I have been on both sides myself and from my prospective neither is any fun. Balance IS what makes PvP fun. You can not “improve” enough to counter a 3-5 to 1 advantage….or in many cases more.
no, but you cannot :
force ppls to join an server they do not like (put ppls from server A to play in server B to balance numbers )
kick 10000 ppls out of wvwvw in queue ( we can consider winning side got an 3 hours queue ) – if you decrease the ammount of players allowed in wvwvw you will have 12 hours queue – leave wvwvw
But you can :
try to drag your pve population intro wvwvw.
try to lure ppls from other servers intro your server
transfer to another server
drop in tier.
This options will not punish the other side, but might help you reach your goal.
What if server population in WvW was scaled based upon the lowest teams population?
This would allow for balanced game place and eliminate the massive population zergs.
It’s funny to see players in Jade Quarry and Blackgate crow about how good they are with multiple massive zergs runnning in all maps at the same time.
This would be based upon the tier you are currently fighting in, not the entier server population.
If server population was scaled based upon the lowest teams population the winning servers would be based entirely on skill and not player prostitutes.
So if i disconect ,cause i take an coffe break , you get disconected also for balance
if i don’;t play this week cause i got real life problem , you don’t play neither, for balance.
If you decide to play untill 1 am , but i want to sleep at 11 am you won;t be able either
Did you ever took in consideration how this will affect the other players ?
Did you ever took in consideration that this will be anti solo players /low lvls ?
My server take 2000 points leading saturday, and decide to stop wvwvw for 1 week.
I cap 1 borderland and move to other, you won’t be able to join there, cause no enemy’s
Nobody will be able to join, for balance
…
etc
For real , take all the factors in consideration
Where are all the solo/duo roamers these days? All I see from deso and viz are 4-5+ groups roaming around. Getting so boring with these groups following my kitten for 5+ mins just to kill 1 mesmer.
Made me giggle, I roam solo and Its so hard to find a SFR or VS player alone, or even a duo. And if by chance I do they run back to hug a keep/npcs or wait for backup. And with Deso being ‘outmanned’ most the time all I run into is sfr or vs zergs.
Funny enough only place for 1v1/1v2/2v2 etc.. these days is EB puzzle
(or spvp shudder)
I’m just an average player, but I just hate people afraid of a fair fight/cowards.
i get 200 – 300 pvps from deso pugs on Vs border every day, hardy doubt you cannot find solo /duo SFR over there
As a deso player i like Vizunah more than SFR because they dont whine on the forums. Before SFR joined tier 1 couple of weeks ago our t1 forums were free from trolls. Now all i see people mostly from SFR side calling out names and talking non sense.
I rather have VS in tier 1 then SFR.
Let me correct it for you
Before SFR joined Tier 1, there was 1 sided match, without any competition.
I also dislike repair costs that increased a lot since SFR joined tier 1
But i made the calculation to point that there are a lot of factors that can influence
Damage / backstab
-skill specific coeficient 2.4 vs 1.2 (backstab vs facestab) 115% assasin signet1.05 sigil of force
traits :
10% if your initiative is over 6
10% if your target got an condition
20% if your target is below 50% hp
5% with dagger
5% from behind
bloodlust stacks
Might stacks (you can get 15 stacks of might in less then 1 second by activating 3 signets with signets of power trait)
I made my thief build especially for some average resistance to stay longer on battlefield. I have 1400 toughness (full exotic) which I think is quite high for this class and yet I have been destroyed by some some glass canon hitting me by Steal 8000, CnD 5500, BS 10200(1vs1 match). I never experienced this with my previous build with 900 t. If +500 t. makes no difference what is the point to have it? If I had my previous build i would be BS by 12000? steal 10000?
Other side is hitting someone in light armor (power 3000, critic. 90%) and doing him 3000 damage by BS. I found that I got Higher damage on warriors then on mesmers or necros. STRANGE INDEED!?
Backstab damage is doubled if you are behind your target
Skill damage coeficient is 1.2 – facestab // 2.4 backstab
Considering an thief can get over 3200 power -120 critical damage (full glas cannon)
we add food buff / 25 bloodlust staks / 25 might stacks – thief can reach 4200-4500 power / 120 crit damage
add 5% (dagger training)+ 5%(flanking strikes) +10% (exposed weakness) +10%(first strikes) + 20%(executioner) from traits = 50% damage modifier , mathematicly is posible to hit with same skill for 5k damage or 20 k damage .
