Guild Wars 2

11/12/2016 – November 11 Patch Notes

Fixed Forum Bug, Thread should now show the Posts.

Obligatory Server Crash Fix otherwise we can’t call it Patch Notes.

Don’t forget that mastering and killing a Raid Boss are two different Things but I agree. The next Bosses should be much harder and require more Effort to take them down. Like for the World first Teams, wiping for a few hundred Times before getting it done.

But TBH if the first Raid of GW2 would like that, with Bosses on Mythic Archimonde Level in Terms of difficulty, it would be too much of a culture Shock. The first Raid is there to introduce GW2 Players into Raiding, it don’t need to be really difficult, its Challenging but you can still mess up a few Things without wiping the entire Raid and I think the second one will also more like getting People more comfortable with Raiding but then Anet should amp up the difficulty of the next Raids

maddoctor.2738:

Walhalla.5473:

While more Classes should be able to give out these Class Buffs. Anet should prevent the Players from Overkilling with the Buffs and having like 20 unique Damage Buffs.

That’s why I say they should give either the exact same buffs or buffs that DO NOT STACK with what we already have.

Whoops, didn’t see that. My bad.

While more Classes should be able to give out these Class Buffs. Anet should prevent the Players from Overkilling with the Buffs and having like 20 unique Damage Buffs.

So they should either give other Classes the same Buffs we have now, or making some Buffs excluding each other ( Just for an Example. You’d either take Empower Allies or Assasins Presence because only one could give the Buff and the other one would do nothing so you take either one of them but not both. I know bad Example but I had to take something for this )

Right now the PvE Balance, has quite a few Problems like:

- A huge difference in DPS between the Classes ( something that a Skill Split would help with making the Gap smaller )

- 5 Man Boon Cap

- No Competition in giving out Boons ( Chrono is the only one giving out so much Quickness. Alacrity is Chrono only. PS has no real competition in Might Buffing )

- Either too many Damage Buffs, or not enough Classes with Damage Buffs

These Problems are Part of why we have crappy Balance in PvE now. ( Not saying that PvE Balance was good before the Balance Patch, but it was better and the best we had in PvE Balance. Its more that the last Changes got rid of the Paint that made a Car full of Rust look better now the PRoblems are much easier to see )

Trying to find the Illusion-Shatter Skill for Rednik so he can see that Anet didn’t focus on Raids at the Expense of everything else.

There should be a summary on this Forum on Guilds who are there to help People to get into Raiding and to train them to get better at this Stuff^^

Could be the Terrain. This Monday my Group had a Spirit not moving at roughly the same Position where the Orb was stucked last Week

So basically it is " Go PvP or kitten off"

He made a good Counter Argument, your Argument is just “Go PvP or kitten off”

Again, you Changes give the Reaper 4 Mobility Skills ( 5 If you also take in the Flesh Wurm ) and One Skill for grabbing People. This is waaay too much, complete Overkill on this Part. No other Class has access to so many Mobility Skills at once.

And you didn’t clarify if you want to keep the additional Gravedigger Effect for CD Reduction for Example. You spam Gravedigger when your Enemy is below 50%. So when it is a Leap Attack you just spam Leaps which is annoying since you give up Control over your Class. You can interrupt a normal Gravedigger by dodging if the Situation demands it. Your Leap can’t be interrupted. So repositioning by yourself due to dodging or moving isn’t possible. It then makes the skill very unconvienent and clunky.
And what about the CD reduction? Kill it? You’d then have killed a very good DPS income. This is why he talks about sinking Power Necros further.

Tell me. What is the Problem Necros Face in PvE? ( Hint: Its not Mobility )

So as long as I don’t do WvW or PvP I have nothing to say about it? This is not how Discussion works.

