“Needing to put in a few hours to complete the track is not in any way unfair. Players who attempt to complete the track, will. The vagaries of WvW matches will have little to no impact.”
So it’s ok that WvW players can buy tons of waypoints, even all of them, towards the PvE Gift of Exploration, using what they earned in WvW, but totally wrong that PvE players earn something in PvE and use it towards the WvW Gift of Battle?
Couldn’t disagree more.
Once you destroy a Legendary weapon by ruining it’s effects, you show the ability to ruin any and all of them. This tells everyone that going to the efforts of making any Legendary weapon can rapidly become a huge waste of time. Any weapon, any generation, plain and simple. Buy a precursor so you get the one you want? Nope, you’ll never really know what it will become.
Put the Predator on the shelf because Rifle has become a laughing stock, now Bolt.
I like Rifle, which is why I started this post, I do enjoy the killshot and volley, but the 1,2,4 and 5 all just deal VERY low damage ( as I said earlier, Longbow Auto attack does more damage than rifle auto attack, and even MORE if you take the burning dual shot trait), and with deadeyes getting a 1500 rifle with 3k damage crits on unmarked enemies, compared to rifles 1.5 to 2k crits at 1200, it just feels like “the weapon master” isn’t a master.
I’m glad you like rifle. I do to after looting the hunter a few years ago. Thing is, there are a lot of good conflicting comments in this thread but the plain and simple fact is in PvE you simply won’t see hardly anyone using rifle anymore. The condi is just so much more powerful than power, that nearly everyone uses longbow now.
I don’t see any reason from the patch notes or from playing, or from what I see around me in PvE to continue with rifle. It’s just not comparable. I hate packing away a legendary weapon but it’s become trash in comparison to longbow.
Yes, this was a fun event that was heavily attended, because it was a lot of fun.
Like someone said, the Marionette is still laying in the snow so why couldn’t the Dragons magic bring it back to life? It could make a fun story segment but then I’d like to see it left in as a world boss. There enough world boss repeats to include the Marionette into the sequence.
Not everyone likes doing the world bosses but for those that do, this would be really nice.
I have played since day 5 and I have never played as the Devs intended. Why would I do that? I play for my interests and not someone else’s reasons. Doing that would make me nothing more than a simple automaton, a slave to whatever whim a dev may want to try, only to change in 2 weeks.
The game is huge and has more than enough to interest a broad range of players, including those that NEVER leave the game mode they enjoy! Once we BUY the game, we can play it however we want, whether it makes sense to you or anyone else.
Ever heard of role playing?
Asking that question of why we don’t play like they want dispays a total lack of understanding of the simple concept that we are all different and as such we enjoy different things. Fortunately the Devs understand this.
I understand the frustration, but I also understand why they made it exclusive to WvW and have repeatedly updated how it’s obtained to ensure that you have to play WvW to get it.
I recently got one through the reward track after not playing WvW for years, and never playing much before that. I honestly didn’t find it that bad and got the whole thing done in approximately 6 hours. WvW is not a mode I especially enjoy and it can be very inconvenient for me because ideally you need to be able to commit to being there for a few hours at a time, and at peak times, but completing 1 reward track is certainly do-able.
If anyone’s interested here’s a guide I wrote which is aimed at people who have never played WvW before but want the Gift of Battle: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/Gift-of-Battle-Catmander-for-WvW-newbies/first#post6703914
That looks like a great guide as it is. Your first paragraph here though is not entirely accurate. There are methods of obtaining the GOB without actually playing WvW, created by Anet, and they have been posted on this forum. They are time consuming, and take months, but then so is the collection of all the other components required to make a legendary weapon.
Please go back to page 4 and look at lozeph.5617’s post. If you ever read a wall of text post, read this one. It is the most accurate description of this games first year I have ever seen.
Many of us have stayed because the game play and potential shown in the first year hooked us. This was truly an amazing stand alone game in an industry full of Wow clone wanna be’s. Since then however, each successive year I have felt the hooks withdrawing as it more and more closely conforms to WoW’s methods.