Direct damage formula is – Damage done = (weapon damage) * Power * (skill-specific coefficient) / (target’s Armor) SITUATION 1
DAMAGE DONE = 952 (weapon dmaage) * 4300 (power ) * 2.4 (backstab skill coeficent) * 150% (traits ) * 2.7 (Critical ) / 2400 armor = result an 16579 backstab SITUATION 2
DAMAGE DONE = 952 (weapon dmaage) 3200 ( no bloodlust/might stacks) 1.2 (facestab skill coeficient)* 115% (traits- no flanking strikes / target got no condition/ you don’t have over 6 initiative /target got over 50% hp) * 2.7 (critical ) =5517 face backstab (Critical ) -2000 non critical
ofc you can get more power – i belive you can reach 4700 full ascended /ruby orbs
Also i did not took in consideration sigil of force 5% damage or any defensive buffs /protection -signet of judgement / -% damage under ….. etc .
And vulnerability /frenzy (take extra 50% damage)
Those could increase even more the damage diference from same player to same target
for 3 or more targets shortbow is already better then D/D.
I do not risk to enter in middle of the fight without any stability, so i prefer to use shortbow and drop dark field (shadow refuge) on my warriors /guardians that are pushing. In the moment that zergs collide, i use dagger storm , but i don’t jump in middle of 30 enemy’s i keep 300 range
he will still be able to do that, in US there are many Europeans /assians , australians with 350 + latency. As you noticed none even bothered to dodge his CnD on the movie, or to track him stealthed with auto attack chain.
He will be affected but not more then other builds.
1. Have own team to count on . at least 7-8 players who play support and CC.
2. Use tanky build
3. Announce your presence on map , and your objectives, but do not try to force ppls to follow you.
4. Run – at supply camps after every attack /defence , where ppls that followed you used supply.
5. Don’t run without sieges , and don’t be cheap at siege /food buffs. IF you announce trial of food at spawn , you will group fast ppls at you:)
I’ve tested an lifesteal /tanky build with arround 470 healing power, only from celestial items +30 points in shadow arts
Signet of malice / shadow refuge (Darkfield ) + whirl ( death blossom /dagger strom) assasin reward , omnomberry pie , 65% critical chance , Opportunist .
Combo is great in pve and Zerg vs zerg in pvp, you can keep full hp , untill you get CC’ed.
You can lifesteal and surive , even against large mobs groups, untill you get CC’ed , when you are preety much dead. Those build scales verry good with high armor and critical chance
If you are able to win 1 vs 2 , those oponents are already 1 lvl bellow you.
1 vs 5 is posible only against opponents with high latency, few experience ingame, and less skilled.
It is an good reason to be unable to determinate how good he really is.
Yes he moves good, time his stealth skills good, but you cannot know how he fights under presure , since he only recorded easy fights
The fact that he can use whirlwind axe in front of 2 warrior for 3 seconds without getting hitted or CC’ed , show the quality of the oponents he chose to record against.
Hi guys, for the last couple of days I’ve been playing on my laptop while relaxing in bed (my kids were on the main PC). In PvE I get little to no lag on the laptop and about 15-35 fps, but in WvW I get ample during battle with mostly < 5 fps (as I’d expect).
The thing is during a large battle of 30+ on each side I get so much lag I am less than 1 fps. But that’s OK because I shouldn’t really be on my laptop to begin with and if I die I deserve it. However, I rarely died during these periods of intense lag. More often than not I could stand still with AOE skills going (what choice did I have as the screen was all but frozen) and by the time the fight was over (if our team was victorious) I had dozens of loot bags at my feet and my health was still full!!!
I don’t plan on playing on my laptop any more because I hate < 60 fps during big battles so I’ll be on my main rig from tonight onward, but, is this an exploit? Or was I just super lucky on the weekend not to have died during these large battles?
How would you do it? As it is now I find it beyond boring / pointless.
I’ve been working on an idea were every server has a Castle/Fortress on their own battle ground, removing the points system and making the entire objective of WvWvW to destroy/capture the other servers Castles/Fortresses. Meaning the entire war effort would be focused on actually defeating your enemy rather than seeing who can make the most points by out playing the other server in musical objectives. Taking another servers fort should be something epic, not something that happens 50 times a day. Something that takes everyone on your server working together for days for that 1 huge battle vs the other server. By doing this you would also have to make a way for a server to essentially lock out the 3rd server from being able to waypoint/spawn into the zone of the server you are attacking. I guess this would be done by making the forward camps in zones captureable/recaptureable.
My thoughts aren’t exactly all there but I’d like to see how other people would like to see WvWvW play out. OR is anyone actually content with how WvWvW is now?