Here I’m talking from a Perspective you just ignore and for Balancing you need to see it from more Angles and not just PvP or WvW and from a PvE Perspective your Suggetion is just meh. To summarize you starting Post:
Make GS1 faster ( the only good Thing for PvE )
Change other GS Skill to Movement Skill
Nerf Damage of GS. ( taking out the only good PvE Suggetion )

You know, Reapers don’t have it easy in PvE Content, especially in Raiding ( Necro is on Life Support there, your Changes would kill it on this Gamemode). Try to look it from a PvE Perspective and what it would change in the different PvE Modes, and don’t just say go PvP/WvW or kitten.

Sry Swagger but while the Changes may be nice they are more likely a kick in the Balls for PvE Reapers. The only thing that would be beneficial would be GS1 with faster Attacks. But then you are overloading the Reaper with Mobility Skills. You would have 4 Skills who are Mobility Skills and also one grabbing your Enemies. Its far too much.

And for PvE. You are just talking about making Things more like Mobility Skills but not talking about how to balance the Damage, CD etc. If everything would stay the same except the Weapon Damage you want to decrease, and the Change just happens to be on the Mobility then you nerfed Reaper hard. Remember?

*Change the weapon to do moderate damage to balance out these cool new features.

I don’t mind Changes to the Reaper GS but it shouldn’t be a complete Rework to something that has more Mobility than a DD Thief or is even close to Daredevil.

While faster attack is nice, GS2 should get also faster Attacks. And we don’t need more reposition Skills in PvE. Shroud 2 is enough. And the Ability to stick to the Target…. Git gut? Srsly its not a Problem at all to stick to the Target in PvE not even as a Reaper.

And nerfing the Weapons Damage for the “cool” new Feature is not helping at all in PvE

Are these Suggestions PvP Motivated? I don’t see how this would help Necros in PvE.

Well my Group had the Bug this Week. Nothing could move the Orb but after some Time ( 30 Seconds to a Minute ) the was Orb retrieved. Had a good laugh on it but if this happens more often than it is gonna be very annoying.

KC in my Opinion is the worst Boss Encounter and its not the Ghosts ( Spirits ) where I’m having a Problem. There are a few Parts of the Fight where you do nothing and the biggest Contender is RNG deciding on what Mechanic you get. Killing the coloured Spirits or spreading with the Bombs. The Spirits are far easier to deal with and the Bombs are getting in the Way of the AOE Indicators of other Attacks like, messing up the AOE Field of the Pizza Attack or rendering the AOE’s of the Ceiling Debris Thing invisible.

UnbentMars.9126:

Engi is a great class, just inconsistent. It’s difficult to play well compared to the other classes, so it’kitten or miss whether you find a person who can do it right or not. PUGS don’t trust engi’s because of that rather than engi’s being weaker

Well Solution would be to make playing Engi good, less complicated but quite a lot of Engis I have seen don’t want this because of the “Flavour” of their Class and just demanding more Damage.

Sry Ohoni, but even with the Knowledge of how deadly Things in Nomarl Mode would be, People would still learn the wrong Stuff in Easy Mode if they are different. I have seen this in WoW with the LFR Mode. It made Normal Mode frustrating because People who went from LFR to Normal learnt on how to deal with Bosses on LFR which was completely Braindead and failed or ignored important Mechanics because it didn’t matter much there even after explaining how to deal with the Mechanics the right Way ( " I did it 100 Times on LFR, I know how to deal with it" cough )

Give People the Option to learn Stuff the wrong Way and you’ll see a lot of People learning the Stuff the wrong Way, which will make pugging more frustrating as there is a big “Chance” of getting People who are doing it completely wrong in the Normal Mode, since they learnt it so in Easy Mode. Consequence. Pugs will set up more restrictions to keep out the “Easy-Mode-Scrubs”. Easy Mode Players will complain about how the “Elitist” Players won’t let them Raid etc etc.

Also again. To have an easier Version being capable to train you, the Core of the Mechanics should stay the same, it should just be easier to deal with it. Again going to my Flamewall Example. If this would be changed on how I see Easy Modes should be, than Players still learn " Big Wall of Flame kills me. Don’t ever touch it", they just have more time to react. On normal Mode they just need to react a bit faster which is much easier than having two completely different Versions of the Flamewall in the Game Modes and learning both of them.