This casual, should reach my long term goal of 5 legendary weapons sometime next month and that will likely do it for me. I’ve spend about 130 mastery points in HoT and feel I have given it a fair try. I just don’t find it fun. I really hope the game can continue for all those who can enjoy riding around on Disney characters. Just be aware though, PoF will totally block progress for those who don’t buy it. That will definitely have an impact on the PvE players who didn’t buy it and those who didn’t buy Hot as well. Add trolls with mounts in Core Tyria PvE to that and I believe a major correction is coming. For the game’s sake I hope I’m wrong.
I’m glad this thread has developed the way it has. It shows the vast difference in what players want and expect in a game. I’m also glad that many players are happy with the ever increased challenge offered in the expacks and some patches.
At the same time, it is important to realize here though that many players do not. This is likely to come to a head and potentially soon. PoF will likely show many that the game they want to play is gone and not likely to return.
What is most important here is how many will leave. We don’t get metric data but its safe to assume that there are 6 or 7 million GW2 accounts. Correct me if I’m wrong but don’t most of those players play mostly PvE? So, If that is the case, the number of players coming to that realization that the game they want is changing/has changed to something they don’t want, and will they continue to play and help fund the game? And more specifically, how many would it take to make the game unsustainable without a monthly fee?
So, while I would never do it, go ahead and tell players “this game is not for you”, “go play something else”, “you are wrong and your opinion doesn’t matter” but remember, the share holders rule and they could decide tomorrow to change it back if they think it changes the money favorably.
(edited by Tumult.2578)
One thing we will no longer be missing is the hatred, spite and vitrol that thrives in PvP and WvW when those players bring their mounts into core Tyria and start affecting PvE players.
When that starts and the first player gets stomped or teabagged, players wont just leave, whole guilds will.
They better figure this out fast. The question isn’t if mounts are better, it’s if the game can survive them.
Yes the Mounts thread is huge. Mostly because the same players kept starting new threads when their requests were met with strong disagreement from so many that gave good reason why they did not want them, and all that got merged. The net result was some wanted them for fun and others thought they would ruin the game. Looks like we will find out.
What could they have done with their time and efforts if they had not done mounts?
How many good suggestions that would work have been made on these forums since HoT that will now not happen because the time and effort went to mounts?
The mount thread IS one of the largest and contains many more accurately put comments against mounts than the “I want mounts because…… they would be cool”. (but I don’t really have any reason why except they might have been cool in a totally different game).
Yes, I played on day one and have owned and played this game since day 5 and I want it to be it’s best for everyone but others are right. This is not so much an expansion, it is so radically different it will seem like a different game for many. Maybe it will bring players, maybe they will stay, maybe they will spend money, maybe they will even make suggestions to help the game. But they already had that before mounts. This will make the difference between who has the expansion and who doesn’t bigger and bigger over time. Will it make new people more likely to buy the game, buy HoT, buy PoF, or simply easier to just play free and be content with that? Core Tyria’s beauty and simple fun is more than enough for many all by itself, especially with life’s time commitments.
And, it’s not the only game I play, but it has been the only game I spend money on and it’s only my opinion that might change that. Mounts are a big push to do so.
Try playing with an account that has HoT and one that doesn’t. I love getting experience on my non HoT account. I love seeing significantly easier dailys on my non HoT account so I can get to what I want to do quicker. It’s not always about what an expansion brings. It’s also about what it takes away.
I may need someone to help my aging memory here.
For those complaining that the new PoF expansion does not have new raids and such….didn’t most of the current raid content come AFTER the HoT expansion? During the Living World updates? But in order to get that new FREE content, you needed to first have the HoT expansion.
I saw nothing in the expansion announcement that suggested that there would NOT be new raids, etc, coming to us in the future. I could easily see extra/new FREE stuff added on later, but one will need to have the PoF expansion.
I think this is a point that a lot of die-hard doomsayers are missing. ArenaNet have now demonstrated that they can deliver live LW, PvP, WvW, Fractal AND Raid updates at decent intervals between expansions. I can understand why trust might still be at a low after HoT, and those with concerns should of course wait until the expansion has been out for a couple of weeks before making a decision, but I think the promise of content for all game types going forward can be reasonably assured.
I don’t see that as a logical expectation at all. By adding things like mounts that so many people clearly said they would hate and likely stop playing over, they lose a lot of players. More importantly, those that stay will not buy the expansion. Without it, all that future content will be unavailable. The story will become nonsense and likely unplayable without the new masterys and any new skills or abilities. That’s when the rest leave.