But:
No competition = no organization
No points – no pride, nothing to fight for, how will you match who vs who fight.
non oraganized zergs, since there will be no reward. Fights against walls , since i will have no interest to fight with 15 ppls vs 40 just to hold my castle, it will be there at 3 am also.
As an conclusion :
Why would ppls follow commanders ?
Tactics would be pointless
Organization would be pointless…
why would you bother to cap another castle if you can fight in front of your casttle. Why would you eat arrows from 7 arrow carts for 20 minutes in row, in front of enemy gate ?
Why would lossing side fight ?
Builds countering our enemies. D/D Approach.
VS Mesmers that use clones (unknown build)
Work your way through clones with C/D.
Use 3 seconds to determine the real Mesmer.
Use short bow aoe spam to nuke the clones.
Doesen’t work vs condition staf mesmers
you get hit stealthed by staf auto attack , if you destroy clones with your CnD , you get confusion
Well then? You can contribute, 1 person giving their personal encounters isnt enough :p
Against staf mesmers i sugest (Hide in shadows – shadowstep /blinding powder / shadaow refuge – basilik vennom) – at least 10 points in Shadow arts for condition removal on stealth
Initiate with shadowstep – 1 autoattack chain -1 hs -CnD – Shadowreturn
Hide in shadows -basilik – steal +HS , dodge,Death blossom , dodge- blinding powder- backstab – try to finish
if you fail shadow refuge.
Why is this skill considered projectile ? (it is blocked by Wall of reflection /smoke screen/etc ). on Skill descritpion i see is bombs /blast /explosion (Fire a cluster bomb at target area. Detonate in midair for multiple explosions //Blast finisher)
Everyone thinkiny that there is the slightest colaboration between sfr and deso are just simply delusional.
Moving towards better arguments WL was really nice how you guys fought last night.We couldn’t touch garri last night but a decent part of that is to be atributed to IRON that just wouldn’t stop focusing us.Strange tactic since reason dictates that VS is their prime enemy this week fighting for the spot in t1 but all in all was a real fun night on VS bl.I would say reset on this bl was a draw draw in both keeps hold and wipes between all the 3 participants and many 3 way fights.
Unfortunately sfr was the only server that didn’t have a 1 mega guild on the map and our forces were always divided but i certainly can’t blame 2 big guilds like wl and iron that they prefer to play as one.
Gl guys and keep the good fights commuing.
ps: can’T wait for the wvw culling patch.
We took both your lake and hills since you guys decided to focus our bay straight away from the start of the reset when we were going for woodhaven. Specifically RIOT guild, after they tried and failed miserably we thought kitten this you want to focus us we take your lake and hills =D.
How could anybody dare to challenge allmighty blob IRON ?
Thieves don’t need more base hp or armor , however some skills /traits could use an buff
what i would like to see
Last refuge – break stun or gain protection
Roll for initiative – reduced cooldown to 40 seconds
expeditious dodger – change swiftness to 1-2 initiative
deceptions available underwater
This won’t strike good thieves
this will strike stealth abuse
this will strike invisible zergs with veil
and hide in towers 4 ever
i consider it fair, as an main thief ,but is more newbie friendly for “Bad zerg” to win against “coordinated zergs”
we know the answer — it’s because the Thief if OP, and those who enjoy being OP are desperately trying to keep it that way.
We = who ? who you represent …. over 10000 ppls read forums every day, from that ppls
5-25 complains about thieves
Thief is OP= too much HP , too high acces to boons , too much CC, and the king of AOE
those who enjoy being OP =players that explain to glass cannons how to counter them…
regarding body shot -blast finisher, no
blast is aoe stealth / aoe might / aoe regeneration
this would make P/D thieves to change for P/P , and hey i don’t need C&D to stealth anymore , i drop smoke field 6 initiative, i use body shot (1 initiative) – sneak attack …2 hits , smoke field /body shot.
you just need to pick 3 out of those : infusion of shadows /patience/ initial strike /infiltrator signet /quick recovery , to become real imortal
daze+ burst + stealth +evade on weapon skil -no
atm
S/D miss burst
S /P miss stealth
D/D // D/P P/D miss daze
P/P miss evade and stealth ( but have range)
You gain so much in fact that a full tank build can hit close to a glass cannon but take hits because they are all tough/vit.