And on the Topic of being too occupied with not getting hit on VG. What the Hell are you doing there? Damage on VG doesn’t come in fast. Are you standing in Seekers or even better, in Front of him? I mean srsly. As Melee DPS you just have to dodge once every 10 Seconds. As Ranged DPS you don’t even have to do that.

Ohoni.6057:

You could be more specific, which phase, which part. But if you can’t do that you probably don’t pay much attention on when and why they die. Sometimes you do have control on when people die, it depends on your role.

Sure, but I was just general DPS, and obviously not the leader of the group, so I wasn’t micromanaging everyone else. I was just doing my job as best I could and expecting them to do theirs.

Even as a DPS you should start watching when People fall down like crazy to see what is hitting them. It is very clear where the Damage comes from in the Fight, so you don’t need to be super crazy observant, just start watching for your surroundings and you’ll see what hits them and then you can tell these People.

Everyone can do something to make the Team itself better.

And with nerfing the Damage in Easy Mode. Let’s say we get an Easy Mode and every One Shot Mechanic is doing normal Damage now. For Example Sabethas Flamewall. Instead of killing someone she just deals 50% of the Maximum Health as Damage. What would People do? Avoid the Flamewall by any means neccesary? Nope just walk or dodge through it. And People in Easy Mode would then learn to do this in a different Way than Players in Normal Mode.
And now lets say People go from Easy Mode to Normal Mode after knowing the Fight in Easy Mode by heart. They go into a Fight saying that they are Exp and start dying on the Flamewall. They react to the Flamewall by walking or dodging through them which is detrimental for the entire Group.
The Moment Things are too different between normal and Easy Mode is gonna be the Moment PuG Groups will raise the Entrance Bar even further, to keep People out who learned the wrong Stuff for the Normal Fight ( It is harder to break bad Habits than to learn new ones )

In an Easy Mode. Deadly Stuff should still be deadly but it should be easier to avoid it, like giving them more Time to react to the Stuff. Flamewall again as an Example. When the Arrow is becomes visible you have 2 Seconds to relocate yourself so you don’t get hit by the Flamewall. Make it 3 or 4 Seconds in Easy Mode for Example and People have much more Time to react and relocate but they still learn. " Flamewall One Shots me, don’t every get hit by it." They get the knowledge that its deadly and it will stay deadly in Normal Mode. They just need to react a bit faster but they didn’t learn the wrong Stuff or get bad Habit, since the Core of this Mechanic is the same.

Ohoni.6057:

If you are experienced with other types of content then it means that either your groups are bad, lacking the same experience as you, or your teamwork is at fault or your composition is wrong. Maybe you could tell us which part of VG you find the the most difficulty at.

The part where people die and the group wipes. I got tired of that bit.

Ok and why do People die?

I have tested a bit with Axe. GS and Dagger and while my Gear isn’t optimal ( too much Zerker Stuff on the Necro ) I would say that the Gap between Axe and Dagger or GS is still high. There was a 5k Gap between Axe and GS Rotation ( even GS Autoattack is better than an Axe Rotation ) in my Tests.

I’m improving my Gear so I can see the Values more precicely but right now for Axe to be competitive in Raids, it needs a big Damage Buff.

Lahmia.2193:

Would you be willing to give up the instant non projectile hits on #1 and #2? Because that is pretty much the reason why Axe will never be buffed into usefulness. The guy in charge of creating Reaper said as much (I forget his name).

Well as long as the Damage Values of Axe stay the same in all Game Mode, it won’t be buffed to be useful. Otherwise it will be broken in PvP.

But I wouldn’t mind, making the Axe Stuff into Projectiles and then bumbing the Damage, if Anet sees it as the only Way to buff Axe then.

maddoctor.2738:

Make them work like Ferocity.

