Guild Wars 2

Chaith.8256:

coglin.1867:

Simon.3794:

coglin.1867:

I have to agree, intelligent people are aware that elementalist are not the problem. It is only the truly salty, unknowledgeable, short sighted, and poorly skilled, who claim the profession as problematic.

This is really funny, because theres literally a thread about how dd should be nerfed which is posted by one of the best elementalists.

i guess he is just unknowledgeable, short sighted and poorly skilled then.

No, he posted on changed that would not hurt the profession as whole, but, that would tone down the specific D/D builds he feels are problematic. At no point does he suggest the profession as a whole is problematic.

zapv.8051:

It is pretty evident d/d ele needs some nerfs.

D/D as a whole is not the problem. The fact that you would imply that, is the problem.

D/D x/x/x/6/6 with celestial, are what I feel is the problem. More specifically, it is a cantrip build.

Coglin, you praise Phantarams’ changes because they don’t hurt the Ele profession ‘as a whole.’ I mostly agree.

However, in the same breath you chirp on someone for merely suggesting D/D Ele needs nerfs, when it’s clearly only Cele x/x/x/6/6 builds that do. You even go so far as to call the fact anyone would say that is a problem.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/Suggestions-to-shave-DD-ele-into-balance/first

I think you’re in the wrong here, because Phantaram’s suggestions clearly aren’t against nerfing D/D ‘as a whole’ as you would grill other people for suggesting.

Suggesting a nerf/fix to Drake’s Breath, Lightning Whip, affect “D/D as a whole”, not just x/x/x/6/6. They’re D/D weapon skills for crying out loud. Suggesting a nerf to Renewing Stamina hits pretty much every Ele build as well.

The best ways to shave D/D Ele aren’t always going to neatly fall outside of every single other non-overpowered D/D build. Phanta’s suggestions most reasonable people can all agree with, and yet they don’t just purely affect x/x/x/6/6 Cele Eles.

So this brings the question to my mind, of why simply nerf weapons skills on a profession with no weapon swap? That would scale every build with those weapons down, yet all it does it create restrictions to the weapon set as a whole, and does nothing to help the weapons set to use other trait lines or traits.

My point is, everyone seems to be fervent about what needs to be nerfed (sometimes without even knowing why), yet so few offer equivalent suggestions to open value to other trait lines, traits, or utilities.

Jelzouki.4128:

coglin.1867:

Jelzouki.4128:

coglin.1867:

Jelzouki.4128:

I never once attacked you, but you are quite the keyboard warrior.

Yes, yes you kind of did.

Jelzouki.4128:

Please provide factual information when you post to this forum, rather than flaming.

Folks tried to explain how open access, crowd source information works on these sights and you accuse them of being misinformed, when the fact of the matter is your misinformed, then you attack them by accusing them of flaming.

Poorly. Tried to explain very poorly and with smart comments and flamed me on my other thread.

Don’t get distracted and stay on topic please. Even if I am in a sort of an argument with another player, it is not your duty to defend him. It just causes more deviation from the thread. If this keeps happening I will have to report.

What portion of the explanations was “poor” to a level that you did not understand it?

If you are personally claiming that builds are so “meta”, how many hours have you personally spent on them?

If your so set that the site isn’t player based information, have you tried to sign up and add a build, just like everyone else can, to disprove it?

How are you accusing someone of being off topic, when they are simply addressing your direct comment or question?

I would hardly suggest that I am or am not defending another poster. I am simply making an effort to limit the misinformation that you are making a solid effort to push upon folks in this thread.

Dude, this is the last time I will convey this to people: go back and read my thread.

I said: “AS STATED BY METABATTLE.COM:”

christ, don’t put these words in your own context.

Yup, and folks are attempting to inform you that those builds, “AS STATED BY METABATTLE.COM:” are not even popular builds, must less “meta” builds, and absolutely not "competitive meta builds.

You can use the guise of suggesting you never thought they were “meta” builds or strong builds, only that you were going off some website, all you like. The fact is, you made the original post, and made a conscience effort to imply other professions have multiple builds, and necros do not. Necros have plenty of builds, I know, I use them. There are also some builds that are very singular in thier purpose, just like most of the builds you listed in the OP. Anyone can list as many necros builds as you listed for other profession. A fair bit of those builds will probably be as limiting or weak as many of the builds you listed in the OP.

If your going to list weak or in some cases, bad builds. Then use them to claim other professions have more diversity. As well as create a thread on it for open discussion. Then you are opening it up for folks to explain to you that listing weak, or bad builds and claiming it as diversity is disingenuous.

Then your calling them things like “keyboard warriors” and accusing them of flaming for disagreeing with you.

I also notice you made a solid effort to avoid answering any of the specific questions tht you were asked. Particularly about explaining how much time you played the professions you are claiming have “more diversity”, and more specifically, how much time you spent in the builds you are claiming offered diversity.

Jelzouki.4128:

dancingmonkey.4902:

Jelzouki.4128:

Anchoku.8142:

This is a really, really… really old discussion that the balance team has weighed and found lacking because Necromancers being able to heal in DS would make them stupid OP. Not saying the heal/siphon scale cannot be tweaked but two years of “NO!” means no.

I wasn’t around two years ago so I can’t take your word for it.

Show me proof of them weighing in on this matter and I’ll drop the subject, but until then I won’t quit until I get some answers.