It’s so sad when you can see them preparing to do an expansion. “Ok, who has ideas?”
Nope, no money there. Nope, No money there. Yes! we can resell all those different pixels we sold for players in the gem shop, now as pixels for mounts. And then they build the expansion, the maps, the skills, the whole thing around those sales.
If I don’t want mounts, do you really think I will buy horse crap for a horse I don’t want?
I don’t see any logic in claiming that showing they can add content in a reasonable amount of time bears any merit, when they showed that in year one already and this expansion has not proven anything yet except that it will block future progress and likely block the future story, if it’s not purchased.
So, no, I will be saving my money because it looks like I will need it elsewhere soon.
Ok, bring on the “go play another game” because my opinion doesn’t count, only yours does.
The game has changed A LOT!
Why not play your current character and learn most of those changes first.
Then you could take a more educated approach to using that level 80 boost.
There is a new character type that you might decide you want at level 80 as your main
character with that new knowledge. Even the old character types have very many changed skills and abilities that could also interest you as a main,
The level 80 boost is a very nice thing to have. Tempting as it is to use though, I hope you wait and use it when your sure you did the right thing.
Big win? Yeah i’d like to see them get it too, but, I’ve already lost all interest in the expansion based on what’s been leaked.
I was referring to the bomb to break bar achievement that is fairly simple if you have gliding and a lot more time consuming and risky if you have to stand at kitten’s foot to break the bar.
Are you using the LFG tool to join World Boss groups and joining group members on other maps till you get one likely to succeed?
Is there another event in core Tyria that has an achievement which requires gliding to do very easily, or very hard and time consuming without gliding?
Shatterer is one of the main events for “free to play” players so it’s an ideal place to add “motivation” to buy HoT.
Is that a good method though, if it’s making players wait to jump in only at the very end?
We won’t need waypoints as much when we have MOUNTS!! in the new expansion!
And we won’t need them if we refuse to buy the expansion because it has mounts.
Having to buy waypoints would just be added cost.
Using map currency to buy shrines that act like waypoints without future travel costs,
makes sense, if the map rewards are interesting enough to go back for repeatedly or it’s a fun map.
IF, you are going back to this seasons previous story maps repeatedly then a change to buying shrines makes sense to me.
While there are a few good changes, I prefer the old shop.
I did check it all out.
I don’t look at the shop every day, but I do use it.
Will this make me want to look more often? No.
Will this make me want to use the shop more? No.
It seems like more of a hard sell. That turns me away.
Yeah. I’ve never seen people use whether there are mounts in a game as a decision points as to whether to play it or not. It’s not likely players are going to magically decide to play the game just because mounts were added.
Yeah, I’ll probably continue to play but there is no way I’ll spend a cent on an expansion that has any mounts in it. Period.
None of the posters here even see a problem with coming upon a player that has obviously taken a champ down to the last hit before death by themselves, and they would take that one shot before that player if they can, every time and then go “oh, were you trying to kill that?”
I don’t have a problem with it, because no one owns a champ. If you want to really practice, solo a dungeon. That will give you real practice. and no one can interfere.
I don’t either. That was not a complaint. I was simply trying to see if anyone else sees the difference between cooperative PvE and forced or required cooperative PvE. I’m not saying forced cooperative PvE is bad at all, just that it could be interesting to play in a game environment that required someone to group up before joining in a fight, or getting some form of acceptance before a reward can be earned, or even some system that awarded loot fairly but based on damage done or time spent or heals done or any number of entitling actions.
Clearly not the way the thread went, once more info was added.
None of the posters here even see a problem with coming upon a player that has obviously taken a champ down to the last hit before death by themselves, and they would take that one shot before that player if they can, every time and then go “oh, were you trying to kill that?”
I’m all for mounts in WvW. Please keep them out of PvE.
Not trying to scare anyone. That’s pointless.
I am saying I will not purchase an expansion that includes mounts.
To think I am the only one like that is also pointless.
If you can post here how excited you are, I can post how thoroughly disgusted I am, without trying to personally attack you like you feel the need to.
……
I will uninstall the first time I see a mount, but not because you told everyone to leave.