So you can then go for more than 100%. Makes sense. Crit Chance isn’t something where you can go over 100% ( or you have to implement Critical Crits ) but Duration is something that can go over 100% since its a Duration and not a Chance.

NovaanVerdiano.6174:

This troll post is confusing me greatly for some reason.

No matter if its a Troll Post. Anet will see it and change Horrors to 5 Seconds.

TexZero.7910:

sweet lets nerf that so norn necro becomes master race and we can all bearform for lulz

Get ready for Ursanway.

Wait… This isn’t GW1

otome.2673:

Walhalla.5473:

And if Anet stops nerfing Classes not called Eles and stops buffing Eles we could see more variety.

Necro is their main target for nerfs lol

Fixed it.

What, as a Necro, is also irritating, is the Fact that Anet said " Necro is faring well, we increase the viability of Power Necros and do some Minor Bug Fixes", while being too afraid to really Buff the Necro Damage and not fixing any Bugs ( at least not in the Patchnotes ).
Instead the Horrors get nerfed without any explanation or compensation. Seeing what Anet said, they see nerfing Necros as " Minor Bug Fixes ". At least this is the impression i get from the Text.

NovaanVerdiano.6174:

Ranael.6423:

Just wondering : how messy would it be to cancel subgroups in raid squads?

Things would be less controllable from player side so we should actually bring some covers around and the risk of redundancy would make the picking of support character a tougher choice right?

Not saying I want it, just philosophical speculations…

As in, forcing all ten players to be in the same subgroup?
If you mean that, I think it’s a bad idea. Boon sharing etc. would be an absolute mess.
I liked how it was before, you had 7-2-1, 5-5 and 4-4-2, so you had some freedom in how to set up your comp. Now you’re pretty much locked into 5-5, though I heard 4-4-2 still works, you just… lose a minute worth of dps on average in comparison to before? I assume 7-2-1 is completely busted.

Would also say that 7-2-1 is busted. 7-2-1 had less DPS than 4-4-2 but had more flexibility and you could run it if you just have 1 PS Warrior available.

And if they force 10 Players into one Subgroup they need to raise the 5 Man Cap, otherwise Boonsharing would be a complete Mess and you couldn’t control the Boonsharing anymore.

Thats why I’m saying that this needs to come with proper Balancing.

Does anyone care to expalin why the last Changes are moving to a healthy Metagame Environment? Metagame will be just Mirror Comp and noone I asked likes this Comp. It hardlocks 6 Spots out of 10 since you need the 6 Spots to give your Group enough Boons for a very good Uptime. The next 2 Spots are Eles since Ele = King of DPS and it even looks like that Condi Ele is going to be a thing. 36k DPS as Condi Ele on Target Golem. If everything goes bad, Condi Ele will go to be the No-Brainer Condi Pick. So even Condi Picks are going to be Ele sigh

In my Opinion the Metagame before the Patch was much healthier than what we have now. Only 3 Hardlocked Spots ( 7 2 1 was still good enough ) and every Class had a Place in the Raid Comp ( well expect Engis even though they can deal a lot of Damage but well it has something to do with their Rotation and the Requirements of good Damage )

Since I doubt that Anet is going to Change the SoI Nerf and give Chrono the Ability back to give near Perma Quickness to the Raid, we need something else to crack up the Supercomp we have now. One Problem is, that we need 2 Chronos, 2 Warriors, 2 Druids to give everyone the desired Boons and Buffs. Nerfing these Classes won’t solve any Problem. You’d make them either more desired or they fall out of the Meta completely.

Again you need 2 because due to 2 Things. 5 Man Buff Cap and not having the ability to pump out enough Boons to ignore this anymore. One Possible Solution would be to get rid of that Buff Cap for Raids and go for 10 Man Buff Cap. With this Mirror Comp would vanish and you’d have Place for more Classes. This Solution also has to come with proper Balancing ( much easier with Skill Splitting ) otherwise we’d have Class Stacking Eles on most Bosses.

maxwelgm.4315:

(he was kitten enough to drive the karka, the largos, the quaggan and the apparently immense and magically powerful krait civilization away from the depths).