Then learn how to use dulfy, look through dev post here, or even learn to use Google.

“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.” – Harlan Ellison

Already did and couldn’t find it. Please keep your smart comments to yourself, as comments like those usually instigate flaming.

How cute. Others try to inform you of common knowledge, and you blow them off calling them unbelievable. Then when others, such as myself who could find it with google as well as it being on dulfy and the wiki, try to tell you where to find it, you attack them.

It is clear you do not want to know. You prefer to attack those who try to guide you to the information rather then to actually learn the facts………..I guess it is true what they say………about bliss and all that.

sinject.4607:

not a single one of these things can be interrupted, knowingly countered, or effectively prevented other than simply forcing them to be used and getting lucky with predicting them or something along the lines of that- and that isn’t necessarily a bad thing on it’s own, but when that applies to almost everything you do, it becomes a problem.

This is where I truly see a problematic pattern arising. You complain about how someone paraphrases you, yet you state your opinion as if it were fact. It is a fact that I personally can, and have countered many a guardian.

I would love to see you post the specific build that you suggest is a problem

sinject.4607:

i’ll hold my tongue on their heal. it has little in the way of counterplay but some counterplay is at least infinitely more than none at all.

You mean as compare to an counterbalance heal such as the thief has? As you have repeatedly declared yourself a thief main, isn’t it extremely hypocritical to argue one is fine and another is problematic?

sinject.4607:

making Valor increase both toughness and ferocity while allowing for a high fury uptime and sustain was simply one of the single worst design decisions in this game period. it essentially allowed Valor to become as strong as thief’s Shadow Arts and warrior’s Discipline combined.

I suspect you would complain regardless of the stat combo that line offered. You offer a great deal of nonconstructive complains, and little to none when it come to constructive feed back. What stats do you suggest this line offers and why?

sinject.4607:

if i had to suggest a nerf, maybe make Focused Mind a GM trait while buffing it to make it worth using as a GM trait. that would force some choice to be made between offensive and defensive viability within the same traitline, while slightly nerfing meditations indirectly.

Hmm, I think you have now covered all of your bases. You have either created a thread, or hijacked a thread, that demanded a nerf for every single profession now, with the exception of thief.

You do realize when you are entirely negative (offering little to know positive feedback) that when the devs that this matter too read this, they may see the same patters I (and I assume others) see, and find it all to easy to dismiss your claims and demands.

sinject.4607:

he is paraphrasing me to make it appear that i am saying i have an issue with getting killed on zerker. my issue isn’t that. I can get dropped by backstab thieves, shatter mesmers, static discharge engineers, power rangers, evis warriors, etc all day and be perfectly fine with it as they are a fair fight in zerker v zerker; my issue (as it was clearly stated) is the complete effectiveness guardian has in general against anything else running a zerker amulet while using zerker itself.

Paraphrasing means someone is summing up what you said. Not saying you said something else. Now that we have cleared that up. I feel you are being dishonest or intentionally misleading. I have never had difficulty with what I assume is a “zerker” guardian. Nor, from what I have read of some of your frivolous complaints, do I believe you can beat most of the good builds i am familiar with in those professions, with decent players.

You are confusing bad players in mediocre builds (I assure you some of the builds you listed are mediocre, although you were not very specific) and projecting that into you beating them easily. by the way, you realize anyone can look at your specific win/loss record and ranking in PvP right? With what I read in a great deal of your recent post, combined with your poor win/lose ration, I have difficulty believing you, when you claim how you are consistently beating all of those professions.

sinject.4607:

meditation guard is largely devoid of counterplay to the point where it’s obnoxious. not a single one of their extremely powerful utilities including their elite has any counterplay whatsoever, they are all instant cast.

It sems fishy to me that I have sen you make similar complaints in other threads about guardians, from the perspective of one of the professions they are known to counter.

sinject.4607:

a complete condition clear that grants them a complete counter to any condition nuke while giving them boons ( a la lyssa runes pre-nerf) and also is a stun break, a teleport that inflicts burning and inflicts damage and is also a stun break as well, a single condition clear that aoe hits for 1k that’s on a 16 second cd, and a 2 second invulnerability; all of these things healing for 2k each and granting 4.5sec of fury. you also have sc/f’s chains of light, a 2 second immobilize and 3x vulnerability inflicting skill which suffers from a lack of counterplay as well. it has no practical cast time (only 0.5sec, near instant), it has no projectile to dodge, and it has no noticeable animation to tell you it’s coming; it genuinely has no counterplay.

This sounds suspiciously like a complaint i read in the thief forums not too long ago.

Jelzouki.4128:

dancingmonkey.4902:

Jelzouki.4128:

Where is the variety?

Necromancer has got to be the one class that has most un-used skills/traits. I find myself getting countered by most builds in the game. A condi necro is really only good at countering engis without condi removal and thieves. Power necro is a joke, its one of the all-or-nothing builds that are extremely difficult to sustain yourself. Every other class has a better source of sustain while rolling berserker. Lich form you say? Yeah blind/dodge/invul etc.

Anyways its not just necros, a lot of other classes have useless builds/traits.

What is the goal of arena net?
Are you trying to balance heavies with heavies, lights with lights, mediums with mediums? You’re doing a terrible job if that is the goal.

Let’s take a look at these three classes on metabattle: Engineer, Elementalist, Warrior.