That will tell me the game is about to die.So you are saying you are playing the game right now because you like the way you traverse the game world so much?
Clearly.
This thread show specifically why they are unneeded and a total waste of time and money.
I am glad this thread was started though. Now I know I won’t be pre-ordering, or ordering a misdirected expansion.
if they’re only added to certain maps, I could live with that (and avoid those maps like the plague), however, if they were added to the core maps at a later date, like gliding was, I would leave and never look back.
why this big extra juicy mega thick closing to new features ?
i’m sure if oakheart was leaked before release you’ll be the first one of them all complaining about it before even waiting properly to give it a shot by yourself.
like i said before , please go back to gw1, no mounts, no dodges, no special stuff to move around the map, just a static boring character with plenty of skills to cast, and waves and waves of ennemies that you need to take one by one.
Definition of fun ain’t it !
It’s not a new feature. It’s an unbearably old topic that has been discussed to death, not popular, and not accepted.
It’s also pretty clear who has a problem with the current game. When you are telling others to leave, it might be time to look in the mirror.
you’re misinterpreting my words.
the game is wonderful as it is, the richiest part of it is the well crafted gameplay, of each and every class, some will appear slower or faster then the others,but they all have their roles. now when it comes to movement,as we’re in an rpg it should be more interesting and lore rewarding to have mounts to carry us through maps, we didn’t say WvW, neither instances nor cities, we said they should be implemented in the wilderness.
for now we’ve skills and traits in each and every class to compensate the lack of speed, but honestly, if we take 1 thief and a ‘staff gardian/engineer with swiftness combinations/staff ele with signets & teleports’ and make them travel straight ahead from the top of a map to the bottom, the thief will beat them 100% fingers in the nose.
it’d be fair for all the classes to get an equal speedlimit , so they can save their skills/traits for actual damage/support/tanky aspects, and save the speed boosts ones for instances, like pvp or WvW or raids … etc.
I did not misinterpret your words.
It’s your way, or get out.
I will uninstall the first time I see a mount, but not because you told everyone to leave.
That will tell me the game is about to die.
(edited by Tumult.2578)
Money talks guys and gals.
If Anet is making outfits it’s because we are buying them.
Direct your purchases to influence future content.
if they’re only added to certain maps, I could live with that (and avoid those maps like the plague), however, if they were added to the core maps at a later date, like gliding was, I would leave and never look back.
why this big extra juicy mega thick closing to new features ?
i’m sure if oakheart was leaked before release you’ll be the first one of them all complaining about it before even waiting properly to give it a shot by yourself.
like i said before , please go back to gw1, no mounts, no dodges, no special stuff to move around the map, just a static boring character with plenty of skills to cast, and waves and waves of ennemies that you need to take one by one.
Definition of fun ain’t it !
It’s not a new feature. It’s an unbearably old topic that has been discussed to death, not popular, and not accepted.
It’s also pretty clear who has a problem with the current game. When you are telling others to leave, it might be time to look in the mirror.
I’d like to see the loot tables shaken up some but I think we are casually overlooking the fact that loot shouldn’t be exciting every time. Sometimes it just needs to increase our stock so we can craft something, or we need 4 rares for the mystic forge, or 50 or 250 to promote to the next level. The idea is that if we take part in some game event or activity we don’t usually get what we want, but we do get items we keep and oddly we don’t complain about them when we eventually use them.
I think a big part of this is lost to many players because the costs to promote items may just be too steep. It’s not difficult but those costs for the results can stop players quick and maybe from considering doing it ever.
So you can personally guarantee an influx of about 5 million players
to make up for masses that will leave.
Race does matter. They should start will compensating the races with penalties.
If you’ve ever done jumping puzzle with a Norn, you know they should get twice the rewards because they’ve earned it.You must be kidding, right? greed is all you’ve shown with that last part of your post.
Yes, that was a tongue in cheek post. Most of the JP’s are not more difficult due to Norn’s size but 3 or 4 of them are very difficult and I actually would support a modestly increased reward.
However I see no reason to be insulting. Some just are more difficult. Personally I hate JP’s. Just the though of doing them for money is absurd. Claiming greed though, is just a lazy response.
(edited by Tumult.2578)
All things said and done, this is a business. Anet must think that providing consistently more challenging content will make them more money, will make the game provide more money long term, or that those who enjoy that type of content spend more money. But, is it sustainable?