You know something is Bad when it makes the Karka flee and make them consider the Fire Island Chain to be a nice Home compared to Fighting with him and yeah. The Krait, they still haven’t recovered from having their Civilisation being destroyed. Even the Skritt are better off than the Krait now ( and some Scratches star Civilisation again )

Being useful without getting nerfed after a Year.

DeoDose.4237:

Valkyre is definatly better and it was the only set I could reach 28k dps but that still is very bad compared to other classes.

28k DPS. This on Realistic…. That would be really nice A Pity that this is only obtainable with all Buffs.

Anet make it happen. Give Reapers another Reason to not dig their own Graves. Buff them.

And since I don’t like to waste Stats I’ll go for Valkyrie. Better Damage as Berserker ( even if the Difference is low ) and more HP. I would say its worth it. ( now the overall DPS needs to compare with other pure DPS Builds )

Crinn.7864:

Err why Valkyrie? Beserker is going to be just straight better.

The usefulness of quickness wells is going to depend on your Mesmer.

Too much Berserker is wasting Stats on Power Reaper. On Raid Bosses you’ll have 50% Crit Chance Base thanks to Decimate Defenses. Add 20% to that due to Fury and you have 70% overall. Then you also get Spotter and Banner of Discipline. Both together should give around 20% ( correct me if I’m wrong ) So you just need to fill up 10% using Berserker.

When you’ve done that you can go and use Valk Gear, thus not wasting Stats and gaining Vitality.

If you use then the Superior Sharpening Stone you get more Power out of it because of this Effect “Gain power equal to 4% of your vitality” Its not a big difference but every Stat Point of Power helps.^^

Perhaps we should try to pretend to be Eles so we get some love.

MrHarses.6801:

It does make sense, but this will probably lead to: 1 war, 1 chrono, 1 druid, 7 ele…

Like I said, some Balance Changes need to be done then if we go this Route but I see this as a good Step in the Right Direction.

And if Anet stops nerfing Classes not called Eles and stops buffing Eles we could see more variety. ( together with more Skill Splitting which also would make Balancing easier )

Well the more I think about it the more I believe this is a big Flaw in Raiding. A Flaw we either didn’t recognize or well ignored because one Class was enough to give everyone quite a lot of Quickness even with a 5 Man Buff Cap and this allowed for enough Flexibility in the Raid Comps and having a good amount of flexibility is a good Thing.

And well 5 Man Buff Cap for 10 Man Content is restricting. If we stay at the Quickness we can generate now we need the 10 Man Buff Cap. With this, you don’t need 2 PS Warriors, 2 Mesmers and 2 Druids to give everyone the Buffs they need and one of each of them would be enough. Obviously some Balance Changes must be done if we go this Route then but it would free up 3 Slots for other Classes, like giving the Auramancer a Shot as a Second Healer.

Nefarius.9702:

Lets stop using this false equivocation that raids are inaccessible, when the cold reality is people whom claim this don’t want to put in the same effort those before them did in building raid groups & learning.

Never mentioned they were inaccessible, I said accesing them is hard. If you point on one of the arguments, get them right please.

Also, if you’re in one of these “so called” learning groups? What do you get?
You see how the boss mechanic works. That’s good. But you’ll likely never be able to have a succesful finish of the boss. You’ll get no LI which is require for almost every serious raid group as evidence you’re experienced.

I was in one of the so calles learning Groups for Sabetha last Friday. 4 Of the Raiders did Sabethe for the first Time. We explained everything and were pretty relaxed about the Fight. Quite a lot of Mistakes were made but we saw that the 4 Guys learned quite fast and they went from missing every Bomb and panicking quite fast to finally killing the Boss with only a few Mistakes. ( And we did it with no Food and everyone was alive ).