Conquest Builds
Warrior – Axe/Longbow
Warrior – Axe/Wh Longbow
Warrior – Banner Bunker
Warrior – GS/Longbow
Warrior – Hambow
Warrior – Hybrid Sword Warrior
Warrior – Mace/Sword Lb Condition
Warrior – Shout Support

Conquest Builds
Engineer – Bomb/Grenade
Engineer – Celestial Rifle
Engineer – Decap
Engineer – Double Kit Condi
Engineer – HGH Hybrid
Engineer – Mobile Turrets
Engineer – Static Discharge
Engineer – Triple Kit Condi
Engineer – Turret

Elementalist – Celestial Staff
Elementalist – D/F 4 Signet Condi
Elementalist – Dagger/Dagger
Elementalist – Scepter/Dagger
Elementalist – Scepter/Focus
(not as many builds as the warrior and engi but they are still superior at everything)

As stated by metabattle.com “this build is in the current in-game meta”
Why is everyone else left in the dust?

The simple fact that you actually believe all of these builds are even remotely “meta” demonstrates your lack of knowledge.

Everyone else is left in the dust simply because players like you havn’t added the builds for other professions to the site. You do understand that it is players like you who put those builds their right?

Yes..and those builds are put through trials. You can’t just slap a build on there and call it meta. Evidently most of those builds come from when they are displayed in high tier play such as tournaments, and are discarded when the “in-game metas” outrun said build.

I never stated that they are all “GREAT” metas, as metabattle ranks the effectiveness of these builds.
Please provide factual information when you post to this forum, rather than flaming.

LMAO. you can’t just slap a build up there and call it “meta”……………………You absolutely can. Anyone can sign onto that site and put any build they want, call it anything they want. The same goes for the GW2 Wiki. Any random person can log onto the wiki and put false information on there. I know, I fix troll addition in my maintaining of aspects of the GW2 wiki…………….

You sem confused, I am not flaming, I am offering you facts. You are attacking me out of your own lack of knowledge on the matter.

Example: If you think an Engineer HgH build is meta, you should be ashamed of yourself

Turret build as meta? LMAO, it is an extremely sub par build. Because it is popular for casual play in solo q doesn’t define it is “meta”. A popular, yet totally uneffective build is by no means “meta” in my eyes.

You really think SD builds are meta?

These are just your misinformation on engineers, I have yet to go into other professions. Mind finding me a recent tournament in which anyone who won a match used a turret build, static discharge build, or HgH build please?

“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.” – Harlan Ellison

Jelzouki.4128:

Where is the variety?

Necromancer has got to be the one class that has most un-used skills/traits. I find myself getting countered by most builds in the game. A condi necro is really only good at countering engis without condi removal and thieves. Power necro is a joke, its one of the all-or-nothing builds that are extremely difficult to sustain yourself. Every other class has a better source of sustain while rolling berserker. Lich form you say? Yeah blind/dodge/invul etc.

Anyways its not just necros, a lot of other classes have useless builds/traits.

What is the goal of arena net?
Are you trying to balance heavies with heavies, lights with lights, mediums with mediums? You’re doing a terrible job if that is the goal.

Let’s take a look at these three classes on metabattle: Engineer, Elementalist, Warrior.

Conquest Builds
Warrior – Axe/Longbow
Warrior – Axe/Wh Longbow
Warrior – Banner Bunker
Warrior – GS/Longbow
Warrior – Hambow
Warrior – Hybrid Sword Warrior
Warrior – Mace/Sword Lb Condition
Warrior – Shout Support

Conquest Builds
Engineer – Bomb/Grenade
Engineer – Celestial Rifle
Engineer – Decap
Engineer – Double Kit Condi
Engineer – HGH Hybrid
Engineer – Mobile Turrets
Engineer – Static Discharge
Engineer – Triple Kit Condi
Engineer – Turret

Elementalist – Celestial Staff
Elementalist – D/F 4 Signet Condi
Elementalist – Dagger/Dagger
Elementalist – Scepter/Dagger
Elementalist – Scepter/Focus
(not as many builds as the warrior and engi but they are still superior at everything)

As stated by metabattle.com “this build is in the current in-game meta”
Why is everyone else left in the dust?

The simple fact that you actually believe all of these builds are even remotely “meta” demonstrates your lack of knowledge.

Everyone else is left in the dust simply because players like you havn’t added the builds for other professions to the site. You do understand that it is players like you who put those builds there on the site right?

sinject.4607:

coglin.1867:

sinject.4607:

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

Let me get this straight. You complaining that you can be killed easily in a full zerker build?

If your complaining that you die quickly while in a full zerker build, what difference does it make if it is a guardian or not?

you completely reworded my argument and created a strawman argument to attack. im not spending my time replying to you with anything serious.

I am a little curious here. How is someone asking you questions considered “rewording your argument”?

Are you suggesting that “as a guardian” you face roll anything with a zerker amulet? I am curious, but are you going to attack me for asking you a question as well?

What skill level of players are you competing against, and what profession are they? I assure you, those two points factor in. The particular build factors in too.

Based on my experience, I hardly believe you are face rolling skilled players.

Shanks.2907:

I don’t see why people think that because they have a level 80 of any given class it means that they understand the profession well. All it shows is that you’ve killed monsters and finished quests. Perhaps swapped at the end of dungeons, used tomes of knowledge or crafted to 80.