I don’t believe that is the case but they clearly do. If you played thru the first year of the living story, you saw them provide significant new content every two weeks. It was the most fun by far but they stopped and said it was just not sustainable. So they were spending more money generating content than they were taking in. They had all the original sales money to work with but they must have seen it wouldn’t last. Four years later and a change in leadership, and it looks like they will have to learn that lesson again. I believe those players looking for only the most challenging content will spend a bunch to prepare for it, but if it’s not sustained, they will move on to the next game real fast. Time will tell.
Race does matter. They should start will compensating the races with penalties.
If you’ve ever done jumping puzzle with a Norn, you know they should get twice the rewards because they’ve earned it.
Have you tried jumping off the east side of the tower climbed in the “Under new management” jumping puzzle on Southsun Cove?
Each time I hit the water, I find myself in a swimsuit till I run back up the steps to the south. Oh, there’s another chest there, with a protector.
Still, there is probably a safe area near the bottom of the steps.
If the cats are acting differently then when you obtained them, or it was not made clear what they would be doing in the home instance, then I would support the expense of adding an option to change that behavior.
If their behavior was fully explained from the start, then no.
Actions have consequences.
Perhaps an option we could set that automatically salvages loot at the setting we choose would work. Something based on the level of item looted, instead of rare, masterwork,…
We would risk loosing things like low level exotics this way if set too high.
Probably much easier to do than change the loot tables for everything.
Don’t Bosses and numerous mobs use interrupts to mitigate damage from Volley and Gun Flame in PvE also? Why the need for two versions of Aimed Shot?
I love the look and feel of the core Tyria maps and feel a few have room for additions and improvements not likely to happen at this point. Specifically, I like Cursed Shore and Diessa Plateau for their increased event activity, as well as Wayfarer Foothills.
After awhile the Hot maps became more enjoyable once I could recognize and use the different forms of travel possible, NOT before though, and still not a favorite there.
My least favorite maps are the two that were changed, Lions Arch and Kessex Hills.
The right combination of fun, activity, mobility, beauty, challenge and reward is hard to attain but totally worth the effort.
It’s pretty unrealistic to expect that Forcing players into game modes they have surely already tried and not enjoyed, would be popular with PvE players in general.
Reward tracks may work in WvW because it’s been basically unrewarding but the players in PvE are used to being rewarded when they accomplish something. Those rewards, combined, should give the Legendary, as they do now. You simply need a broader increase in loot in WvW to be able to create a legendary weapon in that game mode. Then the whole idea would not seem so grindy. This way, many in WvW would already have those Legendary weapons.
Gotta say, this is about as big as an expansion for me. I seriously doubted the possibility of moving some of those items and expected a much smaller list. It looks like you had already cleared the issue of the effect on potential gem shop sales of storage items before even opening the topic. Very wise. THANK YOU!
Can we assume that number 10 on your list might generate additional storage changes?
Clearly, some of us always want more…..
Like the OP, I take the time to make sure I need something, or really want something, in the store before making the purchase. Many times the items go off sale before I try to buy.
To me, this is Anets loss. I know those items will come back eventually but that leaves Anet with nothing till the items resurface and the value of gems is likely to increase. Cosmetics, which most shop items are, don’t affect game play so It’s not like I need to buy right away.
I simply don’t see a better solution to the issue at the time.
Yes, power creep is a secondary matter being discussed but the thread is about reward for higher level content. That is what I responded to. Stat progression has nothing to do with my post. I am not equaling reward with stat progression at all.
Whether the reward has better or worse stats, and those effects on the game in general is not significant to the discussion on the value of the reward itself. It is a valuable discussion on it’s own, but not pertinent to the actual reward Anet decided to give.
I suspect we would agree on stat progression but that is simply not the issue, or value in Legendary Armor. Exclusivity is, whether it’s recognized or not.
Let me give you some perspective.
I believe raiders have been extremely lucky that Anet needs to relearn that ever increasing difficulty, and reward, is unsustainable. They learned it once from the first year personal story but game control changed hands.Here’s what you would have gotten in the past. The rewards for raiding would be simply standing on a leader board. That leader board would have levels. Each level gives you better standing and additional permanent AGONY in everything you do. That would be the only reward.