So its not true that learning Groups never kill a Boss.
And if the first learning group isn’t killing it, here a small Advice. Make Friends with these Raiders so you can get them for the next Groups. Or look out for a Raiding Guild. These Guild are even more likely to train People because they want enough People for their Roster to raid every Week.

They said that they perhaps could pump out 4-5 Wings per Year but didn’t promise anything because Things can Change in the Developement of the Raids.

Absurdo.8309:

Obtena.7952:

cranos.5913:

Obtena.7952:

cranos.5913:

Obtena.7952:

afrocrusade.4253:

DeceiverX.8361:

SNIP

The manner of your typing is what’s pedantic. You say 10 words in 10 sentences. Brevity=soul of wit, blabla.

I don’t think people are being ‘non-brevious’ to avoid being witty. It’s not clear to people how you come to your conclusion about diversity dying … because of class equalizations. Diversity dies when people only want specific classes, which is what was happening due to OP’ed combos of effects. Anet reversed that … diversity should AT LEAST stay the same.

It doesn’t rly tbh because of how OP quickness is, and all other boons tbh. Not taking the buff classes (warr, druid, chrono) puts you at a severe disadvantage. It’s very much worth stacking them. So by nerfing chrono all they did was giving them an extra spot on a raid group.

No, I’m actually correct because you don’t need a Chrono to stack quickness on 10 players to be successful in raids begin with … Quickness being OPed doesn’t mean you need it for success, so yes, you can raid without it successfully and have a diverse team.

This is the same, incorrect mentality that meta lovers forced on players for dungeons … people didn’t need to play only meta builds to complete dungeon content either.

Aye but dungeons were easy. Believe it or not, raiding with pugs is actually quite the challenge. I for one, don’t believe that a no quickness pug raid will have much success, unless you’re planning to spend 2h on a single boss fight.

IDK if you’re overestimating raiders by looking at qT/DnT vids or underestimating the effect quickness has, but for real, you’re making it sooooooo much more difficult not bringing quickness. You’re pretty much always gonna hit enrage.

That doesn’t change the fact that quickness is not a requirement to complete a raid, so I’m not wrong.

I think the main takeaway is that being non-diverse looks to be optimal and the easiest way to complete the fight. That, imo, is a problem.

Yeah, since People want to be efficent, they go for this Mirror Comp Meta, and this has quite less Variety.

To make sure that more Classes have a Place in the Meta there are quite a few Things that can be done. First is Skill-Split and the second Thing that could be done would be bumping up the 5 Man Buff Cap to 10 Man. This Way you wouldn’t need 2 PS Warriors, 2 Druids or 2 Mesmers to Buff everyone in the Group. And well this would shake up the Meta quite hard. Question is, would the Result be a good and healthy Meta or boring and stale Meta.

thewaterguy.4796:

Rising Dusk.2408:

thewaterguy.4796:

Please give me one objective proven reason as to why I am wrong, […]

It would (at least) double the development and maintenance time of raids, and inhibit their ability to deliver new raids and raid wings in a schedule that meets their current intent. In other words, there’s no way they can support another raid mode without reducing the amount of content they output in a year.

Also apologies in advance if I get a bit heated, this topic really bugs me because every time I try getting into raids all I get are elitist pricks giving me 30 reasons why I’m a casual noob and need to stop playing and uninstall and kill myself and blah blah blah

You sure that you played GW2 and not LOL when People gave you this? I haven’T even seen something like this in the Queensdale Champtrain in the Days of old, and this Champtrain was the most toxic Place ever in GW2. ( The Tower of Nightmare would have died from poisoning because of this toxicity )

Also balancing is not an easy Task. You brought up Fractals but Anet showed us that it isn’t easy to scale Things even in 5 Man Content without breaking Stuff or screwing Group Balance. Balancing manually would require quite a lot of Work. It is very easy to overdo it and then making Stuff so easy that Vanilla Open World laughs at it. There is a Line between making the Easy Mode too Punishing and so easy that everything is just Faceroll and you need to work out the Balance before Releasing it. If there is an Easy Mode it should give People an expression on what to expect of the Raid itself and train them on the Mechanics.