If you truly know a class, you would know how to counter it and wouldn’t be on the forums making OP topics.

To be fair, at least this time, he is making a some what informed opinion. Obviously you do not agree with it, but at least it is based on experience and not complete, uninformed assumption.

Not to mention why should it be restricted to rifles? Why are we discussing this in the context that shuts out P/S or P/P users, or want to use one of those combinations?

Damage % increase for rifle damage for each gadget and a condition duration or % of condition damage increased for pistol?

Interesting ideas here.

It is funny, how engineers where treated like the red headed step child profession. Now that the profession has enough valuable skills, the lesser skilled players have made the profession famous. Or should I say infamous. Reminds me of the first year when the weak cried fowl because bunker guardians were “unkillable”, or so the unskilled claimed anyway.

It is a shame, when a player is caught in the act of vocalizing demands to nerf a profession based on revenge. It makes you wonder how many discussions started that ended with tweaks or changes, based on spite, jealousy, and vengeance, instead of experience, honest desire for balance, and reason.

Cygnus.6903:

The logical conclusion here is that they are best used, or ‘intended’ if you will (nitpick incoming) for small scale WvW.

In my opinion.

Doubtful. I would suspect the scale of players in a fight was never drought into the design of these runes. I would think they were simply designed to be used to offer an additional benefit to condition builds.

I see no reason to try to claim they were created for roaming specifically, as you appear to be stating. Seems a bit fishy to me that a roamer projects something to have been designed to be used for or against roamers. You appear to make a vast amount of claims, and statements, with no actual facts or evidence to support it.

I just want to share a quote with you, that seems so relevant here.

“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.” – Harlan Ellison

Ezeriel.9574:

ok.. dancingmonkey…

who do you know that plays condition staff elementalist? do you know anyone? then it’s safe to say most people do not see it as viable.

Who do I know? Me. I have leveled every profession to 80. All of which I did with a condi build except guardian.

As well, anytime you presume to speak for others, and worse, most people, to me, it is a clear display that you do not have confidence in your own opinion or facts, and chose deception, and misrepresentation of others you do not have permission to speak for.

Ezeriel.9574:

if you google “ele staff condi build” you get tons of people saying exactly what I just said. It’s not viable, because you cannot hit anything.

“Tons of people” now equates to “most people”?

Ezeriel.9574:

https://www.google.com/search?q=ele+staff+condi+build&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

There are less people complaining about it here then I have in my guild alliance. Are you suggesting my guild alliance represents “most people”?

Ezeriel.9574:

And yes, that one skill makes the entire class build not viable. You can’t swap to scepter, if you are using a staff, so I don’t want to hear about how great your scepter build is, it isn’t relevant.

No, no it doesn’t (see what I did there. I stated my opinion as if it were fact, just like you)…………………..What would make it not viable if it actually were not viable, is that your choosing the sub par weapon IE. wrong weapon for a pure condition build.

Interesting how you prefer to exclude facts. So one of my condition builds is not relevant simply because you say so? Its cute that you actually believe that, but it doesn’t make it true.

Ezeriel.9574:

I am not being irrational and unreasonable comparing mark of blood and eruption.

Yes, yes you are. You can say your not all you like. The fact is, they have drastically different stacks, and drastically different durations. It is absolutely an apples to oranges comparison.

Ezeriel.9574:

Both skills are the main source of condition damage for staff builds. Both skills have the same cooldown. Anet decided that the classes, as they are, are balanced, and since I am not asking for an increase in damage, only a change the animation, comparing the skills is perfectly reasonable.

I can use this exact explanation to compare mesmers staff chaos armor. That doesn’t make it a reasonable comparison. I can use your same general explanation to compare it to any engineer weapon set or kit. The fact remains, you can claim what ever you like. It doesn’t make the skills even remotely congruent.

Ezeriel.9574:

You repeatedly called me a liar, and say that I am only working for my own personal interest, and then say that you like the skill as it is, because it suits your own self interests in spvp…

wow….

Please quote the “repeated” name calling in my post please…………or are you now doing what you claim I called you?

As well, please explain where I stated “i like it as it is”………….I believe you are being dishonest again here, by claiming I said word in which I did not. Nor did I suggest it served my interest in PvP. I simply reenforced what someone else posted on the matter.

Ezeriel.9574:

There would need to be a lot of tuning needed to be done. Some skills could have a 50% chance to apply bleeding or have their duration cut in half….

for warrior sword chain I like the thought of 1-swing vulnerability, 2-swing bleeding, 3-swing cripple…. but that’s just me.

the point is, the Devs talk about bleeding as if it is a gigantic burden on the servers, and yet tons of skills give out multiple stacks of bleeding, so why not take the time to re-work all of the skills that cause bleeding.

…and some of these minor traits that cause bleeding can just go away.

Seems to me the OP didn’t put much thought into it before posting.

I dunno why, but you appear to me to have a pattern of present half truths in your post. I have never seen the devs suggesting bleed is any more or less problematic for the servers. I only see you suggesting that. They have very clearly suggested it is all stacking conditions.

You keep making post, claims, and statements that counter what the devs have posted and explained. Perhaps it would be in everyone’s best interest, if you took the time to read a bit, and at least study the subject matter before trying trying to make claims about it.

Ezeriel.9574:

I love playing my ele as a condition class, but, as most people will agree, it’s just not viable.

