what type of model you’re promoting
I’m talking for personal meter specifically.It’s not someone else job to see what people are contributing to the group.
The dps Meter is only for personal use for improving your build,seeing what spell with how much is increasing your dps or healing .I want to be able to test different things on the dummies in the Mysts.
If you’re talking about having a type of feature similar to GW1 Isle of Nameless where you could go in, with your build, and beat on barrels that represented the various armor ratings to see how much damage you did, or the guy that told you ‘you do x damage per second. death after x seconds’. Sure, I could see that added to the game, tossed into the mists somewhere so you could try out some build variations. I used to enjoy doing that, liked comparing my pve vs pvp outputs as well when I was using skills that were split, so I wouldnt necessarily mind having something in the pve section either. Maybe a training area in your home instance for trying out builds?
On the other hand, if you’re talking like the WoW meters, where you can see how much everyone in the party is doing (which it doesn’t sound like you are), nope no thank you. We have enough class/armor/weapon discrimination already. They don’t need more tools to make it that much easier.
No not like WoW’s recount.
I want similar tool to what GW1 had.
Sounds to me like this is the fault of the community itself, not the tool. A community of… intellectually challenged… people makes for a bad LFG environment to begin with.
Yes to a personal meter. The combat log is utterly useless.
I really hate to inform you all, but unfortunately there are objective metrics to performance. Whether or not you accept these metrics to be indicative of character ability is another story, but people are theorycrafting “optimal” builds regardless and personally I want to see if the build I’m trying out is more effective than the one I was doing last. Stats are always subjective to interpretation, but to form an analysis of any value, you need actual numbers.
Having the game hide this kind information just because people may get their feelings hurt is silly. Do people not realize many things are situational; and if whatever you’re using is “bad”, then it’s bad? So what if it suggests your build is trash? It probably is. So what? I’m a pretty terrible player, so I don’t hang out with elitists. Cool story really; I do play the way I want, but I don’t want to make any excuses either.
And it does help if we can prove that a build a friend is running is suboptimal to run something else. Better than failing 20-30 times I say.
Also, the next time you bring your non-fotm build/class in and you can prove it can just do just as well as their “favored” builds. Well, wouldn’t that be swell?
As for people being jerks, people always be jerks, and you shouldn’t play with them. The whole thing comes down to the zerker debate. There’s jerks on both ends. I compare rude speedrunners that forum warrior to people who drive fast, constantly tailgate while swapping lanes and think they own the highway, honking at people who get in their way. And then there’s the zerker haters who want to “drive the way they want” but think that going 40 mph in the fast lane and blocking it is perfectly acceptable. (aka the person that feels entitled to join speedruns without gearing for one)
Slower traffic keep to the right. That’s all I’ll say.
Combo field will work the same way if some buff is cast only on one character.So the one who has the buff or the combo field his dmg will be increased.
Combo field is not a new concept.It is in old MMOs presented too just not as combo field but as a buff cast on single target.
I don’t understand what is confusing here.It’s quite simple.
.The guild has a stable community of 170+ members.We use TS3 as voice chat.