Also what about Rewards? No Rewards and this Easy Mode will be dead quickly. Too much and then you could just run Easy Mode and gain mostly the same Rewards, this is where PuGs would then go to.

gin.7158:

tbh Anet should revert the patch, and delete wvw instead /s

I know how you feel. Its frustrating but since Players are still playing WvW deleting it wouldn’t be good.
Anet should split more Skills and perhaps bump the Buff Cap up to 10 People. Perhaps there will be a Supercomp then but I would prefer a Supercomp with Place for 8 – 9 Classes over a Supercomp with Place for like 4-5 Classes. ( Perhaps 10 Man Buff Cap wouldn’t make up Place for more Builds or Classes but it should be tested )

gin.7158:

Super comp is real now. So Anet, could you revisit the idea of spreading buff into 10 people in raid please?

Funny Thing. Anet did not choose to Buff Cap of 10 in Raids because they feared this would lead into a Supercomp.

NovaanVerdiano.6174:

Walhalla.5473:

NovaanVerdiano.6174:

Walhalla.5473:

Ok tested the Condi Necro a bit. DPS on target Golem got cut to around 17- 18k ( can be queezed to 1 or 2k more by better Players than me ).
On smaller Fights Lich Form is more DPS than Fleshgolem but on longer Fights the Fleshgolem is quite a bit better on DPS as far as I see it in the Tests. ( difference is very low tbh ). Bit more testing needed but I think that Condi Necro is rip now ( Epi can make it useful perhaps but other than that, the dying Minions are too much of a DPS-loss. )

The change hit less hard for fractals than it did for raids due to the fights usually being shorter in the former, yes.
I personally don’t think necro is a good pick outside of matthias when it comes to raidbosses now, if you need condis engi and base ranger will probably be better, epi bounce strats didn’t really directly affected by this so in the end they’re still as valid on their own as they were before, the question being if it’s valid enough to take necros over something else for whatever may be needed.

Funny Thing is. Necros were alright in Raids but Fractal Players demanded a Nerf because of Epidemic. Now Necro got nerfed but it was on the Minions and not on Epi. A Nerf to Epi would have hit Necros harder in Fractals than in Raids because on many Raid-fights Necros can crap out Minions and they get good DPS because of it.

So People demanded a Fractal Nerf for Necro. They got a Raid Necro Nerf and Necros in Fractals are not really hit that hard. GG

People who demand an epi nerf are probably not even sure as to WHY they demand it. It transfers a maximum of 25 of each condition with each cast, you still have some ramp up time for the condis in the first place (even more so now since you can’t move minions between fights as they’re most likely dead by that point for whenever it matters) and trash in fractals dies fast anyway, so it didn’t make much difference. Not all bosses have adds or at least not constantly either. Then there’s the bit of coordination required which plenty of pugs didn’t have either, though that’s not something that should be taken into account in this case imo.
Moving away from our DPS being reliant in any way/amount on AI which was kept alive by other player(s) is a good thing, the problem is they didn’t make up for it in any way. 20s cd for BiP in PvE probably would’ve been over the top as that’d lead to 13s~ cd when traited, but we should’ve gotten at least something. I’m aware they need to make sure it’s not completely over the top in WvW/PvP, but yeah…

Thing is, Anet can Split Skills between all 3 Gamemodes. So they could have buffed the Condi Weapons and Shroud 4 for example in PvE only. Or they could have buffed Power Necro enough to make up for the Nerf but they buffed Axe ( not enough ) and the Aftercast Buffs on GS are a Joke.

Xstein.2187:

Aaaand to top it all off, Viper Ele now pretty much kicks every other condi class in the kitten , at least for non moving targets. This just even more enforces eles to take the last 4 spots, 40% of the raid group.