Not only do I disagree, I would like to see your evidence that most people do not find it viable. Perhaps given some of your suggestions lately, you should stick to speaking for yourself and not dishonestly claim to speak for others, a portion of the community, or most players for that matter.

Ezeriel.9574:

But it could be, if we changed just one little thing… Eruption.

If you are claiming that one, single, individual, skill is the difference between a profession being viable for you, and it being not viable, as you claim, then I question either, whether viable means what you think it means, or how bad your playing that one, single, skill makes or breaks a professions viability for you. We need to specift for you because I play it well as a condition build, and I suspect so do a great many others. Why you fail at it because of one single skill is interesting.

Ezeriel.9574:

it is the main source of damage for a condition/staff user.

Then either learn to set up for it, or diversify your damage. Particularly if your going to complain about conditions on a weapon set that is not optimized for conditions. Especially considering there are very strong options for more condition damage is other weapons such as scepter.

Ezeriel.9574:

…but if it was instant damage, like Mark of Blood is for necromancers, the elementalist would have a perfectly viable condition build.

That is completely unreasonable. You want to compare an AoE with 2 stacks of bleeding for 8s to that of 6 stacks of bleeding for 12 seconds? You are unreasonably asking for equality between to ridiculously unequal skills. In this case, I feel your being irrationally unreasonable.

Ezeriel.9574:

And this would, in no way, increase the current dps of eruption. It would only make the skill easier to use.

This is dishonest. Either you are intentionally being dishonest for the sake of your own personal wants, or do not know enough about the skill and others, to be here demanding changes too it.

Ezeriel.9574:

I suggest making Geomancer’s Alacrity (Reduces recharge on all earth weapon skills.) reduce the animation of Eruption.

It always makes me smile a bit, when you see a single poster, disingenuously and dishonestly, claiming to speak for others in the community, to demand a change to a skill in order to boost the power of a single build they use.

Do you back other posters notions to change a skill simply for their individual builds?

emikochan.8504:

It’s pretty great to get people off the point though.

Exactly. WHich supports why I am against the OP demanding a change for his personal wants. Particularly after disingenuously claiming to represent others in the original post.

Tseikk.9032:

Perplex runes are actually pretty balanced at the moment imo.
What makes stuff unbalanced is the ********* +-40% condi duration food (which should not exist)

The food shouldn’t exist? Prove it? I see no justification for removing its existance or how it makes these runes OP in any way.

I do not agree with the OP in almost every aspect of his comment. If you see the last thread the OP made, you my not take this one so seriously. When posters make post with what you feel are bad ideas that are game breaking and counter productive, don’t post on it, let it fade away. The OPs last thread, was an extensive, why I quite the game and deleted it. Keep that In mind.

sinject.4607:

RyuDragnier.9476:

ITT: OP is QQing because he lost a match and rather than get better, he wants to nerf a class because he lost.

Must be an sPvP thread, because I see these sorts of complaints all the time due to sPvP.

literally nobody but the hordes of people hopping on the latest flavor of the month ranger train will tell you that ranger longbow is perfectly fine. that kind of damage from that range on that low of a cooldown isn’t healthy.

I think it is perfectly fine. I also see a great deal of post that state it is fine. I almost never play my ranger. I am simply basing my statement on my experience fighting them on my mesmer, ele, thief, and engineer.

Seems fairly disingenuous of you to presume you can speak for others and thier opinions. Perhaps you should stick to speaking for yourself.

sinject.4607:

In 1v1/2v2/etc scenarios it’s fine because you usually have all of your tools available to you, but in almost any other situation ranger can snipe kills without worrying about any serious retaliation.

So can a grenade engineer, and a thief. You are simply using extreme hyperbole as your examples. That works against your argument, not for it.

sinject.4607:

there is no other profession in the game that is able to invest entirely in offensive-only traitlines and walk away with a build that’s viable against human players.

You mean like the 6/6/0/0/2 zerker grenade engineer that is one of the professions most popular builds? It seems odd, as much as that is discussed as one of the highest AoE damage builds in the game, at 1500+ range, and you claim it doesn’t exist for the purpose of your claim.

The Game Slayer.7632:

You are ignoring the fact that the only classes that utilize fire fields are eles, engis and wars. You can’t view fire fields as something that all 8 professions use like runes or sigils. It’s quite the opposite.

That seems to be a bit disingenuous. My team mates commonly utilize my fire fields. You are incorrectly suggesting that having access to laying your own fire field equates to being the only one that can utilize it.

Since the early September update, the function of Rocket Boots has been broken. In my experience there are three manners it tends to function in a manner that is very literally counter productive to their function

In one, at around the half way point the players character does a 180 mid animation and ends up in the starting location, only facing the other direction.

In another, at around the half way point the players character does a 90 degree left turn mid animation, and ends up facing the left direction.

In another, at around the half way point the players character does a 90 degree right turn mid animation, and ends up facing the right direction.

It does hit the target. In my experience the occasions in which it tends not to is when the player moves out or range from the initiating point. That is what happens the majority of the time it happens to me. I mean, if it was such a problem, why are there not videos of it pasted all over the forums like there are for rocket boots in the bug thread for that skills problems? For that matter, why is there such a lack of foresight that this thread isn’t in the bug sub forums?

I disagree with almost everything the OP said. The only reasonable comments were those about minion AI. Most of the rest of what he stated actually struck me as the opposite of the truth of the matter.