Tough/vit nourishments FTW
Uhh… correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t the most you can get from food/maint ~14% to any one stat or divided over multiple stats? Say you add that to power exclusively, how’s that going to make up for all of the non-existent precision, condition damage, critical damage, critical rate, etc…?
ok let me go with a superior sharpening stone where 6 percent of your toughness and 4 percent of your vitality is converted to power which ends up being 10 percent total. Lets say you have 2200 tough and 2200 vit you are going to end up getting 220 power. Now lets say you go with something like plate of truffle steak which gives you 100 power and 70 precision thats a total of 320 power and 70 precision..
Considering that an naked char got arround 900 -1000 to all stats, and you will add 1200 thoug and 1200 vitality , you will have like 10 critical chance and base critical damage.
So an char who take flat 10% -11% bonus power only from food will have 0 damage anyway
You might say an balanced char will take bonus 6% from double food use, but i hardly doubt you lose at 6% diference an major part of your pvps
with 20 hammer warrior , using CC on same group , for 3 seconds each, with 8 seconds reuse, Considering 1 warrior can stun 5 ppls , mathematically you could stun an 20 enemy’s zerg for 24 hours /day , 7 days / week
First, with the new Power Toughness crit damage gear, the scaling is crazy. On my thief, i get 168 power from sharpening stones and that is HUGE! Then with Plate of truffle steak dinner, that’s and extra +200 power + 10% crit damage. I dont think 368 power +10% crit damage is fair but I’m going to use it because it has that extra edge.
**Edit Another point, 165~ power from sharpening stones + 200 power +10% crit damage, +250 power from stacks of bloodlust, +might stacks 6-10stacks of might average(192-320power) +5% or 10% damage from sigil of force and night. that is a total of 935power +10% crit damage + sigil of force or night. Again why is food needed?
Again why might stacks are needed ? for real bloodlust sigil add you 250 power , might stacks 250-400 , and you blame the food
And your traits for extra 300 power ?
Why
A thief that dies in stealth either:
(1) Needs to l2p
(2) Got unlucky
(3) is glas cannon ( no condition removal on that build)
(4) fight against an decent enemy who know how to track his auto attack
(5) is not invulnerable to aoe, and got hit by an 6 k whirlwind
(6) is tracked by an channeling skill
(7) his enemy’s don’t stop aoe the area where he stealthed
edit *
8 – he got knocked back from his refuge by an mesmer /guard/warrior/ranger
… The problem is that many of them are noob and take the same skills they use for their build for PvP (where there is a low skill floor for thieves) and try to use them in PvE (where there is a higher skill floor for thieves)
Given that thief skills mostly don’t change from PvE to PvP (and if they do is for the worse), it only means that most human players are simply easier to deal with than NPCs.
The skills themselves don’t change, you are correct. However, the skills you use can change as you swap utilities and weapons to adapt to the different fights in PvE … it’s what I do on my Mesmer, Ranger, and Elementalist. It’s what I see the good Thieves do. It’s what I don’t see bad Thieves do.
For example, there are an abundance of locations in Fractals where anti-projectile utilities are extremely useful … but you hardly ever see Thieves equip smoke screen for them.
Additionally, players don’t have the substantially larger health pools that veterans have. This health pool gives a thief from quickly bursting something down before it can strike back.
i agree with you on this point :
For example at dredge fractal , dagger storm is usefull to clean trash, at bosses in general basilik vennom is good ( special mention mosman and collosus boss)
On swap fractals Shadowstep is usefull , when you pick the wisp , but on volcanus fractal is useless since there aren’t many stuns and you can use smoke screen to block projectiles, blinidng powder for an extra stealth/regen /cond removal
01- Every serv which has faced VS since the release deserved #1
02- SFR deserves #1 more than all of these
ETC…
ps: my english is bad, blablablah..
You forgot :
31 – Vizunah are the only server that can use an arrow cart proper ….
32- Vizunah don’t nightcap , true warriors never sleep
33 – Vizunah don’t lose, if you won vs Vizunah is because they allowed you
34 -Vizunah never zerg, they just use mesmer clones and thieves guild
35- Vizunah are like spartans , only 300 /each borderland
i agree with healing signet, should scale better with healing power
an 208 + 0.12 of healing power would not be overpowered at all.
it would basicily give you at 300 healing power 242 Hp/SEC , with some celestial (divinity runes /celestial rings and wvwvw bonuses at 290 hp/sec
I can’t believe some ppl choose Roll for Initiative over Shadowstep, and call themselves thieves
is really situational , shadowstep. is superior in zerg vs zerg , team vs team etc.
But in 1 vs 1 situations RFI is supperior
If A-net decide to reduce cooldown of RFI i might consider to add it on my skill bar as an direct damage build.