The thing with Ele is a Bug and I hope that its gonna be fixed. I was in an Experimental run with 6 Eles, 2 Warris, 2 Druids and we Phased Sabetha faster than normal.
And this Group was inexperienced on Eles and the Eles were not optimized.

Now imagine this with an Optimized Exp Ele Group.

Anet, Fix pls.

NovaanVerdiano.6174:

Walhalla.5473:

Ok tested the Condi Necro a bit. DPS on target Golem got cut to around 17- 18k ( can be queezed to 1 or 2k more by better Players than me ).
On smaller Fights Lich Form is more DPS than Fleshgolem but on longer Fights the Fleshgolem is quite a bit better on DPS as far as I see it in the Tests. ( difference is very low tbh ). Bit more testing needed but I think that Condi Necro is rip now ( Epi can make it useful perhaps but other than that, the dying Minions are too much of a DPS-loss. )

The change hit less hard for fractals than it did for raids due to the fights usually being shorter in the former, yes.
I personally don’t think necro is a good pick outside of matthias when it comes to raidbosses now, if you need condis engi and base ranger will probably be better, epi bounce strats didn’t really directly affected by this so in the end they’re still as valid on their own as they were before, the question being if it’s valid enough to take necros over something else for whatever may be needed.

Funny Thing is. Necros were alright in Raids but Fractal Players demanded a Nerf because of Epidemic. Now Necro got nerfed but it was on the Minions and not on Epi. A Nerf to Epi would have hit Necros harder in Fractals than in Raids because on many Raid-fights Necros can crap out Minions and they get good DPS because of it.

So People demanded a Fractal Nerf for Necro. They got a Raid Necro Nerf and Necros in Fractals are not really hit that hard. GG

Ok tested the Condi Necro a bit. DPS on target Golem got cut to around 17- 18k ( can be queezed to 1 or 2k more by better Players than me ).
On smaller Fights Lich Form is more DPS than Fleshgolem but on longer Fights the Fleshgolem is quite a bit better on DPS as far as I see it in the Tests. ( difference is very low tbh ). Bit more testing needed but I think that Condi Necro is rip now ( Epi can make it useful perhaps but other than that, the dying Minions are too much of a DPS-loss. )

The Buffs aren’t enough to compensate for the Jagged Horror Nerf. The Horrors were a good Source of Condition Damage and now they die after 30 Seconds, even worse, this also hits the Death Nova Horrors, nerfing a Trait with this.

The Buffs on Axe are meh. Axe wasn’t a good Weapon in PvE and it needs bigger Buffs to be viable.
The GS Buffs. First the Aftercast reduction is….. clos to nothing. 0.11 Seconds is something you may notice but 0.06 is literally nothing.
Death Spirals Damage was kitten back then and even after the 66% Buff its not that good to make Power Necros viable.

cranos.5913:

thrag.9740:

Can we please just have all buffs and boons applied to 10 players in pve? Like banners effect 10, grace of the land given to 10 players, quickness shared with 10 players, etc.

Right now, groups are going to start at 2 war, 2 druid, 2 mes, and that leaves 4 spots that are somewhat free to play with (exactly the same as previous 4-4-2 comp). If all skills just effected the whole party, we would only need 1 war 1 mes and 1 druid to cover the big offensive group buffs.

When we all proposed this idea pre-HOT Anet said they didn’t want to create a single super group necessary for raids, but look at how restrictive things are now.

I doubt they’ll do this any time soon. Our dps would be way higher so all the previous content would have to be readjusted to fit this supercomp. Not saying they shouldn’t do it btw, just that it’s highly unrealistic at this point.

Funny Thing is that we’ll see a smaller Version of a Supercomp. Now 8 Places will be set and the last 2 can be either Condi Ranger or Condi Engi if there is Condi Damage needed ( I would go for Condi Ranger, easier and more Damage )

Mea.5491:

As a Power Necro who uses GS and Axe, I am actually happy.

Well GS Buff is like a 200 DPS Increase.