No we do not need another new profession.

OP, if you do not play the game now, because you do not like any of the professions, why would you like a new one? The ones we have are varying and unique in their own ways.

Atherakhia.4086:

We have 8 classes. If only 4 are useful, why add a 9th instead of making the other 4 useful?

All of the professions are useful. If you cannot get solid use out of one, then your doing it wrong.

Would you mind breaking it down for use, showing how it is the strongest option. Would you mind doing it with both poison and non-poisons numbers?

killahmayne.9518:

Unless I don’t understand plain english, did you not claim that Healing Signet with Poison applied is as strong as many other profession heals with a 25s CD that do not have poison applied.

dancingmonkey.4902:

Why don’t you break it down for us then and compare that 4,740 heal every 20s to every other heal in the game with poison?

I agree, you may be struggling with plain English.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Healing Signet ticks for 362 every second, can be halved by poison since it has no controllable uptime, and has a low active heal. It does it’s job, but if anything it is too weak/has no better option.

You keep stating this misinformation. If your going to argue the mater, it would be helpful to know the actual facts. Poison does not halve and thing. It decreases the potency by 33%.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Much of the angst against HS seems to be stemming from some issue with the fact that warriors can facetank and still win.

I cannot speak for everyone else, but my problem with the signets effect have nothing to do face tanking, or whether or not you win or lose. It has to do with the fact that it is too strong of a passive, and no awareness to is required. Allowing for more offensive actions per second, that other professions do not have. It also offers a large boost to stances as utilities, because you passively heal while not taking he damage negated by those utilities. It allows more defensive actions by not needed to take an action to heal. As well it permits full focus on escaping, and requires no effort taken from that to heal either.

killahmayne.9518:

With poison, that would make the heal 237 HP/S, weaker than probably around 95% of healing skills.

Why don’t you break it down for us then and compare that 4,740 heal every 20s to every other heal in the game with poison? I challenge you to do the math and post it hear. That amount of heal with poison is 80% or better then most of the other professions heals without poison.

When the strength of constantly healing you is more then the other professions active heals, I hardly call the active effect of the signet, a weakness. Sometimes I really question if some of the die hard warriors are even awareof the other skills on other professions at times.

OP, your making A LOT of assumptions, and bad ones I might add, while offering no evidence to support your claim. You have already made 3 ranger is OP threads.

Your even making incorrect assumptions about the reasoning of an update. The community has had vast outcry this year about having more frequent balance updates. With some positions having changed personnel, it appear they are moving forward with the concept based on community feed back.

If you truly think it has anything to do with rangers, you truly have my sympathies.

Mikau.6920:

• On #4 – Shield of Judgment – make it apply 5 seconds of cripple on enemies as well. Also increase the Protection duration to 5 seconds on spvp;

Not sure that I agree that cripple is the way to go, but I am not against it, but it could use something of that nature. Anything defensive seems like a good idea.

Mikau.6920:

• On #5 – Shield of Absorption – allow to cast while moving (the bubble will follow the Guardian), also make it apply 5 seconds of Aegis if not detoned and increase the Healing scaling on sequence. In that way you’ll have the option to get a block or heal

I would agree with moving during/after cast, if the bubble was smaller. Seems a bit too strong to move it given its area of protection as it it. Perhaps have it natively reflect projectiles instead of absorbing them.

I am all for something such as healing on actions, perhaps even similar to ele’s healing signet. The fact that it heals, with poison applied, as strong as many professions heals with a 25s, that do not have poison applied, in a passive manner, is problematic.

Harper.4173:

You can’t compare skills across professions because you have to look at the broader context.

Actually, I can, and rightfully so. The fact that you have previously done so in this thread, yet shout down others for doing so, doesn’t yield much value to what your saying.

Harper.4173:

Other professions have the ability to greatly mitigate and avoid incoming damage which warriors are by design supposed to just eat.
Other professions also have other passive skills, mechanics and even heals that are just as passive as healing signet.

You mean such as stances? Dolyak signet doesn’t mitigate damage? You have no proof they are intended to eat damage, you are simply stating your opinion as fact. You chide other passive skills now? A bit of a double standard isn’kitten I know have spoken out against passive play on all of the profession (I have an 80 of each profession), including speaking out against IP, and I main an engineer.

Harper.4173:

Warriors aren’t “free” to use that time. The downside of the skills is that you can’t really use it to heal up after a burst you just received.

Yes, they are. It is actually a proven fact. Would you like me to break down the skills per minute usable and show you how using heal skills will cut down on other skills able to be used by other profession? Link me the build you would like compared and I will gladly do so.

Harper.4173:

Honestly – I don’t even understand why you people are still at it. In case you didn’t notice the warrior profession isn’t even a thing in sPVP or general PVP anymore.
It’s been nerfed so hard the context of this " OP " healing signet is a class who has had its main mechanic butchered.

I have noticed that personally, I see them regularly. I also see a great deal of players who have accounts I recognize, playing long bow rangers now too. That doesn’t make LB rangers ideal for PvP. Nerfed or not, it still heals as much and very often, more then other heals, yet it also does so passively. If you disagree, then prove it. Your making a lot of claims that have already been disproven with actual facts and numbers.

Harper.4173:

It’s ridiculous how people keep complaining about warrior but are totally fine being roflstomped by other classes that use even MORE passive gameplay.