Accept that challenge and show how good you really are.
Not saying you bought your way to play difficult content instead of earning it but it seems like it. That makes you miss 90% of the fun of the game.
Raiding gear is in no way better than gear from any other part of the game. Not sure what you are refering to. Unless you consider legendary armor an upgrasde to ascended, which from a pure stat perspective it is not.
Leaderboards were out the window the moment arenanet noticed how little interest people have in them with adventures.
I didn’t use gear anywhere in my post. Not sure what you are referring to here.
You make it sound like all the raiders have deleted their Legendary armors. Lol.
It’s the reward, clearly established so you know what you are playing for. It is unavailable anywhere else in the game. That makes it a significant reward whether you choose to recognize that value or not. Delete it if it is so inconsequential for you. I would.
As far as leaderboards go, you do understand that there are current leaderboards for structured PvP, WvW Ranking and Acheivements right? I’m not surprised that Anet would drop any extra effort it can, regarding raiding, given the chance. My post talked about what you could have gotten for rewards. Rewards could have been, and in my opinion, should have been, ranking on a leaderboard and the additional Agony you earned with it.
Taking a look at the forums tells me there are a lot of solo players, or as solo as can be possible. I suspect they want to do it solo. I’m pretty sure most of them understand that help is available but they would rather achieve it themselves.
My main concern is what will happen with guild storage under the old system when the next expansion or a major update hits? It gets harder to add stuff and still make everything work and I suspect creating a “one type fits all” guild hall and storage approach would be, should be, on the horizon..
What do you mean by guild storage?
Those who had everything unlocked before the expansion were grandfathered in so they had those storage upgrades unlocked once the expansion hit. I don’t see Anet resetting this with each expansion. What we could see them doing is adding more storage slots but that would just come down to more materials and guild currencies.
Yes, but it’s an old system and they are already having issues with getting new ideas to work in the old system. It just makes sense to me that they would want to simplify it all and they could by just making the obtaining a guild hall more realistically soloable.
Then they could drop all of that old storage system and make some of the changes guilds have been asking for without the added difficulty. I hope your right and it won’t be an issue at all.
I think my mini should reflect what some of my character displays.
Having a character that kills with lightning and wears the purple and gold lightning colors and uses the electromagnetic glider makes me surprised that there are no purple mini’s….
That would likely be my favorite.
Taking a look at the forums tells me there are a lot of solo players, or as solo as can be possible. I suspect they want to do it solo. I’m pretty sure most of them understand that help is available but they would rather achieve it themselves.
My main concern is what will happen with guild storage under the old system when the next expansion or a major update hits? It gets harder to add stuff and still make everything work and I suspect creating a “one type fits all” guild hall and storage approach would be, should be, on the horizon..
I agree that there should not be scaling of guild challenges.
I suspect most small guilds would be fine with this.
Most players that have seen the old system just want to be able to drop a banner here or there to help out. They are prevented from that by the system.
I don’t see a problem with making a hall attainable by a small guild, even one or two player guilds. We have the ability to be in 4 other big guilds at the same time.
How would that be different than players now gaining a hall and selling it to other players?
(edited by Tumult.2578)
I don’t see how guild versus guild wars are a big thing in the game, even in WvW and don’t see any movement to make it important so what is the point of restricting the ability to get a guild hall? Individual players would dump resources into an individual or small guild just like the big guilds. There is no requirement that only actual guild members get you past the restriction. Where is the value in showing us we can’t do everything by ourselves, when it’s already obvious?
Where is the sense in this restriction?
What is your goal?
If it’s to collect resources, don’t you get those from killing those mobs and salvaging the rewards? It sounds like a great setup to me.
Let me give you some perspective.
I believe raiders have been extremely lucky that Anet needs to relearn that ever increasing difficulty, and reward, is unsustainable. They learned it once from the first year personal story but game control changed hands.
Here’s what you would have gotten in the past. The rewards for raiding would be simply standing on a leader board. That leader board would have levels. Each level gives you better standing and additional permanent AGONY in everything you do. That would be the only reward.
Accept that challenge and show how good you really are.
Not saying you bought your way to play difficult content instead of earning it but it seems like it. That makes you miss 90% of the fun of the game.