Got proof anyone on this thread gets roflstomped by any other profession? Unless you do, your simply making unsupported claims. Doing that benefits no one.

Harper.4173:

Also I see you haven’t been with the game long. Since there’s stuff in your post that proves you don’t really have a grasp of class DPS output.

Aside from that – another fun fact : there are more PVE warriors enjoying healing signet then there probably are sPVP hardcore players hating it.

You have to realize this game is mostly focused on PVE, and that PVP is an afterthought at best since hardly anybody plays it now.

Do everyone a favor, and stop trying to use PvE to justify passive skills that promote lack of game play, We do not expect the player base to be genies, but it would be nice if everyone could wrap there head around the fact that PvE is probably the worst aspect to balance around.

Necrotize.2974:

I feel like people just don’t like Healing Signet because it is probably one of warriors best heals if not the best and is completely passive. Passive play inherently has a lower skill cap than active play, but that does not mean passive play should be made stronger than active.

Part of the problem based on this, is that while others have to stop defending themselves or attacking to heal, warriors can skip this step. It is an unfair and unreasonable advantage.

The second problem, as far as I am concerned, is the double standard here, by specific posters. There are posters here defending HS, who constantly attack stealth, troll incendiary powder threads to bash is passive play, and so on. (IP is a problem, stealth is not).

Guyver.1426:

WOW combat system is better than GW2.

LMAO. Not even close. It is an archaic system that punished mobility.

Guyver.1426:

Target system of GW2’s is ridiculous. [Next Target] and some movement skills are disturbed by walls, bridges or doors, rather than to hit enemies. It is difficult to point one target when allies and enemies standing close together. And there is no necessary to place so many animals and mobs in wvw.

Tab or point and click targeting. The same as every MMO. As well there is a reason for mobs in WvW. You really shouldn’t makes claims about aspects, when you do not have an understanding of their purpose and existance.

Guyver.1426:

It may be fun for third party NPC to intercept fight, but I don’t want some mobs hanging around there to screw me up. Wvw battle land looks like a national park. It is exactly one of the problem of wvw. WOW’s battle ground Alterac Valley has better design.

Tough luck, sorry you don’t like it. They serve a purpose for the rest of us. It is unlikely they will. The problem here is you seem to think your way is the only way, and expect them to build the game around you and hose the rest of us. That is unreasonable, and unfair.

Guyver.1426:

In pve, I suggest NPC dialogue box keep close during event. It is very annoying to press interact to loot but call the dialogue box out instead.

If your talking to NPCs while trying to loot, then your screwing up. Yet your here blaming the system because you chose not to have the F key as an AoE button. It is si disheartening to see players make bad choices as you appear to have, then come here and blame the devs or the game.

Guyver.1426:

I’m curious why some bugs in GW2 still not fixed, for examples, trapped between wall while repairing, try picking up/ interacting same item by 2 guys makes one can’t use weapon skill, and skill bugs. It is rare for a Blizzard game to tolerate a bug more than 3 months.

Can I have some of what your having? I can think of 4 bugs that blizzard hasn’t been able to fix since release. That is 10 years. If you are claiming this isn’t the case, you are speaking on maters you are fully unacknowledged about, or being dishonest. They had an off site panel on this ad blizzcon for pete sake.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

at the moment, warrior’s healing signet is fine, in a very good spot and does not require further adjustments. thank you.

No. No it isn’t. Because it is an option in which 100% passive behavior is the best option.

sinject.4607:

it is the year of our lord 2014 and people are still complaining about healing signet

Which seems contradictory considering how hard you bash IP. You cannot have your cake and eat it too. You either are fine with Incendiary Powder and Healing signet as passive effects, or you are not. You cannot support one and condemn the other, and be balanced in your perspective.

Xae Isareth.1364:

@dancingmonley tbh, throwing grenades further than rifle shots doesn’t even make sense from a balancing perspective.

What are you talking about? All of that was stated in the context of the real life comparison the OP made to in game skills. I was suggesting that if realism was used, then ranges would be different. No one said a word about balance.

Xae Isareth.1364:

It makes about as much sense as giving FT a blast-fire field synergy and then make the fire field so short that the blast can’t hit it…oh wait.

No need for the sarcasm launched at me here. Again, you clearly do not know what we were referring to. What your saying makes about as much since as comparing a fantasy fiction video game to real life…….Oh wait.

glock.6590:

I’ve seen so many engis in PvP trying to say " I’m not turret but triple kit" and yet use their crate in the first 3 seconds of the fight.

So I’m just gonna remind you that the use of the supply crate in 1v1 makes you a turret engineer. Like it or not but its the truth . Usually the engineers that lack skill will use the crate as " I win button " in 1v1 and the good engis will save it for team fight or a support utility for their allies.

Sincerly thief, that has been crated in 1v1 in the first 3 seconds by bad engis.

I had you tell me that recently. Do you remember what happened?

Well let me remind you. I slash danced on your corpse, while you were waiting to repawn, as I capped the point. Call me a gadgeteer, call me a turret engineer, call me a kit master. I could care less. I am just glad knowing the fact that I smashed you repeatedly, and that is part of your ire for the profession.

Of all the things that warrior is capable of, I feel they do not need boon removal too. Especially on a weapon. At best, a utility skill dedicated to it. But really, if you give warriors boon removal, they are getting too strong again. As well, you open up opportunity for professions such as thieves, mesmers, and necromancers, a case to demand long duration stability.

It appears to me your either assuming all AoEs pulse, which is not the case, or your using specific AoEs for your point, but you didn’t specify that.

Either way it is not diminishing returns. a specific amount of total damage is capable of being achieves in either case. In the instance your mentioning, it is simply spread around more.

The OPs case is comical to me. He is complaining about an elite that just had a nerf. Worse then that, he failed to use a skill that specifically breaks chill, cripple and immobilize. The build in that video literally had 4 skills capable of solving the issue. Super elixir and Cleansing Burst both clear conditions, and rocket boots (which he never used) and Overcharge Shot, both of which specifically remove cripple, chill, and immobilize.

Using a real life comparison to justify a balance change lost me instantly and left me shaking my head. By that logic, grenade kit would have to have a shorter range then rifle and so on.

The comparison to guardians auto attack on staff though, has sold me on backing this idea.

Help us, help you……………Let us know what you think you might like the build for? Or what you want it to be capable? Do you like playing with the rifle, or do you prefer pistol/pistol or pistol/shield?

Also check out The Engineer Handbook http://www.wolfineer.com/2014/10/the-engineer-handbook/ , it may help you out

Spirit weapons just have to many good skills to contend with if you ask me.

I see warrior physicals, particularly bulls rush and bolas, used all the time in WvW and solo q.

I see ranger shouts used all the time in WvW

Traps, eh, beats me, I have to totally agree with you.

I almost laughed a’loud, eles use signets all the time in my experience.

I see arcane thievery used ALOT. for the other 2 though, not so much. Illusion of life has sooooo much potential to me. I see signet of domination used very oten for the CC in WvW.

Exedore.6320:

Just because they weren’t mentioned doesn’t mean they aren’t broken. Yes, engineer’s Transmute trait needs changed; watching it convert fear to stability show’s how broken it can be, especially if the necro is using fear as a defense.

No. No it isn’t. (see how I can stat my opinion as it were proven fact just the way you did)

Exedore.6320:

But just flat removing all these procs isn’t an answer. Engineer Protection Injection is a good trait because it doesn’t completely shut someone down or waste a key ability, and is predictable (it will will activate most of the time). Developers need to examine all on a case-by-case basis. Obviously that will take some time. The ones which radically alter the course of a fight and are used frequently, like Reaper’s Protection and Nightmare Runes, should be first to be fixed.

What do you suggest? I have to ask because everyone seems so good at making demands or claiming something factually is something, when it actually only their opinion, but you offer no agreeable alternatives. For now though, Reaper’s Protection is the only one that you have presented a reasonable argument for (see how I made my differing opinion appear as another condescending fact, gets old, doesn’kitten

What skill is it your claiming the entire class is built around?

What causes you to make this assumption? It certainly seems like a very incorrect one to me.

What builds are players abandoning?

Booms.2594:

Ezeriel.9574:

TexZero.7910:

Might be because, you know…. If you were using the rifle for bleeds you probably need to re-roll anyway as that is not its primary or intended function.

….the rifle was one of the best condition weapons in the game, the build was amazing. It worked, and how can you claim otherwise?

cuz no one ever ran it lel

Yeah I would like to see a video of someone playing a condition rifle successfully and well. I am sure if it worked as good as he suggest, that surely there is plenty of footage of it used well, he could link us. Consider my interest piqued.

jbondo.9817:

aelfwe.4239:

jbondo.9817:

just nerf all of the gimmick builds, so people have to start thinking again, or even just go back two patches!

im agree with you about nerf all of the “gimmick builds” but..

go back to 2 patches ago???

2 patches ago:

-hambow war
-spirit ranger
-decap engie
-s/p thief

Seriously?

that was God Gimmick Build meta, you want to heal the patient killing it!

I don’t recall having any problem with people running those builds two patches ago.

So they should balance, change, and adjust based on what you are not "having any problem with people running "…………..Seems to me that would be a terrible idea.

As much fun as a guild of that nature could be, it would seem that doing things together would be a bit stale at times (yet a total blast at others) not having other professions around regularly when doing guild things.

sinject.4607:

i don’t even know what to do with meditation guard. it’s in a weird place where it’s kinda too strong in 1v1s but too noticeably weak in groupfights. there’s probably a way to give the build an the option to balance out it’s performance in both situations but i am too lazy atm to think of anything.

Too strong in what way? Based on what? Do you lose to them regularly?

Why are you still refusing to list the traits in the engie, mesmer, and ele builds you are claiming as OP? How long have you played each of those 3 profession to have drawn such a conclusion? How long have you played guardian?

I agree they are probably the least played right now, but I cannot agree with you about leveling. For one, if your leveling by killing mobs, your doing it wrong in the first place. Secondly, you can karma train it in the EoTM as fast an any profession.

sinject.4607:

the only things that need to be looked at are celestial d/d ele, celestial/turret engie (as well as incendiary powder), and PU phantasm mesmers (2/6/6/0/0 & 4/4/6/0/0).

almost everything else is pretty well balanced at the moment (IN SPVP) there’s certain builds that could use some very minor tweaks that improve the amount of counterplay available, builds like terrormancer and mediguard; but again, the only things that need rebalancing urgently are the builds i first mentioned.

What traits are those builds using that your suggesting are problematic? The traits are kind of key for the conversation.

What is problematic with the “terrormancer” and “mediguard” exactly?